Modernising Expect

Cecil Westerhof

unread,

Feb 16, 2018, 3:44:04 AM2/16/18

to

At http://wiki.tcl.tk/201 I read:
The current Expect code was written to pre-7.5 standards, so until
someone steps forward to modernize the code base

I am relative new to Tcl, but already have written a library with 30+
procedures. Would it be manageable for me to update Expect, or do you
need to be a core Tcl programmer with at least ten years under the
belt?

I like a challenge and the best way to learn a language is to program
in it.

--
Cecil Westerhof
Senior Software Engineer
LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/cecilwesterhof

Christian Gollwitzer

unread,

Feb 16, 2018, 4:00:17 AM2/16/18

to

Am 16.02.18 um 09:14 schrieb Cecil Westerhof:

> At http://wiki.tcl.tk/201 I read:
> The current Expect code was written to pre-7.5 standards, so until
> someone steps forward to modernize the code base
>
> I am relative new to Tcl, but already have written a library with 30+
> procedures. Would it be manageable for me to update Expect

Expect is not written in Tcl. It is written in C, and linked to Tcl so
you can use Tcl to control it. In order to hack Expect, you need to be a
C programmer with some basic understanding how the Tcl interpreter works
internally.

I'm also not sure how valid this statement still is - recently, a new
Expect maintainer (Nils Carlsson) has stepped forward and moved the
sources to core.tcl.tk.

Christian

Cecil Westerhof

unread,

Feb 16, 2018, 6:28:06 AM2/16/18

to

Christian Gollwitzer <auri...@gmx.de> writes:

> Am 16.02.18 um 09:14 schrieb Cecil Westerhof:
>> At http://wiki.tcl.tk/201 I read:
>> The current Expect code was written to pre-7.5 standards, so until
>> someone steps forward to modernize the code base
>>
>> I am relative new to Tcl, but already have written a library with 30+
>> procedures. Would it be manageable for me to update Expect
>
> Expect is not written in Tcl. It is written in C, and linked to Tcl so
> you can use Tcl to control it. In order to hack Expect, you need to be a
> C programmer with some basic understanding how the Tcl interpreter works
> internally.

Well, I did program in C a lot. ;-)

> I'm also not sure how valid this statement still is - recently, a new
> Expect maintainer (Nils Carlsson) has stepped forward and moved the
> sources to core.tcl.tk.

I see this as: at the moment my services are not needed.

Kevin Walzer

unread,

Feb 16, 2018, 9:27:40 PM2/16/18

to

On 2/16/18 6:18 AM, Cecil Westerhof wrote:
> I see this as: at the moment my services are not needed.

Why not contact the new maintainer and offer your services? I'm sure
that Expect would benefit from having more than one developer working on
it.

--Kevin

--
Kevin Walzer
Code by Kevin/Mobile Code by Kevin
http://www.codebykevin.com
http://www.wtmobilesoftware.com

Ashok

unread,

Feb 17, 2018, 12:10:09 AM2/17/18

to

Cecil,

Unless your interest is specifically in Expect, there are many useful
extensions, both C and script, where the author no longer has the time
or motivation that could benefit from someone taking over or helping
out. If you're interested, I could come up with a list and I'm sure
others could add to it as well.

/Ashok

Cecil Westerhof

unread,

Feb 17, 2018, 4:14:06 AM2/17/18

to

Ashok <pal...@yahoo.com> writes:

> Unless your interest is specifically in Expect, there are many
> useful

No, I just saw this sentence and thought: this is a good way to give
back and learn Tcl.

> extensions, both C and script, where the author no longer has the time
> or motivation that could benefit from someone taking over or helping
> out. If you're interested, I could come up with a list and I'm sure
> others could add to it as well.

I am certainly interested. Again: the combination of doing something
useful a lot of people could profit from and learning Tcl is a nice
combination. I am primarily interested in Tcl, but if I have also to
touch some C code, I can live with that.

> On 2/16/2018 4:48 PM, Cecil Westerhof wrote:
>> Christian Gollwitzer <auri...@gmx.de> writes:
>>
>>> Am 16.02.18 um 09:14 schrieb Cecil Westerhof:
>>>> At http://wiki.tcl.tk/201 I read:
>>>> The current Expect code was written to pre-7.5 standards, so until
>>>> someone steps forward to modernize the code base
>>>>
>>>> I am relative new to Tcl, but already have written a library with 30+
>>>> procedures. Would it be manageable for me to update Expect
>>>
>>> Expect is not written in Tcl. It is written in C, and linked to Tcl so
>>> you can use Tcl to control it. In order to hack Expect, you need to be a
>>> C programmer with some basic understanding how the Tcl interpreter works
>>> internally.
>>
>> Well, I did program in C a lot. ;-)
>>
>>
>>> I'm also not sure how valid this statement still is - recently, a new
>>> Expect maintainer (Nils Carlsson) has stepped forward and moved the
>>> sources to core.tcl.tk.
>>
>> I see this as: at the moment my services are not needed.
>>
>

Ricardo kozmate.net

unread,

Feb 17, 2018, 2:09:53 PM2/17/18

to

Em 17/02/18 05:10, Ashok escreveu:

> there are many useful extensions, both C and script, where the author no
> longer has the time or motivation that could benefit from someone taking
> over or helping out. If you're interested, I could come up with a list
> and I'm sure others could add to it as well.
>
> /Ashok

And others other than Cecil Westerhof might find some place to help
with. Not very likely to be me but someone. Though I might try something
math related for tcllib some day, could be next week or next decade or
never... I understand Cecil's feeeling helping while learning is s good
thing, and I am back studying math, so... maybe.

That is, it would be good to have such list visible and updatable
(wiki.tcl.tk? github? ...?)

--
{ricardo from kozmate.net}

Cecil Westerhof

unread,

Feb 17, 2018, 3:14:05 PM2/17/18

to

If the lists are shared here, I will create a page for them. Because I
agree: there are probably more people who would like to help.

It would be good to have some extra information:
- How difficult is it?
- What type of work is it? (GUI, logic, mathematical, …)
- Which language(s)?
- What knowledge do you need to be able to do it?
- Is there someone to mentor you when you get stuck? (If yes: who?)
- Why is it important?
- What does it influence and by what is it influenced?
- …

Christian Gollwitzer

unread,

Feb 18, 2018, 4:08:05 AM2/18/18

to

Hi Cecil & Ricardo,

Am 17.02.18 um 21:11 schrieb Cecil Westerhof:

> "Ricardo kozmate.net" <ric...@kozmate.net> writes:
>
>> Em 17/02/18 05:10, Ashok escreveu:

>>> If you're interested, I could come up with
>>> a list and I'm sure others could add to it as well.
>>>
>>

>> That is, it would be good to have such list visible and updatable
>> (wiki.tcl.tk? github? ...?)
>
> If the lists are shared here, I will create a page for them. Because I
> agree: there are probably more people who would like to help.
>
> It would be good to have some extra information:
> - How difficult is it?
> - What type of work is it? (GUI, logic, mathematical, …)
> - Which language(s)?
> - What knowledge do you need to be able to do it?
> - Is there someone to mentor you when you get stuck? (If yes: who?)
> - Why is it important?
> - What does it influence and by what is it influenced?
> - …

In previous years, Tcl took part of Google Summer Of Code. Many smallish
projects were proposed, and only very few realized; the list is here:

https://wiki.tcl.tk/36464

Unfortunately, most of them require programming in C, so they are more
useful if you want to learn the innards of Tcl, rather than learning Tcl
itself.

Christian

Cecil Westerhof

unread,

Feb 18, 2018, 7:59:06 AM2/18/18

to

That is a lot: I have to dig into that.