What's the best IDE?
Hak...@gmail.com
Py2.5, tooka long hiatus, and came back. So now I'm without my god sent
helper, and I'm looking for a cool replacement, or some advocation to
reinstall/setup PyWin. But the Python website's list is irrefutably
long. It would take a month or two to test all of those products. So
I'm looking for experienced advocates.
What's your favorite IDE?
What do you like about it?
It would be fine for a begginer, right?
Steven Bethard
I don't really have a good answer here, but maybe a data point. I got
tired of waiting for ActiveState to put out a Python 2.5 and installed
the one from python.org instead, which doesn't include PythonWin. I
figured that I should take the opportunity to try out Komodo, which I'd
heard was pretty good. I downloaded the alpha and used it for about
half a month. Komodo's interface is pretty good, and when you're
writing code in a module, the auto-completion is great, but there's no
auto-completion at the interactive prompt. I use the interactive prompt
heavily, so that was pretty much the end of it for me. I downloaded the
pywin32 module and got my PythonWin back. =)
STeVe
Bruno Desthuilliers
> Recently I've had some problems with PythonWin when I switched to
> Py2.5, tooka long hiatus, and came back. So now I'm without my god sent
> helper, and I'm looking for a cool replacement, or some advocation to
> reinstall/setup PyWin. But the Python website's list is irrefutably
> long. It would take a month or two to test all of those products. So
> I'm looking for experienced advocates.
>
> What's your favorite IDE?
> What do you like about it?
1. It's so complicated and ugly that just using it is enough to makes
you look like a seasonned pro.
2. It gives me a reason to engage in holy wars with vim users.
> It would be fine for a begginer, right?
Certainly not.
But you may want to look for other advices:
http://groups.google.com/groups?as_q=best+IDE&as_ugroup=comp.lang.python
mkPyVS
and analysis on a daily basis and the IDE I use and recommend is Komodo
from ActiveState. Our worldwide development group (30) has recently all
purchased the professional version as it integrates with several
version control systems, has a built-in python debugger, a
mutli-language/package GUI builder, and in-line code
lookup/auto-complete functionality. There are a few nice-to-haves which
aren't available such as: C (++, # or otherwise) auto-complete and
alternate py-documentation viewer but the pros far outweighed the cons
for our development team.
http://www.activestate.com/Products/Komodo/?tn=1
Hak...@gmail.com
> tired of waiting for ActiveState to put out a Python 2.5 and installed
> the one from python.org instead, which doesn't include PythonWin. I
> figured that I should take the opportunity to try out Komodo, which I'd
> heard was pretty good. I downloaded the alpha and used it for about
> half a month. Komodo's interface is pretty good, and when you're
> writing code in a module, the auto-completion is great, but there's no
> auto-completion at the interactive prompt. I use the interactive prompt
> heavily, so that was pretty much the end of it for me. I downloaded the
> pywin32 module and got my PythonWin back. =)
>
> STeVe
Komodo sounds alright. I don't use the interactive promt much anyway, I
usually just copy and past stuff from my real code to see if it works.
Any more advocates?
I forgot to mention that auto-completion is my favorite little helper.
Any IDEs of astronomical proportions in relation to ease of use to
auto-completion?
Also:
Links to what you suggest?
Hak...@gmail.com
but I get it's pretty silly of me that I didn't utilize this.
And while I was posting another mark for Komodo came. Nice, is it.
Neil Cerutti
> Hak...@gmail.com a écrit :
>> Recently I've had some problems with PythonWin when I switched to
>> Py2.5, tooka long hiatus, and came back. So now I'm without my god sent
>> helper, and I'm looking for a cool replacement, or some advocation to
>> reinstall/setup PyWin. But the Python website's list is irrefutably
>> long. It would take a month or two to test all of those products. So
>> I'm looking for experienced advocates.
> >
>> What's your favorite IDE?
> emacs
>
>> What do you like about it?
> 1. It's so complicated and ugly that just using it is enough to makes
> you look like a seasonned pro.
> 2. It gives me a reason to engage in holy wars with vim users.
It seems like the holy wars are pretty. We disciples of Vim and
Emacs are now content merely being holier than all he others.
Actually, I'm not sure there's been a good Emacs VS Vim holy war
in years. So... ya know what's I find to be shamefully hatefully
orthodox? Believing in the 'meta' key, when it's clearly just
Alt. Those same people often hold to the heresy that 'to fill'
means 'to wrap'. They believe that modes exist for different
'languages', and moreover, that there's more than just the
trinity of INSERT, EDIT and COMMAND-LINE.
--
Neil Cerutti
Neil Cerutti
> It seems like the holy wars are pretty. We disciples of Vim and
> Emacs are now content merely being holier than all he others.
>
> Actually, I'm not sure there's been a good Emacs VS Vim holy war
> in years. So... ya know what's I find to be shamefully
> hatefully orthodox? Believing in the 'meta' key, when it's
> clearly just Alt. Those same people often hold to the heresy
> that 'to fill' means 'to wrap'. They believe that modes exist
> for different 'languages', and moreover, that there's more than
> just the trinity of INSERT, EDIT and COMMAND-LINE.
The above post brought to you by the "Bureau of Dumb Jokes Made
Incomprehensible by Horrible Editing Department".
--
Neil Cerutti
Hak...@gmail.com
are a college fund, and I can't start diping into that until I'm going
to college. Any free AND good IDEs?
limodou
the author of it, you can find the link from my signature. It's cross
platform, and many features. It has not embed debuger in it now, so
you can use winpdb to debug your program. It support auco-complete in
editing and also provide a shell window also support auto-complete.
And the auco-complete in editing is more powerful.
Other good wxPython IDE should be SPE, drPython, PyPE, etc.
--
I like python!
UliPad <<The Python Editor>>: http://wiki.woodpecker.org.cn/moin/UliPad
My Blog: http://www.donews.net/limodou
Gabriel Genellina
There is a list at http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonEditors
Or use Google Groups to search this group for "best IDE" - once a
month someone comes and ask that same question again and again so
you'll find plenty of responses...
--
Gabriel Genellina
Softlab SRL
__________________________________________________
Correo Yahoo!
Espacio para todos tus mensajes, antivirus y antispam Ągratis!
ĄAbrí tu cuenta ya! - http://correo.yahoo.com.ar
Duncan Smith
Ben Finney
Please consider trying Python with a powerful editor, instead of a
just-for-Python environment. Knowing a powerful editor is a far better
investment than a complex tool for a single purpose.
--
\ "I hope if dogs ever take over the world, and they chose a |
`\ king, they don't just go by size, because I bet there are some |
_o__) Chihuahuas with some good ideas." -- Jack Handey |
Ben Finney
demia...@gmail.com
> What do you like about it?
If you are a very good typist you can rock with Vim. Vi and variants
are on _every_ Unix system. It's highly configurable, syntax
highlighting, supports scripting with Python.
> It would be fine for a begginer, right?
Not really, you'll be frustrated for about a week, you'll be productive
after that, from then on you'll keep on learning new things all the
time.
tom arnall
> "Hak...@gmail.com" <Hak...@gmail.com> writes:
>
>> After researching Komodo, I found it's not free. The only funds I
>> have are a college fund, and I can't start diping into that until
>> I'm going to college. Any free AND good IDEs?
>
> Please consider trying Python with a powerful editor, instead of a
> just-for-Python environment. Knowing a powerful editor is a far better
> investment than a complex tool for a single purpose.
Amen.
As an alternative to the IDE straight-jacket you might consider going the
unit-testing/'live code' route, which obviates the need for a debugger and
other clutter found in all of the IDEs i've seen. Also, you might think
about writing your own unit-tester. It's not difficult in python and will
give you a setup tailored to your own tastes. But whatever you do, keep
things simple and light.
--
tom arnall
north spit, ca
usa
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
Hak...@gmail.com
struggling to understand a text adventure, and because I wanted to try
it my own at it (before using a tutorial), this has revieled I no
nothing about parsing or classes. Both are required to make an IDE I
believe.
As for UliPad . . . AWSOME! I love it, more than WinPy even . . . and I
can't get WinPy to work at the moment, but I think I just need to
reinstall Python2.5. Although customizing your syntax highlighting is a
little difficult. I think it's really cool, and is so far at the top of
my list, as I have yet to try Vim - maybe I'll try tomarrow.
Ben Finney
> this has revieled I no nothing about parsing or classes. Both are
> required to make an IDE I believe.
Are you trying to make an IDE, or choose an existing one?
--
\ "This sentence contradicts itself -- no actually it doesn't." |
`\ -- Douglas Hofstadter |
_o__) |
Ben Finney
Hak...@gmail.com
scratch to add more clarity.
BartlebyScrivener
>> you'll be frustrated for about a week,
You'll be frustrated for at least two weeks. But you'll use it forever
for everything from writing to programming, so who cares?
Auto completion is called omni completion in VIM
type ':h new-omni-completion' at the command line after two weeks of
frustration.
rd
Kenneth McDonald
for me.
Ken
Éric Daigneault
Eclipse with pydev and extentions, and subclipse for subversion
/
What do you like about it?
/When I started Python I tried a whole bunch of IDEs, Komodo, Idle, active state but got tired by having to learn to navigate through a new environment, so I settled for PyDev and Eclipse./
/Cause I know it well (used it for java since it`s beta pre release baby versions) and can use the same environment for my C++ (CDT), Java, python (Now that for me is a major +)... I oftenly use python as a glue for different small apps and I do like the idea of staying in the same environment for all of them, feels like good'ol slippers. Plus since I use SCons for building most my C++ apps it's just dandy.
This being said it is not great, the completion sometimes works in mysterious ways, The pydev Extentions nag screen can be annoying (note to self : gotta buy the thing...), some of the automations can be weirdly unproductive and there are probably better python dedicated environment out there but I like it, it suits my needs. However for small hit and run in the code there is nothing like (ViM, Idle, notepad, JPad <Enter a text editor name here...>) as it is very oftenly over with before the splash screen of <Whatever big IDE> ever left the screen.
/It would be fine for a begginer, right?
/If you know Eclipse already then it is a good bet, If not but want an IDE that can be a good swiss army knife *AND* have time to space to learn the environment then it is an excellent choice.
But sincerely, I learned python with Idle and the interactive shell, I did not feel I coule really appreciate what An IDE had to offer me before I really knew what the language could do for me, how it did it and why I would do it with it.
Enough to have to learn a language to be bothered to learn an environment, I mean unless you actually like the exilierating feeling of being a newbie all across the board ;-).
However with Python after you have read the quick card (http://www.limsi.fr/Individu/pointal/python/pqrc/) and poke it with the interactive shell for a couple of hours you'll be (almost) as expert as all the regulars here :-P...
Éric :D.
Colin J. Williams
> I'm not going to call it the 'best' ide as thats just silly.
>
> But if your developing on Windows pyscripter
> http://mmm-experts.com/Products.aspx?ProductId=4 is a great IDE.
>
> -Josh
>
+1
Colin W.
Colin J. Williams
Colin W.
John Salerno
> as I have yet to try Vim - maybe I'll try tomarrow.
Warning: Vim isn't something you just "try tomorrow" :)
Neil Cerutti
You can become proficient enough for basic editing in about 20
minutes with the built-in tutorial.
Getting it to work seemlessly with Python code will take
considerably longer.
--
Neil Cerutti
Michael B. Trausch
>
> With the most recent edition of PyDev, I find Eclipse works quite well
> for me.
>
Since you mentioned it, I have a question that searching around and
poking around has not solved for me, yet.
Do you have auto-completion working with your setup? It does not seem
to work at all for me. I have read through the configuration help, and
there are no firewalls on my system at all, and everything else works
save for auto-completion, which I have had to disable. If left enabled,
even with low timeouts, I have to kill Eclipse and start it again. :-/
Other than that, I find that it is absolutely wonderful. I have used
Eclipse in the past for PHP based projects, and intend on using it for
Java projects in the future (my school has Java classes in its
curriculum instead of C classes... joy).
-- Mike
olive
Michael B. Trausch a écrit :
> Kenneth McDonald wrote:
> >
> > With the most recent edition of PyDev, I find Eclipse works quite well
> > for me.
> >
>
> Since you mentioned it, I have a question that searching around and
> poking around has not solved for me, yet.
>
> Do you have auto-completion working with your setup? It does not seem
> to work at all for me.
Did you try to set your PYTHONPATH properly with the same content in
both central AND project preferences ?
John Salerno
Yeah, it was all the customizing that I could never figure out.
Michael B. Trausch
>
> Did you try to set your PYTHONPATH properly with the same content in
> both central AND project preferences ?
>
Yep. Still does it. And the kicker is, that it does it with things
that it shouldn't have to wonder terribly much about -- classes that I
have custom-built, where it can easily find the available methods and
the like. *shrugs*
-- Mike
Stephen Eilert
As others said, you'll learn new stuff every day. I never knew about
this omni-completion thing until today, and I'm using VIM almost every
day.
Go figure.
Once you generate a tags file, navigation becomes easy. I never managed
to invoke Python inside VIM as a "compiler" tho. The fact that you can
create scripts for VIM in Python is also a plus.
Stephen
Harry George
> Yeah, it was all the customizing that I could never figure out.
years ago this worked for people I was supporting:
set softtabstop=4 shiftwidth=4 expandtab
Personally, I'm an emacs guy, so I wouldn't know.
--
Harry George
PLM Engineering Architecture
Ben Finney
> John Salerno <john...@NOSPAMgmail.com> writes:
> > Yeah, it was all the customizing that I could never figure out.
>
> years ago this worked for people I was supporting:
> set softtabstop=4 shiftwidth=4 expandtab
That's all I've ever needed vim to do with my Python code (apart from
the syntax highlighting, which works by default when I've tried it).
> Personally, I'm an emacs guy, so I wouldn't know.
Should I start another thread about python-mode and how annoying it is?
--
\ "If you get invited to your first orgy, don't just show up |
`\ nude. That's a common mistake. You have to let nudity |
_o__) 'happen.'" -- Jack Handey |
Ben Finney
Hak...@gmail.com
Vim, but it's not like I can spend a week learning it anyway, I don't
have that much time AND time to actualy program. And thanks all to have
posted suggestions and comments thus far.
Hak...@gmail.com
same night. I'll see if I can make it work, use it forever . . . I'll
do it.
olive
Michael B. Trausch wrote:
> Yep. Still does it.
I'm running PyDev 1.2.4 without completion problem so far.
Are you up to date ?
Maybe you should install the latest from scratch.
Michael B. Trausch
Yep, I am up to date. As I said, I am totally confused.
-- Mike
Éric Daigneault
I run the latest pydev on both windows and linux... The setup is excatcly the same (on the eclipse, path setup and all)
My windows setup is much better at auto-complete that the linux setup... In linux, other than with self, I seldom get auto complete on other classes. In windows it sometimes can figure out to what class belong the instance and propose appropriate choices...
Caus of my present workload I gave up trying to make it work...
E :D.
Adam Jones
Hak...@gmail.com wrote:
> Recently I've had some problems with PythonWin when I switched to
> Py2.5, tooka long hiatus, and came back. So now I'm without my god sent
> helper, and I'm looking for a cool replacement, or some advocation to
> reinstall/setup PyWin. But the Python website's list is irrefutably
> long. It would take a month or two to test all of those products. So
> I'm looking for experienced advocates.
>
> What's your favorite IDE?
emacs
> What do you like about it?
It does just about everything. It can edit just about every kind of
code I use, read my mail, connection to irc ... everything. Well,
except order pizza, but I think it might be possible to make that
happen as well.
> It would be fine for a begginer, right?
Probably not. I think you have to spend enough time with environments
that don't let you integrate everything into the editor before you can
really understand why people love emacs (and vi) so much.
-Adam
Tim Chase
>
> emacs
>
>> What do you like about it?
>
> It does just about everything. It can edit just about every kind of
> code I use, read my mail, connection to irc ... everything. Well,
> except order pizza, but I think it might be possible to make that
> happen as well.
Well, if it doesn't have it built in, you can always shell out to
use this program:
http://www.beigerecords.com/cory/pizza_party/
:)
-tkc
Ramon Diaz-Uriarte
>
> emacs
>
(...)
> > It would be fine for a begginer, right?
>
> Probably not. I think you have to spend enough time with environments
Actually, I've read similar things before and I don't quite get it. I
guess all of us are Emacs begginers the first time we try emacs.
Actually, I started using Emacs about 1 month after installing Linux;
what hooked me was the possibility of editing code AND submit it to an
inferior process, just like that (this I experienced first with R, but
of course you can do the same with Python) and using the same
environment for all of my editing and programming tasks.
R.
--
Ramon Diaz-Uriarte
Statistical Computing Team
Structural Biology and Biocomputing Programme
Spanish National Cancer Centre (CNIO)
http://ligarto.org/rdiaz
Theerasak Photha
> Actually, I've read similar things before and I don't quite get it. I
> guess all of us are Emacs begginers the first time we try emacs.
> Actually, I started using Emacs about 1 month after installing Linux;
> what hooked me was the possibility of editing code AND submit it to an
> inferior process, just like that (this I experienced first with R, but
> of course you can do the same with Python) and using the same
> environment for all of my editing and programming tasks.
I've used Emacs for a long time, but I think I might be going back to
Vim 7.0 now that they improved the scripting functionality with *real*
arrays and dicts. In some respects, this is now better than in Emacs,
where the hash functionality is...well...cumbersome at best.
Main reason would be that Vim is so much easier to customize and find
things in than Emacs. I long time ago, I actually submitted a bug
report for the perl plugin I hate to appeal to popularity, but Vim's
greater popularity also contributes to higher quality in a number of
cases: consider Ruby support for instance. Light years ahead of what
Emacs has.
vimshell is a (nearly) full-blown terminal emulator facility for Vim
http://www.wana.at/vimshell/
In any case, chok dee khrab (good luck with it).
-- Theerasak
Ramon Diaz-Uriarte
>
> I've used Emacs for a long time, but I think I might be going back to
> Vim 7.0 now that they improved the scripting functionality with *real*
> arrays and dicts. In some respects, this is now better than in Emacs,
> where the hash functionality is...well...cumbersome at best.
>
> Main reason would be that Vim is so much easier to customize and find
> things in than Emacs. I long time ago, I actually submitted a bug
Yes, I've read that, and I see that point. And that you can do
customization using Python. I've actually been tempted by Vim since I
read this
http://pinard.progiciels-bpi.ca/opinions/editors.html
(and Pinard is someone I do respect, and this is a very well argued document).
> (...)
> vimshell is a (nearly) full-blown terminal emulator facility for Vim
> http://www.wana.at/vimshell/
Thanks for this link! It looks really interesting. I'll try to give it
a try ASAP.
One question, though: can you "send" a block of code to a Python shell
running in vimshell? (somehow like you can do in Emacs)?
sjde...@yahoo.com
> I've used Emacs for a long time, but I think I might be going back to
> Vim 7.0 now that they improved the scripting functionality with *real*
> arrays and dicts.
I've been writing all my extensions in python rather than vimscript for
several releases (occasionally it requires some elbow grease, e.g. I
submitted the fixes to let the python interface call functions
returning vim lists/dicts).
> I hate to appeal to popularity, but Vim's
> greater popularity also contributes to higher quality in a number of
> cases
I'd guess emacs is at least a base-10 order of magnitude more popular
than vim for real development (excluding simple "it's already
installed" basic sysadmin stuff); emacs passed vi c. 1990 and hasn't
looked back.
I say that as a hardcore vim user--getting used to modality really
isn't for everyone, though once you do the payoff is high.
Ramon Diaz-Uriarte
> Harry George <harry.g...@boeing.com> writes:
>
> > John Salerno <john...@NOSPAMgmail.com> writes:
> >
> > years ago this worked for people I was supporting:
> > set softtabstop=4 shiftwidth=4 expandtab
>
> the syntax highlighting, which works by default when I've tried it).
>
>
>
Ben, as an Emacs guy tempted by Vim I'd definitely like to know what
you find annoying about python-mode, and how Vim does not annoy you
here. If this answer might risk leading the thread somewhere we don't
want, I'd anyway by very interested in a private email.
Best,
R.
> --
> \ "If you get invited to your first orgy, don't just show up |
> `\ nude. That's a common mistake. You have to let nudity |
> _o__) 'happen.'" -- Jack Handey |
> Ben Finney
>
> --
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-list
ben.ha...@gmail.com
Linux
-------------------------------
BOA constructor
Eric (the best for python I think it has cool subversion support better
than emacs for non f4cmd67-b jockies emacs sucks anyway you look at it
and lisp is a terrible terrible bad joke unless you are gondi)
oh and some other tool for python glade/gtk widgetmaroo
Mac
------------------------------
Xcode of course
TextMate
Windows
----------------------------
who cares
Personally Eric3 wins for general purpose python code look it up why
did no one mention the best one?
done
Michael B. Trausch
>
> I run the latest pydev on both windows and linux... The setup is
> excatcly the same (on the eclipse, path setup and all)
> My windows setup is much better at auto-complete that the linux
> setup... In linux, other than with self, I seldom get auto complete on
> other classes. In windows it sometimes can figure out to what class
> belong the instance and propose appropriate choices...
>
> Caus of my present workload I gave up trying to make it work...
> E :D.
>
Yeah, I have given up, too. I don't really need it, though it would
have been nice to have because I do not (yet) have a second monitor to
attach to my workstation for information-browsing... :-P
-- Mike