Painter 7 quirk
Larry Burditt
group layers when I try to change the group name I get a pop-up error
message saying the numbers are invalid. I can change the left and top to
zero and then it will take the name. Then I have to shift my
illustration back.
This is a real pain...is there any work around?
Gerry Noble
On 30/8/01 8:48 pm, in article 3B8E9872...@larryburditt.com, "Larry
Jinny Brown
Thanks for bringing this one up. I'm having that problem too but have
been to busy to mention it.
Jinny Brown
http://www.pixelalley.com
_________________________
Larry Burditt
Cricket
I can't get the error. I've tried it with layers of different shapes and
sizes, up to three of them, with preserve transparency on and off. I group
them, get the layer options dialog and the numbers don't say 0, 0. I rename
the layer, hit enter, and all is fine.
What OS? how have your layers been created? what is on them? paint strokes?
text? shapes? mixed? what sizes what resolution. As many details as
possible.
Thanks
Cricket
C_Tech Volunteer
"Larry Burditt" <lar...@larryburditt.com> wrote in message
news:3B8E9872...@larryburditt.com...
Richard
Liquid Ink layers...I get -50-50 with the invalid error but have not had any
problem naming or re-naming any conventional layers.
Now a days I keep a post-it note on the monitor to remind myself that just
because it works for me doesn't mean it not a bug for someone else. Full
moon or not Sylvia's still at the top of my C_Tech Volunteer
list...everybody' s gotta
have a buffer when new software is released if you didn't make the beta
team.
It was nice to see someone from the office step up to offer some details on
the
clipboard thread.
Richard
http://www.rapartz.com
"Cricket" <ct...@corel.ca> wrote in message news:3b904ece$1_3@cnews...
Jinny Brown
Since I have this problem too, I'll try to help you get some details to
work with:
Win98 SE
Pentium III
500 mHz
128 MB RAM
20 GB hard drive with about 11 GB free
Three Netscape 4.77 browser windows, Netscape Messenger, two messages
being written, one newsgroup message open, Notepad, and Windows Explorer
all open at the same time and also connected to the Internet while I'm
doing these tests. (This is not unusual when I'm using Painter 7 or any
other version.)
TEST ONE
________
New White Canvas 600 x 600 pixels, 300 ppi
From the Layers menu, created New Layer 1 - painted one stroke using
Airbrush's Digital Airbrush at default settings and R:255 G:10 B:45
From the Layers menu, created New Liquid Ink Layer 2 - painted two
strokes using Liquid Ink's Airbrush and same color as New Layer 1
From the Layers menu, created New Liquid Ink Layer 3 - painted one
stroke using Liquid Ink's Depth Bristle and R:21 G:10 B:255
Highlighted and Grouped all three Layers using icon at bottom of Layers
palette.
Double-clicked the Group name in the Layers list and saw that the Top
was at 117 and the Left was at 111.
Typed in a new name for the Group and hit the OK button.
No problem this time.. better try again but this time with Water Color
Layers.
TEST TWO
________
New White Canvas 600 x 600 pixels, 300 ppi
Chose Water Color's Fine Camel and painted three strokes using R:255
G:111 B:7. New Water Color Layer 1 was automatically created when I hit
the Canvas with my Water Color brush.
From the Layers menu, created New Water Color Layer 2, chose Water
Color's Runny Wet Bristle and painted three more strokes using R:7 G:159
B:255.
On Water Color Layer 2, chose Water Color's Eraser Salt, used Restore
Default Variant to return the Primary Color to white, and painted over
the three brush strokes.
Highlighted and Grouped both Water Color Layers using icon at bottom of
Layers palette.
Again no problem.
Used Ctrl+Z to try it another way. Group name reverted to Group 1.
(New Problem Introduced in the Following Step):
Used Ctrl+Z again (several times) and the Group would not Ungroup.
Chose Ungroup from the icon dropdown menu. The Group Ungrouped this
time.
With the two Water Color Layers highlighted, chose Group from the Layers
menu.
With the Group highlighted in the Layers list, hit the Enter key to open
the Layer Attributes Dialog box.
I noted that Top was at 2 and Left was at 27, then hit the OK button.
Again no problem.
TEST THREE
__________
New White Canvas 600 x 600 pixels, 300 ppi
Using the Lasso, drew an elaborate loopy selection on the Canvas
Chose one of my custom Water Color variants and painted using R:10 G:10
B:92. New Water Color Layer 1 was automatically created when I hit the
Canvas with my Water Color brush. (This variant is based on the Water
Color's Dry Camel and it's one that takes sometimes minutes to dry
depending on how much paint has been laid down).
Saved the selection.
From the Layers menu, created a New Water Color Layer 2 and using the
Lasso tool, drew another similar selection, then saved the selection.
Chose another color, R:92 G:10 B:88, and painted inside the selection
using the same brush with no adjustments, this time laying down more
paint by painting over previously painted areas.
As my paint dried, I went off to read mail. That was at 10:57 pm.. it
had been drying a while by then. Back again at 11:10.. don't know how
long it was dry.
Loaded New Mask 1 and saved as New Mask 3.
Loaded New Mask 2 and saved as (Add to Mask) New Mask 3.
Loaded New Mask 3, clicked Selection Adjuster tool and moved the
selection.
From the Layers menu, created New Layer 1, chose another color, R:92,
G:10 B:10, and painted using the same brush with no adjustments, again
laying down a lot of paint over previously painted areas. (I need a lot
of breaks to go read mail or eat.)
OOPS! I didn't need to create New Layer 1 (old habits).. it wouldn't
have worked anyway. Water Color Layer 3 was created when I hit the
unneeded Layer 1 with my Water Color brush.
Paint dry, I deleted the unneeded New Layer 1.
By now, Painter 7 is beginning to show the wear and tear of too much
activity.
With Water Color Layers 1, 2, and 3 highlighted, I used Ctrl+G to Group
them, used Ctrl+D to deselect and hit the Enter key to open the Layer
Attributes dialog box, noted that Top was at 69 and Left at 41, then
renamed the Group and hit the OK button.
Again no problem. The Group was renamed just fine.
_________________________________________________
I haven't a clue what has caused the Group and rename process not to
work on several occasions, but if it happens again and I've not gone too
far into working on an image to be able to write things down.. I will,
then send it to you.
Some of this was fun, at least.
_________________________________________________
one more try... TEST THREE AND A HALF
_____________________________________
Saved the Test Three image.
On the same image, I created two New Layers, 1 and 2. On New Layer 1,
painted a squiggly brush stroke with the Airbrush's Digital Airbrush. On
New Layer 1, painted another squiggly stroke using the Impasto's Gloopy.
Used Ctrl+G to Group the two New Layers, 1 and 2, from the Layers menu,
chose Layer Attributes, noted that Top was at 107 and Left at 39,
renamed and hit the OK button.
I give up! It renamed perfectly.
That's it for tonight. <g>
Jinny Brown
http://www.pixelalley.com
_________________________
Matt McElligott
I've also run into this problem, and I can duplicate it pretty regularly.
Here are the steps:
1. Make a new image, say 500 x 500 pixels.
2. Draw something on the canvas.
3. Select all.
4. Either cut/paste or choose Select>Float to put this image on a new layer.
5. Grab the Layer Adjuster tool and drag the image up and to the left, so
that at least part of it is cropped by the upper left corner. The trick is
to get the x and y coordinates less than zero.
6. Double-click the layer in the Layers Palette to rename it. Painter won't
allow you to click OK until you reset the coordinates to zero or greater.
Note: This seems to be caused by the cut/paste step. Creating a new layer,
drawing on it, and dragging off the canvas doesn't seem to cause problems.
Hope this helps!
Matt
Richard
( hiding my red faced head because I reported no problems
but didn't realize I was using 6.1 instead of 7).
I get the same thing following your directions.
10 out of 10 when using cut/paste or Select/Float.
The same using R-Selection and Lasso tools with the Layer Adjuster tool.
It does not seem to matter if I use an existing version 5 or 6 file.
I only have a problem except with -1 numbers...All + numbers work as they
should.
I did a complete reinstall and still have the problem.
Richard
http://www.rapartz.com
"Matt McElligott" <matt at mcegraphics.com> wrote in message
news:3b90c99d$1_3@cnews...
Cricket
Cricket
C_Tech volunteer
"Matt McElligott" <matt at mcegraphics.com> wrote in message
news:3b90c99d$1_3@cnews...
Jinny Brown
I tried it and you're right. It does cause the problem of renaming a
group unless you changed the "offending" Layer's position.
It doesn't answer why I've had this problem on several occasions,
though, because I'm sure that I didn't move any Text or other Layers off
the Canvas, even a little. Any text that I've done was placed well
within the limits of the Canvas dimensions and I don't recall any reason
that other Layers would have been moved (by me).
If it happens again, though, I'll let you know.
Thanks for your help.
Jinny Brown
http://www.pixelalley.com
_________________________
Tom Tilney
Here is a weird one for you. I was working on an image containing many
similar elements that I wanted to make symmetrical. I created an object,
for illustration purposed, assume a grape, shaded it, and duplicated it ten
times. I then moved them around to create the pattern I wanted. I also
wanted to create a mirror image of the same pattern. But I wanted to
maintain the shading the same as the original. Normally what I would do was
to "Group" and "Duplicate"
the ten images,"Flip Horizontal", "Collapse" the group, and flip horizontal
again. This would normally have given me the mirror image with the shading
the same direction as the original. I cannot get the grouped image to
collapse. The command is grayed out. Couldn't cut or copy either for the
same reason. Finally, had to "Drop and Select" and refloat. This seems a
little awkward. Any ideas or is this something you have dealt with. I seem
to remember something in this NG awhile back but couldn't find it.
Tom
"Jinny Brown" <jinb...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3B91E2AB...@mindspring.com...
Jinny Brown
First, I'm puzzled as to how you could expect to reverse the shading.
Second, I'm puzzled as to how following your steps you would even get a
mirror image of the first group. I know that's not what you wrote to ask
about but it's got me curious. What I mean is... What you described as
steps is (in brief)...
Group
Duplicate
Flip Horizontal
Collapse
Flip Horizontal
The second Flip Horizontal undoes the first Flip Horizontal and now you
have two collapsed groups in the same position.. not mirrored. This
would give you a duplicate, with, naturally, the shading on the same
side of the grape as the original. Surely this is not what you want, or
you'd not have mentioned mirroring the grape group.
If by "shading the same direction as the original", you mean that the
light source is the same as that of the original, I don't see how you
expect this to happen just by using Flip Horizontal (even if you don't
do a second Flip Horizontal which effectively undoes the first Flip
Horizontal).
If you shade the images, arrange them in position, Group, Duplicate,
Flip Horizontal, the images will be flipped individually and the
arrangement screwed up. In order to keep the arrangement you'd need to
Collapse before using Flip Horizontal. Even then, the shading would also
be in reverse, with the opposite light source.
To test this, I just drew a grape-shaped selection with the Lasso tool,
filled with grape green, Alt-clicked to make a duplicate, used Flip
Horizontal on the duplicate grape, painted each grape with the
appropriate shading for left or right side of the final arrangement (not
going so far as to make the shading actually correct for each grape as
it would be different unless the grapes were in the same exact position
which of course is ridiculous since you'd only see the top grape <g>),
then duplicated one of the grapes 5 times and arranged them in a half
circle. In order to have the same light source for all of the grapes in
the arrangement I would have had to first duplicate them the appropriate
number of times then paint the shading for each individual grape in the
arrangement.
(All this time I've been holding the original grape aside, that was
shaded on the opposite side from those in the above described
arrangement.)
Next, I highlighted all 6 grapes arranged in the half circle, from the
Layers menu icon, chose Group, then from the Layers menu icon, chose
Collapse. Now I duplicated the Collapsed grapes (squoosh!), and used
Flip Horizontal. Naturally, the shading flipped too and was on the
"wrong" side of the grape, as if the light source were different for the
left grouping from that for the right grouping. This is not "dynamic
shading". Once it's painted or applied using Applied Lighting, it's
simply part of the image... the pixels have changed color and they don't
move when Flip Horizontal is applied.
The only way to have the shading on the "correct" side of the grape is
to use the grape I'm holding aside.. the original grape on which I
painted the opposite-side shading.. duplicate it, and arrange the
individual grapes to mirror the first grape arrangement. Right?
Obviously, Group and Collapse worked for me. I don't know what is
different about the way I did it from the way you did it. Want to give
us some more specifics?
Your Drop and Select method doesn't sound a bit awkward to me. Just
arrange the duplicate grapes, highlight them, choose Drop and Select,
Lift to a Layer, Duplicate, apply Flip Horizontal to the Duplicate, move
the Duplicate into position.. and there you are... all but the correct
shading which is now mirrored, not using the same light source as the
original grouping (repeating myself, aren't I?).
Since it's not clear to either of us why you couldn't Group and
Collapse, I couldn't say if it was the same reason that caused you not
to be able to cut or copy.
Someone did have a problem with having the Collapse option greyed out
when trying to Group and Collapse Water Color Layers. We found that
using Right-Click to open the menu, the Collapse option was available.
However, using that method left white edges around the Water Color brush
strokes where one crossed over the other on separate Layers. To read the
solution, go to this page and scroll down to "Water Color (watercolor)
Layers - Combining on One Layer - (alternative to Group and Collapse)":
http://www.pixelalley.com/tutorials/painter7-findings.html
Sorry I couldn't be more help. With more specifics like what brushes,
what kinds of Layers, etc., maybe we can figure it out.
Jinny Brown
http://www.pixelalley.com
_________________________
Tom Tilney
Let me try again....Step 1; Draw and shade a grape, Light upper
left.....Step 2; Duplicate ten times and set up a pattern with the
ten.......Step 3; Group and duplicate the grapes in the pattern as a unit,
which gives you a new group the same as original....Step 4; select the
second group and flip horizontal; light source is now upper right but the
pattern is still the same as the original. Pattern does not change when
flipped, just the individual grapes are.......Step 5; Collapse the second
cluster and flip the cluster. Light on individual grapes is now upper left
again as the original group however the pattern is the reverse of the
original (My mirror excepting light source). At least that is what I wanted.
I was unable to get past the "collapse" command other than dropping and
selecting. I have to check into the other right click thing. I think you
collapsed both groups instead of just the second. I may have been unclear on
that. To cut to the chase, why couldn't I collapse the duplicated group?
"Jinny Brown" <jinb...@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:3B93207C...@mindspring.com...
Jinny Brown
To cut to the chase, I don't know. <g>
Sorry.. It may be a bug and certainly feels like one but maybe there's
something we're missing and no one has offered the answer yet.
Glad you got it to work, and thanks for the explanation.
Um.. it's Jinny, not Judy (but I don't blame you after all this flipping
horizontal stuff). <g>