I have received the basic information, though as I am in South Africa I
do not have all the details on this issue, so I will summarize
accordingly.

If your activation keys were issued after November 2001 AND are running
4.2.6 your server will automatically shut itself down as of 00:00 GMT
Feb 1 2005. I do not know if there is a date between now and that date
for this not to occur and if I do hear anything I will post it to the
list.

This item was resolved with later releases so upgrade accordingly to
4.2.8.

___________________________________

Philip Slater
Sales Engineer
Stalker Software, Inc.
1 415 383 7164 ext 201
1 800 262 4722 ext 201
psla...@stalker.com
AIM: stalkersoftware

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Phil,

Can I use my old licence number with 4.2.8 or are there any limit in
4.2.8 as well for old licence numbers?

Peter

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On 01.02.2005 11:47 Uhr "Phil Slater" <psla...@stalker.com> wrote:

My license was issued before November 2001 AND i was running 4.2.5 (not
4.2.6) and my Server shut down this night.

So the information you posted above is at least incomplete.

--
Stefan Seiz <http://www.StefanSeiz.com>
Spamto: <b...@imd.net>

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Why don't I see any mention of this bugfix at
http://www.stalker.com/CommuniGatePro/History.html  ?

--
- Ozmiroid

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It is a time bomb. The question what other time bomb are still in the
server.

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Very important information for us ....

Le 1 févr. 05, à 13:43, John Keown a écrit :

Cordialement,

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I for one will not believe what stalker says. I am looking for a
replacement.

Depending on what your needs are, check out SurgeMail -
http://www.surgemail.com

Very nice (admittedly the webmail is not as nice as David Bakker or
Nicolas Haiter's improved Stalker skins). They are very upfront as to
what their maint. costs are and a pretty helpful mailing list.

They will also entertain suggestions instead of ignoring their users or
worse telling them how stupid they are (like stalker has done on occasion).

I already have a 100,000 user license and have been moving my domains
over to it.

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Because there was no bugfix, nor was this a bug in the first place.

I'm merely speculating... I have no evidence to prove this, but here's my
thoughts...

Stalker decides to kick the prices up by several times, and in order to get
their customer base to upgrade, they announce that even though they always
tell people to upgrade to the latest software because they don't release
bugfix only updates, they will begin to enforce the license which says only
2-years of updates are free.

They then put a timebomb into the next version of Communigate Pro so that
there will be more than just words behind their legal threat.

They then catch a lot of flak about pricing and licensing and all of a
sudden they realize that in many countries (including US) it's actually
illegal to put a hidden timebomb into a program.

So they quietly release the next version with the timebomb removed and
figure everyone out there upgrades right away with every new version.

Of course with the license fuss they raised, many people were afraid to
upgrade to any newer versions because of fear that not only are they not
entitled to, but maybe some later version will simply not work at all with
older license keys.  Not to mention that many (if not most?) people will
either wait to upgrade until any known bugs are found, or they don't upgrade
at all if there's no benefit (no bugs affecting them, no new features they
desire).

And so now here we are, Feb. 1 2005 after their time-bomb has hit (it must
be something that only happens when the date actually rolls from one day to
the next, since some folks had rolled their servers forward months and even
years and the server ran fine), and they're calling it a "bug".

I find it hard to believe that an "accidental" "bug" would shut down the
server at midnight GMT on Feb 1 of 2005 for only certain license keys
generated in a certain timeframe.  Yeah...sure.

The REALLY annoying part is that when asked point blank if there was a
time-bomb in CGP, Vladimir wouldn't answer.

I'd suggest that anyone who was affected by this and lives in a country
where timebombs like this are illegal has a very good case to bring against
Stalker, and it could be a class-action civil suit.

How many programmers are there at Stalker and how soon can we get a lawyer
to file suite and issue subpoenas for testimony regarding deliberate
introduction of a timebomb?  Should we start a pool on when the first
lawsuit gets slapped on Stalker?

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Count me in. I will gladly be part of a lawsuit against Stalker.

On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 07:48:19 -0800
  "Aaron" <aa...@madpoo.com> wrote:

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Me too. Where do I sign.

On 01.02.2005 16:48 Uhr, Aaron <aa...@madpoo.com> wrote:

You nailed it. And that is what hurts me the most in this disaster.

I tried to stay as honest as possible. My license only allowed me to run up
to 4.1.8, but by the time we were informed about this, i was already running
a more recent version also due to fixes of serious bugs. I was in
negotiations with Stalker sales since back when the new license disaster
started and was quite sure to upgrade anyway (i did today - new key received
an hour ago).

Now, being an honest guy, i stayed with a version from October 2004 which
was 4.2.5 - i did NOT update anymore neither to 4.2.6 nor 4.2.7 nor 4.2.8.
And now it seems i wouldn't have this mess this morning if i wouldn't had
been so honest and just would have upgraded to 4.2.8.

Lesson learned.

Time for a 180 Degree turn around in Stalkers attitudes i might say.
How can they try so hard to put them selves out of business.
And not a single word or apoligy from Vlad.

This really puzzles me.

--
Stefan Seiz <http://www.stefanseiz.com>
Spamto: <b...@imd.net>

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On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 17:34:38 +0100
  Stefan Seiz <TalkLi...@index-s.de> wrote:

[snip]

You have to be sorry for your actions in order to apologize. I very
much doubt he is sorry for this. If he were, he would not have
instructed the programmers to implement the time bomb in the first
place. Why not simply not let newer versions of the software work with
older keys instead of putting a time-bomb in place? Why not be honest
- unfortunately Vlad et al have proven themselves to be very unethical
and underhanded.

I will do my part in letting people know to stay away from any Stalker
product in the future - this will also be good information for their
competitors to have as part of their sales pitch "We don't install
time-bombs in our software"

Lets see in the new comparision charts:

                                  Stalker   Everyone else
Has time bomb                      yes          no
may stop w/o warning               yes          no
will ignore help requests          yes          no

And don't forget, unless Stalker has unsubscribed the newsgroups from
this list, all of this information will be out there for all to know.

I would suggest it is called greed. Not that I don't think they should
be rewarded for their work. But putting a time bomb in the software is
unethical. Stalkers actions makes Microsoft look good! (and that isn't
a compliment).

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Something has changed at Stalker in the last year, - new managers, new
owners, new corporate philosophy? CGP is still coded very well (with
the major exception of this timebomb code, which obviously did not
work as expected by anyone), but customer relations (keeping customers
informed, acknowledging customer input) has gone down the tubes.

--
- Ozmiroid

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Something has changed at Stalker in the last year, - new managers, new
owners, new corporate philosophy? CGP is still coded very well (with
the major exception of this timebomb code, which obviously did not
work as expected by anyone), but customer relations (keeping customers
informed, acknowledging customer input) has gone down the tubes.

--
- Ozmiroid

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 From reading the posts this morning, I feel lucky. Running 4.2.7 on an
OSX box didn't stop working at 0 hour..
Unfortunately, now it only gives me two copies of each message.
--
Peter

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list-

Sorry, I must be an idiot or something...

- People asking for free immediate 24/7 support at 1am in the morning,
or any other time?

- Using expired keys on new versions illegally?

- Threatening a class-action suit because they can't do something
illegally?

- Involving the FTC, as if their response would be faster (or less
expensive) than Stalkers?

- Saying they will hire lawyers ($400/hr) because they want free stuff?

I did upgrade to a new version, but I emailed stalker saying I was
going to break the original contract and use more recent terms and can
I please upgrade. They told me to do so at a specific version and I
did. If they told me to pay for the upgrade then I would have done that
before upgrading. What? You think I would do something illegal, or
can't read a contract? That's called: Paying a living wage for someone
to do work; or asking if I can get something for free, and not
expecting free stuff. It is up to them.

Am I obtuse and stupid or something? Am I the only idiot that expects
to pay for good software and support? And be gracious, thankful and
humble when I get it for free?

If you pay for 24/7 support and have legal keys and have a problem then
I assume stalker is working hard for you as any good company will and I
am sorry for your difficulty.

thanks!-

-lance

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Stalker should have set their time bomb to go off when their
tech-support were at work.

They said people who gained their licenses after November 2001 should be
able to use 4.2.5 fine.  Thus, the timebomb is the illegal part
Read above, though I do not advocate lawsuits.

No, but perhaps it would encourage stalker to reform their practices in
the long term.

See above posts about what people were liable to use.

No, you just haven't read the posts and the licenses correctly

We've paid for the new keys and have had no problems, but that doesn't
mean I agree with what has happened to people who are LEGALLY able to
use the program and are having problems.
--
-------------------------------------------
Paul Chauvet
UNIX/Linux Systems Administrator
State University of New York at New Paltz
845-257-3828
chauv...@newpaltz.edu
-------------------------------------------

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Hi;

 Why not simply not let newer versions of the

I think that is because you are stealing the software.
If you are, then just get keys from a warez site and
do it without expecting them to do it for you.

Are we sure there is a bomb? From what I read today,
it seems that some people have taken software they do
not own, and it does not work.

Sean

___________________________________________________________
ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger - all new features - even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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People need to STOP saying that people are stealing/pirating/using
software they don't own.

Read what Stalker's site is saying.  You ARE ABLE to use versions up to
and including 4.2.8 if you got a license any time after November 2001.
People who are LEGALLY ALLOWED to use it STOPPED working due to a
timebomb in 4.2.5.

Yes, stalker is remedying this SOMEWHAT by allowing 4.2.8 to be used,
but that doesn't change the fact that this is causing/has caused massive
problems for people.

--
-------------------------------------------
Paul Chauvet
UNIX/Linux Systems Administrator
State University of New York at New Paltz
845-257-3828
chauv...@newpaltz.edu
-------------------------------------------

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On Feb 1, 2005, at 12:56 PM, Paul Chauvet wrote:

The license we have is from November 2001 (or thereabouts) states very
clearly: "We get 2 years of upgrades and that is that".

Then stalker gave us some freebies. Good for them!

Is anyone using a license key LEGALLY that is not able to install the
patch to 4.2.8?

Having code to protect their assets from illegal use is just fine.
Maybe they made a mistake and tripped up over legal use, but that
happens. Too bad. I am sure they are trying their best.

I would like to hear about LEGAL usages where a problem is not being
fixed and where the admins have installed the latest  patch or version
or whatever you want to call it.

thanks!-

-lance

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On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:04:22 +0000 (GMT)
  Dirk Diggler <dirk_diggl...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

Maybe the post was confusing, it is saying don't let newer versions of
the software wotk with old keys. How can you be stealing something
that doesn't work?

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Hello,

On Tue, 01 Feb 2005 13:08:59 -0500
  Paul Chauvet <chauv...@newpaltz.edu> wrote:

they won't stop becuase they think they are better than others that
where following Stalkers directions to upgrade.

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  The REALLY annoying part is that when asked point blank if there was a
  time-bomb in CGP, Vladimir wouldn't answer.

I've had Vlad answer point-blank to me in a private email that such
code does not exist. Additionally, our license contract specifically
prohibits such action. Does yours?

matto

--m...@snark.net------------------------------------------<darwin><
              The only thing necessary for the triumph
              of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke

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On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 18:04:22 +0000 (GMT), Dirk Diggler

I see many posts where they say they have valid, legal, paid-in-full
keys for version 4.2.6. Legal beyond that version? I don't know. I do
see that Stalker says the fix for this issue with 4.2.6 is to upgrade
to 4.2.8. They don't say "upgrade if you have valid keys for 4.2.8",
they just say "upgrade".

I've paid the upgrade license fees to Stalker several times since
first buying the product in 2001, most recently in the spring of 2004
- my keys are valid until at least March 2005, confirmed by Stalker.
And I was caught dead in the water when the timebomb code hit my
server last night.

--
- Ozmiroid

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