KFest 2006 report
Kirk Mitchell
KFest 2006 is now up and running!
Folks have been trickling in most of the afternoon, and being picked up
at airports and train stations by other volunteer attendees.
One word. Hot. It was in the 100's and nice high humidity.
Fortunately, the air conditioning in the dorm is working great!
After we got settled in our rooms, we waited for them to get the
wireless network username and password to us. Finally got that, but
they've certainly limited our access to ports, making telnetting to
a2central.com impossible, as well as not being able to iChat or ftp to
home computers to get forgotten files. We'll see if we can get them to
open up a few more ports.
We ate at Sweet Tomatoes, a soup and salad place that's generally
acceptable to vegans and omnivores alike. We took up a very long
table. B-{)
After eating, we went shopping for the Kookout. Grilled hamburgers and
hot dogs with chips and pop tomorrow! Of course, I'm the Kook, so I
get to grill everything in this nice hot KC weather. I may not take
anyone out with food poisoning, but I'll have beer in hand to rehydrate
myself. B-{)
Right now, folks are just getting reacquainted. And we have 4 new
faces too! I think the participant count is 34 Apple II fans.
We sure hope to see more of you folks here next year! B-{)
Kirk
Matt Lichtenberg
trip to Sweet Tomatoes planned.. mm, I think I might have lunch there
tomorrow.
Here's hoping tomorrow goes as well as today!
Kirk Mitchell
Matt Lichtenberg wrote:
> I'd love to be there next year as well! Especially if there's another
> trip to Sweet Tomatoes planned.. mm, I think I might have lunch there
> tomorrow.
>
That looks like it's going to be the tradition for the first meal here.
The university cafeteria isn't open that evening.
> Here's hoping tomorrow goes as well as today!
Hence todays report. B-{)
Age is catching up with most of us. The vast majority of us went to
bed around 2:30 AM this morning, but were up at 7:00 AM for breakfast.
Standard fare, scrambled eggs, bacon, pancakes, fruit, cerial... Wide
choice at least, and it tasted good.
The morning didn't have anything scheduled until the Great KFest
Kookout at noon. The university had two nice Webber grills to loan, so
I got them both going. They made short work of the hamburger patties
and hotdogs (the veggies amongst us got Boca burgers and tofu undogs).
Fortunately, the temperature was only in the lower 90's that early in
the day, but it was still hot by the grills.
Our first official session, Mark Percival took us through the steps he
took going from a 6502 machine code novice, to experienced programmer
via his excellent program, DiskMaker 8.
Check out his find product at:
http://www.syndicomm.com/~mark/DM8/
It was interesting, but then I'm a geek and like this technical stuff.
B-{)
The next session was Eric Shepherd's announcement of Sweet 16 for Mac
OS X!
This is an Apple IIgs emulator that doesn't require Classic, and it's a
Universal binary too, so it runs on Intel Macs as well as PPC. While
it doesn't have as many features as Bernie to the Rescue, there are
many that Bernie didn't have. And the nice news was that it's
freeware!
Check it out at:
http://sheppyware.net/software-mac/sweet16/index.html
Dinner was OK. Turkey, mashed potatoes and gravy, or you could go for
eggrolls. Nice pie afterwards too.
Sheppy (Eric Shepherd) gave the Keynote this year, and basically
revisited the challenge he presented to us in his 2001 Keynote address.
We mostly tried brainstorming ideas on how to keep the Apple II
community alive and strong. While this year's KFest had more folks
than last year, we still tend to lose track of some fine Apple IIers.
Everyone in attendance definitely wants to continue coming to KFest in
the future, and the way to do that is to be helpful to new Apple II
folks and to make sure Apple II information is well provided.
Wikipedia was suggested as a resource we can add to.
After the Keynote, it was just visiting with others, and looking at all
their equipment. At around 10:00 PM, the Syndicomm.com pizza wagon
rolled in and we all dove in. Thanks Sheppy!
Now, I hear folks laughing down the hall, so I'll wonder down that way
to participate in the REAL joy of KFest. This is one great Fellowship.
B-{)
Kirk
Kirk Mitchell
for breakfast. Standard fare.
First session had Andy Molloy showing the video "Hackers:Wizards of the
Computer Age". Interesting early look at such luminaries as Bill
Budge, Woz and others.
Second session had Bruce Baker demonstrating Silvern Castle, a Wizardry
like game written in BASIC by Jeff Fink. He also demonstrated more 8
bit games from the Softdisk collection. There are some gems there that
I hadn't realized were there, and I have the collection.
Check out:
http://www.syndicomm.com/~finksterj/SilvernCastle/
and
http://tinyurl.com/jf7m6 (this is the Syndicomm store)
Lunch was hamburgers (mine were better!) , chicken tenders, and other
stuff. Hmmm... I sure talk a lot about food. We do eat well.
In the afternoon sessions, Austin Phelps demonstrated Virtual Machines
on PC's. These will be great on an Intel Mac as well. I nearly
suffered a bruised forehead when I about smacked it on table when I
dozed off. I need to make a note to myself to never have a session
right after lunch. I wasn't the only one knodding, and it wasn't
Austin's fault. B-{)
Eric Shepherd did a session on Getting Started with ORCA. It was
basically a quick survey of the wonders of Bytework's great ORCA series
of programming languages and tools. I really need to get back into the
swing of things programming wise. The Opus ][ CD that Syndicomm.com
sells is fantastic!
Ryan Suenaga, the Poi Boi from HI, and my KFest roomie, presented the
results of his latest efforts, Volumes 2 and 3 of the GS+ archives!
He's gone to great lengths to get these issues available as searchable
pdf files, complete with all the graphics archives of the disks that
came with these issues. I got Volume 1 last KFest, and it was great
reading!
OK... more food. I had fajitas, but there was grilled chicken too.
Afterwards, we went to the KC Apple Store and drooled on their
equipment until they kicked us out. They had some cute chicks hanging
out around the Genius Bar though, blocking the rest of us from getting
questions answered though. Tony Diaz even brought an Apple IIc
prototype he wanted to ask them about, but....
A few hours later, Ryan and I went on a Krispy Kreme donut run, and I
succeeded in not getting lost like I did last year. I was even
successful in securing more barley beverage as well. B-{)
We were very popular when we got back. B-{)
Howard Katz had a DVD of a short horror flick, "Stephen King's Gotham
Cafe" which was produced and had short appearances from Woz.
Interesting, but not for the kiddies. B-{)
http://www.bevvincent.com/gotham.html
Right now, Tony Diaz is running around looking for tools in his efforts
to finish yet another hardware project, the rest of us are sitting in
each other's rooms chatting and joking and making fun of Ken Gagne.
B-{)
Rumor is that Jeri Ellsworth will be here tomorrow. That'll be cool.
She missed last year, and certainly enlivened the KFests the previous
two times. All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeri_Ellsworth
That's it for now. Time to see if there are any more donuts left.
B-{)
Kirk
Matt Lichtenberg
> Eric Shepherd did a session on Getting Started with ORCA. It was
> basically a quick survey of the wonders of Bytework's great ORCA series
> of programming languages and tools. I really need to get back into the
> swing of things programming wise. The Opus ][ CD that Syndicomm.com
> sells is fantastic!
This sounds all kinds of interesting.. there wouldn't be anybody who
recorded this (and all the other lectures as well), would there? I
think those of us who couldn't make it out there would get quite a bit
out of them.
> A few hours later, Ryan and I went on a Krispy Kreme donut run, and I
> succeeded in not getting lost like I did last year. I was even
> successful in securing more barley beverage as well. B-{)
>
> We were very popular when we got back. B-{)
Understandably. ;D
> Rumor is that Jeri Ellsworth will be here tomorrow. That'll be cool.
> She missed last year, and certainly enlivened the KFests the previous
> two times. All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
Hilarious, and yet, true.
With every post you make, you make me wish I could've made it out this
year more and more. Now, my rallying cry: 'Next year shall be
different!'
-Matt
Kirk Mitchell
> This sounds all kinds of interesting.. there wouldn't be anybody who
> recorded this (and all the other lectures as well), would there? I
> think those of us who couldn't make it out there would get quite a bit
> out of them.
>
Sheppy and Greg Nelson are recording sessions. I doubt that Sheppy
will be doing DVD's of them as he has in the past, because they just
aren't worth the effort for how few he sells. I don't know WHAT Greg
does with his recordings.
Still, Sheppy may make them available for downloading, but most likely
quite a while after KFest is over. No one wants to do all that much
work while here, when so much fun stuff is going on. B-{)
>>All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
>
> Hilarious, and yet, true.
>
She just walked in the door. And a half dozen geeks went out to help
carry in her luggage. B-{)
> With every post you make, you make me wish I could've made it out this
> year more and more. Now, my rallying cry: 'Next year shall be
> different!'
I used to read reports of KFests past, until 9 years ago when I finally
decided to splurge and just go to one. This is my ninth KFest and it's
no longer splurging, it's tradition. B-{) The wife likes to get me
out of the house so she can move furniture in new and deadly patterns
to surprise me. B-{)
It was a pleasant surprise to see so many new faces this year too. If
my efforts can entice a few folks into joining us, it's worth the
effort. B-{)
There are a lot of sessions today, my report will be a bit longer. And
I'll try not to talk about food as much. B-{)
Kirk
Matt Lichtenberg
Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> Still, Sheppy may make them available for downloading, but most likely
> quite a while after KFest is over.
One can only hope.
> No one wants to do all that much work while here, when so much fun
> stuff is going on. B-{)
Well, yes; quite understandable.
> >>All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
> >
> > Hilarious, and yet, true.
> >
>
> She just walked in the door. And a half dozen geeks went out to help
> carry in her luggage. B-{)
And why didn't the rest of the geeks hold the door for her? ;D
> > With every post you make, you make me wish I could've made it out this
> > year more and more. Now, my rallying cry: 'Next year shall be
> > different!'
>
> I used to read reports of KFests past, until 9 years ago when I finally
> decided to splurge and just go to one. This is my ninth KFest and it's
> no longer splurging, it's tradition. B-{)
Well, I have one other Apple fanboy friend around here, so maybe next
year we'll pile into his hatchback and make the trip. Who knows?
-Matt
Robert Bernardo
> Rumor is that Jeri Ellsworth will be here tomorrow. That'll be cool.
> She missed last year, and certainly enlivened the KFests the previous
> two times. All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeri_Ellsworth
Ha, that Wikipedia entry has several errors in it. Whoever wrote
it up didn't double-check.
CommVEx info at http://www.commodore.ca/forum
and click on ComVEX,
Robert Bernardo
Fresno Commodore User Group
http://videocam.net.au/fcug
Kirk Mitchell
Breakfast was standard fare.
Ryan Suenaga gave a presentation where he gave a brief history of
podcasting, then announced that he planned to start one called
"A2unplugged", which would focus specifically on Apple II's. This
should be interesting!
Eric Shepherd gave a session on Intel Mac tips and tricks where he
demonstrated Sheepshaver, a method of running Classic on the Intel Mac,
Parallels, which will run about every x86 OS out there as a window on
Mac OS X, and Boot Camp, which allows Winblows XP to run on a partition
on an Intel Mac. He also demoed some fun things like MacSabre, and
other fun programs.
Lunch was...hmm... I forget.
Sean Fahey demonstrated the SVD, a device that makes it easier to save
images to a PC, but allow you to use them on an Apple. See:
Austin Phelps gave an interesting session on how to build a RAID array,
with a short lesson on the differerent types, and their advantages and
disadvantages. He shared how he built his 1.2 TB array. Sweet! (and
I didn't fall asleep!)
Margaret Anderson did a session on IF adventure games. I remember
those fondly. She provided lots of sources for new and old adventures.
Andy Malloy demonstrated Skype. Very tempting, seeing how it's free
until Dec... I'll have to give it a try!
The dinner wasn't a banquet like it had been in years past. Somewhat
confusing, but this allowed us to hurry to the Roast of the Roasts
where Ken Gagne did a great job as MC, and allowed him to dig into tha
archives and find embarrassing photo's and videos of Apple II folks.
It was a hoot!
Jeri set up a Playstation where we competed at singing Karoke. We have
some fine voices in our crowd. I shocked folks by kicking some butt
singing "Sweet Home Alabama". B-{)
All that made us hungry, so about 16 of us decided to go to IHOP. 14
of us arrived. Neglect lost us the company of two fine folk. They
found their way back to the dorm. IHOP was so frigging slow getting us
seated that we went to Denny's instead. No problems with seating at
all, and we got our food fast. So, since I've already had breakfast, I
intend to sleep in tomorrow. B-{)
I condensed this report pretty drastically. Like I forgot to mention
that we had a cloudburst in the morning that only the couragious braved
to get to breakfast, or that the temperature was wonderful, and that it
was a grinfest from dawn to nearly dawn... You folks just have to
experience this! B-{)
Kirk
PZ
30 minutes ago @ KFest
Hackfest is the annual programming contest at KFest. Programming can't
start until the beginning of the conference and the contest concludes
on the last full day of KFest. Participants are judged on the
completeness of their entry, programming experience, and by the quality
of their program. The top entries at KFest 2006 were (in no particular
order):
-----------------
Geoff Weiss - Applesoft - Bejeweled
Geoff wrote this Bejeweled clone in Applesoft using Low Rez graphics.
It looked pretty darn good for being Low Rez. Rather than detailed
"jewels" he just used different colored rectangles. Mouse capability
was included.
-----------------
Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd - C - Icon Invaders
Eric created a game which icons drop down the screen at different rates
and you have to shoot them ala Space Invaders style. Pretty cool
looking. The game pulls the icons out of the GSOS icons folder, both
small and large.
--------------------
Stavros Karatsoridis - SUPERPILOT - Kfest Trivia
Sven crated a Kfest Trivia game using SUPERPILOT. This was one of 2
entries which was 100% complete at presentation time.
--------------------
Margaret Anderson - Applesoft - Soduku Problem Helper
This text was the other 100% complete Hackfest entry. It displays 9
Soduku problems on the screen and helps you solve them, offering
suggestions for possible solutions if you would like. The program used
keyboard onscreen editing with a side menu.
---------------------
Matthew Schock - Applesoft - RPG Game
Matthew wrote a text based Samurai Role Playing Game with ASCII
graphics and animation, animated stick figures included.
----------------------------------------
The winners were:
1st Place: Margaret Anderson
2nd Place: Eric "Sheppy" Shephard
3rd Place: Matthew Schock
- Paul
Kirk Mitchell
OK, I've hit the wall. Even though I slept in another hour and missed
breakfast, it wasn't enough. I won't be staying up much later than
now, B-{)
Another busy day as far as sessions went though.
Howard Katz let us know that Deja II, an emulator that works
specifically with Appleworks will be ported to a Universal Binary for
Intel Macs and others. It used to be a Classic application.
Andy Molloy demonstrated the ftp client SAFE 2 "Spectrum Automated File
Exchange 2.0" by Ewen Wannop while using the Uthernet Card with
Marinetti. This looks like a great program! See:
http://homepage.mac.com/speccie/
Paul Zaleski did a presentation on wiki and how we can all contribute
to the Apple II wiki on Wikipedia.com. Very informative tour of the
possibilities!
Andrew Roughan actually called us live from Australia (using Skype of
course) to let us know what he's been up to for the last year. He
announced the availability of Marinetti 3.0b3, which includes bugfixes
and stability issues. He hopes to have a release copy of 3.0 done by
the end of the year!
Next came the judging and awards for the Hackfest contest that's been
running here since Wed. Paul's already written that up on another post
in this tread, so I won't add more. In fact, he was sitting next to me
as he wrote that stuff up. B-{)
The finale was a presentations by Tony Diaz where he showed us a
variety of rare prototypes of the Apple II, Apple II+, IIe, and the
IIgs, dozens of circuit boards, and motherboards. Many of these were
one of a kind. The favorite of course was the Mark Twain IIgs. What
could have been!
It was now time for the Swap Meet/Vendor Fair. We had 4 or 5 folks
selling stuff, and it was fun to poke through old software, or the
newer products from Syndicomm. I left quite a bit of money behind, and
will probably have to try to sneek this back into the house to avoid a
wife who questions my sanity about the Apple II. B-{)
We then piled into cars and headed to KC Masterpiece to do our
carnivore business. Except for Ken and Howard who had to settle for
unfood food. Our table certainly had a lot of fun. B-{)
Afterwards, most of the folks went to the movies to see the Superman
movie. There is a small cadre holding down the fort right now, taking
advantage of the quiet time to shortsheet some of the others, or just
get in one last chat with friends.
The others haven't returned yet. Perhaps things will pick up then.
Unfortunately, you probably won't hear about what happens, since this
is my final report. Tomorrow, it's breakfast if I get up that early,
packing and then for me, a 7 hour drive home. For others, it's flights
or bus or train. And I don't think you'll find a one of them that will
express regret at the cost or time they've spent for these last 6 days.
4 new faces, 30 return attendee's, and at we all know of more who wish
they'd been here.
I feel better about keeping KFest alive this year. And I hope these
reports get you to thinking about next year and joining in the fun!
Ah! The movie folks are back. Gotta go!
Kirk
roughana
Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> Andrew Roughan actually called us live from Australia (using Skype of
> course) to let us know what he's been up to for the last year.
Actually, Skype audio crapped out just before the session started, so I
called in on Tony's mobile. Geoff Weiss was holding the mobile (on
speakerphone) up to the microphone to let the room hear what I was
saying. I was using Skype chat to prompt Tony when to change the
powerpoint slide.
Ahh technology. Love it when it works.
Cheers,
Andrew
Matt Lichtenberg
> Unfortunately, you probably won't hear about what happens, since this
> is my final report.
For your reports this week, and a viewpoint into quite an exciting
event, I thank you, sir.
For convincing me to trek cross-state and 'throw away' more money on a
'useless hobby' next year, however, I curse your name.
Just kidding. ;D
-Matt
PZ
Last night (Saturday) everybody attending Kfest invaded KC Masterpiece
for dinner. Afterwards about half of the group went out and saw
Superman, while the rest returned to the dormitory where we socialized,
and worked / helped out on various projects, built Diet Coke/Mentos
fountains etc.
Once again, many stayed up into the early AM. Hackfest & Session
Presentor prizes were given out (wireless routers, cool electronic
gadgets, etc). Jerri Elsworth was working on a new video project that
drew interest. There was also some last minute system upgrading going
on and as usual there was plenty of humor.
This morning the mood is much more muted (except for the chair racing
incident) as we are packing up and saying our good byes. Looks like
some of us stragglers will go out on the town for lunch once we're
checked out. Admittedly, we still arn't tired of yapping about the
Apple II after a 51 week drought.
- Paul
Kirk Mitchell
roughana wrote:
> Actually, Skype audio crapped out just before the session started, so I
> called in on Tony's mobile. Geoff Weiss was holding the mobile (on
> speakerphone) up to the microphone to let the room hear what I was
> saying. I was using Skype chat to prompt Tony when to change the
> powerpoint slide.
Ah... I saw Geoff over by the sound equipment, but he was still coding
on his Hackfest project at the same time. That boy sure can multitask.
B-{)
> Ahh technology. Love it when it works.
It was certainly nice to hear from you again in any case!
Keep up the good work!
Kirk
Kirk Mitchell
Matt Lichtenberg wrote:
> Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> > Unfortunately, you probably won't hear about what happens, since this
> > is my final report.
>
> For your reports this week, and a viewpoint into quite an exciting
> event, I thank you, sir.
>
You are welcome. I enjoyed doing them. It's sorta like paying back
those who reported in before I started coming. B-{)
> For convincing me to trek cross-state and 'throw away' more money on a
> 'useless hobby' next year, however, I curse your name.
>
Heh. Well, I understand why so many folks cringe when they start
seriously considering coming to a KFest. $325 is nothing to sneeze at.
But I figure it includes 11 meals (the Kookout just cost folks $3
more), 5 nights lodging, and an overdose of entertainment value with
some pretty classy and funny folks. Toss in transportation costs, and
I had to save about $1.50/day to make this happen. I don't have any
problems not buying bottled water and drinking from a fountain...
There, I just saved my daily quota! B-{)
> Just kidding. ;D
I hope so. I'll enjoy meeting you in 2007. B-{)
Kirk
BTW, I'm back home now. Now to recover....
Mitchell Spector
>Matt Lichtenberg wrote:
>> Kirk Mitchell wrote:
>> > Unfortunately, you probably won't hear about what happens, since this
>> > is my final report.
>>
>> For your reports this week, and a viewpoint into quite an exciting
>> event, I thank you, sir.
>
>You are welcome. I enjoyed doing them. It's sorta like paying back
>those who reported in before I started coming. B-{)
I'd like to add my thanks too. I enjoy reading a day by day account
of each day, it almost gives you a sense of what it's like being there.
Besides how fun it sounds, it'd be pretty surreal to meet not one, but
a few dozen people who are all Apple II fanatics--as much or more
so than me. :)
>> For convincing me to trek cross-state and 'throw away' more money on a
>> 'useless hobby' next year, however, I curse your name.
>>
>
>Heh. Well, I understand why so many folks cringe when they start
>seriously considering coming to a KFest. $325 is nothing to sneeze at.
> But I figure it includes 11 meals (the Kookout just cost folks $3
>more), 5 nights lodging, and an overdose of entertainment value with
>some pretty classy and funny folks. Toss in transportation costs, and
>I had to save about $1.50/day to make this happen. I don't have any
>problems not buying bottled water and drinking from a fountain...
>There, I just saved my daily quota! B-{)
It's not so much the conference cost (which can be as much as $380
to $450 if you register after May 31st) but once you add in the travelling
expense of a round trip plane ticket. I've really no idea what the total
cost would be (any guesses?) but I'm very tempted to take the plunge.
Yes, I know, I know, I've been talking about it some 12 years now... ;)
Incidentally, anyone have pictures of KFest 2006 ready to view yet?
Mitchell Spector
Kirk Mitchell
Mitchell Spector wrote:
> I'd like to add my thanks too. I enjoy reading a day by day account
> of each day, it almost gives you a sense of what it's like being there.
> Besides how fun it sounds, it'd be pretty surreal to meet not one, but
> a few dozen people who are all Apple II fanatics--as much or more
> so than me. :)
>
Hi Mitch...
Uh... I'm having an interesting moment here. B-{)
Used to be my nickname for a few years. B-{)
My first few years attending were surreal... I was supposed to room
with Michael Hackett, but I smoked and he didn't. Got the room for
myself. Met lots of other fine folk though. Steve Godzilla for one.
The next year, I roomed with Joe Kohn. Wow! He snores. Not that it
mattered all that much when I wasn't bothering to sleep much. B-{)
Ryan Suenaga has been my roomie for the last bunch of years. Isn't a
nicer guy on the planet. You just don't know who'll become a friend at
KFest. Heck, we already have common ground with the Apple II.
Tony Diaz has darned near parked his plane in my yard. Would have too,
if the road had been a little smoother. Instead, we thrilled my
neighbors by having to park it in front of their house. I've flown
with him to KFest. It'd have been quicker to drive. Tony likes to
make the most of his adventure and knows that it's the trip that's
important, not the destination.
Sheppy intimidates... He's a big guy. But he tells fascinating
stories, and in the end, you realize that you share so much common
ground that you could be brothers.
Carl, Dain, Ken, Howard, Margaret, Mike, Jim, Paul, Ed, Matt, Bruce,
Jeri, Ewen, Richard, Andrew, Cindy, Steve.. Woz!!!! and so many
others...
This is KFest. It's one little piece of common ground that draws
fascinating folks together for nearly a week every year.
I live in Moscow, Kansas. There is a shortage of fascinating folk
around here. I have to spend some bucks to find them. B-{)
> It's not so much the conference cost (which can be as much as $380
> to $450 if you register after May 31st) but once you add in the travelling
> expense of a round trip plane ticket. I've really no idea what the total
> cost would be (any guesses?) but I'm very tempted to take the plunge.
> Yes, I know, I know, I've been talking about it some 12 years now... ;)
Ah.. Canadian dollars suck. B-{)
Mark Percival came from Montreal. He's active here. Perhaps he'll be
able to give you some advice...
I certainly hope you come, Mitchell... I've been on csa, and csa2
since 1986, and consider you one of the guru's of the Apple II
community. I'm more of a lurk. But of I can help here, I'm happy to
contribute to csa2.
In Sheppy's Keynote address, he focused on our common ground... the
Apple II community. We're losing ground. Which is natural for
interests which have slipped into the "retro" era. We can't afford
stupid "sects" in the Apple II world.
He'd be happy to make a2central.com and it's forums, libraries and
chats free for all if we can come up with a way to at least pay for
their maintanance. (sp). Any ideas? He's not willing to be bled dry
to support this.
> Incidentally, anyone have pictures of KFest 2006 ready to view yet?
A few have been observed catching us at embarrassing moments. At least
two are active here. I won't steal their thunder. Give them a break!
They've been having fun and aren't likely to get to these pics until
they've recovered. B-{)
I guess a final comment is warranted here... I didn't crash and burn
like I thought. What wonders a couple of glasses of wine can produce.
B-{)
Even if you can't or won't come to KFest, I hope you enjoy what tales
come from this institution. I'll be happy to write my experiences
until the curtain falls. If it falls, csa2 will be it. I think it
will survive even syndicomm.com. Longevity is on csa2's side.
Whatever animosity has been "flamed" on csa2 had better be extinquished
if this group is going to serve as the nucleus of the Apple II
community though.
OK, it's been more than a couple of glasses of wine. *Preacher mode
off.*
I had a hellava lot of fun last week. Can't wait until next year.
Hope to see you there. B-{)
Kirk
mdj
Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> In Sheppy's Keynote address, he focused on our common ground... the
> Apple II community. We're losing ground. Which is natural for
> interests which have slipped into the "retro" era. We can't afford
> stupid "sects" in the Apple II world.
>
> He'd be happy to make a2central.com and it's forums, libraries and
> chats free for all if we can come up with a way to at least pay for
> their maintanance. (sp). Any ideas? He's not willing to be bled dry
> to support this.
I too would love to see this happen. The question has to be asked
though, if service is provided for free, then what value is there in
maintaining it at all? Much of the same functionality can be provided
by a Yahoo group, if you want something private, or publicly speaking
we already have that with csa2. There's no reason for such services to
cost anything to run, when all are there for gratis on the public
network.
It's a double edged sword of course. Cost creates a barrier which when
viewed from the outside appears to be exclusivity, from the inside it
keeps the riff-raff out.
I always wonder - anyone with a2central access has access to the public
resources as well. Anyone who wants in is welcome, so ultimately, it's
up to them.
We must keep in mind that in any sufficiently diverse community there
will be differences of opinion and thus occasionally, conflict. That's
life.
Anyway, let the discussion begin, says I :-)
> Even if you can't or won't come to KFest, I hope you enjoy what tales
> come from this institution. I'll be happy to write my experiences
> until the curtain falls. If it falls, csa2 will be it. I think it
> will survive even syndicomm.com. Longevity is on csa2's side.
> Whatever animosity has been "flamed" on csa2 had better be extinquished
> if this group is going to serve as the nucleus of the Apple II
> community though.
I'll be in the US this time next year, so hopefully I'll see you all
then :-)
Matt
PZ
Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> Mitchell Spector wrote:
>
> > I'd like to add my thanks too. I enjoy reading a day by day account
> > of each day, it almost gives you a sense of what it's like being there.
> > Besides how fun it sounds, it'd be pretty surreal to meet not one, but
> > a few dozen people who are all Apple II fanatics--as much or more
> > so than me. :)
I have to say it's really-really nice NOT having to dumb down
conversations about what you do with the Apple II! Eventhough KFest
attendees come from very diverse backgrounds in addition to spanning
the age ranges of 17 -> really old, I'm extremely comfortable carrying
on conversations with everyone there; they're all great Apple II users.
There is always stuff to talk about, and its absolutely AMAZING to see
the huge range of things people use their Apple II for.
> > It's not so much the conference cost (which can be as much as $380
> > to $450 if you register after May 31st) but once you add in the travelling
> > expense of a round trip plane ticket. I've really no idea what the total
> > cost would be (any guesses?) but I'm very tempted to take the plunge.
> > Yes, I know, I know, I've been talking about it some 12 years now... ;)
>
> Ah.. Canadian dollars suck. B-{)
Its good that Southwest flys into KC, which makes flights to KC on
other airlines competetive. Also KFest offers a free "Pikop Andropov"
service, so you'll save money cab fare/rental car. Other than going
out to the movies and 2 meals, its really all inclusive. Free Donuts
and Pizza is nice too courtesy of Juiced GS magazine.
> I certainly hope you come, Mitchell... I've been on csa, and csa2
> since 1986, and consider you one of the guru's of the Apple II
> community. I'm more of a lurk. But of I can help here, I'm happy to
> contribute to csa2.
Kirk, your write-ups were great, I had to read them just to make sure I
didn't miss anything since there was so much going on!
Mitchell, I mentioned your work during my Wikipedia and the Apple II
presentation. People were impressed with what you've done. One thing
mentioned was, if we can get enough interest, maybe the community can
create an Apple II Portal / Project Apple II such as what the Mac group
has done.
> > Incidentally, anyone have pictures of KFest 2006 ready to view yet?
>
> A few have been observed catching us at embarrassing moments. At least
> two are active here. I won't steal their thunder. Give them a break!
> They've been having fun and aren't likely to get to these pics until
> they've recovered. B-{)
Oh crap......
> I had a hellava lot of fun last week. Can't wait until next year.
Same here, looking forward to next year as well.
- Paul
PZ
Mike Maginnis
PZ wrote:
> Kirk Mitchell wrote:
> > Mitchell Spector wrote:
> >
> > > I'd like to add my thanks too. I enjoy reading a day by day account
> > > of each day, it almost gives you a sense of what it's like being there.
> > > Besides how fun it sounds, it'd be pretty surreal to meet not one, but
> > > a few dozen people who are all Apple II fanatics--as much or more
> > > so than me. :)
>
> I have to say it's really-really nice NOT having to dumb down
> conversations about what you do with the Apple II! Eventhough KFest
> attendees come from very diverse backgrounds in addition to spanning
> the age ranges of 17 -> really old, I'm extremely comfortable carrying
> on conversations with everyone there; they're all great Apple II users.
> There is always stuff to talk about, and its absolutely AMAZING to see
> the huge range of things people use their Apple II for.
>
Well, mostly. :-) You had to dumb it down to talk to me...
Mike Maginnis
http://www.computist-project.net
Michael J. Mahon
> On Fri, 20 Jul 2006, Kirk Mitchell wrote:
>
>> Rumor is that Jeri Ellsworth will be here tomorrow. That'll be cool.
>> She missed last year, and certainly enlivened the KFests the previous
>> two times. All the young geeks around here are in love. B-{)
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeri_Ellsworth
>
>
> Ha, that Wikipedia entry has several errors in it. Whoever wrote it
> up didn't double-check.
From what I've heard, that's not the exception, that's the rule.
The actual person is restricted from editing or otherwise correcting
his own entry (for possibly good reason), but also has no appeal path
other than discussion about the entry. If someone has an axe to grind,
there's no real remedy.
Although the egalitarian dogma of the Wiki is appealing, it has obvious
shortcomings, since we are not all equally expert in all things, nor
are we equally objective. ;-)
-michael
New, faster SUDOKU v2.0 solver for Apple II's!
Home page: http://members.aol.com/MJMahon/
"The wastebasket is our most important design
tool--and it's seriously underused."
Eric Shepherd
> Still, Sheppy may make them available for downloading, but most likely
> quite a while after KFest is over. No one wants to do all that much
> work while here, when so much fun stuff is going on. B-{)
I don't know yet what I'm going to do with the tapes I have. They're
not very good -- the lighting in the room we did the presentations in
wasn't conducive to decent video of the projected screen, and with all
the echo in the room, you can only marginally make any sense of what
the speaker is saying.
Pretty lousy, in general. I hope we get a better room next year.
Sheppy
Michael J. Mahon
WRT this year's tapes:
Although it's a lot more work than just copying to a DVD recorder, most
video editing programs (like Pinnacle, Adobe, etc.) offer tools to
correct brightness, contrast, and color balance, which can do wonders
to improve bad "exposure". The audio DSP options can also remove some
of the artifacts of "cathedral reverb" etc., but only within limits.
WRT future years:
Lighting is always an issue. Reducing the room lighting is generally
required when videotaping a projection screen.
But the audio can be remarkably improved by using a wireless clip-on
microphone and connecting the receiver to the camera's "mic in". Of
course, the standard "please repeat the question" protocol must be used.
I realize that all this makes it slightly more of a "production", but
I assume that "editing in the camera" is the norm, and that copying
DV tapes to DVD has been made quite easy with most DVD recorders.
Once a "master" DVD has been made, computers make copying for
distribution pretty fast and easy.
Still, at 2 or 2.5 hours of presentation per (single-layer) DVD, the
presentations could easily add up to 3 DVDs per day... But it seems
like a good way to make the 'Fest accessible to more people.
And with the cost of recordable DVDs now regularly at or below 20 cents
per disk, the costs are quite reasonable (not counting disk-swapping
time during duplication ;-).
The sessions could even be put up on a web server for viewing, as long
as the resolution was good enough to read the projection screen.
My own experience with making such videos suggests that with a single
camera, zooming between a frame-filling screen shot and a wider "2-shot"
with the presenter can be very helpful in making the screen readable
while adding interest. Of course, if there's a physical object being
demoed, then getting "up close and personal" is usually required to
make it worthwhile on the video.
This kind of thing is best done by someone who is fascinated with both
the topic of the presentation and the making of videos, since there is
value in the "director" being able to make relevance decisions.
As with most things in the Apple II world, the making of 'Fest videos
would be a labor of love, so the joy would be in the journey.
Bill Garber
"Michael J. Mahon" <mjm...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:54mdnQe2iPDpAVbZ...@comcast.com...
When will we learn not to mention video and audio around you, Mike? :o)
Bill Garber
Eric Shepherd
> He'd be happy to make a2central.com and it's forums, libraries and
> chats free for all if we can come up with a way to at least pay for
> their maintanance. (sp). Any ideas? He's not willing to be bled dry
> to support this.
That's true. It costs good money (and a lot of time) to run, but if I
could afford to, I'd be willing to make it free.
Sheppy
Eric Shepherd
> I too would love to see this happen. The question has to be asked
> though, if service is provided for free, then what value is there in
> maintaining it at all? Much of the same functionality can be provided
> by a Yahoo group, if you want something private, or publicly speaking
> we already have that with csa2. There's no reason for such services to
> cost anything to run, when all are there for gratis on the public
> network.
Well, the main value to Syndicomm's Apple II forum is that you can
access it using pretty much anything, all the way down to a dumb
terminal, as long as you can do telnet.
That's the entire point, really. A totally text-based forum that lets
people using actual Apple IIs communicate with each other.
We have the web interface, but that's just icing on the cake. :)
Sheppy
Michael J. Mahon
> Well, the main value to Syndicomm's Apple II forum is that you can
> access it using pretty much anything, all the way down to a dumb
> terminal, as long as you can do telnet.
>
> That's the entire point, really. A totally text-based forum that lets
> people using actual Apple IIs communicate with each other.
>
> We have the web interface, but that's just icing on the cake. :)
I understand what you mean, but I'm not sure I agree that the
Apple II-accessible interface is the main value.
I think that Syndicom has real value to the community apart from
offering text-based interfaces.
Just as it would be silly to restrict a factory that makes Christmas
tree lights to using them to light the factory, thinking of Apple II
services as valuable just because they are accessible to Apple II
computers is a fallacy.
-michael
Eric Shepherd
> required when videotaping a projection screen.
>
> But the audio can be remarkably improved by using a wireless clip-on
> microphone and connecting the receiver to the camera's "mic in". Of
> course, the standard "please repeat the question" protocol must be used.
>
> I realize that all this makes it slightly more of a "production", but
> I assume that "editing in the camera" is the norm, and that copying
> DV tapes to DVD has been made quite easy with most DVD recorders.
I went whole hog in 2003; the DVDs I produced that year (I never did
finish all the video work I wanted to do, and only got three discs done
out of a planned five) had two cameras on some things, with
picture-in-picture displays of the slides and the presenter,
alternating depending on what was going on.
That year, I didn't need an external microphone -- I was using my
camera, which has very good sound pickup.
The borrowed camera this year didn't pick up sound as well -- plus the
room we were in had a terrible echo problem.
If we could get a room with less light and without the echo, doing
video would be pretty painless.
I'd be inclined to go for a low-priced videocast of the sessions; let
people pick and choose the ones they want to see.
I do my DV editing in Final Cut or in iMovie (Used FC for the 2003
videos to do all the fancy footwork I did in those).
Anyway, hopefully next year I'll be able to bring my own camera, and
hopefully we'll have a better room. This year, the camera stayed home
because I have a daughter who's only a smidge over a year old, and the
camera is required to remain within a 60 foot radius of her at all
times. :)
Sheppy
Eric Shepherd
> Heh. Well, I understand why so many folks cringe when they start
> seriously considering coming to a KFest. $325 is nothing to sneeze at.
> But I figure it includes 11 meals (the Kookout just cost folks $3
> more), 5 nights lodging, and an overdose of entertainment value with
> some pretty classy and funny folks. Toss in transportation costs, and
> I had to save about $1.50/day to make this happen. I don't have any
> problems not buying bottled water and drinking from a fountain...
> There, I just saved my daily quota! B-{)
I'm just glad they don't charge as much as Apple does for WWDC. Yowza!
Sheppy
Eric Shepherd
> Just as it would be silly to restrict a factory that makes Christmas
> tree lights to using them to light the factory, thinking of Apple II
> services as valuable just because they are accessible to Apple II
> computers is a fallacy.
OK, I wasn't really clear with what I meant before. :)
What I mean is that while newsgroups and IRC and web boards and web
chat doohickeys are cool, having all-text forums is a very beneficial
thing, which is why I set them up in the first place.
It'd be easy to say, "csa2 and an IRC room" or "let's use Google Groups
and a web chat site", but the main impetus to creating the
Syndicomm/A2Central.com board, chat room, etc, was to provide a system
that people could access from their Apple II.
If that weren't important to me, I'd not have bothered to write all
that code (well, wouldn't have bothered to nudge Dave Miller to write
all that code, since he did most of it....). Anyway, if we didn't have
the text interface stuff to worry about, having free boards and web
would be pretty trivial to set up, since there are lots of services
that offer those things free or nearly so.
But I like having the text interface available -- being able to access
a service about the Apple II using an Apple II appeals to me, even
though I don't do it very often myself. I know some people do though.
Anyway, just my thoughts on it. :)
Sheppy
Michael J. Mahon
> On 2006-07-29 13:35:44 -0400, "Michael J. Mahon" <mjm...@aol.com> said:
> > But the audio can be remarkably improved by using a wireless clip-on
> > microphone and connecting the receiver to the camera's "mic in". Of
> > course, the standard "please repeat the question" protocol must be used.
> The borrowed camera this year didn't pick up sound as well -- plus the
> room we were in had a terrible echo problem.
>
> If we could get a room with less light and without the echo, doing
> video would be pretty painless.
>
> I'd be inclined to go for a low-priced videocast of the sessions; let
> people pick and choose the ones they want to see.
>
> I do my DV editing in Final Cut or in iMovie (Used FC for the 2003
> videos to do all the fancy footwork I did in those).
>
> Anyway, hopefully next year I'll be able to bring my own camera, and
> hopefully we'll have a better room. This year, the camera stayed home
> because I have a daughter who's only a smidge over a year old, and the
> camera is required to remain within a 60 foot radius of her at all
> times. :)
If you haven't tried a mic close to the speaker's mouth, try it--the
result is fantastic compared to a mic even 5 feet away. It makes
the room reverb irrelevant, unless a PA system is being used.
-michael
Sean Fahey
> Just as it would be silly to restrict a factory that makes Christmas
> tree lights to using them to light the factory, thinking of Apple II
> services as valuable just because they are accessible to Apple II
> computers is a fallacy.
But some of the people on Syndicomm really do use their Apple II to
access the service.
Michael J. Mahon
I understand--but in my mind, the value is in the discourse among
folks thinking about the Apple II, not in how it's accessed.
-michael
Eric Shepherd
> If you haven't tried a mic close to the speaker's mouth, try it--the
> result is fantastic compared to a mic even 5 feet away. It makes
> the room reverb irrelevant, unless a PA system is being used.
We didn't have a mic available this year, unfortunately. I hope to be
better prepared next year.
Of course, you sound like you know what you're talking about -- perhaps
you should come next year and handle this stuff. Would be nice to take
that off my plate -- I'm always so busy between doing presentations,
helping folks out, writing code, participating in HackFest (either as a
judge or competitor), and so forth, that being able to ditch the video
stuff on someone else would be a huge relief!
Sheppy
Eric Shepherd
> I understand--but in my mind, the value is in the discourse among
> folks thinking about the Apple II, not in how it's accessed.
Well, I feel that folks that use their Apple II to get online should
have a place to talk about the Apple II, which is why I set up the
service in the first place. :)
Sheppy
Sean Fahey
> If you haven't tried a mic close to the speaker's mouth, try it--the
> result is fantastic compared to a mic even 5 feet away. It makes
> the room reverb irrelevant, unless a PA system is being used.
I know these are helpful hints and suggestions. However, IMHO its a drag
to worry about taping and/or webcasting something when I'd rather have
my full attention on whats going on. I don't feel like I have to be
responsible, or that I'm letting people down if there is a glitch. I'm
just there to have fun.
Please come to KFest next year and bring your camera, mic and whatever
you need to broadcast. I'll help you set it up.
Kirk Mitchell
Sean Fahey wrote:
> But some of the people on Syndicomm really do use their Apple II to
> access the service.
Exactly. I use Kim Howe's TelnetNDA to access the chat there. It just
gives me warm fuzzies. B-{)
Kirk
Eric Shepherd
> Please come to KFest next year and bring your camera, mic and whatever
> you need to broadcast. I'll help you set it up.
Heck, I'll provide the server to host the files. We have a boatload of
bandwidth on Syndicomm's server that's not being used right now, and
tons of disk space that's not being used yet.
Sheppy
mdj
Eric Shepherd wrote:
> Well, the main value to Syndicomm's Apple II forum is that you can
> access it using pretty much anything, all the way down to a dumb
> terminal, as long as you can do telnet.
>
> That's the entire point, really. A totally text-based forum that lets
> people using actual Apple IIs communicate with each other.
I wonder how many folks still directly dial from their Apple II's ? I
haven't personally done that since about 1992.
These days I'd bet the vast majority are using either another local
machine as a gateway, or have their Apple II ethernet equipped.
There are a lot of ways around the problem on the client end that would
avoid having to maintain server side software.
Matt