Nominations for August 2012 (I believe)

[Kasper Lauritzen]

I'm hereby posting the nominees for my month (August 2012). As always I dwell at the thought of just nominating Groucho, Chico and Harpo Marx (and indeed, which one would be your favorite?).... but NO, I need to enforce some experimental film on this forum :)

So combining two previous and two new nominees I offer you:

Stan Brakhage. American filmmaker of more than 300 films, many of which could be called "essays on seeing" - in his films Brakhage combines the seeing eye with the mind's eye to capture the full 'scope' of vision - an effort that often takes him beyond what can be filmed with a camera and into other strategies of cinematic expression (for example hand-print, rapid cutting, etc.)

Jan Svankmajer. Czech filmmaker/animator of short films and features - Svankmajer is deeply rooted in the Czech surrealism, humorous and grotesque, in the universe where Freud, Poe, De Sade, Carroll and Kafka also lives. Most of his films are sharp parables on the human condition and his best films capture a rare, surrealist beauty.

Jean Painleve. Early, French documentary filmmaker but perhaps even more decisive is his connection to the original surrealist group. Famously he has photographed underwater animals, which seem otherwise hard to imagine and are fantastic to watch, and he does so in a most dreamlike way.

Hollis Frampton. American structuralist filmmaker. His films can seem conceptual and constructed at first, but his mathematical compositions of image and sound manages to trigger a reaction in the viewer that is better described as instinctive than intellectual.

Let the voting begin and also

HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO THORKELL :D

Best regards,

Kasper

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

Thank you Kasper :)

Well, this is all so interesting but I have just had a private Stan
Brakhage month so I think he is out for me. I'm happy with all the
other ones but I guess I will give Jan Svankmajer my vote.

Stan Brakhage 0
Jan Svankmajer 1
Jean Painleve 0
Hollis Frampton 0

Thorkell

[anne]

I've seen quite a lot of these directors' films recently, it has been very interesting to see different forms of film-making.  I probably won't vote because I'm unlikely to watch the films again, but look forward to seeing what everyone has to say about them.
Anne

[Jake Fredel]

I would vote for Hollis Frampton, but Criterion is releasing a DVD retrospective of his work next month (I think), which I will not want to wait until August to watch. Therefore I will vote for Stan Brakhage. I've seen a considerable number of his films, but I'd be fine with watching them again - even The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes.

Stan Brakhage 1

Jan Svankmajer 1
Jean Painleve 0
Hollis Frampton 0

-Jake

[Guillermo Garrido Lestache Vidal]

I have never heard of any of those directors, but based on Kasper's description, it seems that Svankmajer would be most appealing to me.
 
Stan Brakhage 1
Jan Svankmajer 2

Jean Painleve 0
Hollis Frampton 0
 

---

Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 19:56:19 -0500
Subject: Re: Nominations for August 2012 (I believe)
From: wisej...@gmail.com
To: film...@googlegroups.com

[sfdavide]

I will vote for Brakhage

On Apr 11, 8:13 am, Kasper Lauritzen <byldorf.fi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm hereby posting the nominees for my month (August 2012). As always I
> dwell at the thought of just nominating Groucho, Chico and Harpo Marx (and
> indeed, which one would be your favorite?).... but NO, I need to enforce
> some experimental film on this forum :)
>
> So combining two previous and two new nominees I offer you:
>

> *Stan Brakhage.* American filmmaker of more than 300 films, many of which

> could be called "essays on seeing" - in his films Brakhage combines the
> seeing eye with the mind's eye to capture the full 'scope' of vision -
> an effort that often takes him beyond what can be filmed with a camera and
> into other strategies of cinematic expression (for example hand-print,
> rapid cutting, etc.)
>

> *Jan Svankmajer*. Czech filmmaker/animator of short films and features -

> Svankmajer is deeply rooted in the Czech surrealism, humorous and
> grotesque, in the universe where Freud, Poe, De Sade, Carroll and Kafka
> also lives. Most of his films are sharp parables on the human condition and
> his best films capture a rare, surrealist beauty.
>

> *Jean Painleve*. Early, French documentary filmmaker but perhaps even more

> decisive is his connection to the original surrealist group. Famously he
> has photographed underwater animals, which seem otherwise hard to imagine
> and are fantastic to watch, and he does so in a most dreamlike way.
>

> *Hollis Frampton*. American structuralist filmmaker. His films can seem

[Josh Waterman]

We've watched some Brakhage in school and it's absolutely fascinating, like nothing I've ever seen. I vote him.

[Øyvind Rype]

First of all thanks to Thorkell for inviting me to the film club.

My vote goes to Svankmejer.


Øyvind Rype (from Norway)

> Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 21:22:37 -0700

> Subject: Re: Nominations for August 2012 (I believe)

> From: tomjo...@gmail.com
> To: film...@googlegroups.com

[Kasper Lauritzen]

I'm also voting for Brakhage. I think that makes:

Stan Brakhage - 4 (+)

Jan Svankmajer - 3

Jean Painleve - 0

Hollis Frampton - 0

@Jake: "The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes" must get a star ;-)

[Andre Broken]

Jan Svankmajer. 

[Andre Broken]

Jean Painleve sounds rather interesting. My vote shall go to him.

On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:27 PM, Kasper Lauritzen <byldor...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Jake Fredel]

Hahaha, I like the wink there Kasper!

Kasper to group: "Listen all you lowly viewers of narrative cinema: You will be forced to watch experimental cinema during my month. And not just any experiment films - you have to watch a silent film made up completely of AUTOPSY FOOTAGE! It will be HELL for you! Hahahahaha!!!"

What a cruel host. Who ever put him on the list??

-Jake

[Kasper Lauritzen]

LOL - exactly :D

After all, you're not demonstrating (host) power if you're just doing what pleases everyone. Maybe this is why my friends wont let me pick what game we should play anymore...

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

More votes anyone?

[Bobby Beksinski]

I'll vote for Brakhage just to help make a decision but I do not care
who wins, I have never seen any films by these four gentlemen but
Brakhage, Svankmajer, and Frampton are all 3 I have heard of and want
to see their films, never heard of Jean Painleve.

On Apr 15, 8:46 pm, "Thorkell A. Ottarsson" <thork...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> More votes anyone?
>
> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Thorkell A. Ottarsson
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> <thork...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
>
> > On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 1:33 AM, Kasper Lauritzen
> > <byldorf.fi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> LOL - exactly :D
> >> After all, you're not demonstrating (host) power if you're just doing what
> >> pleases everyone. Maybe this is why my friends wont let me pick what game we
> >> should play anymore...
>

> >> Den 13. apr. 2012 00.53 skrev Jake Fredel <wisejake...@gmail.com>:
>
> >>> Hahaha, I like the wink there Kasper!
>
> >>> Kasper to group: "Listen all you lowly viewers of narrative cinema: You
> >>> will be forced to watch experimental cinema during my month. And not just
> >>> any experiment films - you have to watch a silent film made up completely of
> >>> AUTOPSY FOOTAGE! It will be HELL for you! Hahahahaha!!!"
>
> >>> What a cruel host. Who ever put him on the list??
>
> >>> -Jake
>

> >>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 11:54 AM, Andre Broken <badsmilebro...@gmail.com>

> >>> wrote:
>
> >>>> Jean Painleve sounds rather interesting. My vote shall go to him.
>
> >>>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2012 at 4:27 PM, Kasper Lauritzen
> >>>> <byldorf.fi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >>>>> I'm also voting for Brakhage. I think that makes:
>
> >>>>> Stan Brakhage - 4 (+)
> >>>>> Jan Svankmajer - 3
> >>>>> Jean Painleve - 0
> >>>>> Hollis Frampton - 0
>
> >>>>> @Jake: "The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes" must get a star ;-)
>

> >>>>> Den 12. apr. 2012 16.15 skrev Øyvind Rype <oyvind_r...@hotmail.com>:
>
> >>>>>> First of all thanks to Thorkell for inviting me to the film club.
>
> >>>>>> My vote goes to Svankmejer.
>
> >>>>>> Øyvind Rype (from Norway)
>
> >>>>>> > Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2012 21:22:37 -0700
>
> >>>>>> > Subject: Re: Nominations for August 2012 (I believe)

> >>>>>> > From: tomjoad1...@gmail.com

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

I think we have never had so few votes. It has been 8 days since
Kasper posted his nominations. Looks like there is not a great
interest in the directors or people just don't know them or care who
wins. Anyway, it looks like Brakhage will be our August director.

Here are my favorite 30 films by him. Maybe we could use them as a
base for our watch list?:

Main list?
*Dog Star Man: Prelude & Part I - Part IV (1962-4)
*Persian Series #1, #2 & #3 (1999)
I Take These Truths (1994)
*Unglassed Windows Cast a Terrible Reflection (1953) 10/10
Boulder Blues and Pearls and... (1992)
First Hymn to the Night - Novalis (1994)
The Stars Are Beautiful (1974)
Commingled Containers (1997)
The Garden of Earthly Delights (1981)
The Mammals of Victoria (1994)

Extra list?:
Window Water Baby Moving (1962)
Murder Psalm (1980)
Interim (1952)
Yggdrasill: Whose Roots Are Stars in the Human Mind (1997)
Wedlock House: An Intercourse (1959)
Desert (1976)
The Cat of the Worm's Green Realm (1997)
...Reel Five (1999)
Night Music (1986)
The Dead (1960)
Chinese Series (2003)
The Act of Seeing with One's Own Eyes (1971)
23rd Psalm Branch: Part I (1967)
The Dante Quartet (1987)

Pluss - Any other film you can find

Thorkell

[Zelia Trueb]

Some feedback, for whatever it's worth. Although all the director are well regarded, their DVDs are not easily found. I even had a hard time finding Ken Russell's. I already had a couple and found two others in Netflix, that's all.
Good viewing!

Zelia

Sent from my iPad

> ....Reel Five (1999)

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

Criterion has published a collection of Brakhage and a lot of his films can be found on the net.

[anne]

I have recently watched a lot of Brakhage, all of it online, mostly (or possibly all) on youtube.
Anne

[Jake Fredel]

Also, Criterion has released a collection of Jean Painleve with a wide selection of his work, as well as an upcoming Hollis Frampton collection. I also am aware of various Svankmajer DVDs around - not to mention that much of this work by any of these directors can be found by searching the internet a little bit. Watching more experimental films requires more experimental searching methods. But one of the truly good things about our age of technology is that if there's anything that you (and a few others) really want to see, and it's available somewhere to be seen, it will be available on the internet. In rare exceptions are highly sought-after films not able to found anywhere on the internet after a good deep search.

But as someone who watches experimental films like this a fair amount, I'd say that Kasper nominated some pretty accessible directors for experimental filmmakers. If it was me, I would have picked Bruce Conner, my personal favorite experimental filmmaker - who made such films as A Movie, Report, and Crossroads (one of all time favorite films, placed it on my top 100 list). 

Thorkell, I would criticize your list by saying that you have most of the best known Brakhage films in your favorites (except for Dog Star Man) in the extras list. Although Kasper's suggestion of giving The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes a star was perhaps too cruel, I still definitely think it should be in the main list. A brave, distinctive, and powerful film - and essential to Brakhage's constant themes. Window Water Baby Moving (especially) and Wedlock House: An Intercourse are also films that seem that they should possibly be in the main list. I also did not see Anticipation of the Night or Mothlight on your list - and I would consider these definite contenders for the main list. We can at least be in agreement that Dog Star Man should stay and retain its star - really, if you watch no other Brakhage, that could probably be considered his magnum opus (or maybe the nearly impossible-to-see full version, The Art of Vision). But truthfully, I have heard of the Persian Series (haven't seen it), but I've never even heard of the other film you have starred. Admittedly, I am better versed in earlier Brakhage than later Brakhage (at least at this point). Maybe you, I, Kasper, and anyone else who wants to join in and contribute could use our individual opinions to make one master list?

-Jake

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

This was just considered as a first draft Jake, so please feel free to change it. It would also be great to hear from others, especially Kasper.

Regarding Anticipation of the Night. It did  not to much for me. I gave it 6/10. Mothlight is better but still not as good as the others I listed, IMO. :)

Thorkell

[Kasper Lauritzen]

Sounds like Jake and I are more at range regarding which films to watch, but I'll make a list within the next 24 hours or so, and we can try to work something out from there.

I'm thinking availability should also be considered. I mean a film like "Anticipation of the Night" is great, but it took me a long time to find it. The Criterion collections are pretty solid.

@Jake: Haven't seen any Bruce Conner, but I'm definitely going to soon!

[Kasper Lauritzen]

It's really a puzzle to solve... I'd like a list that shows Brakhage's scope in form (epics and songs) and genre (early psychodrama, super-visions, painted films, personal/private films). "Dog Star Man" is pivotal in this respect. The main list should also have some early film ("Unglassed" is fine with me). Many qualify as personal - "Window Water Baby Moving", "The Stars Are Beautiful" (a poem typically Brakhage'ian set to home footage) and the later "I ... Dreaming". Although it isn't painted, "Text of Light" is an epic in his 'abstract' films, but then again also very hard to get. Otherwise we could include a cycle to illustrate this point.

Ah, I don't know... But my musts would look something like this:

EPICS

Unglassed Windows Cast a Terrible Reflection

Anticipation of the Night

* Dog Star Man

The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes

Text of Light

23rd Psalm Branch

Visions in Meditation

Lovemaking

SHORTS

The Dante Quartet

Window Water Baby Moving

Mothlight

Wedlock House: An Intercourse

The Stars Are Beautiful

Commingled Containers

I ... Dreaming

The Garden of Earthly Delights

Song Cycles(?)

Scenes from Under Childhood

That's the closest I'll get to a list right now...

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

Sounds fine to me. What do you say Jake?

Thorkell

[Jake Fredel]

From what you two have brought up, and also from my own opinions, I have crafted a tentative main list (and extra list). The questions I have with this main list are, 1) is it too long, even though the films are shorter than those by narrative filmmakers, and if so which films should be removed, and 2) which two films other than Dog Star Man should get a star? Otherwise, I feel that this list provides a pretty diverse selection for a short, main list.

MAIN LIST

Unglassed Windows Cast a Terrible Reflection

Anticipation of the Night

Window Water Baby Moving

Mothlight

*Dog Star Man

The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes

Scenes From Under Childhood

Visions in Meditation

Persian Series 1-3

EXTRA LIST:

Interim

Desistfilm

The Wonder Ring

Wedlock House: An Intercourse

Sirius Remembered

Cat's Cradle

The Dead

Thigh Line Lyre Triangular

Two: Creeley/McClure

Eye Myth

23rd Psalm Branch

Lovemaking

The Machine of Eden

The Wold Shadow

The Process

The Text of Light

The Stars Are Beautiful

Star Garden

Desert

The Domain of the Moment

Burial Path

Murder Psalm

Duplicity III

Unconscious London Strata

The Garden of Earthly Delights

Arabic Series

The Loom

Night Music

The Dante Quartet

Kindering

Rage Net

I... Dreaming

Visions in Meditation

Passage Through: A Ritual

Glaze of Cathexis

Delicacies of the Molten Horror Synapse

A Child's Garden and the Serious Sea

Untitled (For Marilyn)

Crack Glass Eulogy

Boulder Blues and Pearls and...

Study in Color and Black and White

Stellar

The Mammals of Victoria

The Chartres Series

First Hymn to the Night - Novalis

Black Ice

I Take These Truths

I...

The Cat of the Worm's Green Realm

Yggdrasill: Whose Roots Are Stars in the Human Mind

Commingled Containers

...Reel Three

...Reel Five

The Lion and the Zebra Make God's Raw Jewels

The Dark Tower

The God of Day Had Gone Down Upon Him

Lovesong

Chinese Series

+ ANYTHING ELSE YOU CAN FIND!

NOTE: I did not put The Art of Vision on this list at all, because I sometimes feel that even thinking about it is futile. It is DEFINITELY NOT on the internet or any kind of video/DVD medium - I'm pretty sure it's never been shown in any format other than on film (except Dog Star Man, yes, I know, but it's not the same thing in my opinion). This is my #1 most sought-after film right now, I have driven myself near insanity numerous times trying to uncover information on how to see it, to no avail. It used to be at the Museum of Modern Art in New York, and I was thinking of going to New York this summer and booking a screening in their study room - but a staff member there told me that they no longer have the film in their possession, for reasons unknown. So, I don't want to put it on the main or extra list, because I don't really feel that it's feasible for ANYONE in the film club to see it in August. However, if anyone ever has any info about any type of release or screening in the US, please let me know, I will be so grateful.

-Jake

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

The list looks great Jake and not too long at all. I would put a star
on Unglassed Windows Cast a Terrible Reflection because it is an early
film and it is great. The third one with a star should be a painted
one and Persian Series 1-3 is the best of those, IMO.

As to The Art of Vision. I'm shocked to find out that The Art of
Vision is not in the Museum of Modern Art in New York anymore. I had
planed to find out when they where screening it again, the next time I
was in NY to try to see it. I agree, it should not be on the watch
list, unless Criterion surprises everyone by publishing it before
August :)

Thorkell

[Jake Fredel]

Unfortunately Thorkell, I don't see Criterion or anyone for that matter given permission to release The Art of Vision on DVD. Marilyn Brakhage is a big supporter of her husband's films being seen on film - and The Art of Vision is all about superimposition of the separate rolls that constitute Dog Star Man and what not. I would be ecstatic and preorder a copy the very day a DVD release was announced, and I'm sure that Criterion would do a good job with it, I just don't see them getting clearance. I'm completely ready to travel somewhere and watch it if at all possible, but it doesn't seem to be available anywhere.

Here's our list then (unless Kasper or anyone else disagrees):

NOTE: The large majority of these films can be seen on either of the Brakhage DVD anthologies released by the Criterion Collection. If you get the two volumes, you will be able to see many of these films, and many of them are very short.

MAIN LIST

*Unglassed Windows Cast a Terrible Reflection

Anticipation of the Night

Window Water Baby Moving

Mothlight

*Dog Star Man

The Act of Seeing With One's Own Eyes

Scenes From Under Childhood

Visions in Meditation

*Persian Series 1-3

-Jake

[Kasper Lauritzen]

Thumbs up from me!

[Kasper Lauritzen]

It's not impossible to get "Art of Vision", just unbelievably expensive:

http://canyoncinema.com/catalog/film/?i=3861

I wonder what could qualify the Internet Film Club as an institution in US law :-)

[Thorkell A. Ottarsson]

WOW!

On Sun, Apr 22, 2012 at 12:41 AM, Kasper Lauritzen

[Jake Fredel]

It can also be rented from the Film-Makers' Coop (film-makerscoop.com) for only $500, but it also has to be for an institution, not an individual. We might be able to pass the Internet Film Club off as an institution, but I mean, people would have to come and watch it.

-Jake