Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss

Unipod and Pen Drives

6 views
Skip to first unread message

Denis C Todd

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 9:47:10 AM11/17/07
to
I've just been given a 128MB pen drive and got it working fine on
Unipod.
Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8 characters. ie
any filename of over 8 characters is truncated.Is there any way I can
get the pen drive to save long filenames ??
Using risc od 4.02
RiscPC ARM
TIA

--
Denis C Todd

John Williams (News)

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 9:58:59 AM11/17/07
to
In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,

Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:

> Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8 characters. ie
> any filename of over 8 characters is truncated.Is there any way I can
> get the pen drive to save long filenames ??

It would on an Iyonix which has an improved DOS filing system.

You could format it under RISC OS, but it would then be invisible (in the
'unformatted' sense) to PCs, thus rendering it much less useful!

But, if you only want it readable by RISC OS, that would work.

You could put stuff in zip files instead - which should preserve the long
filenames for both systems, but it'd be a fag.

You can, if you wish to use it for transfer to and from a 'PC', add file
extensions in addition to your 8 characters. As it is, it's just like a
(big) DOS floppy.

John

--
John Williams, Brittany, Northern France - no attachments to these addresses!
Non-RISC OS posters change user to johnrwilliams or put 'risc' in subject
for reliable contact! Who is John Williams? http://www.picindex.info/author/
Somewhere nice to stay in Brittany? http://petit.four.free.fr/visitors/locate

druck

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 10:25:37 AM11/17/07
to
On 17 Nov 2007 Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> I've just been given a 128MB pen drive and got it working fine on
> Unipod.
> Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8 characters. ie
> any filename of over 8 characters is truncated.Is there any way I can
> get the pen drive to save long filenames ??
> Using risc od 4.02

!Win95FS from CJE.

---druck

--
The ARM Club Free Software - http://www.armclub.org.uk/free/
The 32bit Conversions Page - http://www.quantumsoft.co.uk/druck/

Dave Symes

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 10:49:23 AM11/17/07
to
In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,

Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:

I've just taken a file with a 34 character name out of a RO filer
directory and put it on my 1Gig Pendrive and all the characters display.
SARPC Select RO 6.06 and did work on previous versions.
A couple of things to consider.

1) I have Win95FS installed in my boot sequence.
2) Though I have the Filer Configuration "name truncation" set to 20
characters, I also have installed "!Fullnames" By Andrew Booker, which
reveals the full extent of a filer name when the mouse pointer is hovered
over a Directory/file.

Cheers
Dave S

--

cfe...@freeremoveuk.com.invalid

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 1:05:59 PM11/17/07
to
In message <4f433605...@tiscali.co.uk>

"John Williams (News)" <UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

> In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,
> Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8 characters.
> > ie any filename of over 8 characters is truncated.Is there any way
> > I can get the pen drive to save long filenames ??
>
> It would on an Iyonix which has an improved DOS filing system.
>

What about going to the 'ROOL' site and download all-bin-2007-11-5/zip

And search for 'Modules.FileSys.DOSFS'

--
Colin Ferris Cornwall UK

Richard Porter

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 5:53:16 PM11/17/07
to
The date being 17 Nov 2007, "John Williams (News)"
<UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> decided to write:

> In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,
> Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:

>> Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8 characters. ie
>> any filename of over 8 characters is truncated.Is there any way I can
>> get the pen drive to save long filenames ??

> It would on an Iyonix which has an improved DOS filing system.

> You could format it under RISC OS, but it would then be invisible (in
> the 'unformatted' sense) to PCs, thus rendering it much less useful!

I have a 1GB pen drive which I haven't reformatted, but files copied
to it on the RPC are only visible on the RPC, and files copied to it
on a Mac or XP PC are only visible on the Mac and XP PCs. It seems to
have two exclusive partitions. I also have a 128MB pen drive with is
fine.

--
Richard Porter
ricp at / www. minijem.plus.com
"You can't have Windows without pains."

druck

unread,
Nov 17, 2007, 6:26:48 PM11/17/07
to
On 17 Nov 2007 Richard Porter <dontu...@address.uk.invalid> wrote:
> I have a 1GB pen drive which I haven't reformatted, but files copied
> to it on the RPC are only visible on the RPC, and files copied to it
> on a Mac or XP PC are only visible on the Mac and XP PCs. It seems to
> have two exclusive partitions. I also have a 128MB pen drive with is
> fine.

Its more likely to be down to the broken formatting used by XP. It
formats FAT16 with a FAT32 style variable size root directory, where
as other systems which handle FAT16 expect it to have a fixed size
root directory as the format specifies. This means there can be two
different root directories and files seen by one system aren't seen
by another.

The solution is not to trust Microsoft to conform to their own filing
system formats, and format the pen as FAT16 or FAT32 on a different
system.

Denis C Todd

unread,
Nov 18, 2007, 5:21:45 AM11/18/07
to
In message <f93247434...@cferris.freeuk.com>
cfe...@freeRemoveuk.com.invalid wrote:

Downloaded DOSFS 0.85 and this seems to have solved it !
Including being allowed to use lower case.

Where in my Boot sequence do I put the module ?

--
Denis C Todd

Derek Haslam

unread,
Nov 18, 2007, 5:45:24 AM11/18/07
to
In article <4f433605...@tiscali.co.uk>, John Williams

(News) <UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,
> Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:

> > Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8
> > characters. ie any filename of over 8 characters is
> > truncated.Is there any way I can get the pen drive to
> > save long filenames ??

> It would on an Iyonix which has an improved DOS filing
> system.

> You could format it under RISC OS, but it would then be
> invisible (in the 'unformatted' sense) to PCs, thus
> rendering it much less useful!

How does one do this? I would find it useful to have a RISC
OS-formatted pen drive but the Format option on the iconbar
menu of the device is greyed out.

> [snip]

Derek Haslam

--
Derek Haslam dhaslam atte boulsworth dotcodotuk
Powerbase Support http://www.boulsworth.co.uk/

John Williams (News)

unread,
Nov 18, 2007, 6:25:47 AM11/18/07
to
In article <4f43a2b2...@boulsworth.co.uk>,
Derek Haslam <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

> How does one do this? I would find it useful to have a RISC
> OS-formatted pen drive but the Format option on the iconbar
> menu of the device is greyed out.

The Iyonix is supplied with a SCSIForm application in Utilities.USB-Mass. I
assume a similar utility exists for the UniPod SCSI interface. Perhaps
someone could confirm for completeness.

druck

unread,
Nov 18, 2007, 6:46:03 AM11/18/07
to
On 18 Nov 2007 Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> Downloaded DOSFS 0.85 and this seems to have solved it !
> Including being allowed to use lower case.

> Where in my Boot sequence do I put the module ?

You could just put it in directly in to PreDesk, but that may cause
problems in the future. A better solution is to create a sub directory
and constaining !Run obey file to RMEnsure the module. Then if you
ever have a newer module in ROM it wont be downgraded by something in
your boot sequence.

Steve Potts

unread,
Nov 18, 2007, 7:05:46 AM11/18/07
to
In message <4f43a2b2...@boulsworth.co.uk>
Derek Haslam <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

> In article <4f433605...@tiscali.co.uk>, John Williams
> (News) <UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> > In article <fcfe34434...@aquatodd.btinternet.com>,
> > Denis C Todd <aqua...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > > Unfortunately , it only save s files withe the first 8
> > > characters. ie any filename of over 8 characters is
> > > truncated.Is there any way I can get the pen drive to
> > > save long filenames ??
>
> > It would on an Iyonix which has an improved DOS filing
> > system.
>
> > You could format it under RISC OS, but it would then be
> > invisible (in the 'unformatted' sense) to PCs, thus
> > rendering it much less useful!
>
> How does one do this? I would find it useful to have a RISC
> OS-formatted pen drive but the Format option on the iconbar
> menu of the device is greyed out.
>
> > [snip]
>
> Derek Haslam
>

If you have access to Windows 98, this will also format the device so that it
is usable on RISC OS.

--
StevePotts at blastzone DOT demon STOP co DOT uk (www.blastzone.demon.co.uk/)
Written on RISC OS.
http://www.riscos.com/

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Theo Markettos

unread,
Nov 19, 2007, 6:59:45 AM11/19/07
to
"John Williams (News)" <UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> The Iyonix is supplied with a SCSIForm application in Utilities.USB-Mass. I
> assume a similar utility exists for the UniPod SCSI interface. Perhaps
> someone could confirm for completeness.

MassFS 1 on the UniPod doesn't provide a FileCore filing system - it
emulates a single file which is presented as a PC card DOS partition, which
it then opens to implement the DOS formatting. So it's not possible to
format it for RISC OS. There is a program to format as DOS however:
http://www.riscos.info/index.php/Simtec_USB_technical
(did someone do a frontend to this?)

MassFS 1.99/2 on the A9 does provide a FileCore filing system and so there
should be a formatter supplied (is there?)

Theo

Brian Carroll

unread,
Nov 19, 2007, 9:14:28 AM11/19/07
to
In article <4f43a68b...@tiscali.co.uk>, John Williams

(News) <UCE...@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
> In article <4f43a2b2...@boulsworth.co.uk>, Derek Haslam
> <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

> > How does one do this? I would find it useful to have a RISC
> > OS-formatted pen drive but the Format option on the iconbar
> > menu of the device is greyed out.

> The Iyonix is supplied with a SCSIForm application in
> Utilities.USB-Mass. I assume a similar utility exists for the
> UniPod SCSI interface. Perhaps someone could confirm for
> completeness.

Yes. The UNIpod does not include a SCSI disc interface.

There are 2 Simtec /IDE/ ports for which a formatting utility,
IDEtool, is provided. This does provide partitioning facilities
for IDE discs but it is over 10 years old, updated in 2004.
There is no utility for formatting devices attached to the USB
port(s).

Theo has explained further, but to avoid potential confusion,
note that on the RiscPC MassFS is an application in
Boot.Resources entirely divorced from the USB interface to which
it attached and its firmware.

--
______________________________________________________________

Brian Carroll, Ripon, North Yorkshire, UK bric at f2s dot com
______________________________________________________________

Jerome Mathevet

unread,
Nov 19, 2007, 11:09:06 AM11/19/07
to
In message <6040a843...@druck.freeuk.net>
druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:

[Using new DOSFS from RISC OS Open]


>You could just put it in directly in to PreDesk, but that may cause
>problems in the future. A better solution is to create a sub directory
>and constaining !Run obey file to RMEnsure the module. Then if you
>ever have a newer module in ROM it wont be downgraded by something in
>your boot sequence.

I have done exactly what you suggested and have upgraded DOSFS and lots of
modules in my old 4.03 OS. However, how do I go about upgrading Pinboard
("!Size not found") and the Wimp ?

--
Jerome Mathevet

Derek Haslam

unread,
Nov 19, 2007, 1:52:34 PM11/19/07
to
In article <DgE*S6...@news.chiark.greenend.org.uk>, Theo

> Theo

Thank you. That at least clarifies the position.

Andrew Wickham

unread,
Nov 23, 2007, 11:53:39 AM11/23/07
to
On 18 Nov, 11:46, druck <n...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:

> On 18 Nov 2007 Denis C Todd <aquat...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>
> > Downloaded DOSFS 0.85 and this seems to have solved it !
> > Including being allowed to use lower case.
> > Where in my Boot sequence do I put the module ?
>
> You could just put it in directly in to PreDesk, but that may cause
> problems in the future. A better solution is to create a sub directory
> and constaining !Run obey file to RMEnsure the module. Then if you
> ever have a newer module in ROM it wont be downgraded by something in
> your boot sequence.
>
But which PreDesk? Under 4.39 I have several; I started with
!Boot.Choices.Hardware.Disabled.Boot.PreDesk
but !Reporter indicated something had gone wrong, and I was left with
no
DOSFS at all. Soft-loading in the desktop worked fine, so I expect a
load
point later in the boot sequence will be fine too; just not sure I
have the
patience for trial-and-error. I think !
Boot.Choices.Users.Single.Tasks
should (for user "Single") be at/near the end, but would a "later"
PreDesk
or an "earlier" Tasks be a better place?

Andrew

Tony Moore

unread,
Nov 23, 2007, 1:56:44 PM11/23/07
to
On 23 Nov 2007, Andrew Wickham <ajw...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> On 18 Nov, 11:46, druck <n...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:
> > On 18 Nov 2007 Denis C Todd <aquat...@btinternet.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Downloaded DOSFS 0.85 and this seems to have solved it ! Including
> > > being allowed to use lower case. Where in my Boot sequence do I
> > > put the module ?
> >
> > You could just put it in directly in to PreDesk, but that may cause
> > problems in the future. A better solution is to create a sub
> > directory and constaining !Run obey file to RMEnsure the module.
> > Then if you ever have a newer module in ROM it wont be downgraded by
> > something in your boot sequence.
> >
> But which PreDesk?

*filer_opendir <Choices$Write>.Boot.PreDesk

However, when I did that, there seemed to be a clash with Unipod, so I
moved the obey file to <Choices$Write>.Boot.PreDesk.Tasks . No problem.

Tony

druck

unread,
Nov 23, 2007, 4:26:12 PM11/23/07
to
On 23 Nov 2007 Andrew Wickham <ajw...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> But which PreDesk? Under 4.39 I have several;

Use the one associated with your user account, normally 'single'
unless you've set up different users.

Andrew

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 8:33:22 AM12/9/07
to
Having picked up on this thread late on, could I confirm: I have 19MB
of files recorded from the PC on a memory stick but MassFS displays
nothing except the used memory - is there anyway to read them on RISC
OS?

Andrew

--

John Williams (News)

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 8:39:03 AM12/9/07
to
In article <7dee824e...@no.reply>,
Andrew <newpost...@googlemail.com> wrote:

It is possible that they are in a second partition - which RISC OS can't
see.

Paul Stewart

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 9:16:34 AM12/9/07
to
In message <7dee824e...@no.reply>
newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:

> Andrew

I recently had the same problem with a Buffalo 2Gb memory stick.

You need to reformat your memory stick using. You can do this using
!Usb-Util. A link to this is in the downloads section of the A9home
Compatibility site.

Once formatted both Windows and RISC OS are able to see the same
files.

Regards
--
Paul Stewart - Far Bletchley, Milton Keynes, England.
(msn:sa...@hotmail.com)

Be Bold. Dare To Be Different. Use RISC OS (http://www.riscos.com).
It's blue and from outta town - The A9home
(http://www.advantage6.co.uk/A9hsplash.html).
A9home Compatibility page -
(http://www.phawfaux.co.uk/a9home/compatibility.asp).

Derek Haslam

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 10:46:56 AM12/9/07
to
In article <2696864...@phawfaux.co.uk>, Paul Stewart

<pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
> You need to reformat your memory stick using. You can do
> this using !Usb-Util. A link to this is in the
> downloads section of the A9home Compatibility site.

The documentation with !Usb-Util states that it's for
managing USB massFS devices on the A9home. Is it OK for use
on a Unipod?

Paul Stewart

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 10:59:19 AM12/9/07
to
In message <4f4e8edb...@boulsworth.co.uk>
Derek Haslam <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

> In article <2696864...@phawfaux.co.uk>, Paul Stewart
> <pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
>> You need to reformat your memory stick using. You can do
>> this using !Usb-Util. A link to this is in the
>> downloads section of the A9home Compatibility site.

> The documentation with !Usb-Util states that it's for
> managing USB massFS devices on the A9home. Is it OK for use
> on a Unipod?

Do not have a Unipod, therefore cannot comment.
However there is one way of find out......

Brian Carroll

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 3:49:17 PM12/9/07
to
In article <2afe8f4...@phawfaux.co.uk>, Paul Stewart

<pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <4f4e8edb...@boulsworth.co.uk> Derek Haslam
> <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

[Snip]

> > The documentation with !Usb-Util states that it's for
> > managing USB massFS devices on the A9home. Is it OK for use
> > on a Unipod?

> Do not have a Unipod, therefore cannot comment. However there
> is one way of find out......

Indeed, and I tried that a day or two ago after you had
mentioned the USButil on another thread. On clicking to load to
the iconbar an immediate error "SWI not known in user code" but
it does load. then clicking on the icon "Unknown or missing
variable in user code", both are errors from WimpWorks.

It sounds as though it would be very useful for UNIpod users,
however.

Brian.

PS, I notice that you are supplying a very recent MkDOSDisc
(22 Feb 07 - my birthday!); where is it from?

--
______________________________________________________________

Brian Carroll, Ripon, N Yorks, UK briancarroll at f2s dot com
______________________________________________________________

Paul Stewart

unread,
Dec 9, 2007, 4:00:07 PM12/9/07
to
In message <4f4eaa8a2e...@argonet.co.uk>
Brian Carroll <bric-...@argonet.co.uk> wrote:

> In article <2afe8f4...@phawfaux.co.uk>, Paul Stewart
> <pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
>> In message <4f4e8edb...@boulsworth.co.uk> Derek Haslam
>> <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

> [Snip]

>>> The documentation with !Usb-Util states that it's for
>>> managing USB massFS devices on the A9home. Is it OK for use
>>> on a Unipod?

>> Do not have a Unipod, therefore cannot comment. However there
>> is one way of find out......

> Indeed, and I tried that a day or two ago after you had
> mentioned the USButil on another thread. On clicking to load to
> the iconbar an immediate error "SWI not known in user code" but
> it does load. then clicking on the icon "Unknown or missing
> variable in user code", both are errors from WimpWorks.

> It sounds as though it would be very useful for UNIpod users,
> however.

> Brian.

> PS, I notice that you are supplying a very recent MkDOSDisc
> (22 Feb 07 - my birthday!); where is it from?

Apparently it is part of the Open Source !PCPro application.

Kees also provides a utility to format memory sticks here:
http://www.riscos-online.nl/A9support/patches/USBformat.zip

This maybe of some use to you.

Bob Potter

unread,
Dec 10, 2007, 4:57:17 AM12/10/07
to

"Brian Carroll" <bric-...@argonet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:4f4eaa8a2e...@argonet.co.uk...
>
> 22 Feb 07 - my birthday!

You're younger than I thought!

bobp


David Holden

unread,
Dec 10, 2007, 5:02:11 AM12/10/07
to

Or a lot older :-)

--
David Holden - APDL - <http://www.apdl.co.uk>

Bill (Adopt)

unread,
Dec 10, 2007, 6:54:11 AM12/10/07
to
In article <5s4h56F...@mid.individual.net>,
David Holden <Spa...@apdl.co.uk> wrote:

> On 10-Dec-2007, "Bob Potter" <bob.p...@argonet.co.uk> wrote:

> > "Brian Carroll" <bric-...@argonet.co.uk> wrote in message
> > news:4f4eaa8a2e...@argonet.co.uk...
> > >
> > > 22 Feb 07 - my birthday!
> >
> > You're younger than I thought!

> Or a lot older :-)

(..as he strokes whiskers, tucks belly in over pants,
pulls on black boots and reaches for ..green.. cloak
and furry trimmed sleigh cap..?

..hmmm.. must be older... ;'))

--
Adoption InterLink UK with -=- http://www.billsimpson.com/
Domain Host Orpheus Internet -=- http://www.orpheusinternet.co.uk/

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 10, 2007, 8:36:05 AM12/10/07
to
On 9 Dec 2007, Paul Stewart <pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
> In message <4f4eaa8a2e...@argonet.co.uk>
> Brian Carroll <bric-...@argonet.co.uk> wrote:
> > In article <2afe8f4...@phawfaux.co.uk>, Paul Stewart
> > <pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:
> > > In message <4f4e8edb...@boulsworth.co.uk> Derek Haslam
> > > <dha...@ukgateway.invalid> wrote:

[snip]

> > > > The documentation with !Usb-Util states that it's for managing
> > > > USB massFS devices on the A9home. Is it OK for use on a Unipod?
> > >
> > > Do not have a Unipod, therefore cannot comment. However there is
> > > one way of find out......
> >
> > Indeed, and I tried that a day or two ago after you had mentioned
> > the USButil on another thread. On clicking to load to the iconbar an
> > immediate error "SWI not known in user code" but it does load. then
> > clicking on the icon "Unknown or missing variable in user code",
> > both are errors from WimpWorks.
> >
> > It sounds as though it would be very useful for UNIpod users,
> > however.

It apparently runs on a SARPC, RO6.06 but, having scanned Unipod MassFS,
selecting a flash-drive and clicking 'Initialise' leads to

Error from MkDOSDisc
Unknown task
Couldn't change filetype in order to overwrite partiton

I don't know if that error results from some peculiarity of the flash-
drive, or if it is caused by that version of MkDOSDisc (22 Feb 2007).
(An earlier copy of MkDOSDisc runs, and formats, correctly).

> > Brian.
> >
> > PS, I notice that you are supplying a very recent MkDOSDisc
> > (22 Feb 07 - my birthday!); where is it from?
>
> Apparently it is part of the Open Source !PCPro application.
>
> Kees also provides a utility to format memory sticks here:
> http://www.riscos-online.nl/A9support/patches/USBformat.zip

USBformat.zip contains a copy of MkDOSDisc which is identical to the
copy supplied with USB-util (which is a front end for MkDOSDisc).

Tony

Andrew

unread,
Dec 11, 2007, 2:51:00 PM12/11/07
to
In message <0188ab4...@phawfaux.co.uk>
Paul Stewart <pauls...@phawfaux.co.uk> wrote:


is part of the Open Source !PCPro application.
>
> Kees also provides a utility to format memory sticks here:
> http://www.riscos-online.nl/A9support/patches/USBformat.zip
>
> This maybe of some use to you.
>

How do you operate it? Set CSD to the drive and then save the
partition onto it? eg. *MKDOSDisc partition <size>

In what units is <size>?

Andrew

--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 11, 2007, 3:44:07 PM12/11/07
to

Copy MkDOSDisc to Library, and re-boot the machine (or, if present,
double-click ScanLibs, instead of re-booting).

The command needed is

*MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos

<drive_name> is the name of the flash-drive, ie the name under the USB
icon, on the iconbar.

<size> is the capacity of the drive in MB * 1.024 * 1.024

eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is

*MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos

Tony

newpost...@googlemail.com

unread,
Dec 13, 2007, 5:55:07 PM12/13/07
to
In message <fdbcb14f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> Copy MkDOSDisc to Library, and re-boot the machine (or, if present,
> double-click ScanLibs, instead of re-booting).
>
> The command needed is
>
> *MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos
>
> <drive_name> is the name of the flash-drive, ie the name under the USB
> icon, on the iconbar.
>
> <size> is the capacity of the drive in MB * 1.024 * 1.024
>
> eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is
>
> *MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos
>
> Tony

I get "couldn't change filetype in order to overwrite partition".

Andrew

Andrew

unread,
Dec 13, 2007, 5:52:07 PM12/13/07
to

> Copy MkDOSDisc to Library, and re-boot the machine (or, if present,
> double-click ScanLibs, instead of re-booting).
>
> The command needed is
>
> *MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos
>
> <drive_name> is the name of the flash-drive, ie the name under the USB
> icon, on the iconbar.
>
> <size> is the capacity of the drive in MB * 1.024 * 1.024
>
> eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is
>
> *MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos
>
> Tony

I get "couldn't change filetype in order to overwrite partition".

Andrew
--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 14, 2007, 10:30:52 AM12/14/07
to
On 13 Dec 2007, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
> In message <fdbcb14f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > Copy MkDOSDisc to Library, and re-boot the machine (or, if present,
> > double-click ScanLibs, instead of re-booting).
> >
> > The command needed is
> >
> > *MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos
> >
> > <drive_name> is the name of the flash-drive, ie the name under the
> > USB icon, on the iconbar.
> >
> > <size> is the capacity of the drive in MB * 1.024 * 1.024
> >
> > eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is
> >
> > *MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos
>
> I get "couldn't change filetype in order to overwrite partition".

So do I, as noted in message
<57b7064f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>. It seems that that
version of MkDOSDisc is not compatible with Unipod and/or RO6.06. An
earlier version does work, and I'll email a copy to you if you let me
have your address (my from address is valid).

Tony

Andrew

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 7:32:53 AM12/15/07
to

> MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos

The new version you sent me seems to have worked thanks. By this I
mean I just get a new command line prompt after issuing the above
(with 1GB/1076) set. The previous format seemed to be a DOS partition
however as deleting it required me to quit GuardDD (from the PC card
installation). How is this different?

Andrew
--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 8:46:57 AM12/15/07
to
On 15 Dec 2007, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
> In message <fdbcb14f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos
>
> The new version you sent me seems to have worked thanks. By this I
> mean I just get a new command line prompt after issuing the above

It formatted the flash drive, without error.

> (with 1GB/1076) set.

My arithmetic makes that 1048. The specified size should not exceed the
capacity of the flash drive.

> The previous format seemed to be a DOS partition however as deleting
> it required me to quit GuardDD (from the PC card installation).

Sorry, I know nothing about GuardDD or the PC card.

> How is this different?

Different to what? Does the formatted drive behave correctly with both
RISC OS and Windows? ie can you read/write from both platforms, and can
you see the same file, from both platforms?

Tony

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 11:51:09 AM12/15/07
to
On 14 Dec 2007, Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> It seems that that [ROOL] version of MkDOSDisc is not compatible with


> Unipod and/or RO6.06. An earlier version does work, and I'll email a
> copy to you if you let me have your address

Several people have taken up my offer, but I'd like to put MkDOSDisc
(10 May 2006) where it is more easily accessible.

The history of the utility is as follows:

In 2006, Justin Fletcher announced that the copy of MkDOSDisc contained
in the, then open-source, PCPro 3.06 could be used to format a DOS disc
under MassFS.

In fact, it didn't work properly but, after taking up the matter with
Justin, he fixed it, and told me that he would upload it to his website.
Notwithstanding a reminder, the utility has not appeared there.

I have an email from Justin in which he says that MkDOSDisc is freeware,
and that I may do as I please with it. Since I don't have any webspace,
would anyone care to suggest an appropriate home for MkDOSDisc?

Tony

Andrew

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 5:20:33 PM12/15/07
to
In message <d4e39a514f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> On 15 Dec 2007, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
>> In message <fdbcb14f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
>> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>> > MkDOSDisc MassFS::<drive_name>.$ <size> -initdos
>>
>> The new version you sent me seems to have worked thanks. By this I
>> mean I just get a new command line prompt after issuing the above
>
> It formatted the flash drive, without error.
>

Ok.

>> (with 1GB/1076) set.
>
> My arithmetic makes that 1048. The specified size should not exceed the
> capacity of the flash drive.
>
>> The previous format seemed to be a DOS partition however as deleting
>> it required me to quit GuardDD (from the PC card installation).
>
> Sorry, I know nothing about GuardDD or the PC card.
>

GuardDD just protects against DOS partitions being deleted as PCPro
requires a partition for Windows98.

>> How is this different?
>
> Different to what? Does the formatted drive behave correctly with both
> RISC OS and Windows? ie can you read/write from both platforms, and can
> you see the same file, from both platforms?
>

Well I thought the point was to format the drive in a way different to
its factory setting - which didn't allow the files to show on both
platforms but could be recorded upon by both.

Andrew


--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 5:41:57 PM12/15/07
to
On 15 Dec 2007, Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> Since I don't have any webspace, would anyone care to suggest an
> appropriate home for MkDOSDisc?

Simon Willcocks has kindly reminded me of Drobe, so MkDOSDisc (10 May
2006) and a readme file can now be found at

http://oldcoaster.drobe.co.uk/mkdosdisc.zip

Tony

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 15, 2007, 6:06:48 PM12/15/07
to
On 15 Dec 2007, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:

[snip]

> Well I thought the point was to format the drive in a way different to
> its factory setting - which didn't allow the files to show on both
> platforms but could be recorded upon by both.

For me, after using MkDOSDisc to format a flash-drive, I can read/write
files to it using RISC OS, I can read/write files to it using WindowsXP,
and files written by RISC OS can be read by WindowsXP, and vice versa.

If yours doesn't do that, try formatting it to FAT 16 (not 32) on your
Windows machine then re-format it on the RPC using MkDOSDisc.

Tony

Dave Symes

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 3:01:10 AM12/16/07
to
In article <fedecb514f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,

> [snip]

> http://oldcoaster.drobe.co.uk/mkdosdisc.zip

> Tony

Excellent stuff, good man.

A question if I may.

In the ReadMe an example is...

eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is

*MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos

Where does the 134 in the command come from if it's a 128MB flash drive?

1024 * 128 = 131072

Cheers
Dave S

--

Dave Symes

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 3:04:54 AM12/16/07
to
In article <3825ce514f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,

> [snip]

> Tony

Sorry, another question. (Genuine Q BTW.)

How do you manage to format anything FAT 16 on an XP machine?

Cheers
Dave S

--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 4:41:07 AM12/16/07
to
On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:

[snip]

> In the ReadMe an example is...
>
> eg, for a 128MB flash-drive, named 'flash', the command is
>
> *MkDOSDisc MassFS::flash.$ 134 -initdos
>
> Where does the 134 in the command come from if it's a 128MB flash
> drive?
>
> 1024 * 128 = 131072

It's the [nominal capacity of the drive] * 1.024 * 1.024
so in the example: 128 * 1.024 * 1.024 = 134

Tony

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 4:51:55 AM12/16/07
to
On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:

[snip]

> How do you manage to format anything FAT 16 on an XP machine?

open 'My computer'
right-click on the flash-drive
choose 'Format...'
in the 'File system' menu choose FAT (replacing the default FAT32)
click 'Start'

Tony

Dave Symes

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 6:41:43 AM12/16/07
to
In article <473808524f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,

> [snip]

> Tony

Thanks, I see.

Cheers
Dave S

--

Dave Symes

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 7:00:30 AM12/16/07
to
In article <223509524f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,

> [snip]

> Tony

I was under the impression that doing so (FAT under XP) would make the
Pendrive totally unreadable under RO., unless you have Win95FS installed.

I do have Win95FS installed so my reformat on XP of a Pendrive works
anyway.

However thanks for the info, I'd forgotten.

BTW. The MKDOSDisc works a treat here SARPC and Unipod USB.

Cheers
Dave S

--

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 8:00:58 AM12/16/07
to
On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:
> In article <223509524f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,
> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> > On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:
>
> > [snip]
>
> > > How do you manage to format anything FAT 16 on an XP machine?

[snip details]

> I was under the impression that doing so (FAT under XP) would make the
> Pendrive totally unreadable under RO

For me, _FAT32_ makes the pendrive unreadable, but FAT is ok. In fact, I
used FAT to reformat, until MkDOSDisc came along.

> unless you have Win95FS installed.

I don't have Win95FS.

[snip]

> The MKDOSDisc works a treat here SARPC and Unipod USB.

That's good. Incidentally, using it with USB-util, as explained in the
readme file, provides a GUI, and avoids tricky arithmetic.

Tony

druck

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 8:40:57 AM12/16/07
to
On 16 Dec 2007 Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:
>> In article <223509524f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,
>> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>>> On 16 Dec 2007, Dave Symes <d...@ukgateway.net> wrote:
>>
>>> [snip]
>>
>>>> How do you manage to format anything FAT 16 on an XP machine?

> [snip details]

>> I was under the impression that doing so (FAT under XP) would make the
>> Pendrive totally unreadable under RO

> For me, _FAT32_ makes the pendrive unreadable, but FAT is ok. In fact, I
> used FAT to reformat, until MkDOSDisc came along.

DOSFS on all version of RISC OS except RISC OS 5 only handles
FAT12/16. For FAT32 you need either RISC OS 5, or Win95FS on
anything else.

---druck

--
The ARM Club Free Software - http://www.armclub.org.uk/free/
The 32bit Conversions Page - http://www.quantumsoft.co.uk/druck/

Dave Symes

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 10:56:36 AM12/16/07
to
In article <1c841a524f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>,
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[Snippy]

> That's good. Incidentally, using it with USB-util, as explained in the
> readme file, provides a GUI, and avoids tricky arithmetic.

> Tony

Yup! tried that as well, worked okay.

Thanks
Dave S

--

Jess

unread,
Dec 16, 2007, 11:08:44 AM12/16/07
to
In message <202d1e52...@druck.freeuk.net>
druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:

> DOSFS on all version of RISC OS except RISC OS 5 only handles
> FAT12/16. For FAT32 you need either RISC OS 5, or Win95FS on
> anything else.

Or the DOSFS from RISC OS 5 from ROOL on other systems.

--
Jess Iyonix
Hotmail is my spam trap use this for reply:
mailto:nos...@jess.itworkshop-nexus.net or
http://jess.itworkshop-nexus.net

Tony Moore

unread,
Dec 17, 2007, 4:39:46 AM12/17/07
to
On 15 Dec 2007, Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> On 14 Dec 2007, Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

[snip]

> In 2006, Justin Fletcher announced that the copy of MkDOSDisc contained


> in the, then open-source, PCPro 3.06 could be used to format a DOS disc
> under MassFS.

My references to Justin Fletcher here, and elsewhere in relation to this
topic, should have read Jason Tribbeck.

Apologies to both Justin and Jason.

Tony

newpost...@googlemail.com

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 2:58:03 PM1/10/08
to


Tony Moore wrote:

> >
> > The new version you sent me seems to have worked thanks. By this I
> > mean I just get a new command line prompt after issuing the above
>
> It formatted the flash drive, without error.
>
> > (with 1GB/1076) set.
>
> My arithmetic makes that 1048. The specified size should not exceed the
> capacity of the flash drive.
>
> > The previous format seemed to be a DOS partition however as deleting
> > it required me to quit GuardDD (from the PC card installation).
>
> Sorry, I know nothing about GuardDD or the PC card.
>
> > How is this different?
>
> Different to what? Does the formatted drive behave correctly with both
> RISC OS and Windows? ie can you read/write from both platforms, and can
> you see the same file, from both platforms?
>

For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
but what on earth did it do this for?

Andrew

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 3:38:14 PM1/10/08
to
On 10 Jan 2008, newpost...@googlemail.com wrote:
> Tony Moore wrote:
>
> > > The new version [of MkDOSDisc] you sent me seems to have worked

> > > thanks. By this I mean I just get a new command line prompt after
> > > issuing the above
> >
> > It formatted the flash drive, without error.

[snip]

> For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
> presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
> but what on earth did it do this for?

I doubt if XP deleted any files but what, exactly, happened? You saved
files to the flash drive, on the RISC OS machine, and now they cannot be
seen on the XP machine? Or you saved files to the flash drive, on the XP
machine, which now cannot be seen on the XP machine? Or ... ?

Anyway, I would suggest copying the files from the flash drive, wherever
they are accessible, and then re-formatting the flash drive.

Tony

Dave Higton

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 4:17:19 PM1/10/08
to
In message <dc1db043-4c1f-442a...@t1g2000pra.googlegroups.com>
newpost...@googlemail.com wrote:

> For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
> presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
> but what on earth did it do this for?

Because Microsoft knows best?

More seriously, did you go through the "Safely remove hardware"
bit on Windows after altering the drive's contents?

Dave

druck

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 5:36:15 PM1/10/08
to
On 10 Jan 2008 newpost...@googlemail.com wrote:
> For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
> presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
> but what on earth did it do this for?

Whats more likely is the drive is formatted to XP's bastardised
version of FAT16 which doesn't follow the published standard. This
results in Windows and RISC OS using different root directories,
so you can see the files written by one machine on that machine,
but the other machine either shows it empty, or containing a
completely different set of files.

The solution is to either use Win95FS which can work with XPs
FAT16 (or better still FAT32), or reformat the card either on
Win98 or using a RISC OS utility (mkdosdisc, mkdosfs, etc).

Andrew

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 6:28:44 PM1/10/08
to
In message <3347245f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:


>
>> For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
>> presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
>> but what on earth did it do this for?
>
> I doubt if XP deleted any files but what, exactly, happened? You saved
> files to the flash drive, on the RISC OS machine, and now they cannot be
> seen on the XP machine? Or you saved files to the flash drive, on the XP
> machine, which now cannot be seen on the XP machine? Or ... ?
>
> Anyway, I would suggest copying the files from the flash drive, wherever
> they are accessible, and then re-formatting the flash drive.
>

I was referring generally to the thread: I have a memory stick which
I'd formatted with MKDOSdisc to be read/write compatible on ROS and
WXP. On inserting it into a WXP machine today, it suddenly blanked
(and verifiably - I'd just seen the origianl files on another WXP
machine) and presented an empty disk. The new files I saved but
nothing else are visible on ROS.


Andrew


--

Andrew

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 6:30:17 PM1/10/08
to
In message <60db275f4f...@dsl.pipex.com>
Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:


>> For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive and
>> presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on RISC OS
>> but what on earth did it do this for?
>
> Because Microsoft knows best?
>

Heh. We can run down the relative merits of RISC OS hardware but I've
not see it do something as stupid as this.

> More seriously, did you go through the "Safely remove hardware"
> bit on Windows after altering the drive's contents?
>

I didn't alter them, WXP did apparently.

Andrew

--

Andrew

unread,
Jan 10, 2008, 6:32:58 PM1/10/08
to
In message <46152f5f...@druck.freeuk.net>
druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:


> Whats more likely is the drive is formatted to XP's bastardised
> version of FAT16 which doesn't follow the published standard. This
> results in Windows and RISC OS using different root directories,
> so you can see the files written by one machine on that machine,
> but the other machine either shows it empty, or containing a
> completely different set of files.
>
> The solution is to either use Win95FS which can work with XPs
> FAT16 (or better still FAT32), or reformat the card either on
> Win98 or using a RISC OS utility (mkdosdisc, mkdosfs, etc).
>

It was formatted using mkdosdisc but for whatever reason, XP seems to
have formatted it again. I just inserted the stick and clicked on the
"open folder" (from memory) option in the window it shows.

Andrew

--

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 11, 2008, 6:15:58 AM1/11/08
to
On 10 Jan 2008, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
> In message <46152f5f...@druck.freeuk.net>
> druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:
>
> > Whats more likely is the drive is formatted to XP's bastardised
> > version of FAT16 which doesn't follow the published standard. This
> > results in Windows and RISC OS using different root directories, so
> > you can see the files written by one machine on that machine, but
> > the other machine either shows it empty, or containing a completely
> > different set of files.
> >
> > The solution is to either use Win95FS which can work with XPs FAT16
> > (or better still FAT32), or reformat the card either on Win98 or
> > using a RISC OS utility (mkdosdisc, mkdosfs, etc).
> >
> It was formatted using mkdosdisc but for whatever reason, XP seems to
> have formatted it again.

XP won't have formatted the drive, unless you issued a specific
instruction to do so (My Computer > right click the drive > format).

[snip]

Tony

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 11, 2008, 6:26:21 AM1/11/08
to
On 10 Jan 2008, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
> In message <60db275f4f...@dsl.pipex.com>
> Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> > > For some reason today Windows XP deleted the files on the drive
> > > and presented an empty drive to me. The drive is still readable on
> > > RISC OS but what on earth did it do this for?

[snip]

> > More seriously, did you go through the "Safely remove hardware"
> > bit on Windows after altering the drive's contents?
>
> I didn't alter them, WXP did apparently.

If the files were saved, via Unipod on the RISC OS machine, did you
dismount the drive before removing it?

Tony

Andrew

unread,
Jan 29, 2008, 5:54:03 PM1/29/08
to
In message <34a3745f4f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

>> It was formatted using mkdosdisc but for whatever reason, XP seems to
>> have formatted it again.
>
> XP won't have formatted the drive, unless you issued a specific
> instruction to do so (My Computer > right click the drive > format).
>

Funnily enough on saving a textfile to the disc via the RiscPC and
then dismounting and putting it in the Iyonix almost all the files
were deleted and the textfile corrupt.

Andrew

--

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 30, 2008, 6:23:44 AM1/30/08
to

What does that have to do with XP?

Connect the flash drive to the RPC, format it using MkDOSDisc, and save
some files. If the files are unreadable, or absent, when the flash drive
is read by the Iyonix, and/or XP, the flash drive is probably faulty.

Tony

Andrew

unread,
Jan 30, 2008, 3:09:16 PM1/30/08
to
In message <013b3e694f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

It doesn't apparently have anything to do with XP but I'm just
reporting what seems to be a bug whereby the contents of a (AIUI)
drive that is recognised by both RISC OS and WXP seem to be erased for
no apparent reason.

Andrew


--

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 30, 2008, 4:49:26 PM1/30/08
to
On 30 Jan 2008, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:
> In message <013b3e694f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
> Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> > >
> > > > > It was formatted using mkdosdisc but for whatever reason, XP
> > > > > seems to have formatted it again.
> > > >
> > > > XP won't have formatted the drive, unless you issued a specific
> > > > instruction to do so (My Computer > right click the drive >
> > > > format).
> > >
> > > Funnily enough on saving a textfile to the disc via the RiscPC and
> > > then dismounting and putting it in the Iyonix almost all the files
> > > were deleted and the textfile corrupt.
> >
> > What does that have to do with XP?
> >
> > Connect the flash drive to the RPC, format it using MkDOSDisc, and
> > save some files. If the files are unreadable, or absent, when the
> > flash drive is read by the Iyonix, and/or XP, the flash drive is
> > probably faulty.
>
> It doesn't apparently have anything to do with XP but I'm just
> reporting what seems to be a bug

In what?

> whereby the contents of a (AIUI) drive that is recognised by both RISC
> OS and WXP seem to be erased for no apparent reason.

Does 'erased' mean that the files have really been deleted, or just that
you cannot see them in the filer window?

If, by mistake, you have formatted the flash drive using XP FAT32, you
will find that files saved on the XP machine cannot be seen, when viewed
on the RISC OS machine. Similarly, files saved via the RISC OS machine
cannot be seen, when viewed on the XP machine. However, in neither case
have the files been deleted, as you will see if you re-connect the flash
drive to the machine on which the files were saved.

To fix this, re-format the flash drive using MkDOSDisc, as I said above.

Tony

druck

unread,
Jan 30, 2008, 5:33:36 PM1/30/08
to
On 30 Jan 2008 Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> If, by mistake, you have formatted the flash drive using XP FAT32, you
> will find that files saved on the XP machine cannot be seen, when viewed
> on the RISC OS machine. Similarly, files saved via the RISC OS machine
> cannot be seen, when viewed on the XP machine. However, in neither case
> have the files been deleted, as you will see if you re-connect the flash
> drive to the machine on which the files were saved.

> To fix this, re-format the flash drive using MkDOSDisc, as I said above.

Almost, but not quite. FAT32 works ok, but you'll either need an
Iyonix or Win95FS on the Risc PC to read it. The problem you describe
above with files only seen by the system theat writes them is due to
XP's bastardised version of FAT16, which illegally uses the root
directory from FAT32 and therefor can't be seen by DOSFS.

Andrew

unread,
Jan 30, 2008, 6:17:18 PM1/30/08
to
In message <258477694f.old_coaster@old_coaster.yahoo.co.uk>
Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:


>> > > Funnily enough on saving a textfile to the disc via the RiscPC and
>> > > then dismounting and putting it in the Iyonix almost all the files
>> > > were deleted and the textfile corrupt.
>> >
>> > What does that have to do with XP?
>> >
>> > Connect the flash drive to the RPC, format it using MkDOSDisc, and
>> > save some files. If the files are unreadable, or absent, when the
>> > flash drive is read by the Iyonix, and/or XP, the flash drive is
>> > probably faulty.
>>
>> It doesn't apparently have anything to do with XP but I'm just
>> reporting what seems to be a bug
>
> In what?
>

I don't know.

>> whereby the contents of a (AIUI) drive that is recognised by both RISC
>> OS and WXP seem to be erased for no apparent reason.
>
> Does 'erased' mean that the files have really been deleted, or just that
> you cannot see them in the filer window?
>

I cannot see them in RISC OS or WXP.

> If, by mistake, you have formatted the flash drive using XP FAT32,

Not as far as I know. All I know is when I put the drive back in the
Iyonix the files had gone.

Andrew


--

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 31, 2008, 5:12:47 AM1/31/08
to
On 30 Jan 2008, druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:
> On 30 Jan 2008 Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>
> > If, by mistake, you have formatted the flash drive using XP FAT32,
> > you will find that files saved on the XP machine cannot be seen,
> > when viewed on the RISC OS machine. Similarly, files saved via the
> > RISC OS machine cannot be seen, when viewed on the XP machine.
> > However, in neither case have the files been deleted, as you will
> > see if you re-connect the flash drive to the machine on which the
> > files were saved.
>
> > To fix this, re-format the flash drive using MkDOSDisc, as I said
> > above.
>
> Almost, but not quite. FAT32 works ok, but you'll either need an
> Iyonix or Win95FS on the Risc PC to read it. The problem you describe
> above with files only seen by the system theat writes them is due to
> XP's bastardised version of FAT16, which illegally uses the root
> directory from FAT32 and therefor can't be seen by DOSFS.

Thanks for the clarification. I use an RPC without Win95FS so, as you
say, FAT32 doesn't work for me. However, I have found that FAT (not 32),
via Win2k, does work.

Tony

Tony Moore

unread,
Jan 31, 2008, 5:06:26 AM1/31/08
to
On 30 Jan 2008, newpost...@googlemail.com (Andrew) wrote:

[snip]

> All I know is when I put the drive back in the Iyonix the files had
> gone.

If the problem persists, after correctly re-formatting the flash drive,
the flash drive itself may be faulty.

Tony

Dave Higton

unread,
Feb 8, 2008, 5:11:06 PM2/8/08
to
In message <608f7b69...@druck.freeuk.net>
druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:

> On 30 Jan 2008 Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> > If, by mistake, you have formatted the flash drive using XP FAT32, you
> > will find that files saved on the XP machine cannot be seen, when viewed
> > on the RISC OS machine. Similarly, files saved via the RISC OS machine
> > cannot be seen, when viewed on the XP machine. However, in neither case
> > have the files been deleted, as you will see if you re-connect the flash
> > drive to the machine on which the files were saved.
>
> > To fix this, re-format the flash drive using MkDOSDisc, as I said above.
>
> Almost, but not quite. FAT32 works ok, but you'll either need an
> Iyonix or Win95FS on the Risc PC to read it. The problem you describe
> above with files only seen by the system theat writes them is due to
> XP's bastardised version of FAT16, which illegally uses the root
> directory from FAT32 and therefor can't be seen by DOSFS.

Do you have a "recipe" by which I can format a flash drive of an
appropriate size, to this problematic version of FAT16?

Do you have any Internet references on its structure?

Dave

druck

unread,
Feb 8, 2008, 5:17:46 PM2/8/08
to
On 8 Feb 2008 Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> Do you have a "recipe" by which I can format a flash drive of an
> appropriate size, to this problematic version of FAT16?

> Do you have any Internet references on its structure?

Pop the relevant terms in to google groups, its come up several times
before.

Dave Higton

unread,
Feb 10, 2008, 5:48:04 PM2/10/08
to
In message <10a21c6e...@druck.freeuk.net>
druck <ne...@druck.freeuk.com> wrote:

> On 8 Feb 2008 Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> > Do you have a "recipe" by which I can format a flash drive of an
> > appropriate size, to this problematic version of FAT16?
>
> > Do you have any Internet references on its structure?
>
> Pop the relevant terms in to google groups, its come up several times
> before.

That, of course, is not a helpful response.

To clarify what sort of information I'm looking for, and why I'm
looking for it: I want to examine a device with this format so I
can see about modifying !ROFS so it can cope with it. So I need
a reliable recipe to reformat a device that I already have to the
problem format, or to be able to buy such a device. Also, if you
know so much about it, you've probably found a specific reference
to the detail of the format. I've just found around a third of a
million hits in Google, and it may be some time before I reach a
hit with any hard information. If you possess this hard info,
you might save me a lot of time. In turn, I might help a few RISC
OS users by providing them with some useful software for free.

Dave

druck

unread,
Feb 10, 2008, 6:33:36 PM2/10/08
to
On 10 Feb 2008 Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:

>> On 8 Feb 2008 Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>>> Do you have a "recipe" by which I can format a flash drive of an
>>> appropriate size, to this problematic version of FAT16?
>>
>>> Do you have any Internet references on its structure?
>>
>> Pop the relevant terms in to google groups, its come up several times
>> before.

> That, of course, is not a helpful response.

If you you aren't willing to make any effort perhpas.

> To clarify what sort of information I'm looking for, and why I'm
> looking for it: I want to examine a device with this format so I
> can see about modifying !ROFS so it can cope with it. So I need
> a reliable recipe to reformat a device that I already have to the
> problem format, or to be able to buy such a device. Also, if you
> know so much about it, you've probably found a specific reference
> to the detail of the format. I've just found around a third of a
> million hits in Google, and it may be some time before I reach a
> hit with any hard information. If you possess this hard info,
> you might save me a lot of time. In turn, I might help a few RISC
> OS users by providing them with some useful software for free.

As I said use google groups, there are far less than a million hits
for csa.*

Dave Higton

unread,
Feb 11, 2008, 4:01:17 PM2/11/08
to
In message <3714276f4f...@dsl.pipex.com>
Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:

> To clarify what sort of information I'm looking for, and why I'm
> looking for it: I want to examine a device with this format so I
> can see about modifying !ROFS so it can cope with it. So I need
> a reliable recipe to reformat a device that I already have to the
> problem format, or to be able to buy such a device. Also, if you
> know so much about it, you've probably found a specific reference
> to the detail of the format. I've just found around a third of a
> million hits in Google, and it may be some time before I reach a
> hit with any hard information. If you possess this hard info,
> you might save me a lot of time. In turn, I might help a few RISC
> OS users by providing them with some useful software for free.

Perhaps someone else can help me. I want to get my hands on a
device that has the problem FAT16 format, so that I can make
!ROFS read it. I had hoped that I could "just" reformat a
128 GB USB pen that I have, using XP, so I did that a few
minutes ago, then transferred a number of small files onto it.
I can see all the files, using RO5's built in filer (which
sees it as SCSI::0) or using !ROFS. So simply using Windows
XP to FAT-format a small drive isn't enough to guarantee that
it will get the problem format. (!ROFS's "Stats" shows it as
512 bytes per sector, 4 sectors i.e. 2048 bytes per cluster,
1 reserved sector, 2 FATs, 245 sectors per FAT, 32 sectors in
the root dir, base of root dir = 523, FAT type FAT16.)

Can anyone give me a can't-fail recipe for producing a drive
with the problem FAT format, please? I'm prepared to buy a
drive if I have to (and if it's not expensive).

Dave

davehigton

unread,
Feb 12, 2008, 2:57:41 AM2/12/08
to
On 11 Feb, 21:01, Dave Higton <davehig...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
> In message <3714276f4f.davehig...@dsl.pipex.com>

> Dave Higton <davehig...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:
>
> Perhaps someone else can help me. I want to get my hands on a
> device that has the problem FAT16 format, so that I can make
> !ROFS read it. I had hoped that I could "just" reformat a
> 128 GB USB pen that I have, using XP, so I did that a few
^^ MB, of course.

Tony Moore

unread,
Feb 12, 2008, 1:38:57 PM2/12/08
to
On 11 Feb 2008, Dave Higton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com> wrote:

[snip]

> Can anyone give me a can't-fail recipe for producing a drive with the
> problem FAT format, please? I'm prepared to buy a drive if I have to
> (and if it's not expensive).

I have just tried to do this, using an old 128MB drive, but failed!
Having formatted to XP FAT32, I found that files saved on the XP machine
_could_ be seen on the RO machine, and vice versa. I also obtained the
same result, when the drive was formatted to XP FAT.

Since I first noticed the problem, maybe a year ago, there have been
some changes to my systems: the XP machine has been upgraded to SP2, the
RISC OS machine has been upgraded to RO6.06 (from 4.39) and I'm using
ROOL's DOSFS 0.85 (instead of whatever RO4.39 or RO6.06 provide). Maybe
these changes fix the problem?

Tony

Richard Porter

unread,
Feb 12, 2008, 3:19:52 PM2/12/08
to
The date being 12 Feb 2008, Tony Moore <old_c...@yahoo.co.uk>
decided to write:

> [snip]

I've only had the problem with a 1GB pen drive. My 128kB one is OK,
but almost certainly it's FAT16.

--
Richard Porter
ricp@ / www. minijem.plus.com
"You can't have Windows without pains."

davehigton

unread,
Feb 13, 2008, 3:48:22 AM2/13/08
to
On 12 Feb, 20:19, Richard Porter <dontuset...@address.uk.invalid>
wrote:

>
> I've only had the problem with a 1GB pen drive. My 128kB one is OK,
> but almost certainly it's FAT16.

Do you still have the drive, and is it still causing the problem?

Dave

Richard Porter

unread,
Feb 13, 2008, 7:35:18 PM2/13/08
to
The date being 13 Feb 2008, davehigton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com>
decided to write:

I still have the drive. I haven't used it for a while, but I don't
think anything's changed. It was only exposed to XP once, but afair
the Mac reads and writes to the PC side, not the RO side.

davehigton

unread,
Feb 14, 2008, 11:53:28 AM2/14/08
to
On 14 Feb, 00:35, Richard Porter <dontuset...@address.uk.invalid>
wrote:
> The date being 13 Feb 2008, davehigton <davehig...@dsl.pipex.com>

> decided to write:
>
> > On 12 Feb, 20:19, Richard Porter <dontuset...@address.uk.invalid>
> > wrote:
>
> >> I've only had the problem with a 1GB pen drive. My 128kB one is OK,
> >> but almost certainly it's FAT16.
> > Do you still have the drive, and is it still causing the problem?
>
> I still have the drive. I haven't used it for a while, but I don't
> think anything's changed. It was only exposed to XP once, but afair
> the Mac reads and writes to the PC side, not the RO side.

Right. Is there any chance that I can either borrow ir from you,
or buy it from you? This is only a useful thing to do if it really
is still in the state that causes the problem.

Dave

Richard Porter

unread,
Feb 15, 2008, 1:19:32 PM2/15/08
to
The date being 14 Feb 2008, davehigton <daveh...@dsl.pipex.com>
decided to write:

> Right. Is there any chance that I can either borrow ir from you,
> or buy it from you? This is only a useful thing to do if it really
> is still in the state that causes the problem.

I'll email you.

0 new messages