Disclaimer, not been active in quite a while, though I have been lurking and trying to send folks toward the meetings/aurdiuno inductions, etc.
The comment about dorkbotters getting sued, as this is an informal organization, not one with officers or such, really not much of a "membership" other than an e-mail list. How? I get e-mails from other groups, maybe they are incorporated, maybe not, but does that make me culpable (right word?) I wouldn't think so.
I much prefer the "group of people who get together every so often to dork out and drink beer" organization that has people organize money type things on their own, than the sort that has officers, dues, etc. Even if we live under the threat of lube sales.
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:37 AM, Thomas Lockney <tho...@lockney.net> wrote: > On Feb 8, 2012, at 10:56 AM, David Madden wrote:
>> On 2/8/2012 09:07, Thomas Lockney wrote: >>> Among other things, Dorkbot is not a name we have any claim to, but >>> that is not really the biggest source of my concern. Mostly, I just >>> really want to avoid having the group end up turning into any sort of >>> operation that handles money. I think going down that road can >>> quickly result in bad things happening and have asked all workshop >>> organizers, etc. to keep the money handling as a separate concern. >>> Please let's keep it that way.
>> I see this attitude a lot among young (often) idealistic engineers. In fact, I was one myself, once. But what you don't see, the flip side of "not incorporating," is that somebody else starts selling "DorkbotPDX Dessert Topping and Anal Lube (Now with less Santorum!)" or something, and you can't do anything about it. Or somebody gets shocked by a Van de Graff generator, and before you know it, half-a-dozen Dorkbotters are defendants in a lawsuit, not because they had anything to do with it, but because they happen to have the biggest bank accounts.
>> Incorporating doesn't mean you HAVE TO make money. In fact, you can set up your articles pretty much any way you want to, so that it's harder for somebody to come in, take over, and turn you into an evil money-grubbing corporation.
>> At the very least, it'd be smart to have insurance, which we could all chip in for, or pay for out of a "tax" on group orders, or whatever.
> Just FYI, we are not in a vacuum here. Dorkbot is not just DorkbotPDX, though we could certainly act as if it is. The Dorkbot community as a whole has, as far as I can tell based on talks with the other organizers, avoided this, explicitly, on purpose. There are numerous reasons, but the moment we begin to act like something more than just a community and like some sort of active interest group, the nature of things change. I'd prefer not to see that happen and, if it does, I'd prefer not to be a part of it.
> I understand there are legal reasons to want to do something like this, as you explained -- I have more than enough lawyers in the family and around me to have heard about the dangers that await out there. But I, for one, prefer to hold onto the hope that no one will do anything stupid here. Yes, I know that's idealistic, but I'm also not what most people would still consider young. I also know that we walk a fine line. I'd prefer to keep trying to talk that line for now.
> As I told Don in another email off list, I'd be more than happy to participate in setting up an organization that can act as sponsor for DorkbotPDX, so long as I don't have to be the person dealing with the money (can you tell that's something I really don't care for?). In fact, I think we probably should do that. Many of the other Dorkbot groups around the world work, essentially, this way -- a person or organization sponsors them and makes sure the business needs are covered. But that keeps the "community" distinct from the "operations" -- something that I think is very important for our continuing as a healthy entity (whatever form that might take).
> This is just my $0.02 (not worth much these days).
I was down at Backspace tonight for an event and talked to the owner, Eric, about a Dorkbot vending machine. He was interested in the idea and would be willing to discuss some sort of shared operation arrangement. Perhaps they would "own" the machine and parts would be stocked on consignment from the various suppliers (PJRC, FunGizmos, etc). A Dorkbotter willing to take the lead on maintaining and stocking the machine could do so on a contract basis with Backspace. Not sure how all the details would work out, but the possibility is there.
ADX is interested in working something out as well.
Anybody interested in taking on a side business keeping a couple of vending machines stocked and maintained?
> Does anyone have any objections to doing Vending Machines in both spaces? I've been out to ADX once, but I'm at backspace at almost every meeting. It might be even fun to team up and challenge each other to feature additions.
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 10:30 AM, Monty Goodson <mon...@bittybot.com> wrote: > On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:07 AM, Thomas Lockney wrote:
> > On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:58 PM, David Madden wrote:
> >>> Oregon might require a DBA (ABN), depending on the specifics (David, can > >>> you address this?)
> >> DBA is (sometimes) required if you're doing business under a name that's not your own (and that is not the name of a corporation or LLC). If Dorkbot was going to own & operate a vending machine, it'd probably be a good idea to incorporate, maybe as a non-profit, and maybe even to buy some insurance. (Incorporation/non-profit and/or insurance might be a good idea anyway, since there's always open chassis around and people can't resist sticking their fingers into them.)
> > <begin rant>
> > This is where I step in and mention that DorkbotPDX should not be turned into any sort of business entity. I have strong reasons for this and Jason, Don, etc. have heard me go on at length about this in the past. If there is enough interest in doing this, it is easy enough to set up a new entity, with appropriate people taking the lead, that can run and operate it, and they can even use the DorkbotPDX name in marketting/advertising, for all I care.
> > Among other things, Dorkbot is not a name we have any claim to, but that is not really the biggest source of my concern. Mostly, I just really want to avoid having the group end up turning into any sort of operation that handles money. I think going down that road can quickly result in bad things happening and have asked all workshop organizers, etc. to keep the money handling as a separate concern. Please let's keep it that way.
> > </end rant>
> I agree -- I like Dorkbot's simplicity. No paperwork, money, elections, or other BS to deal with. It does make it harder to do some things though, like arrange group hack sessions at someplace like ADX that requires contracts and payment. How are the workshops handled? Is that just somebody stepping up and taking the responsibility under their own name?
> For the vending machine, I can see a few possible solutions -- > 1.) Backspace and/or ADX "owns" the machine and we maintain and stock it > I got a message from Kelley at ADX -- they are excited about the vending machine idea and have been thinking about their own for small tools and consumables. > 2.) Somebody starts an organization separate from DorkbotPDX to do this -- non-profit preferred so that anybody willing to donate a vending machine, or parts, can get a tax write-off. > 3.) An existing company with ties to DorkbotPDX takes this on.
> I was down at Backspace tonight for an event and talked to the owner, > Eric, about a Dorkbot vending machine. He was interested in the idea and > would be willing to discuss some sort of shared operation arrangement. > Perhaps they would "own" the machine and parts would be stocked on > consignment from the various suppliers (PJRC, FunGizmos, etc). A > Dorkbotter willing to take the lead on maintaining and stocking the machine > could do so on a contract basis with Backspace. Not sure how all the > details would work out, but the possibility is there.
> ADX is interested in working something out as well.
> Anybody interested in taking on a side business keeping a couple of > vending machines stocked and maintained?
> Monty
> On Feb 8, 2012, at 10:39 AM, Aaron Eiche wrote:
> Does anyone have any objections to doing Vending Machines in both spaces? > I've been out to ADX once, but I'm at backspace at almost every meeting. It > might be even fun to team up and challenge each other to feature additions.
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 10:30 AM, Monty Goodson <mon...@bittybot.com>wrote:
>> On Feb 8, 2012, at 9:07 AM, Thomas Lockney wrote:
>> > On Feb 7, 2012, at 10:58 PM, David Madden wrote:
>> >>> Oregon might require a DBA (ABN), depending on the specifics (David, >> can >> >>> you address this?)
>> >> DBA is (sometimes) required if you're doing business under a name >> that's not your own (and that is not the name of a corporation or LLC). If >> Dorkbot was going to own & operate a vending machine, it'd probably be a >> good idea to incorporate, maybe as a non-profit, and maybe even to buy some >> insurance. (Incorporation/non-profit and/or insurance might be a good idea >> anyway, since there's always open chassis around and people can't resist >> sticking their fingers into them.)
>> > <begin rant>
>> > This is where I step in and mention that DorkbotPDX should not be >> turned into any sort of business entity. I have strong reasons for this and >> Jason, Don, etc. have heard me go on at length about this in the past. If >> there is enough interest in doing this, it is easy enough to set up a new >> entity, with appropriate people taking the lead, that can run and operate >> it, and they can even use the DorkbotPDX name in marketting/advertising, >> for all I care.
>> > Among other things, Dorkbot is not a name we have any claim to, but >> that is not really the biggest source of my concern. Mostly, I just really >> want to avoid having the group end up turning into any sort of operation >> that handles money. I think going down that road can quickly result in bad >> things happening and have asked all workshop organizers, etc. to keep the >> money handling as a separate concern. Please let's keep it that way.
>> > </end rant>
>> I agree -- I like Dorkbot's simplicity. No paperwork, money, elections, >> or other BS to deal with. It does make it harder to do some things though, >> like arrange group hack sessions at someplace like ADX that requires >> contracts and payment. How are the workshops handled? Is that just >> somebody stepping up and taking the responsibility under their own name?
>> For the vending machine, I can see a few possible solutions -- >> 1.) Backspace and/or ADX "owns" the machine and we maintain and stock it >> I got a message from Kelley at ADX -- they are excited about the vending >> machine idea and have been thinking about their own for small tools and >> consumables. >> 2.) Somebody starts an organization separate from DorkbotPDX to do this >> -- non-profit preferred so that anybody willing to donate a vending >> machine, or parts, can get a tax write-off. >> 3.) An existing company with ties to DorkbotPDX takes this on.
> I was down at Backspace tonight for an event and talked to the owner, Eric, about a Dorkbot vending machine. He was interested in the idea and would be willing to discuss some sort of shared operation arrangement. > Perhaps they would "own" the machine and parts would be stocked on consignment from the various suppliers (PJRC, FunGizmos, etc). A Dorkbotter willing to take the lead on maintaining and stocking the machine could do so on a contract basis with Backspace. Not sure how all the details would work out, but the possibility is there.
> ADX is interested in working something out as well.
> Anybody interested in taking on a side business keeping a couple of vending machines stocked and maintained?
> Monty
What keeps going through my head is that there must be some way to use VendScreen to make inventory management tractable when multiple suppliers share a machine. Can it now be done with clever software taking the place of a middle-man doing the restocking?
Its awesome that Backspace would consider hosting and/or shared operation. They wouldn't be the middle man that I'm hoping to eliminate. _______________________________________________ dorkbotpdx-blabber mailing list dorkbotpdx-blab...@dorkbot.org http://music.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/dorkbotpdx-blabber
Howdy All, I am posting on behalf of an acquaintance looking for a Python tutor for her 13 year old home-schooled son. I gather the job is flexible as far as timing but should start soon. If you are interested, I'll put you in touch so you can name your rate and determine if the job is a fit. Thanks!
Learn to program with Javascript online. One lesson is posted per week. Lessons are easy enough for a 13 year old. Very simple lessons, slowly introducing new concepts, plenty of repetition.
On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 12:12 PM, Steve D. <pxl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> Howdy All, > I am posting on behalf of an acquaintance looking for a Python tutor for > her 13 year old home-schooled son. I gather the job is flexible as far as > timing but should start soon. > If you are interested, I'll put you in touch so you can name your rate and > determine if the job is a fit. > Thanks!
> Learn to program with Javascript online. One lesson is posted per week. > Lessons are easy enough for a 13 year old. Very simple lessons, slowly > introducing new concepts, plenty of repetition.
> On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 12:12 PM, Steve D. <pxl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Howdy All, >> I am posting on behalf of an acquaintance looking for a Python tutor for >> her 13 year old home-schooled son. I gather the job is flexible as far as >> timing but should start soon. >> If you are interested, I'll put you in touch so you can name your rate >> and determine if the job is a fit. >> Thanks!
On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 6:05 PM, Doug Ausmus <daus...@gmail.com> wrote: > This is a link directly to the languages page at that site, where you can > choose python and get started: > http://labs.codecademy.com/#
> On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 2:16 PM, Greg Peek <gpe...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Learn to program with Javascript online. One lesson is posted per week. >> Lessons are easy enough for a 13 year old. Very simple lessons, slowly >> introducing new concepts, plenty of repetition.
>> On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 12:12 PM, Steve D. <pxl...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Howdy All, >>> I am posting on behalf of an acquaintance looking for a Python tutor for >>> her 13 year old home-schooled son. I gather the job is flexible as far as >>> timing but should start soon. >>> If you are interested, I'll put you in touch so you can name your rate >>> and determine if the job is a fit. >>> Thanks!
After wasting the weekend fighting the apple store and downloading something we should have been able to just go to the apple store and pick up, we still do not have a working lion system. If anyone is running lion who can help me resolve some issues with the workshop kits and the arduino it would be greatly appreciated.
I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
-Jerry
On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
I think you were supposed to go to build out party so the list didn't have to support this.
BLDGP
On Mar 28, 2012, at 2:28 PM, Jerry Biehler wrote:
> I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
> -Jerry
> On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
> -Jerry
> On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I think you were supposed to go to build out party so the list didn't have to support this.
> BLDGP
> On Mar 28, 2012, at 2:28 PM, Jerry Biehler wrote:
>> I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
>> -Jerry
>> On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
>> -Jerry
>> On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
>> -Jerry
>> On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> wrote:
You seem to have some very specific ideas about what this list is for. Could you please define "blabber" so that the rest of us don't make the mistake of offending you in the future? Maybe you should unsubscribe to avoid future annoyance.
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 14:31, D Delmar Davis <art...@suspectdevices.com>wrote:
> I think you were supposed to go to build out party so the list didn't have > to support this.
> BLDGP
> On Mar 28, 2012, at 2:28 PM, Jerry Biehler wrote:
> > I hand soldered my bust pirate Monday might and borrowed an ICD2 puck to > program the thing. It sees the uC but for the life of me I can't find the > files to program the boot loader. Anyone know where to find them?
> > -Jerry
> > On Mar 28, 2012, at 1:00 PM, interrupt 0x03 <interrupt0...@gmail.com> > wrote:
