OTHER companies in Microsoft's crosshairs
Au79
BearItAll
> CNET News.com - United States
>
>
<http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
>
Just yesterday I read that Skype had 80million users world wide (in Computer
Weekly). Also Vonage, being able to make use of most current mobiles/PDA's
that have Internet access, must be a major advantage because users don't
have to lug around a computer.
I have distributed Skype to many traveling users at work, also to people who
regularly call our other sites, and saved the company a fair amount of
money in international phone calls (which I hope to claim towards my budget
next year so I can have a new HP super computer in my office).
The only down side is if you try to use the likes of Skype to ring someone
who chose another system.
I also set my dad up to use the Yahoo version, so he can chat for hours with
my sister in America. I particularly like the Yahoo version, it's very rare
that you get any stutter even in busy times.
So for home and business internet phones are a wonderfull thing.
At some point though the various Internet-land line suppliers must get
together and share numbers/user names. The sooner it is done the easier it
will be. Then, combined, they will hold such a large share that the new MS
version wouldn't get a look in. Something the users will not do is use the
speakers and microphone built into their computers, they seem to Need the
handset or headphones with microphone.
It just occured to me, Orange push their MS CE PDA's, they gave me one for
free, I wonder how they will feel when MS allow their users to by-pass the
Orange phone network to make free calls. (the internet access through
Orange is free, or at least hidden in the monthly payment, on these
phones).
Richard R
I wonder. Has anyone tried Gizmo? http://www.gizmoproject.com Does it
compare well with the competition?
--
10:09:08 up 47 days, 19:59, 3 users, load average: 2.48, 2.21, 2.08
Kernel Version
2.6.8-2-686 GNU/Linux
http://www.debian.org
Thomas Wootten
>
http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html
"Live Safety Center is pretty much a "me too" service from Microsoft, which
is looking to catch up with the established security players, Gartner"
and the wintrolls claim Open Source just copies other's ideas. Well, this is
just one example of MS doing it, as they have for years.
Typical MS, let other people test the market, then jump on the bandwagon and
muscle everybody else out of the way.
WHY does MS CONSTANTLY feel the need to bundle stuff in with it's OS and
thereby exclude competitors, when it gains nothing from it?
Oh yeah, it's Bill's dream
A computer on every desk and in every home, [exclusively] running Microsoft
software.
and he does it by the same tactics as drug dealers. Offer a freebie beta or
trial, then charge for it later.
--
Tom Wootten, Fresher NatSci, Trinity Hall.
oof.trinhall.cam.ac.uk
There was only ever one valid use for the notorious <blink> tag:
Schrodinger's cat is <blink>not</blink> dead.
Thomas Wootten
I haven't read all the new posts yet, so this may have been addressed
already.
Some ISP/Phone companies are considering a sort of filtering service
designed to block out VoIP data packets. It could set a nasty precedent -
internet access with dozens of restrictions on what you may and may not do
with it. Since if they can block VoIP packets, to protect their commercial
interests, the RIAA and so on will probably strongarm the ISPs into
blocking P2P packets as well.
And when the heuristics get it wrong...C H A O S
r.e.b...@usa.net
Au79 wrote:
> CNET News.com - United States
> <http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
Yet another attempt by Microsoft to introduce it's own proprietary
product as an "Innovation" which is based on Open Source code.
Vonage, Skype, and a number of other VOIP carriers have been offering
their services on a number of small "appliance" boxes which plug into
an ethernet port, then into the telephone wiring, or just a local
phone. And guess what all these little appliances run as software?
If you guessed Linux - you're right on the money.
The fact is that Linux has offered VOIP for quite a while. It's
technology based on the h.323 standard (I'm not sure of the exact ansii
numbers). The big problem in the past has been that there weren't
enough servers to handle millions of VOIP boxes dialing to cities all
over the world. The other problem was that there weren't millions of
users with high reliability high-bandwidth connections.
Most of these appliances use a combination of LDAP to find locations,
and the h.323 or h.325 VOIP standards to support the connections.
These are usually coupled with ipsec based virtual private networks
which can then be used to simulate static IP addresses.
Many of these now VOIP "appliances" also have something similar to a
MAC Address which can be used by the VOIP provider to securely map the
phone number to the virtual static IP even though the customer is
connected via DHCP IP which can change on a whim.
Since these applications were written for Linux, it's trivial to have
them working on a Linux workstation.
Net2Phone has been around for quite a while and provides the ability to
deliver phone service to users, including Windows users. They charge
about 2 cents/minute and bill in $25 increments which can be
replenished in a "pay as you go" model. Since most people use
Voice-over-PC VOIP much less frequently than cell phones or appliance
VOIP, this is often a very practical model.
For years, the traditional phone companies have been resisting VOIP and
even tried to derail VOIP efforts. Now that most telephone companies
are offering DSL to retail customers, and are competing with Cable TV
companies, who can also provide high-bandwidth services, they are now
beginning to make the VOIP service part of their own DSL package.
Microsoft is again trying to subvert accepted public standards in hopes
of extending it's monopoly into the telephony realm. This should be a
wake-up call to the telephone companies to resist the temptation to
allow Microsoft to add some field protected by an NDA, and then use
that proprietary field to extend it's monopoly control to all VOIP
services.
> http://www.euronet.nl/users/frankvw/rants/microsoft/IhateMS.html
Sinister Midget
> CNET News.com - United States
>
><http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
Novell (Quote, Chart) plans to cut roughly 600 jobs and focus on its
core businesses, Linux and identity, to drive company growth,
executives announced Wednesday.
The restructuring is expected to save the company more than $110
million in annual run-rate expenses, officials said, resulting in a
restructuring charge of $30 million to $50 million in the fourth
quarter, which ended Monday.
Wasn't some Windolt trying to make the case that Novelll was dumping
linux when they posted the job cuts?
--
Qdens: Innovative Microsoft peer-to-peer software.
BearItAll
Thats a tricky one, because you could understand some of the smaller
internet companies wanting to block what could eventually account for a
very large amount of their bandwidth. It may only take a couple of their
commercial customers, with say 500 employees each moving to voip, and they
other customers may suffer a major loss of bandwidth.
Then, heading towards your last line which I thought was quite neat, could
be seen as very funny or very disasterous, anyone can set off a data
stream, which could be data or digitized voice, how are they going to know
what protected packets contain without snooping?
Snooping on the Internet is a daft game simply because of the volume of
traffic. Ok, it's a good idea to use protected packets for voip because
those who want to hear what you are talking about are going to watch for
packets/streams with specific source and/or destination, which is quite
easily done. But to attempt to block all voip would require knowing for
certain that this packet is in fact a digitised voice packet. Chances are
that two ends of a voip link would also have other forms of protected
communications in place, such as vpn.
Streams are no different in that respect, still protected, still need to be
sure of what the stream contains before you can block it. They is the point
that the packet type makes a major difference in stutter free voice comms
so you could block a particular type. But with the increasing speed of
Internet links, that may well be a problem that will fade away in time, so
that snooping is then their only reliable way of knowing what to block.
William Poaster
Midget console, was as follows:
The Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll in the "Linux PCs: Customer service or
lip service?" thread, I believe you mean....
--
Lie of the 70's = The check is in the mail
Lie of the 80's = Trickle down economics
Lie of the 90's = I have not had sex with that woman/man/computer/etc.
Lie of the 00's = Monopoly promotes innovation.
Sinister Midget
> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 10:43:27 +0000, a broadcast message from the Sinister
> Midget console, was as follows:
>
>> On 2005-11-04, Au79 <au...@33mc2.edu> posted something concerning:
>>> CNET News.com - United States
>>>
>>><http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
>>
>> Novell (Quote, Chart) plans to cut roughly 600 jobs and focus on its
>> core businesses, Linux and identity, to drive company growth,
>> executives announced Wednesday.
>>
>> The restructuring is expected to save the company more than $110
>> million in annual run-rate expenses, officials said, resulting in a
>> restructuring charge of $30 million to $50 million in the fourth
>> quarter, which ended Monday.
>>
>> Wasn't some Windolt trying to make the case that Novelll was dumping linux
>> when they posted the job cuts?
>
> The Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll in the "Linux PCs: Customer service or
> lip service?" thread, I believe you mean....
That must be the one that I recall seeing secondhand.
--
Joex: Innovative Microsoft peer-to-peer software.
William Poaster
Midget console, was as follows:
> On 2005-11-04, William Poaster <will...@jvyycbnfg.zr.hx> posted
> something concerning:
>> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 10:43:27 +0000, a broadcast message from the
>> Sinister Midget console, was as follows:
>>
>>> On 2005-11-04, Au79 <au...@33mc2.edu> posted something concerning:
>>>> CNET News.com - United States
>>>>
>>>><http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
>>>
>>> Novell (Quote, Chart) plans to cut roughly 600 jobs and focus on its
>>> core businesses, Linux and identity, to drive company growth,
>>> executives announced Wednesday.
>>>
>>> The restructuring is expected to save the company more than $110
>>> million in annual run-rate expenses, officials said, resulting in a
>>> restructuring charge of $30 million to $50 million in the fourth
>>> quarter, which ended Monday.
>>>
>>> Wasn't some Windolt trying to make the case that Novelll was dumping
>>> linux when they posted the job cuts?
>>
>> The Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll in the "Linux PCs: Customer service or
>> lip service?" thread, I believe you mean....
>
> That must be the one that I recall seeing secondhand.
I only saw Linųnutlinųnut's reply to him.
lqu...@uku.co.uk
William Poaster wrote:
> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 10:43:27 +0000, a broadcast message from the Sinister
> Midget console, was as follows:
>
> > On 2005-11-04, Au79 <au...@33mc2.edu> posted something concerning:
> >> CNET News.com - United States
> >>
> >><http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
> >
> > Novell (Quote, Chart) plans to cut roughly 600 jobs and focus on its
> > core businesses, Linux and identity, to drive company growth,
> > executives announced Wednesday.
> >
> > The restructuring is expected to save the company more than $110
> > million in annual run-rate expenses, officials said, resulting in a
> > restructuring charge of $30 million to $50 million in the fourth
> > quarter, which ended Monday.
> >
> > Wasn't some Windolt trying to make the case that Novelll was dumping linux
> > when they posted the job cuts?
>
> The Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll in the "Linux PCs: Customer service or
> lip service?" thread, I believe you mean....
>
Learn to read. Better yet, show where I said that "Novell is dumping
Linux" - I didn't think so.
What I posted was the fact that Novell had a layoff yesterday. And the
FACT (according to SEC filings) that SuSE revenue declined by 17%
compared to the prior year.
But hey, don't let FACTS get in the way of your lies. Keep claiming
that I said "Novell is dumping Linux." Perhaps someone here is stupid
enough to believe it.
lqu...@uku.co.uk
No, it was not. So guess again.
What I posted was the fact that Novell had a layoff yesterday. And the
FACT (according to SEC filings) that SuSE revenue declined by 17%
compared to the prior year. I said nothing about any plans by anyone to
dump Linux.
lqu...@uku.co.uk
William Poaster wrote:
> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 12:15:28 +0000, a broadcast message from the Sinister
> Midget console, was as follows:
>
> > On 2005-11-04, William Poaster <will...@jvyycbnfg.zr.hx> posted
> > something concerning:
> >> On Fri, 04 Nov 2005 10:43:27 +0000, a broadcast message from the
> >> Sinister Midget console, was as follows:
> >>
> >>> On 2005-11-04, Au79 <au...@33mc2.edu> posted something concerning:
> >>>> CNET News.com - United States
> >>>>
> >>>><http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
> >>>
> >>> Novell (Quote, Chart) plans to cut roughly 600 jobs and focus on its
> >>> core businesses, Linux and identity, to drive company growth,
> >>> executives announced Wednesday.
> >>>
> >>> The restructuring is expected to save the company more than $110
> >>> million in annual run-rate expenses, officials said, resulting in a
> >>> restructuring charge of $30 million to $50 million in the fourth
> >>> quarter, which ended Monday.
> >>>
> >>> Wasn't some Windolt trying to make the case that Novelll was dumping
> >>> linux when they posted the job cuts?
> >>
> >> The Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll in the "Linux PCs: Customer service or
> >> lip service?" thread, I believe you mean....
> >
> > That must be the one that I recall seeing secondhand.
>
> I only saw Linønutlinønut's reply to him.
More like you only see what you want to see and only hear what you want
to hear.
Roy Schestowitz
>
> Au79 wrote:
>> CNET News.com - United States
>>
<http://news.com.com/Other+companies+in+Microsofts+crosshairs/2100-1011_3-5927345.html>
>
> Yet another attempt by Microsoft to introduce it's own proprietary
> product as an "Innovation" which is based on Open Source code.
>
> Vonage, Skype, and a number of other VOIP carriers have been offering
> their services on a number of small "appliance" boxes which plug into
> an ethernet port, then into the telephone wiring, or just a local
> phone. And guess what all these little appliances run as software?
>
> If you guessed Linux - you're right on the money.
That includes Asterisk servers. I know someone who was introduced to Linux
through his passion for VoIP. To Microsoft, such introduction are a
substantial threat.
> The fact is that Linux has offered VOIP for quite a while. It's
> technology based on the h.323 standard (I'm not sure of the exact ansii
> numbers). The big problem in the past has been that there weren't
> enough servers to handle millions of VOIP boxes dialing to cities all
> over the world. The other problem was that there weren't millions of
> users with high reliability high-bandwidth connections.
Do not forget inertia due to hype, as well as the willingness among users to
cut down their bills. They are now able to connect with many people as the
growth of VoIP is exponential. Imagine yourself a Linux router/box at every
home. Then imagine Gates' reaction.
VoIP opens to the door to a few more lock-ins. Assuming the telephone, the
computer, the TV, and the cellphone are bound to merge at one level or
another, it is important for Microsoft to have presence in all. They have
already entered the market of mobile devices; DRM comes to mind too. Need I
mention live.com, an Internet version of Office, and .Net? All of these are
intended to grant Windows ownership over the Net.
Roy
--
Roy S. Schestowitz | $> wget -r -erobots=off http://www.*
http://Schestowitz.com | SuSE Linux | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
4:50pm up 1 day 12:48, 4 users, load average: 0.05, 0.10, 0.14
http://iuron.com - next generation of search paradigms
Roy Schestowitz
Novell laid off a large proporation of their employees as a part of re-
structuring process. According to what I read in the news this morning, a
/tighter/ bond with Linux and re-centralisation around Open Source forms
the very core of that restructuring process. If anything, this reorganisa-
tion (Microsoft are going through a similar phase by the way) shows that
Novell are strengthening their SuSE front more than ever before. It would
be foolish to assume anything else.
http://computerworld.co.nz/news.nsf/news/00A78590A3A229DBCC2570A40021DC61
lqu...@uku.co.uk
I agree with you Roy - this was plainly stated in at least 6 of the
press-releases issued by Novell. (They're all basically the same PR
that was published in several sources.) And that's why I never refuted
this statement and that is why I *clearly* didn't say that Novell was
"Dumping Linux."
But evidently some people will stoop to any level and lie claiming that
I did say this. And I doubt the lying cowards have the decency to admit
they were wrong.
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
11/04/2005
at 02:38 AM, r.e.b...@usa.net said:
>The fact is that Linux has offered VOIP for quite a while. It's
>technology based on the h.323 standard (I'm not sure of the exact
>ansii numbers).
What about peer-to-peer VOIP? Why do you need a central server to
communicate between two computers with compatible VOIP software?
The typical argument is that you need a central server to call someone
over the analog voice network, but how expensive is a voice modem?
--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT <http://patriot.net/~shmuel>
Unsolicited bulk E-mail subject to legal action. I reserve the
right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail. Reply to
domain Patriot dot net user shmuel+news to contact me. Do not
reply to spam...@library.lspace.org
Roy Schestowitz
Read this first:
Novell announced changes including SUSE developer jobs cuts this week:
Contrary to what was expected from recent Novell announcements, Novell
executives are apparently slicing deeply into the Linux heart of the
company. Jobs and resources are actually being slashed in several
areas previously dubbed by Novell management as "key component parts
of Novell's Linux developments": staffers working on Mono, Hula,
Evolution and Desktop Strategy are getting the sack.
SUSE customers around the world will be shocked and puzzled by this
management decision. If they feel like I do, they'll liken the recent
Novell moves to the ones we witnessed at Sun Microsystems--a
management team that doesn't know what direction they want to head and
changes course every other week.
More:
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2005-11-04-018-26-OP-SS-NV
Don't neglect to read this too:
Kurt Pfeifle, a KDE developer, stated in his Linux today story that,
"Contrary to what was expected from recent Novell announcements,
Novell executives are apparently slicing deeply into the Linux heart
of the company."
"Nonsense," replied one senior Novell open-source engineer to this
comment.
Kevan Barney, Novell's senior public relations manager, said, "The
Linux teams are largely intact, and the desktops aren't going away.
Pfeifle went on to write, "staffers working on Mono, Hula, Evolution
and Desktop Strategy are getting the sack."
While cuts are being made across the company, Mancusi-Ungaro
emphasized that "Novell is not pulling the plug on the desktop. We
feel we lead it today, and we look forward to the next generation of
the desktop. The desktop is in the core set of Novell open enterprise
stack of data center, workgroup and desktop, identify and resource
management."
More:
Mark Kent
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz <spam...@library.lspace.org.invalid> espoused:
> begin In <1131100700....@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, on
> 11/04/2005
> at 02:38 AM, r.e.b...@usa.net said:
>
>>The fact is that Linux has offered VOIP for quite a while. It's
>>technology based on the h.323 standard (I'm not sure of the exact
>>ansii numbers).
>
> What about peer-to-peer VOIP? Why do you need a central server to
> communicate between two computers with compatible VOIP software?
>
H.323 can work p2p quite happily. The problem H.323 has is that
it's not very firewall friendly, nor is SIP. Stun servers were
supposed to get around that problem, but they're being blocked
too. Asterisk's IAX works around this well, however, and Cisco
have made their extended H.323 work through firewalls, and are
working on extensions to SIP as well.
> The typical argument is that you need a central server to call someone
> over the analog voice network, but how expensive is a voice modem?
>
Depends on how much traffic you want to carry. A four PRI line card is
about £1000-£2000, I think. If you just want to do IP-only, then the
sound card in a PC is probably good enough for most people, but you'll
need some kind of headset to avoid echo problems. Also, as you don't
get side-tone, people tend to yell into them, as they do into Mobile
handsets, for the same reason.
There is no analogue voice network, though - it's all digital, and
has been for rather a long time.
--
end
| Mark Kent -- mark at ellandroad dot demon dot co dot uk |
This Fortune Examined By INSPECTOR NO. 2-14
William Poaster
Schestowitz console, was as follows:
In your reply to the Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll, I understand he posted
this:- "What I posted was the fact that Novell had a layoff yesterday. And
the FACT (according to SEC filings) that SuSE revenue declined by 17%
compared to the prior year"
What he actually replied to someone (I only saw Linonut's reply to him)
was:-
"...Novell, No. (Hence the reason for a 20% layoff today. Novell's SuSE
revenues actually fell 17% YoY.)"
So just WTF *was* the troll implying, if it wasn't that Novell were laying
of *linux* staff?
Roy Schestowitz
> On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 03:33:44 +0000, a broadcast message from the Roy
> Schestowitz console, was as follows:
>
> In your reply to the Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll, I understand he posted
> this:- "What I posted was the fact that Novell had a layoff yesterday. And
> the FACT (according to SEC filings) that SuSE revenue declined by 17%
> compared to the prior year"
>
> What he actually replied to someone (I only saw Linonut's reply to him)
> was:-
> "...Novell, No. (Hence the reason for a 20% layoff today. Novell's SuSE
> revenues actually fell 17% YoY.)"
>
> So just WTF *was* the troll implying, if it wasn't that Novell were laying
> of *linux* staff?
I need to check these trolls lists (ngstats.pl) more frequently. I am
embarrassing not only myself, but some others in this group too... If only
we could colour posters red and blue...
Roy
--
Roy S. Schestowitz | LINUX - (L)ove (I)s (N)ever (U)tterly eXPensive
http://Schestowitz.com | SuSE Linux | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
1:35pm up 2 days 9:33, 5 users, load average: 0.37, 0.43, 0.41
lqu...@uku.co.uk
William Poaster wrote:
> On Sat, 05 Nov 2005 03:33:44 +0000, a broadcast message from the Roy
> Schestowitz console, was as follows:
>
> In your reply to the Larry Qualig/lqualig wintroll, I understand he posted
> this:- "What I posted was the fact that Novell had a layoff yesterday. And
> the FACT (according to SEC filings) that SuSE revenue declined by 17%
> compared to the prior year"
>
> What he actually replied to someone (I only saw Linonut's reply to him)
> was:-
> "...Novell, No. (Hence the reason for a 20% layoff today. Novell's SuSE
> revenues actually fell 17% YoY.)"
>
> So just WTF *was* the troll implying, if it wasn't that Novell were laying
> of *linux* staff?
Wasn't implying anything asshole. Was simply stating a FACT.
http://linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?ltsn=2005-11-04-018-26-OP-SS-NV
You are either misinformed, ignorant or plain stupid. I suspect that
it's all of the above. But the FACT is that Novell is laying off
people from their SuSE division. Just because you are too
dumb/stupid/ignorant to know this doesn't mean that it isn't true.
SO EAT SHIT ASSHOLE !!!
Because you are wrong again you dumb fsck.