Right to Work Michigan

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

...what a beautiful phrase!

And, while it is entertaining to watch the raging impotence of the
sniveling dregs of union thuggery that brought it all crashing down on
themselves in the first place, it would be well to remember the levels
of violence these goons have shown themselves willing to sink to in
the past, and prepare oneself accordingly.

If they want to follow through on the "bloodshed and civil war" they
are openly threatening, let them be mowed down as they crawl from
their trenches.

America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
fascist left.

[hal lillywhite]

On 13 dic, 01:20, 1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities

<Tawana.Braw...@whitehouse.gov> wrote:

> America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> fascist left.

I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.

[Bill Shatzer]

Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!

Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!

Really Harold!

Sheesh!

peace and justice,

[Al]

We know the left always acts out when they don't get what they want, bug waaaaah babies.

If they actually grew the fuck up to maturity, they'd be conservatives.

This is why we carry,

[hal lillywhite]

On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:

> >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> >>fascist left.
> > I hope so.  Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>
> Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>
> Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!

Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
that especially most universities are likewise. Whether that was
because of a concerted effort to put leftists in those positions or
just that leftists found those positions attractive is of lesser
importance than the fact that it happened.

[Sancho Panza]

The OP must think that not reporting -- intentionally concealing -- the
the assault, battery and other violence in East Lansing isn't a
conspiracy. It's de rigueur. After all, there's no news or other
interest in sucker punching news correspondents and toppling tents with
women and the elderly inside. Keep moving on, folks.

[clw]

In article
<03f5874c-5501-4ceb...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

hal lillywhite <hlil...@juno.com> wrote:

> On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>
> > >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> > >>fascist left.
> > > I hope so.  Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
> >
> > Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
> >
> > Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
>
> Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?

Bill did not say that. In fact he says the opposite. It is the
opposite political persuasion (wing nut) that sees conspiracy in
anything they oppose.

> It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
> that especially most universities are likewise.

vote for higher level intelligence. Expected.

> Whether that was
> because of a concerted effort to put leftists in those positions or
> just that leftists found those positions attractive is of lesser
> importance than the fact that it happened.

And the majority opinion by the under thirty group supporting gay
marriage indicates that it seems to be working.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"hal lillywhite" wrote in message
news:03f5874c-5501-4ceb...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

> Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?

You post a whine about some crazy leftist conspiracy - and then complain
that other people are posting about conspiracies.
Typical Republican hypocrisy there.

[hal lillywhite]

On Dec 13, 6:19 pm, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
> In article
> <03f5874c-5501-4ceb-8be7-d13282090...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

>  hal lillywhite <hlill...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>
> > > >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> > > >>fascist left.
> > > > I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > > > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > > > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>
> > > Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>
> > > Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
>
> > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>
> Bill did not say that.  In fact he says the opposite.  It is the
> opposite political persuasion (wing nut) that sees conspiracy in
> anything they oppose.

Where do you get that? I never suggested any conspiracy, it was Bill
that brought that up.

Seems like a typical leftist trick, you cannot dispute the facts so
you accuse your opponent of something he did not say. Usually it is
racism but in this case it is believing in a conspiracy.

> > It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
> > that especially most universities are likewise.
>
>  vote for higher level intelligence.  Expected.

And college professors are so renowned for common sense, right?

[hal lillywhite]

On Dec 13, 6:49 pm, "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote:
> "hal lillywhite"  wrote in message
>
> news:03f5874c-5501-4ceb...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>
> You post a whine about some crazy leftist conspiracy

When did I post any such thing? When did I mention or even imply
conspiracy? You are once again the champion liar on this group.

[clw]

In article
<ac54c88b-9165-4d4a...@po6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

hal lillywhite <hlil...@juno.com> wrote:

> Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?

Hal, you are the one who said "Do you think everything that happens is
caused by conspiracy?"

If you don't want that connotation do not use the term.

[clw]

In article
<ac54c88b-9165-4d4a...@po6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

hal lillywhite <hlil...@juno.com> wrote:

> On Dec 13, 6:19 pm, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
> > In article
> > <03f5874c-5501-4ceb-8be7-d13282090...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> >  hal lillywhite <hlill...@juno.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > > >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> > > > >>fascist left.
> > > > > I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > > > > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > > > > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
> >
> > > > Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
> >
> > > > Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
> >
> > > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
> >
> > Bill did not say that.  In fact he says the opposite.  It is the
> > opposite political persuasion (wing nut) that sees conspiracy in
> > anything they oppose.
>
> Where do you get that? I never suggested any conspiracy, it was Bill
> that brought that up.

No, Hal. you suggested conspiracy thinking. You did not have to use
the word.

>
> Seems like a typical leftist trick, you cannot dispute the facts so
> you accuse your opponent of something he did not say. Usually it is
> racism but in this case it is believing in a conspiracy.

Hal, you have resorted to obfuscation too many times. You defined the
action and it it is conspiratorial. Intelligent people can infer from
the content.

>
> > > It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
> > > that especially most universities are likewise.
> >
> >  vote for higher level intelligence.  Expected.
>
> And college professors are so renowned for common sense, right?

Correct. Have you looked for it at BYU?

[Al]

To be a leftist, you have to be a very good liar and a very good schemer. Of course the good and effective leftists are intelligent, they couldn't survive otherwise. Of course they are highly skilled at wordplay, evasion, slippery methods to get out of logical traps.

A good leftist can keep an honest man running in circles until they give up from sheer frustration or anger or a combination of both , the objective is not truth, or logic, or anything useful to society, the objective is to win. Logic, truth, morality, consistency of core beliefs, all totally malleable in pursuit of the objective, victory.

That's why unintelligent and provably and cinfessed failed folks like S Kaufmann will snip your point, or micharacterize your argument, or even slander, he has to win, not demonstrate integrity or good faith of argument.

The man at his age is so deep in the hole of dismal failure, anyone who encounters him knows he comes from a position of resigned desperation. The person most aware of his lot in life is him.

If he truly believes he has any positive virtue in his persona here, he's not stupid, he's crazy.

He's at the point in life that he's basically given up, and the most he can hope to accomplish is to successfully waste someone's time. if he lands a sucker, he's had a most excellent day.

What a life, eh? Would YOU want be Sanders Kaufman? The sad thing is , he'll still be the Dull Boy in ten years, in twenty years. He will one day die a waste, and no-one will miss him.

Sad to watch maybe, if anyone actually cared. How are your tires these days, fast-food giant?

[Bill Shatzer]

hal lillywhite wrote:

> On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>
>
>>>>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
>>>>fascist left.
>>>
>>>I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
>>>news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
>>>citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>>
>>Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>>
>>Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!

> Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?

The more relevant question would be why do you think that way?

"Fascist left". "control of the media and education". "working hard".
"sheep-like creatures".

That sounds a lot like conspiracy theory la-la land to me.

> It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
> that especially most universities are likewise.

But "fascist left"? C'mon!

> Whether that was
> because of a concerted effort to put leftists in those positions or
> just that leftists found those positions attractive is of lesser
> importance than the fact that it happened.

Perhaps - but only a conspiracy nut would content that there is some
ulterior plan to create "sheep-like creatures."

And in my experience, most universities -promote- critical thinking, not
the reverse. There are exceptions of course. Liberty University and Oral
Roberts spring to mind - as well as a couple others.

Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?

http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572

peace and justice,

[Freebie Fred]

Shitzy, you cut your own throat and will bleed to death before you know
what you also did to your kids. Maybe you aren't as smart as you think
you are.

[Freebie Fred]

Shitzy is one of those bumper sticker guys.

[Freebie Fred]

Bucky eats sperm in bus stations.

[Freebie Fred]

Lees go slash Bucky's tires again. Actually his sister slashed his tires
because he prematurely ejaculates.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Don't forget the UAKKKW's racist assault on the hotdog vendor...

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2012/12/13/Unions-Attack-Destroy-African-American-Hot-Dog-Vendor-s-Equipment

All while President Tawana Hussein Brawley stood by and smiled.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

"I voted for the Earth to freeze before I voted for it to melt" -
Perfessor Al 'Manbearpig' Gore.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

"Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!"

- Bill 'Buy my free software!' Shatzer, at the beginning of thread
before it was edited out by his fellow travelers.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 17:25:44 -0800, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:

>In article
><ac54c88b-9165-4d4a...@po6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> hal lillywhite <hlil...@juno.com> wrote:
>
>> On Dec 13, 6:19 pm, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
>> > In article
>> > <03f5874c-5501-4ceb-8be7-d13282090...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
>> >  hal lillywhite <hlill...@juno.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > > On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>> >
>> > > > >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
>> > > > >>fascist left.
>> > > > > I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
>> > > > > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
>> > > > > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>> >
>> > > > Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>> >
>> > > > Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
>> >
>> > > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>> >
>> > Bill did not say that.  In fact he says the opposite.  It is the
>> > opposite political persuasion (wing nut) that sees conspiracy in
>> > anything they oppose.
>>
>> Where do you get that? I never suggested any conspiracy, it was Bill
>> that brought that up.
>
>No, Hal. you suggested conspiracy thinking. You did not have to use
>the word.

No, Shatz did. Read above; try for comprehension.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

"Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!"

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 21:07:41 -0800, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu>
wrote:

>hal lillywhite wrote:
>
>> On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
>>>>>fascist left.
>>>>
>>>>I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
>>>>news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
>>>>citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>>>
>>>Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>>>
>>>Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
>
>> Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>
>The more relevant question would be why do you think that way?
>
>"Fascist left". "control of the media and education". "working hard".
>"sheep-like creatures".
>
>That sounds a lot like conspiracy theory la-la land to me.

Sounds a lot more like Bill 'buy my free software' Shatzer to the rest
of us.

>> It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
>> that especially most universities are likewise.
>
>But "fascist left"? C'mon!

S'truth, dude.

>> Whether that was
>> because of a concerted effort to put leftists in those positions or
>> just that leftists found those positions attractive is of lesser
>> importance than the fact that it happened.
>
>Perhaps - but only a conspiracy nut would content that there is some
>ulterior plan to create "sheep-like creatures."

The 'Rats have succeeded without even trying, then? How little credit
you give your masters! This will not look good on your annual
review...

>And in my experience, most universities -promote- critical thinking, not
>the reverse.

...as long as it adheres to the Party Line. Dare to step out of
favor, and you will be slapped down for any number of "hate speech
infractions."

>There are exceptions of course. Liberty University and Oral
>Roberts spring to mind - as well as a couple others.
>
>Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?
>
>http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572

BYU is a private LDS institution. They get to make the rules on their
campus, right or wrong. Oh, right - you fascist 'Rats have no
compunctions about forcing religious believers to conform to your
deviance.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Thank God for fender-benders.

[clw]

In article <b7olc81is1gg31btn...@4ax.com>,

1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities

<Tawana....@whitehouse.gov> wrote:

> BYU is a private LDS institution. They get to make the rules on their
> campus, right or wrong. Oh, right - you fascist 'Rats have no
> compunctions about forcing religious believers to conform to your
> deviance.

As long as BYU recruits non-LDS athletes to play on their sports teams,
they have an obligation to act like a real University.

[hal lillywhite]

On 13 dic, 19:25, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
> In article

> <ac54c88b-9165-4d4a-a255-71fce9643...@po6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

>  hal lillywhite <hlill...@juno.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Dec 13, 6:19 pm, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
> > > In article
> > > <03f5874c-5501-4ceb-8be7-d13282090...@ut5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> > > hal lillywhite <hlill...@juno.com> wrote:
>
> > > > On 13 dic, 14:28, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>
> > > > > >>America ~will~ be free, no matter the will, wishes, and ways of the
> > > > > >>fascist left.
> > > > > > I hope so. Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > > > > > news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > > > > > citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>
> > > > > Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>
> > > > > Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
>
> > > > Why? Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>
> > > Bill did not say that. In fact he says the opposite. It is the
> > > opposite political persuasion (wing nut) that sees conspiracy in
> > > anything they oppose.
>
> > Where do you get that?  I never suggested any conspiracy, it was Bill
> > that brought that up.
>
> No, Hal.  you suggested conspiracy thinking.  You did not have to use
> the word.

And why would you think that conspiracy is the only explanation for
that? See the response I intend to write to Bill

...

> > And college professors are so renowned for common sense, right?
>
> Correct.  Have you looked for it at BYU?

Found a lot of it, and some profs who lacked it. The ratio was
probably better than at most universities since a lot of BYU profs
come from rural backgrounds where they are not protected from the
realities of life.

[hal lillywhite]

On 13 dic, 23:07, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:

> >>>I hope so.  Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> >>>news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> >>>citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
>
> >>Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
>
> >>Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
> > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
>
> The more relevant question would be why do you think that way?

Because study after study has shown that college profs and media
people tend to be far more to the left than the average citizen.

> "Fascist left".

Yup. Read for example Goldberg's book, _Liberal Fascism_. And note
that fascism is not just Nazism,

"The economic system inaugurated by the Fascist regime of Benito
Mussolini in Italy. It was adapted in modified form under other
European dictatorships, among them Adolf Hitler's National Socialist
regime in Germany and the Spanish regime of Francisco Franco. Although
the Italian system was based upon unlimited government control of
economic life, it still preserved the framework of capitalism.
Legislation of 1926 and later years set up guilds, or associations, of
employees and employers to administer various sectors of the national
economy. These were represented in the national council of
corporations. The corporations were generally weighted by the state in
favor of the wealthy classes, and they served to combat socialism and
syndicalism by absorbing the trade union movement. The Italian
corporative state aimed in general at reduced consumption in the
interest of militarization."
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Fascism/Fascism_def_char_hx.html

Today's "liberals" are not in favor of the military but do want more
government control of our lives and to mix government with industry.

> "control of the media and education".

Yup. See above. They hold the positions of power in most universities
and the MSM so they can control those institutions.

> "working hard". "sheep-like creatures".

Try opposing political correctness on an average college campus and
see what happens. They want sheeple who will accept their ideas
without question.

> That sounds a lot like conspiracy theory la-la land to me.

Try thinking a bit more broadly. There is more than one explanation
for that type of thinking. Personally I think the major explanation
is groupthink. That type of sheep-like behavior is all around us,
from following fashion to political correctness etc. I think the MSM
and most university people are engaging in groupthink.

> > It has been shown multiple times that the MSM is leftist dominated and
> > that especially most universities are likewise.
>
> But "fascist left"?  C'mon!

In the real sense of fascism, lock-step ideas, big government etc.
Remember that fascism was kind of the in thing before Hitler gave it a
bad name. As Goldberg documents, Wilson wanted it for the US.

> > Whether that was
> > because of a concerted effort to put leftists in those positions or
> > just that leftists found those positions attractive is of lesser
> > importance than the fact that it happened.
>
> Perhaps - but only a conspiracy nut would content that there is some
> ulterior plan to create "sheep-like creatures."

Who said there was a plan? Groupthink seldom involves planning to
force people into that mold.

> And in my experience, most universities -promote- critical thinking, not
> the reverse.

Try telling that to Lawrence Summers who was forced out at Harvard for
having the temerity to suggest that they look at science to see if
women really are identical to men except for plumbing.

Actually most universities will accept and even maybe encourage
critical thinking as long as it does not infringe on their politically
correct sacred cows. Propose a way of testing a theory in chemistry
or physics and that is just fine. However don't you dare propose a
critical examination of affirmative action or the idea that women have
the same interests as men.

> There are exceptions of course. Liberty University and Oral
> Roberts spring to mind - as well as a couple others.

And Harvard.

> Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?
>
> http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572

Opposing homosexual marriage is leftist? If you work for a private
institution don't be surprised if they get unhappy if you oppose
something important to the sponsor.

However BYU was quite accepting of the alternate graduation speaker
some students got when they did not want to hear Dick Cheney. How
many schools like Oregon, Oregon State, Harvard etc. would have
allowed Cheney to speak at all, or not drowned him out had he tried to
speak?

[hal lillywhite]

On 14 dic, 02:15, 1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities

<Tawana.Braw...@whitehouse.gov> wrote:

> "Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!"
> - Bill 'Buy my free software!' Shatzer, at the beginning of thread
> before it was edited out by his fellow travelers.

Actually the free software guy is LeRoy Baxter. Shatzer is a former
lawyer.

[hal lillywhite]

On 14 dic, 10:59, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:

> As long as BYU recruits non-LDS athletes to play on their sports teams,
> they have an obligation to act like a real University.

The fact is that they do act like a real university, just see US News
& World Report's annual issue any year when they rate universities.
BYU consistently rates rather high.

And why would admitting non-LDS students, athletes or not, obligate
them to act in any way differently than without such students? Those
students are told clearly what the requirements are and agree to live
according to the rules.

[clw]

In article
<13966cc0-e2ef-4785...@qi10g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,

hal lillywhite <hlil...@juno.com> wrote:

> On 13 dic, 23:07, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
>
> > >>>I hope so.  Unfortunately the fascist left has control of much of the
> > >>>news media and education system and is working hard to turn the
> > >>>citizens into sheep-like creatures who do no critical thinking.
> >
> > >>Ah-ooh-gah! Ah-ooh-gah!
> >
> > >>Conspiracy nut alert! Conspracy nut alert!
> > > Why?  Do you think everything that happens is caused by conspiracy?
> >
> > The more relevant question would be why do you think that way?
>
> Because study after study has shown that college profs and media
> people tend to be far more to the left than the average citizen.

Must be an intelligence gap phenonemon.

[Bill Shatzer]

1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities wrote:

> On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 21:07:41 -0800, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu>

>>There are exceptions of course. Liberty University and Oral
>>Roberts spring to mind - as well as a couple others.

>>Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?

>>http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572

> BYU is a private LDS institution.

So? The issue is whether this sort of thing encourages critical thinking
or whether BYU is part of the vast "fascist left" educational system
seeking to turn out "sheep-like creatures" who do no such thinking.

> They get to make the rules on their
> campus, right or wrong.

Of course they do. But the issue not whether the rules are "right" or
"wrong" but whether or not BYU's "rules" promote or hinder "critical
thinking."

You might wish to review what happens to apostate Mormon students at BYU.

> Oh, right - you fascist 'Rats have no
> compunctions about forcing religious believers to conform to your
> deviance.

Whoosh! Right over your head.

peace and justice,

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Damn. They all look the same to me... Shatz is also the one who
thinks we need more 9/11s, too.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Education and sports at just about ~any~ university have virtually
nothing in common.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

You're not allowed to set rules for moonbats. Ask any Occupier...

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 16:51:20 -0800, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu>
wrote:

>1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 13 Dec 2012 21:07:41 -0800, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu>
>
>>>There are exceptions of course. Liberty University and Oral
>>>Roberts spring to mind - as well as a couple others.
>
>>>Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?
>
>>>http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572
>
>> BYU is a private LDS institution.
>
>So? The issue is whether this sort of thing encourages critical thinking
>or whether BYU is part of the vast "fascist left" educational system
>seeking to turn out "sheep-like creatures" who do no such thinking.

They are not such an institution.

>> They get to make the rules on their
>> campus, right or wrong.
>
>Of course they do. But the issue not whether the rules are "right" or
>"wrong" but whether or not BYU's "rules" promote or hinder "critical
>thinking."

Guaranteed there is far more than on the average lefty sheep farm.
Unless you are talking about which party to throw up at on Friday
night...

>You might wish to review what happens to apostate Mormon students at BYU.
>
>> Oh, right - you fascist 'Rats have no
>> compunctions about forcing religious believers to conform to your
>> deviance.
>
>Whoosh! Right over your head.

Right through yours, ear-to-ear.

[1834 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Clearly. Them what can't do, teach.

[Bill Shatzer]

hal lillywhite wrote:

> On 13 dic, 23:07, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:

- snip -

>>Maybe BYU is a part of the "fascist left"?

>>http://www.sltrib.com/ci_3932572

> Opposing homosexual marriage is leftist?

I don't know where that falls on the left/right political spectrum but
it's at least quasi fascist and hardly calculated to encourage "critical
thinking" or non-sheep tendancies, at least on those issues deemed
crucial to the Mormon Church.

> If you work for a private
> institution don't be surprised if they get unhappy if you oppose
> something important to the sponsor.

Which is hardly the point. Critical thinking on certain points deemed
important to the Church is not only discouraged but outright prohibited
on pain of dismissal.

> However BYU was quite accepting of the alternate graduation speaker
> some students got when they did not want to hear Dick Cheney.

Heh! As I recall the incident, students opposed to Cheney had to take
their "alternate commensement" off campus to a commencement speech and
ceremony they organized themselves. I don't recall any "accepting" by
BYU. Certainly no BYU support or encouragement.

> How
> many schools like Oregon, Oregon State, Harvard etc. would have
> allowed Cheney to speak at all, or not drowned him out had he tried to
> speak?

Who knows. Still commencement speeches tend to be rather bland, one-shot
affairs not renowned for encouraging critical thinking. Cheney's
certainly was and didn't.

Firing a professor who dared to question the pronouncements of the
Mormon Church has a pretty chilling effect on anyone who might be
inclined to question Church doctrine or display non-ovine proclivities
in that regard.

peace and justice,

[Bill Shatzer]

hal lillywhite wrote:

> On 14 dic, 10:59, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
>
>
>>As long as BYU recruits non-LDS athletes to play on their sports teams,
>>they have an obligation to act like a real University.

> The fact is that they do act like a real university, just see US News
> & World Report's annual issue any year when they rate universities.
> BYU consistently rates rather high.

Sixty-eighth is "rather high"?

Some the chant, "We're number 68!" lacks a certain je ne sais quoi.

peace and justice,

[Bill Shatzer]

Try just about any Division III school.

peace and justice,

[hal lillywhite]

On 14 dic, 23:10, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:

> > Opposing homosexual marriage is leftist?
>
> I don't know where that falls on the left/right political spectrum

??? Come on Bill, you have to have followed the news and know that
the left is much more likely to support homosexual marriage and the
right more likely to oppose it.

> but
> it's at least quasi fascist and hardly calculated to encourage "critical
> thinking" or non-sheep tendancies, at least on those issues deemed
> crucial to the Mormon Church.

Lots of LDS hace supported homosexual marriage with no consequences.
However if you are in the pay of an organization it is normal to not
work contrary to that organization.

> > If you work for a private
> > institution don't be surprised if they get unhappy if you oppose
> > something important to the sponsor.
>
> Which is hardly the point. Critical thinking  on certain points deemed
> important to the Church is not only discouraged but outright prohibited
> on pain of dismissal.

I am not aware of anyone who faced church discipline for disagreement
with the church unless they actively worked against the church. Why
would you want to belong to a church if you disagree that much with
it? After all, churches are organizations of *believers*. If you do
not believe that is your right but don't expect to have the same
standing as do believers. Would you expect, for example, to remain a
member in good standing of the NAACP while preaching white supremacy?

> > However BYU was quite accepting of the alternate graduation speaker
> > some students got when they did not want to hear Dick Cheney.
>
> Heh! As I recall the incident, students opposed to Cheney had to take
> their "alternate commensement" off campus to a commencement speech and
> ceremony they organized themselves. I don't recall any "accepting" by
> BYU. Certainly no BYU support or encouragement.

Nor any adverse consequences.

> > How
> > many schools like Oregon, Oregon State, Harvard etc. would have
> > allowed Cheney to speak at all, or not drowned him out had he tried to
> > speak?
>
> Who knows.

Get real Bill, you must have read about at least many of the cases in
which a conservative speaker was shouted down or not allowed to speak
on or near campus.

> Still commencement speeches tend to be rather bland, one-shot
> affairs not renowned for encouraging critical thinking. Cheney's
> certainly was and didn't.
>
> Firing a professor who dared to question the pronouncements of the
> Mormon Church has a pretty chilling effect on anyone who might be
> inclined to question Church doctrine or display non-ovine proclivities
> in that regard.

When I was there I saw plenty of disagreement among professors and
students. As long as they didn't actively work against the church
there were no consequences. In fact I argued with my frosh religion
teacher about evolution. He was a strong believer in the young earth
theory and opponent of evolution. Still got an A in the class.

[hal lillywhite]

On 14 dic, 23:18, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:
> hal lillywhite wrote:
> > On 14 dic, 10:59, clw <c...@ohsu.gov> wrote:
>
> >>As long as BYU recruits non-LDS athletes to play on their sports teams,
> >>they have an obligation to act like a real University.
> > The fact is that they do act like a real university, just see US News
> > & World Report's annual issue any year when they rate universities.
> > BYU consistently rates rather high.
>
> Sixty-eighth is "rather high"?

Out of how many universities in the country? Yes, it is rather high.
They are even higher in the most cost effective list.

[hal lillywhite]

On 14 dic, 23:32, Bill Shatzer <ww...@NOcornell.edu> wrote:

> > Education and sports at just about ~any~ university have virtually
> > nothing in common.
>
> Try just about any Division III school.

Or even a few of the major ones. BYU is pretty good at encouraging
their athletes to study, I remember the wrestling coach calling us in
and reviewing how the teams for the different sports did
academically. I know that when I was there any football player in
academic trouble got a bit of help - a special study hall at 6am.

Paterno had a terrible end but at Penn State he was famous for pushing
his players to do well in school.

And I'm not sure about now but when Eddie Robinson was at Grambling he
also pushed his players to do well in school.

I'm sure there are others. Unfortunately the other types get most of
the news.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"hal lillywhite" wrote in message

news:ac54c88b-9165-4d4a...@po6g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

> Seems like a typical leftist trick, you cannot dispute the facts so
> you accuse your opponent of something he did not say.

That would be bad, but there's nothing "leftist" about that.
Leftism is something else entirely.
Your response however, is very typical.. of someone with a paranoid
delusion.

You're such an idiot, and have been for so long, that you've come to think
the world is against you somehow.
That's how the disease progresses.

[Sancho Panza]

When nothing but crap insults are hurled at you, are you supposed to
welcome them? Just like the new Army manual that instructs soldiers to
be "nice" to the Taliban that is trying to kill them. Real intelligent, huh?

[Sanders Kaufman]

"Bill Shatzer" wrote in message news:kah17a$55k$1...@dont-email.me...
> hal lillywhite wrote:

>>sixty-eighth is "rather high"?

>Some the chant, "We're number 68!" lacks a certain je ne sais quoi.

Maybe, to a liberal elitist, 68th among accredited schools is no big deal.
But the evangelical community can't afford to be so snobby.
Hell, most of their schools can't even get accredited.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"hal lillywhite" wrote in message

news:2ea9fefb-97b4-47b4...@pp8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

> Paterno had a terrible end but at Penn State he was famous for pushing
> his players to do well in school.

That's how child predators in the Evangelical community (like Paterno and
Sandusky) operate.
They call it "grooming" and it's why they get away with it for so many, many
decades.

What evangelicals need to come to understand is that Paterno's sins were in
how he LIVED his life, not the random way that life ended.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"hal lillywhite" wrote in message

news:13966cc0-e2ef-4785...@qi10g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

> Because study after study has shown that college profs and media
> people tend to be far more to the left than the average citizen.

It's pathetic when white-power evangelicals cite unnamed studies to promote
their sick beliefs.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"Sancho Panza" wrote in message news:50cf2c62$0$24768$607e...@cv.net...

> When nothing but crap insults are hurled at you, are you supposed to
> welcome them?

You racist pigs sure do ask some stupid questions.

[Sancho Panza]

What was "racist pig" about my post?

[1835 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Sanders has this knee-jerk problem he's been working on. It's not
going well at all...

[hal lillywhite]

On Dec 17, 9:34 am, "Sanders Kaufman" <bu...@kaufman.net> wrote:

> It's pathetic when white-power evangelicals cite unnamed studies to promote
> their sick beliefs.

It is hilarious when our liar in chief ignores the studies that have
been posted here repeatedly, while implying that I am an evangelical.
Some of the evangelicals with whom I've had religious disagreements
would also find it hilarious.

[Sanders Kaufman]

"hal lillywhite" wrote in message

news:50c5ce3e-84b4-4b8f...@pp8g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...

>It is hilarious when our liar in chief ignores the studies that have
>been posted here repeatedly,

It's hilarious when when right-wing, anti-government psychos get upset when
nobody will pay attention to their "studies".

[Sancho Panza]

Especially when those "studies" show so clearly so often just how
misinformed and skewed the left-wing pro-big-govvernment psychos are.

[1838 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

Hilarious is the left's inability to comprehend anything beyond 'Dick
and Jane'.

[Al]

In article <1W4Bs.42995$LS5....@newsfe10.iad>,

You find willful ignorance amusing? Gotta like a guy willing to laugh at
himself.

[Al]

In article <c74bd8dkj83f94vsq...@4ax.com>,
1838 murdered in Obama's organized communities

What makes you think Bucky ever understood any of those stories?

[Sancho Panza]

That's one of his survival mechanisms.

[Al]

In article <50d63998$0$1204$607e...@cv.net>,

Sanders is surviving? Coulda fooled me.

[1838 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Sat, 22 Dec 2012 12:25:30 -0600, Al <albert.f...@gmail.com>
wrote:

He masturbates to the pictures. Of Spot.

[1838 murdered in Obama's organized communities]

On Sat, 22 Dec 2012 21:23:53 -0600, Al <albert.f...@gmail.com>
wrote:

They say cockroaches will inherit the world...