tethered quad copter

[Tim Bolz]

An Israel firm made this tethered pentacopter.

http://skysapience.com/

The potential up in the air time is as long as you like.

Could we build a tethered quad copter? You have tethered ballons with
advertisements.

Quad copter with a webcam looking down and around. Transmitting the
data down through cat5 cabling.
Zooming camera.

I think someone in the group can do it.

Octoberfest DHMH. Could be a big draw for us.

Paul suggested an anroid app which prominently displays the DHMN logo.

Can we do it? Anyone interested?

Tim

[Mike Putnam]

First video gives a good explanation (sales pitch)

http://skysapience.com/products/images-and-videos

[Jacob Kasper]

Sounds fun.  With a tether, there would be no need for on-board batteries, or microcontrollers, probably just a 3-axis accelerometer for stabilization, some webcams, other instrumentation or sensors.  And with the tether for power, we can make it larger than most quadcopters I've seen.

[Lynne Whitehorn]

Imagine a big mylar toroidial balloon with the quadcopter in the
center. Now you can have a really, really wimpy copter and a lot of
payload, plus more safety in every respect. Make it so that buoyancy is
just slightly negative.

-Lynne

[Tim Bolz]

The safety thing is a good idea especially if we can promote our group
at events.
There would be less chance of loosing power and it falling to the
ground on top of someone. Unless there was a deployable parachute.

Now does anyone want to take up this project and who would to assist?
I would love to assist.

Tim

[Tim Bolz]

Hit send before rereading it should read.
Now does anyone want to take up this project and who would like to assist?

I would love to assist.

[Paul Klemstine]

If we can get a Wifi camera on something that flies or floats, I'll build a DHMN branded Android App, so that everyone at Oktoberfest can see the overhead view from their Robot Overlord.

[Jacob Kasper]

I would imagine a mylar toroidial balloon would be difficult to source.  How about a blimp?  It would float, have a good amount of surface area for decorating, and should be able to carry a camera.

[Jacob Kasper]

As far as a parachute for unpowered landings, how high would the quadcopter be?  A parachute from ten or twenty feet may not slow the descent of the quadcopter by all that much.  What about airbags?  A CO2 cartridge can be incorporated into the design,  and have some tubing to distribute the CO2 to a series of airbags(perhaps balloons?) spaced throughout the frame to protect from damage, either to itself or to who or what it may be landing on abruptly. 
And a portion of the CO2 could be used to deploy a parachute, as well.

[Bob Watson]

Sky Sapience doesn't actually have a video of the Hover Mast flying. It's all simulations. Maybe we can beat them to market ;)

--
Bob Watson

Author of Gladiator Girl

Trade paperback or Kindle ebook. Amazon.com

Also available on the Nook. Barnes & Noble

[Erin Quick-Laughlin]

Can someone come up with a parts list, source it and price it?

[Lynne Whitehorn]

I'm not planning on using an actual torus.  Instead I'd use cells, as in a true airship, using carbon kite spars bent into a couple of circles, with the cells taped to them.  The "cells" could just be cheapo party balloons, which can be purchased in just about any imaginable shape.  I bought a couple last year to see how long they'd last and they were still floating after a couple of months. 

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_i_0_13?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=mylar+balloons&sprefix=mylar+balloon%2Caps%2C202

-Lynne

[Tim Bolz]

Balloons would be good. Could we do a net with balloons in it? A
blimp shape might be better for windy times.

I don't know that much about quad copter voltage. Could we use cat5
cable using POE? We could go 328 feet up with cat5 , which is pretty
high. If there is ten feet per floor which it could be 32 floors
high. I'm not sure we want to get that high.

I think we will have to have a reel to get it in.

If we do cat5 we could do a very good quality security camera. I
don't know if we will need two cable or one. I think security
camera's would go over one twisted pair. And the other twisted pair
is power. correct me if I'm wrong.

Talked with Bob Watson today and he thought about where you could walk
it to different places. He though power lines might be a problem
though. If were mobile it could be on a wagon to pull around with a
motorized reel to pull it in. Stationary would be no problem. We
could have a big screen at the base showing the video feeds. To draw
people to our booth. We could also rent it out. Radio stations, TV
stations. Just a thought to get revenue for a meeting space.

I just thought this could be used for a wireless access point too.
Don't know how far they would reach. I would think pretty far.
We could use our shoebox network to extend the range area.

Tim

[Tim Bolz]

Another thought adding a parabolic microphone. Or a small megaphone.
Hey look up here. now follow the cable down to the booth and come and
visit us. Come over and see

Tim

[Jacob Kasper]

Here's a pic of a quick model.  If balloons were attached to the outer ring, we could use smaller motors or have a higher payload.

How big of a payload should the quad carry?

What kind of motors should be used?  Brushed or brushless?  Brushed is cheaper, brushless is faster.

Here is a link I found to some brushless motors.
http://www.hobby-lobby.com/brushless_rc_motors_shop_by_size.htm

With the small size of the wires in an ethernet cable, I am unsure if we could supply enough power to run four motors.

[Alex Hunt]

The power over ethernet spec (specifically PoE plus), allows 25.5 Watts to the device.  The supply voltage is about 50V.  We can probably adjust that a little on a custom device, but 25 W is not a big number for quadcopter power.

It would need a little on-board storage as well if you want to fly it over a crowd.  Cat5 cable is a solid conductor and will eventually break with all that flexing.  The quadcopter would need to land immediately if cable power is lost.

Alex

[Tim Bolz]

Just read up on stranded vs solid core cat5. It cost a little more
but stranded would be the better way to go. Stranded is used in patch
cables which allow for flexibility. For a temporary short solid cable
to run inside a building.

How many strands would we need for the motors? Could we do it on a
single pair? Two for power,two for the camera that leaves us with
four wires left.

I think cat5 adapters on the the quadcopter and base. On the
quadcopter it would have a harness which hold the cable in place.
Either tied or cabled. If we need to we can attach a thin cable to
the cat5 cabling such as stranded wire used to hold up pictures on
wall.

I'm going add the project on trello. Add yourself if you want to be
part of the group project.

Starting out without a camera.
The second phase would would adding the camera.

We can decide on a camera. Anyone know about simple cheap security
camera. We could go simple then get elaborate after. The elaborate
would be one one with zoom and high definition.

Could we run the quadcopter and a camera over one cat5 line? I am
thinking we can.
Here is a link to one site which sells the connectors to run over cat5
http://www.vpi.us/balun-bnc.html
The video feed runs at 12 volt this poe can be reduced to 12 volt on both ends.

Tim

[Tim Bolz]

Found this link. arduino based quadcopter.
http://code.google.com/p/quaduino-ng/
Has a shopping list.

Tim

[Jacob Kasper]

But can his quad lift a webcam? Or twenty feet of cable?

For that matter, can we make a gyro-stabilized webcam to put on a quad?  Helicopter camera footage seems somewhat shaky.

[Jacob Kasper]

I went and talked to some guys at Galaxy Science and Hobby on Richmond Street, and they have a good amount of stuff, including brushless electric motors, electronic speed controllers for the motors, propellers, carbon fiber rods , narrow tubes, and strips, assorted soft and hard woods, foam, paint, lots of stuff.  One guy recommended a kit, has a 15 amp brushless motor, controller, prop, prop adapter, and bracket for the motor, costs $85 each, he said it should be able to give about two pounds of lift.  If that is insufficient, there are larger motors, 25 and 30 amp, but they are not in a kit, cost $75 and $80 each, and requires a 60 amp controller per motor, costs $100 each.

I believe that this can be done with four of the 15 amp motors, since the quad will be tethered, but I do not think we can supply power over an ethernet cable.  Perhaps if we used a medium duty extension cord?