adding floppy to cube
Max Hailperin
adding a floppy drive to an '040 cube that doesn't have one? PLI
sells an external SCSI floppy drive for $449 (NeXTconnection price).
I've also heard a speculation that one could just by a Teac 2.88Mb
floppy drive out of computer shopper ($83) and plug it into the mother
board with some ribbon cable, mounting it using some mechanical
ingenuity.
Can someone confirm or deny the latter wild speculation, comment on
the PLI drive, or point out any other options to me?
Many thanks.
Nevin Pratt
It works fine if you get the cabling right.
The first time I saw this done was by an ex-NeXT engineer who had an old
PLI drive that the SCSI controller had gone bad on. He just yanked the bare
drive out of the PLI case, and plugged it directly into the '040 motherboard.
Worked great-- AFTER he unplugged it from the motherboard, turned the cable
around, then plugged it back in (seems he plugged it in backwards the first time).
I've done it myself, too, and mine worked on the first shot. But, I had
a keyed cable that wouldn't let me plug it in backwards :-).
Nevin
ke...@infoserv.com
writes:
#It works fine if you get the cabling right.
#
#The first time I saw this done was by an ex-NeXT engineer who had an old
#PLI drive that the SCSI controller had gone bad on. He just yanked the bare
#drive out of the PLI case, and plugged it directly into the '040 motherboard.
#Worked great-- AFTER he unplugged it from the motherboard, turned the cable
#around, then plugged it back in (seems he plugged it in backwards the first
time).
#
#I've done it myself, too, and mine worked on the first shot. But, I had
#a keyed cable that wouldn't let me plug it in backwards :-).
#
#Nevin
What manufacturer and model?
Kent
--
/* K.L. Shephard Consulting is my company. Infoserv only delivers my mail. */
/* Please direct mail to ke...@infoserv.com other adresses may not work. */
Nikos P. Pitsianis
How can this be done? What kind of floppy drive / ribbon cable?
Where on the mother board do you connect it? Do you need special
software?
If what you are saying works without major drawbacks (in performance for
example, or not being able to boot) then we have a major case of
--- as we say in greek ---
someone (PLI in our case) "selling sea weed as silk ribbons".
Please post all info you have on the subject.
Thanks
-- Nikos
_____________________________________________________________________
Nikos P Pitsianis Internet : ni...@cs.cornell.edu
Cornell University Phone : (607) 255 3042
4130 Upson Hall, Dept of Comp Sc FAX : (607) 255 4428
Ithaca, NY 14853 Home : (607) 277 7630
Nevin Pratt
> In article <1vlmro$1...@cnn.sim.es.com>, npr...@gecko.modsys (Nevin Pratt) writes:
> |> In article 93Jun1...@Kolmogorov.gac.edu, m...@Kolmogorov.gac.edu (Max Hailperin) writes:
> |> > Does anyone have experience or recommendations as to options for
> |> > adding a floppy drive to an '040 cube that doesn't have one? PLI
> |> > sells an external SCSI floppy drive for $449 (NeXTconnection price).
> |> > I've also heard a speculation that one could just by a Teac 2.88Mb
> |> > floppy drive out of computer shopper ($83) and plug it into the mother
> |> > board with some ribbon cable, mounting it using some mechanical
> |> > ingenuity.
> |> It works fine if you get the cabling right.
> |>
> How can this be done? What kind of floppy drive / ribbon cable?
> Where on the mother board do you connect it? Do you need special
> software?
>
> If what you are saying works without major drawbacks (in performance for
> example, or not being able to boot) then we have a major case of
> --- as we say in greek ---
> someone (PLI in our case) "selling sea weed as silk ribbons".
>
Nobody is selling sea weed as silk ribbons. If you want to hook a floppy
drive up to the SCSI port of ANY NeXT machine, then obviously you need
a suitable SCSI interface board on the floppy drive. This is what PLI sells.
And, on the old 68030 based cubes, that was the ONLY way you could add
a floppy drive to the system.
All newer 68040 based NeXT machines have a floppy port integrated on the
motherboard. Consequently, you can add a floppy drive to these machines
without being forced to put the drive on the SCSI bus (ala: PLI's method).
However, even with these newer machines, if you want a PORTABLE floppy drive
that you can move from machine to machine, you need to get a drive (like PLI's)
that plugs into the SCSI port.
But, if you want a single, internal floppy drive on any 68040 NeXT, you can
plug the bare drive (the 2.88 MB variety) directly into the built-in floppy
port on the motherboard. That's how the NeXTStation's do it!
If you buy a PLI drive, you are buying: a case, a SCSI interface board,
a power supply (to run the drive as well as the SCSI board), and miscellaneous
stuff like the SCSI id selector switch, connectors, a ribbon cable that connects
the drive to the SCSI board, etc.
If you plug the drive into your motherboard instead, all you need is the drive
(it'll take power off the motherboard via the ribbon cable), and a standard
ribbon cable with two standard connectors.
Nevin
Dennis Pejcha
Is it possible to connect a second drive to the floppy port on the '040
motherboards? (Not that I have the ROOM to shove another drive in my slab)
I imagine backups would go a lot faster since you could be switching disks
in one drive while writing data to the other drive. Anyone know if this is
possible?
Like I said, just a random thought.
-D
----------------------------------+----------------------------------
My undergraduate identity: | My current co-op identity
----------------------------------+----------------------------------
Dennis Pejcha | Dennis Pejcha
University of Waterloo | Bell Northern Research, Ottawa
Faculty of Mathematics | Carling Labs, Lab 3
Comp. Sci. Major | Integrated Node Mtce, Co-op
dpe...@cantor.math.uwaterloo.ca | inm...@bnr.ca ('til Aug/93)
----------------------------------+----------------------------------
If the University of Waterloo, Bell Northern Research, or anyone else
shares my opinions, that's their problem, not mine.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
In article <1vo7lc$h...@cnn.sim.es.com>, npr...@gecko.modsys (Nevin Pratt) writes:
[munch]
Nevin Pratt
> Just a random thought...
>
> Is it possible to connect a second drive to the floppy port on the '040
> motherboards? (Not that I have the ROOM to shove another drive in my slab)
> I imagine backups would go a lot faster since you could be switching disks
> in one drive while writing data to the other drive. Anyone know if this is
> possible?
>
> Like I said, just a random thought.
>
I believe the answer is: "No", although I've never bothered to verify it.
Back in the early days of 40-track 5.25" drives with the early Schugart SA-400
interface, drive selection was via one of the leads (pins) of the interface
cable. To make a drive answer to a particular "address", you could do it one
of two ways: (1) via a jumper on the drive board, or (2) via a special connector
on the interface cable that had some of the pins removed (this option required
you to leave all addresses jumpered to TRUE on the board of the drive).
With option #1, drive B could be plugged into connector A, B, C, or D. This
was how most manufacturers did it.
With option #2, drive 'X' was always drive B if it was plugged into connector
B, and was drive A if plugged into connector A. This was how Radio Shack
did theirs.
The point is: I don't remember seeing any pins removed on the floppy connector
for the NeXT, so I don't think option #2 is being done. And, I don't remember
any physical jumpers for drive address selection on the mechanism, so I don't
think option #1 is being done.
I suppose they could be doing some sort of auto-sensing with auto-address
programming (it's been a long time since I looked into these things, and I've
fallen behind quite a bit), but if I was a betting man, I'd bet that you can
only have one floppy drive plugged into the floppy port.
And, I seem to remember a post by M Carling that stated the same thing.
Nevin
ke...@infoserv.com
Pejcha) writes:
#Just a random thought...
#
#Is it possible to connect a second drive to the floppy port on the '040
#motherboards? (Not that I have the ROOM to shove another drive in my slab)
#I imagine backups would go a lot faster since you could be switching disks
#in one drive while writing data to the other drive. Anyone know if this is
#possible?
#
#Like I said, just a random thought.
There is a device called fd0a and fd1a so I assume it is possible but I
don't know how.
Greg Toews
manager and I press and hold the backspace key multiple error beeps are
generated because that is not a valid key. This is fine but it seems that
the speed at which the beeps are coming out causes the sound to break up
(it sounds like interference on a radio). I've never noticed this before,
and I am curious about the reason for this.
Greg
Craig Federighi
NeXT Cube and ran into some trouble. Apparrently one must be extremely
careful to get the cable to the floppy drive put on in the right direction. When I put mine on the wrong way and then hit the power on switch on my
keyboard, I heard some funny clicking on the drive followed by a little bit
of smoke, and my computer didn't power up. When I reversed the direction of
the cable, the NeXT started up and recognized the drive, but the came up
with a "fd: DISK UNINITIALIZED" message in the monitor window during start
up, and failed to work there after. I assume that the initial smoke
exhalation experience is the cause of its failure.
QUESTIONS FOR THE KNOWING:
- What EXACT model number drive will work in the NeXT?
- I couldn't kind any "keyed" drive cables; How can I tell the right
way to put the cable in?
- Are the newer cube front face plates (with a floppy slot) available
so I can mount my drive internally?
Please mail me in addition to posting.
Thanks!!
- Craig Federighi
cra...@cs.berkeley.edu
Davor Barcan
> I've also heard a speculation that one could just by a Teac 2.88Mb
> floppy drive out of computer shopper ($83) and plug it into the
> mother board with some ribbon cable, mounting it using some
> mechanical ingenuity.
Mechanical ingenuity? I just wish I knew where I could get a
face-plate which has a hole for a floppy drive instead of an optical
drive. Anyone want to trade face-plates? :)
--
Davor Barcan
da...@griffin.cuc.ab.ca (NeXTMail)
j...@afs.com
writes:
|If you buy a PLI drive, you are buying: a case, a SCSI interface board, a
| power supply (to run the drive as well as the SCSI board), and miscellaneous
|stuff like the SCSI id selector switch, connectors, a ribbon cable that
connects
|the drive to the SCSI board, etc.
<sorry to followup an ancient article...>
What amazes me is that PLI sells a SCSI 21 Meg floptical drive for less than a
NeXT 2.88 Meg floppy. Now, if the bare 2.8 floppy costs ~$75, then either the
21 meg floptical drive is much less expensive than a mere 2.8 floppy drive, or
they are inflating their price due to the "small" market. How much can black
paint and a black faceplate cost??
If the 21's had been available when I bought my PLI floppy, I would have bought
one of them (and I'd actually be able to keep some Docs on-line for a change.)
--
Jonathan W. Hendry <j...@afs.com>
It's a hundred classes, give or take a few,
I'll be writing more in a week or two.
I can make it deeper if you like the style,
I can change it round and I want to be an ObjectWare writer,
Kevin John Wang
>All newer 68040 based NeXT machines have a floppy port integrated on the
>motherboard. Consequently, you can add a floppy drive to these machines
>without being forced to put the drive on the SCSI bus
correct
>But, if you want a single, internal floppy drive on any 68040 NeXT, you
can
>plug the bare drive (the 2.88 MB variety) directly into the built-in
floppy
>port on the motherboard. That's how the NeXTStation's do it!
Well, yes, and no. You cannot just pull *ANY* floppy drive. The
bare minimum that I now is that you must have a floppy drive that
supports the auto-eject mechanism (like on the mac's) If you get
a drive that is for IBMs that does NOT have this, you're in deep.
NOW, what we are looking for is models that CAN plug into a NeXT
'040 machine. clarified?
- Kevin Wang
Art Isbell
In article <1993Jun23....@afs.com> j...@afs.com writes:
>If the 21's had been available when I bought my PLI floppy, I would have bought
>one of them (and I'd actually be able to keep some Docs on-line for a change.)
Unfortunately, the floptical 21 MB drive didn't support 2.88 MB floppies, so
buying one of them instead of the SuperFloppy would have made reading 2.88 MB
floppies impossible. Maybe this has changed (well, 2.88 floppy drives don't
seem to be well-supported on NEXTSTEP PC hardware, so maybe the 2.88 floppy
issue is becoming moot).
What I'm chafed about is that 3.1 broke my PLI's capability to format NEXTSTEP
floppies. NeXT, please fix this ASAP. Those of us who spent probably more
money than we should've on these PLI drives don't want you to break them for
us.
--
Art Isbell Cubic Solutions
NeXT Registered Developer #745 NEXTSTEP software development and consulting
NeXTmail: isb...@cats.UCSC.EDU Voice: (408)335-1154
USmail: 95018-9442 Fax: (408)335-2515
Michael Mossal
writes:
> I tried installing both a TEAC FD-235J 2.88 MB floppy drive in my old '040
> NeXT Cube and ran into some trouble. Apparrently one must be extremely
Is that a ordinary PC Drive or a special drive with a motor to eject the disk?
> the cable, the NeXT started up and recognized the drive, but the came up
> with a "fd: DISK UNINITIALIZED" message in the monitor window during start
What message you you get im rom-monitor until you boot the machine?
> up, and failed to work there after. I assume that the initial smoke
> exhalation experience is the cause of its failure.
I am sure of that.
> QUESTIONS FOR THE KNOWING:
> - What EXACT model number drive will work in the NeXT?
I have no drive but sometimes I dry to buy a one. But I had no access.
I also had the correct model number, its a sony drive, but I can't find the number.
> - I couldn't kind any "keyed" drive cables; How can I tell the right
> way to put the cable in?
The Pin with a pad in form of a quadrat is always the pin number one.
--
Ciao
mmo
fido: 2:245/5800.6
email: m...@sydney.bo.open.de (NeXTmail welcome)