LEDs with tropical aquarium

[damie...@gmail.com]

Hi folks,

One of the fluorescent tubes in my fish-tank light is on the blink.
Blink-blink-blinkety-blink. Again. Seems this happens every few
months. It may be because they run 16 hours a day and it's warm and
humid a few centimetres above a water of tropical tank. The holder has
a pair, and each tube is rated to approx 7500 hours.

Can any of you see a reason _not_ to replace this setup with a strip
of RGB LEDs tuned to approximate the spectral output of the tubes?
(Note, colour of these tubes is a little different to regular
household/factory tubes.)

Look-up "LED RGB SMD 5050" on eBay. Comes as a roll of stick-on
waterproof tape embedded with LEDs (including a power
control/regulator unit) for half the cost of one replacement tube.
These LEDs have more than 8 times the lifespan, use a fair bit less
power, and don't flicker.

Anyone tried it?
How waterproof is "waterproof" for this LED tape?
What were your experiences?

Cheers,
Damien
--
Damie...@gmail.com

[Stuart Young]

You won't get the UV output you might want out of LEDs without spending quite a large amount of money. The UV LED's you can commonly buy are way too long a wavelength to be useful for plant life (which is part of what you usually want lamps for in a fish tank).

That said, you could switch to higher UV output lamps and replace the standard visual spectrum light with LED's.

Have you thought of simply putting a cooling fan in the current light housing to avoid any build-up of moisture and to keep the temperature down?

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Damie...@gmail.com

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[willy]

On Saturday, September 22, 2012 3:47:54 PM UTC+10, Damien wrote:

One of the fluorescent tubes in my fish-tank light is on the blink.
Blink-blink-blinkety-blink. Again. Seems this happens every few
months. It may be because they run 16 hours a day and it's warm and
humid a few centimetres above a water of tropical tank. The holder has
a pair, and each tube is rated to approx 7500 hours.

 

when fluoro tube blinks, it just means you need a new tube.

Filaments have aged &/or leaked its gas and won't hold an arc.

 

if you let it keep blinking (= restarting) for long time then you'll be

overstressing the starter circuitry which will reduce its lifespan;

then you need new electronics.

 

Wouldn't worry too much about heat, humid air conducts heat better than dry air.

 

Fish tank tubes are a lot more expensive than household 40W tubes ~$3 :(

Believe they output more red although never tried testing their actual spectrum;

LEDs are more energy-efficient as they can be made a lot tighter in wavelength.

When our tank tubes blink & we don't have a spare on hand, we either remove the

bad tube or switch in a std coolwhite tube until a proper replacement can be found.

 

We've killed more than enough tropical fish (99.99% success rate so far!) but

i doubt any of them have died from having the white tube there for a few days/weeks.

White fluoro does seem to cause algae to grow faster though

and the whole tank looks duller/greyish.

 

 

btw if you wish to change the light's electronics there are different designs

of starter/ballast; some boast to prolong tubelife more than others.

Much less choice here in Oz but overseas i have gone to lighting wholesalers

to buy light fittings (where they'll build your light from components you specify)

& there's myriad choice/price just for that little blackbox between mains & tube.

 

What they offer in Bunnings/Masters is a joke by comparision, was there looking

at fluoros last wk & all i found were cheap china junk built to lowest possible price.

For my own usage I'd be willing to pay a bit more for European branded ballast;

also means less likely i'd be up on the ladder again to replace prematurely.

 

 

[Michael Sullivan]

If you have replaced the tube a number of times and they are not lasting then the ballast has gone.

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[damie...@gmail.com]

Considered adding a fan to blow air from one end of the light-fitting
to the other, but am already getting close-ish to the spec for the
tubes, 7500 hours.

Normally, I'd agree with you that the poor UV output of these LEDs
would be a problem for an aquarium, but this is a somewhat unusual
setup.
Firstly, the tank receives ample UV from the <sarcasm>wonderful
designed</sarcasm> north-facing windows at the opposite end of the
room.
Secondly, the only vegetation in the tank grows on the glass. Choosing
to plant anything larger incurs the wrath of the fish -- they're
Oscars (from the Cichlid family), so they delight in destroying
anything in their habitat softer than rocks or logs.

That said, I might consider some UV LEDs in addition to the visible
ones, since even a tiny bit of greenery is good -- it consumes
nitrogenous waste and helps with oxygen. Chemical balance and the
effect on the good bacteria in the filters is a consideration. Big
part of why I'm asking if anyone else has experience with this sort of
thing.
The UV end of the curve for aquarium tubes peaks between 410-500 nm,
with a pronounced spike around 430mn. UV LEDs are around 395-400mn,
some 400-450mn.

Cheers,
Damien

Damie...@gmail.com

[damie...@gmail.com]

Hi Willy,

Sounds like you've had similar experiences.

> if you let it keep blinking (= restarting) for long time then you'll be
> overstressing the starter circuitry which will reduce its lifespan;
> then you need new electronics.

Yep, I've heard of cases where it shortens the life of a tube, or has
trouble starting a new tube.
The ballast seems fine.

> Fish tank tubes are a lot more expensive than household 40W tubes ~$3 :(

These particular tubes are 30W, though I know what you mean about
aquarium tubes being costly. Replacing with LEDs is cost-effective
immediately. Long-term power-savings from LEDs would add-up nicely.

> Believe they output more red although never tried testing their actual
> spectrum;

Yes, a lot more at the red end. You can get a range of aquarium lights
that are optimised for specific purposes / climate simulation.
To my eyes, these have a magenta tint.

> LEDs are more energy-efficient as they can be made a lot tighter in
> wavelength.
> When our tank tubes blink & we don't have a spare on hand, we either remove
> the
> bad tube or switch in a std coolwhite tube until a proper replacement can be
> found.

First thing I did was swap-in a spare tube I have for times like this.
It's not quite the same, but satisfactory for a few days.

> We've killed more than enough tropical fish (99.99% success rate so far!)
> but
> i doubt any of them have died from having the white tube there for a few
> days/weeks.
> White fluoro does seem to cause algae to grow faster though
> and the whole tank looks duller/greyish.

Glad to say I've had better longevity with my fish; sorry to hear
about your bad luck!
I think a regular fluorescent tube looks a dull greeny-yellow in
comparison, though haven't used one of each long enough for a useful
side-by-side comparison of algae growth. ;)

> btw if you wish to change the light's electronics there are different
> designs
> of starter/ballast; some boast to prolong tubelife more than others.
> Much less choice here in Oz but overseas i have gone to lighting wholesalers
> to buy light fittings (where they'll build your light from components you
> specify)
> & there's myriad choice/price just for that little blackbox between mains &
> tube.
>
> What they offer in Bunnings/Masters is a joke by comparision, was there
> looking
> at fluoros last wk & all i found were cheap china junk built to lowest
> possible price.
> For my own usage I'd be willing to pay a bit more for European branded
> ballast;
> also means less likely i'd be up on the ladder again to replace prematurely.

Probably cheap'n'nasty ferromagnetic. There'd be a few people on this
list who have stories to tell about Bunnings quality.
IIRC, the fitting came bare, so I installed electronic ballasts from
Jaycar or Altronics.

Cheers,
Damien

[wes Black]

Ecoxotic LED strip 'stunners' and 'panorama' come in a range of colours. The Stunners are 'bout 9 W and $30 each, the Panoramas 'bout 30 W and $80 each. Waterproof-ish. Works off 12 or 24 V, dimmable, daisy-chainable. Nice.

Colours inc. 12000 K, actinic blue 454 nm, royal blue 440 nm, or such wavelengths, magenta/royal blue combo, UV, 8000 K, others maybe (just shooting from the hip, exact nm may differ from reality). Also, have RGB combos that can be adjusted to suit your tastes.

Australian distributor is Aquasonic in NSW. If you want, I can buy some for you as they are wholesalers and require an ABN before they can sell to you.

Yeah, I have a marine tank that *should* be growing corals and fish, but is presently growing fungus, grotty algae of various natures, a grumpy hermit crab and 3 annoyed chromis. Cycling the tank and only 6 weeks in. Takes a while to begin denitrifying via nitrosomonas, and the ammonia levels are so high it's a wonder anything is alive at all!

Oscars and fresh-ish / chichlid lake water doesn't need quite so much light in total (lumens) or intensity (lux).

Did have T5 fluoro tubes but figured that they only really pump out maybe 1200 lumens in a 130 L tank at 110 W. Ends up being maybe $100/yr just powering the lights.

LEDs are maybe 5x more efficient than fluoro, and don't fade as quick as fluoro tubes (which sounds like your problem) and then begin blinking.

Although the ballast can begin to go funny, too.

I say: rip out the T5s and ballast and fans, throw in the waterproof LED strips and enjoy same or greater lumens at less cost, and much less heat, no fan noise.

Why do you want UV anyway? I got some only 'coz they look pretty with some fluoro corals (... well, there *were* some zooanthids with green fluoro protein (GFP) in 'em... but... well... hopefully they'll come back after the ammonia denitrifyers kick in...)

Photosynthetic algae, plants, etc., prefer red and mid-blue, but all subject to change depending on exact algae, plants, bacteria, etc. Does sound like your tank isn't getting the right wavelengths from the lights, but is getting them from the light from the window.

Often soda glass tends to filter out most UV. Could well be red and blue it is getting from the window instead.

Don't get cheap LEDs, however, they tend to be the junk quality graded ones.

Er, UV probably starts at 380 nm or less. Longer is visible violet-blue. Don't expect UV LEDs to last that long, however.

Wes

[willy]

Chiclids are very dirty, or at least ours were... we supplemented their pellet with raw meat, clams etc.

Filtering had to be outboard as there was no way an undergravel setup would cope.

Think we had at most a large pair each in 4-6' tanks so there was plenty of water volume

to cover power outages. They're diggers too so plants were a waste of time;

tanks were left devoid with a chunky gravel or coral to bed the bottom.

 

 

Glass filters UV, none will get through the sides. We had tanks outside house,

plants won't survive if there's a wooden or glass cover over the water surface.

Surface had to be left open, made some wiremesh covers to avoid loss

from cat/bird fishing & jumpers.

 

Fish don't need UV anyways... and afaik tank filters work perfectly well in the dark;

saw some ozone devices you can plumb inline to the waterflow - haven't tried.

Chiclids needed weekly water changing anyway.

 

As for LEDs being more cost/energy efficient than older tech for growing plants indoors,

if it were the case i'd think there'll be heaps of R&D into "grow lamps" using LED

but i haven't come across too many converts... they're sticking mainly to halides.

There are some though, for our errr "hydroponic fanatics" :- http://www.hydrogrowled.com/

 

I assume you're in Melbourne... your tank heater would consume more $$ than light.

Just a thought that you don't even need to leave the lights on when you're not there,

imho our tank fish went about their biz as usual in the dark.