Post ADSL 2+ Upgrade - Does this make sense?
James J
There is so much technical expertise knocking around this group I'd
really appreciate an opinion on this text chat exchange with Demon
Helpdesk. I received an email just after the major outage last week
telling me that my account had been upgraded. Ever since I've been
having problems (see Text Chat below).
I'm a little suspicious that I may be being fed a line by the help
desk. Before I invest yet more dosh in (yet another) router is anyone
able to confirm the information Demon are giving me? Basically, do I
need to get another router (and not a Netgear or Cisco one)?
One of the issues I have with this is that whilst he tells me that
Netgear and Cisco products are not compatible with ADSL 2+ he says
that Linksys are. But aren't Linksys really Cisco in disguise? And,
given the market penetration of both why didn't Demon warn us before
the upgrade?
Thanks in advance for your opinions.
Cut and Paste of Text Chat sessions follow (for the avoidance of
doubt, James is me - Joseph is Demon)
4th October 19:15
Connected To: Demon Text-Chat Live
James has joined the session
Connected to chat server, an agent will be with you shortly
Joseph has joined the session
James: (Broadband connection) Broadband
James: Hi
Joseph: Hello James, welcome to Demon Helpdesk,you are through to
Joseph. May I take your hostname please?
James: <whatever>
Very long pause
James: ?
Joseph: Please give me a moment while I access your account
information.
Joseph: Thank you for your patience,I have got the account
information.How can I help you?
James: I got an email saying my connection has been upgraded. But now
the linespeed is less and the connection only stays up for a few hours
at a time - that is if I can get one at all.
Joseph: In order for me to confirm security for this account please
can you quote your security code word or phrase?.
James: I don't believe I have such a thing - when would that have been
created?
Joseph: In order for me to confirm security for this account please
can you quote your full address with the post code,Account holders
full name and the Demon account number.
James: XX Xxxxxxxx
James: XXXXXXX XXX
James: St Albans
James: XXX XXX
James: X XXXXXXX
James: XXXXXXXX XXXX
James: Where will I find the account number?
Joseph: u can find it on bill or any paper work sent by demon.
James: That may take me a few minutes
Joseph: Take ur time...!
James: 1-XXXXX
Joseph: Which router is that ur using, And from how long ...?
Joseph: could i take make and modle no of the rtr that ur using ...?
James: It's a Netgear router DG834. I've had it for about 6 months.
It's worked perfectly until this "upgrade".
James: It has the latest firmware on it by the way
Joseph: ok ,Please give me a moment, While i do line check....
19:33 - connection drops (having stayed up for about 27 minutes in
total)
19:41 - re-establish router connection after several re-boots and get
back on to text chat
Connected To: Demon Text-Chat Live
James has joined the session
Connected to chat server, an agent will be with you shortly
Joseph has joined the session
James: (Broadband connection) Broadband
James: Hi, you were testing my line and I lost connectivity. Got it
back now.
Joseph: hi, as per line check it shows me that ur connection is
intermittent ,And that y ur finding slow speed
James: yes those are the symptoms exactly. Started earlier this week
Joseph: Need to inform u that there is a known issue with netgear rtr
on adsl2+ line ,Eve if u have got brand new rtr ,also line check shows
same and states that connection is droped by rtr....
James: what does that mean?
Joseph: Netgear rtr are not compatable with adsl2+ line and drops
connection.
James: Router is syncing - but other end is not authenticating.
Routers drops the session and tries again.
James: What routers are compatible with the upgrade?
Joseph: Any ADSL2+ rtr ,other than netgear and cisco.
James: Really? Two of the biggest names in the industry!
Joseph: that right but is true, these rtrvery good when u use them on
adsl connect byt not on adsl2+
James: Is linksys OK? I have ADSL modem somewhere.
Joseph: link sys rtr are ok but it should be adsl2+ rtr which has
latest firware...
James: I see. I'll have to reconfigure my network then!
Joseph: That right even if connect is not stable after u try diff
rtr ,then we would like u to try few caheck and then get in touch with
us so that we can get this issue reported ....
Joseph: Basic Checks for Intermittent conection 1) Swaping the
filters ., 2) Check the physical connections ., 3) Moniter connection
from master socket and test socket, 4) Isolat the line (Checked if
there is any devices connected to the line), 5) Check for the dial
tone , 6) Try with diffrent router ,
James: Ok - I'll do that. BTW the Netgear router claims it is ADSL2+
compatible (both on paper and online).
James: I've done all those steps with the exception of the last. Which
I will now do.
20:02 - Connection drops again
20:05 - Rebooted the router. Connection is established immediately and
has remained stable for the last 30 minutes (almost a record
recently!)
Paul C. Dickie
<6bb47894-b0d7-4689...@h30g2000vbr.googlegroups.com>,
James J <jenk...@gmail.com> writes
>One of the issues I have with this is that whilst he tells me that
>Netgear and Cisco products are not compatible with ADSL 2+ he says
>that Linksys are. But aren't Linksys really Cisco in disguise? And,
>given the market penetration of both why didn't Demon warn us before
>the upgrade?
>
>20:05 - Rebooted the router. Connection is established immediately and
>has remained stable for the last 30 minutes (almost a record
>recently!)
Did it remain stable with the Netgear router DG834and, if it did,
doesn't that suggest that "Joseph" was yet another flim-flam man?
On thinkbroadband.com, other people report no problems with that router,
even when used on C&W LLU. Why, then, should a "known problem"
apparently manifest itself on one service provider, but not on any
others?
--
< Paul >
Big Les Wade
>Folks,
>
>There is so much technical expertise knocking around this group I'd
>really appreciate an opinion on this text chat exchange with Demon
>Helpdesk. I received an email just after the major outage last week
>telling me that my account had been upgraded. Ever since I've been
>having problems (see Text Chat below).
Welcome to the Demon Theatre of Shite.
>I'm a little suspicious that I may be being fed a line by the help
>desk. Before I invest yet more dosh in (yet another) router is anyone
>able to confirm the information Demon are giving me? Basically, do I
>need to get another router (and not a Netgear or Cisco one)?
You don't need a new router. You need out.
--
Les
Peter Ceresole
> One of the issues I have with this is that whilst he tells me that
> Netgear and Cisco products are not compatible with ADSL 2+ he says
> that Linksys are. But aren't Linksys really Cisco in disguise? And,
> given the market penetration of both why didn't Demon warn us before
> the upgrade?
From the look of the transcript you posted, it looks as though the
connection is dropping every few minutes, certainly several times a day.
I'm on Demon's ADSL2+ service, using a Netgear DG834N wireless router.
It usually stays connected all day. Occasionally the data rate
disappears but it's always around the same time of the evening and it's
cured by a restart of the router- this doesn't seem to me to be
incompatibility of the DG834 with ADSL2+, but with some local source of
interference. As for speed, I was told before the changeover that on my
phone line I would get up to 4Mbps, and that's roughly what I do get in
practice. I can successfully stream the BBCiPlayer HD, which is a useful
test.
Tonight's figures from the ThinkBroadband speed tester go like this:
Downstream Upstream
04/10/09 21:27 3461.21 Kbps 845.59 Kbps
It's been higher than this, but it'll do. It's been connected since last
night.
The point is that this is with a DG834, so to say that they are not
compatible with ADSL2+ sounds like nonsense to me.
Having said that, people here have reported that the router that Demon
provide does work well.
--
Peter
Stephen Wolstenholme
<p...@bozzie.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>Did it remain stable with the Netgear router DG834and, if it did,
>doesn't that suggest that "Joseph" was yet another flim-flam man?
>
>On thinkbroadband.com, other people report no problems with that router,
>even when used on C&W LLU. Why, then, should a "known problem"
>apparently manifest itself on one service provider, but not on any
>others?
There is no major problem with the DG834 apart from its tolerance of
line noise. The Thomson TG585 supplied free by Demon negotiates faster
connections and is more tolerant of line noise. I have used both with
Demon.
Steve
--
Neural Planner Software Ltd www.NPSL1.com
Peter Ceresole
> There is no major problem with the DG834 apart from its tolerance of
> line noise. The Thomson TG585 supplied free by Demon negotiates faster
> connections and is more tolerant of line noise. I have used both with
> Demon.
Thanks for posting that. I have had occasional problems with a DG834
that, from their pattern, appear to be caused by line noise. Maybe I
should explore the Thompson option.
--
Peter
Nospam News
Ceresole <pe...@cara.demon.co.uk> writes
>James J <jenk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> given the market penetration of both why didn't Demon warn us before
>> the upgrade?
>
>
>compatible with ADSL2+ sounds like nonsense to me.
>
>Having said that, people here have reported that the router that Demon
>provide does work well.
Reading your mail I might ask Demon to provide a new router as I have
now had two Netgear routers the first one dropped continuously so I
bought a new one thinking it was dead. On set up I had a chat with a
technical support person who went through the usual questions then
stated their is a problem with Netgear and Cisco routers.
I followed the set up advice but the new router is still dropping and
talking with another support person it seems the only way is to replace
the router, what a pain!
I am a bit fed up with this as James said in his initial post Demon
didn't warn people about this router problem and the customer service
person recommended I buy yet another new router which is not good news
having just spent around a �100 on a DGN 2000 because I though my
earlier Netgear model had died.
Having been with Demon for over 10 years during which time they have
always provided good service I will probably just get on with it rather
than change providers.
I am informed you can get a free router if you sign a years contract so
that might be the way forward.
--
Adrian Richmond
arichmond@'nospam'ensign.demon.co.uk
as usual just remove 'nospam' to reply.
Les Desser
<6bb47894-b0d7-4689...@h30g2000vbr.googlegroups.com>,
James J <jenk...@gmail.com> Sun, 4 Oct 2009 12:27:38 writes
>It's a Netgear router DG834. I've had it for about 6 months.
Is that a V4 or V5 model?
The DG834 was the standard router I have been using for all my clients
for the last ... many years.
Since the upgrade to ADSL2+ we have found that you need V4 or later to
obtain a reasonable connection but even then the connection can be
problematic.
I have a Draytek Vigor 100 modem and V2910 router and virtually a day
does not go by when I do not lose connection at least once a day. The
modem stays up but the router re-syncs.
It does seem, from what people write here, that the Demon supplied
router gives less problems, but I cannot accept that a general service
provider cannot run a system that will work with all mass market
routers.
The DG834 must be one of the most popular routers used by people who
post here.
As at today, about a third of all my clients have decided to migrate
away from Demon.
I personally have also, reluctantly, made the same decision.
--
Les Desser
(The Reply-to address IS valid)
Simon Clubley
>
> Since the upgrade to ADSL2+ we have found that you need V4 or later to
> obtain a reasonable connection but even then the connection can be
> problematic.
>
> I have a Draytek Vigor 100 modem and V2910 router and virtually a day
> does not go by when I do not lose connection at least once a day. The
> modem stays up but the router re-syncs.
>
> It does seem, from what people write here, that the Demon supplied
> router gives less problems, but I cannot accept that a general service
> provider cannot run a system that will work with all mass market
> routers.
>
> The DG834 must be one of the most popular routers used by people who
> post here.
>
People are naturally focusing on which router works best with Demon, but
maybe we should take a step back and ask where the real problem is ?
I have also been given the "Netgear and Cisco not reliable" speech by
Demon and I am having a major problem with the idea that Cisco, of all
companies, would put out unreliable equipment.
This makes me wonder if the C&W LLU kit in the exchange is the real
source of the problems.
I also wonder what Cisco would say if they knew a major (at least in
the business market) UK ISP was telling it's customers that Cisco
equipment was unreliable.
Simon.
--
Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Microsoft: Bringing you 1980's technology to a 21st century world
Peter Ceresole
> It does seem, from what people write here, that the Demon supplied
> router gives less problems, but I cannot accept that a general service
> provider cannot run a system that will work with all mass market
> routers.
I think that you may find that it's a question of the 'delicacy' of
ADSL2+, its sensitivity to interference, and that the same problems will
happen with any provider using 2+.
It seems from posts here that the Thomson router has got it right, and
that Demon are providing the correct router.
Certainly, 2+ is faster than ADSLMax, and the higher upload speeds are
very useful indeed. I'd hate to have to downgrade to a provider still
using ADSLMax.
--
Peter
Peter Ceresole
> I am informed you can get a free router if you sign a years contract so
> that might be the way forward.
That does sound like a good idea.
Although my DG834 is actually working well 95% of the time, I'm also
considering going for a free Thomson router from Demon. The rest of
Demon's service (mail and basic connectivity) is working just fine for
me, so I have no worries about taking out a new contract.
--
Peter
Neale D. Hind
<6bb47894-b0d7-4689...@h30g2000vbr.googlegroups.com>,
James J <jenk...@gmail.com> writes
>Folks,
>
>There is so much technical expertise knocking around this group I'd
>really appreciate an opinion on this text chat exchange with Demon
>Helpdesk. I received an email just after the major outage last week
>telling me that my account had been upgraded.
What was the subject line of that email?
Cheers,
--
Neale Hind
Insanity is hereditary, you get it from your children
Stephen Wolstenholme
It's not just Demon. The Thomson router is also supplied by other
ISP's. Thomson routers work better than some mass market routers with
ADSL2+. Demon and some other ISP's picked the router that performed
best. No doubt they did some comparative tests with different makes of
routers. I compared Netgear V5 and the Thomson supplied by Demon. The
clear winner was Thomson.
Ian
<News...@dessergroup.com> writes
Anyone considering dumping their DG834XX, might want to consider
changing the firmware first.
You can still dump it afterwards.
You can find unofficial firmware here,
The site is unobtainable quite a lot, but you will get there eventually.
--
Ian
Stephen Wolstenholme
wrote:
>Anyone considering dumping their DG834XX, might want to consider
>changing the firmware first.
>
>You can still dump it afterwards.
>
>You can find unofficial firmware here,
>
>http://dgteam.ilbello.com/
>
>The site is unobtainable quite a lot, but you will get there eventually.
The site only provides firmware for routers up to DG834Gv4.
I'm not at all convinced it will help much as I have a DG834Gv5 which
has the latest firmware and it still has problem with ADSL2+
After using various Netgear routers over the years the only problem I
have had is with ADSL2+. Netgear have still not got it quite right.
I know I am now testing routers with good line conditions as
http://www.pingtest.net/ says my line quality is 'A' - that's as good
as it gets.
Peter Ceresole
> I know I am now testing routers with good line conditions as
> http://www.pingtest.net/ says my line quality is 'A' - that's as good
> as it gets.
I get the same here.
Unless Netgear sort out their DG834N routers (the one I have) I shall go
for a Thomson from Demon. I have nothing to lose, since it's free and
their service is excellent in every way except the problem with the DG,
which I believe is not unique to Demon.
--
Peter
Keith Pike
Wolstenholme <st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk> writes
My Linksys WAG345G V2 router performed faultlessly until the upgrade.
Now it drops at least once every evening.
I looked at the Demon website, found the Thomson routers at
https://www.upgrade2plus.demon.net/cpe but clicking on the 'more
details' just gave me '404 NOT FOUND'.
Which is the best replacement for my Linksys WAG345G?
--
Keith
Paul C. Dickie
Ceresole <pe...@cara.demon.co.uk> writes
Or a different ISP with less noisy lines?
--
< Paul >
Paul C. Dickie
<clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP> writes
>I have also been given the "Netgear and Cisco not reliable" speech by
>Demon and I am having a major problem with the idea that Cisco, of all
>companies, would put out unreliable equipment.
>
>This makes me wonder if the C&W LLU kit in the exchange is the real
>source of the problems.
I would not be at all amazed if it were.
>I also wonder what Cisco would say if they knew a major (at least in
>the business market) UK ISP was telling it's customers that Cisco
>equipment was unreliable.
I wonder if they'll sue?
--
< Paul >
Stephen Wolstenholme
<{$mrtickle$}@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>In <vjnjc55415otrpj76...@4ax.com>, Stephen Wolstenholme
><st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>I know I am now testing routers with good line conditions as
>>http://www.pingtest.net/ says my line quality is 'A' - that's as good
>>as it gets.
>
>How does that website get access to your line quality statistics which as
>far as I'm aware are only on your router? I've just done a test on that
>website and it said nothing about my line's SNR, FEC errors, CRC errors,
>HEC errors, errored seconds, or the number of times my router has
>retrained automatically since its last reset. The ONLY way to get those
>stats is to telnet to my router directly, or jump through hoops and turn
>on SNMP and use some monitoring software.
>
>For "line quality" readings you need to be checking the router statistics
>at the ATM layer, surely.
It's an estimate of line quality based on a series of pings and
jittered pings so it does not need to access the router. The
description in http://www.pingtest.net/learn.php some of the method
used.
It isn't just the line quality as it is more of an end to end
broadband test. As you will know line quality is a very important part
of any broadband test.
Andy
<p...@bozzie.demon.co.uk> wrote
exchange? If so, changing ISPs won't help.
--
Andy Taylor [Editor, Austrian Philatelic Society].
Visit <URL:http://www.austrianphilately.com>
Stephen Wolstenholme
In 99% of cases the lines will still be BT owned. My problem with
noise was the few yards of wire that ran close to an old printer
before it got to the telephone socket. Once that was fixed most
problems were cured. I was lucky to have a friend that knew a lot
about telephone communications and also had an oscilloscope so the
noise could be located exactly.
Peter Ceresole
> Which is the best replacement for my Linksys WAG345G?
From posts here by poeple who use them, the Thomson routers that Demon
provide are the best with ADSL2+.
The point is that 2+ is a whole different bag of tricks from ADSLMax.
When it works (which with my DG834N is most but not all of the time) the
performance is significantly better. But as happened when a transmission
standard changes, not all manufacturers get it quite right. Even
reputable makers sometimes take a while to sort themselves out.
At least Demon seem to have gone with the right one.
--
Peter
Mark
>Folks,
>
>There is so much technical expertise knocking around this group I'd
>really appreciate an opinion on this text chat exchange with Demon
>Helpdesk. I received an email just after the major outage last week
>telling me that my account had been upgraded. Ever since I've been
>having problems (see Text Chat below).
>
>I'm a little suspicious that I may be being fed a line by the help
>desk. Before I invest yet more dosh in (yet another) router is anyone
>able to confirm the information Demon are giving me? Basically, do I
>need to get another router (and not a Netgear or Cisco one)?
>
>One of the issues I have with this is that whilst he tells me that
>Netgear and Cisco products are not compatible with ADSL 2+ he says
>that Linksys are. But aren't Linksys really Cisco in disguise? And,
>given the market penetration of both why didn't Demon warn us before
>the upgrade?
>
>Thanks in advance for your opinions.
This is, I suspect, the sort of thing that might be happening:
http://www.pixelportal.demon.co.uk/good.jpg
http://www.pixelportal.demon.co.uk/bad.jpg
Both of these pictures are from my ST536 v6. My Speedtouch never loses its connection. The
main symptom of the compromised tones in the spectrum is that the FEC count goes crazy -
by that I mean it throws thousands of errors a second.
This effect occurs according to the time of day. I do not believe it has anything to do
with any man-made interference. At night in particular the higher frequencies struggle to
maintain a decent SNR value, but what is worse is that once a tone has been badly hit, it
never seems to recover. A resync will bring the tone spectrum back to all positive SNR
values, although often at the expense of some frequencies being wholly dropped.
Unfortunately, in the early morning it seems to be the lower frequencies that are more
vulnerable to going negative. So there is no happy medium. Sooner, or later, a resync is
required to bring the whole thing back to an even keel.
I can only assume that this is in the nature of ADSL2+ but I've never found any
authoritative commentary on its characteristics. I am also guessing that some routers do
not like this behaviour, and rather than cling on to their connection they just resync by
themselves.
However, to stand any chance of understanding what's going on I think you really need to
do a much deeper analysis. :)
The tool I'm using is here: http://dmt.mhilfe.de/
--
Mark.
Mark
>What we really need is for Demon to switch on SRA (Seamless Rate Adaption)
>which I think would solve this problem at a stroke. Your router and mine
>are both capable of using SRA (it's the tickbox on the right next to
>Trellis) - but you can't force it on by ticking the box unfortunately :-(
Funny you should mention that. Demon sent me a 'Demon Broadband Questionnaire' email on
the 11th September: "As part of our ongoing Customer Experience program we would like your
views on your recent ADSL2+ upgrade.", with a link to survey.
Having answered to the effect that my connection was now faster, but less stable, in the
comments I did suggest that perhaps now was the time for them to start using SRA.
Nothing yet though. ;)
--
Mark.
Big Les Wade
>
>Funny you should mention that. Demon sent me a 'Demon Broadband
>Questionnaire' email on
>the 11th September: "As part of our ongoing Customer Experience program
>we would like your
>views on your recent ADSL2+ upgrade.", with a link to survey.
>
When interpreting the results of this survey, I hope people will bear in
mind that they didn't send me a questionnaire. And probably quite a few
others who wouldn't have been very positive.
--
Les
Conspiracy theory: A suspicion that officials sometimes mislead the public in
order to protect their own interests.
Les Desser
Ceresole <pe...@cara.demon.co.uk> Mon, 5 Oct 2009 16:15:32 writes
>At least Demon seem to have gone with the right one.
Well after the event! When the original letters advising about the
change came out (for those that were lucky to get one) the explicit
advice was "no change of router is necessary".
Les Desser
Ceresole <pe...@cara.demon.co.uk> Mon, 5 Oct 2009 11:03:34 writes
>Les Desser <News...@dessergroup.com> wrote:
>
>> It does seem, from what people write here, that the Demon supplied
>> router gives less problems, but I cannot accept that a general service
>> provider cannot run a system that will work with all mass market
>> routers.
>
>I think that you may find that it's a question of the 'delicacy' of
>ADSL2+, its sensitivity to interference, and that the same problems will
>happen with any provider using 2+.
>
>It seems from posts here that the Thomson router has got it right, and
>that Demon are providing the correct router.
If the Demon service needs the Thomson router to work properly then they
should be giving it away free without locking users into a further 12
month contract.
Be supply their modem without conditions - other than it must be
returned at the end of the contract (using a Freepost address).
From Be forum postings it seems that Be will work just as well with
other equipment - and that is at an expected speed nearly twice what I
am getting now with ADSL2+.
>
>Certainly, 2+ is faster than ADSLMax, and the higher upload speeds are
>very useful indeed. I'd hate to have to downgrade to a provider still
>using ADSLMax.
My new Be line should be going live tomorrow and I will report back.
Paul
line if they hadn't been supplying Thomsons exclusively since the early
days of their ADSL service. It may just be my suspicious mind, but it's
entirely possible they tuned their exchange kit to suit the modems they
could offer 'free' to customers as a solution to connection problems,
whilst locking them in to a new 12 month contract.
Paul
Paul
There's nothing wrong with your router, mine (a DG834v3 non-wireless) was
dodgy at first until I shortened the socket to modem wire and made sure it
ran nowhere near any other wires. Now it's as stable as it was pre-2+
Paul
Peter Ceresole
> There's nothing wrong with your router, mine (a DG834v3 non-wireless) was
> dodgy at first until I shortened the socket to modem wire and made sure it
> ran nowhere near any other wires. Now it's as stable as it was pre-2+
That's good. But my socket to modem wire is as short as it gets (they
are centimetres apart) and I suspect that the interference I get comes
from further away; I never, ever get any problems in the day time; they
always arise around the same time of night, and as usual in these cases
are completely cured by a router reboot.
It looks as though, every few nights, it gets a burst of interference
that wedges it in some way. But the wire from the splitter/filter is the
very least of the susceptible elements; there's a longish wire that runs
90m from the house to the pole in the road, where it joins a rat's nest
of other phone wires. If you wanted to design a layout that will pick up
RF interference, it's be hard to do better.
I think it'll have to be tackled differently- by getting a less
susceptible router. And the Thomson sounds like it might do the job.
--
Peter
Peter Ceresole
> It may just be my suspicious mind, but it's
> entirely possible they tuned their exchange kit to suit the modems they
> could offer 'free' to customers as a solution to connection problems,
> whilst locking them in to a new 12 month contract.
That simply sounds like paranoia to me. Mainly because other people are
reporting ADSL2+ problems on other providers than Demon. Do you think
they are all trying the same ploy?
--
Peter
Paul Terry
I think that's highly unlikely. Demon's ADSL2+ service uses C&W
equipment that was already in use by Bulldog.
--
Paul Terry
Paul
> Paul <pa...@hectortd.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>> There's nothing wrong with your router, mine (a DG834v3 non-wireless) was
>> dodgy at first until I shortened the socket to modem wire and made sure it
>> ran nowhere near any other wires. Now it's as stable as it was pre-2+
>
> That's good. But my socket to modem wire is as short as it gets (they
> are centimetres apart) and I suspect that the interference I get comes
> from further away; I never, ever get any problems in the day time; they
> always arise around the same time of night, and as usual in these cases
> are completely cured by a router reboot.
Mine loses a few kbps in the evening, but gets it back over the early hours.
And yes, my other post was just a tiny bit sarcastic/paranoid, there's not
enough sniping and conspiracy theories in here these days ;)
Paul
jasee
> In message <3YDm$yU$abyK...@dessergr0up.invalid>, Les Desser
> <News...@dessergroup.com> writes
>> In article
>> <6bb47894-b0d7-4689...@h30g2000vbr.googlegroups.com>,
>> James J <jenk...@gmail.com> Sun, 4 Oct 2009 12:27:38 writes
>>
>>> It's a Netgear router DG834. I've had it for about 6 months.
>>
>> Is that a V4 or V5 model?
>>
>> The DG834 was the standard router I have been using for all my
>> clients for the last ... many years.
>>
>> Since the upgrade to ADSL2+ we have found that you need V4 or later
>> to obtain a reasonable connection but even then the connection can be
>> problematic.
>>
>> I have a Draytek Vigor 100 modem and V2910 router and virtually a day
>> does not go by when I do not lose connection at least once a day. The
>> modem stays up but the router re-syncs.
>>
>> post here.
>>
> Anyone considering dumping their DG834XX, might want to consider
> changing the firmware first.
>
> You can still dump it afterwards.
>
> You can find unofficial firmware here,
>
> http://dgteam.ilbello.com/
When installed the DG modified software does give you many more options to
play with regarding the ADSL connection.
For instance the signal to noise ratio is continuously variable
quote (slightly strange language) :SNR puts in a relationship signal power
and noise on the line. The more SNR is low the more data trasmission will be
hard.
Aging on slider, or directly on box, is possible to vary the downstream SNR
percentage value.
Lowering it more than 100%, you'll obtain as consequence an ADSL line more
sensible to interferences/noise (worst case: connection failure) but in
advantage an higher attainable rate (max downstream available): to obtain
the best performance from ADSL line, the attainable rate should be always
higher (equal at least) than Downstream value.
Raising it more than 100%, as opposite, will cause an attainable rate
decrease in favour of an higher SNR value. In brief, the line will result
more stable (bettere rejection to noises) with the disadvantage of a little
line performance decrease if attainable rate becomes lower than Downstream
value.
Choose the best setting value to obtain the right compensation: speed vs
reliability.
Default value is of course 100% which means no modification.
Upstream SNR, instead, can't be modified.
Peter Ceresole
> > http://dgteam.ilbello.com/
>
> When installed the DG modified software does give you many more options to
> play with regarding the ADSL connection.
That sounds pretty interesting. Thank you.
--
Peter
Ian
<ja...@btinternet.com> writes
--
Ian
jasee
"Ian" <ne...@nospam.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:TSmnEOBc...@nospam.demon.co.uk...
Well if that's his picture on the site he certainly looks hispanic!
BTW the actual ADSL extra settings you get depend very specifically on the
model and the version number of the model (as written on it) not as shown on
the firmware page on the router.
RELL6G
> In message <ulijc5diftotlqqh2nu0itpcivlk6a0...@4ax.com>, Stephen
> Wolstenholme <st...@tropheus.demon.co.uk> writes
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 11:03:34 +0100, pe...@cara.demon.co.uk (Peter
> >Ceresole) wrote:
>
> >>Les Desser <NewsDu...@dessergroup.com> wrote:
>
> >>> It does seem, from what people write here, that the Demon supplied
> >>> router gives less problems, but I cannot accept that a general service
> >>> provider cannot run a system that will work with all mass market
> >>> routers.
>
> >>I think that you may find that it's a question of the 'delicacy' of
> >>ADSL2+, its sensitivity to interference, and that the same problems will
> >>happen with any provider using 2+.
>
> >>It seems from posts here that the Thomson router has got it right, and
> >>that Demon are providing the correct router.
>
> >>very useful indeed. I'd hate to have to downgrade to a provider still
> >>using ADSLMax.
>
> >ISP's. Thomson routers work better than some mass market routers with
> >ADSL2+. Demon and some other ISP's picked the router that performed
> >best. No doubt they did some comparative tests with different makes of
> >routers. I compared Netgear V5 and the Thomson supplied by Demon. The
> >clear winner was Thomson.
>
> >Steve
>
> My Linksys WAG345G V2 router performed faultlessly until the upgrade.
> Now it drops at least once every evening.
>
> I looked at the Demon website, found the Thomson routers athttps://www.upgrade2plus.demon.net/cpebut clicking on the 'more
> details' just gave me '404 NOT FOUND'.
>
> Which is the best replacement for my Linksys WAG345G?
> Keith- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
The best solution (although sadly not possible for everyone) is to
have cable installed and get rid of Demon and BT in one fell swoop -
as discussed elsewhere I had nigh on 3 months of carrying on with the
Helpless Desk about line drops so in the end having discovered I could
have cable installed it wasn't very long before a stable reliable
connection was once again to be had.
--
Mark B
Email address is valid
Dave Baxter
2f675d...@f16g2000yqm.googlegroups.com>, a2523...@yahoo.co.uk
says...
> The best solution (although sadly not possible for everyone) is to
> have cable installed and get rid of Demon and BT in one fell swoop -
> as discussed elsewhere I had nigh on 3 months of carrying on with the
> Helpless Desk about line drops so in the end having discovered I could
> have cable installed it wasn't very long before a stable reliable
> connection was once again to be had.
> --
> Mark B
>
>
But not if youre in the Northampton area.
A certain cable media co can't fight their way out of a wet paper bag re
faulty cable in the ground. Even their own field engineers are verbaly
recomending a certain satelite TV company for tv/phone/'net packages.
Seems they have "very well used" infrastructure, and no intention of
maintaining it, from what we saw during a friends fight with them.
Cheers.
Dave B.