More XP woes...
Snit
a deep, deep panic. He had someone install camera software onto his XP
machine, and then the machine would not reboot.
He called me - did not know the exact error message... and asked if I could
run over today... knowing he would have to pay both "emergency" and weekend
rates. I told him we could check a couple basic things over the phone - but
he wanted me there and nobody else to touch the computer.
So I ran over... and ejected the floppy (I did suggest that to him on the
phone, but he was not going to let anyone touch the machine).
Now you can blame the users - certainly they made a silly error. But think
about it... if they almost never use floppies (which is true) how would they
know about this oddity of most PC's? They were convinced it was a virus in
the camera software or something - and were too panicked to think clearly.
In any case - problem solved: and next week I will be there setting up a
backup system for them. Would have saved a few gray hairs today if nothing
else. :)
And, of course, on a Mac this never would have been a concern. Even the
older Macs with floppies built in would not have helped create this type of
stress.
And, of course, there is nothing they do with their computer that could not
be done as well on a Mac. Maybe someday the company will take my advice and
upgrade to Macs. Would have saved them a few bucks today! In the long run,
the Macs would be much cheaper for them, and would look better, too.
--
I am one of only .3% of people who have avoided becoming a statistic.
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
news:BDEA072A.17A48%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
> Just came back from a customer's company. The owner had given me a call
in
> a deep, deep panic. He had someone install camera software onto his XP
> machine, and then the machine would not reboot.
>
> He called me - did not know the exact error message... and asked if I
could
> run over today... knowing he would have to pay both "emergency" and
weekend
> rates. I told him we could check a couple basic things over the phone -
but
> he wanted me there and nobody else to touch the computer.
>
> So I ran over... and ejected the floppy (I did suggest that to him on the
> phone, but he was not going to let anyone touch the machine).
>
> Now you can blame the users - certainly they made a silly error. But
think
> about it... if they almost never use floppies (which is true) how would
they
> know about this oddity of most PC's? They were convinced it was a virus
in
> the camera software or something - and were too panicked to think clearly.
>
What the hell are you talking about? A floppy boot is not an oddity.
It's quite common. In fact some of the most powerful tools for PCs come on
floppy. Floppies on PCs added another way to boot the machine if the OS on
the HD was dead. Most of that can be done with CDs now but floppies are
still just as usefull.
The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run. So
how can you say this is an XP problem? You don't know much about PCs do you?
John
>>
Snit
G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com on 12/18/04 5:35 PM:
>
> "Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> news:BDEA072A.17A48%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
>> Just came back from a customer's company. The owner had given me a call in a
>> deep, deep panic. He had someone install camera software onto his XP
>> machine, and then the machine would not reboot.
>>
>> He called me - did not know the exact error message... and asked if I could
>> run over today... knowing he would have to pay both "emergency" and weekend
>> rates. I told him we could check a couple basic things over the phone - but
>> he wanted me there and nobody else to touch the computer.
>>
>> So I ran over... and ejected the floppy (I did suggest that to him on the
>> phone, but he was not going to let anyone touch the machine).
>>
>> Now you can blame the users - certainly they made a silly error. But think
>> about it... if they almost never use floppies (which is true) how would they
>> know about this oddity of most PC's? They were convinced it was a virus in
>> the camera software or something - and were too panicked to think clearly.
>>
>
> What the hell are you talking about? A floppy boot is not an oddity.
> It's quite common. In fact some of the most powerful tools for PCs come on
> floppy. Floppies on PCs added another way to boot the machine if the OS on
> the HD was dead. Most of that can be done with CDs now but floppies are
> still just as usefull.
Who said anything about not wanting a computer to be able to boot from
another drive?
>
> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run. So
> how can you say this is an XP problem?
It is not XP specific... and if you read what I wrote, I never suggested it
was.
> You don't know much about PCs do you?
Enough to get paid nicely on a Saturday to eject a floppy. :)
--
Look, this is silly. It's not an argument, it's an armor plated walrus with
walnut paneling and an all leather interior.
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
This is actually lamer than Jim Polaski's made up tales of Windows
woes. Aren't you going to tell us that at first it would read the
floppy then later it wouldn't? 8)
--
"...I doubt that I would ever buy a Mac. I've seen
what owning one can do to people. And I don't want
any part of that."
Rich Brooks
columnist for the
Southwest Florida
Herald-Tribune
Ian
Ian
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
news:BDEA072A.17A48%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
Sandman
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> <snip misconceptions>
You mislabeled your thread as "XP woes" when the problems had nothing to do
with XP.
--
Sandman[.net]
Sandman
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> > The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> > blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run. So
> > how can you say this is an XP problem?
>
> It is not XP specific... and if you read what I wrote, I never suggested it
> was.
Incorrect. Read the title of the thread you created, Michael.
--
Sandman[.net]
Tim Adams
Sandman <m...@sandman.net> wrote:
He'd have to LEARN to read in order to do that.
--
Tim
Snit
on 12/18/04 5:20 PM:
> Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with XP.
Correct.
>
--
"If a million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing."
- Anatole France
Snit
teadams$2$0$0$3-047906.08...@news1.east.earthlink.net on 12/19/04
6:31 AM:
Here, short sentences to help you understand:
Machine running XP.
Problem not XP only.
Problem on XP machine.
Problem no exist on Macs.
Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
Snit
mr-DC248F.12...@individual.net on 12/19/04 4:54 AM:
Here, short sentences to help you understand:
Machine running XP.
Problem not XP only.
Problem on XP machine.
Problem no exist on Macs.
Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
--
Snit
Here, short sentences to help you understand:
Machine running XP.
Problem not XP only.
Problem on XP machine.
Problem no exist on Macs.
Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
--
Snit
on 12/18/04 5:22 PM:
> Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with XP.
Here, short sentences to help you understand:
Machine running XP.
Problem not XP only.
Problem on XP machine.
Problem no exist on Macs.
Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
--
Tim Adams
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
See what I mean Sandman?
--
Tim
ZnU
"John Slade" <hitm...@pacbell.net> wrote:
The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
"Free societies are hopeful societies. And free societies will be allies against
these hateful few who have no conscience, who kill at the whim of a hat."
--George W. Bush in Washington, D.C., Sept. 17, 2004
Mayor of R'lyeh
bless us with the following wisdom:
>In article <G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>
>Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Snit
abc-FE245B.1...@28-76.newscene.com on 12/19/04 10:41 AM:
> In article <BDEAF3C9.17B2F%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> "Ian" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in post b_ycnSRZ8dQ...@karoo.co.uk
>> on 12/18/04 5:20 PM:
>>
>>> Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with XP.
>>
>> Correct.
>
> I'm still waiting for one of these "XP problem" threads to actually have
> *something* to do with XP!
>
> First we had a CD drive failure, then we had some software update
> failure, now we have "XP wouldn't boot because someone left a floppy in
> the drive"!
>
> None of these situations have anything to do with XP. But in the
> world of "Mac Advocacy", *everything* is XP's fault!
The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
--
If A = B and B = C, then A = C, except where void or prohibited by law.
Roy Santoro, Psycho Proverb Zone (http://snipurl.com/BurdenOfProof)
Snit
5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
The machine in question is just a couple months old.
What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
running XP.
>
>>
>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Snit
znu-E79117.1...@individual.net on 12/19/04 10:18 AM:
Thanks... with so many people not understanding the point I was making, it
is good to see it was quite clear...
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>
>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>
>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>
>The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>
>What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>running XP.
What you're describing is something you made up.
>>>
>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Richardson
"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>
>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>
>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>
>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>
>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>
>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>> running XP.
>
> What you're describing is something you made up.
>
>>>>
>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
You quote Rich Brooks who is one of the dumbest fucktards to hold down a
newpaper gig...what a joke....
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>On 12/19/04 12:59 PM, in article jegbs01bs6304tjd5...@4ax.com,
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
>> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>>
>>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>>
>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>
>>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>>
>>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>>
>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>> running XP.
>>
>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
>
>You quote Rich Brooks who is one of the dumbest fucktards to hold down a
>newpaper gig...what a joke....
LOL! He asks a question none of you Maccies can answer so you hurl
names at him. The best part is that you can't even see how this
relates to his quote I use as a sig.
Snit
10:02 AM:
LOL!
Snit
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>
>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>
>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>
>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>
>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>
>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>> running XP.
>
> What you're describing is something you made up.
Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
Are you really that ignorant about computers?
>
>>>>
>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Snit
> In article <BDEAF719.17B37%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
>>
>> Machine running XP.
>>
>> Problem not XP only.
>>
>> Problem on XP machine.
>>
>> Problem no exist on Macs.
>>
>> Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
>
> And yet you titled this thread "More XP woes...".
So you are going to nit-pick that it is in reference to the machine that is
running XP and not just the OS itself... right?
>
> Repeating something does not make it true.
>
> The same problem would have happened had the machine been running Linux
> or DOS or OS/2.
Right... but not a Mac. It is a definite Mac advantage.
>
> IOW, It was not related to XP at all.
It was related to the XP machine. Very much so.
>
> It's not even "PC related", because I have seen many PCs simply ignore
> the non-bootable floppy and proceed to boot normally from the HD.
Yes, PC's are inconsistent in this area... and others.
>
> I hope those were short enough sentences for *you*.
Sure, you do not get that OS's run on hardware, and want to nitpick instead
of addressing the point. I have pointed out a clear Mac advantage... and it
is pissing you off.
Richardson
Brooks is too fucking stupid to utter a credible syllable about Macs. When
it comes to that space cadet, there is no 'best part.'
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>jegbs01bs6304tjd5...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:59 AM:
>
>> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
>> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>>
>>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>>
>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>
>>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>>
>>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>>
>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>> running XP.
>>
>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>
>Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
>Are you really that ignorant about computers?
I haven't seen one that chokes on a nonbootable floppy for years. And
unlike you actually work on machines as opposed to pretending that I
do on Usenet.
And even if there is a modern BIOS that still stops on such a thing I
would imagine that it would still put up the old message which makes
it 100% clear that you need to eject the floppy. Your story is a bunch
of bullshit just like Polaski's.
>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Richardson
If a 'Maccie' is someone who spends 75% of their day making money on XP Pro
and the rest running Panther, then I plead 'guilty.'
Snit
>>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>>> running XP.
>>>
>>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>>>
>>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
>>
>> You quote Rich Brooks who is one of the dumbest fucktards to hold down a
>> newpaper gig...what a joke....
>
> LOL! He asks a question none of you Maccies can answer so you hurl
> names at him. The best part is that you can't even see how this
> relates to his quote I use as a sig.
He asks a question? What question? I pointed out a disadvantage of a
machine running XP, and he claims I made it up... even though anyone with
any technical sense and moderate computer experience has almost undoubtedly
seen the same "feature" I describe.
Keep in mind: this whole debate is over a machine running XP that would not
boot because of a disk in the floppy drive. I commented about how Macs do
not suffer from this weakness, and pointed out a specific example where
someone running XP had to pay weekend and "emergency" rates to get around
the silliness of this XP machine. Several Windows apologists jumped in
claiming that since this would have happened even if the machine were
running another OS (which is correct) that somehow this makes machines
running XP look better. The fact is, using a PC running Windows cost my
client standard labor costs plus the double whammy of weekend / emergency
rates... which would *never* have happened on a Mac.
The next silly argument will be to blame the user... as if the user is at
fault for the poor design / default configuration of the computer.
Mayor of R'lyeh
So you've surely got an answer to his question then. Why don't you
share it with us?
Mayor of R'lyeh
That's not the definition of a Maccie but I'm still sure that you
qualify as one. 8)
Snit
>>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>>
>>>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>>>
>>>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>>>
>>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>>> running XP.
>>>
>>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>>
>> Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
>> Are you really that ignorant about computers?
>
> I haven't seen one that chokes on a nonbootable floppy for years.
I never suggested you work on computers or have a clue about them. I never
suggested you, personally, had worked with modern computer at all. If you
care, the machine in question is an HP. It is just a few months old...
The fact that you are in utter denial of something that is quite common in
the PC world discredits your following sentence:
> And unlike you actually work on machines as opposed to pretending that I do on
> Usenet.
Look at your reactions to my pointing out a common "feature" of machines
running XP: you not only show your ignorance of modern hardware, you go so
far as to make trolling accusations against me.
Keep in mind, the weakness I describe for the machine running XP would never
happen on any modern Mac, and few if any older ones.
> And even if there is a modern BIOS that still stops on such a thing I
> would imagine that it would still put up the old message which makes
> it 100% clear that you need to eject the floppy. Your story is a bunch
> of bullshit just like Polaski's.
Is this how you excuse the weaknesses of the hardware XP runs on... just
deny it? I have no idea what you were denying in regards to Polaski's
claims, but your blind denial here does not speak highly of your computer
knowledge / experience.
>>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>j4ibs0ht19uakvii8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 11:29 AM:
>
>>>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>>>> running XP.
>>>>
>>>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>>>>
>>>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
>>>
>>> You quote Rich Brooks who is one of the dumbest fucktards to hold down a
>>> newpaper gig...what a joke....
>>
>> LOL! He asks a question none of you Maccies can answer so you hurl
>> names at him. The best part is that you can't even see how this
>> relates to his quote I use as a sig.
>
>He asks a question? What question? I pointed out a disadvantage of a
>machine running XP, and he claims I made it up...
Rich Brooks claimed you made it up? How was he even aware of your
bullshit claim to know that it existed?
>even though anyone with
>any technical sense and moderate computer experience has almost undoubtedly
>seen the same "feature" I describe.
Ten years ago.
>
>Keep in mind: this whole debate is over a machine running XP that would not
>boot because of a disk in the floppy drive. I commented about how Macs do
>not suffer from this weakness, and pointed out a specific example where
>someone running XP had to pay weekend and "emergency" rates to get around
>the silliness of this XP machine.
One thing about you is very clear, Snit. You don't know enough about
Windows to actually get paid to work on it.
> Several Windows apologists jumped in
>claiming that since this would have happened even if the machine were
>running another OS (which is correct) that somehow this makes machines
>running XP look better. The fact is, using a PC running Windows cost my
>client standard labor costs plus the double whammy of weekend / emergency
>rates... which would *never* have happened on a Mac.
>
>The next silly argument will be to blame the user... as if the user is at
>fault for the poor design / default configuration of the computer.
--
Sandman
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> "Sandman" <m...@sandman.net> wrote in post
> mr-7DEDC8.12...@individual.net on 12/19/04 4:52 AM:
>
> > In article <BDEA072A.17A48%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> > Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >
> >> <snip misconceptions>
> >
> > You mislabeled your thread as "XP woes" when the problems had nothing to do
> > with XP.
>
> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
>
> Machine running XP.
>
> Problem not XP only.
>
> Problem on XP machine.
>
> Problem no exist on Macs.
>
> Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
"Problem" not related to operating system. You're welcome.
--
Sandman[.net]
Richardson
You fit the description: 'often wrong, but seldom in doubt.' Rich Brooks
got crucified because he supported the decision of a new school
superintendent to eliminate Macs in Sarasota without presenting a scintilla
of evidence for any financial justification for that change. Brooks'
self-admitted ignorance re Macs did not stop him from sharing his ignorance
instead of doing his job. That's the template for a journalistic fucktard.
Sandman
Mayor of R'lyeh <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> >> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run. So
> >> how can you say this is an XP problem? You don't know much about PCs do
> >> you?
> >
> >The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
> >primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
> >try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
> >hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> >boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
My newly built dual 3.6Ghz PC with Tyan motherboard won't skip anything in the
boot order. I bought this computer two weeks ago. When did you buy yours?
--
Sandman[.net]
Sandman
Mayor of R'lyeh <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
> >Are you really that ignorant about computers?
>
> I haven't seen one that chokes on a nonbootable floppy for years. And
> unlike you actually work on machines as opposed to pretending that I
> do on Usenet.
Mayor - you are truly as PC illiterate as is Michael. neither of you have any
leverage on the other in this issue.
--
Sandman[.net]
Mayor of R'lyeh
with the following wisdom:
>In article <znu-E79117.1...@individual.net>,
> ZnU <z...@acedsl.com> wrote:
>
>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
>Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>
>Mike
Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
Snit
It is related to the machine running XP. That is the point you are not
willing to address.
Nor will you.
Snit
Hmmm, I describe a situation that happened... and you want to claim that I
have no "leverage" on the issue.
Sandman - why must you continue your trolling?
The facts are simple:
Customer running machine with XP
Customer can not get machine to boot
Customer pay me to "fix" machine - paying weekend and emergency fees
Problem no exist on Macs
It is really not a hard concept, but one that none of the Windows apologists
have been willing to face.
Snit
9akbs0t1t7s8qd5n9...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 12:05 PM:
> On 19 Dec 2004 13:03:06 -0600, Mike <a...@def.ghi> chose to bless us
> with the following wisdom:
>
>> In article <znu-E79117.1...@individual.net>,
>> ZnU <z...@acedsl.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>
>> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>>
>> Mike
>
> Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
No doubt: machines that run XP are not consistent in this area.
Snit
> In article <znu-E79117.1...@individual.net>,
> ZnU <z...@acedsl.com> wrote:
>
>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
Exactly. I will set the machine to boot first from the C: drive when I set
up their backup system.
--
I am one of only .3% of people who have avoided becoming a statistic.
Snit
> In article <BDEB0BAD.17B67%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
>> want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
>
> Then why was this an "XP woe"? Why not a "PC woe".
Sure... I could have said "PC woe" or "XP Machine woe", but the PC / Windows
apologists would have found something else to nit pick ... and would still
not have talked about the actual issue. Keep in mind, the issue is with the
machine running XP where my customer ended up paying me weekend and
emergency rates to come "fix" the computer... and this would *never* have
happened on a Mac.
>
>> And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
>> users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
>
> It has been explained away. Set the BIOS properly and this "XP woe"
> goes away. Sorry if choices and flexibility confuse you.
Sure, there are work grounds for the problem. And my customer will have to
pay to have the poorly set default corrected, too (though I am sure it will
just work into the hour that I am setting up a backup system - so it will
not cost them anything extra).
Keep in mind: the fact is my customer paid for weekend and emergency rates
for a problem that should never have existed in the first place. And would
not have - had they been using a Mac.
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>9akbs0t1t7s8qd5n9...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 12:05 PM:
>
>> On 19 Dec 2004 13:03:06 -0600, Mike <a...@def.ghi> chose to bless us
>> with the following wisdom:
>>
>>> In article <znu-E79117.1...@individual.net>,
>>> ZnU <z...@acedsl.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>
>>> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>>> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>>> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>
>> Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
>
>No doubt: machines that run XP are not consistent in this area.
So you're saying that when I boot this machine into FreeBSD it does't
have this feature anymore? And you actually wonder why I don't take
you seriously when you claim to work on computers for a living?
Snit
>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>
>>>> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>>>> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>>>> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>>>
>>> Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
>>
>> No doubt: machines that run XP are not consistent in this area.
>
> So you're saying that when I boot this machine into FreeBSD it does't
> have this feature anymore?
No. Never even suggested it. Keep in mind, the comparison is between the
machine running XP and other machines running OS X. Macs do not have this
"feature".
You are jumping to the bizarre and erroneous conclusion that the same
machine that runs XP would suddenly lose those hardware BIOS feature if it
were to run FreeBSD. This is whole incorrect, and such a bizarre jump does
not speak well of your computer knowledge.
> And you actually wonder why I don't take you seriously when you claim to work
> on computers for a living?
No, I do not really wonder why you would make such trolling comments. If
you would like to offer an explanation, though, feel free.
Mayor of R'lyeh
chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>bgmbs0l1oskch2cqf...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 12:43 PM:
>
>>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>>
>>>>> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>>>>> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>>>>> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>>>>
>>>> Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
>>>
>>> No doubt: machines that run XP are not consistent in this area.
>>
>> So you're saying that when I boot this machine into FreeBSD it does't
>> have this feature anymore?
>
>No. Never even suggested it. Keep in mind, the comparison is between the
>machine running XP
A machine booted into FreeBSD isn't running XP. You seem to be not
aware of this.
>and other machines running OS X. Macs do not have this
>"feature".
So now you're saying that if I fire up VPC on an Apple machine and
start up XP the Apple machine will have this problem? You're getting
wierder and wierder, Snit.
>
>You are jumping to the bizarre and erroneous conclusion that the same
>machine that runs XP would suddenly lose those hardware BIOS feature if it
>were to run FreeBSD.
I'm jumping to no such conclusion. You are outright stating this and
similar things for some reason, however. I can only assume its your
ignorance that lets you believe this.
> This is whole incorrect, and such a bizarre jump does
>not speak well of your computer knowledge.
>
>> And you actually wonder why I don't take you seriously when you claim to work
>> on computers for a living?
>
>No, I do not really wonder why you would make such trolling comments. If
>you would like to offer an explanation, though, feel free.
Let me explain this to you slowly.
When you first start up a PC it has a thing called a BIOS that
performs some tasks.
This BIOS thing has nothing whatsoever to do with the OS. This is the
point that you are totally unaware of.
The last thing the BIOS does is hand off control to an OS that it can
go looking for in one of several different ways.
Every single OS for the PC is not some variant of XP no matter how
many times you say they are.
Snit
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 12:51:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>
>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>> bgmbs0l1oskch2cqf...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 12:43 PM:
>>
>>>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Actually, there are PCs that do this also, and it depends how the BIOS
>>>>>> is set up. Most machines nowadays have settings like "1st boot device,
>>>>>> 2nd boot device, 3rd boot device", etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mine has that plus I can hit F9 to select from a menu if I want.
>>>>
>>>> No doubt: machines that run XP are not consistent in this area.
>>>
>>> So you're saying that when I boot this machine into FreeBSD it does't
>>> have this feature anymore?
>>
>> No. Never even suggested it. Keep in mind, the comparison is between the
>> machine running XP and other machines running OS X. Macs do not have this
>> "feature".
>
> A machine booted into FreeBSD isn't running XP. You seem to be not
> aware of this.
Um... no... but believe this all you want. Seems you are not willing to
look at the point... Macs do not have this feature. Many machines running
XP do. Other OS's were not a part of the discussion.
> So now you're saying that if I fire up VPC on an Apple machine and
> start up XP the Apple machine will have this problem?
No.
> You're getting wierder and wierder, Snit.
Ok... so you simply want to troll... and try to place words in my mouth.
Good for you.
Let it be noted you will keep running from the point of the post.
>> You are jumping to the bizarre and erroneous conclusion that the same
>> machine that runs XP would suddenly lose those hardware BIOS feature if it
>> were to run FreeBSD.
>
> I'm jumping to no such conclusion.
Sure you did. You stated:
So you're saying that when I boot this machine into FreeBSD it does't
have this feature anymore?
Yet I had not made any such statement or even suggested anything of the
type. I had not even mentioned FreeBSD. I simply was talking about the
differences between a specific machine running XP (and, by extension, other
machines running XP) and Macs. The machines running XP have a "feature"
that the Macs do not.
> You are outright stating this and similar things for some reason, however. I
> can only assume its your ignorance that lets you believe this.
Keep in mind: I talked about a machine running XP that did something,
compared it to a Mac which would do something different... and you jumped to
the idea that the same machines that is running XP would do something
different if it were running FreeBSD. You tried to push that "idea" on to
me, but it was solely your idea - not mine.
>
>> This is whole incorrect, and such a bizarre jump does
>> not speak well of your computer knowledge.
>>
>>> And you actually wonder why I don't take you seriously when you claim to
>>> work on computers for a living?
>>
>> No, I do not really wonder why you would make such trolling comments. If
>> you would like to offer an explanation, though, feel free.
>
> Let me explain this to you slowly.
> When you first start up a PC it has a thing called a BIOS that
> performs some tasks.
>
> This BIOS thing has nothing whatsoever to do with the OS. This is the
> point that you are totally unaware of.
>
> The last thing the BIOS does is hand off control to an OS that it can
> go looking for in one of several different ways.
>
> Every single OS for the PC is not some variant of XP no matter how
> many times you say they are.
See, look at your miserable understanding of my comments. You are still
showing your ignorance... not in the fact that you are wrong about the BIOS
(you are not), but in that you did not understand my comments.
In any case, since you are clearly just trolling, and I am enjoying
responding, I moved our back and forth silliness to the correct thread. I
hope you understand.
If you have any non-trolling comments to make, please do so in the original
thread.
ZnU
Mayor of R'lyeh <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 12:18:00 -0500, ZnU <z...@acedsl.com> chose to
> bless us with the following wisdom:
>
> >In article <G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
> > "John Slade" <hitm...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> >> What the hell are you talking about? A floppy boot is not an oddity.
> >> It's quite common. In fact some of the most powerful tools for PCs come on
> >> floppy. Floppies on PCs added another way to boot the machine if the OS on
> >> the HD was dead. Most of that can be done with CDs now but floppies are
> >> still just as usefull.
> >>
> >> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> >> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run. So
> >> how can you say this is an XP problem? You don't know much about PCs do
> >> you?
> >
> >The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
> >primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
> >try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
> >hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> >boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
It looks like we've found another little inconsistency of the x86
platform then, because I've run across quite a few much newer machines
which don't do that.
--
"Free societies are hopeful societies. And free societies will be allies against
these hateful few who have no conscience, who kill at the whim of a hat."
--George W. Bush in Washington, D.C., Sept. 17, 2004
Tim Adams
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
> jegbs01bs6304tjd5...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:59 AM:
>
> > On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
> > chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
> >
> >> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
> >> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
> >>
> >>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
> >>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
> >>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
> >>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> >>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
> >>>
> >>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
> >>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
> >>
> >> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
> >>
> >> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
> >> running XP.
> >
> > What you're describing is something you made up.
>
> Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
> Are you really that ignorant about computers?
Modern PC DO have this 'feature'. To bad your attributed it to XP.
> >
> >>>>
> >>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
> >>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
> >>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
> >>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Tim
Snit
teadams$2$0$0$3-658FC3.15...@news1.east.earthlink.net on 12/19/04
1:47 PM:
> In article <BDEB1758.17B7F%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>> jegbs01bs6304tjd5...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:59 AM:
>>
>>> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 10:44:07 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
>>> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>>>
>>>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>>>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>>>
>>>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>>>
>>>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>>>
>>>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>>>>
>>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>>>> running XP.
>>>
>>> What you're describing is something you made up.
>>
>> Are you suggesting that modern PC's do not have the "feature" I describe?
>> Are you really that ignorant about computers?
>
> Modern PC DO have this 'feature'. To bad your attributed it to XP.
Yaaaaaaawn.
Nope... it is the BIOS. Macs do not have this problem. Many machines
running XP do.
It is that simple.
>
>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
--
Tim Adams
Mike <a...@def.ghi> wrote:
> In article <BDEB0BAD.17B67%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
> > The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
> > want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
>
> Then why was this an "XP woe"? Why not a "PC woe".
Because snit's brain dead
>
> > And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
> > users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
>
> It has been explained away. Set the BIOS properly and this "XP woe"
> goes away. Sorry if choices and flexibility confuse you.
>
> Mike
--
Tim
Snit
znu-CF7280.1...@individual.net on 12/19/04 1:44 PM:
The funny thing is not only are the Windows apologists not acknowledging
this - they are showing off their ignorance when they claim such machines do
not exist. I saw it on my customers HP and just tested it on Dell laptop.
Both got stuck on the floppy. Easy problem to get around... if you know
what you are doing... still... the point was that this oddity of a machine
running XP cost my customer weekend and emergency rates... and it is a
problem that does not exist on a Mac.
Snit
1:50 PM:
> In article <abc-05BCE5.1...@28-76.newscene.com>,
> Mike <a...@def.ghi> wrote:
>
>> In article <BDEB0BAD.17B67%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
>> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>>
>>> The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
>>> want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
>>
>> Then why was this an "XP woe"? Why not a "PC woe".
>
> Because snit's brain dead
Funny to see all the Windows apologists go into full troll mode when I point
out a machine running XP costing a client money... in a way that no Mac
would.
The more these trolls call me names and lie... the more we can see that they
are not able to face that very, very simple reality.
>
>>
>>> And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
>>> users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
>>
>> It has been explained away. Set the BIOS properly and this "XP woe"
>> goes away. Sorry if choices and flexibility confuse you.
>>
>> Mike
--
Dawg Tail
> In article <BDEAF3C9.17B2F%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>
>> "Ian" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in post b_ycnSRZ8dQ...@karoo.co.uk
>> on 12/18/04 5:20 PM:
>>
>> > Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with XP.
>>
>> Correct.
>
> I'm still waiting for one of these "XP problem" threads to actually have
> *something* to do with XP!
>
> First we had a CD drive failure, then we had some software update
> failure, now we have "XP wouldn't boot because someone left a floppy in
> the drive"!
>
> None of these situations have anything to do with XP. But in the
> world of "Mac Advocacy", *everything* is XP's fault!
It just goes to show you how biased and stupid some of these Mac advocates
are. This has nothing to do with XP yet Snit will argue to the end of time
that this is somehow Microsoft's fault!
Mayor of R'lyeh
You're problem is that you think anybody believes that you even have
any customers. Given your demonstrated knowledge of Windows no one
would ever call you twice.
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
news:BDEA1D73.17A70%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
> "John Slade" <hitm...@pacbell.net> wrote in post
> G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com on 12/18/04 5:35 PM:
>
> >
> > "Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> > news:BDEA072A.17A48%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
> >> Just came back from a customer's company. The owner had given me a
call in a
> >> deep, deep panic. He had someone install camera software onto his XP
> >> machine, and then the machine would not reboot.
> >>
> >> He called me - did not know the exact error message... and asked if I
could
> >> run over today... knowing he would have to pay both "emergency" and
weekend
> >> rates. I told him we could check a couple basic things over the
phone - but
> >> he wanted me there and nobody else to touch the computer.
> >>
> >> So I ran over... and ejected the floppy (I did suggest that to him on
the
> >> phone, but he was not going to let anyone touch the machine).
> >>
> >> Now you can blame the users - certainly they made a silly error. But
think
> >> about it... if they almost never use floppies (which is true) how would
they
> >> know about this oddity of most PC's? They were convinced it was a
virus in
> >> the camera software or something - and were too panicked to think
clearly.
> >>
> >
> > What the hell are you talking about? A floppy boot is not an oddity.
> > It's quite common. In fact some of the most powerful tools for PCs come
on
> > floppy. Floppies on PCs added another way to boot the machine if the OS
on
> > the HD was dead. Most of that can be done with CDs now but floppies are
> > still just as usefull.
>
> another drive?
> >
> > The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> > blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run.
So
> > how can you say this is an XP problem?
>
it
> was.
What is the name of the thread?
>
> > You don't know much about PCs do you?
>
> Enough to get paid nicely on a Saturday to eject a floppy. :)
The person you worked for is a fool.
John
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> 6:31 AM:
>
> > In article <mr-DC248F.12...@individual.net>,
> > Sandman <m...@sandman.net> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <BDEA1D73.17A70%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> >> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >>
> >>>> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You trying to
> >>>> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to
run. So
> >>>> how can you say this is an XP problem?
> >>>
> >>> It is not XP specific... and if you read what I wrote, I never
suggested it
> >>> was.
> >>
> >
> > He'd have to LEARN to read in order to do that.
>
> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
>
> Machine running XP.
>
> Problem not XP only.
>
Then why did you name it XP woes?
John
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> "Mike" <a...@def.ghi> wrote in post
>
> > In article <BDEAF719.17B37%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> > Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >
> >> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
> >>
> >> Machine running XP.
> >>
> >> Problem not XP only.
> >>
> >>
> >> Problem no exist on Macs.
> >>
> >> Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
> >
>
> So you are going to nit-pick that it is in reference to the machine that
is
> running XP and not just the OS itself... right?
> >
> > Repeating something does not make it true.
> >
> > The same problem would have happened had the machine been running Linux
> > or DOS or OS/2.
>
> Right... but not a Mac. It is a definite Mac advantage.
> >
> > IOW, It was not related to XP at all.
>
> It was related to the XP machine. Very much so.
> >
> > It's not even "PC related", because I have seen many PCs simply ignore
> > the non-bootable floppy and proceed to boot normally from the HD.
>
> Yes, PC's are inconsistent in this area... and others.
No they aren't. If you insert a blank floppy into any PC, it wont load an
OS off that floppy. It's a matter of logic.
John
Edwin
My guess is it has something to do with the coupius amount of lead
paint chips he consumed while he was a child...
John Slade
"ZnU" <z...@acedsl.com> wrote in message
news:znu-E79117.1...@individual.net...
> In article <G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
> "John Slade" <hitm...@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> > "Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> > blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to run.
So
you?
>
> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>
> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
As I have told you most PCs will do this as well. To any novice user the
ones that don't boot after a floppy fails, will realize the problem. This is
not a major issue to us in the computer repair and sales profession.
John
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>
> >> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
> >> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
> >> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> >> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
> >
> > both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>
Then you don't know what you're doing. Why is the make and model fo the
PC? If it's a white box, what is the make and model of the motherboard?
>
> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
> running XP.
This is a BIOS/CMOS issue and not an OS issue. If you knew what you
were doing, XP would never have entered into the conversation. Now look
everyone, this is the problem with these computer "experts" that don't get
proper training. First they call it a problem with the computer was designed
to work that way. They don't know it's a CMOS setting that governs this.
Thirdly this Snit person doesn't even know the difference between an OS
problem and CMOS settings. If I had this guy working under me, I would make
him study an A+ book and then give him a test myself. If he didn't want to
do that, he would be looking for another job.
John
John Slade
"Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
>
> >>>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
> >>>> running XP.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting
is, if
> >>>>>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot
from,
> >>>>>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other
devices.
> >>
a
> >> newpaper gig...what a joke....
> >
> > LOL! He asks a question none of you Maccies can answer so you hurl
> > names at him. The best part is that you can't even see how this
> > relates to his quote I use as a sig.
>
> He asks a question? What question? I pointed out a disadvantage of a
> machine running XP, and he claims I made it up... even though anyone with
> any technical sense and moderate computer experience has almost
undoubtedly
> seen the same "feature" I describe.
>
> Keep in mind: this whole debate is over a machine running XP that would
not
> boot because of a disk in the floppy drive. I commented about how Macs do
> not suffer from this weakness, and pointed out a specific example where
> someone running XP had to pay weekend and "emergency" rates to get around
> the silliness of this XP machine. Several Windows apologists jumped in
> claiming that since this would have happened even if the machine were
> running another OS (which is correct) that somehow this makes machines
> running XP look better. The fact is, using a PC running Windows cost my
> client standard labor costs plus the double whammy of weekend / emergency
> rates... which would *never* have happened on a Mac.
>
> The next silly argument will be to blame the user... as if the user is at
> fault for the poor design / default configuration of the computer.
OK Snit. We can settle this once and for all. If you made it up or not
can be easily proven. All you have to do is tell us the make and model of
the computer or the make and model of the motherboard. Anything that is a
couple of months old will have online documentation to back up your claim.
Now are you going to ante up and prove your point or admit you made this
whole thing up?
The ball is in your court Snit. It's so so easy to prove all of us
wrong.
John
Tim Adams
Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> "Tim Adams" <teadams$2$0$0$3...@earthlink.net> wrote in post
> teadams$2$0$0$3-C879AF.15...@news1.east.earthlink.net on 12/19/04
> 1:50 PM:
>
> > In article <abc-05BCE5.1...@28-76.newscene.com>,
> > Mike <a...@def.ghi> wrote:
> >
> >> In article <BDEB0BAD.17B67%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> >> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >>
> >>> The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
> >>> want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
> >>
> >> Then why was this an "XP woe"? Why not a "PC woe".
> >
> > Because snit's brain dead
>
> Funny to see all the Windows apologists go into full troll mode when I point
> out a machine running XP costing a client money... in a way that no Mac
> would.
>
To bad it wasn't XP costing them money - just an incompetent person that
set up the system.
> The more these trolls call me names and lie... the more we can see that they
> are not able to face that very, very simple reality.
> >
> >>
> >>> And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
> >>> users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
> >>
> >> It has been explained away. Set the BIOS properly and this "XP woe"
> >> goes away. Sorry if choices and flexibility confuse you.
> >>
> >> Mike
--
Tim
John Slade
"Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:ndibs0p0t59jfbtv2...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 11:32:40 -0700, Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>
> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>
> >> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
> >>
> >>>
> >>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the
rather
> >>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured
to
> >>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the
internal
> >>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
> >>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
> >>>>
> >>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
> >>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
> >>>
> >>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
> >>>
> >>> running XP.
> >>
> >> What you're describing is something you made up.
> >
> >Are you really that ignorant about computers?
>
> unlike you actually work on machines as opposed to pretending that I
> do on Usenet.
> would imagine that it would still put up the old message which makes
> it 100% clear that you need to eject the floppy. Your story is a bunch
> of bullshit just like Polaski's.
>
Hey don't say that! I've issued a challenge to Snit all he has to do is
to get the make and model of the PC he's talking about. He said it was a
couple of months old. He could look into the BIOS and see the model of the
motherboard if it's a white box. I'm interested in finding out what company
made a new computer with this screwed up CMOS.
John
Steve Mackay
> "Tim Adams" <teadams$2$0$0$3...@earthlink.net> wrote in post
> teadams$2$0$0$3-658FC3.15...@news1.east.earthlink.net on 12/19/04
> 1:47 PM:
<snip>
>> Modern PC DO have this 'feature'. To bad your attributed it to
XP.
>
> Yaaaaaaawn.
>
> Nope... it is the BIOS. Macs do not have this problem. Many machines
> running XP do.
>
> It is that simple.
But, it really is irrelevent to what OS it's runing. The title should have
"been more PC woes", or "Clueless PC user needs help". Either one would
have been far more relevent to the situation. While
Steve Mackay
No, they are trying to shed some light on to the fact it has nothing to do
with Windows, and everything to do with PCs in general.
> - they are showing off their ignorance when they claim such machines do
> not exist. I saw it on my customers HP and just tested it on Dell
> laptop. Both got stuck on the floppy.
Sure, if you can't figure out how to eject a floppy, you'd be stuck<eye
roll>
> Easy problem to get around... if
> you know what you are doing...
Yup, it takes a ton of technical knowledge to eject a floppy :)
> still... the point was that this oddity
> of a machine running XP cost my customer weekend and emergency rates...
> and it is a problem that does not exist on a Mac.
But it still has nothing to do with XP. One of the Dells I have is runing
Linux, and will still do the same thing.
Snit
pan.2004.12.19....@dawg-bogus-tail.com on 12/19/04 2:07 PM:
Who said it was MS's fault?
Amazing how ignorant the Windows / PC apologists are...
The problem lead to a user of XP spending weekend + emergency rates to get a
problem solved. The problem would not have existed on a Mac.
Period. Yet look at all the Windows apologists running from the facts.
Hillarious!
--
If A = B and B = C, then A = C, except where void or prohibited by law.
Roy Santoro, Psycho Proverb Zone (http://snipurl.com/BurdenOfProof)
Snit
>> I haven't seen one that chokes on a nonbootable floppy for years. And
>> unlike you actually work on machines as opposed to pretending that I
>> do on Usenet.
>> And even if there is a modern BIOS that still stops on such a thing I
>> would imagine that it would still put up the old message which makes
>> it 100% clear that you need to eject the floppy. Your story is a bunch
>> of bullshit just like Polaski's.
>>
>
> Hey don't say that! I've issued a challenge to Snit all he has to do is
> to get the make and model of the PC he's talking about. He said it was a
> couple of months old. He could look into the BIOS and see the model of the
> motherboard if it's a white box. I'm interested in finding out what company
> made a new computer with this screwed up CMOS.
Do not have the model, but as I have said, it was an HP. I also wrote about
the Dell on my desk and gave the make and model... and it does the same
thing.
So both Dell and HP have, in your words, "screwed up" CMOS's. That was my
point... and add to it that *no* Mac is screwed up in the same way... and
the HP being "screwed up" this way was an expensive problem for the company
in question.
Really very, very simple.
Snit
> OK Snit. We can settle this once and for all. If you made it up or not
> can be easily proven. All you have to do is tell us the make and model of
> the computer or the make and model of the motherboard. Anything that is a
> couple of months old will have online documentation to back up your claim.
> Now are you going to ante up and prove your point or admit you made this
> whole thing up?
>
> The ball is in your court Snit. It's so so easy to prove all of us
> wrong.
One: I owe you no "proof" of how machines that run XP work. I assume you
are able to test them yourself.
Two: Do not have the model, but as I have said, it was an HP. I also wrote
about the Dell on my desk and gave the make and model... and it does the
same thing.
So both Dell and HP have, in your words from another post, "screwed up"
CMOS's. That was my point... and add to it that *no* Mac is screwed up in
the same way... and the HP being "screwed up" this way was an expensive
problem for the company in question.
Really very, very simple.
--
Edwin
>
> > In article <G14xd.309$5R....@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
> > "John Slade" <hitm...@pacbell.net> wrote:
> >
oddity.
> >> It's quite common. In fact some of the most powerful tools for PCs
come on
> >> floppy. Floppies on PCs added another way to boot the machine if
the OS on
> >> the HD was dead. Most of that can be done with CDs now but
floppies are
> >> still just as usefull.
> >>
> >> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You
trying to
> >> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to
run. So
> >> how can you say this is an XP problem? You don't know much about
PCs do you?
> >
> > The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the
rather
> > primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured
to
> > try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the
internal
> > hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try
to
> > boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
> >
> > internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting
is, if
> > a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot
from,
> > it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other
devices.
>
making, it
> is good to see it was quite clear...
That's the "point" you were trying to make by claiming a non-boot
floppy in the A: drive was a "problem" you were paid overtime to "fix?"
That was the "point" you were making by labeling normal BIOS operation
as "More XP woes...?"
ZnU is just trying to give you an escape hatch, but you already welded
it shut.
Snit
>
> "Snit" <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote in message
> news:BDEB0BF7.17B68%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID...
>> "Mayor of R'lyeh" <ev5...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
>> 5uebs0tgbmp6csbv8...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 10:34 AM:
>>
>>>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>>>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>>>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>>>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>>>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>>
>>> You need to get a newer computer. Even my old PII machine would skip
>>> both the floppy and the CD if nonbootable ones were present.
>>
>> The machine in question is just a couple months old.
>
> Then you don't know what you're doing. Why is the make and model fo the
> PC? If it's a white box, what is the make and model of the motherboard?
How many times are you going to ask... *after* I have told you the make and
model of a Dell that does this... and told you the original machine was an
HP?
Really... I would love to know.
>
>>
>> What you are describing is the inconsistency in the world of machines
>> running XP.
>
> This is a BIOS/CMOS issue and not an OS issue. If you knew what you
> were doing, XP would never have entered into the conversation.
The machine is running XP. You do realize that PC's can and often do run
XP, right?
> Now look everyone, this is the problem with these computer "experts" that
> don't get proper training. First they call it a problem with the computer was
> designed to work that way.
A problem being from bad design does not make the customer any happier...
they still had to pay. I do not have a "bad design" discount.
> They don't know it's a CMOS setting that governs this.
Why would the customer? The fact that I do does not give them a discount...
actually, if I had to do research, I may have given them some sort of
discount.
> Thirdly this Snit person doesn't even know the difference between an OS
> problem and CMOS settings. If I had this guy working under me, I would make
> him study an A+ book and then give him a test myself. If he didn't want to do
> that, he would be looking for another job.
None of your trolling makes this would have made the job one cent cheaper
for the customer...
You act like I did not know what my customer did not know. You are simply
trolling.
Steve Mackay
You may want to sit down for this one...
Snit isn't really lying on this one, at least I don't think he is. At
least on the Dell laptop, I know he isn't. On the HP, I dunno. I got a
fairly modern HP desktop at home, with a 2.7GHZ P4 that I'll try when I
get home.
Snit
1103495078.0...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com on 12/19/04 3:24 PM:
>> Thanks... with so many people not understanding the point I was making, it is
>> good to see it was quite clear...
>
> That's the "point" you were trying to make by claiming a non-boot
> floppy in the A: drive was a "problem" you were paid overtime to "fix?"
Overtime? Who mentioned overtime? What are you talking about?
> That was the "point" you were making by labeling normal BIOS operation
> as "More XP woes...?"
The fact that when people select to get an XP machine they often have to pay
more than those that have Macs. I provided a very clear example, and you
and the other Windows / PC apologists went ape shit. Really rather funny.
>
> ZnU is just trying to give you an escape hatch, but you already welded
> it shut.
--
Snit
pan.2004.12.19....@hotmail.com on 12/19/04 3:37 PM:
>> Hey don't say that! I've issued a challenge to Snit all he has to do is
>> to get the make and model of the PC he's talking about. He said it was a
>> couple of months old. He could look into the BIOS and see the model of the
>> motherboard if it's a white box. I'm interested in finding out what company
>> made a new computer with this screwed up CMOS.
>>
>> John
>
> You may want to sit down for this one...
>
> Snit isn't really lying on this one, at least I don't think he is. At
> least on the Dell laptop, I know he isn't. On the HP, I dunno. I got a
> fairly modern HP desktop at home, with a 2.7GHZ P4 that I'll try when I
> get home.
I even gave him the make and model on the Dell... do not know it for the
HP...
Snit
>> The real issue here isn't the usefulness of floppies, it's the rather
>> primitive way x86 machines handle boot devices. Most are configured to
>> try to boot from the floppy drive and the CD drive before the internal
>> hard drive. If an unbootable floppy or CD is present, they'll try to
>> boot from it, give an error message, and stop.
>>
>> Macs, in their default configuration, are set to boot from their
>> internal hard drives. But no matter what the boot device setting is, if
>> a Mac finds it can't boot from a device it has been told to boot from,
>> it won't just give up; it will see if it can boot from other devices.
>
> As I have told you most PCs will do this as well. To any novice user the
> ones that don't boot after a floppy fails, will realize the problem. This is
> not a major issue to us in the computer repair and sales profession.
I would not say it is a "major" issue... but my customer might disagree.
Snit
>>> It looks like we've found another little inconsistency of the x86
>>> platform then, because I've run across quite a few much newer machines
>>> which don't do that.
>>
>> The funny thing is not only are the Windows apologists not acknowledging
>> this
>
> No, they are trying to shed some light on to the fact it has nothing to do
> with Windows, and everything to do with PCs in general.
Which has never been in question.
>
>> - they are showing off their ignorance when they claim such machines do
>> not exist. I saw it on my customers HP and just tested it on Dell
>> laptop. Both got stuck on the floppy.
>
> Sure, if you can't figure out how to eject a floppy, you'd be stuck<eye
> roll>
And that is exactly where my customer found himself... and paid me to "fix"
the computer for him. Paid me weekend and emergency fees... which Edwin
calls "overtime" for reasons that are known only to him. :)
>
>> Easy problem to get around... if you know what you are doing...
>
> Yup, it takes a ton of technical knowledge to eject a floppy :)
More than many people have. They were stuck.
>
>> still... the point was that this oddity
>> of a machine running XP cost my customer weekend and emergency rates...
>> and it is a problem that does not exist on a Mac.
>
> But it still has nothing to do with XP. One of the Dells I have is runing
> Linux, and will still do the same thing.
Of course it will. But none of the Macs will.
Snit
Funny how you change the topic yet again...
Who mentioned blank floppies being able to actually boot a PC?
The topic was how the PC handles non-bootable floppies...
Snit
Machine running XP.
--
Picture of a tuna milkshake: http://snipurl.com/bh6q
Feel free to ask for the recipe.
Snit
>> It is not XP specific... and if you read what I wrote, I never suggested it
>> was.
>
> What is the name of the thread?
Can you not tell? Why ask such a foolish question?
>>> You don't know much about PCs do you?
>>
>> Enough to get paid nicely on a Saturday to eject a floppy. :)
>
> The person you worked for is a fool.
When it comes to running their computer - at least outside of specific
programs - yes... you are right. This was a foolish mistake.
Not any bigger than your mistake of not knowing the name of the thread!
But a mistake that cost them money they would not have had to spend if they
had a Mac.
Snit
nirbs05cbepr0j7s9...@4ax.com on 12/19/04 2:10 PM:
You think I care if *you* believe me... oh.
However you get around talking about the issue... you know... the "feature"
on the machine running XP that does not exist on Macs... the "feature" that
cost the customer money ...
That is what this is about... your lack of willingness to even acknowledge
such a thing.
Steve Mackay
> "Edwin" <thor...@juno.com> wrote in post
> 1103495078.0...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com on 12/19/04 3:24 PM:
>
>>> Thanks... with so many people not understanding the point I was making, it is
>>> good to see it was quite clear...
>>
>> That's the "point" you were trying to make by claiming a non-boot
>> floppy in the A: drive was a "problem" you were paid overtime to "fix?"
>
> Overtime? Who mentioned overtime? What are you talking about?
>
>> That was the "point" you were making by labeling normal BIOS operation
>> as "More XP woes...?"
>
> The fact that when people select to get an XP machine they often have to pay
> more than those that have Macs.
Stupidity is not an excuse for paying more for a Mac.
> I provided a very clear example, and you
> and the other Windows / PC apologists went ape shit. Really rather funny.
No you provided us with some humor about a stupid PC user. No more, no
less.
>>
>> ZnU is just trying to give you an escape hatch, but you already welded
>> it shut.
Eddie, I like that one. :)
Snit
>>> Modern PC DO have this 'feature'. To bad your attributed it to XP.
>>
>> Yaaaaaaawn.
>>
>> Nope... it is the BIOS. Macs do not have this problem. Many machines
>> running XP do.
>>
>> It is that simple.
>
> But, it really is irrelevent to what OS it's runing. The title should have
> "been more PC woes", or "Clueless PC user needs help". Either one would
> have been far more relevent to the situation. While
Yes, the subject line is open to nit picking. I suppose I could nit pick
your last "sentence"... the one that reads "While". The point of the post
was that the machine in question, a machine that runs XP, had to be "fixed"
in a way that no Mac would ever need to be fixed.
So if your point is that I could have titled the post better - sure... but
the silly trolls would have just found something else to deny. Look at them
now... some are claiming I am lying about what happened, and others are
saying that it is so obvious I should not have to even mention it... that
somehow my telling the trolls implies I think it is rare knowledge or
something of that nature.
Snit
3:10 PM:
>>>>> The comparison is with the whole machine - not just the OS's... or do you
>>>>> want to exclude all the silly one button mouse arguments. :)
>>>>
>>>> Then why was this an "XP woe"? Why not a "PC woe".
>>>
>>> Because snit's brain dead
>>
>> Funny to see all the Windows apologists go into full troll mode when I point
>> out a machine running XP costing a client money... in a way that no Mac
>> would.
>>
>
> To bad it wasn't XP costing them money - just an incompetent person that
> set up the system.
The system, I believe, came that way. I doubt the people who set it up have
ever even been in the BIOS settings.
They would have saved money with a Mac.
>
>
>> The more these trolls call me names and lie... the more we can see that they
>> are not able to face that very, very simple reality.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> And, I notice nobody has been able to explain away this weakness with a
>>>>> users experience with ... get this... an XP machine.
>>>>
>>>> It has been explained away. Set the BIOS properly and this "XP woe"
>>>> goes away. Sorry if choices and flexibility confuse you.
>>>>
>>>> Mike
--
Snit
> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:35:15 -0700, Snit wrote:
>
>> "Edwin" <thor...@juno.com> wrote in post
>> 1103495078.0...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com on 12/19/04 3:24 PM:
>>
>>>> Thanks... with so many people not understanding the point I was making, it
>>>> is
>>>> good to see it was quite clear...
>>>
>>> That's the "point" you were trying to make by claiming a non-boot
>>> floppy in the A: drive was a "problem" you were paid overtime to "fix?"
>>
>> Overtime? Who mentioned overtime? What are you talking about?
>>
>>> That was the "point" you were making by labeling normal BIOS operation
>>> as "More XP woes...?"
>>
>> The fact that when people select to get an XP machine they often have to pay
>> more than those that have Macs.
>
> Stupidity is not an excuse for paying more for a Mac.
No... intelligence / computer knowledge is generally what leads to getting a
Mac. And, as we all know, they are comparably priced, as the comparisons
show:
http://myweb.cableone.net/snit/csma/prices
And, yes, I know that the comparisons do not apply to csma trolls, so do not
bother reminding me.
>> I provided a very clear example, and you
>> and the other Windows / PC apologists went ape shit. Really rather funny.
>
> No you provided us with some humor about a stupid PC user. No more, no
> less.
You know nothing of the person, yet you call them stupid because they could
not interpret a poorly worded error on a machine with a silly "feature".
Dawg Tail
> "Dawg Tail" <da...@dawg-bogus-tail.com> wrote in post
> pan.2004.12.19....@dawg-bogus-tail.com on 12/19/04 2:07 PM:
>
>> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 11:41:04 -0600, Mike wrote:
>>
>>> In article <BDEAF3C9.17B2F%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
>>> Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "Ian" <nos...@nospam.com> wrote in post b_ycnSRZ8dQ...@karoo.co.uk
>>>> on 12/18/04 5:20 PM:
>>>>
>>>>> Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with XP.
>>>>
>>>> Correct.
>>>
>>> I'm still waiting for one of these "XP problem" threads to actually have
>>> *something* to do with XP!
>>>
>>> First we had a CD drive failure, then we had some software update
>>> failure, now we have "XP wouldn't boot because someone left a floppy in
>>> the drive"!
>>>
>>> None of these situations have anything to do with XP. But in the
>>> world of "Mac Advocacy", *everything* is XP's fault!
>>
>> It just goes to show you how biased and stupid some of these Mac advocates
>> are. This has nothing to do with XP yet Snit will argue to the end of time
>> that this is somehow Microsoft's fault!
>
> Who said it was MS's fault?
>
> Amazing how ignorant the Windows / PC apologists are...
>
> The problem lead to a user of XP spending weekend + emergency rates to get a
> problem solved.
The problem was that the user wanted someone onsite. If the user had
bothered to listen to you when you suggested that someone eject the
floppy then they wouldn't have incurred as much expense.
But one has to wonder why the user didn't listen to the advice that you
provided over the phone. Surely he trusted you enough to walk him through
pushing the eject button on the floppy drive.
> The problem would not have existed on a Mac.
Nope. But if this is the best you can come up with for Mac advocacy then
the Mac is in a lot worse shape than I previously thought.
> Period. Yet look at all the Windows apologists running from the facts.
The facts are that this had nothing to do with Windows. The fact that you
keep attributing it to Windows shows what lengths you're willing to go to
fault it.
> Hillarious!
Yes, your anti-Windows arguments are certainly that.
Jim Lee Jr.
<a...@def.ghi> wrote:
> I'm still waiting for one of these "XP problem" threads to actually have
> *something* to do with XP!
>
> First we had a CD drive failure, then we had some software update
> failure, now we have "XP wouldn't boot because someone left a floppy in
> the drive"!
>
> None of these situations have anything to do with XP. But in the
> world of "Mac Advocacy," *everything* is XP's fault!
>
> Mike
I blame a lot of the problems on stupid and lazy Windoze users and
stupid IT personnel.
Jim Lee Jr.
Tail <da...@dawg-bogus-tail.com> wrote:
> It just goes to show you how biased and stupid some of these Mac advocates
> are. This has nothing to do with XP yet Snit will argue to the end of time
> that this is somehow Microsoft's fault!
Damn right it is Microshaft's fault, for putting out a shoddy OS.
Edwin
You failed to answer his question. This is a BIOS issue, it has
nothing to do with XP.
Snit
>>>>>> Booting from a floppy is a capability of the BIOS - nothing to do with
>>>>>> XP.
>>>>>
>>>>> Correct.
>>>>
>>>> I'm still waiting for one of these "XP problem" threads to actually have
>>>> *something* to do with XP!
>>>>
>>>> First we had a CD drive failure, then we had some software update
>>>> failure, now we have "XP wouldn't boot because someone left a floppy in
>>>> the drive"!
>>>>
>>>> None of these situations have anything to do with XP. But in the
>>>> world of "Mac Advocacy", *everything* is XP's fault!
>>>
>>> It just goes to show you how biased and stupid some of these Mac advocates
>>> are. This has nothing to do with XP yet Snit will argue to the end of time
>>> that this is somehow Microsoft's fault!
>>
>> Who said it was MS's fault?
>>
>> Amazing how ignorant the Windows / PC apologists are...
>>
>> The problem lead to a user of XP spending weekend + emergency rates to get a
>> problem solved.
>
> The problem was that the user wanted someone onsite. If the user had
> bothered to listen to you when you suggested that someone eject the
> floppy then they wouldn't have incurred as much expense.
Actually, for such a short call they would not have paid a dime. For my
frequent customers I let an occasional couple minute call go without
charging... esp. for something so simple.
So yes, you are right... they should have listened. When I asked them why
they did not, they told me nobody ever uses the drive, and so even though I
repeatedly told them to check (and they told me they had!) nobody really
had. Grrrr... I should charge a dishonesty fee! :)
>
> But one has to wonder why the user didn't listen to the advice that you
> provided over the phone. Surely he trusted you enough to walk him through
> pushing the eject button on the floppy drive.
He was in such a panic that he was not able to listen to anything.
>
>> The problem would not have existed on a Mac.
>
> Nope. But if this is the best you can come up with for Mac advocacy then
> the Mac is in a lot worse shape than I previously thought.
Just telling about a real-case scenario. I will grant you that you are the
first person to comment on the issue and the real user end of the problem...
not their lack of knowledge, but their lack of doing what I told them to do
and they told me they had! That was foolish on their part. Does not mean
that Macs would even have let them get this far, though.
>
>> Period. Yet look at all the Windows apologists running from the facts.
>
> The facts are that this had nothing to do with Windows. The fact that you
> keep attributing it to Windows shows what lengths you're willing to go to
> fault it.
It is a part of the experience of working with Windows.
>
>> Hillarious!
>
> Yes, your anti-Windows arguments are certainly that.
Yawn. Hey, at least you got one thing right - the user was foolish to not
try the floppy when I told them to!
Snit
191220041716477434%peejs...@insightbb.com on 12/19/04 4:16 PM:
In this case it was not based on the OS, but the shoddy computers the OS
runs on.
Edwin
Snit wrote:
> "Sandman" <m...@sandman.net> wrote in post
> mr-DC248F.12...@individual.net on 12/19/04 4:54 AM:
>
> > In article <BDEA1D73.17A70%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> > Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >
> >>> The floppy boot is covered in basic computer literacy. You
trying to
> >>> blame this on XP is pretty pathetic. XP does not need a floppy to
run. So
> >>> how can you say this is an XP problem?
> >>
> >> It is not XP specific... and if you read what I wrote, I never
suggested it
> >> was.
> >
> > Incorrect. Read the title of the thread you created, Michael.
>
>
> Machine running XP.
>
> Problem not XP only.
>
Not a problem anywhere. It's a PC. It only becomes an "XP machine"
once it gets past the BIOS routines and starts booting XP.
> Problem no exist on Macs.
Problem no exist on PCs either.
> Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
Damn right you can't! I'm not paying overtime rates to a swindler
like you.
Jonas is yet another Mac advocate who's telling you you're incompetent
WRT to PCs. You've united Mac Advocate and PC Advocate in common
cause.
Snit
>>>> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
>>>>
>>>> Machine running XP.
>>>>
>>>> Problem not XP only.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Then why did you name it XP woes?
>>
>> Machine running XP.
>
> You failed to answer his question. This is a BIOS issue, it has
> nothing to do with XP.
>
Nobody has suggested it is not a BIOS issue. Sure, the subject line is
nit-pickable... OK... you got me on that one... my subject line could have
made it more clear I was talking about the experience of an XP user and not
the OS itself. Oh my!
But only Dawg has really commented on the error itself, and even then he
pointed to the error the user made and ignored the error of the machine.
Snit
>> Here, short sentences to help you understand:
>>
>> Machine running XP.
>>
>> Problem not XP only.
>>
>> Problem on XP machine.
>
> Not a problem anywhere. It's a PC. It only becomes an "XP machine"
> once it gets past the BIOS routines and starts booting XP.
The computer is used with XP. That is what I mean be an "XP machine". Is
that something you still do not understand?
>
>> Problem no exist on Macs.
>
> Problem no exist on PCs either.
Sure it does... you just said it was the PC and not the OS.
>
>> Easy enough for you to understand. If not, well, I can not help you.
>
> Damn right you can't! I'm not paying overtime rates to a swindler
> like you.
You keep talking about overtime. What overtime? What are you talking
about?
For that matter, you call me a swindler, but can not suggest a thing I could
have done differently. Why is that?
>
> Jonas is yet another Mac advocate who's telling you you're incompetent
> WRT to PCs. You've united Mac Advocate and PC Advocate in common
> cause.
LOL... all this fuss over a poorly designed / configured PC that runs XP.
Edwin
Snit wrote:
> "Mike" <a...@def.ghi> wrote in post
> abc-911E74.1...@28-76.newscene.com on 12/19/04 11:05 AM:
>
> > In article <BDEAF719.17B37%SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID>,
> > Snit <SN...@CABLE0NE.NET.INVALID> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Machine running XP.
> >>
> >> Problem not XP only.
> >>
> >> Problem on XP machine.
> >>
> >>
you.
> >
>
> So you are going to nit-pick that it is in reference to the machine
that is
> running XP and not just the OS itself... right?
That's not a "nit-pick." This has nothing to do with Windows XP.
> > Repeating something does not make it true.
> >
> > The same problem would have happened had the machine been running
Linux
> > or DOS or OS/2.
>
> Right... but not a Mac. It is a definite Mac advantage.
How can a machine with no floppy drive have an advantage in how it
handles floppy disks?
> > IOW, It was not related to XP at all.
>
> It was related to the XP machine. Very much so.
> >
> > It's not even "PC related", because I have seen many PCs simply
ignore
> > the non-bootable floppy and proceed to boot normally from the HD.
>
> Yes, PC's are inconsistent in this area... and others.
So newer PCs have eliminated the "problem" you're whining about, but
instead of admitting that what you're complaining about has been fixed,
you label the fix as an "inconsistency?" Wierd.
> > I hope those were short enough sentences for *you*.
>
> Sure, you do not get that OS's run on hardware, and want to nitpick
instead
> of addressing the point. I have pointed out a clear Mac advantage...
and it
> is pissing you off.
For some reason, Mac Advocates are also "pissed off" at you over this.
Yet you remain oblivious to how stupid you're being.
So first Maccies tell us computers don't need a floppy drive, then you
start a thread to 'prove' how the Mac handles floppy disks is an
"advantage?"
Steve Mackay
> "Steve Mackay" <steve_...@hotmail.com> wrote in post
> pan.2004.12.19....@hotmail.com on 12/19/04 3:52 PM:
>
>> On Sun, 19 Dec 2004 15:35:15 -0700, Snit wrote:
>>
>>> "Edwin" <thor...@juno.com> wrote in post
>>> 1103495078.0...@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com on 12/19/04 3:24 PM:
>>>
>>>>> Thanks... with so many people not understanding the point I was making, it
>>>>> is
>>>>> good to see it was quite clear...
>>>>
>>>> That's the "point" you were trying to make by claiming a non-boot
>>>> floppy in the A: drive was a "problem" you were paid overtime to "fix?"
>>>
>>> Overtime? Who mentioned overtime? What are you talking about?
>>>
>>>> That was the "point" you were making by labeling normal BIOS operation
>>>> as "More XP woes...?"
>>>
>>> The fact that when people select to get an XP machine they often have to pay
>>> more than those that have Macs.
>>
>> Stupidity is not an excuse for paying more for a Mac.
>
> No... intelligence / computer knowledge is generally what leads to getting a
> Mac. And, as we all know, they are comparably priced, as the comparisons
> show:
>
> http://myweb.cableone.net/snit/csma/prices
ROFLMA!
>
> And, yes, I know that the comparisons do not apply to csma trolls, so do not
> bother reminding me.
They just don't apply to current reality either.
>
>>> I provided a very clear example, and you
>>> and the other Windows / PC apologists went ape shit. Really rather funny.
>>
>> No you provided us with some humor about a stupid PC user. No more, no
>> less.
>
> You know nothing of the person, yet you call them stupid because they could
> not interpret a poorly worded error on a machine with a silly "feature".
Allright, ignorant.