Clan Lord: My thoughts after leaving to play EverQuest
Jason Rochelle
ClanLord. I just thought i'd put this up so that if anyone is interested
they can read it. If you're not interested: DON'T READ IT. One thing to
note EQ is a PC-only game, so most of you can;t switch even if you
wanted, but i have a Mac and a PC.
I'll compare and contrast CL and EQ in several different areas, rating
them on a scale of 1 to 10 in each area. I'm listing the pro-EQ things
first, don't get discouraged, CL gets some points later on.
Graphics: EQ:9 CL:6
The graphics in CL are nice, but the graphics in EQ are ASTOUNDING.
Entire groups of characters have stood motionless, looking at the sun
rise over the Sea of Tears while sailing on the Frigate Stormbreaker.
Having said that Graphics aren't the main reason to play these games,
and THAT'S why CL gets a 6, the graphics are functional and adequate.
Races: EQ:8 CL:7
There are more races in EQ (EQ has 12) than CL (6?), but CL gains strong
points here for having unique races. You can also choose between male
and female, as well as picking from 8 different faces for each race/sex
option. Different armor also changes the character portrait in the
affected area (if i put on steel guantlets, you can tell)
Classes EQ:10 CL:4
There are 14 classes in EQ, allowing massive specialization. As an
example, it is rather rare for me to see another person of the same
race/class/level combo as myself, versus EQ where there were ALWAYS the
same race/class/level combo as myself EVERYWHERE. (Many dressed exactly
like me). At the time of my departure from CL (pre-release) there where
3 classes.
Game Size: EQ:9 CL:6
EQ is huge. There are currently 3 continents. On the main continent
alone there are 7 different cities, each containing (in surrounding
areas) a newbie zone, a mid-level zone and an advanced zone. In addition
to that there are several ultra-high zones around also. When i left CL
the size of the world was approximately the size of ONE of these
city/adventure zones.
Training EQ:9 CL:2
This is CLs WORST feature as far as i'm concerned. I remember at one
point, when i was a mid-level fighter (lord by the old system) thinking
to myself, "i should just stop training now, every time i train, i seem
to get worse". Add to that the fact that i wasn;t ever REALLY sure what
my training DID! In EQ, training is simple: you want to be better at
attacking with a slashing weapon? 2 choices: go to trainer and use
training points, or get a slashing weapon and go out and USE it against
equal foes. It will improve as you use it (gee just like real life!).
Spells: EQ:8 CL:1
600 spells in EQ (healing, fireballs, charm, cure poison, faster
running, teleport, wizard eye, Vampiric touch, Invisibility, etc). How
many in CL? 6-7 at most? how useful are they?
Weapons and Armor: EQ:10 CL:2
There are around 100 different weapons in EQ as well as about 100
different types of armor (maybe more). Every one of them has a label on
it saying what damage and attack speed (or armor class) it is. More
expensive items are actually BETTER than Less expensive items. In CL
there were a pitiful ammount of weapons, and they were confusing. What's
better a sword or a shiny dagger? which one costs more? When I left CL
there was NO armor.
Trade skills EQ:7 CL:0
CL has none, in EQ i can be a tailor, a smith, a jewler, a baker, or a
brewer. MOST of these actually produce items that characters want and
need. You can provide a service for your friends, AND make money for
yourself.
GMs EQ:8 CL:8
Both are staffed with good people i believe, and they respond to
problems.
Interface EQ:6 CL:7
The CL interface is so simplistic, I loved it. It actually worked with a
minimum of stretching and key punches, very nice. EQs interface is kinda
clunky, easy for things to sneak up on you in the 1st person view.
Playability EQ:8 CL:9
Once again, CL was easy to learn for the most part. In EQ there are
STILL commands i don't know how to use.
Social interaction: EQ:6 CL:8
I had friends in both games, but in CL i had Family. I truly cared about
the characters and the people behind them. Eq has not evolved (for me
anyway) to that level.
One item i don't have a name for: In EQ i can sell and trade directly
with other characters. If i want to GIVE a friend an axe, I can, if i
want to sell it at any price, I CAN. In CL, such things had to go
through the merchants, paying a commission, and right before i left, the
merchants were TAKING items sold at too low a price. This is unrealistic
and unneccessary.
Costs: EQ:8 CL:8
The costs are roughly the same. I payed $38.99 for EQ with one free
month, and paid $8.33 a month for 6 months of unlimited play.
Overall: EQ:8 CL:7
These numbers may not seem to jive, but I believe CL is ALMOST as good
as EQ. CL has strong roleplaying and character interaction where EQ is
lacking, and those are the most important parts of an ONLINE RPG. EQ
really shines in Specialization of character, and character advancement,
as well as graphics.
Once again, just some thoughts you can use to compare your online RPG
experience with someone elses.
Jason Rochelle
SD
\>Once again, just some thoughts you can use to compare your online RPG
>experience with someone elses.
>
>Jason
I'm sort of bothered by the fact that it takes DT about 18 years to come
up with a new caste. I suspect this is due in part to their insistence
on some sort of originality which forbades them from using classical
fantasy genre classes. Whatever the reason, us players really take the
hit.
-Outcast
--
Remove "MANGO" from email adress to contact me
Odessesus
> OK, first i'd like to say this is NOT an attempt to get people to leave
> ClanLord.
Heh, nice absolvment of a plug. But I like the sentiment, anyway.
>
> There are more races in EQ (EQ has 12) than CL (6?), but CL gains strong
> points here for having unique races. You can also choose between male
> and female, as well as picking from 8 different faces for each race/sex
Humpf! No fen'neko! And you rate EverQuest that highly? Some of the
races in EQ look rather repulsive. I can't imagine anyone wanting to
play them. I *DO* like the idea of more individuality. But, with such
small icons, there is little room.
>
> Classes EQ:10 CL:4
>
> There are 14 classes in EQ, allowing massive specialization. As an
> example, it is rather rare for me to see another person of the same
> race/class/level combo as myself, versus EQ where there were ALWAYS the
> same race/class/level combo as myself EVERYWHERE. (Many dressed exactly
> like me). At the time of my departure from CL (pre-release) there where
> 3 classes.
>
I think you meant in *CL* you saw many very similar characters. In the
commercial release we hear there maybe sub-classes (not proven yet) and
there is a Bard class now.
> Game Size: EQ:9 CL:6
>
> EQ is huge.
CL has grown. Just how large, I'm not sure since I am too weak to
venture far without falling. Too early to tell for a comparison, I'd
say.
>
> Training EQ:9 CL:2
>
> This is CLs WORST feature as far as i'm concerned.
I don't think it's the worst feature. Sunstone spam is. But I must
admit, the training in CL leaves a decent amount to be desired. If I
train with someone, I better know what I'm learning. Not always the
case.
>
> Spells: EQ:8 CL:1
>
> 600 spells in EQ
600! Yikes, how do you keep track?! I suspect there will be
significantly more, but then, that's vaporwand...
>
> Weapons and Armor: EQ:10 CL:2
>
> There are around 100 different weapons in EQ as well as about 100
> different types of armor
As a fighter, all I can say is "I hate you" ;>
>
> Trade skills EQ:7 CL:0
>
> CL has none, in EQ i can be a tailor, a smith, a jewler, a baker, or a
> brewer.
Maybe the Bard title falls under this one. I dunno, sounds too much like
real life to me. This is what I want to *escape*.
>
> > Social interaction: EQ:6 CL:8
>
> I had friends in both games, but in CL i had Family.
This is the MOST endearing part of CL. I think it's partly the game and
partly the type of people Mac users are, IMHO.
>
> Overall: EQ:8 CL:7
>
> These numbers may not seem to jive, but I believe CL is ALMOST as good
> as EQ.
Considering that EQ has a hot-to-trot 3-D viewpoint, PLUS all those
tasty pieces of armor and weapons, I consider this to be a good score.
\thank Jason for his review
Oh, and you're welcome back anytime!
- * - * - * - * - * -
Visit Rising Claw's scrolls at http://www.roundspace.com/claw/
And while you're at it, take a look at Odesseus' drawings at
http://www.roundspace.com/odesseus/
Blur
odess...@aoHELL.com (Odessesus) wrote:
> > Classes EQ:10 CL:4
> >
> > There are 14 classes in EQ, allowing massive specialization. As an
> > example, it is rather rare for me to see another person of the same
> > race/class/level combo as myself, versus EQ where there were ALWAYS the
> > same race/class/level combo as myself EVERYWHERE. (Many dressed exactly
> > like me). At the time of my departure from CL (pre-release) there where
> > 3 classes.
> >
> I think you meant in *CL* you saw many very similar characters. In the
> commercial release we hear there maybe sub-classes (not proven yet) and
> there is a Bard class now.
Bard is not a class. its a Profession a real one. there are syb-classes
but who knows if we will ever see them.
Jason Rochelle
Odessesus wrote:
> > Game Size: EQ:9 CL:6
> >
> > EQ is huge.
>
> CL has grown. Just how large, I'm not sure since I am too weak to
> venture far without falling. Too early to tell for a comparison, I'd
> say.
Even if CL is twice the size it was, EQ is MASSIVE. I estimate it to be
10-15 times the size of the old CL, maybe larger
> > Spells: EQ:8 CL:1
> >
> > 600 spells in EQ
>
> 600! Yikes, how do you keep track?! I suspect there will be
> significantly more, but then, that's vaporwand...
600 is for all classes, Mages, Wizards, enchanters, necromancer, shamans
druids, shadowknights rangers and paladins all have class-specific
spells
> > Weapons and Armor: EQ:10 CL:2
> >
> > There are around 100 different weapons in EQ as well as about 100
> > different types of armor
>
> As a fighter, all I can say is "I hate you" ;>
Yup, I love this feature
> > Overall: EQ:8 CL:7
> >
> > These numbers may not seem to jive, but I believe CL is ALMOST as good
> > as EQ.
>
> Considering that EQ has a hot-to-trot 3-D viewpoint, PLUS all those
> tasty pieces of armor and weapons, I consider this to be a good score.
AS i mentioned earlier, it's not the graphics that make a game, they are
extra, that's why CL rates so high.
> \thank Jason for his review
Thank YOU for taking it in the way it was intended
> Oh, and you're welcome back anytime!
You may see me in the future... who knows... Sharpclaw may return...
Odessesus
> > I think you meant in *CL* you saw many very similar characters. In the
> > commercial release we hear there maybe sub-classes (not proven yet) and
> > there is a Bard class now.
>
> Bard is not a class. its a Profession a real one. there are syb-classes
> but who knows if we will ever see them.
Right, I think I mentioned in another part of my reply that Bard might
be a profession. Wonder if there will be others?
--
SD
mac...@stega.smoky.org (Blur) wrote:
>In article <1drtjsn.rvr...@stk-pw159.gotnet.net>,
>odess...@aoHELL.com (Odessesus) wrote:
>
>> > Classes EQ:10 CL:4
>> >
>> > There are 14 classes in EQ, allowing massive specialization. As an
>> > example, it is rather rare for me to see another person of the same
>> > race/class/level combo as myself, versus EQ where there were ALWAYS the
>> > same race/class/level combo as myself EVERYWHERE. (Many dressed exactly
>> > like me). At the time of my departure from CL (pre-release) there where
>> > 3 classes.
>> >
>> I think you meant in *CL* you saw many very similar characters. In the
>> commercial release we hear there maybe sub-classes (not proven yet) and
>> there is a Bard class now.
>
>Bard is not a class. its a Profession a real one. there are syb-classes
>but who knows if we will ever see them.
If DT keeps up at this rate, we'll begin seeing some sort of fighter
subclass with spells as the universe starts collapsing.
Joe Williams
but it's not the same game at all.
The number of classes in EverQuest is somewhat misleading -- there are a
lot of them, but in my opinion none of them differ as greatly from each
other as even Fighter and Healer. All classes have spells that do damage,
for example.
I really like in EQ that the races are substantially varied in size.
The biggest difference, in my opinion, is that Clan Lord is focused much
more on the community than in single-player hunts. In EverQuest it tends
to be difficult to stay with a group (even two people), and communication
is harder. (Imagine Clan Lord without the talk bubbles, with only the
text log.)
And, of course, EverQuest has nothing to compare to the Court, the
Coliseum, or even the Purple Tor.
Graphically, it is very impressive.
It remains to be seen whether EverQuest will have any long-term story
development -- but I don't think that's their plan.
--
--Joe Williams
President, Delta Tao Software, Inc.
To subscribe to Joe's rambling personal mailing list,
send "subscribe joedeltalist" to majo...@ten.net.
Rob Viesca
SD wrote:
> In article <macnyt-1505...@den-co66-56.ix.netcom.com>,
> mac...@stega.smoky.org (Blur) wrote:
>
> >In article <1drtjsn.rvr...@stk-pw159.gotnet.net>,
> >odess...@aoHELL.com (Odessesus) wrote:
> >
> >> > Classes EQ:10 CL:4
> >> >
> >> > There are 14 classes in EQ, allowing massive specialization. As an
> >> > example, it is rather rare for me to see another person of the same
> >> > race/class/level combo as myself, versus EQ where there were ALWAYS the
> >> > same race/class/level combo as myself EVERYWHERE. (Many dressed exactly
> >> > like me). At the time of my departure from CL (pre-release) there where
> >> > 3 classes.
> >> >
> >> I think you meant in *CL* you saw many very similar characters. In the
> >> commercial release we hear there maybe sub-classes (not proven yet) and
> >> there is a Bard class now.
> >
> >Bard is not a class. its a Profession a real one. there are syb-classes
> >but who knows if we will ever see them.
>
> If DT keeps up at this rate, we'll begin seeing some sort of fighter
> subclass with spells as the universe starts collapsing.
>
> -Outcast
They did say if fighters did have spells they would be spells which could harm,
i.e fireballs.
-Rob
--
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
"With Infinite time comes Infinite chances. With Infinite chances comes
Infinite numbers. Since Infinity has no number it is uncertain. Therefore
Infinite time disproves all certainty."
Guy and Karen Enki
<j...@deltatao.com> wrote:
> EverQuest is a pretty good game. It is similar in many ways to Clan Lord,
> but it's not the same game at all.
>
> The number of classes in EverQuest is somewhat misleading -- there are a
> lot of them, but in my opinion none of them differ as greatly from each
> other as even Fighter and Healer. All classes have spells that do damage,
> for example.
>
> I really like in EQ that the races are substantially varied in size.
>
> The biggest difference, in my opinion, is that Clan Lord is focused much
> more on the community than in single-player hunts. In EverQuest it tends
> to be difficult to stay with a group (even two people), and communication
> is harder. (Imagine Clan Lord without the talk bubbles, with only the
> text log.)
There are instances where talk bubbles do more harm than good. Things
that draw large crowds, for instance. A run-time (or menu option) to
turn off talk bubbles would be a good thing. Nothin says lovin like a
screen full of talk bubbles, flashing like strobe lights. Probably not
a problem, right now.
>
> And, of course, EverQuest has nothing to compare to the Court, the
> Coliseum, or even the Purple Tor.
>
"Surely, you can't be serious? I am serious and don't call me Shirley."
If that's CL's edge, then you best hope there is no Mac port of EQ.
> Graphically, it is very impressive.
>
> It remains to be seen whether EverQuest will have any long-term story
> development -- but I don't think that's their plan.
If it turns out to be something they need, I'm sure they'll add it.
Lorian
>
> There are instances where talk bubbles do more harm than good. Things
> that draw large crowds, for instance. A run-time (or menu option) to
> turn off talk bubbles would be a good thing. Nothin says lovin like a
> screen full of talk bubbles, flashing like strobe lights. Probably not
> a problem, right now.
>
>
I have to disagree. I find talk bubbles in a crowded room entirely
realistic. I find I'm constanltly saying, "what???" as if the room were
really crowded with lots of conversation! And I have to "listen
carefully" just as I do in real life!
Yes I have been in both worlds myself. But I dumped EverQuest. I am
interested in story development and social interaction, and I think
rating CL much higher there is exactly on track!
One other point I should point out.... I find EQ somewhat offensive.
All of the females are overly-endowed anorexics clad in practically
nothing.
I prefer to call the game...
"EverBreast"
LOL!!!
Don't suppose they have many women playing, do they? Or are interested
in this market at all!
/thank DT for making the females modest
Lorian
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Joe Williams
<loria...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>Don't suppose they have many women playing, do they? Or are interested
>in this market at all!
I am very pleased that we have so many female players. Many computer
games, designed by men, have limited appeal to women. We've worked hard
to avoid this -- our female GMs have helped a lot.
Maquiladora
> him joy, I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks. I would
> like to say that characters like Theranger are a major reason I did not
> buy CL. On several occasions, he ruined what might have been a perfectly
> good hunt, by luring blocking pushing and pulling. All in All, what
> irritated me most was the lack of response from ANYONE at DeltaTao when
> I prayed for help. Even if they had said "That's the way we want it".
> That would have been better than the silence I received. Lesson in
> customer service for you...
>
> Jason Rochelle
I think of all the bad guys we have seen, TheRanger/Ther' Anger (although
he has had his bad days) does the best job at it. He tries to be in
character at all times when being evil, and sometimes even gives the
occasional "OOC: =)" to make it clear he is merely playing a role. I
think jerks like Bruin had it all wrong and took away from the game for
people, but I think that TheRanger/Ther' Anger does not fall into this
category. Just my personal opinion of course.
maq
Jason Rochelle
> The number of classes in EverQuest is somewhat misleading -- there are a
> lot of them, but in my opinion none of them differ as greatly from each
> other as even Fighter and Healer. All classes have spells that do
> damage, for example.
Well, true, but why does that really matter? Does it matter if a healer
casts a spell to kill a creature or bashes them in the head with a blunt
object? Both are crude violent expressions we would not expect to see
from any "holy man" in our real life...
> I really like in EQ that the races are substantially varied in size.
This is a neat feature. My Primary character, A Troll Shadow Knight,
stands over 11 feet tall. When i look down to talk to dwarves or evern
humans, it really adds perspective to the game.
> The biggest difference, in my opinion, is that Clan Lord is focused much
> more on the community than in single-player hunts. In EverQuest it tends
> to be difficult to stay with a group (even two people), and communication
> is harder. (Imagine Clan Lord without the talk bubbles, with only the
> text log.)
Maybe at lower levels this is true, but once I joined a guild at level
8, i found it easy to join a group of 4-5 friend to journey to far-off
places. Navigation can be a bit tricky. I REALLY miss /yell. The best
radar system ever!
> And, of course, EverQuest has nothing to compare to the Court,
Thank GOD!
> the Coliseum,
True, although While sitting on a hill today looking over the desert my
party saw a Desert Madman approach 2 Cutthroat Dervishes. I immediately
said "1 platnium on the Dervishes" and wound up winnin some coins.
>or even the Purple Tor.
Hmm, from what i see, EQ has lots of buildings with empty rooms, (isn't
that what the Purple Tor is? or did I miss something?
Jason Rochelle
> Yes I have been in both worlds myself. But I dumped EverQuest. I am
> interested in story development and social interaction, and I think
> rating CL much higher there is exactly on track!
True, CL is better in this area, and i rated it as such. To put in in a
somewhat derogatory phrasing: "If you want a graphical chatroom, CL is
for you". Now that's an exagreation, but it has a valid point. The
GAMEPLAY in CL dosen't measure up to EQ. The STORY of EQ dosen't compare
to CL.
> One other point I should point out.... I find EQ somewhat offensive.
> All of the females are overly-endowed anorexics clad in practically
> nothing.I prefer to call the game...
> "EverBreast"
> Don't suppose they have many women playing, do they? Or are interested
> in this market at all!
Well, gotta agree with you. I'm a male and *I* find some of the pictures
objectionable. There are some females that play, But even most of the
female characters are run by males.
Jason Rochelle
One: Another thing i love about EQ is that just because i put on my
SnakeSkin Tunic, That does NOT meant that the Patchwork Leather Tunic I
was wearing Mysteriously disappears, or that I can never change back.
That's one thing I REALLY found to be annoying and unrealistic about
ClanLord.
Two: Although this may be hard to believe, I REALLY didn't intend this
thread to evolve into "Which one is better". I think that if anything,
my intention was just to set out those measurements in my own mind, and
possibly let DT know what SOME people like over the RPG world they have
invented.
M. W. Welsh
<jas...@home.com> wrote:
> Well, true, but why does that really matter? Does it matter if a healer
> casts a spell to kill a creature or bashes them in the head with a blunt
> object? Both are crude violent expressions we would not expect to see
> from any "holy man" in our real life...
I have yet to meet a doctor that anyone would call "holy".
--
Sincerely, M. W. Welsh (Monolith in CL)
Ok, I un-killfiled Outcast. I'd rather respond directly to him than to a quote.
Check out Monolith's Web Scroll at http://members.xoom.com/Monolith_CL/main.htm
M. W. Welsh
maquiladora80@_NO_SPAM_hotmail.com (Maquiladora) wrote:
> I think of all the bad guys we have seen, TheRanger/Ther' Anger (although
> he has had his bad days) does the best job at it. He tries to be in
> character at all times when being evil, and sometimes even gives the
> occasional "OOC: =)" to make it clear he is merely playing a role. I
> think jerks like Bruin had it all wrong and took away from the game for
> people, but I think that TheRanger/Ther' Anger does not fall into this
> category. Just my personal opinion of course.
>
> maq
Indeed Ther' Anger does a terrific job. I never see him drop OOC. Other
evil characters drop OOC all the time. I remember an instance where
LeAnn and I were speaking about her clan and a certain "evil" character
walked up. We had had trouble with him before both IC and OOC so I
immediatly cursed him with the reason, "go away". He went ballistic and
said that Clan Lord wasn't a private chat room. I laughed and said,
"What is Clan Lord?" I mean this sorry excuse for an evil character
dropped into OOC as soon as I cursed him. Of course, he did back curse
too. I'll never recover from one bad karma point. ;-)
avi
> Lorian wrote:
>
> > Yes I have been in both worlds myself. But I dumped EverQuest. I am
> > interested in story development and social interaction, and I think
> > rating CL much higher there is exactly on track!
> True, CL is better in this area, and i rated it as such. To put in in a
> somewhat derogatory phrasing: "If you want a graphical chatroom, CL is
> for you". Now that's an exagreation, but it has a valid point. The
> GAMEPLAY in CL dosen't measure up to EQ. The STORY of EQ dosen't compare
> to CL.
I've never played EQ, but took a stroll to its news group after seeing
this thread. I wouldn't want to judge a game having not even played it,
but looking at all the threads there it seems EQ's challenges, quests,
gameplay etc. etc. are much more dependant on the AI, scripting, premade
quests etc. etc.
Whereas ClanLord's fun come from social interaction applied to a very
simple AI and world design. What do you do mostly in ClanLord? You go on
group hunts or rescue missions, which are 90% player-created adventures.
EQ looks like it's a lot more "Well I want to get this item, so I need to
go here and talk with this guy and then do this and this and fight this
and then I get it". Which isn't a bad thing, but quite a different sort of
game. I might be misjudging it due to my ignorance, though.
--(Trauma)
Jason Rochelle
> I've never played EQ, but took a stroll to its news group after seeing
> this thread. I wouldn't want to judge a game having not even played it,
> but looking at all the threads there it seems EQ's challenges, quests,
> gameplay etc. etc. are much more dependant on the AI, scripting, premade
> quests etc. etc.
A good parallel to this might be to look at the posts in THIS newsgroup.
I would not know about all the FUN in CL, Just about things that are
broken (court), not implemented or explained(Bards), or the irritating
players(theranger).
> Whereas ClanLord's fun come from social interaction applied to a very
> simple AI and world design. What do you do mostly in ClanLord? You go on
> group hunts or rescue missions, which are 90% player-created adventures.
In reality 90% of MY time in EQ is group hunts and rescues (although
rescues are VERY different, since in EQ, your body stays behind where
you fell, you are transported home, and YOU get to help rescue YOURSELF!
> EQ looks like it's a lot more "Well I want to get this item, so I need to
> go here and talk with this guy and then do this and this and fight this
> and then I get it". Which isn't a bad thing, but quite a different sort of
> game. I might be misjudging it due to my ignorance, though.
>
> --(Trauma)
There is that element to it. However, there is no item that you HAVE to
go get. I have YET to go on any of the long, involved quests. In fact
the longest quest i ever went on was the one i went on to join my Guild
(clan). I had to bring the GuildLeader (a PC) 2 bronze weapons. Took me
a few hours to compete that (kinda rare).
Jason
Tamarin of Puddleby
> Two: Although this may be hard to believe, I REALLY didn't intend this
> thread to evolve into "Which one is better".
Forget which is better. You did us all a service by broadening our
horizons. Joe and DT would have to be utter fools to ignore what is good
about their competition, which is what it is. Speaking of which... "Joe!
I'd like to see some more races, please! The extra classes and 3D
interface wouldn't suck, either, but I can wait on those."
I didn't read that post, but didn't DT post an April Fool's press release
for Clan Lord 3D that almost perfectly describes Everquest? ;-)
> ... I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks.
He is. Thank you so much for filling up the rat hut with great rockodiles!
While I do truly *enjoy* the antics of Ther'Anger, it does raise one
concern in my mind. This one character can force the whole town to
unwillingly play his game, which is kind of a "violation of civil
liberties" if you will. People who don't want to play the game of sitting
dead in town for 15 minutes out of every hour because Ther'Anger decided
to bring in a pride of Mahas are stuck with it, and that's kind of
unfair. No one player should force all the other players into his plot
like that. It's like a little kid (or some adults I know) who can't
accept not being the center of attention at ***EACH AND EVERY PLACE THREE
OR MORE PEOPLE COME TOGETHER***. While it can be fun, it's also
undeniably childish and immature. Maybe we should negotiate some ground
rules about what sort of abuse from Ther'Anger we are willing to tolerate?
Blah blah blah,
HWC for Tamarin
--
Please visit my Enchanted Web Scrolls!
<http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Cauldron/6257/>
Joe Williams
>Three: Even though i hesitate to write this because i know it will give
>him joy, I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks. I would
>like to say that characters like Theranger are a major reason I did not
>buy CL. On several occasions, he ruined what might have been a perfectly
>good hunt, by luring blocking pushing and pulling. All in All, what
>irritated me most was the lack of response from ANYONE at DeltaTao when
>I prayed for help. Even if they had said "That's the way we want it".
>That would have been better than the silence I received. Lesson in
>customer service for you...
We are sincere in not wanting Clan Lord to be about GMs telling people
what to do and what not to. Ther'Anger is evil, and many people hate
him. There are tools in the game to handle him, including throwing him in
jail. If the tools are insufficient, we'll do more, but as a rule we do
not interfere with people playing the game.
If the GMs made a policy of doing what players prayed for, just imagine
what he might pray for you!
As a rule of thumb, the GMs do not respond to any prayers that are not
related to bugs.
Joe Williams
me that once you engaged a monster, it was pretty much just autofight.
(To be fair, my experience with the game is limited; perhaps there are
more decisions to make at higher level.)
Clan Lord is still far weaker in this regard than I'd like it to be, but I
am pleased that combat requires more than a little thinking. I have often
been surprised when looking at the stats of a stalwart warrior: "How can
he be that weak? He's awesome in battle!" The answer: He's good at the
tactics.
Some things we hope to add in the future:
Different fighting styles (some better against others)
Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues with this)
Sans Sarif
> I'd like to see some more races, please! The extra classes and 3D
> interface wouldn't suck, either, but I can wait on those."
Personally, I like the non-3D interface. Some of use are not so lucky/rich
as to have a super-fast G3 on our desktops and must make do with much
slower systems. The current incarnation of CL plays perfectly well on my
PPC 7100/66, and I understand it runs great on even weaker systems.
As for classes, it would of course be nice to see other possibilities come
up, but I'm happy being a fighter, as far as profession is concerned...
now if only the Bards' instruments/training would become available so I
could also do the music which I love, I'd be too happy for words. :}
See another thread here for what I've been able to learn about Bards so far.
-Marc (happily not in 3D)
~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~'+.,.+'~
Marc R. Stephens swin...@earthlink.net
Sans Sarif (Fen'neko Fighter) mar...@umich.edu
,.+'~'+.,.+The best diplomat I know is a sharp sword!'+.,.+'~'+.,
Carl Hommel
>
>There are tools in the game to handle him, including throwing him in
>jail. If the tools are insufficient, we'll do more, but as a rule we do
>not interfere with people playing the game.
Sunday morning (EDT), a snert named "Meriin" led a maha and a zerk trapped
in Mai's Lawn into the town square. The first time was roleplayed pretty
well; he claimed that Algernon had asked him to bring the pretty kitty to
play with. We all shouted "No!" and he went and did it anyway.
About 15 fell, of course. Finally, someone sacrificed themself and got
the maha back in the garden.
The second time was less fun. By the fifth time, Meriin had over 50 bad
karma. When asked "Why?" he replied "Because it's fun!"
Where was Constance? Several of us wanted to haul Meriin's ass into
Court. Even if the bug meant he got 3 month's probation, at least he'd
have been off the street during the trial. And we'd get to vent our
spleen on the stand.
Eventually, enough people woke up and began clanning, that we were able to
swarm the maha with bodies and kill it. And the zerk. Meriin *finally*
died, and TheRanger organized a group pull to stick him in the town hall.
(Guess TheRanger doesn't like competition!)
So, I disagree. The tools in the game do not work at present. The
"concerned citizens" had no way (other than bad karma) to sanction the
snert's behavior.
--
Carl Hommel
http://www.notelrac.com
Guy and Karen Enki
<Tamar...@GeoCities.com> wrote:
> In article <373F83AE...@home.com>, Jason Rochelle <jas...@home.com>
> wrote:
> > Two: Although this may be hard to believe, I REALLY didn't intend this
> > thread to evolve into "Which one is better".
>
> Forget which is better. You did us all a service by broadening our
> horizons. Joe and DT would have to be utter fools to ignore what is good
> about their competition, which is what it is. Speaking of which... "Joe!
> I'd like to see some more races, please! The extra classes and 3D
> interface wouldn't suck, either, but I can wait on those."
>
> I didn't read that post, but didn't DT post an April Fool's press release
> for Clan Lord 3D that almost perfectly describes Everquest? ;-)
>
>
> > ... I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks.
>
> He is. Thank you so much for filling up the rat hut with great rockodiles!
>
> While I do truly *enjoy* the antics of Ther'Anger, it does raise one
> concern in my mind. This one character can force the whole town to
> unwillingly play his game, which is kind of a "violation of civil
> liberties" if you will. People who don't want to play the game of sitting
> dead in town for 15 minutes out of every hour because Ther'Anger decided
> to bring in a pride of Mahas are stuck with it, and that's kind of
> unfair. No one player should force all the other players into his plot
> like that. It's like a little kid (or some adults I know) who can't
> accept not being the center of attention at ***EACH AND EVERY PLACE THREE
> OR MORE PEOPLE COME TOGETHER***. While it can be fun, it's also
> undeniably childish and immature. Maybe we should negotiate some ground
> rules about what sort of abuse from Ther'Anger we are willing to tolerate?
Ther'Angers antics will only last as long as it takes the population to
obtain enough skill to kill what he drags back into town. In a month,
he'll be nothing more than an obnoxious memory...
Luca
Tamar...@GeoCities.com (Tamarin of Puddleby) wrote:
>> ... I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks.
>
>He is. Thank you so much for filling up the rat hut with great rockodiles!
>
>While I do truly *enjoy* the antics of Ther'Anger, it does raise one
>concern in my mind. This one character can force the whole town to
>unwillingly play his game, which is kind of a "violation of civil
>liberties" if you will. People who don't want to play the game of sitting
>dead in town for 15 minutes out of every hour because Ther'Anger decided
>to bring in a pride of Mahas are stuck with it, and that's kind of
>unfair.
Bah, we don't need Ther'Anger for that. North beach (or even Crawler's
Revenge) was much safer than town for hours yesterday, first because a
deadly crawler was laying waste to it, then because of a half dozen or
so detached spirits at least some of which seemed to be coming out of
buildings with locked doors (or spawning right in front of them).
Of course, nobody was able to stop either of these invasions. And
Ther'Anger spend some quality time on his back, too.
BTW: Crawler's Revenge? That sounds more like a second-class sequel to
a third-class movie than place.
Luca
Guy and Karen Enki
<j...@deltatao.com> wrote:
> I was disappointed in EQ's combat system. For the most part, it seemed to
> me that once you engaged a monster, it was pretty much just autofight.
> (To be fair, my experience with the game is limited; perhaps there are
> more decisions to make at higher level.)
>
> Clan Lord is still far weaker in this regard than I'd like it to be, but I
> am pleased that combat requires more than a little thinking. I have often
> been surprised when looking at the stats of a stalwart warrior: "How can
> he be that weak? He's awesome in battle!" The answer: He's good at the
> tactics.
Tactics? Heh. Once you understand, the "strategy" of killing monsters
(see below) in CL, there is very little else required, in the way of
tactics. Group dynamics make killing a monster different but do not
require much more in the way of tactics.
All you ever need for Clanlord combat (strategy, not tactics).
1) find or create an obstruction to block the monster, if possible
2) determine what kind of attack is required to kill the monster
3) stay alive
4) kill the monster
> Some things we hope to add in the future:
>
> Different fighting styles (some better against others)
> Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
> Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
> Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues with this)
Until you implement some of the above, tactics will be as simplistic,
in CL, as your artwork... One of the "bad" things you need to consider
fixing is "facing". A monster attacks in a particular amount of time,
no matter which direction it's facing/attacking. Reality shows us time
and effort must be expended to change direction. So if there's exiles
north and south of a monster, the monster needs to expend "time" to
change its target.
Allen Taylor
Joe Williams wrote:
> <snippage on stuff about EQ>
>
> Some things we hope to add in the future:
>
> Different fighting styles (some better against others)
> Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
> Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
> Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues with this)
>
> --
> --Joe Williams
> President, Delta Tao Software, Inc.
>
> To subscribe to Joe's rambling personal mailing list,
> send "subscribe joedeltalist" to majo...@ten.net.
Joe,
The only reason I became a Sylvan (way back in the late 20's) was because I wanted
to use ranged weapons. Heck, I even trained before the ripture wars as if I had a
ranged weapon (atkus/balance).This has always been my favorite type of character
to play. Seriously, why have Sylvans (at all?) with bows if there will be no
ranged weapons. Why can't bows be integrated just like other items (runes come to
mind)? I can think of many ways that make IC sense, I'm sure you have too, to make
them balanced in game - less damage, take longer to fire, lots of atkus for hits,
etc.
In short; ranged weapons would be a great addition and I hope they are added and
soon.
-Althepal
p.s. Please, please, please.
Luca
<alth...@earthlink.net> wrote:
>The only reason I became a Sylvan (way back in the late 20's) was because I
>wanted to use ranged weapons.
The sylvan lady in town hall says: "Sylvans are the best scouts and
archers."
At least give her something different to say then.
Luca
avi
Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
> All you ever need for Clanlord combat (strategy, not tactics).
>
> 1) find or create an obstruction to block the monster, if possible
> 2) determine what kind of attack is required to kill the monster
> 3) stay alive
> 4) kill the monster
All you ever need for driving a car
1) Determine whether you want to use the accelerator or brakes
2) Steer the wheel in the direction you wish to travel
3) Don't hit anything
3) Eventually stop
Why they don't lower the driving age to 10 is beyond me.
--(Trauma)
Jason Rochelle
> "concerned citizens" had no way (other than bad karma) to sanction the
> snert's behavior.
> --
> Carl Hommel
> http://www.notelrac.com
Exactly. What irritated me was that most of therangers tactics would
NEVER succeed in RL (would 10 warrior stand idly by while theranger
pushes their sleeping comrade into "a deep cavern" to die? Never!).
Joe, wake up. I liked CL because i could be with friends doing cool
things, NOT because theranger might trap me in some situation where I
could die over and over. NOT because Theranger helped to kill my
friends. NOT because theranger played an evil character by making my
gaming life hell. So much NOT that you lost ONE paying customer that
actually comes back and tells you why they left. How many others do you
think just left?
Rob Viesca
avi wrote:
All you need to get a job:
1. Qualifcations
Lowest number of points yet ! =)
Rob Viesca
Tamarin of Puddleby wrote:
> In article <373F83AE...@home.com>, Jason Rochelle <jas...@home.com> wrote:
> > Two: Although this may be hard to believe, I REALLY didn't intend this
> > thread to evolve into "Which one is better".
>
> Forget which is better. You did us all a service by broadening our
> horizons. Joe and DT would have to be utter fools to ignore what is good
> about their competition, which is what it is. Speaking of which... "Joe!
> I'd like to see some more races, please! The extra classes and 3D
> interface wouldn't suck, either, but I can wait on those."
>
> I didn't read that post, but didn't DT post an April Fool's press release
> for Clan Lord 3D that almost perfectly describes Everquest? ;-)
>
> > ... I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks.
>
> He is. Thank you so much for filling up the rat hut with great rockodiles!
>
> While I do truly *enjoy* the antics of Ther'Anger, it does raise one
> concern in my mind. This one character can force the whole town to
> unwillingly play his game, which is kind of a "violation of civil
> liberties" if you will. People who don't want to play the game of sitting
> dead in town for 15 minutes out of every hour because Ther'Anger decided
> to bring in a pride of Mahas are stuck with it, and that's kind of
> unfair. No one player should force all the other players into his plot
> like that. It's like a little kid (or some adults I know) who can't
> accept not being the center of attention at ***EACH AND EVERY PLACE THREE
> OR MORE PEOPLE COME TOGETHER***. While it can be fun, it's also
> undeniably childish and immature. Maybe we should negotiate some ground
> rules about what sort of abuse from Ther'Anger we are willing to tolerate?
>
> Blah blah blah,
I try to get some variety in my characters role. I may lure things into
the town while I still can. But before reset he has done things people have never
thought of, or would dare to do. I do not try to be the center of attention people
usually put the spotlight on my character. Or is it that I make an effort at
roleplaying pewople criticize me? You do have one defense against Anger, the
courthouse, even thought it is inoperable at the moment. Others may say that the
punishments aren't severe enough at the moment, but I do believe Joe said people
may be able to ban others from the city for a week or so.
I never remember having Ther lead more than one monster into a crowd of people
since the ripture war. I think your points are highly exaggerated and one-sided
Rob Viesca
Carl Hommel wrote:
> Eventually, enough people woke up and began clanning, that we were able to
> swarm the maha with bodies and kill it. And the zerk. Meriin *finally*
> died, and TheRanger organized a group pull to stick him in the town hall.
>
> (Guess TheRanger doesn't like competition!)
>
> --
> Carl Hommel
I guess its because Meriin wasn't roleplaying it out =)
Anger has a reason why he does all the things he does, but if I ever released
his role, that would ruin my entire job.
-Rob
Tamarin of Puddleby
mar...@umich.edu (Sans Sarif) wrote:
> Personally, I like the non-3D interface. Some of use are not so lucky/rich
> as to have a super-fast G3 on our desktops and must make do with much
> slower systems.
Don't get me wrong; I don't have a G3 either. But Dark Forces runs
wonderfully on my 7200/75, so I don't see why "CL3D" couldn't, too. I
didn't say so in my post, but what I really favor is two clients, one 2D
and one 3D. That way, when I upgrade to my quad G4 with dual Voodoo3's
next week :-), I'll be ready.
Rob Viesca
Tamarin of Puddleby wrote:
I don't think Dark Forces has any 3d models.
M. W. Welsh
wrote:
> I don't think Dark Forces has any 3d models.
>
> -Rob
Very true, no 3-D there. Not like Quake or Unreal.
M. W. Welsh
<jas...@home.com> wrote:
> Rob Viesca wrote:
>
> >more stupid crap
>
> I think we've all discerned why you do the things you do. You can't
> succeed in CL the way it was meant to be, so you content yourself with
> screwing up things for other people. I'm not impressed.
OOC
Compared to other "evil" characters Ther'Anger is quite brilliant. I
don't see him much because I am smart enough to run the other way.
M. W. Welsh
<jas...@home.com> wrote:
> Rob Viesca wrote:
> > a big load of crap
>
> Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> freedoms.
Hmmm... So how should "evil" characters behave then?
Ther'Anger: \action looks really evil.
Peasant: Oh I'm terrified.
Ther'Anger: \action looks evil.
Peasant: Oh stop! I'm really frightened now!
Ther'Anger is hated by Monolith because Ther is evil, however I think
that Rob does a pretty good job. He stays in character and annoys the
hell out of everyone. People who couldn't roleplay their way out of a
wet paper bag used to attcak Teioh and say he ruined the game too and
that he couldn't roleplay. He was one of the most consistent
roleplayers in the game.
mike pearson
> Compared to other "evil" characters Ther'Anger is quite brilliant. I
> don't see him much because I am smart enough to run the other way.
Heh. He really isn't that bad of a role player. He's very good at
being evil. :-)
> Ok, I un-killfiled Outcast. I'd rather respond directly to him than to a
> quote.
That is worthy of being put in your sig? Bah! :-)
--
mike pearson : "Never underestimate the power of stupid people
Adrian in Clan Lord : in large groups." - unknown
Rob Viesca
Jason Rochelle wrote:
> Rob Viesca wrote:
>
> >more stupid crap
>
> I think we've all discerned why you do the things you do. You can't
> succeed in CL the way it was meant to be, so you content yourself with
> screwing up things for other people. I'm not impressed.
Since when did I say "more stupid crap"? Actually I succeed in my early
days then put a twist on roleplaying.
Rob Viesca
Jason Rochelle wrote:
> Rob Viesca wrote:
> > a big load of crap
>
> Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> freedoms.
I'd appreciate if you would not quote things I did not say. Use editor's
brackets.
Blur
Williams) wrote:
> We are sincere in not wanting Clan Lord to be about GMs telling people
> what to do and what not to. Ther'Anger is evil, and many people hate
> jail. If the tools are insufficient, we'll do more, but as a rule we do
> not interfere with people playing the game.
>
> what he might pray for you!
>
> As a rule of thumb, the GMs do not respond to any prayers that are not
> related to bugs.
You know what would be cool joe? if the Court system worked. i love all
those 3 month probations that do nothing.
Thkel/Neo
Blur
Williams) wrote:
> In article <7hn7vq$5bm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, Lorian
> <loria...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>
> >Don't suppose they have many women playing, do they? Or are interested
> >in this market at all!
>
> I am very pleased that we have so many female players. Many computer
> games, designed by men, have limited appeal to women. We've worked hard
> to avoid this -- our female GMs have helped a lot.
Yea They Are Some of the nicer Gms And They kinda listen. but our favorite
cross dresser listens the best.(if you dont get that you havent played Cl
that long, And im not about to explain this one.)
Blur
Williams) wrote:
> I was disappointed in EQ's combat system. For the most part, it seemed to
> me that once you engaged a monster, it was pretty much just autofight.
> (To be fair, my experience with the game is limited; perhaps there are
> more decisions to make at higher level.)
>
> Clan Lord is still far weaker in this regard than I'd like it to be, but I
> am pleased that combat requires more than a little thinking. I have often
> been surprised when looking at the stats of a stalwart warrior: "How can
> he be that weak? He's awesome in battle!" The answer: He's good at the
> tactics.
>
> Some things we hope to add in the future:
>
> Different fighting styles (some better against others)
> Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
> Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
> Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues
with this)
Joe Ranged Weapon will be a problem yes but that is life and in a Real
world wouldnt you attack an orga From behind the safety of a Wall?
Maquiladora
> Rob Viesca wrote:
> > a big load of crap
>
> Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> freedoms.
I like Rob. I think he does a good job with his role, and it's pretty
safe to say I'm not defending my own freedoms. Ther' Anger is in
character 99.9% of the time from what I've seen, and I feel like if he
ever went to far IC and was offensive I could step OOC and tell him or
meet with him in the fairgrounds. Sure, he does IC things with are evil,
he is an evil character. So, he messes up hunts and leads baddies into
healing groups, he gets in arguments with other exiles. What else would
an evil character do? I am glad that of all the evil characters, Rob is
still here, because he was the only one who was even close to doing it
right IMO. I think a lot of people would agree with me on this. If you
think Rob has no place in CL, then you probably don't want any evil
characters. That's fine, but I don't think DT feels the same way.
maq
Joe Williams
Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
>One of the "bad" things you need to consider
>fixing is "facing".
We've toyed with allowing things to only turn one notch per frame. This
is more realistic, but we found it annoying to have to wait 4 frames to do
a 180. (Made it impossible to do bump and run tactics, too.)
J. Scott
> Three: Even though i hesitate to write this because i know it will give
> him joy, I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks. I would
> like to say that characters like Theranger are a major reason I did not
> buy CL. On several occasions, he ruined what might have been a perfectly
> good hunt, by luring blocking pushing and pulling.
Imagine what he could do with a chain?
/action shudders
-Runner
--
J. Scott Davis
jscottdavis AT alltel DOT net ;-)
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and
certain of what we do not see." - Hebrews 11:1
(Replace "nospam" with "net" for responses, please)
J. Scott
> > Imagine what he could do with a chain?
> >
>
> Even more limited than his current activities. Chains don't last very
> long...
Buy would YOU want to be the guy dragged of to some lonely corner of the East
Forrest and left there? :-)
You "fallen" area would not even match.
-J.
Rob Viesca
Guy and Karen Enki wrote:
> In article <37415D37...@home.com>, Jason Rochelle
> <jas...@home.com> wrote:
>
> > Rob Viesca wrote:
> > >
> > > Jason Rochelle wrote:
> > >
> > > > Rob Viesca wrote:
> > > > > a big load of crap
> > > >
> > > > Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> > > > (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> > > > stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> > > > freedoms.
> > >
> > > I'd appreciate if you would not quote things I did not say. Use editor's
> > > brackets.
> >
> > Sorry Rob, i was roleplaying an evil newsgroup poster. I could tell you
> > why i feel the need to do this but that would ruin it for me, so i
> > won't.
>
> Sorry, but that's my job...
She and/or he is right =)
Luca of the Lok'Grotons
<jas...@home.com> wrote:
>They do not exploit Game Play
>features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do. They Roleplay
>being evil by doing things like killing the guards of The human cities,
>leaving them mostly defenseless (except for the PCs that are left).
So it's good roleplaying if you kill the guards yourself, but bad
roleplaying if you get a monster to do the dirty work for you? I don't
get your point.
>If CL is REALLY to be realistic and have EVIL characters, then Players
>should be able to kill other Players.
I won't start the "what's realistic" debate again, but how is being
able to kill other players going to improve the roleplaying of the
killers - or those killed?
Luca
Tarsaroth
> It would be interesting albeit difficult if some of the more
> intelligent creatures learned that a piece of white (or turquoise)
> clothing meant healer, and that one of the quickest ways to rid
> the lair of those darned exile invasions is to make sure those
> so clothed are immobile/grounded. I don't say this just to make
> healer's
> lives even more difficult in those areas infested by such creatures;
> but thinking from the critter's view, if they can make that cause/effect
> leap, why not?
> +r / Kodo
ack!!
\action takes Kodo's turkey leg and stuffs it unceremoniously in his mouth
\action hopes he got Kodo shut up before Joe heard that!
Tarsaroth
Maquiladora
> if we put it in as the only option. So it's waiting for us to get the
> code that allows picture variants.
Heh, well, I am one of the original members of the Minis actually (like I
said, for irony's sake). But I do agree that some of my former clanmates
would be upset if you took away the option altogether. So is it safe to
say that this picture variant code is something in the works, that should
happen real soon? I can wait for however long it takes to get
implemented, as long as it is of reasonably high priority :)
maq
Maquiladora
If what TheRanger did with monster leading and lurking about was over the
line for him, how would "evil" characters running around PKing people make
things more tolerable? It seems like this would make things worse. And I
agree with Luca, "what's realistic" can only be used with a grain of
salt. After all, we are fighting giant ants and undeads, and we can be
healed by a magical stone.
maq
Guy and Karen Enki
<Lu...@G9.com> wrote:
> In article <37415FC7...@home.com>, Jason Rochelle
> <jas...@home.com> wrote:
>
> >They do not exploit Game Play
> >features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do. They Roleplay
> >being evil by doing things like killing the guards of The human cities,
> >leaving them mostly defenseless (except for the PCs that are left).
>
> So it's good roleplaying if you kill the guards yourself, but bad
> roleplaying if you get a monster to do the dirty work for you? I don't
> get your point.
>
> >If CL is REALLY to be realistic and have EVIL characters, then Players
> >should be able to kill other Players.
>
> I won't start the "what's realistic" debate again, but how is being
> able to kill other players going to improve the roleplaying of the
> killers - or those killed?
>
Revenge comes to mind.
Guy and Karen Enki
Maquiladora <maquiladora80@_NO_SPAM_hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >They do not exploit Game Play
> > >features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do. They Roleplay
> > >being evil by doing things like killing the guards of The human cities,
> > >leaving them mostly defenseless (except for the PCs that are left).
> >
> > So it's good roleplaying if you kill the guards yourself, but bad
> > roleplaying if you get a monster to do the dirty work for you? I don't
> > get your point.
> >
> > >If CL is REALLY to be realistic and have EVIL characters, then Players
> > >should be able to kill other Players.
> >
> > I won't start the "what's realistic" debate again, but how is being
> > able to kill other players going to improve the roleplaying of the
> > killers - or those killed?
> >
> > Luca
>
> If what TheRanger did with monster leading and lurking about was over the
> line for him, how would "evil" characters running around PKing people make
> things more tolerable? It seems like this would make things worse. And I
> agree with Luca, "what's realistic" can only be used with a grain of
> salt. After all, we are fighting giant ants and undeads, and we can be
> healed by a magical stone.
And some demand that your name be a certain style while others think
that being OOC while IC is criminal.
It's a game folks. Play it anyway you like but it's still a game.
Guy and Karen Enki
<jscot...@alltel.net> wrote:
> Guy and Karen Enki wrote:
>
> > > Imagine what he could do with a chain?
> > >
> >
> > Even more limited than his current activities. Chains don't last very
> > long...
>
> Buy would YOU want to be the guy dragged of to some lonely corner of the East
> Forrest and left there? :-)
>
> You "fallen" area would not even match.
A depart is most useful when you die in an area that others cannot
reach. Doesn't matter much how you ended up there...
Sutai
> a third-class movie than place.
Yes! Oh please... change the name of that place to Crawler Beach or something.
And while you're at it, put a "Ladies only." sign on the purple shirt
hut. It can be really confusing if you think it is a secret mystic place!
And about arrows-
Can they not work like boomerangs? If they hit an obstacle, they break
instantly, so you couldn't really shoot something from behind a wall....
And the aim could be imperfect, causing arrows to go in strange
directions. Atkus would help the aim. Not too abuseable are they? (oh,
arrows would be small, NOT boomerang-sized) : P
--
To reply, remove SCRIMP SAMMICH. :P
mike pearson
> <btw, I agree with Rob [regarding summaries that appear to be the original
> poster's words]: please enclose summaries in <...> >
Actually, editor's brackets are [], although I think the best way to
quote an article that you don't want to quote, other then to omit the
quote entirely, is: (just modify the attributation line that your
newsreader includes.)
John Doe <joh...@somplace.com> wrote something useless.
> If CL was a game that you solved in a few hours and put on the shelf
> forever, then a spoiler would be a game-killer. In a society (which is how
> I see this "game"), spoilers are incentives for improvement and
> advancement.
Yes, but if someone discovers the secret to becomming a bard, for
example, and announces it to everyone, that means that the quest that DT
took their time making is ruined for anyone else who saw the spoiler.
I have absolutly no problem with people telling someone how to
do/get/become something, as long as it is done in private. In game, this
would be whispers when nobody else is in earshot, or thinktos. On the
web, there should be a warning page. In other words, nobody who does not
want to see the spoiler should see it.
This is what started the "blabbermouth flag" - people announcing in
town how to get some item. It's one thing to tell someone in private,
quite another to announce it around town.
--
mike pearson : You know you're drinking too much coffee when...
Adrian in Clan Lord : You short out motion detectors.
Manx
> > > Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> > > (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> > > stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> > > freedoms.
\action plants tongue firmly in cheek
I have an idea. Let's get rid of all the harmful things
in Clanlord... like those annoying and aggressive
creatures. Then Ther'Anger couldn't lead them into
town to hurt exiles. We could all chase butterflies or stand
around in Puddleby square and talk about whether
miniskirts are in or out. Sounds fun.
But seriously... who hasn't been the victim of
Ther's nasty trickery? He's practically a villain.
I first encountered Ther'Anger during the ripture
wars (he pushed Manx into the riptures at least a
couple of times), and he made her blood boil.
Ther taught me a number of things that have
helped to round out my character. Manx was a naive
youngster - and now she's a bit wary... not so
quick to trust strangers (which can be a good
trait), and not so dependent on others for guidance.
She's becoming independent and strong-willed.
Also, Ther delights in pinning exiles against nasty
creatures, so Manx has donned another layer of
preparation when Ther's lurking about.
He sharpens Manx's wits as much as any nasty
critter.
And finally, in a sort of twisted way, he has helped
me to learn to enjoy the "wholeness" of Clanlord
bit more. I can't explain why, but Manx is the
type of character that takes everything seriously
and to heart. She has had to learn how to deal (or
not deal) with evil characters and even make sport
of trying to outwit or out-maneuver them. Manx
actually enjoyed her pulling-battle with Ther earlier
today when he pinned her against an angry maha.
Some things that annoy Manx a LOT more than Ther:
Fighters that chastize healers for fighting
Strangers that order Manx about (she had her fill
of that as a slave)
Liars
People who insist everyone should Clan just like them
Just my opinion
(written for Manx)
SD
>Rob Viesca wrote:
>> a big load of crap
>
>Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
>(how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
>stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
>freedoms.
I like him, and not for the reasons you said.
So there.
-Outcast
--
Remove "MANGO" from email adress to contact me
SD
an...@anon.anon (avi) wrote:
>In article <3740BC3E...@home.com>, Jason Rochelle <jas...@home.com>
wrote:
>
>> Rob Viesca wrote:
>>
>> >more stupid crap
>>
>> I think we've all discerned why you do the things you do. You can't
>> succeed in CL the way it was meant to be, so you content yourself with
>> screwing up things for other people. I'm not impressed.
>
>Disagreed. CL was designed to be enjoyed by following the rules, killing
>monsters, staying alive and cooperate. To enjoy it by following the exact
>opposite set of rules is more difficult. You can't revert to the latter
>because you're no good at the former.
>
>--(Trauma)
Oh? Are you saying DT has finally decided it wants a role playing game
with no 'evil' characters?
SD
pearson.p...@k-o.org.invalid (mike pearson) wrote:
>M. W. Welsh <mono...@neo.lrun.com> wrote:
>
>> Compared to other "evil" characters Ther'Anger is quite brilliant. I
>> don't see him much because I am smart enough to run the other way.
>
> Heh. He really isn't that bad of a role player. He's very good at
>being evil. :-)
>
>> Ok, I un-killfiled Outcast. I'd rather respond directly to him than to a
>> quote.
>
> That is worthy of being put in your sig? Bah! :-)
>
Also, check out Snrub's email adress.
-Outcast
SD
Williams) wrote:
>In article <180519990832190959%Hopeles...@nowhere.special>, Guy and
>Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
>
>>Losing balance makes sense, in the CL world, for turning.
>
>Not a bad idea. We'll consider it.
>
And please make them lose balance for running around so much. Everyone is
always running around, never tiring or slowing down. I can't stand it.
SD
<mono...@neo.lrun.com> wrote:
Ok, I un-killfiled Outcast. I'd rather respond directly to him than to a quote.
Check out Monolith's Web Scroll at http://members.xoom.com/Monolith_CL/main.htm
Ah, good. I think I've worked through most of my unusually pissy spell.
SD
>In article <maquiladora80-1...@lindsay.xnet.com>,
>maquiladora80@_NO_SPAM_hotmail.com (Maquiladora) wrote:
>
>>Well said, and I agree completely. If I had realized what the female
>>human icon was originally, I wouldn't have chosen it in the first place.
>
>We have a pants-wearing human female, but I fear the Minis would lynch me
>if we put it in as the only option. So it's waiting for us to get the
>code that allows picture variants.
>
yea, I'd like to see multi colored Moritica Addams dress Humans running around.
-outcast
mike pearson
> The Game Exploit I was speaking of specifically was when Theranger is in a
> crowd of 10 warriors standing at the edge of "a deep cavern". One of the
> warriors standing right next to the edge says "AFK". Theranger moves up
> next to him and pushes him into "a deep cavern". Warrior is instantly
> killed by 8 noids there, and returns to his mac to find his lifeless body
> there.
That's no game exploit. It's stupidity on the part of the person
going AFK. That is what \sleep is for. USE IT PEOPLE! You CANNOT be
\push'd when you are \sleep'ing, AND people relize that you are AFK by
just looking at you!
</rant>
--
mike pearson | "A lecture is where the notes of the professor
Adrian in Clan Lord | become the notes of the student without passing
| through the mind of either one." - anonymous
mike pearson
> >> Ok, I un-killfiled Outcast. I'd rather respond directly to him than to
> >> a quote.
> >
> > That is worthy of being put in your sig? Bah! :-)
>
> Also, check out Snrub's email adress.
I saw that a long time ago. Took YOU a while to notice it though, if
I remember correctly...
--
mike pearson | "Common sense is the collection of prejudices
Adrian in Clan Lord | acquired by age eighteen." - Albert Einstein
Rob Viesca
Jason Rochelle wrote:
> mike pearson wrote:
> >
> > Jason Rochelle <jas...@home.com> wrote:
> >
> > > They do not exploit Game Play
> > > features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do.
> >
> > What game play features has ranger "exploited"
>
> I thought my example was pretty clear. Leading creatures to town is not
> a Game Exploit. Any fool can do that (as theranger has shown). The Game
> Exploit I was speaking of specifically was when Theranger is in a crowd
> of 10 warriors standing at the edge of "a deep cavern". One of the
> warriors standing right next to the edge says "AFK". Theranger moves up
> next to him and pushes him into "a deep cavern". Warrior is instantly
> killed by 8 noids there, and returns to his mac to find his lifeless
> body there.
>
I really need to answer to this one.
A long long (not that long) time ago, it was a law of Elkhorns to kill
any person who declared asylum by saying AFK. Not many people objected,
they thought the people should learn not to be away in places like that.
It is pretty much the same in arachnoid caverns, why would anyone leave
their person in a place full of deadly spiders? I just can't fathom it.
Even if they had to go, can't they have a macro of \sleep?
As an addition, its not system abuse, if it was then you wouldn't be
able to push people accross screens anymore. The just uses what it was
meant for, pushing.
Jason Rochelle
Jason Rochelle
Maquiladora
> >if we put it in as the only option. So it's waiting for us to get the
> >code that allows picture variants.
> >
>
>
> yea, I'd like to see multi colored Moritica Addams dress Humans running
around.
>
> -outcast
I'd like to see Outcast put in stocks in town square for several hours a
day but we can't always get what we want :P
maq
avi
Disagreed. CL was designed to be enjoyed by following the rules, killing
Guy and Karen Enki
<an...@anon.anon> wrote:
> In article <170519990906497671%Hopeles...@nowhere.special>, Guy and
> Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
>
> > All you ever need for Clanlord combat (strategy, not tactics).
> >
> > 1) find or create an obstruction to block the monster, if possible
> > 2) determine what kind of attack is required to kill the monster
> > 3) stay alive
> > 4) kill the monster
>
> All you ever need for driving a car
>
> 1) Determine whether you want to use the accelerator or brakes
> 2) Steer the wheel in the direction you wish to travel
> 3) Don't hit anything
> 3) Eventually stop
>
> Why they don't lower the driving age to 10 is beyond me.
Because a 10 year old can't reach the pedal.
Maquiladora
> a Game Exploit. Any fool can do that (as theranger has shown). The Game
> Exploit I was speaking of specifically was when Theranger is in a crowd
> of 10 warriors standing at the edge of "a deep cavern". One of the
> warriors standing right next to the edge says "AFK". Theranger moves up
> next to him and pushes him into "a deep cavern". Warrior is instantly
> killed by 8 noids there, and returns to his mac to find his lifeless
> body there.
>
It would be like an exile goes to sleep and an evil exile comes and drags
her to her death. It's not like TheRanger warps the fighter to solitary
confinement, she is now just fallen in the noids deep cavern, and this
leads to my favorite part of the game, the daring rescue! If people
didn't die in the most impossible to rescue places, I would have a lot
less fun!
maq
Polerand Alferar
right to responding to it..semi-seriously..I mean as serious as I can
get in a good mood. =) Probably because there is a just a wee bit of
responsibility in driving ya know...like the other drivers and such and
then of course anyone riding with you while...really ther'es no
responsibility in fighting ya know. ANd I know some damn tall 10 year
olds who can reach the pedals. ;) Of course why there is an age limit on
anything is silly..except I can sorta, sorta only, understand an age
requirement for retirement and etc. but just sorta. =)
-Polerand
avi wrote:
>
> In article <170519990906497671%Hopeles...@nowhere.special>, Guy and
> Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
>
> > All you ever need for Clanlord combat (strategy, not tactics).
> >
> > 1) find or create an obstruction to block the monster, if possible
> > 2) determine what kind of attack is required to kill the monster
> > 3) stay alive
> > 4) kill the monster
>
> All you ever need for driving a car
>
> 1) Determine whether you want to use the accelerator or brakes
> 2) Steer the wheel in the direction you wish to travel
> 3) Don't hit anything
> 3) Eventually stop
>
> Why they don't lower the driving age to 10 is beyond me.
>
> --(Trauma)
Rob Viesca
Blur wrote:
> In article <joe-170599...@192.168.1.3>, j...@deltatao.com (Joe
> Williams) wrote:
>
> > I was disappointed in EQ's combat system. For the most part, it seemed to
> > me that once you engaged a monster, it was pretty much just autofight.
> > (To be fair, my experience with the game is limited; perhaps there are
> > more decisions to make at higher level.)
> >
> > Clan Lord is still far weaker in this regard than I'd like it to be, but I
> > am pleased that combat requires more than a little thinking. I have often
> > been surprised when looking at the stats of a stalwart warrior: "How can
> > he be that weak? He's awesome in battle!" The answer: He's good at the
> > tactics.
> >
> > Some things we hope to add in the future:
> >
> > Different fighting styles (some better against others)
> > Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
> > Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
> > Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues
> with this)
>
> Joe Ranged Weapon will be a problem yes but that is life and in a Real
> world wouldnt you attack an orga From behind the safety of a Wall?
Yeah in a real world I would be spelunking and killing arachnoids. Couldn't
help myself in that one =)
Rob Viesca
Blur wrote:
> In article <joe-170599...@192.168.1.3>, j...@deltatao.com (Joe
> Williams) wrote:
> > We are sincere in not wanting Clan Lord to be about GMs telling people
> > what to do and what not to. Ther'Anger is evil, and many people hate
> > him. There are tools in the game to handle him, including throwing him in
> > jail. If the tools are insufficient, we'll do more, but as a rule we do
> > not interfere with people playing the game.
> >
> > If the GMs made a policy of doing what players prayed for, just imagine
> > what he might pray for you!
> >
> > As a rule of thumb, the GMs do not respond to any prayers that are not
> > related to bugs.
>
> You know what would be cool joe? if the Court system worked. i love all
> those 3 month probations that do nothing.
>
> Thkel/Neo
They do give a criminal record to judge others on.
-Rob
Tamarin of Puddleby
> is more realistic, but we found it annoying to have to wait 4 frames to do
> a 180. (Made it impossible to do bump and run tactics, too.)
One idea that occurred to me is to make movement carry a balance penalty.
The faster you run, or the greater the angle of your turn, the more
balance you lose. Your smartest critters will back themselves into a
corner and not allow themselves to be led out.
HWC for Tamarin
--
Please visit my Enchanted Web Scrolls!
<http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Cauldron/6257/>
Jason Rochelle
>
> Jason Rochelle wrote:
>
> > Rob Viesca wrote:
> >
> > >more stupid crap
> >
> > I think we've all discerned why you do the things you do. You can't
> > succeed in CL the way it was meant to be, so you content yourself with
> > screwing up things for other people. I'm not impressed.
>
> days then put a twist on roleplaying.
Sorry Rob, I was just roleplaying an Evil Newsgroup poster.
Jason Rochelle
>
> Jason Rochelle wrote:
>
> > Rob Viesca wrote:
> brackets.
Sorry Rob, i was roleplaying an evil newsgroup poster. I could tell you
why i feel the need to do this but that would ruin it for me, so i
won't.
Jason Rochelle
all the women to look like that because they fit "heroic" ideals. Go
figure.
Joe Williams wrote:
>
> In article <7hn7vq$5bm$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, Lorian
> <loria...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>
> >Don't suppose they have many women playing, do they? Or are interested
> >in this market at all!
>
> I am very pleased that we have so many female players. Many computer
> games, designed by men, have limited appeal to women. We've worked hard
> to avoid this -- our female GMs have helped a lot.
>
> --
> --Joe Williams
> President, Delta Tao Software, Inc.
>
> To subscribe to Joe's rambling personal mailing list,
> send "subscribe joedeltalist" to majo...@ten.net.
Jason Rochelle
>
> Ther'Anger: \action looks really evil.
> Peasant: Oh I'm terrified.
> Ther'Anger: \action looks evil.
> Peasant: Oh stop! I'm really frightened now!
I don't have a solution for how evil characters should roleplay in CL.
However I didn't enjoy the "accepted" way in CL, moreover, it ruined the
CL experience for me, so I left.
In EQ (the game i DID buy) There are 3 evil Races. Trolls, Ogres and
Dark Elves. Evil things done by these races are accepted. It makes
sense. And their Evil actions MAKE SENSE. They do not exploit Game Play
features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do. They Roleplay
being evil by doing things like killing the guards of The human cities,
leaving them mostly defenseless (except for the PCs that are left).
If you REALLY enjoy playing the GOOD/EVIL thing, you can play on the
Rallos Zek server. It is Player vs Player At ALL times. The other
servers are PVP only if YOU decide to be. So the RZ server is more
realistic, because if a troll pops up in the human city, most of the PCs
will gang him and kill him. However I choose to play as -PVP because i
like helping more than harming (something i thought CL believed in).
If CL is REALLY to be realistic and have EVIL characters, then Players
should be able to kill other Players. Ultima Onlime has that feature,
and it sucks. 10% of the players ruin the experience for the other 90%.
J. Scott
> Three: Even though i hesitate to write this because i know it will give
> him joy, I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks. I would
> like to say that characters like Theranger are a major reason I did not
> buy CL. On several occasions, he ruined what might have been a perfectly
> good hunt, by luring blocking pushing and pulling.
Imagine what he could do with a chain?
/action shudders
-Runner
--
J. Scott Davis
jscottdavis AT alltel DOT net ;-)
"Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and
certain of what we do not see." - Hebrews 11:1
(Replace "nospam" with "net" for responses, please)
Peter W. Meek
>>One of the "bad" things you need to consider
>>fixing is "facing".
>
>We've toyed with allowing things to only turn one notch per frame. This
>is more realistic, but we found it annoying to have to wait 4 frames to do
>a 180. (Made it impossible to do bump and run tactics, too.)
Joe!! we don't want **exiles** to be limited, just critters. (Maybe
only very large critters should be turn-limited; you expect a Death
Vermine to be agile.)
--
--Pol
Marty Dodge
between
the ages of 14-30. If you want a successful game this is the group to
aim at,
if your company wants to stay afloat. It is worth pointing out that
several
small independent game companies who tried to aim themselves at an all
girl
market have been financial failures, one having to sell themselves to a
big
maker (Purple Moon) or go under. There are plenty of female designers in
the
business pumping out the same pathetic crap as the men. I dont think it
is a
sex issue but one of markets. Women like to be employed and making a
good
salary just as much as men.
I think Tomb Raider style females are ludicrous in any game, of course I
never
liked the Tomb Raider series because it seems to rely solely on the
comeliness
of its main character and stuff the gameplay. I recently had an email
chat
with a leading female game reviewer in response to her piece on women in
games. It was interesting to see that our opinions on the subject were
similar. Scantily clad men and women are fine in the proper context or
if it
befits the storyline. What is sad and pathetic is scantily clad women
for the
sake of having scantily clad women. Of course I think this trend is just
a
part of a larger problem in games today. Most game makers seem to care
little
about the plot and only hire the graphics whizzes instead of writers.
Interesting, Joe's post. I think the human female icons in CL are
pathetic.
What adventuring women would be dumb enough to go out in a miniskirt. To
me
they are not different than Lara Croft.
Marty
Nohn
Maquiladora <maquiladora80@_NO_SPAM_hotmail.com> wrote:
> I like Rob. I think he does a good job with his role <snip>
I'll tell you one thing--Ther'Anger makes Nilor look like a beginner.
Tam
mike pearson
> There are plenty of female designers in
> the
> business pumping out the same pathetic crap as the men. I dont think it
> is a
> sex issue but one of markets. Women like to be employed and making a
> good
> salary just as much as men.
First off, could you kindly set your news reader to wrap posts at 72
or 75 characters? I think 72 is more standard, so that things don't have
to be rewraped when quoting...
Secondly, you make a good point. Unfortionatly, in an online game, a
lack of female players messes with the dynamic of the game, while on a
single player game, all they loose is some potential players.
--
mike pearson : As long as there are tests,
Adrian in Clan Lord : there will be prayer in public schools.
mike pearson
> They do not exploit Game Play
> features, like most of Theranger's "evil" actions do.
What game play features has ranger "exploited"
Ut oh, I just gained some experience by clubbing a rat, I must be
exploiting the game system.
Ut oh, I'm leading the zerk around town, I must be exploiting the
game system.
Neither of these are things that are bugs in the system. One is
evil, the other is not (well, to post people at least), however neither
are prevented in the game system...
--
mike pearson : "...all the modern inconveniences..."
Adrian in Clan Lord : - Mark Twain
mike pearson
> There are plenty of female designers in
> the
> business pumping out the same pathetic crap as the men. I dont think it
> is a
> sex issue but one of markets. Women like to be employed and making a
> good
> salary just as much as men.
--
mike pearson : "A lie gets halfway around the world before the
Adrian in Clan Lord : truth has a chance to get its pants on."
......................: - Sir Winston Churchill
Peter W. Meek
>Rob Viesca wrote:
>> a big load of crap
>
>Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
>(how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
>stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
>freedoms.
<btw, I agree with Rob: please enclose summaries in <...> >
As to defending freedoms of others in the course of defending
my own freedoms, count me in on the side of the defenders.
The innocents who fall to the results of defended freedoms
are soldiers in the war to defend freedom. Uniforms are not
a requirement, nor an army. It has always been so, and
always will be.
As for "ruin[ing] the CL experience for many", I don't
think it will be as much of a problem once the court
and penalty things are finalized. There have been
quite a number of things which (for the moment) have
"spoiled" CL in one aspect or another for me, but they
get fixed sooner or later. I can see the trend, and
I'm in it for the long haul. If CL was a game that
you solved in a few hours and put on the shelf forever,
then a spoiler would be a game-killer. In a society
(which is how I see this "game"), spoilers are incentives
for improvement and advancement.
However, don't forget: "Extreme circumstances engender
bad laws." Don't allow the rush to "do something"
about Ther'Anger (or anything else) cause anyone to do
(or even ask for) something foolish, that will damage
CL (or society at large) forever.
--
--Pol
Guy and Karen Enki
<Tamar...@GeoCities.com> wrote:
> In article <joe-170599...@192.168.1.3>, j...@deltatao.com (Joe
> Williams) wrote:
> > We've toyed with allowing things to only turn one notch per frame. This
> > is more realistic, but we found it annoying to have to wait 4 frames to do
> > a 180. (Made it impossible to do bump and run tactics, too.)
>
> One idea that occurred to me is to make movement carry a balance penalty.
> The faster you run, or the greater the angle of your turn, the more
> balance you lose. Your smartest critters will back themselves into a
> corner and not allow themselves to be led out.
Losing balance makes senes, in the CL world, for turning. Low balance
is when you're most likeley to get get. Likewise, changing targets,
when surrounded is when you're also most likely to get hit.
Guy and Karen Enki
<jscot...@alltel.net> wrote:
> Jason Rochelle wrote:
>
> > Three: Even though i hesitate to write this because i know it will give
> > him joy, I see that Theranger is still up to his old tricks. I would
> > like to say that characters like Theranger are a major reason I did not
> > buy CL. On several occasions, he ruined what might have been a perfectly
> > good hunt, by luring blocking pushing and pulling.
>
> Imagine what he could do with a chain?
>
Even more limited than his current activities. Chains don't last very
long...
Guy and Karen Enki
<jas...@home.com> wrote:
> Rob Viesca wrote:
> >
> > Jason Rochelle wrote:
> >
> > > Rob Viesca wrote:
> > > > a big load of crap
> > >
> > > Face it, no one likes you and it's not "because you roleplay so well"
> > > (how stupid). You've ruined the CL experience for many and the few who
> > > stand in your defense are mostly not defending you as much as their own
> > > freedoms.
> >
> > I'd appreciate if you would not quote things I did not say. Use editor's
> > brackets.
>
> Sorry Rob, i was roleplaying an evil newsgroup poster. I could tell you
> why i feel the need to do this but that would ruin it for me, so i
> won't.
Sorry, but that's my job...
Maquiladora
Jason, I think you need to chill out.
maq
Maquiladora
> What adventuring women would be dumb enough to go out in a miniskirt. To me
> they are not different than Lara Croft.
>
> Marty
Well said, and I agree completely. If I had realized what the female
human icon was originally, I wouldn't have chosen it in the first place.
Then I kind of took an ironic, sarcastic embracing of the whole thing,
although I asked Joe if there would be some way to get rid of it. It
really makes no sense to have the skirt, so in what way is it not
gratuitous? Some female humans like the skirt, although I don't think
that it is a majority (certainly not a majority of SWC players). All
this time Joe has been saying to me that there would be an alternative to
this skirt, and so I have stuck with it. Well, I know he has been
planning to give alternative icons for all the races and sexes, but who
knows when DT will get around to that. If you all aren't planning on
changing or adding to all the icons *SOON*, then _please_ do something
about the skirt for us in the meantime. It's really hard to say you aim
this at women as much as men with that silly icon as the only female human
option :)
maq
Ben
maquiladora80@_NO_SPAM_hotmail.com (Maquiladora) wrote:
>
> I never saw the Morticia Addams dress, I just wanted to see Outcast in
> stocks. And the gag- definitely.
>
> maq
Found a pic of Mystic Healer wearing it on
http://home.earthlink.net/~quidex/paper14.html
about halfway down the page - she is healing (with old style healing
sparkles) Kingpin, who was a blue thoom at the time :) Monster names also
visible..
(man, removing monster names was possibly the smartest change they ever
made, remember how much we complained? :)
-Ben
Allen Taylor
Rob Viesca wrote:
> avi wrote:
>
> > In article <170519990906497671%Hopeles...@nowhere.special>, Guy and
> > Karen Enki <Hopeles...@nowhere.special> wrote:
> >
> > > All you ever need for Clanlord combat (strategy, not tactics).
> > >
> > > 1) find or create an obstruction to block the monster, if possible
> > > 2) determine what kind of attack is required to kill the monster
> > > 3) stay alive
> > > 4) kill the monster
> >
> > All you ever need for driving a car
> >
> > 1) Determine whether you want to use the accelerator or brakes
> > 2) Steer the wheel in the direction you wish to travel
> > 3) Don't hit anything
> > 3) Eventually stop
> >
> > Why they don't lower the driving age to 10 is beyond me.
> >
> > --(Trauma)
>
> All you need to get a job:
> 1. Qualifcations
>
> Lowest number of points yet ! =)
>
> -Rob
>
Actually it should be:
.5) in-laws
--
-------------------
Photographer: http://www.LlamaPhoto.com/
Clan Lord: http://home.earthlink.net/~althepal/
Rich Everett
>
> I was disappointed in EQ's combat system. For the most part, it seemed to
> me that once you engaged a monster, it was pretty much just autofight.
> (To be fair, my experience with the game is limited; perhaps there are
> more decisions to make at higher level.)
>
> Clan Lord is still far weaker in this regard than I'd like it to be, but I
> am pleased that combat requires more than a little thinking. I have often
> been surprised when looking at the stats of a stalwart warrior: "How can
> he be that weak? He's awesome in battle!" The answer: He's good at the
> tactics.
>
> Some things we hope to add in the future:
>
> Different fighting styles (some better against others)
> Positional advantages (attack the monster from the rear for a bonus)
and the same for monsters attacking exiles?
> Balance attacks (knock the monster down instead of hurting it)
> Ranged weapons (though I'm still concerned about game balance issues with this)
I applaud all of the above, except possibly the last. I would
love to see "basic" combat become more varied.
How about some weopons being more effective against
certain creatures as well? It doesn't have to be only
or just the rpg standard, use a blunt weopon vs skeletons, etc.
It would be interesting albeit difficult if some of the more
intelligent creatures learned that a piece of white (or turquoise)
clothing meant healer, and that one of the quickest ways to rid
the lair of those darned exile invasions is to make sure those
so clothed are immobile/grounded. I don't say this just to make
healer's
lives even more difficult in those areas infested by such creatures;
but thinking from the critter's view, if they can make that cause/effect
leap, why not?
/action imagines creatures with ranged attack with this ability
and shudders.
Or perhaps some creatures are just offended/enraged by some colors?
Hmmm, what if you remained perfectly still and some creatures could no
longer find you visually and might wander off?
+r / Kodo
---
Richard Everett (+Rich) A pun is the lowest form
Evolutionary Technologies Intl. of humor only if you didn't
Austin, TX think of it first...