Newsgroups: comp.lang.scheme
From: Benjamin L. Russell <DekuDekup...@Yahoo.com>
Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 15:45:33 +0900
Local: Thurs, Feb 26 2009 1:45 am
Subject: Re: History of Scheme People
On Wed, 25 Feb 2009 07:05:41 -0800 (PST), Grant Rettke
<gret...@gmail.com> wrote: Looking at the graph, it is remarkable how there is a sudden break in >On Feb 24, 8:39?pm, j85wilson <j85wil...@fastmail.fm> wrote: >> A thought occurred to me while reading the r6rs-discuss list. ?I know >> some (although surely not enough) of the history of Scheme itself, but >> almost none of the history of the people who have created, shaped, and >> used Scheme. >I wondered that myself. I started here: >http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/article/1927/a-scheme-timeline continuity between most of the members of the list of authors for R2RS - R5RS, and those for R6RS. Specifically, the following authors were in common between R2RS - R5RS, but suddenly disappeared in R6RS: Chris Hanson Instead, we suddenly see the appearance of the following authors for Anton Van Straaten In fact, the only person common in the lists between R3RS - R5RS (What follows is a rather long and possibly controversial discussion <monologue> Well, I know of both Matthew Flatt and Robert Bruce Findler from PLT > Functional programming and object-oriented programming differ with respect to I.e., Flatt and Findler believe that teaching functional programming >the syntax and semantics of the underlying languages. The core of a functional lan- >guage is small. All a beginning programmer needs are function definition, function >application, variables, constants, a conditional form, and possibly a construct for >defining algebraic types. In contrast, using an object-oriented language for the same >purposes requires classes, fields, methods, inheritance in addition to everything that >a functional language needs.... > Using a functional language followed by object-oriented language is thus the >natural choice. The functional language allows students to gain confidence with >program design principles. They learn to think about values and operations on >values. They can easily comprehend how the functions and operations work with >values. Better still, they can use the same rules to figure out why a program pro- >duces the wrong values, which it often will. Teaching an object-oriented language >in the second course is then a small shift of focus.... should be followed by teaching object-oriented programming. This concept, however, is not shared by all educators. In particular, Paul Hudak, one of the designers of the Haskell programming language, writes on the Haskell-Cafe mailing list as follows on a related issue (see "[Haskell-cafe] a regressive view of support for imperative programming in Haskell" at http://www.haskell.org/pipermail/haskell-cafe/2007-August/030178.html): >All of the recent talk of support for imperative programming in Haskell While Hudak contrasts imperative vs. functional, as opposed to >makes me really nervous. To be honest, I've always been a bit >uncomfortable even with monad syntax. Instead of: >do x <- cmd1 >I was always perfectly happy with: >cmd1 >>= \x-> >Functions are in my comfort zone; syntax that hides them takes me out of >In my opinion one of the key principles in the design of Haskell has >Well, you could argue, monad syntax is what really made Haskell become object-oriented vs. functional, the basic issue is the same: Should functional programming be treated as a separate paradigm by itself (as "the Functional Way" vs. "the Imperative Way" (or maybe even "the Object-oriented Way")), or should it be combined with a different paradigm (be it imperative or object-oriented, the issue is the same). Or even (according to some educators), should there even be an issue of "paradigm" at all? This is an issue of basic teaching philosophy. As an example of the >Besides the simplistic In the referenced page, Krishnamurthi writes as follows: >reasoning, I am opposed to the whole idea of programming languages (or >even much of programming) being organized around "paradigms". Here is >a short and intentionally somewhat provocative article that I recently >wrote about this: >http://www.cs.brown.edu/~sk/Publications/Papers/Published/sk-teach-pl... >Programming language ``paradigms'' are a moribund and tedious legacy of a In the referenced paper (see "Teaching Programming Languages in a >bygone age. Modern language designers pay them no respect, so why do our courses >slavishly adhere to them? This paper argues that we should abandon this method of >teaching languages, offers an alternative, reconciles an important split in programming >language education, and describes a textbook that explores these matters. Post-Linnaean Age" at http://www.cs.brown.edu/~sk/Publications/Papers/Published/sk-teach-pl...), Krishnamurthi writes (see p. 1, third paragraph): >Most books Ultimately, it seems that this issue boils down to a matter of taste. >rigorously adhere to the sacred division of languages into “functional”, “imperative”, “object-oriented”, >and “logic” camps. I conjecture that this desire for taxonomy is an artifact of our science-envy from the >early days of our discipline: a misguided attempt to follow the practice of science rather than its spirit. >We are, however, a science of the artificial. What else to make of a language like Python, Ruby, or Perl? >Their designers have no patience for the niceties of these Linnaean hierarchies; they borrow features as they >wish, creating melanges that utterly defy characterization. This is usually not a problem, so long as this taste is confined to a The members of the board had to vote for all the changes taken Some of the main points of this division seem to be the following the module system (see votes by Chris Hanson SYNTAX-CASE (see the vote by Chris Hanson above) defining too many features as part of the language, rather than on top lack of time to change the draft to meet the deadline of the too long description of the specification (thrice the previous one); Even some of the "yes" votes list "imperfections" that "troubled" apparent inflexibility of the library system, and absence of a In sum, it seems that R6RS was at least partly motivated by a Another problem was lack of time. R6RS seems rather rushed compared -- Benjamin L. Russell You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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