Holidays as public holidays
B Anderson
whereby the day between two holidays has been declared another holiday.
But it is not glorious. Why must the Japanese have these elongated
sessions of national holidays? It is disruptive, bad for productivity,
and everyone pours into holiday destinations, crams onto planes and
shinkansens that are near empty most of the year.
My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
And I can answer my own question: the Japs need to be forced at gunpoint
to take a holiday. Their office has to actually be closed to convince
them to take days off.
They get 2 weeks annual leave but I doubt they take even a week in any
given year. I know someone whose summer holidays consist of two Fridays
off in a row. WOW!! Really kicking back there, that sure makes up for
the 14 hour days.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> So now we have a glorious repeat of Golden Week coming up September,
> whereby the day between two holidays has been declared another holiday.
> But it is not glorious. Why must the Japanese have these elongated
> sessions of national holidays? It is disruptive, bad for productivity,
> and everyone pours into holiday destinations, crams onto planes and
> shinkansens that are near empty most of the year.
> My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
> thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
> And I can answer my own question: the Japs need to be forced at gunpoint
> to take a holiday. Their office has to actually be closed to convince
> them to take days off.
I found one of the advantages of being a furriner was that I could work
through those periods, keeping the office open for clients, and enjoy
a MUCH less crowded Tokyo, and take comp time when all the vacation spots
were far less crowded, and the prices lower.
Mike
John W.
> So now we have a glorious repeat of Golden Week coming up September,
> whereby the day between two holidays has been declared another holiday.
>
> But it is not glorious. Why must the Japanese have these elongated
> sessions of national holidays? It is disruptive, bad for productivity,
> and everyone pours into holiday destinations, crams onto planes and
> shinkansens that are near empty most of the year.
>
suggested, work.
> My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
> thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
>
So... tell them you'll be out, that it's a national holiday, sorry,
and, if you have to... work.
> And I can answer my own question: the Japs need to be forced at gunpoint
> to take a holiday. Their office has to actually be closed to convince
> them to take days off.
>
Correct, though I hope you realized that particular way of referring
to Japanese is pretty offensive. But I believe your assertion is
right. At some point I think Japanese offices confused having a good
work ethic with being productive.
> They get 2 weeks annual leave but I doubt they take even a week in any
> given year. I know someone whose summer holidays consist of two Fridays
> off in a row. WOW!! Really kicking back there, that sure makes up for
> the 14 hour days.
Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
sounded like a good plan.
John W.
John W.
Japan on a corporate ticket. My company's international expansion
plans are limited to maybe Canada.
John W
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
Marvel
"John W." <worth...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:73d10499-9d31-4899...@t13g2000yqt.googlegroups.com...
John W.
>
> Why the big nut offering over living in Japan?
No clue, to be honest. It could be that I can't, therefore I want to.
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 3, 9:08?pm, "Marvel" <mar...@nospam.net> wrote:
> >
> > Why the big nut offering over living in Japan?
> No clue, to be honest. It could be that I can't, therefore I want to.
Ah, kinda like high-school dating...
Mike
John W.
John W.
Marvel
Now you are a man who knows exactly what he wants!
Marvel
<mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net> wrote in message
news:h59cnv$d11$1...@news.stanford.edu...
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> <mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net> wrote in message
> news:h59cnv$d11$1...@news.stanford.edu...
> > John W. <worth...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Aug 3, 9:08?pm, "Marvel" <mar...@nospam.net> wrote:
> >
> >> >
> >> > Why the big nut offering over living in Japan?
> >
> >> No clue, to be honest. It could be that I can't, therefore I want to.
> >
> > Ah, kinda like high-school dating...
> What is the statute of limitation on that?
I'm gonna go with "the end of high school"
Mike
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
>years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
>vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
>vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
>sounded like a good plan.
And then three weeks before his retirement, he keels over from a heart attack...
--
The 2-Belo [the2beloATmsdDOTbiglobeDOTneDOTjp]
alt.flame alt.fan.karl-malden.nose alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk
meow a brimful of asha on a 45 meow
meowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeow
The Brain: Yes, finally! The Happy Sappy Children
of Many Lands ride! Where cheering music
will spread the message that a mouse should
rule the world!
Pinky: Oh no, Brain. Narf! You're thinking of that
other park in Orlando.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>So now we have a glorious repeat of Golden Week coming up September,
>whereby the day between two holidays has been declared another holiday.
Yay!
>But it is not glorious. Why must the Japanese have these elongated
>sessions of national holidays? It is disruptive, bad for productivity,
>and everyone pours into holiday destinations, crams onto planes and
>shinkansens that are near empty most of the year.
They can have their fun being stuck in traffic. I stay at home and play video
games while the wife makes cookies. What's not to like?
Besides, long vacation periods (long, you say? Ever been to Europe in August?)
can't be any worse for productivity in the typical Japanese corporation than the
average Monday morning department head meeting.
>My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
>thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
Serves them right for never answering *me* within 24 hours either. I deal with
nearly 15 different overseas companies whose software we sell here, and they are
notorious for completely ignoring or overlooking repeated requests for
materials, new version information, or tech support.
If you just let them know "hey, in the third week of September we're all going
to be disappearing for three or four days so we can all sit in traffic jams
while our children* screech in our ears on the way to Universal Studios Japan;
we won't be answering emails or calls during that time", I'm sure they would
freak out a little less.
>And I can answer my own question: the Japs
*PHWEET!* Illegal epithet, number eight, 5 yards, loss of down!
>need to be forced at gunpoint to take a holiday. Their office has to actually
>be closed to convince them to take days off.
Sometimes that doesn't even work.
>They get 2 weeks annual leave but I doubt they take even a week in any
>given year. I know someone whose summer holidays consist of two Fridays
>off in a row. WOW!! Really kicking back there, that sure makes up for
>the 14 hour days.
"They" get the 2 weeks annual leave, but what about you? If you get it, why not
take it?
* I have no children and am therefore exempt. Neener.
The 2-Belo
I cheated; I moved here first, and *then* looked for a job.
Declan Murphy
> On Aug 3, 8:05 am, B Anderson <b...@qld.com> wrote:> So now we have a glorious repeat of Golden Week coming up September,
> > My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
> > thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
>
> So... tell them you'll be out, that it's a national holiday, sorry,
> and, if you have to... work.
I would think it should be fairly easy to set an auto-responder to
your email, put a message on your website, and edit the answering
machine or voice mail?
> > They get 2 weeks annual leave but I doubt they take even a week in any
> > given year. I know someone whose summer holidays consist of two Fridays
> > off in a row. WOW!! Really kicking back there, that sure makes up for
> > the 14 hour days.
>
> Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
> years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
> vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
> vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
> sounded like a good plan.
Thats pretty uncommon, at least in my experience.
My company "allows" the accumulation of up to 40 days of paid leave,
but any more than that are forfeited under a use or lose policy. We
work all weekdays, and no weekends, and observe almost no public
holidays, so most of the staff can avoid using their paid leave and
just take days of in lieu of the public holidays they worked.
John W.
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> [...]
>
> >Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
> >years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
> >vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
> >vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
> >sounded like a good plan.
>
> And then three weeks before his retirement, he keels over from a heart attack...
>
just what they're about in encouraging their husbands to bust their
ass at the office all the time.
John W.
John W.
> On Aug 4, 3:02 am, "John W." <worthj1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 3, 8:05 am, B Anderson <b...@qld.com> wrote:> So now we have a glorious repeat of Golden Week coming up September,
> <snip>
> > > My office deals with many overseas clients and they basically freak out,
> > > thinking we are ignoring their calls and e-mails.
>
> > So... tell them you'll be out, that it's a national holiday, sorry,
> > and, if you have to... work.
>
> I would think it should be fairly easy to set an auto-responder to
> your email, put a message on your website, and edit the answering
> machine or voice mail?
>
> > > They get 2 weeks annual leave but I doubt they take even a week in any
> > > given year. I know someone whose summer holidays consist of two Fridays
> > > off in a row. WOW!! Really kicking back there, that sure makes up for
> > > the 14 hour days.
>
> > Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
> > years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
> > vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
> > vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
> > sounded like a good plan.
>
> Thats pretty uncommon, at least in my experience.
>
comes with it's own set of rulles. My best friend here in the US is
allowed to accumulate leave; it's really rare here, but he figured it
up that if he were to get ill he could take off almost an entire
school year.
John W.
John W.
wrote:
>
> Sometimes that doesn't even work.
>
while on vacation, which is becoming not only common but somewhat
expected. One boss I had refused to get a PDA because he didn't want
to work when not at work; he's tolerated but not advancing very
rapidly (which could be his lack of intelligence, though that doesn't
seem to inhibit any of the other directors/VPs).
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> [...]
> >Way back when I knew of a guy that hadn't taken a day off in his 20
> >years with the company, and the company allowed him to roll that
> >vacation over from year to year. His goal was to accumulate enough
> >vacation so that he could retire 18 months early. I thought that
> >sounded like a good plan.
> And then three weeks before his retirement, he keels over from a heart attack...
Hey, I saw that show...
Mike
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >> I would give my left (and maybe my right, too) testicle to work in
> >> Japan on a corporate ticket. My company's international expansion
> >> plans are limited to maybe Canada.
> >
> >I cheated; I worked for a Japanese company.
> I cheated; I moved here first, and *then* looked for a job.
Couldn't do that; didn't have the money. I got my job via
"Shushokujouhou", and the company paid everything.
Mike
Declan Murphy
I still avoid a PDA, but have a laptop and cell with me almost
everywhere I go. I don't think I'll ever be able to have a "real"
holiday again, but without these tools I'd be stuck in the office.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>> "They" get the 2 weeks annual leave, but what about you? If you get it, why not
>> take it?
>
>I am currently on holiday (that's why I'm home at the ridiculously early
>hour of 9pm). But I was made to feel like an evil-doer for indulging in
>1.5 weeks holiday.
I have since learned to grow a thick enough skin to not let the guilt-tripping
bother me. You just have to take it for what it's worth, and remember that you
have to allow people to manipulate you.
If they don't like treating employees like human beings, then that's their
problem.
>> * I have no children and am therefore exempt. Neener.
>
>The more disturbing thing is the adults who are obsessed with USJ... and
>there are many at my work.
I tend to think people in this country aren't *good* at vacationing and need a
little training. One of the greatest trips my wife and I ever took was just last
autumn, a three day trip by car from here in Gifu down through Awaji-shima, to
Takamatsu, over the Seto Bridge into Okayama, on a ferry to Shodojima in the
middle of the Inland Sea, and back. No packages, no guides, just the two of us
and our own four tires and a back seat full of camera gear. And it only took
three days.
The 2-Belo
has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>On Aug 5, 9:26?pm, "John W." <worthj1...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Aug 5, 1:05?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
That's why I bought a huge honking desktop. The company won't buy me a laptop
for work use, and I didn't want to use my personal laptop for work matters, so I
told them I'm taking it out of commission. I'll work via remote from home as
much as necessary, but when I leave the house, I leave the house. When I use my
personal mobile phone for work purposes they get a bill.
The 2-Belo
I borrowed the money, and went to Hello Work. :)
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>On Aug 5, 12:47?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
Then I must have been issued a defective one, because she is constantly telling
me to come the hell home already before I drive myself batshit. Far from
encouraging me to bust my ass -- she already knows I do :) -- she would vastly
prefer it if I came home right at ????.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>prefer it if I came home right at ????.
定時. I hate this newsreader.
John W.
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >And his wife pockets the money. I've long thought Japanese wives know
> >just what they're about in encouraging their husbands to bust their
> >ass at the office all the time.
>
> Then I must have been issued a defective one, because she is constantly telling
> me to come the hell home already before I drive myself batshit. Far from
> encouraging me to bust my ass -- she already knows I do :) -- she would vastly
> prefer it if I came home right at ????.
>
A: how long have you been married?
B: how many children do you have?
I think one reason some women marry us ferriners is that we are home
more and do more work around the house, etc. To be fair, I know
'merikan women who don't want their husbands at home that much.
Children either, for that matter; I think that's why they're always
putting kids in camps, sports, or other programs to keep them out of
the house where the parent might be forced to turn off the TV or video
games.
John W.
John W.
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that B Anderson has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> >> "They" get the 2 weeks annual leave, but what about you? If you get it, why not
> >> take it?
>
> >I am currently on holiday (that's why I'm home at the ridiculously early
> >hour of 9pm). But I was made to feel like an evil-doer for indulging in
> >1.5 weeks holiday.
>
> I have since learned to grow a thick enough skin to not let the guilt-tripping
> bother me. You just have to take it for what it's worth, and remember that you
> have to allow people to manipulate you.
>
I would imagine being a foreigner would help in that.
> I tend to think people in this country aren't *good* at vacationing and need a
> little training. One of the greatest trips my wife and I ever took was just last
> autumn, a three day trip by car from here in Gifu down through Awaji-shima, to
> Takamatsu, over the Seto Bridge into Okayama, on a ferry to Shodojima in the
> middle of the Inland Sea, and back. No packages, no guides, just the two of us
> and our own four tires and a back seat full of camera gear. And it only took
> three days.
>
I think many are, particularly when you get out of the big cities
(Tokyo in particular). Once you get into the more rural areas people
do a particularly good job of taking time off, maintaining hobbies,
etc. My brother in law is a true work-a-holic, but is also a gentleman
farmer and brings in a nice crop of rice, strawberries, etc. every
year.
John W.
Declan Murphy
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that Declan Murphy
> has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Aug 5, 9:26?pm, "John W." <worthj1...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Aug 5, 1:05?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> >> wrote:
>
> >> > Sometimes that doesn't even work.
>
> >> The great thing about laptops and PDAs is that now you can work even
> >> while on vacation, which is becoming not only common but somewhat
> >> expected. One boss I had refused to get a PDA because he didn't want
> >> to work when not at work; he's tolerated but not advancing very
> >> rapidly (which could be his lack of intelligence, though that doesn't
> >> seem to inhibit any of the other directors/VPs).
>
> >I still avoid a PDA, but have a laptop and cell with me almost
> >everywhere I go. I don't think I'll ever be able to have a "real"
> >holiday again, but without these tools I'd be stuck in the office.
>
> That's why I bought a huge honking desktop. The company won't buy me a laptop
> for work use, and I didn't want to use my personal laptop for work matters, so I
> told them I'm taking it out of commission. I'll work via remote from home as
> much as necessary, but when I leave the house, I leave the house. When I use my
> personal mobile phone for work purposes they get a bill.
I have a desktop at home, but when I leave the house I really leave
the house (I'm sitting in a coffee shop in Toyota's headquarters
surrounded by drones who look a little terrified, Mie tomorrow, then
Tokyo and Sapporo - I won't be home for 2 weeks). I could invoice my
company for my cellphone bills (about 50000/month) but effectively I'd
be invoicing myself. Tax wise it would make sense. Time wise it seems
a waste.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>> Then I must have been issued a defective one, because she is constantly telling
>> me to come the hell home already before I drive myself batshit. Far from
>> encouraging me to bust my ass -- she already knows I do :) -- she would vastly
>> prefer it if I came home right at ???? (teiji).
>>
>A: how long have you been married?
As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
>B: how many children do you have?
Zilch.
Well, unless you count my niece, who lives with us, and for whom I provide 90%
of the financial support (it's a long story). But the mom-in-law takes care of
her for the most part so it's not as if I'm a surrogate dad or anything. (In
fact, most other fjlijers here should be able to vouch for the fact that I am
often quite vocal in my pride at not having produced any offspring.)
>I think one reason some women marry us ferriners is that we are home
>more and do more work around the house, etc. To be fair, I know
>'merikan women who don't want their husbands at home that much.
>Children either, for that matter; I think that's why they're always
>putting kids in camps, sports, or other programs to keep them out of
>the house where the parent might be forced to turn off the TV or video
>games.
The solution here is to buy a Wii and have everybody play bowling or doubles
tennis. :D
CL
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> [...]
>> A: how long have you been married?
>
> As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
No, you're not. Get in line. Close to the back. (mutters something
about "friggen showoff newbies").
>> B: how many children do you have?
>
> Zilch.
More than zilch, fewer than she wants, but it isn't from a lack of trying.
--
C "Twenty-three years and counting" L
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 6, 2:00?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> wrote:
> A: how long have you been married?
19 years.
> B: how many children do you have?
A brace.
> I think one reason some women marry us ferriners is that we are home
> more and do more work around the house, etc. To be fair, I know
> 'merikan women who don't want their husbands at home that much.
> Children either, for that matter; I think that's why they're always
> putting kids in camps, sports, or other programs to keep them out of
> the house where the parent might be forced to turn off the TV or video
> games.
No, I think it's more that they're afraid someone else will be able to say
"My kid did <whatever> this summer/winter" and they won't have a one-up.
Mike
John W.
> The 2-Belo wrote:
> > We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> > exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> > [...]
> >> A: how long have you been married?
>
> > As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
>
> No, you're not. Get in line. Close to the back. (mutters something
> about "friggen showoff newbies").
>
Japanese two thirds of my marraige (just being honest; I make no claim
to majority rule) doesn't want to live in Japan (she's lived most of
her adult life in the US, after all), and the 'merikan third doesn't
want to live in sepponia.
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 7, 3:30?am, CL <flot...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > The 2-Belo wrote:
> > > We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
> > > exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >
> > > [...]
> > >> A: how long have you been married?
> >
> > > As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
> >
> > about "friggen showoff newbies").
> >
> I've been tied to the wheel for 15 years. I find it curious that the
> Japanese two thirds of my marraige (just being honest; I make no claim
> to majority rule) doesn't want to live in Japan (she's lived most of
> her adult life in the US, after all), and the 'merikan third doesn't
> want to live in sepponia.
My wife grew up in Japan, but wants to stay here; 'course, living in
San Francisco may have something to do with that.
I could live either place; the area is more important than the country.
Mike
The 2-Belo
>John W. <worth...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Aug 6, 2:00?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
>> wrote:
>
>> A: how long have you been married?
>
>19 years.
>
>> B: how many children do you have?
>
>A brace.
A herd? A murder?
>> I think one reason some women marry us ferriners is that we are home
>> more and do more work around the house, etc. To be fair, I know
>> 'merikan women who don't want their husbands at home that much.
>> Children either, for that matter; I think that's why they're always
>> putting kids in camps, sports, or other programs to keep them out of
>> the house where the parent might be forced to turn off the TV or video
>> games.
>
>No, I think it's more that they're afraid someone else will be able to say
>"My kid did <whatever> this summer/winter" and they won't have a one-up.
Hahahahahahaha *clicks "I like this!"*
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>The 2-Belo wrote:
>> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
>> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>>
>> [...]
>
>>> A: how long have you been married?
>>
>> As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
>
>No, you're not. Get in line. Close to the back. (mutters something
>about "friggen showoff newbies").
Perhaps, but just off the top of my head I can count at least five cases over
the years of intergalactic marriages I've witnessed that went kablooie after
about three year's time because of one of the usual reasons.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >John W. <worth...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Aug 6, 2:00?am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> >> wrote:
> >
> >> A: how long have you been married?
> >
> >19 years.
> >
> >> B: how many children do you have?
> >
> >A brace.
> A herd? A murder?
Somewhat closer to a leap, actually.
> >> I think one reason some women marry us ferriners is that we are home
> >> more and do more work around the house, etc. To be fair, I know
> >> 'merikan women who don't want their husbands at home that much.
> >> Children either, for that matter; I think that's why they're always
> >> putting kids in camps, sports, or other programs to keep them out of
> >> the house where the parent might be forced to turn off the TV or video
> >> games.
> >No, I think it's more that they're afraid someone else will be able to say
> >"My kid did <whatever> this summer/winter" and they won't have a one-up.
> Hahahahahahaha *clicks "I like this!"*
Yeah, takes us a couple years to figger all that out, though...
Mike
CL
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that CL has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
>> The 2-Belo wrote:
>>> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that John W. has
>>> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>> A: how long have you been married?
>>> As of last May 17, precisely 10 years. I AM TEH KOKUSAI KEKKON VETERAN!!!!1
>>
>> No, you're not. Get in line. Close to the back. (mutters
>> something about "friggen showoff newbies").
>
> Perhaps, but just off the top of my head I can count at least five cases over
> the years of intergalactic marriages I've witnessed that went kablooie after
> about three year's time because of one of the usual reasons.
Here in the legal services business, we've noted several premarital
meeting / dating / sex provision patterns that are proportionally
weighted toward smoking crater / steaming carcass levels of failure by
incendiary or other other highly explosive means. Reports of failures
of same are never surprising and, after you've lived in Wa for a while
you can predict which unions are heading for the rocks before the knot
even gets tied ... usually around his neck.
--
CL
The 2-Belo
Ooh. Do tell. Not for preventive maintenance or anything, I'm just curious :)
CL
The general outline is ... and there are more marriages that fall into
this pattern than I ever would have expected ...
She is 5~7 years older than him.
They met on a deaikei site or at a disco ... a non-social meeting place,
in other words.
She was most probably on the rebound.
She proceeded to drub his ding in more ways, in more locations, on top
of more kinds of furniture and counters, and more often, than any of the
girls back in Kansas.
In a majority of cases, she gets pregnant premaritally.
He proposes and marries her at the Embassy ... but not always. Some
have a white shotgun wedding at a wedding hall or do the "virgin road"
number back at the Lutheran Church in Omaha.
If they move to the US, she never learns English, tries to make the kids
speak only Japanese, and orders lots of stuff from Benesse and Pinocchio.
If they stay in Japan, she urges him to work a second job and never has
the housework done or food made for him when he gets home.
She moves out of the bedroom and begins sleeping with the kid(s).
At an average of two popped sprogs, she cuts his sex access off
completely and urges him to live in another room or find a small
apartment for himself (I am constantly surprised at the number of cases
I have investigated where this is happens).
In some cases, she suggests that he needs a fuck friend and in even
fewer, she'll ask a friend to haul hubby's ashes for her.
Husband usually suggests separation. She grabs the kids and disappears.
Some husbands file for divorce anyway, most go around with long faces
trying to find their kids.
Total cycle, 4~9 years.
Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
pattern. We're talking a couple of dozen _reported_ cases a year ...
--
CL
John W.
>
> Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
> pattern. We're talking a couple of dozen _reported_ cases a year ...
>
friend' concept intrigues me and I will start looking at my wife's
friends in a different light.
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 18, 12:11?am, CL <flot...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
> >
> I guess I got lucky and didn't even know it, though that whole 'fuck
> friend' concept intrigues me and I will start looking at my wife's
> friends in a different light.
Try flourescents...
Mike
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> The 2-Belo wrote:
> > We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that CL has
> > exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> > Ooh. Do tell. Not for preventive maintenance or anything, I'm just curious :)
> The general outline is ... and there are more marriages that fall into
> this pattern than I ever would have expected ...
> She is 5~7 years older than him.
I guess I'm off the hook; I'm 10 years older than the boss-unit.
> She proceeded to drub his ding in more ways, in more locations, on top
> of more kinds of furniture and counters, and more often, than any of the
> girls back in Kansas.
Well, I don't like to brag...
> In a majority of cases, she gets pregnant premaritally.
Now, now; it's only the 2nd and 3rd that take 9 months. The first can come
any time.
> He proposes and marries her at the Embassy ... but not always. Some
> have a white shotgun wedding at a wedding hall or do the "virgin road"
> number back at the Lutheran Church in Omaha.
Hm, proposal on the airplane back to Japan, wedding in Kochi.
> If they move to the US, she never learns English, tries to make the kids
> speak only Japanese,
My wife speaks English, but God help our kids if they speak anything but
Japanese to her.
Rest deleted.
> Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
> pattern. We're talking a couple of dozen _reported_ cases a year ...
Most of the JW-AH breakups here in the States are of the "they met in the
US, fell in love, had a couple kids" variety. The "they met in Japan and
moved to the States" seem to be more stable.
Mike
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>> Ooh. Do tell. Not for preventive maintenance or anything, I'm just curious :)
>
>The general outline is ... and there are more marriages that fall into
>this pattern than I ever would have expected ...
And now I will do the comparison. :)
>She is 5~7 years older than him.
Nope. She's 4 younger than me. One down.
>They met on a deaikei site or at a disco ... a non-social meeting place,
>in other words.
As it happens, we did indeed meet at a nightclub where loud music was being
played. But I was the one doing the loud music playing, as I was the DJ at the
time, and in fact we had just both been fans of one of the artists. I didn't
even take her on a date until over a month later.
>She was most probably on the rebound.
I doubt that, because of the dating time involved.
>She proceeded to drub his ding
No comment. :) (But I realize what you're getting at, and no, that wasn't a
factor.)
>He proposes and marries her at the Embassy ... but not always. Some
>have a white shotgun wedding at a wedding hall or do the "virgin road"
>number back at the Lutheran Church in Omaha.
I married her after we had been living together for three years already. I
proposed to her about a month the house where she grew up burned to the ground
one night and her family had lost everything but their lives, and we were all
suddenly cognizant of our own mortality. We never had a ceremony, preferring to
honeymoon in Australia instead because we couldn't afford both. We took our
wedding photos at a studio, directing the photographer to angle the shots so no
Christian paraphernalia would appear.
>If they stay in Japan, she urges him to work a second job and never has
>the housework done or food made for him when he gets home.
Neat freak, makes too much food and has fattened me up, always complains about
my long hours and wishes I was home more. :)
[rest irrelevant]
Another reason I wonder if I'm unusual is, we don't have children and never
seriously thought about having them.
>Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
>pattern. We're talking a couple of dozen _reported_ cases a year ...
The biggest thing that surprised me about this list was the meeting venue -- I
always thought they were, say, NOVA teacher and student.... :)
CL
NOVA teacher and student (actually ANY teacher + student) is Variation 1
in the Meeting Type List. Lots of Loser Dog Girls do eikaiwa, even some
fairly attractive ones. And their American Loser Dog Lady counterparts
did much fine horizontal English instruction in their day, too. That's
Variation 2 ...
The other thing I forgot to mention is how many dumped husbands go off
whining to Debito ... who has to be about the most useless ex-burger
turner in the entire known universe ... but that is another painful
direction we need not go.
--
CL
John W.
>
> NOVA teacher and student (actually ANY teacher + student) is Variation 1
> in the Meeting Type List. Lots of Loser Dog Girls do eikaiwa, even some
> fairly attractive ones. And their American Loser Dog Lady counterparts
> did much fine horizontal English instruction in their day, too. That's
> Variation 2 ...
>
say Western, but mean 'not bride for hire/illegal worker.)? I guess
I'm lucky that I met my wife in the US and we already had a fairly
stable relationship that survived (more or less) me working in Korea
while she studied in the US.
John W.
CL
> How many of the cases are foreign Western female rather than male? (I
> say Western, but mean 'not bride for hire/illegal worker.)?
Roughly 5% p.a., but the percentage varies a lot because of the total
sample size.
> I guess I'm lucky that I met my wife in the US and we already had a
> fairly stable relationship that survived (more or less) me working in
> Korea while she studied in the US.
My wife likes to remind me that, because she is an advisor from
time-to-time and makes calls to the police to help me bail out husbands
who have done Very Stupid Things (tm), she knows about this part of my
business and ... so far ... she's resisted any temptation to dump me for
any of the reasons she's observed lesser Japanese women dumping their
husbands for. I'm not sure if that means we're stable or that she's too
lazy ...
--
CL
John W.
>
> My wife likes to remind me that, because she is an advisor from
> time-to-time and makes calls to the police to help me bail out husbands
> who have done Very Stupid Things (tm), she knows about this part of my
> business and ... so far ... she's resisted any temptation to dump me for
> any of the reasons she's observed lesser Japanese women dumping their
> husbands for. I'm not sure if that means we're stable or that she's too
> lazy ...
>
humble men with low self esteem. Like a maternal thing.
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
Both are good qualities...
Mike
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>>> Believe it or not, over half of the cases we've handled match this
>>> pattern. We're talking a couple of dozen _reported_ cases a year ...
>>
>> The biggest thing that surprised me about this list was the meeting venue -- I
>> always thought they were, say, NOVA teacher and student.... :)
>
>NOVA teacher and student (actually ANY teacher + student) is Variation 1
>in the Meeting Type List. Lots of Loser Dog Girls do eikaiwa, even some
>fairly attractive ones. And their American Loser Dog Lady counterparts
>did much fine horizontal English instruction in their day, too. That's
>Variation 2 ...
Yeah. This is what I gathered. Once back in the day my wife and I were persuaded
by an acquaintance to attend a barbecue for the eikaiwa she was running. Having
rarely ever been in such circles before, I had no idea what to expect, but I did
notice that a) a significant number of the female students were decidedly
leaning toward the [*stomps dirt and makes whinny noise*] type, and b) a scary
percentage of these were flat-out overly-makeupped cougars (you could almost
hear the "WHOOP! WHOOP! AMERICAN TEACHER OFF THE PORT BOW! BRING ALL FALLOPIAN
TUBES TO BEAR!"). The single teachers at this event were sucking it all up like
a Dyson vacuum. It was a thinly-disguised meat market, and I'm not talking about
the burgers on the grill.
I became very very thankful that I did not meet my owner in climes such as
those.
>The other thing I forgot to mention is how many dumped husbands go off
>whining to Debito ... who has to be about the most useless ex-burger
>turner in the entire known universe ... but that is another painful
>direction we need not go.
Oh, jeebus. That guy's site makes me *so* depressed, like I expect to be tackled
in a dark alley and wake up in a labor colony on Sado or something.
chuckers
Previously CL <flot...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Husband usually suggests separation. She grabs the kids and disappears.
> Some husbands file for divorce anyway, most go around with long faces
> trying to find their kids.
Seems that is what Debito did a few years ago. He divorced his wife
claiming he no longer loved her anymore. I wouldn't be surprised if
he
did it just to get a blog post out of it, maybe with bonus points if
he could
get his fellow countrymen to "discriminate" against him for being
Japanese
of caucasian descent. One daughter now lives with his parents in the
US and
they won't let him see her. The other lives with his wife in the
house they built together.
On Aug 19, 4:19 pm, CL <flot...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> The other thing I forgot to mention is how many dumped husbands go off
> whining to Debito ... who has to be about the most useless ex-burger
> turner in the entire known universe ... but that is another painful
> direction we need not go.
>
On Aug 20, 10:48 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
wrote:
> Oh, jeebus. That guy's site makes me *so* depressed, like I expect to be tackled
> in a dark alley and wake up in a labor colony on Sado or something.
>
He should probably title his blog: "Beware! Here there be
Windmills!"
His current tirade is against McD Japan for their Nippon All Stars
campaign featuring
what he refers to as a "bespectacled nerd that speaks only in
katakana." Hitting too
close to home?
He has also be going through and editting posts from various readers
that have been
pointing out some of his errors and tossing them down the memory hole
so as to
make it look like people are supporting him.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>Seems that is what Debito did a few years ago. He divorced his wife
Hahahahhaahahakjdfhl#{$%`+&sdflkajhahahaha, really?! How spectacularly ironic!
>One daughter now lives with his parents in the US and
>they won't let him see her. The other lives with his wife in the
>house they built together.
Okay, where does *he* live now? Has he been busted back to looking at "no pets
or foreigners" signs again?
One can only hope that this endless wave of disgruntled ire eventually ends as
all sagas involving angry furriners must: "screw you guys, I'm going home". Now
that would be something to see.
>He should probably title his blog: "Beware! Here there be Windmills!"
>His current tirade is against McD Japan for their Nippon All Stars campaign featuring
>what he refers to as a "bespectacled nerd that speaks only in katakana." Hitting too
>close to home?
I guess I don't watch enough television anymore; this entire campaign has
totally passed me by so I can't really pass judgment on it. If it is what I
*think* it is, then I can't deny that I would be a little miffed at such a
thing. But I would not be particularly moved to boycott Big Macs because of
this. (I would be more inclined to boycott them because their hamburger patties
taste like -- and likely contain -- rat poo.)
>He has also be going through and editting posts from various readers that have been
>pointing out some of his errors and tossing them down the memory hole so as to
>make it look like people are supporting him.
A common M.O., from what I understand.
chuckers
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that chuckers has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> [...]
>
> >Seems that is what Debito did a few years ago. He divorced his wife
>
> Hahahahhaahahakjdfhl#{$%`+&sdflkajhahahaha, really?! How spectacularly ironic!
>
I don't think it is called "schadenfreude" when referring to someone
with a martyr complex.
> >One daughter now lives with his parents in the US and
> >they won't let him see her. The other lives with his wife in the
> >house they built together.
>
> Okay, where does *he* live now? Has he been busted back to looking at "no pets
> or foreigners" signs again?
>
> One can only hope that this endless wave of disgruntled ire eventually ends as
> all sagas involving angry furriners must: "screw you guys, I'm going home". Now
> that would be something to see.
>
As far as I know, he is still in Hokkaido. Not sure if it is an
apartment or not. Don't
know if he mentioned it anywhere (or if he did, I couldn't bother to
continue reading
to find out.)
Since he is proud of the fact that he has Japanese citizen ship now,
he may not have
a place to go back to without re-immigrating. Assuming, of course, he
gave up his
US citizenship rather than trying to do dual citizenship (which
probably wouldn't be
allowed for him.)
> >He should probably title his blog: "Beware! Here there be Windmills!"
> >His current tirade is against McD Japan for their Nippon All Stars campaign featuring
> >what he refers to as a "bespectacled nerd that speaks only in katakana." Hitting too
> >close to home?
>
> I guess I don't watch enough television anymore; this entire campaign has
> totally passed me by so I can't really pass judgment on it. If it is what I
> *think* it is, then I can't deny that I would be a little miffed at such a
> thing. But I would not be particularly moved to boycott Big Macs because of
> this. (I would be more inclined to boycott them because their hamburger patties
> taste like -- and likely contain -- rat poo.)
>
I have only seen a sticker of "Mr. James" on my morning train,
adverstising a Tamago
burger which actually looks rather good but haven't gone to go get one
because there
are other places I would rather eat.
One of Debito's sticking points on this campaign is that calling the
character "Mr. James"
is racist because you aren't supposed to call someone by their first
name with "Mr." prefixed
to it. When someone pointed out that "James" could be a last name
(and given that no
other name appears to be associated with the character) he replied in
comment that "James" wasn't
known to be a last name. When examles like "Jesse James" were pointed
out, his comment
and the original posted were edited into the memory hole, never to be
seen again.
He has also been complaining that the Japanese government isn't
including the number foreigners
in its reports on the number of Japanese citizens currently living in
Japan. The mind boggles.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 21, 10:27 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> Since he is proud of the fact that he has Japanese citizen ship now,
> he may not have
> a place to go back to without re-immigrating. Assuming, of course, he
> gave up his
> US citizenship rather than trying to do dual citizenship (which
> probably wouldn't be allowed for him.)
Why not?
> One of Debito's sticking points on this campaign is that calling the
> character "Mr. James"
> is racist because you aren't supposed to call someone by their first
> name with "Mr." prefixed
> to it. When someone pointed out that "James" could be a last name
> (and given that no
> other name appears to be associated with the character) he replied in
> comment that "James" wasn't
> known to be a last name. When examles like "Jesse James" were pointed
> out, his comment
> and the original posted were edited into the memory hole, never to be
> seen again.
I actually saw him on TV once, and he pulled something like that. I pointed
out to my wife that he was wrong; since it was on Japanese TV, my wife
drew the obvious conclusion that I had no idea what I was talking about.
Mike
chuckers
> chuckers <chucker...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Aug 21, 10:27 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> > Since he is proud of the fact that he has Japanese citizen ship now,
> > he may not have
> > a place to go back to without re-immigrating. Assuming, of course, he
> > gave up his
> > US citizenship rather than trying to do dual citizenship (which
> > probably wouldn't be allowed for him.)
>
> Why not?
>
I was assuming that he actually followed the letter of the Japanese
law which states
that he needs to choose his citizenship within 2 years of
naturalisation as Japan
does not recognise dual citizenship. The US will ignore duality but
Japan makes you
choose and apparently insists you renounce your previous nationality
with official paperwork
and stuff.
http://www.moj.go.jp/MINJI/minji06.html
Looks like he might have weasled it and kept is US passport. That, of
course,
puts him at risk for losing his Japanese nationality. Of course, he
might also weasle it
and say "I tried to give up my US citizenship but they wouldn't let me
for tax reasons"
which may be enough.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> http://www.moj.go.jp/MINJI/minji06.html
OK, that's what I thought.
The US recognizes the concept of renunciation under duress. So, even if you
renounce your US citizenship, you can retain it, if you contact the US
embassy and explain the situation. Remember to always enter the US under your
US passport, however. Failure to do so can be considered a de facto renunciation
in that case.
In point of fact, Japan cannot prevent dual citizenship. Some nations do
not recognize renunciation (France and S Korea used to be that way, but
there are undoubtedly more), so if you naturalize in Japan, or are also
born a Japanese citizen (international marriage), you're a dual citizen
no matter what Japan sez.
Mike
CL
> On Aug 21, 12:49 pm, mtfes...@netMAPSONscape.net wrote:
>> chuckers <chucker...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> On Aug 21, 10:27 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
>>>
>>> Since he is proud of the fact that he has Japanese citizen ship
>>> now, he may not have a place to go back to without
>>> re-immigrating. Assuming, of course, he gave up his US
>>> citizenship rather than trying to do dual citizenship (which
>>> probably wouldn't be allowed for him.)
>>
>> Why not?
>
> I was assuming that he actually followed the letter of the Japanese
> law which states that he needs to choose his citizenship within 2
> years of naturalisation as Japan does not recognise dual citizenship.
> The US will ignore duality but Japan makes you choose and apparently
> insists you renounce your previous nationality with official
> paperwork and stuff.
Japan has a "don't ask, don't tell" attitude. If you show a Japanese
passport when you come in and go out, no questions are asked. DAMHIKIJK.
I _may_ have knowledge of situations in which US Immigration will place
an entry stamp into a Japanese passport if you first show them your US
passport, but if I said where or who, that would make me complicit in
something or other. So, let's pretend I didn't write that ...
> http://www.moj.go.jp/MINJI/minji06.html
> Looks like he might have weasled it and kept is US passport. That,
> of course, puts him at risk for losing his Japanese nationality. Of
> course, he might also weasle it and say "I tried to give up my US
> citizenship but they wouldn't let me for tax reasons" which may be
> enough.
Uhhh ... you never heard? When Debit got his Japanese citizenship, he
made a Very Big Deal (tm) out of going to the US Consulate and handing
in his US docs. According to my sources, he was taken into a side room
and advised that all he needed to do was to go home and quietly stick
his passport in a drawer and everyone would pretend the same thing.
Then, in ten years, he could quietly find it, bring it in with a new
photo, and they'd give him a new one that he could forget, again. He
chose to make a huge deal of handing it over to some mid-to-high level
muckety muck (oddly enough, Walter Mondale was busy viewing a dam,
attending a lecture on finger painting, or listening to some
schoolchildren sing and could not attend) in front of many cameras ...
which he'd arranged. The Real Press was not in attendance, though.
When the Secretary refused to accept it, Debit set it on a table and
walked out.
So, he is Republicanly (we are a democracy and have no royalty, after
all) Fjyucked and, I doubt that anyone in the Sapporo Consulate or the
Embassy gives a rat's about him or his impending problem.
--
CL
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> chuckers wrote:
> > On Aug 21, 12:49 pm, mtfes...@netMAPSONscape.net wrote:
> >> chuckers <chucker...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> On Aug 21, 10:27 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> Japan has a "don't ask, don't tell" attitude. If you show a Japanese
> passport when you come in and go out, no questions are asked. DAMHIKIJK.
> I _may_ have knowledge of situations in which US Immigration will place
> an entry stamp into a Japanese passport if you first show them your US
> passport, but if I said where or who, that would make me complicit in
> something or other. So, let's pretend I didn't write that ...
I may know of a couple dozen such situations as well. Like, oh, any and
all of the US-born dual citizens.
> Uhhh ... you never heard? When Debit got his Japanese citizenship, he
> made a Very Big Deal (tm) out of going to the US Consulate and handing
> in his US docs. According to my sources, he was taken into a side room
> and advised that all he needed to do was to go home and quietly stick
> his passport in a drawer and everyone would pretend the same thing.
> Then, in ten years, he could quietly find it, bring it in with a new
> photo, and they'd give him a new one that he could forget, again. He
> chose to make a huge deal of handing it over to some mid-to-high level
> muckety muck (oddly enough, Walter Mondale was busy viewing a dam,
> attending a lecture on finger painting, or listening to some
> schoolchildren sing and could not attend) in front of many cameras ...
> which he'd arranged. The Real Press was not in attendance, though.
> When the Secretary refused to accept it, Debit set it on a table and
> walked out.
> So, he is Republicanly (we are a democracy and have no royalty, after
> all) Fjyucked and, I doubt that anyone in the Sapporo Consulate or the
> Embassy gives a rat's about him or his impending problem.
Well, if you're going to be dumb, might as well do it up proud.
Mike
John W.
> He has also been complaining that the Japanese government isn't
> including the number foreigners
> in its reports on the number of Japanese citizens currently living in
> Japan. The mind boggles.
I wouldn't lay claim to him, either.
John W.
The 2-Belo
>since it was on Japanese TV, my wife drew the obvious conclusion that I had
>no idea what I was talking about.
This always happens at my house when someone comes on the television talking
about fan death.
The 2-Belo
>Remember to always enter the US under your US passport, however.
This has always gotten me confused. If the Japanese immigration guy stamps your
Japanese passport when you leave, and the American immigration guy stamps your
US passport when you enter the US, then what do you tell the Japanese
immigration guy when you come back home again and there's absolutely nothing in
your Japanese passport that shows where you've been? "Uh, sir, I stamped you
out, but where did you go? The International Space Station?"
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>He has also been complaining that the Japanese government isn't
>including the number foreigners in its reports on the number of
>Japanese citizens currently living in Japan. The mind boggles.
If I didn't know this was Debito we're talking about, I would naturally assume
you just meant "the number of *naturalized* foreigners", as opposed to the
native-born, which would actually make some sense. But I have a hunch you meant
it just like you wrote it....
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >Remember to always enter the US under your US passport, however.
> This has always gotten me confused. If the Japanese immigration guy stamps your
> Japanese passport when you leave, and the American immigration guy stamps your
> US passport when you enter the US, then what do you tell the Japanese
> immigration guy when you come back home again and there's absolutely nothing in
> your Japanese passport that shows where you've been? "Uh, sir, I stamped you
> out, but where did you go? The International Space Station?"
According to the people who've done this, the US customs agents are usually
happy to stamp both passports.
Mike
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that chuckers has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >He has also been complaining that the Japanese government isn't
> >including the number foreigners in its reports on the number of
> >Japanese citizens currently living in Japan. The mind boggles.
> If I didn't know this was Debito we're talking about, I would naturally assume
> you just meant "the number of *naturalized* foreigners", as opposed to the
> native-born, which would actually make some sense.
And would number, what? 12? 20?
> But I have a hunch you meant it just like you wrote it....
I vaguely remember reading something like in in Japan Times; I think he (Debito)
indeed mean it as it was read.
Mike
The 2-Belo
Heh. Watch, someday I'll naturalize, and the next time I go to the US, I get the
customs agent to which "usually" does not apply.
And I wonder what happens when you're in the baggage claim waiting for your
suitcase with LET'S HAPPY TRIP printed on the side, and you suddenly think "OMG
I FORGOT TO STAMP BOTH."
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >The 2-Belo <the2...@msd.bigremovethislobe.ne.jp> wrote:
> >> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
> >> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net has exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >
> >> >Remember to always enter the US under your US passport, however.
> >
> >> This has always gotten me confused. If the Japanese immigration guy stamps your
> >> Japanese passport when you leave, and the American immigration guy stamps your
> >> US passport when you enter the US, then what do you tell the Japanese
> >> immigration guy when you come back home again and there's absolutely nothing in
> >> your Japanese passport that shows where you've been? "Uh, sir, I stamped you
> >> out, but where did you go? The International Space Station?"
> >
> >According to the people who've done this, the US customs agents are usually
> >happy to stamp both passports.
> Heh. Watch, someday I'll naturalize, and the next time I go to the US, I get the
> customs agent to which "usually" does not apply.
> And I wonder what happens when you're in the baggage claim waiting for your
> suitcase with LET'S HAPPY TRIP printed on the side, and you suddenly think "OMG
> I FORGOT TO STAMP BOTH."
Just checked with (one of) my daughter. She shows the US passport, and asks
them to stamp the Japanese.
Mike
The 2-Belo
Good to know. Thanks for the tip. In the event I am someday able to convince the
wife that naturalization is a good idea...
chuckers
> The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigremovethislobe.ne.jp> wrote:
> > We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that chuckers has
> > exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> > >He has also been complaining that the Japanese government isn't
> > >including the number foreigners in its reports on the number of
> > >Japanese citizens currently living in Japan. The mind boggles.
> > If I didn't know this was Debito we're talking about, I would naturally assume
> > you just meant "the number of *naturalized* foreigners", as opposed to the
> > native-born, which would actually make some sense.
>
> And would number, what? 12? 20?
>
I know you are being facetious (<-never knew how to spell that word
until now)
but according to information found here:
the increase in the number of Japanese citizens due to a change of
Nationality
is not so hideously small. In 2008, for example, 13,802 people
acquired Japanese nationality.
A 0.01% population increase.
Btw, the info was provided TO Debito, not BY Debito. He rejected it
off hand
claiming that wasn't the point of his article.
> > But I have a hunch you meant it just like you wrote it....
>
> I vaguely remember reading something like in in Japan Times; I think he (Debito)
> indeed mean it as it was read.
>
My wording was probably not as clear as it could have been. Debito
was basically
up in arms about this article:
which states: "The number of Japanese citizens residing in the
country rose for the second year to over 127 million."
He is hung up on phrasing "the number of Japanese citizens" which is
actually incorrect. He took this
to mean that the foreign population was not being counted in the
population of Japan, calling it bad social science.
It was pointed out to him that counting only J Citizens was useful
(actually *required*) for calcuating GNP, whereupon
he changed tactics and said it was bad of the Japanese government to
not include foreigners in TOTAL population.
Unfortunately, checking the government statistics website shows that
the J Gov DOES include foreigners in total population.
The original article was worded incorrectly. The number of Japanese
citizens residing in the country is actually
125 million whereas the population of Japan (not Japanese population,
a big difference) is 127 million. When this
was pointed out to him again, he got testy and said that wasn't what
the GoJ said in their press release and the
subject should be dropped.
The way the GoJ counts its citizens is to use the Juminhyou register.
Foreigners are obviously not on those lists.*
But foreigners are obviously being counted via the Gaijin Touroku
lists or something similar and the numbers are
added into total population. This can be seen in all kinds of data
put out by the GoJ which includes both total
population and population of Japanese citizens.
* Passage over the summer of a new law will add foreigners to the
Juminhyou register. Debito actually OPPOSED
the passing of this law, even helping to organise sit-ins in the Diet
building to express opposition.
It will be interesting to see if he complains in the future when the
GoJ releases the population numbers again.
By his reckoning, the population numbers should jump by about 2
million people (the foreigners) if the GoJ was only
counting people with Juminhyou. That's assuming that the law takes
affect in the next 3 years or so like it is
supposed to.
chuckers
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
>
> >Remember to always enter the US under your US passport, however.
>
> This has always gotten me confused. If the Japanese immigration guy stamps your
> Japanese passport when you leave, and the American immigration guy stamps your
> US passport when you enter the US, then what do you tell the Japanese
> immigration guy when you come back home again and there's absolutely nothing in
> your Japanese passport that shows where you've been? "Uh, sir, I stamped you
> out, but where did you go? The International Space Station?"
"Uh...I was denied entry and had to spend my time surrounded by a
bunch of smelly
foreigners in a locked room and they treated me awfully. Foreigners
are so mean. It
is good to be back in Japan. NIPPON BANZAI!"
chuckers
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
>
>
>
> >The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigremovethislobe.ne.jp> wrote:
> >> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
>
> >> >The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigremovethislobe.ne.jp> wrote:
> >> >> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that
>
> >> >> >Remember to always enter the US under your US passport, however.
>
> >> >> This has always gotten me confused. If the Japanese immigration guy stamps your
> >> >> Japanese passport when you leave, and the American immigration guy stamps your
> >> >> US passport when you enter the US, then what do you tell the Japanese
> >> >> immigration guy when you come back home again and there's absolutely nothing in
> >> >> your Japanese passport that shows where you've been? "Uh, sir, I stamped you
> >> >> out, but where did you go? The International Space Station?"
>
> >> >According to the people who've done this, the US customs agents are usually
> >> >happy to stamp both passports.
>
> >> Heh. Watch, someday I'll naturalize, and the next time I go to the US, I get the
> >> customs agent to which "usually" does not apply.
>
> >> And I wonder what happens when you're in the baggage claim waiting for your
> >> suitcase with LET'S HAPPY TRIP printed on the side, and you suddenly think "OMG
> >> I FORGOT TO STAMP BOTH."
>
> >Just checked with (one of) my daughter. She shows the US passport, and asks
> >them to stamp the Japanese.
>
> Good to know. Thanks for the tip. In the event I am someday able to convince the
> wife that naturalization is a good idea...
>
What does naturalization have over, say, permanent residency? The
right to vote is
one thing that springs to mind but if/when the DPJ comes to power this
time next
week, foreigners might get the right to vote anyway, at least at the
local level.
Oh, you won't have to carry your gaijin card, I suppose but I don't
consider that to
be particularly onerous. Any non-Asian would have to convince the
local PD
that you don't need a gaijin card because you aren't gaijin whenever
they roust you,
which, according to Debito, HAPPENS EVERYDAY SO LETS ALL SING "WE
SHALL OVERCOME!"
You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law
goes into effect.
The only other advantage I have heard was that Japanese citizens are
perhaps better liked
than certain other countries so getting visa (or even being able to go
without a visa) to travel to
various places is easier with a Japanese passport than some other
types of passports.
Am I missing anything? I am sure my wife would throttle me if I ever
got it into my head
that I ought to naturalise to Japanese.
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>> Good to know. Thanks for the tip. In the event I am someday able to convince the
>> wife that naturalization is a good idea...
>
>What does naturalization have over, say, permanent residency? The right to vote is
>one thing that springs to mind but if/when the DPJ comes to power this time next
>week, foreigners might get the right to vote anyway, at least at the local level.
I don't know, I actually find myself opposing this for a number of reasons,
mostly ideological. If you're going to be committed to a country you should go
all the way. If I'm going to get the right to vote I don't want "at least at the
local level". I want the whole thing. I don't pay taxes just at the local level,
either.
Does the US extend suffrage to non-citizens? I forgot.
>Oh, you won't have to carry your gaijin card, I suppose but I don't consider that to
>be particularly onerous. Any non-Asian would have to convince the local PD
> that you don't need a gaijin card because you aren't gaijin whenever they roust you,
>which, according to Debito, HAPPENS EVERYDAY SO LETS ALL SING "WE SHALL OVERCOME!"
Although I have only ever been requested to show my alien card to random cops on
the street once in 17 years... yeah. I won't have to carry my alien card, but I
will have to carry my Japanese passport to prove that I don't have to carry my
alien card. Win-win!
>You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law goes
>into effect.
And I will have my own family register. Currently, I taint my wife's.
>The only other advantage I have heard was that Japanese citizens are perhaps better liked
>than certain other countries so getting visa (or even being able to go without a visa)
>to travel to various places is easier with a Japanese passport than some other
>types of passports.
I don't travel to places where such things would be required anymore. I do my
biannual trip to the US to see my family, and that's it.
>Am I missing anything?
Currently the only other thing I could think of in the same vein as the above
would be, you could come home again to the country you live in without needing a
re-entry permit and a terrorist photo and a terrorist fingerprinting EVERY.
SINGLE. TIME.
This is the thing that burns my britches the most, more than Mr. James (I don't
eat at McDonald's); more than the Roppongi white people drug testing (I wouldn't
go to Roppongi at machete-point); more than the stupid onsens (I have a bathtub
and I know how to use it). I'm a permanent resident, and the current immigration
requirements have rendered it completely meaningless. I don't like that.
>I am sure my wife would throttle me if I ever got it into my head that
>I ought to naturalise to Japanese.
I decided long ago that I'm going to live here for the rest of my life. My
entire life is here now, so why wouldn't I want to state my full commitment to
the country in which I reside? And in return, wouldn't I want a legal guarantee
(if a cultural one was otherwise impossible) that I would be recognized as a
member of that society?
I would keep my US passport to facilitate visits to family members, but I see no
reason why I shouldn't do it, to make it *really* permanent. I believe the
proper phrase is けじめをつける。Either do it all the way or don't do it at all.
I would be willing to go through the paper chase (I already have the vast
majority of the required documents) and the invasive interrogations and
floggings by the jackbooted storm troopers if it meant proving that goddammit I
made a decision and I'm sticking to it.
This is why I think Debito is a big counterproductive blotch who does nothing
but perpetuate negative foreign stereotypes even as he flails around trying to
dispel them. He became a Japanese national for the express purpose of waving his
Japanese passport in front of everybody's face while yelling "DIPLOMATIC
IMMUNITAAAAAAAAY!"
--
The 2-Belo [the2beloATmsdDOTbiglobeDOTneDOTjp]
alt.flame alt.fan.karl-malden.nose alt.alien.vampire.flonk.flonk.flonk
meow a brimful of asha on a 45 meow
meowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeowmeow
"The 1980s will be the most catastrophic decade in the history of man."
- Hal Lindsey
chuckers
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that chuckers has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> [...]
>
> >> Good to know. Thanks for the tip. In the event I am someday able to convince the
> >> wife that naturalization is a good idea...
>
> >What does naturalization have over, say, permanent residency? The right to vote is
> >one thing that springs to mind but if/when the DPJ comes to power this time next
> >week, foreigners might get the right to vote anyway, at least at the local level.
>
> I don't know, I actually find myself opposing this for a number of reasons,
> mostly ideological. If you're going to be committed to a country you should go
> all the way. If I'm going to get the right to vote I don't want "at least at the
> local level". I want the whole thing. I don't pay taxes just at the local level,
> either.
>
> Does the US extend suffrage to non-citizens? I forgot.
I believe the US has suffrage for non-citizens in certain areas for
local elections.
Some elections require citizenship, others do not. Some areas require
citizenship,
others do not. Way too messy.
>
> >Oh, you won't have to carry your gaijin card, I suppose but I don't consider that to
> >be particularly onerous. Any non-Asian would have to convince the local PD
> > that you don't need a gaijin card because you aren't gaijin whenever they roust you,
> >which, according to Debito, HAPPENS EVERYDAY SO LETS ALL SING "WE SHALL OVERCOME!"
>
> Although I have only ever been requested to show my alien card to random cops on
> the street once in 17 years... yeah. I won't have to carry my alien card, but I
> will have to carry my Japanese passport to prove that I don't have to carry my
> alien card. Win-win!
>
I have yet to be randomly stopped to show my card by the local
constabulary but
have had to show it at various places (hotels etc.) because I had no
other form of ID.
Whether ID was actually required is a seperate issue. Now that I have
my DL converted,
I use that when I am required to show photo ID. Haven't been accosted
on my
bicycle, either. Having my daughter strapped into the back may have
helped with
that, though.
> >You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law goes
> >into effect.
>
> And I will have my own family register. Currently, I taint my wife's.
>
True. But to what advantage? And you might likely have to go to
family court
to get it changed so your wife was to "taint" yours if that is what
you/she wanted.
IANAL.
> >The only other advantage I have heard was that Japanese citizens are perhaps better liked
> >than certain other countries so getting visa (or even being able to go without a visa)
> >to travel to various places is easier with a Japanese passport than some other
> >types of passports.
>
> I don't travel to places where such things would be required anymore. I do my
> biannual trip to the US to see my family, and that's it.
>
I don't travel back home near as often as that. Again, this was
pretty much only an advantage
for people from 4th world types of countries.
> >Am I missing anything?
>
> Currently the only other thing I could think of in the same vein as the above
> would be, you could come home again to the country you live in without needing a
> re-entry permit and a terrorist photo and a terrorist fingerprinting EVERY.
> SINGLE. TIME.
>
Re-entry permit (the only really TRUE gaijin-only tax in Japan) is
also going away when the
new law comes into affect. YAH!
Fingerprinting and terrorist photo, yes, that is annoying. But it
isn't as if I am not leaving
fingerprints all over the place everywhere I go anyway.
> This is the thing that burns my britches the most, more than Mr. James (I don't
> eat at McDonald's); more than the Roppongi white people drug testing (I wouldn't
> go to Roppongi at machete-point); more than the stupid onsens (I have a bathtub
> and I know how to use it). I'm a permanent resident, and the current immigration
> requirements have rendered it completely meaningless. I don't like that.
>
That sounds like me. I am PR as well.
What it got for me:
Ability to sign most of my future earnings away to the bank until
they deem I have paid them enough to sign over the entire house to my
name.
The ability to be ungainfully unemployed for a brief period without
having to worry
about getting deported if I couldn't find a job before my visa ran out
(my PR app
completed about 1 month after my previous company folded up shop and
left Japan.
I didn't mention that when I went to get my passport stamped.)
The ability to not have to remember to renew my visa once a year (or
every 3 years.)
A friend of mine became a visa overstayer because he forgot to renew
and his employer
didn't remind him. After apoligising, imigration issued him a new
visa. But then he did
the same thing AGAIN the next year. He had to find a bigger wig to
apoligise to in order
to get his visa renewed again. Being nikkei might have helped. Lord
knows what might have
happened if he was from a tin pot little African country.
Okay, so I have to remember to keep my passport updated as well as the
re-entry
permit but the former problem is unavoidable and the latter is going
away on its own.
> >I am sure my wife would throttle me if I ever got it into my head that
> >I ought to naturalise to Japanese.
>
> I decided long ago that I'm going to live here for the rest of my life. My
> entire life is here now, so why wouldn't I want to state my full commitment to
> the country in which I reside? And in return, wouldn't I want a legal guarantee
> (if a cultural one was otherwise impossible) that I would be recognized as a
> member of that society?
>
> I would keep my US passport to facilitate visits to family members, but I see no
> reason why I shouldn't do it, to make it *really* permanent. I believe the
> proper phrase is けじめをつける。Either do it all the way or don't do it at all.
> I would be willing to go through the paper chase (I already have the vast
> majority of the required documents) and the invasive interrogations and
> floggings by the jackbooted storm troopers if it meant proving that goddammit I
> made a decision and I'm sticking to it.
>
I am pretty much settled in here myself and in it for the long haul.
Or at least
until I wake up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night screaming
"WHAT AM I
DOING WITH MY LIFE!?!?"
Starting over back home would be difficult, to say the least.
Especially in this
economy. I fully understand about けじめ and think that if I were to do
the
"hardcore" thing (as Debito refers to it) I *would* do the "hardcore"
thing and
actually throw away my home country's passport and NOT renew it. Why
be
a weasle? It is one thing to have dual citizenship by birth or having
someone
come up and giving it to you because you are a good guy, but if you
are going
to make a decision to change to a new nationality, you should have the
balls
to go all the way and forego your previous one. You don't have to
forego your
culture or upbringing of course.
I just don't feel I need to give up my current nationality, even if I
am here for a long
time. Sure, PR can be taken away, but then so can Japanese
Nationality if
you weasle it, according to Japanese law.
Of course, doing the non-weasley hardcore thing means having to be
fingerprinted
and terrorist photo-ed whenever I go back to my home country.
Besides, the wife is convinced we will be retiring to Hawaii when the
time comes.
Being a hardcore non-weasle would probably put a crimp in that (which
may not
be a bad thing....)
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 25, 11:29 am, The 2-Belo <the2b...@msd.bigREMOVETHISlobe.ne.jp>
> wrote:
> > Does the US extend suffrage to non-citizens? I forgot.
> I believe the US has suffrage for non-citizens in certain areas for
> local elections.
No, it does not; San Francisco once tried to allow it for school board
elections, and it was shot down with extreme prejudice.
> Some elections require citizenship, others do not. Some areas require
> citizenship, others do not.
I know of no public elections open to non-citizens. Some European nations
allow limited participation in local elections.
> > alien card. Win-win!
> >
> I have yet to be randomly stopped to show my card by the local
> constabulary but
I was asked to show it a couple times, but when I didn't have it, I simply
apologized, told the officer where I lived (usually just pointed, as I
was usually out on a short errand), and was let off without even a mild
warning.
> > >You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law goes
> > >into effect.
> > And I will have my own family register. Currently, I taint my wife's.
> True. But to what advantage? And you might likely have to go to
> family court
> to get it changed so your wife was to "taint" yours if that is what
> you/she wanted.
Actually, he can simply get "adopted" by his in-laws, which makes it then
his registry.
Mike
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>> Although I have only ever been requested to show my alien card to random cops on
>> the street once in 17 years... yeah. I won't have to carry my alien card, but I
>> will have to carry my Japanese passport to prove that I don't have to carry my
>> alien card. Win-win!
>>
>I have yet to be randomly stopped to show my card by the local constabulary but
>have had to show it at various places (hotels etc.) because I had no other form of ID.
>Whether ID was actually required is a seperate issue. Now that I have my DL converted,
>I use that when I am required to show photo ID. Haven't been accosted on my
>bicycle, either. Having my daughter strapped into the back may have
>helped with that, though.
Every once in a great while (twice, as of this writing) I'll come across a
business hotel where the staff will insist I write my name in Roman letters and
hand over my alien card so they can make a copy "because it is hotel policy". I
will simply state that I don't have my alien card on me (a lie, but they don't
have to know that) and a driver's license will suffice -- like it suffices for
everyone else that patronizes the joint -- and if they can't accept that I can
always go somewhere else. Both times they have acquiesced.
Before you ask, I did not return later to picket the place dressed as a seal,
no.
>> >You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law goes
>> >into effect.
>>
>> And I will have my own family register. Currently, I taint my wife's.
>
>True. But to what advantage?
Permanence. Being a beneficiary. Peace of mind. Because I don't like being a
footnote.
>And you might likely have to go to family court
From what I understand she will simply be registered on mine as if we had been
that way in the first place. We're 別姓 anyway (she didn't take my last name) so
it's a matter of going through the motions we would have 10 years ago had I had
a koseki at the time.
[...]
>> Currently the only other thing I could think of in the same vein as the above
>> would be, you could come home again to the country you live in without needing a
>> re-entry permit and a terrorist photo and a terrorist fingerprinting EVERY.
>> SINGLE. TIME.
>>
>Re-entry permit (the only really TRUE gaijin-only tax in Japan) is also going away when the
>new law comes into affect. YAH!
>
>Fingerprinting and terrorist photo, yes, that is annoying. But it isn't as if I am not leaving
>fingerprints all over the place everywhere I go anyway.
Again, this is a point of personal preference; it is not simply "annoying" to
me. When I enter Japan I am going home, to my house. I want to be treated
accordingly. But currently, not only do I have to stand there like a cretin in
front of a webcam, I get a passport stamp that says 上陸許可(再）: You Are
Permitted To Walk On Our Soil (Again). And then I fill out a form that says
"Purpose of Re-entry" on it. Why, to live my life, sir. Why do you ask?
>> This is the thing that burns my britches the most, more than Mr. James (I don't
>> eat at McDonald's); more than the Roppongi white people drug testing (I wouldn't
>> go to Roppongi at machete-point); more than the stupid onsens (I have a bathtub
>> and I know how to use it). I'm a permanent resident, and the current immigration
>> requirements have rendered it completely meaningless. I don't like that.
>
>That sounds like me. I am PR as well.
>
>What it got for me:
>
>Ability to sign most of my future earnings away to the bank until
>they deem I have paid them enough to sign over the entire house to my
>name.
Done. I'll be indebted until I'm 65 :D
>The ability to be ungainfully unemployed for a brief period without having to worry
>about getting deported if I couldn't find a job before my visa ran out (my PR app
>completed about 1 month after my previous company folded up shop and left Japan.
>I didn't mention that when I went to get my passport stamped.)
>The ability to not have to remember to renew my visa once a year (or every 3 years.)
When I first came here it was six months. Now *that* was a bitch.
>Okay, so I have to remember to keep my passport updated as well as the re-entry
>permit but the former problem is unavoidable and the latter is going away on its own.
When *does* this take effect, anyway? I was under the impression that the only
thing that was changing was adding more personal information to the alien card
on an IC chip that could be easily sniffed by super-secret secret police yakuza
operatives with wireless receivers or something.
>> >I am sure my wife would throttle me if I ever got it into my head that
>> >I ought to naturalise to Japanese.
>>
>> I decided long ago that I'm going to live here for the rest of my life. My
>> entire life is here now, so why wouldn't I want to state my full commitment to
>> the country in which I reside? And in return, wouldn't I want a legal guarantee
>> (if a cultural one was otherwise impossible) that I would be recognized as a
>> member of that society?
>>
>> I would keep my US passport to facilitate visits to family members, but I see no
>> reason why I shouldn't do it, to make it *really* permanent. I believe the
>> proper phrase is けじめをつける。Either do it all the way or don't do it at all.
>> I would be willing to go through the paper chase (I already have the vast
>> majority of the required documents) and the invasive interrogations and
>> floggings by the jackbooted storm troopers if it meant proving that goddammit I
>> made a decision and I'm sticking to it.
>>
>I am pretty much settled in here myself and in it for the long haul. Or at least
>until I wake up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night screaming "WHAT AM I
>DOING WITH MY LIFE!?!?"
That already happened to me. I was in the Philippines at the time, though. (Long
work-gulag-related story.)
>Starting over back home would be difficult, to say the least. Especially in this
>economy. I fully understand about けじめ and think that if I were to do the
>"hardcore" thing (as Debito refers to it) I *would* do the "hardcore" thing and
>actually throw away my home country's passport and NOT renew it.
Once that opportunity presents itself I would be doing the same thing --
particularly when I think that I'm likely bringing my mother over *here* once
starts needing care.
>the wife is convinced we will be retiring to Hawaii when the time comes.
AH! Now we have uncovered the real reason! :)
I have gone through the "I wanna live out my retirement days in a tropical
paradise!" thing with my wife before in years past, but we have since become
realistic about it: I'm never going to make that much damned money. I don't
think the possibility of buying a camper and taking road trips up and down the
country in our twilight years is too much of a stretch, but living on Oahu is
pushing it.
chuckers
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that chuckers has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> [...]
>
>
> >What it got for me:
>
> >Ability to sign most of my future earnings away to the bank until
> >they deem I have paid them enough to sign over the entire house to my
> >name.
>
> Done. I'll be indebted until I'm 65 :D
>
Been doing a lot of double payments. Hope to be finished by 55.
Those
double payments are probably going to have to stop when the little
starts
school, though.
> >Okay, so I have to remember to keep my passport updated as well as the re-entry
> >permit but the former problem is unavoidable and the latter is going away on its own.
>
> When *does* this take effect, anyway? I was under the impression that the only
> thing that was changing was adding more personal information to the alien card
> on an IC chip that could be easily sniffed by super-secret secret police yakuza
> operatives with wireless receivers or something.
>
The only thing I can find about it is here:
http://www.asahi.com/politics/update/0708/TKY200907080106.html
which says it will take effect within 3 years. Gaijin card goes away
to be replaced with a
"Residence card." Still required to carry it unless you are zainichi.
Other things covered by it appear here:
http://www.shugiin.go.jp/itdb_gian.nsf/html/gian/honbun/houan/g17105044.htm?OpenDocument
One of the big things is they are clamping down on pension/health
insurance cheats. Part
of that goes into affect next year (probably from some different law)
which is probably going to
cause a lot of the eikawa burger flippers to bug out when they can't
get their visas renewed.
If you are really worried about the IC chip in the new card, line the
back of your wallet with a
bit of aluminum foil and keep it next to your DL. The foil will help
block the signals from a fair
distance and the IC chip in the DL might cause some additional
interference. They *might*
bring out super-duper high powered sniffers but reading the IC card
would be the least of
your worries in that case. I would be more worried about them
radiating my junk.
I also think it is likely that there will be 1 or 2 PINs associated
with the info like the DL.
Yeah, yeah, I know. Super secret government agency requires you to
put a PIN on it for
your protection and *they* can't read it either because of the PIN.
But it should keep the
akiba-kei otaku from sniffing my butt for my personal info.
> >I am pretty much settled in here myself and in it for the long haul. Or at least
> >until I wake up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night screaming "WHAT AM I
> >DOING WITH MY LIFE!?!?"
>
> That already happened to me. I was in the Philippines at the time, though. (Long
> work-gulag-related story.)
>
Do tell. Not as if this group isn't inundated with activity nor that
this thread can't handle
another fork. But only if you want, of course.
> >the wife is convinced we will be retiring to Hawaii when the time comes.
>
> AH! Now we have uncovered the real reason! :)
>
> I have gone through the "I wanna live out my retirement days in a tropical
> paradise!" thing with my wife before in years past, but we have since become
> realistic about it: I'm never going to make that much damned money. I don't
> think the possibility of buying a camper and taking road trips up and down the
> country in our twilight years is too much of a stretch, but living on Oahu is
> pushing it.
>
It's the wife's thinking, not mine. I am fine here although
retirement in Kansai
or the inaka would be more preferable. The wife will have none of
that, though.
And don't go to Oahu. Big Island is better.
Malaysia is supposed to be pretty good for Japanese retirees. There
is a Japanese
community and Japanese speaking doctors. Things are cheap and if the
Yen stays strong, your meagre pension could easily be used as
savings. Probably
can't do that in Wai-Ha.
Jim Breen
> I know of no public elections open to non-citizens. Some European nations
> allow limited participation in local elections.
Here in the state of Victoria in Australia, non-citizen land-owners
can enrol and vote in local government elections. Dunno what happens
elsewhere in Oz.
The UK allows full voting rights to citizens of Commonwealth countries
(my son, daughter and son-in-law all voted in the 2005 General Election
there.) All you need is to have an address to put on your enrolment.
(There are changes proposed to the UK electoral law which will remove
this ability to vote.)
--
Jim Breen http://www.csse.monash.edu.au/~jwb/
Clayton School of Information Technology,
Monash University, VIC 3800, Australia
ジム・ブリーン@モナシュ大学
chuckers
> mtfes...@netMAPSONscape.net wrote:
> > I know of no public elections open to non-citizens. Some European nations
> > allow limited participation in local elections.
>
> Here in the state of Victoria in Australia, non-citizen land-owners
> can enrol and vote in local government elections. Dunno what happens
> elsewhere in Oz.
>
Wonder what happens if the *don't* vote? Same as citizens?
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
[...]
>> >Ability to sign most of my future earnings away to the bank until
>> >they deem I have paid them enough to sign over the entire house to my
>> >name.
>>
>> Done. I'll be indebted until I'm 65 :D
>>
>Been doing a lot of double payments. Hope to be finished by 55. Those
>double payments are probably going to have to stop when the little [one] starts
>school, though.
I don't have any little ones. I have piles of camera lenses, however.
>> >Okay, so I have to remember to keep my passport updated as well as the re-entry
>> >permit but the former problem is unavoidable and the latter is going away on its own.
>>
>> When *does* this take effect, anyway? I was under the impression that the only
>> thing that was changing was adding more personal information to the alien card
>> on an IC chip that could be easily sniffed by super-secret secret police yakuza
>> operatives with wireless receivers or something.
>
>The only thing I can find about it is here:
>
>http://www.asahi.com/politics/update/0708/TKY200907080106.html
>
>which says it will take effect within 3 years. Gaijin card goes away
>to be replaced with a "Residence card."
Oh, that. I thought that was snecked for being too expensive to implement and
not really being any more effective in preventing illegals than the current one
is.
>Still required to carry it unless you are zainichi.
Yeah, for supposed historical reasons (i.e. to avoid pissing off all the Koreans
who might think they're being rounded up and oppressed again). But I don't have
anything to do with that. I don't wanna carry anything either. Waah baaw whine
bitch complain. :)
And again, it doesn't eliminate the tit-for-tat entry procedures (everyone knows
it's only being implemented because of the US-VISIT program).
>Other things covered by it appear here:
>
>http://www.shugiin.go.jp/itdb_gian.nsf/html/gian/honbun/houan/g17105044.htm?OpenDocument
>
>One of the big things is they are clamping down on pension/health insurance cheats. Part
>of that goes into affect next year (probably from some different law) which is probably going to
>cause a lot of the eikawa burger flippers to bug out when they can't get their visas renewed.
It will likely do little damage. There are 4 eikaiwa burger flippers ready to
replace any current one who leaves.
>If you are really worried about the IC chip in the new card, line the
>back of your wallet with a bit of aluminum foil
You silly man. Anyone with sense knows that you're going to need a huge
battery-powered radio jamming device to counter this. Why do you think those
long-haired trekking hippies are riding trains wearing those massive rucksacks
all the time?
>> >I am pretty much settled in here myself and in it for the long haul. Or at least
>> >until I wake up in a cold sweat in the middle of the night screaming "WHAT AM I
>> >DOING WITH MY LIFE!?!?"
>>
>> That already happened to me. I was in the Philippines at the time, though. (Long
>> work-gulag-related story.)
>>
>Do tell. Not as if this group isn't inundated with activity nor that
>this thread can't handle another fork. But only if you want, of course.
Yeah. Well, it wasn't pretty. *long deep breath*
1) IN 1999, WAR WAS BEGINNING. (Girlfriend lives with me in apartment in
Kakamigahara, happily. I had already been in this country 7 years already so
everything was honky-dory, not a care in the world, la de la de la when all of a
sudden:)
2) GIRLFRIEND PARENTS HOUSE BURN DOWN (WHAT YOU SAY?!)
3) Fire squad: ALL YOUR FURNITURE ARE BELONG TO US. YOUR PIANO HAVE NO CHANCE TO
SURVIVE MAKE YOUR TIME.
4) So her family survived but had lost everything and was in (not to be overly
dramatic but these are the facts) a borrowed squalid hovel with an outhouse hole
in the ground for sanitation.
5) We were planning to get married *someday* but now that we were feeling our
own mortality breathing down our necks I thought PERHAPS WE SHOULD GET MARRIED
NOW.
6) Her family can't afford to rebuild, so THIS LOOKS LIKE A JOB FOR etc etc.
7) I obtain permanent residency to deal with #6.
8) As a result of #7 I can now get a 30-year home loan to deal with #6 with the
provision that I get ownership of the house and my own workroom with a leather
command chair and laser turrets. I am in the midst of selecting the pattern of
Kryptonite armor cladding when:
9) The company I work for COLLAPSES HORRIBLY LIKE THE WORLD TRADE CENTER
AIEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. I am now an Unemployed Foreigner, which is a Bad State to Be
In.
10) Because of #9 I now can't qualify for #8 so things are looking Very Really
Ultra-Bad. We have a foundation but no way to pay for it and I begin to fear
evil yakuzas cutting my fingers off one at a time.
11) A friend sets me up with a huge scary corporate octopus with enough clout to
call up the bank and tell them that He's Working for Us Now, so they can give me
the loan back. FUKKEN SAVED!
12) Or so I think.
13) I end up in the Philippines in a computer chip factory waste water treatment
plant at the bottom of a tank knee deep in sludge for a year and a half. (I'm
not trying to be overly dramatic. I'm just stating facts.) I had lived in our
newly built house for about 4 months.
14) The *real* World Trade Center *really* collapses.
My wife, thinking I was about to be assassinated, promptly goes insane.
(Figuratively.)(I hope.)
15) After 14 or 15 months of working 17-hour days with no days off in an
environment where it's 35C every day of the year and the McDonald's is guarded
by men with automatic weapons, one night I wake up in a cold sweat screaming
"WHAT AM I DOING WITH MY LIFE!?!?" (Which is, of course, the relevant part of
this story.)
16) I announce my intention to quit my job while still in the Philippines,
enduring 3 hours of verbal abuse by a superior in my hotel room.
17) Once I plant my toes back on Japanese soil I am tearfully singing an off-key
rendition of the national anthem at full volume in the car while at the same
time resolving that the next time I leave this country against my will I'm going
to be in a box.
18) I get another job, at which I work to this day. You're welcome.
[...]
>Malaysia is supposed to be pretty good for Japanese retirees. There
>is a Japanese community and Japanese speaking doctors
B-B-B-B-BUT THE *MUZLIMZ*#{`+%&{#`+%
Jim Breen
AFAIK, yes. If you are enrolled to vote, you have to unless you
have a good excuse. The usual excuse was that you were away
interstate/overseas/etc., but now the voting is by post and you have
a couple of weeks to return the ballot paper. It's about a $50
fine for not voting.
You get to vote for each local council/ward you have a property in.
My wife and I can vote in two wards in the council we live in, because
we own two houses, and we also vote for the council where our holiday
house is.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net wrote:
> > I know of no public elections open to non-citizens. Some European nations
> > allow limited participation in local elections.
> Here in the state of Victoria in Australia, non-citizen land-owners
> can enrol and vote in local government elections. Dunno what happens
> elsewhere in Oz.
I'd heard that, and I heard the same about New Kiwiland.
> The UK allows full voting rights to citizens of Commonwealth countries
> (my son, daughter and son-in-law all voted in the 2005 General Election
> there.) All you need is to have an address to put on your enrolment.
> (There are changes proposed to the UK electoral law which will remove
> this ability to vote.)
Do you need to be a permanent UK resident/Commonwealth citizen of some sort?
Mike
Jim Breen
> Jim Breen <jimb...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>The UK allows full voting rights to citizens of Commonwealth countries
>>(my son, daughter and son-in-law all voted in the 2005 General Election
>>there.) All you need is to have an address to put on your enrolment.
>>(There are changes proposed to the UK electoral law which will remove
>>this ability to vote.)
>
> Do you need to be a permanent UK resident/Commonwealth citizen of some sort?
Just a Commonwealth citizenship and a local address.
Back in the good old days Commonwealth (and before that Empire)
citizens could move freely between countries and settle, work
and vote. The UK cancelled that arrangment in the late 1960s
when the influx of "Asian" (i.e. Indian) emigres from Idi
Amin's Uganda upset things a lot. Other countries eventually
reciprocated; in Australia's case in 1984, so Brits settling
here before 1984 can vote without having taken out Australian
citizenship.
Jean-Marc Desperrier
> Some nations do
> not recognize renunciation (France and S Korea used to be that way, but
> there are undoubtedly more)
Where did you get the idea France did not recognize nationality
renunciation ? They are even some cases where the renunciation is
imposed (as a consequence of Council of Europe's convention on reduction
of cases of multiple nationality).
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> mtfe...@netMAPSONscape.net wrote:
> > Some nations do
> > not recognize renunciation (France and S Korea used to be that way, but
> > there are undoubtedly more)
> Where did you get the idea France did not recognize nationality
> renunciation ?
From a French guy who lived across the hall from me.
Mike
chuckers
Especially considering the massive hate-on he has for Tony. From what
I can gather, a lot of that seems
to be centred around how much Debito despises the fact that everyone
in Japan knows and loves Tony
because of the books but the only people that seem to give a whit
about Debito are his sock puppets and astroturfers.
Jim Breen
> Debito is probably going to *LOVE* this:
>
> http://www.japantoday.com/category/entertainment/view/mao-inoue-and-jonathan-sherr-to-star-in-my-darling-is-a-foreigner
Well, well. Tony and Saori are friends of mine; I'll have to see it.
> Especially considering the massive hate-on he has for Tony. From what
> I can gather, a lot of that seems
> to be centred around how much Debito despises the fact that everyone
> in Japan knows and loves Tony
> because of the books but the only people that seem to give a whit
> about Debito are his sock puppets and astroturfers.
I'm 80:20 about Debito. 80% of the time I think he's making a fool
of himself, but 20% of the time I think he's saying and doing
things that I wish more gaigins would say and do. Often we bend
over backwards to accept and defend blatantly xenophobic
actions in the interest of having a quiet life and not making
a fuss.
chuckers
> I'm 80:20 about Debito. 80% of the time I think he's making a fool
> of himself, but 20% of the time I think he's saying and doing
> things that I wish more gaigins would say and do. Often we bend
> over backwards to accept and defend blatantly xenophobic
> actions in the interest of having a quiet life and not making
> a fuss.
>
Not sure what my percentage would be. I can agree with some of
his message. But the way he CONVEYS the message just
makes me wretch. The amount of ego stroking and self congratulations
on his site can cause brain rot. It is too easy to him imagine
stroking other things while he is reading the comments of his "fans."
Damn, now I have THAT image back in my head...
The 2-Belo
exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>chuckers wrote:
>> Debito is probably going to *LOVE* this:
>>
>> http://www.japantoday.com/category/entertainment/view/mao-inoue-and-jonathan-sherr-to-star-in-my-darling-is-a-foreigner
>
>Well, well. Tony and Saori are friends of mine; I'll have to see it.
Do tell. My wife adores her books. Seems to "find similarities" or something.
Hmm.
>> Especially considering the massive hate-on he has for Tony. From what
>> I can gather, a lot of that seems
>> to be centred around how much Debito despises the fact that everyone
>> in Japan knows and loves Tony
>> because of the books but the only people that seem to give a whit
>> about Debito are his sock puppets and astroturfers.
>
>I'm 80:20 about Debito. 80% of the time I think he's making a fool
>of himself, but 20% of the time I think he's saying and doing
>things that I wish more gaigins would say and do. Often we bend
>over backwards to accept and defend blatantly xenophobic
>actions in the interest of having a quiet life and not making
>a fuss.
Heh. Avoid confrontation in the interest of not making a fuss? That sounds like
the classic Japanese way of doing things! And they say we refuse to assimilate?!
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that Jim Breen has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
> >chuckers wrote:
> >> Debito is probably going to *LOVE* this:
> >>
> >> http://www.japantoday.com/category/entertainment/view/mao-inoue-and-jonathan-sherr-to-star-in-my-darling-is-a-foreigner
> >
> >Well, well. Tony and Saori are friends of mine; I'll have to see it.
> Do tell. My wife adores her books. Seems to "find similarities" or something.
> Hmm.
So does mine. the description in the article, though, is puzzling:
"the comic books tell the tales of her life with American husband Tony
Laszlo, as they encounter and overcome cultural differences and barriers"
I don't see why that's interesting; if she's like most Japanese wifes,
she simply explains why he's wrong, and if he knows what's good for him,
he either agrees or suddenly remembers an important task elsewhere.
Mike
Jean-Marc Desperrier
He certainly got it confused with, as used to be, automatic acquisition
of french nationality with no possibility of refusing it.
But this automatic acquisition concerns people who are born and living
in France from non-french parents. That was first changed to not be
automatic (after some nationalist uproar about peoples who were french
without even knowing it), and then changed again to be automatic, but
with a 6 month delay after majority to renunce it.
But even at that time, if you wanted to renounce french nationality, all
what was required was living permanently in another country, owning
another nationality and making an official demand. Thus the problem only
concerned people who wanted to both live in France and *not* be french.
And you probably guessed it by now that law had originally been created
to make sure there would never be a zainichi problem in France.
John W.
wrote:
> We have a report from the fj.life.in-japan Dynamics Officer that Jim Breen has
> exploded. Flight director confirms that:
>
> >chuckers wrote:
> >> Debito is probably going to *LOVE* this:
>
>
> >Well, well. Tony and Saori are friends of mine; I'll have to see it.
>
perspective that I will share if I know what's good for me.
John W.
John W.
> On Aug 27, 9:13 am, Jim Breen <jimbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm 80:20 about Debito. 80% of the time I think he's making a fool
> > of himself, but 20% of the time I think he's saying and doing
> > things that I wish more gaigins would say and do. Often we bend
> > over backwards to accept and defend blatantly xenophobic
> > actions in the interest of having a quiet life and not making
> > a fuss.
>
> Not sure what my percentage would be. I can agree with some of
> his message.
I don't know if he still has his Yahoo group, but he used to revoke
membership of anyone who posted a dissenting or contrary opinion; I
can't stand closed minded people, and he's firmly in that camp. I
think every member of society has to bend a little to conform to that
society to some extent, even if it's your home country. But every rule
of society will not apply to every individual, and it definitely won't
if you consider yourself the white Rosa Parks of Nippon.
> But the way he CONVEYS the message just
> makes me wretch. The amount of ego stroking and self congratulations
> on his site can cause brain rot. It is too easy to him imagine
> stroking other things while he is reading the comments of his "fans."
>
I haven't read anything he's said in a long time; it went from "Hmmmm"
to "Hehe" to "hurl" fairly quickly.
John W.
mtfe...@netmapsonscape.net
> On Aug 26, 7:39?pm, chuckers <chucker...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Aug 27, 9:13 am, Jim Breen <jimbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > of himself, but 20% of the time I think he's saying and doing
> > > things that I wish more gaigins would say and do. Often we bend
> > > over backwards to accept and defend blatantly xenophobic
> > > actions in the interest of having a quiet life and not making
> > > a fuss.
> >
> > his message. ?
> I don't know if he still has his Yahoo group, but he used to revoke
> membership of anyone who posted a dissenting or contrary opinion; I
> can't stand closed minded people,
Me neither; oughtta be a law against 'em, there oughtta.
Mike
CL
You're forgetting the golden opportunity to pay more taxes. Once you're
a citizen, all of your overseas income and property becomes taxable in
Japan. If you were a burger flipper in Gaikoku and never had any real
property or other possessions, then there will be little change. But,
if mommy and daddy left you the family manse, their 20,000 shares of
Xerox, and the family cabin on The Lake, you'll get to pay Japanese
taxes on these items from now on. As I understand it, the tax treaties
that allow you to pay tax only in Japan or your home country only apply
to income taxes ... double taxation on everything else is okay.
> Oh, you won't have to carry your gaijin card, I suppose but I don't
> consider that to be particularly onerous. Any non-Asian would have to
> convince the local PD that you don't need a gaijin card because you
> aren't gaijin whenever they roust you, which, according to Debito,
> HAPPENS EVERYDAY SO LETS ALL SING "WE SHALL OVERCOME!"
I really hate the daily truncheon beatings but have come to expect them
as a small price to pay for the right to live in Paradise. And, after
you live here for a while, you can arrange a specific time for your
beating. I like that convenience. When you live in a small town like I
do, the two cops know who you are and have endearing names for you like
"Ano gaijin ..." and the Kenkei guys know a safe place on the main to
pull you over for your Driving While White license check.
> You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law
> goes into effect.
Before or after the family pets? I always liked that ""Dogs," "Cats,"
"Other Pets," "Gaijin, Notes and Other Comments"" organization. It gave
you an easy way to find your name, down at the bottom left corner of the
document. Sort of reassuring in its own little way.
> The only other advantage I have heard was that Japanese citizens are
> perhaps better liked than certain other countries so getting visa (or
> even being able to go without a visa) to travel to various places is
> easier with a Japanese passport than some other types of passports.
Yeah, but part of that is based upon appearance. And also, some places
like Japanese tourists better because they're easier to fleece than
people from other countries.
> Am I missing anything? I am sure my wife would throttle me if I ever
> got it into my head that I ought to naturalise to Japanese.
If I ever mentioned naturalization, I am sure I'd be bundled into a
straitjacket and hauled to the local mental health (sic) center.
--
CL
chuckers
> chuckers wrote:
[chop]
> > What does naturalization have over, say, permanent residency? The
> > right to vote is one thing that springs to mind but if/when the DPJ
> > comes to power this time next week, foreigners might get the right to
> > vote anyway, at least at the local level.
>
> You're forgetting the golden opportunity to pay more taxes. Once you're
> a citizen, all of your overseas income and property becomes taxable in
> Japan. If you were a burger flipper in Gaikoku and never had any real
> property or other possessions, then there will be little change. But,
> if mommy and daddy left you the family manse, their 20,000 shares of
> Xerox, and the family cabin on The Lake, you'll get to pay Japanese
> taxes on these items from now on. As I understand it, the tax treaties
> that allow you to pay tax only in Japan or your home country only apply
> to income taxes ... double taxation on everything else is okay.
>
I thought the rule was that if you been in J-Land for 5 plus years,
regardless
of visa status (LEGAL visa status at any rate) you were required to
pay taxes
on foreign sourced income anyway?
Ah, here it is:
http://www.nta.go.jp/taxanswer/english/12001.htm
The use of an alphabet on some of the words rather than Satan's
scratchings make
it difficult to read but it seems to say that if you are here for 5
years or more in a 10 year
period, the TAX authorities consider you to be a Permanent resident
(immigration people
want you to pay some money for that privilege) so you owe taxes on
income from overseas
(saying you are getting money from abroad sounds like you are a pimp.)
Even if you are under the 5 year limit, if you have money sent to you
in Japan, you have
to pay taxes on that as well.
Of course, how the taxman finds out about foreign income is probably
up to the individual
to report. The Swiss may bend over for the US government nowadays but
I doubt they
will for the Japanese.
On the plus side, filling out a Japanese tax form is a HELL of a lot
easier than anything
my home country could devise. Tends to all fit on one page instead of
a coming out
the size of doctoral disertation detailing the changes J-Land has
undergone since the
time Amaterasu Omikami until the intrdoction of the Nintendo Wii.
[chop]
> > You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law
> > goes into effect.
>
> Before or after the family pets? I always liked that ""Dogs," "Cats,"
> "Other Pets," "Gaijin, Notes and Other Comments"" organization. It gave
> you an easy way to find your name, down at the bottom left corner of the
> document. Sort of reassuring in its own little way.
>
That maybe Koseki. Or maybe not. Probably depends on where you live
because each ward/city office apparently has different rules for which
box
to put things in. Have to wait and see. It might be a completely
different
list in order to avoid tainting the locals.
Jim Breen
> He certainly got it confused with, as used to be, automatic acquisition
> of french nationality with no possibility of refusing it.
>
> But this automatic acquisition concerns people who are born and living
> in France from non-french parents. That was first changed to not be
> automatic (after some nationalist uproar about peoples who were french
> without even knowing it), and then changed again to be automatic, but
> with a 6 month delay after majority to renunce it.
In the late 19th/early 20th century the British embassy in Paris
even had a small maternity wing, so that female Brits living in
France could give birth there without their offspring
irrevocably becoming French citizens (and liable for conscription
if male.)
CL
> On Aug 28, 10:50 am, CL <flot...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> chuckers wrote:
> [chop]
>>> What does naturalization have over, say, permanent residency? The
>>> right to vote is one thing that springs to mind but if/when the DPJ
>>> comes to power this time next week, foreigners might get the right to
>>> vote anyway, at least at the local level.
>> You're forgetting the golden opportunity to pay more taxes. Once you're
>> a citizen, all of your overseas income and property becomes taxable in
>> Japan. If you were a burger flipper in Gaikoku and never had any real
>> property or other possessions, then there will be little change. But,
>> if mommy and daddy left you the family manse, their 20,000 shares of
>> Xerox, and the family cabin on The Lake, you'll get to pay Japanese
>> taxes on these items from now on. As I understand it, the tax treaties
>> that allow you to pay tax only in Japan or your home country only apply
>> to income taxes ... double taxation on everything else is okay.
>>
>
> I thought the rule was that if you been in J-Land for 5 plus years,
> regardless
> of visa status (LEGAL visa status at any rate) you were required to
> pay taxes
> on foreign sourced income anyway?
>
> Ah, here it is:
>
> http://www.nta.go.jp/taxanswer/english/12001.htm
TOTAL INCOME ... yes, this is true. But, note that I said TOTAL ASSETS.
And, if you are an American (swallows hard and raises hand) the USGOV
expects your heirs and assigns to cough up a mucho huge chunk of estate
tax to Internal Revenue that cannot be ameliorated by showing that you
have also paid another government. So, if you choose the Japan passport
option, you need to break the evil hold of foreign intervention or gift
the living shit out of your relatives and be permitted to live in their
new house.
> The use of an alphabet on some of the words rather than Satan's
> scratchings make it difficult to read but it seems to say that if you
> are here for 5 years or more in a 10 year period, the TAX authorities
> consider you to be a Permanent resident (immigration people want you
> to pay some money for that privilege) so you owe taxes on income from
> overseas (saying you are getting money from abroad sounds like you
> are a pimp.) Even if you are under the 5 year limit, if you have
> money sent to you in Japan, you have to pay taxes on that as well.
Immigration people want you to pay through sweating blood. I am not PR
despite having lived here for over 25 years. My wife has a Green Card
simply by being married to me for more than ten years. Never thought PR
was necessary. Got my home loan with out it. Paid my home loan without
it. Etc.
> Of course, how the taxman finds out about foreign income is probably
> up to the individual to report. The Swiss may bend over for the US
> government nowadays but I doubt they will for the Japanese.
Easy. A Japanese bank tells them. Japanese tell anyone in the world
anything they want to know unless it inconveniences them personally, in
which case it falls under the Privacy Act and cannot be divulged. I
have noticed that what people think falls under the Privacy Act is
proportional to how much trouble they'd be in if they told you.
> On the plus side, filling out a Japanese tax form is a HELL of a lot
> easier than anything my home country could devise. Tends to all fit
> on one page instead of a coming out the size of doctoral disertation
> detailing the changes J-Land has undergone since the time Amaterasu
> Omikami until the intrdoction of the Nintendo Wii.
Mukashi, mukashi, when I was still working in the securities (sic)
industry for a US company, a co-worker decided to creatively rip off the
Uncle of us all ... who promptly sent a Puerto Rican tax investigator to
Japan to audit all of the Americans in the company. I recall handing
over all of my tax return backup information and having the woman
sputter "This is all in Japanese! I can't read this!" and then getting
to point sagely out the window and say "Do you see that wall over there?
The other side is not America. That is the side I live on." (I still
commend myself for not asking if it was true that all Spanish speaking
women in the US are prostitutes ...)
> [chop]
>
>>> You will soon be listed in the Juminhyou, once the recently passed law
>>> goes into effect.
>> Before or after the family pets? I always liked that ""Dogs," "Cats,"
>> "Other Pets," "Gaijin, Notes and Other Comments"" organization. It gave
>> you an easy way to find your name, down at the bottom left corner of the
>> document. Sort of reassuring in its own little way.
>>
>
> That maybe Koseki. Or maybe not. Probably depends on where you live
> because each ward/city office apparently has different rules for
> which box to put things in. Have to wait and see. It might be a
> completely different list in order to avoid tainting the locals.
Koseki tohon. Shinagawa-ku. Even more special is that it is tied to an
address in a section of the ward that hasn't officially existed since
1963 and the ward decided that, as long as a family continued to use it
without interruption, the koseki address would not be updated to the new
one. My wife's family relocated there from Shitamachi, where they'd
lived since 1598, in 1883. The Kuyakusho has all of the records.
Whenever I go in for a copy, they have to find the One Old Guy Who Knows
the Old Address System. Every time one dies, they have to train a new
one and all of the old guys either spend half their day in the bathroom
or forget which desk they're working at and end up wandering around the
Kuyakusho until someone finds them and brings them back.
--
CL
John W.
> spend half their day in the bathroom
> or forget which desk they're working at and end up wandering around the
> Kuyakusho until someone finds them and brings them back.
>
"Kuyakusho".
John W.
CL
> Debito is probably going to *LOVE* this:
>
> http://www.japantoday.com/category/entertainment/view/mao-inoue-and-jonathan-sherr-to-star-in-my-darling-is-a-foreigner
>
> Especially considering the massive hate-on he has for Tony.
I have found that, in person, Tony does not seem to be as much bigger
than life as his wife makes him out to be. I think he owes about 99.9%
of his popularity to her. I've met both of them a few times and he
really doesn't make much of a permanent impression. Also have seen him
on several news programs / political debates and thought Tony could be
interchanged with the cute announcerette for the job of holding the
potted plant that makes up the background of those thrown-together ad
hoc proggies.
But, getting to lie next to Inoue Mao .... now THAT is interesting ...
> From what I can gather, a lot of that seems to be centred around how
> much Debito despises the fact that everyone in Japan knows and loves
> Tony because of the books but the only people that seem to give a
> whit about Debito are his sock puppets and astroturfers.
When the cameras are aimed at Tony, only the cameras are whining ...
--
CL