What are Microsoft *really* good at ?
Terry Porter
Microsoft: We have this incredible new Windows 7 Beta, it's awesome, fast
and free, get it here ...
Linux User: Your new Windows 7 Beta looks a lot like Vista and it has
fundamental design problems with its UAC !
Microsoft: No it's not Vista, it's a BETA, and you have to expect initial
problems with BETAs OK!
Linux User: Well, ok, but I think it still looks a lot like Vista
Microsoft: Why do you hate Microsoft so much ?
Microsoft: HEY, the new Windows 7 BETA is so great, with so few bugs we are
going straight to a RELEASE CANDIDATE!
Linux User: You are going straight to a RC from a BETA ?
Microsoft: It's not a BETA, it's based on Vista, which is already proved so
going to a RC is ok in this case.
Linux User: But that's what I said before, and your response was to ask me
why I hate Microsoft so much ???
Microsoft: Yeah, well you commie, pinko, anti American, viral Linux users
are all the same.
Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
--
If we wish to reduce our ignorance, there are people we will
indeed listen to. Trolls are not among those people, as trolls, more or
less by definition, *promote* ignorance.
Kelsey Bjarnason, C.O.L.A. 2008
7
> *Marketing* of course :-
If you can call it marketing.
Technology evangelism that bases its techniques on
Stazi style infiltration
All here PLEX_2456.pdf http://www.iowa.gotthefacts.org
Followed by GESTAPO style behind your back operations
- e.g. attacking Linux staff inside Del by naming them
and plotting to take actions against them.
All here PX09280.pdf http://www.iowa.gotthefacts.org
Would any of the Linux engineers reacted differently
if they knew Stazi style infiltration and GESTAPO
style targetting was being used against them by micoshaft?
I think so!
Every fscking micoshaft stupid fsck that turned up
would have got beaten up and escorted out of Del's premises.
And the police would have to be called to recover
all those illegally obtained bits of information from spying
and plotting.
If I were Del management or its investors, I would not
allow any micoshaft sales reps to enter the building
without signing a VERY VERY DISCRIMINATORY NDA that
among other things require micoshaft to turn over all
past documentation held on all Del employees.
to address issues in PX09280.pdf http://www.iowa.gotthefacts.org.
amicus_curious
"Terry Porter" <lin...@netspace.net.au> wrote in message
news:9sCdnVCGFPlZ9RrU...@netspace.net.au...
>
> Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
>
Roy Schestowitz
Hash: SHA1
____/ Terry Porter on Monday 02 February 2009 21:42 : \____
> *Marketing* of course :-
>
> Microsoft: We have this incredible new Windows 7 Beta, it's awesome, fast
> and free, get it here ...
>
> Linux User: Your new Windows 7 Beta looks a lot like Vista and it has
> fundamental design problems with its UAC !
>
> Microsoft: No it's not Vista, it's a BETA, and you have to expect initial
> problems with BETAs OK!
>
> Linux User: Well, ok, but I think it still looks a lot like Vista
>
> Microsoft: Why do you hate Microsoft so much ?
>
> Microsoft: HEY, the new Windows 7 BETA is so great, with so few bugs we are
> going straight to a RELEASE CANDIDATE!
>
> Linux User: You are going straight to a RC from a BETA ?
>
> Microsoft: It's not a BETA, it's based on Vista, which is already proved so
> going to a RC is ok in this case.
>
> Linux User: But that's what I said before, and your response was to ask me
> why I hate Microsoft so much ???
>
> Microsoft: Yeah, well you commie, pinko, anti American, viral Linux users
> are all the same.
>
> Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
It was the same in 2006 when Microsoft prepared to released Vista.
"Last nail on Linux' coffin..."
"Vista is so amazing, beautiful, etc."
Did you know that Vista7 will make you toast and help your grandma cross the
road safely?
- --
~~ Best of wishes
Beware the Windows box spewage (more commonly known as "spam")
http://Schestowitz.com | GNU is Not UNIX | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
http://iuron.com - proposing a non-profit search engine
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ray
great at extortion.
ray
Find - just keep that attitude!
Rex Ballard
> "Terry Porter" <linu...@netspace.net.au> wrote in message
>
> news:9sCdnVCGFPlZ9RrU...@netspace.net.au...
>
> > Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
>
> Microsoft: Well, I may be slow, but I'm way ahead of YOU!!! Chump.
I'd just like to know what kind of "gun" Microsoft is pointing at the
heads of the CEOs of Dell, HP, Lenovo, and Acer, that make those
companies want to write "blank checks" that give Microsoft complete
power to turn their PCs into worthless commodities that have to be
sold at a LOSS of 5-20%.
I know what kind of "guns" Microsoft used against IBM, both during OS/
2 and during their efforts to put Linux on the desktops. I've
described them in numerous posts.
All I can figure is that Microsoft is telling HP, Dell, Acer, and
Lenovo that if they don't buy a few million more licenses than the
number of computers they sell, and they don't preinstall Windows
exactly the way Microsoft wants them to, with no provision for even
running the Linux that is embedded in the mother-board, Microsoft will
demand $400 per machine for every machine shipped with Linux that ends
up running a "Pirated" version of Windows.
Pretty arrogant when you think about it. Microsoft things Dell can
sell 20 million computers, demands that Dell purchase 30 million
licenses or pay a about twice as much for 20 million licenses, and
then demands that every machine be installed and configured with
Windows, only Windows, and nothing but Windows - even though they are
under a court settlement which demands that they NOT interfere with
any attempts to market or distribute preinstalled versions of Linux on
those same computers.
What's even more absurd is that Dell's sales were below Microsoft's
estimates, and they only sold 15 million PCs, which means that they
now have 15 million licenses from this year, and 15 million licenses
from last year, along with 10 million licenses from Pre-Vista XP days,
which means that they really don't NEED to buy any licenses from
Microsoft, they have more than they need.
But even funnier, is that most companies with 1000 or more employees
have to by 1200 licenses per 1200 employees, even if 1/2 of those
employees never use a computer in their job (warehouse, manufacturing,
mechanics...).
So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
"upgrades") per 1000 computers, and they are bitching and demanding
$400 per copy for "pirated" versions installed on machines that were
shipped with Vista?
It must feel like "negotiating" with O.J. Simpson in Los Vegas.
Hadron
> On Feb 2, 5:41 pm, "amicus_curious" <A...@sti.net> wrote:
>> "Terry Porter" <linu...@netspace.net.au> wrote in message
>>
>> news:9sCdnVCGFPlZ9RrU...@netspace.net.au...
>>
>> > Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
>>
>> Microsoft: Well, I may be slow, but I'm way ahead of YOU!!! Chump.
>
> I'd just like to know what kind of "gun" Microsoft is pointing at the
> heads of the CEOs of Dell, HP, Lenovo, and Acer, that make those
> companies want to write "blank checks" that give Microsoft complete
> power to turn their PCs into worthless commodities that have to be
> sold at a LOSS of 5-20%.
I dont know that makes any sense. Linux is available from DELL. Linux is
available to download.
PCs without Windows tend not to sell so much since people dont want the
hassle of buying and installing an OS separately. People WANT
Windows. Right or wrong. They want it.
Stop making things up Rexx.
Rex Ballard
> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think they're
> great at extortion.
They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
sabotage, and obstruction of justice, just before negotiating
settlements where the lawyers get $millions in cash, and the plaintiff
gets $millions worth of "Billy Bucks" - Microsoft licenses - for
computers that were previously running Linux.
Microsoft has demonstrated that CRIME DOES PAY!
Of course, many others have emulated the style, including
Enron
WorldCom
Bernie Maddof
Goldman Sachs
Country Wide Mortgage
Merril Lynch
Haliburton
Exxon
BP
And they are still looking at
Citi Bank
Bank of America
Chase
JP Morgan
And so many others with market caps that don't make them newsworthy.
The American corporate boardrooms are filled with Bill Gates wannabes
who have turned the market into a cesspool, and now they want the
United States taxpayers to fork over a $trillion in cash, no questions
asked, or they will collapse the American Economy?
Yes, George W Bush and Paulson should be charged with fraud, blackmail
and extortion as well.
Note that most of the companies above, including Microsoft, were big
ticket contributors to Bush and Republican campaigns for the last 8
years.
Imagine going to you safety deposit box and finding out that your
jewelry, stocks, bonds, and the deed to your house had all been
replaced with IOU slips from a wino on skid row.
The Bill Gates model of business.
amicus_curious
"Rex Ballard" <rex.b...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3931439c-6193-468f...@17g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
> On Feb 2, 5:41 pm, "amicus_curious" <A...@sti.net> wrote:
>> "Terry Porter" <linu...@netspace.net.au> wrote in message
>>
>> news:9sCdnVCGFPlZ9RrU...@netspace.net.au...
>>
>> > Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
>>
>> Microsoft: Well, I may be slow, but I'm way ahead of YOU!!! Chump.
>
> I'd just like to know what kind of "gun" Microsoft is pointing at the
> heads of the CEOs of Dell, HP, Lenovo, and Acer, that make those
> companies want to write "blank checks" that give Microsoft complete
> power to turn their PCs into worthless commodities that have to be
> sold at a LOSS of 5-20%.
>
abandon your fantasies and pay more attention to what is really happening,
you would understand that there is no gun at all, just a continuing history
of Microsoft servicing the changing wants and needs of their customer.
> I know what kind of "guns" Microsoft used against IBM, both during OS/
> 2 and during their efforts to put Linux on the desktops. I've
> described them in numerous posts.
>
Total fiction, of course.
> All I can figure is that Microsoft is telling HP, Dell, Acer, and
> Lenovo that if they don't buy a few million more licenses than the
> number of computers they sell, and they don't preinstall Windows
> exactly the way Microsoft wants them to, with no provision for even
> running the Linux that is embedded in the mother-board, Microsoft will
> demand $400 per machine for every machine shipped with Linux that ends
> up running a "Pirated" version of Windows.
>
Is that really all that you can "figure"? You are stuck in the wrong box, I
believe.
> Pretty arrogant when you think about it. Microsoft things Dell can
> sell 20 million computers, demands that Dell purchase 30 million
> licenses or pay a about twice as much for 20 million licenses, and
> then demands that every machine be installed and configured with
> Windows, only Windows, and nothing but Windows - even though they are
> under a court settlement which demands that they NOT interfere with
> any attempts to market or distribute preinstalled versions of Linux on
> those same computers.
>
You are only fantasizing again. The OEMs do not want to distribute
pre-installed versions of Linux.
> What's even more absurd is that Dell's sales were below Microsoft's
> estimates, and they only sold 15 million PCs, which means that they
> now have 15 million licenses from this year, and 15 million licenses
> from last year, along with 10 million licenses from Pre-Vista XP days,
> which means that they really don't NEED to buy any licenses from
> Microsoft, they have more than they need.
>
> But even funnier, is that most companies with 1000 or more employees
> have to by 1200 licenses per 1200 employees, even if 1/2 of those
> employees never use a computer in their job (warehouse, manufacturing,
> mechanics...).
>
> So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
> "upgrades") per 1000 computers, and they are bitching and demanding
> $400 per copy for "pirated" versions installed on machines that were
> shipped with Vista?
>
Keep on chugging, Rex, you are clearly on a roll!
> It must feel like "negotiating" with O.J. Simpson in Los Vegas.
>
I think that he is in the county clink still.
Hadron
Ezekiel
"Rex Ballard" <rex.b...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:3931439c-6193-468f...@17g2000vbf.googlegroups.com...
>> "Terry Porter" <linu...@netspace.net.au> wrote in message
>>
>> news:9sCdnVCGFPlZ9RrU...@netspace.net.au...
>>
>> > Linux User: <sigh> Same old Microsoft, same old crappy OS...
>>
>> Microsoft: Well, I may be slow, but I'm way ahead of YOU!!! Chump.
>
> I'd just like to know what kind of "gun" Microsoft is pointing at the
> heads of the CEOs of Dell, HP, Lenovo, and Acer, that make those
> companies want to write "blank checks" that give Microsoft complete
> power to turn their PCs into worthless commodities that have to be
> sold at a LOSS of 5-20%.
You are a liar and once again making up lies. Take a look at the facts and
you'll see that those companies like Dell continue to make Billions (with a
B) in profit each year. That would be impossible if they had to sell their
products at a LOSS you idiot.
> I know what kind of "guns" Microsoft used against IBM, both during OS/
> 2 and during their efforts to put Linux on the desktops.
Quite frankly you don't know anything. And you certainly have ZERO idea of
what high level negotiations took place during OS2.
> I've described them in numerous posts.
Your numerous posts mainly consist of paranoid stories and lies that you
have never been able to back up.
> All I can figure is that Microsoft is telling HP, Dell, Acer, and
I don't have to figure anything. You are simply a liar. Why haven't you
ever backed up your lie that the 'Vista EULA gives MS the right to access
any data on your computer for any purpose.'
You a a delusional COLA liar. Nothing more.
> Pretty arrogant when you think about it. Microsoft things Dell can
> sell 20 million computers, demands that Dell purchase 30 million
> licenses or pay a about twice as much for 20 million licenses,
It's more arrogant for a uninformed dutz like you to fabricate BS stores
about your imaginary delusion of what the contract between MS and Dell
might be. The **FACT** is that you don't know and have zero way of knowing
what the contractural terms are but you continue to post nonsense and lies.
> But even funnier, is that
What's even funnier than that is the completely fake facts that you
continue to post.
> So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
> "upgrades") per 1000 computers,
So now you continue to make up stories and talk about things, sales figures
and contracts that you know absolutely ZERO about.
Ezekiel
> On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think
>> they're
>> great at extortion.
>
> They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
> sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
Then you won't have trouble backing up this latest claim of yours. Of
course you won't because you'll hide behind some BS story of how the court
records were sealed. Yet you think that people will believe a liar like
you.
So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
access any data on your computer at any time?
Rex Ballard - clueless liar.
>
> And so many others with market caps that don't make them newsworthy.
Not nearly corrupt as IBM. And not nearly as dishonest as you and the rest
of the COLA liars.
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
> "upgrades") per 1000 computers, and they are bitching and demanding
> $400 per copy for "pirated" versions installed on machines that were
> shipped with Vista?
It's all funny money.
> It must feel like "negotiating" with O.J. Simpson in Los Vegas.
Not O.J. -- Johnny Cochran.
--
And we can always supply them with a program that makes identical files
into links to a single file.
-- Larry Wall in <1997092920...@wall.org>
Rex Ballard
IBM has been working very hard to maintain ethical standards. There
are business conduct guidelines, and every employee is required to re-
certify every year.
I've even had to report possible misconduct and found that Management
and the legal department were very supportive. There was a potential
piracy issue and the issue was resolved legally and ethically.
90% of the companies in the world are very honest and ethical. For
the last 8-12 years however, there have been some shady deals. In
some companies, ethics is not an asset companies are looking for.
Starting in the Reagan era, Companies financed take-overs by selling
junk bonds to their own pension programs and then raiding the pension
funds of the "over-funded" pension plans of the target company to pay-
off the junk bonds.
The only problem was that when the crash of 2001 hit, and pension
plans lost huge chunks of their funding to Enron, WorldCom, and other
Harvey Pitt targets, the pension funds suddenly weren't "over-funded"
anymore.
The housing crisis wiped out pensions who were heavily invested in
REITs and Mortgage backed bond funds. I'm not even sure where the
money is going. Some bank in Jamaica?
The Bill Gates business model - strikes again.
Ezekiel
What a load of bullshit. Even by the extremely low standards you normally
use..
<quote>
Ripples Keep Spreading in a Chinese Bribery Case
IBM., NCR and Hitachi of Japan were named in a court verdict this month
in the case of a bank chief convicted of accepting more than $500,000 in
bribes.
</quote>
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/01/business/worldbusiness/01bribe.html
<quote>
Settlement Made by I.B.M.
Securities and Exchange Commission agrees to pay $300,000 to settle
regulatory complaints related to allegations that unit in Argentina paid
bribe to win contracts
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D04EFDF1638F931A15751C1A9669C8B63
<quote>
Money-Laundering Report Gives Argentine Leader a New Woe
It also reported that Federal Bank sent about $1 million to a Citibank
account that originated from bribes that an IBM subcontractor paid to an
Argentine public bank to acquire a contract with the government.
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C00EEDB1E38F932A35750C0A9679C8B63
<quote>
Ex-I.B.M. Executive Charged In Multimillion-Dollar Scheme
Former IBM executive Robert St Germain and Lawrence Laspina, Fort
Lauderdale, Fla, man who bought discontinued computer parts, are indicted
by Federal grand jury on charges that they were part of conspiracy to
swindle company out of at least $20 million worth of surplus computer
equipment; grand jury also charges that outsiders provided company insiders
with over $500,000 in bribes to promote scheme
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0DEFDA1438F93BA35757C0A96F958260
(MURDER - Yeah, that's nice.)
<quote>
INTERNATIONAL BUSINESS; Bribery Suspect Is Found Dead
Marcelo Cattaneo, suspect in bribery investigation involving IBM and
Argentine state bank, Banco de la Nacion, is found hanged, a presumed
suicide; case reviewed
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C01E7D6163BF934A35753C1A96E958260
<quote>
Argentina to Seek Extradition Of 2 Executives From U.S.
Argentina will seek extradition from US of two current and two former IBM
executives, amid allegations that company gave Government officials up to
$21 million in bribes in exchange for lucrative bank contract
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9905EED91F3EF936A35756C0A96E958260
> There
> are business conduct guidelines, and every employee is required to re-
> certify every year.
Yeah. And these stories are all "fake" because Microsoft controls the
press. Right liar?
<quote>
Ripples Keep Spreading in a Chinese Bribery Case
IBM., NCR and Hitachi of Japan were named in a court verdict this month
in the case of a bank chief convicted of accepting more than $500,000 in
bribes.
</quote>
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/01/business/worldbusiness/01bribe.html
<quote>
Settlement Made by I.B.M.
Securities and Exchange Commission agrees to pay $300,000 to settle
regulatory complaints related to allegations that unit in Argentina paid
bribe to win contracts
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D04EFDF1638F931A15751C1A9669C8B63
<quote>
Money-Laundering Report Gives Argentine Leader a New Woe
It also reported that Federal Bank sent about $1 million to a Citibank
account that originated from bribes that an IBM subcontractor paid to an
Argentine public bank to acquire a contract with the government.
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C00EEDB1E38F932A35750C0A9679C8B63
<quote>
Ex-I.B.M. Executive Charged In Multimillion-Dollar Scheme
Former IBM executive Robert St Germain and Lawrence Laspina, Fort
Lauderdale, Fla, man who bought discontinued computer parts, are indicted
by Federal grand jury on charges that they were part of conspiracy to
swindle company out of at least $20 million worth of surplus computer
equipment; grand jury also charges that outsiders provided company insiders
with over $500,000 in bribes to promote scheme
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0DEFDA1438F93BA35757C0A96F958260
(MURDER - Yeah, that's nice.)
<quote>
INTERNATIONAL BUSINESS; Bribery Suspect Is Found Dead
Marcelo Cattaneo, suspect in bribery investigation involving IBM and
Argentine state bank, Banco de la Nacion, is found hanged, a presumed
suicide; case reviewed
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C01E7D6163BF934A35753C1A96E958260
<quote>
Argentina to Seek Extradition Of 2 Executives From U.S.
Argentina will seek extradition from US of two current and two former IBM
executives, amid allegations that company gave Government officials up to
$21 million in bribes in exchange for lucrative bank contract
</quote>
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9905EED91F3EF936A35756C0A96E958260
> I've even had to report possible misconduct and found that
I've found that your a habitual liar who has yet to post a single
verifiable fact.
Rex Ballard
> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
> >> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think
> >> they're great at extortion.
> > They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
> > sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
> Then you won't have trouble backing up this latest claim of yours. Of
> course you won't because you'll hide behind some BS story of how the court
> records were sealed. Yet you think that people will believe a liar like
> you.
Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
prosecution.
Windows NT 4.0 service pack 3 was released as part of a settlement
where Microsoft admitted to deliberately sabatoging the Cyrix chip
(IBM had recently purchased Cyrix) causing it to go into a loop that
caused it to overheat. Microsoft's defense was that IBM shouldn't be
allowed to present the code in court because of license terms which
forbade the "Reverse Engineering" of the code.
The judge ruled against suppression of the evidence, pointing out that
this was obstruction of justice. Furthermore, he ruled that the code
Microsoft produced did appear to be sabotage. Microsoft settled very
quickly - releasing a service pack that included a fix that
anticipated the ruling.
Microsoft lost a $200 million judgment to Stack for sabotaging their
"stacker" disk compression software in an attempt to force people to
use Microsoft's proprietary compression instead.
In Caldera vs Microsoft - Microsoft admitted to sabotaging DR-DOS,
making subtle changes in Windows deliberately intended to prevent
proper operation.
IBM testified that Microsoft used extortion and blackmail to try and
get IBM to agree to stop shipping PCs pre-configured with OS/2 Warp.
They provided substantial details, and the Microsoft attorney opted
not to attempt to discredit the witness or cross-examine to get more
details. They knew that the more they asked, the more trouble they
would be in.
But hey,
IBM got $3 billion in settlements from Microsoft for various misdeeds
against IBM, including attempting to embezzle both code and staff
allocated and funded for OS/2 and reallocating them to Windows NT.
IBM also got all the source code to OS/2 - but it took them 2 years to
get all of the bugs out (Warp 4). When they got the bugs out,
Microsoft demanded that they stop selling it.
The Combs vs Microsoft exhibits are available on public web sites.
Unfortunately they are faxes and the printer was crappy so it's a non-
trivial task to transcribe them to searchable text. Roy Schestowitz
has been working on it, releasing a few documents every day, but there
are 9,000 exhibits and even at 9 a day, it could take about 3 years to
get them all out. And that's just ONE case.
The Caldera vs Microsoft case - filled a 10x10x10 storage locker
almost completely. The documents were destroyed when Caldera decided
they couldn't afford to pay for storage any more. Nobody knows what
the terms of the settlement were.
> So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
> access any data on your computer at any time?
Asked and answered. Previous COLA post.
> Rex Ballard - clueless liar.
Hadron Quark - relentless troll and nit picker.
Ezekiel - too lazy to look up past COLA documents.
Ezekiel
> On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
>> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
>> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>> >> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think
>> >> they're great at extortion.
>
>> > They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
>> > sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
>
>> Then you won't have trouble backing up this latest claim of yours. Of
>> course you won't because you'll hide behind some BS story of how the
>> court
>> records were sealed. Yet you think that people will believe a liar like
>> you.
>
> Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
> law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
> reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
> Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
> prosecution.
I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion was.
Your claim is:
<quote>
They (Microsoft) have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion,
blackmail, sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
</quote>
So I don't give a damn at all what some judge has to say because that's not
the issue. The issue is your claim that Microsoft publically admitted this.
Where is this public admission? Not what does some judge think or what
some blogger said. Where is this public admission from Microsoft that you
are claiming?
> Windows NT 4.0 service pack 3 was released as part of a settlement
Blah-blah-blah. Nobody cares about NT 4.0 service pack 3. Where is the
public admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything
about MS having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
> The judge ruled against ....
Blah-blah-blah. I don't care what the judge ruled. Where is the public
admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
> Microsoft lost a $200 million judgment to Stack
Yeah Stacker... stack... 1990. Who ares. Where is the public admission by
MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS having the
right to access any of your data for any reason.
> In Caldera vs Microsoft -
Nobody is asking about or cares about Caldera. Where is the public
admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
> IBM testified that ...
Blah-blah-blah. IBM is a bunch of dirtbag liars and I don't care what they
testified to. Where is the public admission by MS and where in the Vista
EULA does it say anything about MS having the right to access any of your
data for any reason.
> The Combs vs Microsoft exhibits are
That's nice but I don't care about Combs either. Where is the public
admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
>> So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
>> access any data on your computer at any time?
>
> Asked and answered. Previous COLA post.
Where exactly.
Rex Ballard
> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:d0b58b5a-9d23-49b5...@s1g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 2, 6:50 pm, Hadron <hadronqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Rex Ballard <rex.ball...@gmail.com> writes:
> >> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
> >> >> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think
> >> >> they're
> >> >> great at extortion.
What Microsoft is really good at, is providing HELP to customers,
through their software. Microsoft took Mac, "The computer for the
rest of us" and taught us how to use it, without ever opening a
manual, reading a book, or taking lots of college courses.
Sometimes, Microsoft got a little carried a way. We are often annoyed
by the dancing paper clip,and the animated dog helping us search, and
BOB just never even made it to market. It seems that for those helps,
Microsoft assumed that we were dumber than we really were.
I admit, I was using a Mac quite successfully long before Microsoft
even put out Windows 1.0 and Microsoft didn't saturate applications
with help until Windows 3.1, but I also remember being frustrated by
some applications that might have been able to do something - but
figuring out how wasn't so easy.
The Linux community is getting better at providing really good context
sensitive help in newer applications, but there are still a lot of
applications where the only documentation is in the man pages.
> >> > They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
> >> > sabotage, and obstruction of justice, just before negotiating
> >> > settlements where the lawyers get $millions in cash, and the plaintiff
> >> > gets $millions worth of "Billy Bucks" - Microsoft licenses - for
> >> > computers that were previously running Linux.
>
> >> > Microsoft has demonstrated that CRIME DOES PAY!
> >> Why did you not list IBM Rexx?
> > IBM has been working very hard to maintain ethical standards.
> What a load of bullshit. Even by the extremely low standards you normally
> use..
> <quote>
> Ripples Keep Spreading in a Chinese Bribery Case
> </quote>http://www.nytimes.com/2006/12/01/business/worldbusiness/01bribe.html
And not only was the IBM employee fired, but IBM provided evidence
needed to convict him.
> <quote>
> Settlement Made by I.B.M.
> Securities and Exchange Commission agrees to pay $300,000 to settle
> regulatory complaints related to allegations that unit in Argentina paid
> bribe to win contracts
> </quote>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D04EFDF1638F931A15751...
And not only was the IBM employee fired, but IBM provided evidence
needed to convict him.
> <quote>
> Money-Laundering Report Gives Argentine Leader a New Woe
> It also reported that Federal Bank sent about $1 million to a Citibank
> account that originated from bribes that an IBM subcontractor paid to an
> Argentine public bank to acquire a contract with the government.
> </quote>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C00EEDB1E38F932A35750...
And not only was the IBM subcontractor fired, but IBM provided
evidence needed to convict them.
> <quote>
> Ex-I.B.M. Executive Charged In Multimillion-Dollar Scheme
> Former IBM executive Robert St Germain and Lawrence Laspina, Fort
> Lauderdale, Fla, man who bought discontinued computer parts, are indicted
> by Federal grand jury on charges that they were part of conspiracy to
> swindle company out of at least $20 million worth of surplus computer
> equipment; grand jury also charges that outsiders provided company insiders
> with over $500,000 in bribes to promote scheme
> </quote>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9D0DEFDA1438F93BA35757...
IBM doesn't normally declare why someone is an ex-employee. Could it
be that he was fired for misconduct? Doesn't really say - does it?
> (MURDER - Yeah, that's nice.)
> INTERNATIONAL BUSINESS; Bribery Suspect Is Found Dead
> Marcelo Cattaneo, suspect in bribery investigation involving IBM and
> Argentine state bank, Banco de la Nacion, is found hanged, a presumed
> suicide; case reviewed
> </quote>http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9C01E7D6163BF934A35753...
IBM routinely helps to prosecute employees and partners found guilty
of misconduct, especially bribery. It's possible that someone,
knowing that IBM was willing to be more than just a little bit
cooperative - and facing an Argentine prison, might be inclined to
take the "Easy way out".
[snip redundant articles covering the same 3-4 incidents]
> > There
> > are business conduct guidelines, and every employee is required to re-
> > certify every year.
> Yeah. And these stories are all "fake" because Microsoft controls the
> press. Right liar?
No. IBM has almost 1/2 million employees. Some of them do things
they shouldn't. If IBM catches them, IBM often notifies the
authorities themselves. In some cases, especially those involving
government contracts, IBM often initiates their own investigation and
if they think something looks "fishy" they help the authorities
investigate. If there are amends to be made, they get made, even if
the people involved made the illegal actions without IBM's knowledge.
> I've found that your a habitual liar who has yet to post a single
> verifiable fact.
I'm posting in my spare time, often in transit, often with little time
to even type out the post on my Dvorak keyboard (60-80 wpm).
Providing comprehensive research into cases reported 15-20 years ago,
or only currently documented in "paper archives" such as Microfilm or
Microfiche, with no "Google" to aid in the search - tends to take a
very long time.
Sometimes, I'll even throw in a "ringer", posting something I'm
reading in a current issue of a print publication. Ironically, the
referenced information "disappears" shortly after I quote it.
Try reading George Orwell's 1984 or Ray Bradbury's Farenheit 451
If you can find a paper copy anymore.
How much longer before they start burning all the books and closing
all the libraries?
Maybe one of these days, I'll post something really proposterous
sounding, and risk a copyright violation by putting the scanned copy
of the original 20 year old publication article on the web site. I
should probably even include the advertizing of the competitor
products.
I still have a few magazines that go back 30 years.
I once had a complete collection of Byte Magazine from 1979 to 1995
when they stopped the print publication. I'd read every issue cover
to cover. Including the "marginally interesting legal news" in the
back 1/3 of the magazine.
There were THOUSANDS of interesting events that NEVER got reported on
television, or even page one of Time Magazine, or even the first 10
pages of the New York Times.
It seems that nearly all of those events remain undocumented on the
web, even to this day.
RonB
But you're going backwards.
--
RonB
"There's a story there...somewhere"
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> On Feb 2, 6:50 pm, Hadron <hadronqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
He didn't list AT&T or Standard Oil, either, dumbass.
Recent history.
> IBM has been working very hard to maintain ethical standards. There
> are business conduct guidelines, and every employee is required to re-
> certify every year.
>
> I've even had to report possible misconduct and found that Management
> and the legal department were very supportive. There was a potential
> piracy issue and the issue was resolved legally and ethically.
>
> 90% of the companies in the world are very honest and ethical. For
> the last 8-12 years however, there have been some shady deals. In
> some companies, ethics is not an asset companies are looking for.
>
> . . .
>
> The Bill Gates business model - strikes again.
--
In case it's not obvious, any solution to this problem that introduces a
dependency on Java is profoundly uninteresting to me. In fact, my
indifference to that could only be described as "sexual" in intensity.
-- Jamie Zawinski
DFS
> All I can figure is that Microsoft is telling HP, Dell, Acer, and
> Lenovo that if they don't buy a few million more licenses than the
> number of computers they sell, and they don't preinstall Windows
> exactly the way Microsoft wants them to, with no provision for even
> running the Linux that is embedded in the mother-board, Microsoft will
> demand $400 per machine for every machine shipped with Linux that ends
> up running a "Pirated" version of Windows.
Figures don't lie, but liars sometimes figure...
> Pretty arrogant when you think about it. Microsoft things Dell can
> sell 20 million computers, demands that Dell purchase 30 million
> licenses or pay a about twice as much for 20 million licenses, and
> then demands that every machine be installed and configured with
> Windows, only Windows, and nothing but Windows - even though they are
> under a court settlement which demands that they NOT interfere with
> any attempts to market or distribute preinstalled versions of Linux on
> those same computers.
Your supremely stupid fiction is pretty arrogant, too. Every sentence in
the last two paragraphs is a total Rex fabrication.
> What's even more absurd is that Dell's sales were below Microsoft's
> estimates, and they only sold 15 million PCs, which means that they
> now have 15 million licenses from this year, and 15 million licenses
> from last year, along with 10 million licenses from Pre-Vista XP days,
> which means that they really don't NEED to buy any licenses from
> Microsoft, they have more than they need.
I want to set some things straight:
1) you don't know if Dell's sales were below MS estimates
2) you don't know if Dell sold 15 million PCs
3) you don't know if Dell has 15 million licenses left from this year
4) you don't know if Dell has 15 million licenses left from last year
5) you don't know if Dell has 10 million licenses left from pre-Vista
6) you don't know if Dell NEEDS more licenses or not.
In short, you don't know a single thing you just claimed to know.
> But even funnier, is that most companies with 1000 or more employees
> have to by 1200 licenses per 1200 employees, even if 1/2 of those
> employees never use a computer in their job (warehouse, manufacturing,
> mechanics...).
I bet they don't.
> So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
> "upgrades") per 1000 computers, and they are bitching and demanding
> $400 per copy for "pirated" versions installed on machines that were
> shipped with Vista?
Wow! You "advocates" are really good at math!
> It must feel like "negotiating" with O.J. Simpson in Los Vegas.
He *finally* got a bit of what he deserved.
DFS
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Rex Ballard belched out
> this bit o' wisdom:
>
>> So now, Microsoft has managed to get 2700 "licenses" (including
>> "upgrades") per 1000 computers, and they are bitching and demanding
>> $400 per copy for "pirated" versions installed on machines that were
>> shipped with Vista?
>
> It's all funny money.
You read the entire slimy post, and not a word about its veracity?
Linosuckup sucks up again.
Rex Ballard
> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:
266ded66-8359-4f14...@e3g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
> >> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> >> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
> > Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
> > law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
> > reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
> > Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
> > prosecution.
> I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion was.
> Your claim is:
Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
Remember, Microsoft had overturned a prior Jackson ruling by simply re-
presenting evidence to the appellate court, claiming that the Judge
didn't know what he was doing. The 3 judge panel sided with
Microsoft, dismissing the contempt of court ruling - not even
remanding it back to Jackson's court. As a result DOJ and Janet Reno
never had a chance to refute Microsoft's new "evidence".
To prevent this, Judge Jackson issued findings of fact, findings of
law, and the final remedy. He really didn't want to break-up
Microsoft, but Microsoft was so busy attempting to claim that Jackson
was an idiot that they just made the judge unwilling to continue the
remedy hearing. He would have been willing to entertain an argument
of why a break-up would be bad, but Microsoft was trying to claim that
the Judges prior rulings were completely wrong - but his rulings
weren't up for dispute.
When the jury rules guilty, the worst thing you could possibly do is
tell the judge that the judge and the jury were too stupid to
understand the facts, and that you shouldn't be punished for their
ignorance. The judge is very likely to give let you rant, then give
you the maxumum possible number of concurrent sentences, and set your
first eligibility for parole for about 200 years into the future.
Microsoft has settled hundreds of cases to preempt judgments, based on
preliminary rulings, usually getting immunity for it's executives in
the settlements, refusing to admit any wrong-doing, even though the
judge has ruled that wrong-doing was done in preliminary rulings.
Microsoft also has all the records sealed, so that the preliminary
rulings cannot be used against them in other cases. In addition, the
discovery from one case cannot be used in other cases. Even today,
the public documents from Combs vs Microsoft can't be used in future
court cases.
> <quote>
> They (Microsoft) have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion,
> blackmail, sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
> </quote>
> So I don't give a damn at all what some judge has to say because that's not
> the issue. The issue is your claim that Microsoft publically admitted this.
> Where is this public admission? Not what does some judge think or what
> some blogger said. Where is this public admission from Microsoft that you
> are claiming?
Microsoft executives described activities, including their tactics
used to prevent IBM from selling OS/2 and prevent OEMs from
preinstalling Netscape, describing acts which, if they had admitted to
FBI agents in recorded sessions - would have been grounds for
indictments. Judge Jackson declared informally that these were
criminal acts, based on legal definitions of the crimes listed above.
Microsoft has been under various investigations dating back to 1987,
when they were being investigated for fraud based on their use of
"vapor-ware". Microsoft's top executives admitted that they used
vapor-ware, and their defense was that all software companies try to
sell software that hasn't been released yet. The settled with the FTC
prior to the formal vote which went 5 to 4 in favor of not having
Microsoft indicted.
> > Windows NT 4.0 service pack 3 was released as part of a settlement
>
> Blah-blah-blah. Nobody cares about NT 4.0 service pack 3.
You get an answer, and you don't care - so then you change the subject
mid-paragraph.
> Where is the
> public admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything
> about MS having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
Nice strategic subject.
Tell you what, you get me a copy of the exact wording of the Vista
EULA as it was included in the initial January 31 release of Vista,
and I'll highlight the clauses that give Microsoft the right to access
your data for any reason and give it ot anybody.
Microsoft licenses are written in "plain English" and are deliberately
deceptive.
From: http://download.microsoft.com/documents/useterms/Windows%20Vista_Ultimate_English_36d0fe99-75e4-4875-8153-889cf5105718.pdf
<quote>
Activation associates the use of the software with a specific device.
During activation, the software will send information about the
software and the device to Microsoft. This information includes the
version, language and product key of the software, the Internet
protocol address of the device, and nformation derived from the
hardware configuration of the device. For more information, see
http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=69497. By using the software,
you consent to the transmission of this information.
</quote>
Keep in mind that this information, combined with UUID information,
can be linked to other information such as your Active Directory
Kerberos encryption key, your Verisign encryption key, your e-mail
accounts, your web browser, and what 3rd party competitor software you
are using.
<quote>
During a validation check, the software will send information about
the software and the device
to Microsoft. This information includes the version and product key of
the software, and the
Internet protocol address of the device.
</quote>
If this information is provided to a 3rd party, it can be used to
identify you and monitor your activities.
<quote>
Consent for Internet-Based Services. The software features described
below and in the
Windows Vista Privacy Statement connect to Microsoft or service
provider computer systems over
the Internet. In some cases, you will not receive a separate notice
when they connect. You
may switch off these features or not use them. For more information
about these features, see
the Windows Vista Privacy Statement at http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=20615.
By
using these features, you consent to the transmission of this
information.
</quote>
<quote>
Computer Information. The following features use Internet protocols,
which send to the
appropriate systems computer information, such as your Internet
protocol address, the type of
operating system, browser and name and version of the software you are
using, and the
language code of the device where you installed the software.
Microsoft uses this information to make the Internet-based services
available to you.
</quote>
<quote>
Windows Update Feature. You may connect new hardware to your device.
Your device
may not have the drivers needed to communicate with that hardware. If
so, the update
feature of the software can obtain the correct driver from Microsoft
and install it on your
device. You can switch off this update feature.
· Web Content Features. Features in the software can retrieve related
content from Microsoft
and provide it to you. Examples of these features are clip art,
templates, online training,
online assistance and Appshelp. You may choose not to use these web
content features.
· Digital Certificates. The software uses digital certificates. These
digital certificates confirm
the identity of Internet users sending X.509 standard encrypted
information. They also can
be used to digitally sign files and macros, to verify the integrity
and origin of the file contents.
The software retrieves certificates and updates certificate revocation
lists over the Internet,
when available.
· Auto Root Update. The Auto Root Update feature updates the list of
trusted certificate
authorities. You can switch off the Auto Root Update feature.
· Windows Media Digital Rights Management. Content owners use Windows
Media digital
rights management technology (WMDRM) to protect their intellectual
property, including
copyrights. This software and third party software use WMDRM to play
and copy
WMDRM-protected content. If the software fails to protect the content,
content owners may
ask Microsoft to revoke the software’s ability to use WMDRM to play or
copy protected
content. Revocation does not affect other content. When you download
licenses for
protected content, you agree that Microsoft may include a revocation
list with the licenses.
Content owners may require you to upgrade WMDRM to access their
content. Microsoft
software that includes WMDRM will ask for your consent prior to the
upgrade. If you decline
an upgrade, you will not be able to access content that requires the
upgrade. You may
switch off WMDRM features that access the Internet.
</quote>
In very plain terms, you give Microsoft the right to examine ANY file
on your computer.
<quote>
Malicious Software Removal/Clean On Upgrade. Before installation of
the software, the
software will check and remove certain malicious software listed at
http://www.support.microsoft.com/?kbid=890830 (“Malware”) from your
device. When the
software checks your device for Malware, a report will be sent to
Microsoft about any
Malware detected or errors that occurred while the software was
checking for Malware. No
information that can be used to identify you is included in the
report. You may disable the
software’s Malware reporting functionality by following the
instructions found at
http://www.support.microsoft.com/?kbid=890830.
· Network Connectivity Status Icon. This feature determines whether a
system is connected
to a network by either passive monitoring of network traffic or active
DNS or HTTP queries.
The query only transfers standard TCP/IP or DNS information for
routing purposes. You can
switch off the active query feature through a registry setting.
</quote>
Microsoft can monitor all software you install, and all network
traffic.
You CAN switch it off, using Regedit - yeah, that's a trivial task.
<quote>
Use of Information. Microsoft may use the computer information, error
reports, and Malware
reports to improve our software and services. We may also share it
with others, such as
hardware and software vendors. They may use the information to improve
how their products
run with Microsoft software.
</quote>
<quote>
Use of Information. Microsoft may use the computer information,
</quote>
Note, this says ANY information on your computer. it is NOT limited
to
<quote>
error reports, and Malware
reports to improve our software and services.
</quote>
<quote>
We may also share it with others,
</quote>
Including any government agency, any political party, any political
committee, or any blogger likely to make the information public
anonymously.
It does not say information will be limited to software vendors and
will be used ONLY for improving how the software will work with Vista.
It also says they MAY use this information to improve how the software
works, but it doesn't say they may ONLY use it to improve how the
software works. They could also use it to embarass an unfavorable
governor (Spitzer), No restriction on how the information could be
used by Microsoft or anybody else they want to give the information
to.
No limitation on the information to be collected from the computer.
---------
Notice that the license is carefully worded, by giving you benign
examples of possible uses, encouraging you to assume that these are
the only possible uses. Yet, in numerous cases, Microsoft has stated
that it is THEIR interpretation of the contract that matters, not the
end user's "reasonable assumption".
If you accept the EULA license, you legally wave your right to privacy
and grant Microsoft legal permission to monitor ANY information
available on your computer (including the microphone and web-cam if
attached).
And no, there is no need for a warrant to get that information. All a
government agency has to do is request any information that Microsoft
might be able to collect.
> > The judge ruled against ....
> Blah-blah-blah. I don't care what the judge ruled. Where is the public
> admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
> having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
Microsoft admitted to specific activities. The Judge(s) ruled that
these activities were illegal. In many cases, the specific crime was
cited. This is frequently a way for the judge to tell the defendent
(I've reviewed the evidence, you should settle or I'll throw the book
at you).
Microsoft often uses "Letter of the law" defenses, attempting to claim
that their licenses protect them from ANY claims by plaintiffs. They
consented to extortion and sabotage, therefore it's legal.
> > Microsoft lost a $200 million judgment to Stack
> Yeah Stacker... stack... 1990. Who ares. Where is the public admission by
> MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS having the
> right to access any of your data for any reason.
You only want to hear what you want to hear, that you agree with.
> > In Caldera vs Microsoft -
>
> Nobody is asking about or cares about Caldera. Where is the public
> admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
> having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
See above.
> > IBM testified that ...
>
> Blah-blah-blah. IBM is a bunch of dirtbag liars and I don't care what they
> testified to. Where is the public admission by MS and where in the Vista
> EULA does it say anything about MS having the right to access any of your
> data for any reason.
See above
> > The Combs vs Microsoft exhibits are
>
> That's nice but I don't care about Combs either. Where is the public
> admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
> having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
See above
> >> So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
> >> access any data on your computer at any time?
See above
> > Asked and answered. Previous COLA post.
>
> Where exactly.
<quote>
SCOPE OF LICENSE. The software is licensed, not sold. This agreement
only gives you some rights to use the software.
</quote>
<quote>
Microsoft reserves all other rights.
</quote>
Including the right to use any information stored on your computer in
ways NOT listed as examples - as described above.
<quote>
Unless applicable law gives you more rights despite this limitation,
you may use the software only as expressly permitted in this
agreement.
</quote>
In other words, until some judge rules that Microsoft may not engage
in the espionage that you have already consented to as part of the
license, you don't have a right to contest information found and
released or published by Microsoft or any other recipient of that
information.
Hadron
You sound surprised. Why?
Hadron
> On Feb 2, 7:48 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
>> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:
> 266ded66-8359-4f14...@e3g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
>> > On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
>> >> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>>news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>> >> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>
>> > Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
>> > law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
>> > reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
>> > Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
>> > prosecution.
>
>> I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion was.
>> Your claim is:
>
> Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
> criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
> cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
Also, what he says is not what MS "admits to" as you claim.
Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation and almost
nothing you can say can be proved or verified.
Tony Sivori
>
> So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
> access any data on your computer at any time?
Microsoft saves the blanket Administrator rights EULA for security updates
and service packs.
> Rex Ballard - clueless liar.
Nice abusive ad hominem attack. Since you don't cross post to other
groups, I'd put off plonking you. Time to rectify my laziness.
--
Tony Sivori
Due to spam, I'm filtering all Google Groups posters.
Rex Ballard
> Rex Ballard <rex.ball...@gmail.com> writes:
> > On Feb 2, 7:48 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
> >> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:
> >> > On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
> >> >> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> >>>news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> >> >> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
> >> > Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
> >> > law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
> >> > reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
> >> > Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
> >> > prosecution.
> >> I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion was.
> >> Your claim is:
> > Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
> > criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
> > cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
> Also, what he says is not what MS "admits to" as you claim.
Microsoft's defense was not that they didn't do it, but rather that it
was justified as "Corporate Self Defense". They tried to claim that
any moment someone could come up with an innovation that would result
in the complete collapse of Microsoft.
> Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation
You're probably right. I should probably "mellow out" a little.
What I do find very frustrating is that the Linux and OSS community
has worked very hard to generate wonderful innovations including the
Web Browser, the low cost sub-notebook (OLPC), Linux in Firmware,
Virtualisation of servers and desktops, and numerous other innovations
designed to "Play Nice" with Windows, and Microsoft has not only
created massive contractural barriers, effectively tying the hands of
OEMS, preventing them from even attempting to explore the demand for
Linux, by offering systems where BOTH Windows AND Linux are installed
and play nicely together - allowing the CONSUMER, the END USER, to
decide whether to run Windows, Linux, or BOTH.
Then WinTrolls come onto this COLA group and claim that Vista must be
vastly superior to Linux and everything else on the market because
99.9% of the machines sold by Dell, HP, Acer, Lenovo, Toshiba, and
Sony are shipped with Linux pre-installed. The OEMs buy more licenses
than they need, and aren't allowed to give buyers credit for the
licenses unless the the machine is shipped with Vista pre-installed
and running EXCLUSIVELY on the laptop or desktop.
The reality is that in the one scenario where Linux DID compete side-
by-side with Windows XP in a single niche market for a few months
before Microsoft shut down the retail channel, Linux machines outsold
XP machines 60% Linux, 40% Windows.
Microsoft has already been convicted of creating illegal barriers to
compettiion, has been fined $billions in the EU, Asia, and South
America, and yet the United States has been SUPPORTING Microsoft's
anticompetitive tactics - even in the face of a ruling that forbids
them from interfering with OEM attempts to market Linux on desktops
and laptops.
> almost nothing you can say can be proved or verified.
I provide supporting information, or Roy S does, and the topic is
flooded with "noise". The topic gets changed. I've read about 2,000
of the 9,000 exhibits in Combs vs Microsoft and it's very clear that
Microsoft has not only engaged in criminal acts, but knew they were
illegal, and knew that they were violating existing court settlements.
Microsoft paid off Ohio, and tried to have the court records sealed,
but the Judge ruled that those who had archived the documents while
they were in public domain had the right to publish them as public
domain documents.
Too bad those documents can't be used as discovery by the people who
had invested so much time and resources into innovations such as
VMWare, Xen, OLPC, Web, SOA, JavaScript, Java, and Windows. Oh,
that's right, Microsoft has SETTLED with Apple, Sun, IBM, and was
found to be in contempt of court for shipping IE, and paid a whopping
$1 billion for Mosaic to Spyglass, who was only authorized to sell
them "branding rights".
The up-side is that nobody trusted the National Science Foundation or
the NCSA anymore, and started publishing most of their work under Open
Source licenses including GPL, LGPL, and Artistic (Apache) licenses.
Microsoft's latest tactic is to claim "damage to brand" if retailers
display Linux machines next to XP or Vista machines, and to file
lawsuits for copyright violation if machines are NOT sold with
corresponding Windows or Vista licenses. Microsoft has tried to claim
that 80% of the machines not sold with Windows, such as the 40% of the
market that is "White Box" machines sold without an operating system
or with Linux preinstalled (common in Asia and South America), are
actually pirating Windows. They are not willing to provide proof of
this in the form of actual piracy reports from Windows XP or Vista
systems themselves.
Who are the people Micrcosoft least wanted as Obama's Attorney
General?
Elliot Spitzer?
John Edwards?
Hillary Clinton?
And look what happened to them?
At least Hillary got a good deal.
William Poaster
trolls, Tony Sivori was heard to say:
> On Mon, 02 Feb 2009 19:04:36 -0500, Ezekiel wrote:
>>
>> So Rex - where exactly in the Vista EULA does it give MS the right to
>> access any data on your computer at any time?
>
> Microsoft saves the blanket Administrator rights EULA for security updates
> and service packs.
>
>> Rex Ballard - clueless liar.
And:
<quote>
The terms of the Vista EULA, like the current EULA related to the
“Windows Genuine Advantage,” allows Microsoft to unilaterally decide
that you have breached the terms of the agreement, and they can
essentially disable the software, and possibly deny you access to critical
files on your computer without benefit of proof, hearing, testimony or
judicial intervention.
[==]
The Vista EULA informs the licensee that Vista will automatically send
information about the version, language and product key of the software,
the user's Internet protocol address of the device, and information
derived from the hardware configuration of the device.
<unquote>
http://www.securityfocus.com/columnists/423
Ezekiel wintroll - clueless idiot.
Terry Porter
> On Feb 3, 3:31 am, Hadron <hadronqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation
I say Hadrongo is wrong again.
>
> You're probably right.
He's probably not.
> I should probably "mellow out" a little.
Nah, you're always cool and collected, which is simply amazing considering
the sheer volume of smelly wintrolls jumping onto your every post.
Keep up the good work Rex, you're a class act in my book.
--
If we wish to reduce our ignorance, there are people we will
indeed listen to. Trolls are not among those people, as trolls, more or
less by definition, *promote* ignorance.
Kelsey Bjarnason, C.O.L.A. 2008
JEDIDIAH
>
> "Rex Ballard" <rex.b...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:266ded66-8359-4f14...@e3g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
>> On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
>>> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>> news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>>
>>> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>>> >> Actually, I'm not so sure they'e very good at marketing - I think
>>> >> they're great at extortion.
>>
>>> > They have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
>>> > sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
>>
>>> Then you won't have trouble backing up this latest claim of yours. Of
>>> course you won't because you'll hide behind some BS story of how the
>>> court
>>> records were sealed. Yet you think that people will believe a liar like
>>> you.
>>
>> Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
>> law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
>> reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
>> Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
>> prosecution.
>
> I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion was.
> Your claim is:
...yes.
"Nevermind that it's been proven that Microsoft are crooks."
"We're only interested in the claim that Microsoft has admitted they
are crooks."
[deletia]
--
If you think that an 80G disk can hold HUNDRENDS of |||
hours of DV video then you obviously haven't used iMovie either. / | \
Ezekiel
"JEDIDIAH" <je...@nomad.mishnet> wrote in message
news:slrngogju...@nomad.mishnet...
What we're interested in is COLA liars substantiating their ridiculous
claims. The original claim was:
<quote>
They (MS) have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion, blackmail,
sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
</quote>
If MS did in fact 'publicly admit this in court' then let's see some proof.
When and where did MS publicly admit to extortion, blackmail and sabotage.
Where's this admission that was claimed? And if this can't be proven then
it's yet another lie from a Linux "advocate."
Clear enough for you?
chrisv
>Rex Ballard wrote:
>
>> On Feb 3, 3:31 am, Hadron <hadronqu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation
>
>I say Hadrongo is wrong again.
>>
>> You're probably right.
>
>He's probably not.
>
>> I should probably "mellow out" a little.
>
>Nah, you're always cool and collected, which is simply amazing considering
>the sheer volume of smelly wintrolls jumping onto your every post.
>
>Keep up the good work Rex, you're a class act in my book.
Yeah, he's really far too respectful of shite like "Hadron" Quack.
"You're probably right" my arse.
--
"Linux has lost the initiative." - "True Linux advocate" Hadron
Quark, claiming that XP has surpassed Linux on netbooks.
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> Rex Ballard <rex.b...@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
>> criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
>> cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
>
> Also, what he says is not what MS "admits to" as you claim.
>
> Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation and almost
> nothing you can say can be proved or verified.
http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=2007021720190018
No monopoly too repellent for "True Linux Advocate" Hadron Qook to defend.
--
So much food; so little time!
Ezekiel
"Chris Ahlstrom" <ahls...@launchmodem.com> wrote in message
news:z8Zhl.407$QP5...@bignews4.bellsouth.net...
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Hadron belched out
> this bit o' wisdom:
>
>> Rex Ballard <rex.b...@gmail.com> writes:
>>
>>> Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
>>> criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
>>> cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
>>
>> Also, what he says is not what MS "admits to" as you claim.
>>
>> Your posts have recently taken on the tinge of desperation and almost
>> nothing you can say can be proved or verified.
>
> http://www.groklaw.net/staticpages/index.php?page=2007021720190018
>
There is absolutely NOTHING in that link where MS pubically admits to
bribary, extortion and blackmail The link does nothing to support Rex's
ridiculous claim.
Hadron
Ezekiel
On Feb 2, 7:48 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:
266ded66-8359-4f14...@e3g2000vbe.googlegroups.com...
> > On Feb 2, 7:04 pm, "Ezekiel" <Z...@z.com> wrote:
> >> "Rex Ballard" <rex.ball...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:ad5d7665-db9a-4731...@z28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
> >> > On Feb 2, 5:56 pm, ray <r...@zianet.com> wrote:
>> > Judge Thomas Penfield Jackson, shortly after issuing his rulings of
>> > law, and just before releasing the final remedy judgment told a
>> > reporter that, based on the evidence presented in the case,
>> > Microsoft's top executives were criminals and should face criminal
>> > prosecution.
>
>> I don't give a crap what Judge Jackson had to say or what his opinion
>> was.
>> Your claim is:
>
>Jackson is a federal court judge, and had he been able to rule on
>criminal charges, would have probably ruled against them. He also
>cited several criminal activities in his findings of law.
Yeah - I know who judge Jackson is. But this doesn't answer the question of
where "MS publically admitted to extortion, bribery and blackmail" as you
claimed.
>Remember, Microsoft had overturned a prior Jackson ruling by simply....
Stay on topic Rex.
>To prevent this, Judge Jackson issued ...
Stay on topic Rex. Where to MS publically admit this?
>Microsoft has settled hundreds of cases to ...
Stay on topic Rex. Where to MS publically admit this?
>Microsoft also has all the records sealed, so that ...
Yeah right. The records are all sealed but somehow *you* know the contents
of the sealed records.
>> <quote>
>> They (Microsoft) have publicly admitted, in court, to fraud, extortion,
>> blackmail, sabotage, and obstruction of justice,
>> </quote>
>
>> So I don't give a damn at all what some judge has to say because that's
>> not
>> the issue. The issue is your claim that Microsoft publically admitted
>> this.
>> Where is this public admission? Not what does some judge think or what
>> some blogger said. Where is this public admission from Microsoft that
>> you
>> are claiming?
>
>Microsoft has been under various investigations dating back to 1987,
Stay on topic Rex. Where to MS publically admit this?
>> > Windows NT 4.0 service pack 3 was released as part of a settlement
>>
>> Blah-blah-blah. Nobody cares about NT 4.0 service pack 3.
>
>You get an answer, and you don't care - so then you change the subject
>mid-paragraph.
No Rex - it's you who likes to change the subject. You are the one who
brought up NT 4 SP 3. You are the one who brought up OS2. You are the one
who brought up some Iowa settlement. These have absolutely ZERO to do with
the subject at hand.
The subject at hand is - When and where exactly did "MS publically admit to
extortion, bribery and blackmail." I don't care about some judge or about
some service pack that was released 15 years ago. You claimed that MS
publically admitted to this and you have provided absolutely ZERO proof or
citations of where MS publically made this admission.
>> Where is the
>> public admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything
>> about MS having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
>
>Nice strategic subject.
>
>Tell you what, you get me a copy of the exact wording of the Vista
>EULA as it was included in the initial January 31 release of Vista,
I'll tell you what. Since you're the one who made this BS claim so why don't
*YOU* get a copy of the Vista EULA. Do your own homework.
> and I'll highlight the clauses that give Microsoft the right to access
> your data for any reason and give it ot anybody.
Show me any worthwhile interpretation of this that matches your nonsense.
Clearly there would be exactly 0% usage of Vista in business and government
if this were even the slightest bit true. Because you have your own personal
screw-ball interpretation of an EULA doesn't make it so.
>From:
>http://download.microsoft.com/documents/useterms/Windows%20Vista_Ultimate_English_36d0fe99-75e4-4875-8153-889cf5105718.pdf
><quote>
>Activation associates the use of the software with a specific device.
>During activation, the software will send information about the
>software and the device to Microsoft. This information includes the
>version, language and product key of the software, the Internet
>protocol address of the device, and nformation derived from the
>hardware configuration of the device. For more information, see
>http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?linkid=69497. By using the software,
>you consent to the transmission of this information.
></quote>
So what. It's product activation. (And it's not even required on all
machines such as systems from major OEMs (Dell, Lenovo, etc) since the
product activation key is tied to the machine serial number. No need to
activate - ever.)
> Keep in mind that this information, combined with UUID information,
> can be linked to other information such as your Active Directory
> Kerberos encryption key, your Verisign encryption key, your e-mail
Bullcrap. Quit throwing around words like Active Directory, Kerberos and
Verisign because it has absolutely ZERO to do with product activation and
absolutely ZERO to do with giving MS access to your files. There is
absolutely ZERO reason why product activation would need to access or send
your AD credentials anywhere.
> <quote>
> During a validation check, the software will send information about
> the software and the device
> to Microsoft. This information includes the version and product key of
> the software, and the
> Internet protocol address of the device.
> </quote>
> If this information is provided to a 3rd party, it can be used to identify
> you and monitor your activities.
What information? An IP address and the product activation key? Sending a
product activation key to activate a install of Windows is *NOT* giving MS
permission to access any file for any reason.
(SNIP - Major paranoid nonsense)
You ramble and ramble and try to add 2+2+2+2 together and you come up with
38,432. Your paranoid and ridiculous interpretation of the EULA is nonsense.
Show me *ANY* worthwhile interpretation of the EULA to mean what you claim
it means. Show me *ANYONE* who has read the EULA and who also claims that it
gives MS the right to "access any file on your computer at any time."
You're not a lawyer and your ridiculous claims are simply nonsense.
If what you say is true and accurate then there would be hundreds of not
thousands of credible references to back you up. So where are they?
> If you accept the EULA license, you legally wave your right to privacy
> and grant Microsoft legal permission to monitor ANY information
> available on your computer (including the microphone and web-cam if
> attached).
No. You don't wave your right to privacy and don't grant Microsoft anything.
Quit making up lies. Back up your claim with something credible - not your
paranoid delusions.
>> Yeah Stacker... stack... 1990. Who ares. Where is the public admission by
>> MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS having the
>> right to access any of your data for any reason.
>
>You only want to hear what you want to hear, that you agree with.
No... I want to see evidence of your claim that MS publically admitted to
blackmail, extortion and bribery. I do *not* want to read your nonsense
about Stac or NT3 SP3 or any of the other nonsense that you keep changing
the subject to. Show me the quote - where did MS publically admit to this?
>> > In Caldera vs Microsoft -
>>
>> Nobody is asking about or cares about Caldera. Where is the public
>> admission by MS and where in the Vista EULA does it say anything about MS
>> having the right to access any of your data for any reason.
>
>See above.
See above indeed. Where and when did MS publically admit this? I don't give
a hoot about these topics that you keep trying to switch the discussion to.
You made a claim that something was pubically admitted. Where's the quote,
time and place where this was admitted. Caldera, IBM, Novell, flying
saucers, black helicopters and the Illuminati have zero do to with the
question. You claimed that something was publically admitted - where's the
simple link that shows this alledged admission.
Homer
Illegally shooting antelope.
Throwing chairs and profanities at employees who leave for Google.
Selling towels and soda machines to survive a financial crisis.
Making false accusations.
Bleeding their victims dry in litigation.
Tax evasion.
Harvesting other companies' products, then transforming them into slop
in an inept attempt to "integrate" them with all their other assimilated
warez.
Burning people's houses down, and killing babies, with faulty electrical
components, then blaming the victims for not knowing about the recall
notice, and demanding they pay the legal fees, whilst challenging the
validity of claiming a dead baby represents any kind of "loss".
Scratching Xbox games discs, then denying liability, whilst secretly
acknowledging it.
Sabotaging charities for fun and profit.
Bricking Xboxes with poor ventilation, resulting in a Red Ring of Death,
then denying warranty repairs to the victims.
Shrugging their shoulders as Xbox Live accounts get stolen.
Pretending to be the police by demanding to audit other companies'
books, if they dare to refuse to renew Windows/Office licenses.
Infecting the world with a million+ viruses.
Missing the boat on essential technologies, declaring them to be
insignificant, then running around like headless chickens trying to
catch up after everyone else has adopted those technologies, whilst
claiming that was the plan all along, pretending to have invented that
technology, applying for patents on it, assimilating it, perverting it
into something proprietary and/or encumbered to Microsoft, then denying
everyone else access to that technology.
Dumping products at a loss in order to destroy competition.
Getting letters of support from dead bodies.
Inextricably integrating a Web browser into their OS, in order to try to
win the browser standards war.
Bribing ISO delegates to vote in their favour.
Bribing Nigerian education suppliers to wipe Linux from schoolkids' laptops.
Bribing bloggers with laptops to provide favourable reviews for Vista.
Talking and behaving like drug dealers.
Blackmailing OEMs to exclude competing products.
Running smear campaigns against ISO chairmen who don't support them.
Hiring proxies to attack critics.
Hiring Munchkins to discredit competing products.
Hiring astroturfers to do damage limitations for Microsoft by proxy.
Hiring analysts to lie in Microsoft's favour.
Creating fake grass-roots organisations to support Microsoft's agenda.
Creating shell companies to litigate against their competition by proxy.
Trying to compete with the world's most beautifully designed digital
media player, by producing something which looks and behaves like a
rectangular turd, even to the point of actually being coloured brown
(initially).
Producing a spreadsheet application which can't actually calculate
anything accurately, but which subsequently forms the basis of nearly
every business' office in the world, thus dooming mankind to years of
worthless and untrustworthy accounts.
Hypocritically claiming "IP" infringement, whilst basing their entire
business empire on stolen property.
Breeding an entire generation of toner-monkeys, due to them being taught
"Microsoft" instead of "computing" at school.
Destroying American jobs with cheap, foreign labour, by bribing
politicians to extend the H1-B visa program, then making their
indigenous workforce redundant instead if immigrant workers, at the
first sign of financial trouble.
Using India as a software engineering sweat-shop.
Poisoning Free Software with patent-encumbered garbage, with the eager
help of FOSS traitors.
Did I miss anything?
--
K.
http://slated.org
.----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----
Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
05:49:27 up 93 days, 13:32, 5 users, load average: 0.03, 0.02, 0.04
Robert
> Re: What are Microsoft really good at ?
> From:
> Homer <use...@slated.org> (Slated.org)
> Date:
> Saturday 07 February 2009 12:49:50 am
> Groups:
> comp.os.linux.advocacy
> User-Agent:
> Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-GB; rv:1.8.1.19) Gecko/20090105
> Fedora/2.0.0.19-1.fc8 Thunderbird/2.0.0.19 Mnenhy/0.7.5.666
> Message-ID:
> <u0kv56-...@sky.matrix>
> References: 1
> What are Microsoft really good at?
> K.
> http://slated.org
>
the best summery i have seen yet.
good job Homer
DFS
> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>
Nice rant! It could be used as a reference document to explain what "Linux
advocacy" really means: childish lying and frothing, mindless, anti-MS rage.
With guys like [H]ypocrite promoting Linux/OSS, MS is clearly doomed.
> Did I miss anything?
The last week of your meds...
Ezekiel
"Robert" <di...@bat.com> wrote in message
news:6v4p08F...@mid.individual.net...
Slurp.
Don't forget to wipe your chin.
Homer
> the best summery i have seen yet.
> good job Homer
Thanks.
It's my ambition to consolidate the evidence of the aforementioned
criticisms, from the many disparate sources in which they're currently
found, into a single searchable archive. I then hope to write a book
based on that information (cc-by-sa licensed), some time in the distant
future.
--
K.
http://slated.org
.----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----
Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
18:01:12 up 94 days, 1:44, 4 users, load average: 0.29, 0.18, 0.08
Hadron
<high five>
Roy Schestowitz
Hash: SHA1
____/ Homer on Saturday 07 February 2009 18:01 : \____
> Verily I say unto thee, that Robert spake thusly:
>
>> the best summery i have seen yet.
>> good job Homer
>
> Thanks.
>
> It's my ambition to consolidate the evidence of the aforementioned
> criticisms, from the many disparate sources in which they're currently
> found, into a single searchable archive. I then hope to write a book
> based on that information (cc-by-sa licensed), some time in the distant
> future.
Good luck with that. Tell me if you want lists of references to each point
because such a book needs to be published.
- --
~~ Best of wishes
"I have never known much good done by those who affected to trade for the
public good."
--Adam Smith
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Gregory Shearman
> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
[...]
> Did I miss anything?
I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
and mice.
They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
--
Regards,
Gregory.
Gentoo Linux - Penguin Power
Peter Köhlmann
> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>
> [...]
>
>> Did I miss anything?
>
> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
> and mice.
>
> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>
Inthe pat I also used MS keyboards/mice
Then the quality went down the drain. After the second set starting to act
weirdly just shortly after the warranty expired, I switched to Logitech.
Still working fine, no hassle
So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
--
It's not about, 'Where do you want to go today?' It's more like,
'Where am I allowed to go today?'
Homer
> ____/ Homer on Saturday 07 February 2009 18:01 : \____
>
>> Verily I say unto thee, that Robert spake thusly:
>
>>> the best summery i have seen yet.
>>> good job Homer
>> Thanks.
>
>> It's my ambition to consolidate the evidence of the aforementioned
>> criticisms, from the many disparate sources in which they're
>> currently found, into a single searchable archive. I then hope to
>> write a book based on that information (cc-by-sa licensed), some
>> time in the distant future.
>
> Good luck with that. Tell me if you want lists of references to each
> point because such a book needs to be published.
I'm quite happy to collaborate on such a project.
--
K.
http://slated.org
.----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----
Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
08:24:10 up 95 days, 16:07, 5 users, load average: 4.06, 4.21, 4.23
Homer
> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>
> [...]
>
>> Did I miss anything?
>
> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft
> keyboards and mice.
>
> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
I heard (from Chris, IIRC) that the lettering on the keys wears off
easily, on the newer MS keyboards. But anyway, AFAIAC /all/ membrane
keyboards are crap, regardless of who manufactures them.
Personally, I'd rather have one of these:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Model_M_keyboard
Newer models (design now owned by Unicomp):
http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net
Originals still available:
http://www.clickykeyboards.com
They do a Linux model too:
http://pckeyboards.stores.yahoo.net/linux101.html
Meanwhile, Microsoft apparently do an *anti*-Linux keyboard:
[quote]
Have you gone keyboard shopping lately? Microsoft are a big player in
this space, but have you seen what they've started to do with the INSERT
key?
Either they find INSERT an affront to humanity, or they are trying to
make life hard for the Linux community because they have relegated the
INSERT key on their newest keyboards to an ALT position on the PrtScn /
SysRq key.
For those who don't know why this matters, think about the linux / unix
terminal. Want to copy something? You can't use CTRL-C because that
sends and escape command, so you you use CTRL-INSERT instead.. Well I
don't even know HOW to do that on a new Micrsoft keyboard.
[/quote]
http://linuxscorecard.blogspot.com/2007/11/microsoft-anti-linux-keyboard.html
I also found this comment (on the same page) rather interesting:
[quote]
As an aside, while looking through the latest keyboards from Microsoft I
noticed that they need up to 100MB of free disk space for drivers!!!!
ARE YOU F**KING KIDDING ME? In 1982 I was playing chess on a Dragon 32..
a wopping 32k and Microsoft need 100Mb for a mouse and keyboard driver!
[/quote]
For those who (for some reason) actually prefer membrane keyboards, I
recommend the Tux Keyboard from Zareason:
http://www.zareason.com/shop/product.php?productid=16189&cat=0&page=1
They also have some other interesting GNU/Linux products. ;)
--
K.
http://slated.org
.----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----
Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
09:50:05 up 95 days, 17:32, 5 users, load average: 4.17, 4.21, 4.19
The Lost Packet
yah, I'll stick with my PS/1 clicky keyboard, methink... <g>
But seriously, Microsoft's Mark I Natural is/was an excellent piece of
hardware, I'll certainly give it that. I wouldn't mind getting my hands
on another Mk.I, the last one I had attached itself to someone's duffel
and walked off. The mice, unfortunately, I didn't get much chance to
play with as Microsoft are and always have been anti-Lefty and I can't
use a device moulded for the right hand. On looking though, they also
seemed solid enough to be able to withstand some amount of rough
handling. The ambidextrous opticals though, I didn't like at all - the
cables just weren't flexible enough and tended to quickly break at the
so-called strain point, rendering them useless. I'll stick with Logitech
trackballs since a: they don't move around the desk, b: they're the
right size for my piano player hands, and c: they're comfortable to use.
Still on the subject of ergonomics, the Duke controllers for the classic
XBox are the right size for my hands, so if anyone's got one or two
going spare (I know a lot of people didn't like the Duke as they
considered it far too big) then mayhaps we can arrange something... one
of a few other things Microsoft have actually got right.
--
Disclaimer: No fluffy warm creatures were maimed, dismembered, tortured,
deplumed, discarded, deflowered, dropped, twisted, wrungOut, extended,
respliced, broken, humiliated, irradiated, browbeaten, pickled, deluded,
duped, detained, mishandled, desiccated, bronzed, belittled, coddled,
expelled, deported, imbibed, elected, marginalized, placated,
misrepresented, overworked, underpaid, underappreciated, prepackaged,
overly petted, genetically altered or cloned during the making of this
product, except of course for Bunny and Bear
- IE4 Easter Egg
Hadron
The IBM kbds are great. Just no good for home unless you're in a private
study. They DO make a LOT of noise.
Also, they use patented technology ....
United States Patent # 4,118,611
http://www.clickykeyboards.com/
Personally, I highly recommend Cherry Keyboards:
http://www.cherrycorp.com/english/keyboards/Desktop/Business_Keyboard/index.htm
G83-6104
Roy Schestowitz
Hash: SHA1
____/ Peter Köhlmann on Monday 09 February 2009 08:21 : \____
>
>
> Gregory Shearman wrote:
>
>> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> Did I miss anything?
>>
>> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
>> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
>> and mice.
>>
>> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>>
>
> Inthe pat I also used MS keyboards/mice
>
> Then the quality went down the drain. After the second set starting to act
> weirdly just shortly after the warranty expired, I switched to Logitech.
> Still working fine, no hassle
>
> So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
I may be wrong to suggest this (I haven't checked to verify), but didn't
Microsoft /ACQUIRE/ these products? In turn, their quality degraded, which is
hardly shocking.
- --
~~ Best of wishes
Roy S. Schestowitz | McDonald's does to diet what Microsoft does to PC's
http://Schestowitz.com | GNU is Not UNIX | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
http://iuron.com - proposing a non-profit search engine
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Hadron
> ____/ Peter Köhlmann on Monday 09 February 2009 08:21 : \____
>
>>
>>
>> Gregory Shearman wrote:
>>
>>> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>>>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> Did I miss anything?
>>>
>>> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
>>> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
>>> and mice.
>>>
>>> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>>>
>>
>> Inthe pat I also used MS keyboards/mice
>>
>> Then the quality went down the drain. After the second set starting to act
>> weirdly just shortly after the warranty expired, I switched to Logitech.
>> Still working fine, no hassle
>>
>> So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
>
> I may be wrong to suggest this (I haven't checked to verify), but didn't
> Microsoft /ACQUIRE/ these products? In turn, their quality degraded, which is
> hardly shocking.
You haven't checked to verify?
Wow!
Terry Porter
> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>
> [...]
>
>> Did I miss anything?
>
> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
> and mice.
>
> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>
I don't buy MS hardware any more after my cool ms wireless mouse failed with
a dead usb dongle. A friend had exactly the same problem with his, which
was exactly the same model.
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>
> [...]
>
>> Did I miss anything?
>
> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
> and mice.
>
> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
Let us know how well the keycaps hold up under sustained use. Are the
letters sprayed on, or injection-molded?
I like my Microsoft keyboards, and the Linux kernel supports its features,
but don't appreciate the lettering wearing off.
--
Dijkstra probably hates me.
-- Linus Torvalds, in kernel/sched.c
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> Gregory Shearman wrote:
>
>> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>>
>> [...]
>>
>>> Did I miss anything?
>>
>> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
>> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft keyboards
>> and mice.
>>
>> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>
> Inthe pat I also used MS keyboards/mice
>
> Then the quality went down the drain. After the second set starting to act
> weirdly just shortly after the warranty expired, I switched to Logitech.
> Still working fine, no hassle
>
> So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
Others may think so. At the "Out of Business" sale for the local Circuit
City, the remaining keyboards and mice are mainly Microsoft's.
--
Humor in the Court:
Q: Did you tell your lawyer that your husband had offered you indignities?
A: He didn't offer me nothing; he just said I could have the furniture.
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> Homer wrote:
>
>> I heard (from Chris, IIRC) that the lettering on the keys wears off
>> easily, on the newer MS keyboards.
Yes, on the Microsoft Natural 4000 ergo keyboard. The one at home is still
doing fine, though, but I use that one a lot less.
> so-called strain point, rendering them useless. I'll stick with Logitech
> trackballs since a: they don't move around the desk, b: they're the
> right size for my piano player hands, and c: they're comfortable to use.
I like the Logitech Marble Mouse -- inexpensive, ambidextrous, with two
extra buttons to program.
--
What I want to find out is -- do parrots know much about Astro-Turf?
chrisv
> Homer wrote:
>>
>> Did I miss anything?
I'm certain you did, but it was a good effort. 8)
>the best summery i have seen yet.
>good job Homer
Classic, no doubt. Has "Hadron" rushed to Microshaft's defense yet,
claiming that it's all "lies"?
--
Advocate: You know damned well how microsoft abused their position.
Hadron Quack's response: Actually I do not.
Peter Köhlmann
> After takin' a swig o' grog, Peter Köhlmann belched out
> this bit o' wisdom:
>
>> Gregory Shearman wrote:
>>
>>> On 2009-02-07, Homer <use...@slated.org> wrote:
>>>> What are Microsoft *really* good at?
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>>> Did I miss anything?
>>>
>>> I just bought a new Microsoft wireless keyboard and mouse. It is an
>>> excellent product and what I've come to expect from Microsoft
>>> keyboards and mice.
>>>
>>> They should stick to making keyboards and mice.
>>
>> Inthe pat I also used MS keyboards/mice
>>
>> Then the quality went down the drain. After the second set starting to
>> act weirdly just shortly after the warranty expired, I switched to
>> Logitech. Still working fine, no hassle
>>
>> So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
>
> Others may think so. At the "Out of Business" sale for the local
> Circuit City, the remaining keyboards and mice are mainly Microsoft's.
>
Well, you kind of getting annoyed when pressing keys either results in
nothing happening or having the character repeated multiple times
(happened with 2 MS keyboards here), or pressing the mouse switches does
nothing, since the micro-switches in that thing have thrown in the towel
(happened with 2 MS tilt-wheel mice here).
The old natural keyboard worked fine, and had none of those problems, even
after years of use.
So, it isn't any MS hardware for me anymore. The quality they once had is
no longer there. They can use their shit themselves
--
Micro$oft. What's broken today?
Chris Ahlstrom
this bit o' wisdom:
> Chris Ahlstrom wrote:
>
>>> So, in my experience, MS *used* to do fine hardware. They don't anymore
>>
>> Others may think so. At the "Out of Business" sale for the local
>> Circuit City, the remaining keyboards and mice are mainly Microsoft's.
>
> Well, you kind of getting annoyed when pressing keys either results in
> nothing happening or having the character repeated multiple times
> (happened with 2 MS keyboards here), or pressing the mouse switches does
> nothing, since the micro-switches in that thing have thrown in the towel
> (happened with 2 MS tilt-wheel mice here).
>
> The old natural keyboard worked fine, and had none of those problems, even
> after years of use.
>
> So, it isn't any MS hardware for me anymore. The quality they once had is
> no longer there. They can use their shit themselves
At Microsoft, it's called "Eating your own dog food" <chuckle>.
Personally, I feed my dogs better than that.
--
pos += screamnext[pos] /* does this goof up anywhere? */
-- Larry Wall in util.c from the perl source code
Homer
> Robert wrote:
>> Homer wrote:
>>>
>>> Did I miss anything?
>
> I'm certain you did, but it was a good effort. 8)
>
>> the best summery i have seen yet. good job Homer
>
> Classic, no doubt. Has "Hadron" rushed to Microshaft's defense yet,
> claiming that it's all "lies"?
I look forward to it.
--
K.
http://slated.org
.----
| "Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It
| is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves." ~ William
| Pitt the Younger
`----
Fedora release 8 (Werewolf) on sky, running kernel 2.6.25.11-60.fc8
23:06:17 up 96 days, 6:49, 5 users, load average: 0.11, 0.07, 0.02