The face of V4 looks very strange (Facegen Customizer )

Kipp

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Oct 3, 2009, 1:04:13 AM10/3/09

to FaceGen

I tried to use Facegen Customizer to create a V4 head model set.
And then I open the V4 model set in Facegen Modeller.
There are many spots in the V4 face.
[IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/V4.jpg[/IMG]
Can somebody help me?

Galiano

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Oct 3, 2009, 11:29:14 AM10/3/09

to FaceGen

HI Kipp,

It looks like your mesh has overlapping UVs. When this happens, the
same point on the texture image maps to multiple places on the head.

Since Customizer can't pick a colour that works for both you'll get
patches depending on where the colour was sampled from.

The solution is to get rid of any overlapping areas in your UV map
then re-run the geometry & texture integration steps in Customizer.

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 3, 2009, 11:39:12 PM10/3/09

to FaceGen

HI Galiano,

Thanks for your reply.

>>>The solution is to get rid of any overlapping areas in your UV map
>>>then re-run the geometry & texture integration steps in Customizer.

I tried to use Photoshop to modify the head.bmp file. I copy a piece
of skin picture and paste to overlapping areas (forehead of V4). The
spots still exist.

All the steps I did are as blow.
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A000.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A000.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A001.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A001.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A002.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A002.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A003.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A003.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A004.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A004.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A005.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A005.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A006.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A006.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A007.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A007.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A008.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A008.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A009.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A009.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A010.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A010.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A011.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A011.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A012.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A012.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A013.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A013.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A014.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A014.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A015.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A015.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A016.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A016.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A017.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A017.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A018.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A018.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A019.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A019.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A020.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A020.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A021.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A021.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A022.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A022.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A023.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A023.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A024.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A024.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A025.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A025.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A026.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A026.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A027.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A027.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A028.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A028.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
[URL=http://s563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/?
action=view&current=A029.jpg][IMG]http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/
ss74/kipptsai002/th_A029.jpg[/IMG][/URL]

You can see the same result in V4 and M4 (spots on their faces)
Can you give me another suggestions?

Best Regards,

Kipp

Kipp

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Oct 3, 2009, 11:45:21 PM10/3/09

to FaceGen

Galiano

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Oct 5, 2009, 8:18:21 AM10/5/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

I've looked through your images, thanks for that.

What's happening here is when you export Victoria 4 from Poser, you
are exporting all the face model parts at once. Some of these parts,
such as the eyes, eyelashes and mouth parts, have different texture
maps. However they get merged going into Customizer so it appears to
Customizer as if they have overlapping UVs, and you get the funny
patches.

Your approach works great for the geometry integration, since you can
preserve the vertex order to import back into Poser, however for the
texture integration to create a proper texture, you need to *also*
export the model parts separately, and create the face and eye
textures separately, from just those parts.

Alternatively, you can just wait until around the middle of next year
when we release a version of FaceGen that directly supports Poser and
Daz3D characters.

Best wishes,
Andrew for FaceGen.

Kipp

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Oct 5, 2009, 11:40:57 AM10/5/09

to FaceGen

Dear Andrew,

When I use V4 model in Poser.
It's easy for me to separate eyes from head, and then I indeed did it.
You can see the picture as below.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A030.jpg

But it's hard to separate eyelashes or mouth parts from head because I
cannot find the items when I do the exporting steps. Maybe someone
will ask me to use the other 3D software to separate them, I am sorry
I am not good at all 3D software.

http://www.facegen.com/Tyler/CustomizerTutorial.htm
I thought that I did the same steps as Denise Tyler did. I wonder why
he did not metion of the patches.

http://forum.daz3d.com/viewtopic.php?p=1136941&sid=63d21db048fedf9a92d3cdb1833422d5
Deecey use the same V4 head model set to finish the work. You can see
the result, no patches on V4 face. What's the difference between
Deecey and me.

I tried to use the only head model (I remove the REye, LEye and neck)
to proceed the geometry integration and texture integration at that
time, but I got the same result, many patches on V4 face.

>>>Alternatively, you can just wait until around the middle of next year
>>>when we release a version of FaceGen that directly supports Poser and
>>>Daz3D characters.

It sounds good to all Poser and Daz3D users. I hope it will be very
easy to use somebody's picture to do their own 3D character. I think
the software will be very popular.

Anyway, thank you for your help again.
Best wishes,

Kipp

Kipp

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Oct 5, 2009, 12:53:29 PM10/5/09

to FaceGen

All I want to explain is that I agree with your analysis as below.

>>>What's happening here is when you export Victoria 4 from Poser, you
>>>are exporting all the face model parts at once. Some of these parts,

>>>such as the eyes, eyelashes and mouth parts....

But It's difficult to seperate eyelashes and mouth from V4 head in
Poser.
Why did Denise Tyler and Deecey not encounter the same problem as me.
It seemed that we did the same steps. They used Poser to export the
objects, so
I believe they did not seperate the eyelashes and mouth from V4 head.

Best Regards,

Kipp

Galiano

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Oct 5, 2009, 1:27:52 PM10/5/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

I took another look at your process, and I think the problem is that
you are exporting from Poser in 3DS format. If you export in OBJ
format, then Customizer will give you the option to automatically
split apart all the different surfaces when you import the OBJ. Then
you can select just the face surface for building the face texture,
and just the eye surface for building the eye texture.

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 6, 2009, 8:05:21 AM10/6/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

Thanks for your answer, I finally finished the V4 model set.
I tried to use pictures to do PhotoFit, and it looked good.
But I found I cannot use Morph function on the V4 model set.
It seemed that only the Default Model V3 can proceed morphing.
What a pity.

Best wishes,
Kipp

Galiano

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Oct 6, 2009, 8:16:24 AM10/6/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

The morph tab controls are mesh-specific.

If you wanted, you could export V4 morphs from Poser and add them to
your Customizer project (in the geometry integration step) and they
would show up in the Modeller morphs tab.

Alternatively, you should also be able to apply them in Poser with
your completed face, but of course you have to import the new face
you've created as a shape target rather than a separate model.

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 7, 2009, 8:13:55 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

>>>Alternatively, you should also be able to apply them in Poser with
>>>your completed face, but of course you have to import the new face
>>>you've created as a shape target rather than a separate model.

At first, I export the files from Poser to 3DS format, and then use
Cinema to tranfer
them to OBJ files. I encounter the patches problem. Now I accept your
suggestion,
export the files from Poser to OBJ format directly. I import the OBJ
to Facegen Customizer,
the software give me the option to automatically split apart all the
different surfaces.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A031.jpg

The head is not a single object any more. I cannot assign the seam
vertices as before.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A032.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A033.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A034.jpg

Without seam vertices, it means I cannot use the morph target to get
the head in Poser.
The message "Target geometry has wrong number of vertices." will
appear when I use the
morph target function.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A036.jpg

I'm sorry to ask so many questions. In my opinion, Facegen Customizer
is a
very attractive software for Poser users. The software give us a hope
to make our own model.
Unfortunately, the software is very difficult to use. If you try to
google the messages about
Facegen Customizer, you will know what I mean. Although you can find
the tutorial steps, it's still
hard to follow. I think it is because Facegen Customizer is not
designed for Poser but games.

>>>Alternatively, you can just wait until around the middle of next year
>>>when we release a version of FaceGen that directly supports Poser and
>>>Daz3D characters.

Hope to see the new version of FaceGen software soon. May it will give
us a easy way to work
with Poser.

Best wishes,
Kipp

Galiano

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Oct 7, 2009, 8:38:05 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hello Kipp,

It's true, FaceGen Customizer was designed for game developers, and it
is very difficult to integrate Poser/Daz models. We recommend people
wait until our Poser/Daz compatible product is released next year.

You're getting very close though. You've integrated the geometry using
the first method you described, now using the second method you can
integrate the texture statistics. You can ignore the geometry issues
this time around; don't bother with seams and don't worry about vertex
alignment, just generate the proper texture statistics. Finally, you
will combine the texture statistics from your earlier efforts with
colour stats from this OBJ export approach.

Best wishes,

Galiano

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Oct 7, 2009, 8:39:56 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Ooops, I meant to say ... "combine the *shape* statistics from your
ealier efforts with colour stats from this OBJ export approach."

Kipp

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Oct 7, 2009, 10:07:59 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

There are one BMP file about head in method 1.
There are nine BMP files about head in method 2 because Customizer
automatically split apart all the different surfaces, nine objects so
it get nine BMP files after texture integration. I don't know how to
use the nine pictures in method 2 to replace the one picture in method
1.

The head generated by FaceGen is very huge. The size and location of
head is different from Poser model.
It means that even though I can use morph target to import the head to
Poser because of the correct seam vertices, I still cannot get the
morph target I want.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A037.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A038.jpg

Best Regards,
Kipp

Galiano

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Oct 7, 2009, 10:50:53 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

You don't replace one image with nine. You use the geometry exported
from method 1, and the textures exported from method 2 (all with the
same desired FG file).

As for head size, if you follow the Customizer instructions to change
the internal mean face to coordinate system you want during the setup
stage, then everything will be exactly the size and position you
specify.

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 7, 2009, 11:50:02 AM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

>>>You don't replace one image with nine. You use the geometry exported
>>>from method 1, and the textures exported from method 2 (all with the
>>>same desired FG file).

I'm not sure what you mean.
I got the files about head from FaceGen Customizer in method 1.
method1.bmp
method1.egm
method1.egt
method1.fim
method1.fr3d
method1.tri

I got the files about head from FaceGen Customizer in method 2.
method2-1.bmp
method2-1.egm
method2-1.egt
method2-1.fim
method2-1.fr3d
method2-1.tri
method2-2.bmp
method2-2.egm
method2-2.egt
method2-2.fim
method2-2.fr3d
method2-2.tri
method2-3.bmp
method2-3.egm
method2-3.egt
method2-3.fim
method2-3.fr3d
method2-3.tri
method2-4.bmp
method2-4.egm
method2-4.egt
method2-4.fim
method2-4.fr3d
method2-4.tri
method2-5.bmp
method2-5.egm
method2-5.egt
method2-5.fim
method2-5.fr3d
method2-5.tri
method2-6.bmp
method2-6.egm
method2-6.egt
method2-6.fim
method2-6.fr3d
method2-6.tri
method2-7.bmp
method2-7.egm
method2-7.egt
method2-7.fim
method2-7.fr3d
method2-7.tri
method2-8.bmp
method2-8.egm
method2-8.egt
method2-8.fim
method2-8.fr3d
method2-8.tri
method2-9.bmp
method2-9.egm
method2-9.egt
method2-9.fim
method2-9.fr3d
method2-9.tri

What do you want me to do? Put the files as below together?
method1.egm
method1.egt
method1.fim
method1.fr3d
method1.tri
method2-1.bmp
method2-2.bmp
method2-3.bmp
method2-4.bmp
method2-5.bmp
method2-6.bmp
method2-7.bmp
method2-8.bmp
method2-9.bmp
The files above are the geometry exported from method 1, and the
textures exported from method 2.
Is what I guess correct?

Best wishes,
Kipp

Galiano

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Oct 7, 2009, 12:14:45 PM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

No. You *export* the method 1 model. For instance to OBJ. Use only the
mesh in Poser or whatever.

You export method 2 models. Use the texture images in Poser or
whatever.

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 7, 2009, 12:39:55 PM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

>>>As for head size, if you follow the Customizer instructions to change
>>>the internal mean face to coordinate system you want during the setup
>>>stage, then everything will be exactly the size and position you
>>>specify.

I had resized, rotated and moved the mean face to the correct
position.
I show the steps I made as below.

Import the mean face FaceGen Customizer provided.
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A039.jpg

resize, rotate and move the mean face
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A040.jpg

Victoria 4.2
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A041.jpg

Adjust the shape of V4 face to fit the mean face.

http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A000.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A001.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A002.jpg
http://i563.photobucket.com/albums/ss74/kipptsai002/A003.jpg

Galiano

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Oct 7, 2009, 1:03:08 PM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi Kipp,

I suspect the problem here is that Poser changed the coordinate
systems of the models when they were exported (or imported).

FaceGen Customizer and Modeller are very careful to never change
coordinate systems (unless you explicitly specify in the export
dialog), and it apears you were also very careful to align the
internal mean face with V4 and export them both back out so that the
resulting model was properly textured.

Most people using the Customizer work with tools like 3DSMax or Maya
so I'm not sure how to make sure Poser doesn't change the coordinate
system when you export (or import).

Best wishes,

Kipp

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Oct 7, 2009, 9:46:02 PM10/7/09

to FaceGen

Hi,

>>>I suspect the problem here is that Poser changed the coordinate
>>>systems of the models when they were exported (or imported).

It's why I use method 1. At first, I export the objects Poser to OBJ
format directly.
mean face.obj
head.obj
LEye.obj
REye.obj
neck.obj
head-all.obj
(I learn the operating steps from the FaceGen Customizer tutorial)
I import the six files to FaceGen Customizer, and I find the location
of the internal mean face is different from the others. I think that
Poser cannot keep the size and location data when export to OBJ
format. I try to solve the problem. Later, I decide to export the
files to 3DS format, and use Cinema 4D or 3D Studio to transfer them
to OBJ format. I guess Poser is not good at exporting and importing to
OBJ format.

I encounter the patches problem using the method 1, so I come here to
ask the question. Anyway, thank you for your help.

Best wishes,
Kipp

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