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New Toshiba laptop with Windows 7
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Yousuf Khan
Feb 3, 2012, 2:52:41 PM2/3/12
to
I bought a new Toshiba Satellite laptop with Windows 7 installed. The
moment I opened it up, it went into its automatic setup procedure and
installed Windows 7 from a recovery partition. There weren't many
options available during setup (choose 32-bit or 64-bit Windows 7,
choose your language, and that's about it). It ended up creating the
following disk structure on the drive:
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/759/capturediskman.jpg
Well, I was about to go and repartition it to my own preferences, when I
discovered that all 4 primary partitions were taken up by the Toshiba
setup. The first partition is 1.46GB is listed as the recovery
partition, but it's probably a boot manager partition. Then there is the
last partition, 527.65GB, which is the actual Windows partition. Then
there are two mysterious hidden partitions, 24.44GB & 13.19GB,
respectively. I called up Toshiba support to ask them what these were.
They said that the 13.19GB partition is the place where they actually
store the recovery data. The 24.44GB partition according to them is
reserved for the volume shadow copy service (VSS), I think.
Now, I have another machine running Windows 7, a desktop PC, and it
doesn't have this separate partition for volume shadow copies. It has a
retail version of Windows 7 Ultimate installed. I believe it stores the
shadow copies directly within the same volume it's shadowing.
I'm trying to reduce the size of the boot partition and free up space to
add a Linux partition for dual-boot. But with the first 4 entries
already used up in the primary partition table, I can't even add an
extended partition for Linux to reside in. Thinking what the
consequences of removing the VSS partition will be? I think VSS should
work fine with or without the separate partition. Toshiba obviously said
that they suggest leaving everything alone the way it is now, but of
course they would say that. What's the opinion here?
Yousuf Khan
moment I opened it up, it went into its automatic setup procedure and
installed Windows 7 from a recovery partition. There weren't many
options available during setup (choose 32-bit or 64-bit Windows 7,
choose your language, and that's about it). It ended up creating the
following disk structure on the drive:
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/759/capturediskman.jpg
Well, I was about to go and repartition it to my own preferences, when I
discovered that all 4 primary partitions were taken up by the Toshiba
setup. The first partition is 1.46GB is listed as the recovery
partition, but it's probably a boot manager partition. Then there is the
last partition, 527.65GB, which is the actual Windows partition. Then
there are two mysterious hidden partitions, 24.44GB & 13.19GB,
respectively. I called up Toshiba support to ask them what these were.
They said that the 13.19GB partition is the place where they actually
store the recovery data. The 24.44GB partition according to them is
reserved for the volume shadow copy service (VSS), I think.
Now, I have another machine running Windows 7, a desktop PC, and it
doesn't have this separate partition for volume shadow copies. It has a
retail version of Windows 7 Ultimate installed. I believe it stores the
shadow copies directly within the same volume it's shadowing.
I'm trying to reduce the size of the boot partition and free up space to
add a Linux partition for dual-boot. But with the first 4 entries
already used up in the primary partition table, I can't even add an
extended partition for Linux to reside in. Thinking what the
consequences of removing the VSS partition will be? I think VSS should
work fine with or without the separate partition. Toshiba obviously said
that they suggest leaving everything alone the way it is now, but of
course they would say that. What's the opinion here?
Yousuf Khan
Tony
Feb 3, 2012, 3:12:07 PM2/3/12
to
So just format that 24.44GB partition and throw another operating system on
it.
--
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Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city
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Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs but got fired the first day
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Bur-ring, i'll get this one: WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM JERK!!? We're here to help
you dickweed, ok, ok give the power cord the jiggily piggily wiggily all the
while pushing the power button repeatedly now take everything out of your
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I hate them both, With useless bogus bullshit you need at least *three*
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I'm a fulltime text *only* man on usenet now. The rest of the world
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VBB = Volume based billing. How many bytes can we shove down your throat and
out your arse sir?
UBB = User based bullFROGGING
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Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions beyond
the realm of understandability
Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday
This sig file was compiled via my journeys through usenet
it.
The Grandmaster of the CyberFROG
Come get your ticket to CyberFROG city
Nay, Art thou decideth playeth ye simpleton games. *Some* of us know proper
manners
Very few. I used to take calls from *rank* noobs but got fired the first day
on the job for potty mouth,
Bur-ring, i'll get this one: WHAT'S YOUR PROBLEM JERK!!? We're here to help
you dickweed, ok, ok give the power cord the jiggily piggily wiggily all the
while pushing the power button repeatedly now take everything out of your
computer except the power supply and *one* stick of ram. Ok get the next
sucker on the phone.
Deirdre Straughan (Roxio) is a LIAR (Deirdre McFibber)
There's the employer and the employee and the FROGGER and the FROGEE, which
one are you?
Hamster isn't a newsreader it's a mistake!
El-Gonzo Jackson FROGS both me and Chuckcar (I just got EL-FROG-OED!!)
I hate them both, With useless bogus bullshit you need at least *three*
fulltime jobs to afford either one of them
I'm a fulltime text *only* man on usenet now. The rest of the world
downloads the binary files not me i can't afford thousands of dollars a
month
VBB = Volume based billing. How many bytes can we shove down your throat and
out your arse sir?
UBB = User based bullFROGGING
Master Juba was a black man imitating a white man imitating a black man
Using my technical prowess and computer abilities to answer questions beyond
the realm of understandability
Regards Tony... Making usenet better for everyone everyday
This sig file was compiled via my journeys through usenet
Ed Cryer
Feb 3, 2012, 4:21:15 PM2/3/12
to
Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there make a
note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
and install.
Ed
Ed Light
Feb 3, 2012, 9:01:20 PM2/3/12
to
With Bootit Bare Metal partition & boot manager, you can have lots of
primary partitions, but of course, only 4 active for one boot choice.
I think you can only have one active extended partition, but of course
with lots of volumes, any of which you can hide for a boot choice.
It comes with an imaging program built in.
PS Once you don't limit primary partitions, you must use only Bootit to
alter partitions.
--
Ed Light
Better World News TV Channel:
http://realnews.com
Iraq Veterans Against the War and Related:
http://ivaw.org
http://couragetoresist.org
http://antiwar.com
Send spam to the FTC at
sp...@uce.gov
Thanks, robots.
primary partitions, but of course, only 4 active for one boot choice.
I think you can only have one active extended partition, but of course
with lots of volumes, any of which you can hide for a boot choice.
It comes with an imaging program built in.
PS Once you don't limit primary partitions, you must use only Bootit to
alter partitions.
--
Ed Light
Better World News TV Channel:
http://realnews.com
Iraq Veterans Against the War and Related:
http://ivaw.org
http://couragetoresist.org
http://antiwar.com
Send spam to the FTC at
sp...@uce.gov
Thanks, robots.
Ed Light
Feb 3, 2012, 9:04:41 PM2/3/12
to
PS re Bootit.
The way I use it on my netbook is, I have an extended partition with
various data volumes, then of course there's the factory restore
partition, and the Bootit partition. I shrunk the original C: partition
way down to 30 Gigs, and I have a copy of it as an alternate. I have
images of C: in a volume that I update when changes are made to C:, so I
can pull out of any difficulties by restoring, and the data is
untouched, being on the volumes.
Ta da!
On the bootit site there are faq's about linux, plus there's a great
newsgroup where you get really quick answers.
It's a very geeky program.
bootitng.com
The way I use it on my netbook is, I have an extended partition with
various data volumes, then of course there's the factory restore
partition, and the Bootit partition. I shrunk the original C: partition
way down to 30 Gigs, and I have a copy of it as an alternate. I have
images of C: in a volume that I update when changes are made to C:, so I
can pull out of any difficulties by restoring, and the data is
untouched, being on the volumes.
Ta da!
On the bootit site there are faq's about linux, plus there's a great
newsgroup where you get really quick answers.
It's a very geeky program.
bootitng.com
a1pcfixer
Feb 3, 2012, 10:42:09 PM2/3/12
to
Ed,
> With Bootit Bare Metal partition & boot manager
Might help to give a link<g>
http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/index.htm
> With Bootit Bare Metal partition & boot manager
http://www.terabyteunlimited.com/index.htm
Yousuf Khan
Feb 3, 2012, 10:50:48 PM2/3/12
to
On 03/02/2012 4:21 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:
> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>
> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there make a
> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
> and install.
Neither of the two mystery partitions seem to be NTFS or FAT-formatted.
> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>
> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there make a
> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
> and install.
They seem to be proprietary.
Yousuf Khan
Rod Speed
Feb 4, 2012, 1:38:24 AM2/4/12
to
Andy goes into quite a bit of detail with his Toshiba Satellite
and its likely using the same setup as yours.
With his, those two partitions are for the diskless
restore and what creates the restore CDs,
I thought he might reply to you but then I remember that
his Toshiba Satellite has just gone back to Toshiba for
hard drive replacement and thats the only real PC he has.
Paul
Feb 4, 2012, 2:56:14 AM2/4/12
to
If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
Another way to attempt to identify a partition like that, is with "Disktype".
http://disktype.sourceforge.net/
To get that, you can boot a Ubuntu CD, open Synaptic Package manager,
enable all the repositories, reload the repository info (lots of downloads,
takes a minute or so), then in Synaptic package manager you can install
the "disktype" package. Once in there, open a Terminal window and type
sudo disktype /dev/sda2
That would check the second partition of hard drive "sda". It will
then attempt to identify the partition type. The tool will even
accept a file which holds a file system (like if you "dd" dump a
partition into a file, if you feed it the file, it can also say
what the file system is).
As far as I know, there isn't a Windows version of "disktype". I see
on the info page, it mentions Cygwin, but I don't have that here.
HTH,
Paul
Yousuf Khan
Feb 4, 2012, 5:30:26 PM2/4/12
to
either? I see the other thread in *.storage now. Looks like Andy Hancock
had an almost identical sized hard disk as mine, it was setup in the
same way.
Anyways, it looks like I may have gotten my answer from Toshiba. When I
called them, I expected to get the run-around from them, and they did
for a while. They told me what the two mystery partitions are for: (1)
recovery, and (2) Volume Shadow Service. But according to the other
thread, they are for recovery, and language packs. I think the language
packs makes more sense to me than the Volume Shadow Service. I then
called them back and asked them to send me to their second-line
engineers. And I told the second-line guy, point blank that I needed to
install Linux on the box, and that he needed to tell me which of the
partitions can be removed after backing up. So he figured I knew what I
was doing, and so he told me that the 13 GB parition is the recovery
partition, and that it can be backed up to DVD's and removed later.
Toshiba furnishes an utility called the Toshiba Recovery Media Creator,
which does the imaging for you. When the utility first starts, it asks
you which language pack you want to back up (the choices are English and
French in Canada, of course). You have to back up each language in
separate actions, so you can do that, or just backup the one that's most
relevant to you.
Yousuf Khan
Yousuf Khan
Feb 4, 2012, 5:48:04 PM2/4/12
to
On 02/04/2012 02:56 AM, Paul wrote:
> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>> On 03/02/2012 4:21 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:
>>> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>>>
>>> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there make a
>>> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
>>> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
>>> and install.
>>
>> Neither of the two mystery partitions seem to be NTFS or
>> FAT-formatted. They seem to be proprietary.
>>
>> Yousuf Khan
>
> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>
> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
Ah great, this worked thanks! The 4 partitions were type respectively:
> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>> On 03/02/2012 4:21 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:
>>> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>>>
>>> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there make a
>>> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
>>> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
>>> and install.
>>
>> Neither of the two mystery partitions seem to be NTFS or
>> FAT-formatted. They seem to be proprietary.
>>
>> Yousuf Khan
>
> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>
> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
27, 07, 17, and 17.
Type 27 is listed as a PQservice partition, which is either FAT32 or
NTFS (it is NTFS in this case). It's apparently used by Acer and other
OEMs as a hidden rescue partition.
Type 07 is standard NTFS (it can also be HPFS, and exFAT).
Type 17 is listed as a Hidden IFS, e.g. possibly HPFS.
http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/partitions/partition_types-1.html
> Another way to attempt to identify a partition like that, is with
> "Disktype".
>
> http://disktype.sourceforge.net/
>
> To get that, you can boot a Ubuntu CD, open Synaptic Package manager,
> enable all the repositories, reload the repository info (lots of downloads,
> takes a minute or so), then in Synaptic package manager you can install
> the "disktype" package. Once in there, open a Terminal window and type
>
> sudo disktype /dev/sda2
>
> That would check the second partition of hard drive "sda". It will
> then attempt to identify the partition type. The tool will even
> accept a file which holds a file system (like if you "dd" dump a
> partition into a file, if you feed it the file, it can also say
> what the file system is).
>
> As far as I know, there isn't a Windows version of "disktype". I see
> on the info page, it mentions Cygwin, but I don't have that here.
on this machine. :)
Yousuf Khan
Paul
Feb 4, 2012, 7:30:49 PM2/4/12
to
Yousuf Khan wrote:
> On 02/04/2012 02:56 AM, Paul wrote:
>> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>>> On 03/02/2012 4:21 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:
>>>> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>>>>
>>>> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there
>>>> make a
>>>> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
>>>> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
>>>> and install.
>>>
>>> Neither of the two mystery partitions seem to be NTFS or
>>> FAT-formatted. They seem to be proprietary.
>>>
>>> Yousuf Khan
>>
>> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
>> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>>
>> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
>>
>
> Ah great, this worked thanks! The 4 partitions were type respectively:
> 27, 07, 17, and 17.
>
> Type 27 is listed as a PQservice partition, which is either FAT32 or
> NTFS (it is NTFS in this case). It's apparently used by Acer and other
> OEMs as a hidden rescue partition.
>
> Type 07 is standard NTFS (it can also be HPFS, and exFAT).
>
> Type 17 is listed as a Hidden IFS, e.g. possibly HPFS.
>
> http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/partitions/partition_types-1.html
>
I'd bet they were all NTFS, given the situation.
> On 02/04/2012 02:56 AM, Paul wrote:
>> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>>> On 03/02/2012 4:21 PM, Ed Cryer wrote:
>>>> My new Acer doesn't have the VSS partition; Win7 HP 64-bit.
>>>>
>>>> Give it a letter, take a look inside it. If there's nothing there
>>>> make a
>>>> note of the exact size in case you need to recreate it, then remove it.
>>>> Reduce the C partition by as much as you need, create your Linux one,
>>>> and install.
>>>
>>> Neither of the two mystery partitions seem to be NTFS or
>>> FAT-formatted. They seem to be proprietary.
>>>
>>> Yousuf Khan
>>
>> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
>> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>>
>> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
>>
>
> Ah great, this worked thanks! The 4 partitions were type respectively:
> 27, 07, 17, and 17.
>
> Type 27 is listed as a PQservice partition, which is either FAT32 or
> NTFS (it is NTFS in this case). It's apparently used by Acer and other
> OEMs as a hidden rescue partition.
>
> Type 07 is standard NTFS (it can also be HPFS, and exFAT).
>
> Type 17 is listed as a Hidden IFS, e.g. possibly HPFS.
>
> http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/partitions/partition_types-1.html
>
>> Another way to attempt to identify a partition like that, is with
>> "Disktype".
>
> Well, the whole problem started as a result of trying to install Linux
> on this machine. :)
>
> Yousuf Khan
You can "install" packages when using the LiveCD - it's just wasteful
> on this machine. :)
>
> Yousuf Khan
(not persistent). The files end up on the ram based file system, while
you're using them. (There are some persistent options as well, but
that's another story, and more of a nuisance.)
I'm kinda curious, whether you could make an Extended partition (leaving
room for three primaries), then shift some of that stuff into logical
partitions ? If the small 1.4GB partition is what Windows 7 boots from,
perhaps C: can actually be a logical. Then, it's a question of whether
one of those hidden partitions can be moved into a logical as well. Perhaps
you can free up enough primaries, to end up with a spare you can use for
Linux. (The Toshiba software might not be too happy about that though, if
you ever need to restore to factory config - some restore packages insist
on the same partition scheme as was there originally, before they'll run.)
As for the idea of a separate VSS Cache partition, I thought that was only
supported on server OSes. I wanted to do that (move the VSS Cache stuff
off C:), but when I read up on it, I got the impression Windows 7 desktop
didn't include code to do it.
Paul
Yousuf Khan
Feb 6, 2012, 5:19:30 PM2/6/12
to
On 04/02/2012 7:30 PM, Paul wrote:
> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>> On 02/04/2012 02:56 AM, Paul wrote:
>>> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
>>> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>>>
>>> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
>>>
>>
>> Ah great, this worked thanks! The 4 partitions were type respectively:
>> 27, 07, 17, and 17.
>>
>> Type 27 is listed as a PQservice partition, which is either FAT32 or
>> NTFS (it is NTFS in this case). It's apparently used by Acer and other
>> OEMs as a hidden rescue partition.
>>
>> Type 07 is standard NTFS (it can also be HPFS, and exFAT).
>>
>> Type 17 is listed as a Hidden IFS, e.g. possibly HPFS.
>>
>> http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/partitions/partition_types-1.html
>>
>
> I'd bet they were all NTFS, given the situation.
It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
> Yousuf Khan wrote:
>> On 02/04/2012 02:56 AM, Paul wrote:
>>> Use PTEDIT32 and get the partition type fields ?
>>> If run in Win7, use Run As Administrator, or you might see an "Error 5".
>>>
>>> ftp://ftp.symantec.com/public/english_us_canada/tools/pq/utilities/PTEDIT32.zip
>>>
>>
>> Ah great, this worked thanks! The 4 partitions were type respectively:
>> 27, 07, 17, and 17.
>>
>> Type 27 is listed as a PQservice partition, which is either FAT32 or
>> NTFS (it is NTFS in this case). It's apparently used by Acer and other
>> OEMs as a hidden rescue partition.
>>
>> Type 07 is standard NTFS (it can also be HPFS, and exFAT).
>>
>> Type 17 is listed as a Hidden IFS, e.g. possibly HPFS.
>>
>> http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/partitions/partition_types-1.html
>>
>
> I'd bet they were all NTFS, given the situation.
diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical Disk
Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on the Type 17
partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type 27 partition,
even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS. And of course, it
recognized the filesystem on the type 07 partition, which is a
completely unhidden standard partition.
> I'm kinda curious, whether you could make an Extended partition (leaving
> room for three primaries), then shift some of that stuff into logical
> partitions ? If the small 1.4GB partition is what Windows 7 boots from,
> perhaps C: can actually be a logical. Then, it's a question of whether
> one of those hidden partitions can be moved into a logical as well. Perhaps
> you can free up enough primaries, to end up with a spare you can use for
> Linux. (The Toshiba software might not be too happy about that though, if
> you ever need to restore to factory config - some restore packages insist
> on the same partition scheme as was there originally, before they'll run.)
able to read that partition is Toshiba`s own disk imaging utility. I
suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility, but
then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
> As for the idea of a separate VSS Cache partition, I thought that was only
> supported on server OSes. I wanted to do that (move the VSS Cache stuff
> off C:), but when I read up on it, I got the impression Windows 7 desktop
> didn't include code to do it.
is a VSS partition is. Besides, a 24GB partition seems awfully large for
a VSS partition, doesn't it? The only thing I've seen that uses the VSS
system regularly is my backup/imaging program (in my case it's Macrium
Reflect, but it could be Acronis TrueImage, or whatever). During the
time that the imager is working I doubt you're going to get 1GB of
changes happening in the background, let alone 24GB!
Yousuf Khan
Mike Tomlinson
Feb 6, 2012, 10:36:39 PM2/6/12
to
En el artículo <4f3051e7$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical Disk
>Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on the Type 17
>partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type 27 partition,
>even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
What does TestDisk say?
http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
> I
>suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility, but
>then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
>machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
use a live CD.
--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical Disk
>Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on the Type 17
>partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type 27 partition,
>even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
> I
>suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility, but
>then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
>machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")
Yousuf Khan
Feb 7, 2012, 9:43:25 AM2/7/12
to
On 06/02/2012 10:36 PM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
> En el artículo<4f3051e7$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
> <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>
>> It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>> diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical Disk
>> Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on the Type 17
>> partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type 27 partition,
>> even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
>
> What does TestDisk say?
>
> http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
> En el artículo<4f3051e7$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
> <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>
>> It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>> diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical Disk
>> Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on the Type 17
>> partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type 27 partition,
>> even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
>
> What does TestDisk say?
>
> http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
>> I
>> suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility, but
>> then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
>> machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
>
> use a live CD.
file system, which usually means the internal hard disk.
Yousuf Khan
Paul
Feb 7, 2012, 11:39:38 AM2/7/12
to
http://disktype.sourceforge.net/
Available from Synaptic Package Manager, if you have all
repositories turned on.
Paul
Mike Tomlinson
Feb 7, 2012, 12:56:25 PM2/7/12
to
En el artículo <4f31387a$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
there's your answer then.
TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
>You'd still need to be able to store the image file on a large enough
>file system, which usually means the internal hard disk.
What's wrong with using an external USB disk?
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
>You'd still need to be able to store the image file on a large enough
>file system, which usually means the internal hard disk.
Rod Speed
Feb 7, 2012, 3:02:14 PM2/7/12
to
Yousuf Khan wrote
> Mike Tomlinson wrote
>> Yousuf Khan <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> wrote
>>> It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>>> diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical
>>> Disk Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on
>>> the Type 17 partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type
>>> 27 partition, even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
>> What does TestDisk say?
>> http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>>> I suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility,
>>> but then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
>>> machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
>> use a live CD.
> You'd still need to be able to store the image file on a large enough
> file system, which usually means the internal hard disk.
Nope, the better live CDs can store on an external drive fine.
> Mike Tomlinson wrote
>> Yousuf Khan <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> wrote
>>> It's probable, but when I used the command-line based Windows util,
>>> diskpart.exe (which I assume is more powerful than the graphical
>>> Disk Management utility), it couldn't recognize the filesystem on
>>> the Type 17 partitions. I did recognize the filesystem on the type
>>> 27 partition, even though that's also considered a hidden NTFS.
>> What does TestDisk say?
>> http://www.cgsecurity.org/wiki/TestDisk
> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>>> I suppose I could read it raw with the Unix/Linux-based DD utility,
>>> but then I need to clear off this partition to even get Unix on this
>>> machine. Lotsa catch-22's.
>> use a live CD.
> You'd still need to be able to store the image file on a large enough
> file system, which usually means the internal hard disk.
Yousuf Khan
Feb 8, 2012, 11:52:23 PM2/8/12
to
On 07/02/2012 12:56 PM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
> En el artículo<4f31387a$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
> <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>
>> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>
> there's your answer then.
>
> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
> it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
> that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
> En el artículo<4f31387a$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
> <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>
>> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>
> there's your answer then.
>
> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
> it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
> that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
with my imaging program.
Yousuf Khan
Arno
Feb 9, 2012, 3:14:18 AM2/9/12
to
In comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage Yousuf Khan <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> wrote:
> On 07/02/2012 12:56 PM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
>> En el art?culo<4f31387a$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
> On 07/02/2012 12:56 PM, Mike Tomlinson wrote:
>> <bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribi?:
>>
>>> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>>
>> there's your answer then.
>>
>> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
>> it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
>> that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
> I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
> with my imaging program.
> Yousuf Khan
If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
>>> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>>
>> there's your answer then.
>>
>> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS,
>> it should be able to produce a list of files for you. That'll confirm
>> that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
> I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
> with my imaging program.
> Yousuf Khan
Arno
--
Arno Wagner, Dr. sc. techn., Dipl. Inform., CISSP -- Email: ar...@wagner.name
GnuPG: ID: 1E25338F FP: 0C30 5782 9D93 F785 E79C 0296 797F 6B50 1E25 338F
----
Cuddly UI's are the manifestation of wishful thinking. -- Dylan Evans
Mike Tomlinson
Feb 9, 2012, 3:26:21 AM2/9/12
to
En el artículo <4f3350c5$1...@news.bnb-lp.com>, Yousuf Khan
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
>it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
>with my imaging program.
Just changing the partition type should not be data-destructive, but if
you're ultra-cautious, as a precaution you could make an image of the
partition elsewhere and change the type on that to 07, then see if it
appears as a normal NTFS filesystem.
<bbb...@spammenot.yahoo.com> escribió:
>I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
>it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
>with my imaging program.
you're ultra-cautious, as a precaution you could make an image of the
partition elsewhere and change the type on that to 07, then see if it
appears as a normal NTFS filesystem.
Rod Speed
Feb 9, 2012, 4:20:48 AM2/9/12
to
>>> It says both are "hid HPFS/NTFS"
>> there's your answer then.
>> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS, it should be able to produce a list of files
>> for you. That'll confirm that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
> I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
> with my imaging program.
Any decent imaging program can back it up regardless of whether it recognised the file system or not.
>> there's your answer then.
>> TestDisk has a 'file browser' built-in. If those partitions are NTFS, it should be able to produce a list of files
>> for you. That'll confirm that they are NTFS format and not some Toshiba proprietary format.
> I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
> with my imaging program.
Paul
Feb 9, 2012, 9:40:30 AM2/9/12
to
But if I had doubts, I'd use "disktype". I have a USB flash with
Ubuntu on it, with a copy of disktype loaded. I can plug that into
a machine and have an answer in about 3 minutes or so (slow slow boot,
partially the fault of the flash).
Paul
Yousuf Khan
Feb 9, 2012, 2:15:41 PM2/9/12
to
On 09/02/2012 3:14 AM, Arno wrote:
> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
I've gone ahead and let Ptedit32 change the partition types, and then
> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
after a reboot, the two partitions were actually automatically mounted
by Windows as E: and F:.
Yousuf Khan
Rod Speed
Feb 9, 2012, 4:25:26 PM2/9/12
to
Yousuf Khan wrote
> Arno wrote
>> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
> I've gone ahead and let Ptedit32 change the partition types, and then after a reboot, the two partitions were actually
> automatically mounted by Windows as E: and F:.
And thats presumably why Toshiba chooses to fake the partition type, so that doesnt happen.
>> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
> I've gone ahead and let Ptedit32 change the partition types, and then after a reboot, the two partitions were actually
> automatically mounted by Windows as E: and F:.
Yousuf Khan
Feb 10, 2012, 2:31:02 PM2/10/12
to
partitions, and it looks like the two partitions are almost identical,
both seem to be Windows recovery partitions, even though only one of
them is listed as a Windows recovery partition. In fact, the 13GB is all
either of them needed, I'm not sure why Toshiba decided to make one
24GB, it was nearly half empty. I'm not sure if maybe one of them was a
32-bit Windows image, while the other one was 64-bit. But they both seem
to contain directories named "64" inside. One could be a Toshiba-centric
customization of Windows 7, or something.
Yousuf Khan
Yousuf Khan
Feb 10, 2012, 2:33:17 PM2/10/12
to
On 09/02/2012 4:20 AM, Rod Speed wrote:
> Yousuf Khan wrote
> Yousuf Khan wrote
>> I wonder if I can just change the partition type from 17 to 07, then
>> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
>> with my imaging program.
>
> Any decent imaging program can back it up regardless of whether it recognised the file system or not.
The Windows imaging programs tend to be a bit smart, so they need to
>> it'll become a standard NTFS. I should then be able to just back it up
>> with my imaging program.
>
> Any decent imaging program can back it up regardless of whether it recognised the file system or not.
know a little bit about the overlying filesystem.
Yousuf Khan
a1pcfixer
Feb 10, 2012, 3:37:45 PM2/10/12
to
Yousuf,
> But they both seem
> to contain directories named "64" inside. One could be a Toshiba-centric
> customization of Windows 7, or something.
Maybe one was for the OS itself to be restored, the other maybe drivers &
apps? HP & Gateway have their restore's like that, but not split as in your
case.
You don't by chance happen to have a version of Windows with bitlocker
encryption do ya? Windows Ultimate is one of two it's offered on.
> But they both seem
> to contain directories named "64" inside. One could be a Toshiba-centric
> customization of Windows 7, or something.
apps? HP & Gateway have their restore's like that, but not split as in your
case.
You don't by chance happen to have a version of Windows with bitlocker
encryption do ya? Windows Ultimate is one of two it's offered on.
Rod Speed
Feb 10, 2012, 6:02:00 PM2/10/12
to
Yousuf Khan wrote
one is the diskless recovery and the other creates the recovery disks.
> In fact, the 13GB is all either of them needed, I'm not sure why Toshiba decided to make one 24GB, it was nearly half
> empty.
Presumably it uses the free space when doing the diskless recovery,
maybe as where it puts some of the settings etc so you dont have
just the option of a return to the factory config as supplied etc.
> I'm not sure if maybe one of them was a 32-bit Windows image, while the other one was 64-bit. But they both seem to
> contain directories named "64" inside.
That appears to blow that theory up.
> One could be a Toshiba-centric customization of Windows 7, or something.
Yeah, tho that doesnt explain the free space.
Bet the small one creates the recovery disks and the larger one does
the diskless recovery with at least optionally some way of preserving
settings or additional installs etc if the story Andy got is correct.
> Rod Speed wrote
>> Yousuf Khan wrote
>>> Arno wrote
>>>> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
>>> I've gone ahead and let Ptedit32 change the partition types, and then after a reboot, the two partitions were
>>> actually automatically mounted by Windows as E: and F:.
>> And thats presumably why Toshiba chooses to fake the partition type, so that doesnt happen.
> I've now made an image of both partitions and blown away the original partitions, and it looks like the two partitions
> are almost identical, both seem to be Windows recovery partitions, even though only one of them is listed as a Windows
> recovery partition.
Andy said that someone told him, forget who he said it was now, that
>> Yousuf Khan wrote
>>> Arno wrote
>>>> If you do a sector-image, the partition type should not matter.
>>> I've gone ahead and let Ptedit32 change the partition types, and then after a reboot, the two partitions were
>>> actually automatically mounted by Windows as E: and F:.
>> And thats presumably why Toshiba chooses to fake the partition type, so that doesnt happen.
> I've now made an image of both partitions and blown away the original partitions, and it looks like the two partitions
> are almost identical, both seem to be Windows recovery partitions, even though only one of them is listed as a Windows
> recovery partition.
one is the diskless recovery and the other creates the recovery disks.
> In fact, the 13GB is all either of them needed, I'm not sure why Toshiba decided to make one 24GB, it was nearly half
> empty.
maybe as where it puts some of the settings etc so you dont have
just the option of a return to the factory config as supplied etc.
> I'm not sure if maybe one of them was a 32-bit Windows image, while the other one was 64-bit. But they both seem to
> contain directories named "64" inside.
> One could be a Toshiba-centric customization of Windows 7, or something.
Bet the small one creates the recovery disks and the larger one does
the diskless recovery with at least optionally some way of preserving
settings or additional installs etc if the story Andy got is correct.
Rod Speed
Feb 10, 2012, 6:05:17 PM2/10/12
to
Yousuf Khan wrote
Thats not true of Acronis True Image. It will be smart enough to save only
the parts of the partition that are actually used with file systems that it
recognises and does a sector by sector image of those where it doesnt.
I've never tried it with a partition whose partition type is faked
to see if it can pick file systems with faked partition types.
It certainly handles more than just FAT and NTFS file systems.
the parts of the partition that are actually used with file systems that it
recognises and does a sector by sector image of those where it doesnt.
I've never tried it with a partition whose partition type is faked
to see if it can pick file systems with faked partition types.
It certainly handles more than just FAT and NTFS file systems.
AndyHancock
Feb 11, 2012, 2:05:30 PM2/11/12
to
tests, etc. New HDD and new mobo (including video chip).
Unfortunately, the HDD got an unintended BUMP in the process. I mean
with the all-caps.
About the purposes of partitions 3 & 4, it's all a bit foggy, since
it's gathered through peoples experienced assessments on Toshiba
forums (Toshiba.com and Toshiba-europe), as well as Seagate & Norton
forums. As well, from talking with Toshiba technical support. As you
might have gathered from your experience, anything they say over the
phone is not to be taken as authoritatively accurate (likely even less
than the info from forums, both Toshiba and others). But yes, the
gist I got was that partitions 3 & 4 are for recovery discs, disc-less
recovery, and other-language info for the above. *If* that is
accurage, then how they are distributed between the partitions isn't
all that clear to me. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful than that.
P.S. Sorry for fragmenting the thread, but I got the following
message:
Google Groups does not currently support posting to the following
usenet groups: "alt.windows7.general"
Rod Speed
Feb 11, 2012, 3:19:34 PM2/11/12
to
AndyHancock wrote
Urk, what happened there ?
> About the purposes of partitions 3 & 4, it's all a bit foggy, since
> it's gathered through peoples experienced assessments on Toshiba
> forums (Toshiba.com and Toshiba-europe), as well as Seagate & Norton
> forums. As well, from talking with Toshiba technical support. As you
> might have gathered from your experience, anything they say over the
> phone is not to be taken as authoritatively accurate (likely even less
> than the info from forums, both Toshiba and others). But yes, the
> gist I got was that partitions 3 & 4 are for recovery discs, disc-less
> recovery, and other-language info for the above. *If* that is
> accurage, then how they are distributed between the partitions isn't
> all that clear to me. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful than that.
> P.S. Sorry for fragmenting the thread, but I got the following message:
> Google Groups does not currently support posting to the following
> usenet groups: "alt.windows7.general"
No problem, gg can be a bit quirky at times.
> About the purposes of partitions 3 & 4, it's all a bit foggy, since
> it's gathered through peoples experienced assessments on Toshiba
> forums (Toshiba.com and Toshiba-europe), as well as Seagate & Norton
> forums. As well, from talking with Toshiba technical support. As you
> might have gathered from your experience, anything they say over the
> phone is not to be taken as authoritatively accurate (likely even less
> than the info from forums, both Toshiba and others). But yes, the
> gist I got was that partitions 3 & 4 are for recovery discs, disc-less
> recovery, and other-language info for the above. *If* that is
> accurage, then how they are distributed between the partitions isn't
> all that clear to me. Sorry I couldn't be more helpful than that.
> P.S. Sorry for fragmenting the thread, but I got the following message:
> Google Groups does not currently support posting to the following
> usenet groups: "alt.windows7.general"
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