Microsoft Has to Change (Cringely)
nes...@wigner.berkeley.edu
-----------
Microsoft is in crisis, and crises sometimes demand bold action. The
company is demoralized, and most assuredly HAS seen its best days in
terms of market dominance. In short, being Microsoft isn't fun anymore,
which probably means that being Bill Gates isn't fun anymore, either.
But that, alone, is not reason enough for Gates to leave. Whether he
instigated the change or someone else did, Gates had no choice but to
take this action to support the value of his own Microsoft shares.
-------------
End quote
Erik Funkenbusch
I don't agree with Cringely much, but in this case, I think he's hit the
nail on the head pretty well.
Roy Schestowitz
It's more enjoyable watching a boat sink while lying on a sandy, sunny, and
remote beach than being in that boat, hearing people yell and jumping onto
dingies. Gates has put his sunglasses on. And he's going to Disneyland. Ke
sera sera.
Best wishes,
Roy
--
Roy S. Schestowitz | Data lacking semantics is currency in an island
http://Schestowitz.com | GNU/Linux Ś PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
7:25pm up 55 days 0:39, 12 users, load average: 1.22, 1.10, 1.07
http://iuron.com - next generation of search paradigms
asj
Cringely is a bona fide idiot. He states obvious things as if only he
can see them, and his actual predictions usually have less chance of
happening than gates suddenly going linux.
*Posted while dozing off at times in my car. Have you tried
www.widgets.com yet?
John Bailo
> Cringely is a bona fide idiot. He states obvious things as if only he
> can see them, and his actual predictions usually have less chance of
> happening than gates suddenly going linux.
Why wouldn't gates go Linux?
He's under no obligations, if say, the B&M G.Foundation wanted to
support the $100 laptop project?
asj
Mark Kent
Roy Schestowitz <newsg...@schestowitz.com> espoused:
> __/ [ nes...@wigner.berkeley.edu ] on Wednesday 21 June 2006 18:53 \__
>
>> Quote:
>> -----------
>> Microsoft is in crisis, and crises sometimes demand bold action. The
>> company is demoralized, and most assuredly HAS seen its best days in
>> terms of market dominance. In short, being Microsoft isn't fun anymore,
>> which probably means that being Bill Gates isn't fun anymore, either.
>> But that, alone, is not reason enough for Gates to leave. Whether he
>> instigated the change or someone else did, Gates had no choice but to
>> take this action to support the value of his own Microsoft shares.
>> -------------
>> End quote
>>
>> http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20060615.html
>
> It's more enjoyable watching a boat sink while lying on a sandy, sunny, and
> remote beach than being in that boat, hearing people yell and jumping onto
> dingies. Gates has put his sunglasses on. And he's going to Disneyland. Ke
> sera sera.
>
I've been saying much the same thing in this group for a long time now.
I do not believe that MS has the required internal culture to survive
its current woes without considerable change. I do not believe that just
changing the senior management team will be enough, it'll take much more
than that, so I'd expect to see a lot of departures across the company,
top to bottom, over the next few years. I'd personally suggest that
5-10 years will be the time taken to turn MS around from an amorphous,
directionless, ammoral group of bullies into a professional, well-lead
ethically sound organisation with a reasonable and achievable strategy.
Unfortunately, in that time, MS will probably have to give up huge
swathes of monopoly, this means income, which means it's going to use
up tremendous amounts of its reserves in staying afloat.
This change is going to require some fairly basic, fundamental, changes.
One is, in my view, going to /have/ to be the abandonment of the Windows
code-base. It's quite clear that it is not maintainable, even by a
company with the resources MS has available, and because of MS's dubious
business practices, it's probably not GPLable either, as they've
probably got a lot of code they shouldn't have, and perhaps won't want
to take the risk of some company claiming stolen code (can anyone think
of a company that might consider that? One with deep pockets, perhaps
one which has been similarly threatened?). It's way too risky, so it
won't happen.
MS /might/ look at a purchase of Apple - this would be a strategic
masterstroke, and might even have been on the cards for some time,
and /could/ even explain the odd decision of Apple's to move to x86
processors. Apple have a viable, quality, modern OS, with an excellent
GUI, but with all the advantages of Unix under the bonnet. All the hard
work has been done, /and/ MS could offer dual-boot XP/OSX machines on
Apple hardware. If they were /really/ smart, they'd keep the machines
badged as Apple, too. Most people probably wouldn't even know.
Option B would have to be a move to Linux or a BSD, but then there'd be
the huge risk that MS would want to port the Windows shell, which would
be a 5 year job, probably, anyway.
Option C might be to buy up codeweavers, fix up the Wine code until it's
good enough, and then restart the Vista work on a linux+wine base. This
would be arguably the technically best solution, and would bring the
significant advantage that MS would get to benefit from all the native
linux applications out there, although they'd probably look to find ways
of stopping them from running on /their/ version, unless they were 'MS
approved'.
Oh, it's que, not ke, btw.
--
| Mark Kent -- mark at ellandroad dot demon dot co dot uk |
We all declare for liberty, but in using the same word we do not all mean
the same thing.
-- A. Lincoln
nes...@wigner.berkeley.edu
suppose MS could do the same. And they have enormous resources, if
they are not wasted. But all the choices look bad, and the change in
direction is so great that it will be a completely new company if they
pull it off. And the rest of the world is not standing still! Look at
how much progress has been made in the FOSS world in just the last
year! And this is just the beginning.
Erik Funkenbusch
> I've been saying much the same thing in this group for a long time now.
> I do not believe that MS has the required internal culture to survive
> its current woes without considerable change.
I do not believe this is a matter of culture as much as it is a matter of
upper management of the Windows Desktop division. Other divisions, such as
Office, are leading the way in innovative new ideas and producing amazing
code. Server versions of Windows have likewise been very solid.
I think the management shakeup at the end of this product cycle will be a
very good thing.
Mark Kent
nes...@wigner.berkeley.edu <nes...@wigner.berkeley.edu> espoused:
> IBM recovered from their low point and are very viable today, so I
> suppose MS could do the same.
To be honest, IBM are one of the examples I had in mind when scribing my
last missive on this.
> And they have enormous resources, if
> they are not wasted. But all the choices look bad, and the change in
> direction is so great that it will be a completely new company if they
> pull it off. And the rest of the world is not standing still! Look at
> how much progress has been made in the FOSS world in just the last
> year! And this is just the beginning.
>
I'm not sure that FOSS is particularly moving all that fast, rather, I
think it's a bit like doing building work; the foundations seem to take
æons, (hey, I can now write encyclopædia properly, and æther, so we
could have real æthernet!), but once they're down, the infra and
superstructure goes up very fast indeed. FOSS distros, major packages,
and so on, are building the superstructures now, and in some cases,
starting to consider what the decoration should look like, where the
mouldings should go, what colour it should be, where to put the windows
(hehe) and so on.
The comparison of Linux to Windows could be likened to the 3 little pigs
story. The first house is built of straw with no foundation, but can be
built very quickly. Unfortunately, as more and more superstructure is
added, the original building is not capable of supporting the additions.
Linux is more like the last pig, who builds from stone with proper
foundation. It takes much much longer, so that the straw house is
already decorated, and heated, and lit, and very comfortable. Until the
wolf comes along...
Windows is a house of straw, it's foundations and basic infrastructure
so poor that it's unlikely it could be cost-effectively rebuilt.
Linux distros are like the house of stone, they've taken a long time to
become as visually appealing as those of straw, but in that time, the
foundations and infrastructure are of such high quality that they are
rapidly overtaking the Windows house, because building on them is easy
and safe.
Mark Kent
Erik Funkenbusch <er...@despam-funkenbusch.com> espoused:
> On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 16:48:43 +0100, Mark Kent wrote:
>
>> I've been saying much the same thing in this group for a long time now.
>> I do not believe that MS has the required internal culture to survive
>> its current woes without considerable change.
>
> I do not believe this is a matter of culture as much as it is a matter of
> upper management of the Windows Desktop division.
Supported by?
> Other divisions, such as
> Office, are leading the way in innovative new ideas and producing amazing
> code.
I'm impressing people with a ubuntu CD which boots on their PC, comes
straight up, has full office capabilities, costs nothing, and doesn't
need virusguarding. That's innovation - I see nothing remotely similar
coming from MS, but as I said above, I think that they lack the culture
to ever come close to this without a near total rebuild of the company.
> Server versions of Windows have likewise been very solid.
Whilst there are some legacy windows servers around, I'm not aware of
anyone planning large deployments of such. I don't know that anyone
would be interested in such ancient code, with so many security
problems. I do know of a lot of organisations looking to move to the
new wave, up to date, code bases.
>
> I think the management shakeup at the end of this product cycle will be a
> very good thing.
At this point I have to laugh! 6 years, and still no product? Even for
a monopoly, that's a terrible performance. Not even a hint that it
will be out in 7 or even 8 years...
It'll need much more than a management change to fix these issues.
Erik Funkenbusch
>> I do not believe this is a matter of culture as much as it is a matter of
>> upper management of the Windows Desktop division.
>
> Supported by?
My observations. Which is why I said "I do not believe".
>> Other divisions, such as
>> Office, are leading the way in innovative new ideas and producing amazing
>> code.
>
> I'm impressing people with a ubuntu CD which boots on their PC, comes
> straight up, has full office capabilities, costs nothing, and doesn't
> need virusguarding. That's innovation - I see nothing remotely similar
> coming from MS, but as I said above, I think that they lack the culture
> to ever come close to this without a near total rebuild of the company.
Other than the "cost nothing", i've been doing that for more than 2 years.
I've got a Windows PE CD right here that boots from the CD, has all sorts
of diagnostic and Office tools, because it's read-only, doesn't need virus
guarding either.
So, problem solved.
>> Server versions of Windows have likewise been very solid.
>
> Whilst there are some legacy windows servers around, I'm not aware of
> anyone planning large deployments of such. I don't know that anyone
> would be interested in such ancient code, with so many security
> problems. I do know of a lot of organisations looking to move to the
> new wave, up to date, code bases.
Tell that to the large hosting environments moving to Windows servers. The
fact of the matter is, Windows servers have had FAR better security over
the last 3 years. There have been no worms, or major vulnerabilities that
affected a standard security configuration windows server, and IIS 6 and
ASP.NET have not had a single major vulnerability (compare that to PHP and
Apache which have both had quite a few).
People are starting to notice. Even if you don't count the parked domain
shifting, IIS has grown the numnber of sites it hosts by almost 8% in the
last 3 months.
>> I think the management shakeup at the end of this product cycle will be a
>> very good thing.
>
> At this point I have to laugh! 6 years, and still no product? Even for
> a monopoly, that's a terrible performance. Not even a hint that it
> will be out in 7 or even 8 years...
>
> It'll need much more than a management change to fix these issues.
Vista is not going to ship by any major amount, if at all. I fully expect
it to ship in october as planned, but if it does slip again, it will be at
most until january 2007.
That's not to say I think it *SHOULD* ship. I'm currently of the opinion
that Microsoft should cancel Vista and ship an XP R2 with all the various
technologies they've built up for vista (Avalon, Indigo, Windows Workflow,
etc..) along with driver and code refreshes. Push Vista back onto Windows
Vienna, which is likely going to be a "Vista R2" anyways.
But we'll see. Of course, I don't expect any of the people claiming Vista
won't ship until 2009 to admit they were wrong.
arachnid
> On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 20:58:48 +0100, Mark Kent wrote:
>
>>> I do not believe this is a matter of culture as much as it is a matter of
>>> upper management of the Windows Desktop division.
>>
>> Supported by?
>
> My observations. Which is why I said "I do not believe".
>
>>> Other divisions, such as
>>> Office, are leading the way in innovative new ideas and producing amazing
>>> code.
>>
>> I'm impressing people with a ubuntu CD which boots on their PC, comes
>> straight up, has full office capabilities, costs nothing, and doesn't
>> need virusguarding. That's innovation - I see nothing remotely similar
>> coming from MS, but as I said above, I think that they lack the culture
>> to ever come close to this without a near total rebuild of the company.
>
> Other than the "cost nothing", i've been doing that for more than 2 years.
> I've got a Windows PE CD right here that boots from the CD, has all sorts
> of diagnostic and Office tools, because it's read-only, doesn't need virus
> guarding either.
Have you booted it on other systems, or does it only work on your own?
Linonut
> Tell that to the large hosting environments moving to Windows servers.
Such as?
> The
> fact of the matter is, Windows servers have had FAR better security over
> the last 3 years. There have been no worms, or major vulnerabilities that
> affected a standard security configuration windows server, and IIS 6 and
> ASP.NET have not had a single major vulnerability (compare that to PHP and
> Apache which have both had quite a few).
Show us the actual exploits and headlines then.
> People are starting to notice. Even if you don't count the parked domain
> shifting, IIS has grown the numnber of sites it hosts by almost 8% in the
> last 3 months.
So what?
> But we'll see. Of course, I don't expect any of the people claiming Vista
> won't ship until 2009 to admit they were wrong.
Pffft. No one here cares about Vista. At all.
--
[ X ] Check here to always trust content from Linonut.
Tim Smith
>> ASP.NET have not had a single major vulnerability (compare that to PHP and
>> Apache which have both had quite a few).
>
> Show us the actual exploits and headlines then.
Subscribe to the Security Focus Linux newsletter, and to Bugtraq, and see for
yourself. Just this week, Security Focus' newsletter reported the following
PHP application problems:
WordPress Username Remote PHP Code Injection Vulnerability
BugTraq ID: 18372
Remote: Yes
Date Published: 2006-06-12
Relevant URL: http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/18372
Summary:
WordPress is prone to a remote PHP code-injection vulnerability. This issue
is due to a failure in the application to properly sanitize user-supplied
input.
An attacker can exploit this issue to facilitate a compromise of the
application and the underlying system; other attacks are also possible.
For a successful exploit of this issue, the MySQL password used in the
application must be either blank or trivial to guess.
That one is not too bad, as a decent MySQL password will protect you.
Horde Application Framework Multiple Cross-Site Scripting Vulnerabilities
BugTraq ID: 18436
Remote: Yes
Date Published: 2006-06-14
Relevant URL: http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/18436
Summary:
Horde is prone to multiple cross-site scripting vulnerabilities. These
issues are due to a failure in the application to properly sanitize
user-supplied input. An attacker may leverage these issues to have
arbitrary script code execute in the browser of an unsuspecting user in the
context of the affected site. This may help the attacker steal cookie-based
authentication credentials and launch other attacks.
Not nice.
Invision Power Board Admin.PHP Cross-site Scripting Vulnerability
BugTraq ID: 18450
Remote: Yes
Date Published: 2006-06-15
Relevant URL: http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/18450
Summary:
Invision Power Board is prone to a cross-site scripting vulnerability. This
issue is due to a failure in the application to properly sanitize
user-supplied input.
An attacker may use this issue to have arbitrary script code execute in the
browser of an unsuspecting user in the context of the affected site. This
may let the attacker steal cookie credentials; other attacks are also
possible.
Also not nice.
If you've got an exposed web server, check your logs. That's another good
way to keep tabs on what's going on out there. Scans looking for assorted
PHP blogs and calendaring systems and such now outnumber scans looking for
Windows holes in my logs.
--
--Tim Smith
Larry Qualig
Linonut wrote:
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out this bit o' wisdom:
> > But we'll see. Of course, I don't expect any of the people claiming Vista
> > won't ship until 2009 to admit they were wrong.
> Pffft. No one here cares about Vista. At all.
The total lack of interest in Vista in COLA must be the reason why
there have "only" been 400+ posts mentioning Vista in the last 30 days.
Not to mention all the threads and [News] stories with "Vista" in the
title.
Oh yeah... nobody here cares one bit about Vista. No interest at all.
Linonut
> Linonut wrote:
>
>> Pffft. No one here cares about Vista. At all.
>
> The total lack of interest in Vista in COLA must be the reason why
> there have "only" been 400+ posts mentioning Vista in the last 30 days.
> Not to mention all the threads and [News] stories with "Vista" in the
> title.
>
> Oh yeah... nobody here cares one bit about Vista. No interest at all.
Why do you think posts denigrating Vista indicate an interest in Vista?
I'm not interested in Vista. I was interested in hearing opinions and
data about it, and, having heard them, I'm not interested in Vista at
all.
Even though I'm posting about it.
Get it?
Not interested, as in "Not interested in it -- it's a piece of shit."
--
Press every key to continue.
Larry Qualig
It's still an interest. Interest can be positive or negative. But it's
still an interest.
Look at all the thread titles with Vista in them....
* Linux: Hasta La "Vista" Baby
* So what's the business case for Windows Vista?
* Hasta ls Vista
* Rants about Vista UI
* Vista delayed?
* Techno-rant: Microsoft INNOVATES with Longhorn/Vista
* Longhorn/Vista conspiracy: some questions
* Todd's Blog: Longhorn is now 'Vista' !
* Open source aims to cash in on Vista migrations
* Ignore Vista until 2008?
* SEVEN versions of Vista planned
* Vista release date: 7 December 2006?
* MS, Vista and existing machines
... and MANY, MANY more.
These threads often end up being the ones with the most
posts/discussion. Sounds to me like people here are "interested" in
Vista. Perhaps the interest is negative or they are merely interested
in trashing it... but whatever it is, people are interested in talking
about Vista. Ergo, there's interest in Vista.
It's like the many 10's of millions of housewives that aren't
interested in Brad and Angelina's new baby. Sure... they're not
interested. But they are the same ones spending millions on magazines
where they only want to read about the baby. But they're not really
interested.
Erik Funkenbusch
>> Other than the "cost nothing", i've been doing that for more than 2 years.
>> I've got a Windows PE CD right here that boots from the CD, has all sorts
>> of diagnostic and Office tools, because it's read-only, doesn't need virus
>> guarding either.
>
> Have you booted it on other systems, or does it only work on your own?
It works on pretty much any hardware, though it may be reduced video
quality if there isn't a driver for it.
Erik Funkenbusch
> In article <-oOdnY4Mlts3lwbZ...@comcast.com>, Linonut wrote:
>>> ASP.NET have not had a single major vulnerability (compare that to PHP and
>>> Apache which have both had quite a few).
>>
>> Show us the actual exploits and headlines then.
>
> Subscribe to the Security Focus Linux newsletter, and to Bugtraq, and see for
> yourself. Just this week, Security Focus' newsletter reported the following
> PHP application problems:
The problems you list are application issues, not problems with PHP itself.
However, PHP has had a significant number of vulnerabilities itself.
Sinister Midget
I guess he missed your question since a few hours have passed since it
was asked. Maybe he'll see my response to it and take the opportunity
to answer.
<Is that pigshit that just fell out of the sky?>
--
I'm in search of myself. If you found me before I arrive, please have
me wait.
Sinister Midget
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Erik Funkenbusch belched out this bit o' wisdom:
>> But we'll see. Of course, I don't expect any of the people claiming Vista
>> won't ship until 2009 to admit they were wrong.
>
> Pffft. No one here cares about Vista. At all.
Except to make fun of it.
I was wondering. Since Erik mentioned people admitting when they're
wrong......Nah. Too much to ask of him.
--
The largest living land mammal is the absent mind.
-- Captain Beefheart
John Bailo
> These threads often end up being the ones with the most
> posts/discussion. Sounds to me like people here are "interested" in
> Vista. Perhaps the interest is negative or they are merely interested
> in trashing it... but whatever it is, people are interested in talking
> about Vista. Ergo, there's interest in Vista.
Yes, but all that pales against the sheer weight of Microsoft sponsored
publicity regarding Vista (which seems to have subsided recently).
These "threads" that seem to spook you, are mere rejoinders -- people
responding to the enourmous push.
> It's like the many 10's of millions of housewives that aren't
> interested in Brad and Angelina's new baby. Sure... they're not
> interested. But they are the same ones spending millions on magazines
> where they only want to read about the baby. But they're not really
> interested.
Maybe they wish there were something else to read about...but either
there isn't...or they just don't know about it.
Linonut
> It's still an interest. Interest can be positive or negative. But it's
> still an interest.
Ah, the old word play gambit.
Take a word that has more than one meaning, and you argue your preferred
meaning, and I'll argue mine.
No thanks.
I will grant that some people are "interested" in Vista in the sense
that they care about news of Vista, even if they do not want to use
Vista.
> Look at all the thread titles with Vista in them....
>
> * Linux: Hasta La "Vista" Baby
> * So what's the business case for Windows Vista?
> * Hasta ls Vista
> * Rants about Vista UI
> * Vista delayed?
> * Techno-rant: Microsoft INNOVATES with Longhorn/Vista
> * Longhorn/Vista conspiracy: some questions
> * Todd's Blog: Longhorn is now 'Vista' !
> * Open source aims to cash in on Vista migrations
> * Ignore Vista until 2008?
> * SEVEN versions of Vista planned
> * Vista release date: 7 December 2006?
> * MS, Vista and existing machines
>
> ... and MANY, MANY more.
>
>
> These threads often end up being the ones with the most
> posts/discussion. Sounds to me like people here are "interested" in
> Vista. Perhaps the interest is negative or they are merely interested
> in trashing it... but whatever it is, people are interested in talking
> about Vista. Ergo, there's interest in Vista.
Actually, a better term would be...
... morbid fascination.
--
Tagline generated by 'gensig' mail-client-independent .signature generator.
Get your copy at http://www.geekthing.com/~robf/gensig/
Erik Funkenbusch
> On 2006-06-22, arachnid <no...@goawayspammer.com> posted something concerning:
>> On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 16:38:39 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>
>>> Other than the "cost nothing", i've been doing that for more than 2 years.
>>> I've got a Windows PE CD right here that boots from the CD, has all sorts
>>> of diagnostic and Office tools, because it's read-only, doesn't need virus
>>> guarding either.
>>
>> Have you booted it on other systems, or does it only work on your own?
>
> I guess he missed your question since a few hours have passed since it
> was asked. Maybe he'll see my response to it and take the opportunity
> to answer.
>
> <Is that pigshit that just fell out of the sky?>
I guess you're just an idiot, since I answered the question an hour before
you made your stupid comment. I won't wait for your appology.
arachnid
I've heard that when you put Windows on a bootable CD, it'll only work
on one system. Have you actually plugged that CD into other systems and
tried it?
ws
Well, a "live Windows CD" is quite a standard item in a sysadmin's
toolchest nowadays.
WinPE is usually only available for OEMs
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Preinstallation_Environment
But BartPE is generally avaiable:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_PE
However, due to licensing issues you have to build it yourself, and you
can't copy it around, obviously. Many plugins are available - I have not
tried it, but I believe Office is available as a plugin too.
It is excellent as a windows-based recovery tool, but IMO, it is not
generally as "kitchen-sink" complete the way knoppix is, for example.
So while you could function very well by booting Knoppix and using it
exclusively as your desktop, the live windows CDs mentioned isn't really
suitable for that purpose.
Regards,
ws
--
change to leews to mail
GreyCloud
Enough so that PHP even gives OpenVMS security problems.
--
Where are we going?
And why am I in this handbasket?
Peter Köhlmann
So you assume anyone is reading usenet in the sequence you are?
You are even dumber than DFS
--
You're genuinely bogus.
Mark Kent
ws <see...@pacific.net.sg> espoused:
> arachnid wrote:
>> On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 23:09:54 -0500, Erik Funkenbusch wrote:
>>
>>
>>>On Thu, 22 Jun 2006 15:53:43 -0500, arachnid wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>>Other than the "cost nothing", i've been doing that for more than 2 years.
>>>>>I've got a Windows PE CD right here that boots from the CD, has all sorts
>>>>>of diagnostic and Office tools, because it's read-only, doesn't need virus
>>>>>guarding either.
>>>>
>>>>Have you booted it on other systems, or does it only work on your own?
>>>
>>>It works on pretty much any hardware, though it may be reduced video
>>>quality if there isn't a driver for it.
>>
>>
>> I've heard that when you put Windows on a bootable CD, it'll only work
>> on one system. Have you actually plugged that CD into other systems and
>> tried it?
>>
>
> Well, a "live Windows CD" is quite a standard item in a sysadmin's
> toolchest nowadays.
>
> WinPE is usually only available for OEMs
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Preinstallation_Environment
>
> But BartPE is generally avaiable:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bart_PE
>
> However, due to licensing issues you have to build it yourself, and you
> can't copy it around, obviously. Many plugins are available - I have not
> tried it, but I believe Office is available as a plugin too.
Surely the Windows licence doesn't even permit the creation of such a
tool?
>
> It is excellent as a windows-based recovery tool, but IMO, it is not
> generally as "kitchen-sink" complete the way knoppix is, for example.
>
> So while you could function very well by booting Knoppix and using it
> exclusively as your desktop, the live windows CDs mentioned isn't really
> suitable for that purpose.
>
--
| Mark Kent -- mark at ellandroad dot demon dot co dot uk |
The trouble with being poor is that it takes up all your time.
Erik Funkenbusch
Yet you don't complain that Midget assumed so. Typical.
Peter Köhlmann
I don't make that kind of silly assumptions. That still is entirely your job
chrisv
>I won't wait for your appology.
Because you don't deserve one, scum.