anyone here ever program a complex database in lisp only?

[der_gavio_fhurer]

wondering

it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

[der_gavio_fhurer]

cl-prevayler would seem to obsolete oracle immediatly.

Then the question would be simply howto interface cl-prevayler with the internet.

All searches at 100s of thousands a second, and transactions at 100,000 /s on desktop hardware.

www.prevayler.org

power dies? read back the commit log.

acid compliant

Why aren't there 1000s of startups exploiting this?

Maybe I should make one myself.

[Bigos]

Yes, definitely you should make it yourself. It will make you start
asking sensible questions on this list.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

There is 0 evidence than I ask anything non sensile. Maybe if you worried more about large website performance my questions would start to sound genius.

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> Why aren't there 1000s of startups exploiting this?
>
> Maybe I should make one myself.

Why startups? You should bring this up with your manager at work and see
how much your company can save on Oracle licensing.

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

People at work are already using oracle and fearful of change.

Thats why startup seems the only way.

Why aren't more lispers already doing it?

Zach are you making over 100? or some kid in school living in moms basement?

[der_gavio_fhurer]

hey zach just to be clear if you were kinda pasive aggresivly insulting like this to me in person at say a lisp conference I'd be punching you in head and booting you tummy with u on ground by now :)

Especially since I never did shit to you.

Just saying...

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> People at work are already using oracle and fearful of change.

Can't you persuade them with a great application you write in Lisp?

Zach

[Zach Beane]

You sound like a real serious character! I bet that has a great effect
on the respect your technical decisions get at work.

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

> Can't you persuade them with a great application you write in Lisp?

no, the managment is scared to go with something new and the loans the company gets might involve going with oracle

[der_gavio_fhurer]

Well I do run a lot yes. I mean I am a top unix guy with 15 years. Are you indeed in school and living at moms in the basement? thinking evil america and capitalism are the devil? lol

get a job son!!

real world will cure your wise ass quickly

[der_gavio_fhurer]

remember england lost world war 1 and 2

and all be speaking german if not for USA

:)

hek germany romped on england even while stomping most of the eastern hemisphere lol

if they had given england thier full attention hek fish and chips might be a thing of the past

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> cl-prevayler would seem to obsolete oracle immediatly.

You wrote about prevayler before:

http://technoninja.blogspot.com/2012/01/wwwprevaylerorg-oracle-database-is.html (2012)

http://technoninja.blogspot.com/2011/03/62531-pm-gavin0himself.html (2011)

http://technoninja.blogspot.com/2010/08/sssh-prevayler-for-python.html (2010)

http://bootiack.livejournal.com/343588.html (2009)

http://bootiack.livejournal.com/268332.html (2008)

http://bootiack.livejournal.com/2728.html (2007)

Any good feedback on those articles from your coworkers or other
technical peers? Any luck in the past six years getting to use
prevayler? Where are you blogging about prevayler these days (2013)?

Zach

[Norbert_Paul]

Hi Zach,

have you given up yopur work in favor of troll-keeping?
You are doing a good Job in feeding him.

Norbert

[Luís Oliveira]

Norbert_Paul <norbertpau...@yahoo.com> writes:

> have you given up yopur work in favor of troll-keeping?

Zach is really good at meta-trolling. Just sit back and enjoy. :-)

--
Lu�s Oliveira
http://kerno.org/~luis

[Madhu]

* Luís Oliveira <y53hagu...@siscog.pt> :
Wrote on Wed, 19 Jun 2013 10:26:05 +0100:

| Norbert_Paul <norbertpau...@yahoo.com> writes:
|
|> have you given up yopur work in favor of troll-keeping?
|
| Zach is really good at meta-trolling. Just sit back and enjoy. :-)

When your business is spam/bandwidth/internet/industry the familiar
maxim "There is no such thing as bad publicity" applies.

Both Zach and Gavino serve the same masters. --- Madhu

[der_gavio_fhurer]

alas no but I did work for the company that served all the ads on myspace when it has 25 people

they used a preayler like setup but with berkley DB

I think the idea is coming perhaps being used all over even in app engine by google but not admitted to since it is something that would obsolete oracle.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

I have never been a troll.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

oh please

[der_gavio_fhurer]

Anyone know if zach is indeed a 20 year old college guy or someone with a job?

I am 15 year unix vert with 100k net worth and no debt.

I am also tall and good loooking and living in southern california.

I am polytheistic and admire cat-v.org archlinux lisp haskell forth ada smalltalk and tcl.

I would end public school and replace lawyers with software.

I would also tax consumption with something like www.fairtax.org.

I think the NBA is fixed so obviously now that its getting insulting and that the spurs should have won the 2013 title last night with free throws by genolbi.

I love getbig.com and admire arnold and vince girona and think flex wheeler was not the next arnold, whom we are sill waiting for. Bodybuilders with too much quads delts n back and weak chest and arms look like shit inclduing ronnie and dorian.

Le bron james and his sidekick wade are made great not by play but by refs who if they did not get bailed out would be above avg but not star players.
Call offensiev alone on le bron and he foul out in first half, its his only offfensive move.

Dont call bialout freethrows on wade run into defeneder and throw it up horse crap and he misses almost every shot.

Sanrenna lee is a 10 not hale or aniston or beyonce, who are all 2-4 on 10 scale.

Fast and furius 6 was more fantasy than lord of the rings or the hobbit.

now there that was, while unspeakable awesome, TROLLING

ok?


asking if an in ram queryable data store with update logging and image serialization can in the large, given large hardware, repalce oracle, is quite valid tehcnical and gods bless me and INTERESTING techincal question and debate starter.

la!

[Raymond Wiker]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> Well I do run a lot yes. I mean I am a top unix guy with 15 years.
> Are you indeed in school and living at moms in the basement?
> thinking evil america and capitalism are the devil? lol

There's absolutely no fucking way that you are a "top Unix guy".

[der_gavio_fhurer]

> There's absolutely no fucking way that you are a "top Unix guy".

Well I make 85/hour with 16 years in the biz, with 6 figure net worth, 0 debt, does that count? Or to you do top unix guys only code linux device drivers? I didn't mean I was Al Viro or Theo De Raadt.... or Rob fukin Pike.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

aside from quicklisp? any lisp apps you have coded on github?

[der_gavio_fhurer]

I get great financial feedback.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

> Can't you persuade them with a great application you write in Lisp?
>
>
>
> Zach

Aside from quicklisp what apps at all have you done in lisp?

:)

[der_gavio_fhurer]

remember: germany romped on engladn in ww1 and 2, and germany would have easily won the war without USA intervening, and hek I think we should have allied with germany and organzied europe then probly have more progress than now :)

[Zach Beane]

I bet you write a lot of great shell and awk scripts, though! That
counts for something right? I wonder if you could use prevayler ideas
in awk scripts!

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

sarcasm is the most boring form of humor, suited only for pseudo intellects
cmon zak
get better
lol
the point of prevayler is logic in ram, update log to disk, and logic updates only through commadn objects, and blobs of course on disk
its an idea whos time has come
I wonder if google app engine runs this way?
coreserver is very interesting lisp server closest to haskells www.happstack.com which has acidstate

zak I make 85/hour so yeah I do kick ass in biz :)
I am massivly productive with my bash skill and hek some tcl.
Not so with lisp yet..
it seems with lisp the biger win would be if lisp did both that database and the logic or the dymanic website

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> zak I make 85/hour so yeah I do kick ass in biz :)
> I am massivly productive with my bash skill and hek some tcl.
> Not so with lisp yet..
> it seems with lisp the biger win would be if lisp did both that database and the logic or the dymanic website

I bet! There's not a lot of people who can do great scripting stuff,
plus there's a big demand for those kind of skills in the industry!
Where do you work? Do you think you might write Lisp programs sometime?
Do you use Prevayler from Tcl?

For easier reference, I've updated the subject of my replies with [Gavin
Schuette]. That way you can highlight them with your newsreader.

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

I have asked some tcl folks about a tcl port of prevayler.
With tcl as phil greenspun did, I would probably just use the classic aolserver postgresql tcl stack on freebsd on a large box, with a second for redundancy..
tcl has oo now built into 8.6 as well as 2 other oo systems so could concievably port www.prevayler.org over.
:)

zak where are some lisp websites you have created?

[der_gavio_fhurer]

On Friday, June 28, 2013 2:58:22 PM UTC-7, Zach Beane wrote:

well really its knowing redhat, tomcat, apache, cherokee, nginx, isilon, vmware, netapp SAN, cloud, devops, mysql, AND scripting that brings it all together

:)

hek I use netbsd openbsd freebsd illumian for fun
not that into ZFS but its cool

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

>
> well really its knowing redhat, tomcat, apache, cherokee, nginx,
> isilon, vmware, netapp SAN, cloud, devops, mysql, AND scripting that
> brings it all together

A full-stack config file kind of guy! Nice!

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

Lol you know how dumb you sound?
Sarcasm remember is the dumbest for of humor!
Although with sshpass multi box config file delivery can be achieved in 1% the code of solutions like chef.
:)
oracle must die!
export all democrats!

[der_gavio_fhurer]

Still waiting to vidi some of your lisp powered websites :)
lol
yeah

[der_gavio_fhurer]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, der_gavio_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

anyone

I mean I thought many would come forward with a story of lisp being used as a database being flexible and a joy to evolve compared to other solutions.

I had hoped to get some interesting accounts.

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> Although with sshpass multi box config file delivery can be achieved
> in 1% the code of solutions like chef.

It sounds like you are really great at scripting and config files!
That's a great asset in a top Unix guy!

Zach

[gavino_himself]

lol damn right it is!!
top unix guy has to know
automation
SAN
virtualization
kernel tuning
networking
database
cloud
cdn
dns
the list goes on!!! lol
yeah
zak remember, you aren't me
lol

[gavino_himself]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, der_gavio_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

I imagine using only lisp on a free unix like freebsd would be quite liberating for many lispers.

[Zach Beane]

Too funny! Do you think you might ever write an application or library?

Zach

[gavino_himself]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, der_gavio_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>

> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexibility to return results processed and reduced any which way

Maybe this is the best way to use lisp.

I wonder how many concurrent users a 48g ram 16 cpu box could handle with a 16 disk raid 10 softraid freebsd under it using gmirror and gstripe?

1000s?

[Öö Tiib]

On Sunday, 30 June 2013 07:12:40 UTC+3, gavino_himself wrote:
>
> I wonder how many concurrent users a 48g ram 16 cpu box could handle with a
> 16 disk raid 10 softraid freebsd under it using gmirror and gstripe?
>
> 1000s?

Can jet plane fly? Yes, but someone who asks such a thing should perhaps
avoid trying it out.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

That makes not too much sense... is english not your main language?

[der_gavio_fhurer]

still waiting to see the websites you wrote in lisp?

http://l1sp.org/html/

this is one kinda eeeeh

[Öö Tiib]

English is my 4-th language, sorry. Do you claim that the things what
you tend to write here ... (example: "god chef and puppet suck ass")
... make better sense in English than what I wrote above? Then I am
sorry also for English.

[der_gavio_fhurer]

I can help with English. I am a published author.
The quote you made there from me is an exclamation.
If you were a native speaker it would make more sense.
Remember usa #1 economy due to unregulated capitalism and freedom.

[Zach Beane]

der_gavio_fhurer <vispha...@gmail.com> writes:

> I can help with English. I am a published author.

Where can this published work be found?

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

zak Ill tell after you show me the lisp powered websites you published!! LOL
LOL!!!!

[der_gavio_fhurer]

On Tuesday, July 2, 2013 1:47:03 PM UTC-7, Zach Beane wrote:

whos Gavin Schuette?

[Zach Beane]

I like this collection of Gavin Schuette quotes from Joe Marshall in
2006:

is scheme a useless academic langage? What commonly sed app is done in
scheme?
how can I build a kick butt website using scheme?
wait does slib actually implement a relational db?
what do schemers use for e commerce?
does SLIB allow scheme to talk to postgresql?
how do i update one section of a page leaving rest?
are appservers BS? is python a bunch of snooty wankers?
can someone unban me from freenode irc? #perl ?
if Clisp is so good where are the commonly used apps?
how in hell can I learn CLISP? PCL seems lame
even with lisp, are websites just interfaces to databases? or can you
skip the rdbms? How can I build a dynamic website better with
CLISP?
is aolserver 4.5 compiling on linux yet?
http://aolserver.com/lists.php why is aolsever mailing list done in
php?
anyone like gobolinux? It seems great to me
embperl the fastest perl website setup?
zd1211 driver for usb nic, adding to non knopix distro?
wireless usb ethernet card for linux?
where is the APL website production tool? APl databasE?
Is there an APL system that is free for commercial use for linux?
I want a 100% as in beer free APL interpreter and manual. Where do I
find one?
is there a web browser in APL? or a DNS server?
APl v J?
Is there a linux version of APL?
what is scalability limit on smallalk oo db?
is anyone using squeak prevalence? al objects in ram?
can squeak be used for huge sites? screw non free smalltalk!
how does seaside compare to this? happs
http://happs.org/HAppS/README.­html
seaside for customer service website adn sales website?
how do I schedule jobs in smalltalk? involving automation of ftp
transfers?
linux monitoring using smalltalk?
can smalltalk split work among multiple machines for speed?
what is new about oo programming why does it matter? why did world run
with non oo before?
smalltalk as 'going further' than python or ruby = more poweR? also
lisp haskell etc.
is the an app server in forth yet?
what kinds of app can you build in forth? webserver? dynamic websie?
Is there a purely event driven framework for java?
is cocoon a hunk of crap? or dope?
why so many frameworks? Can you just put all best ideas in 1?
job scheduler free software quartz?
jboss, boon or bain? my work is bringing it in on linux redhat
is stripes any good?
what is the best java framework for distributed transactions?
does php+apache have caching of page+data, db connect pool?
sugarcrm sucks, but so does xoops, is there a decent free biz package?

whats best functional application server?
is haskell more productive than scheme?
is forth a functional language?
is haskell a form of lisp?
haskell for webapps? happs? is haskell better than java php asp etc?

How is haskell more powerful than lisp ?
http://happs.org/HAppS/README.­html can happs be used in production?
what is a COTS?
How do I test the network speed between 2 linux boxes?
annoying preview popup graphic in 9, and how make save with images
default?
why can't you set the default save to save with images?
conan RPG any good?
how is netbsd under heavy net loads?
database web programming, scrap the appserver, use aolserver, stuff in
ram?
can ostgresql handle 50k users simulaneously?
playing 3 movies at same time with media player how?
6-6 280 33, how do I get down to 210? I eat a lot
can someone learn programming with D?

And another few from 2002:

Is freebsd or linux faster?
Does freebsd use the linux kernel?

Zach

[der_gavio_fhurer]

Who is this Gavin Schuette?

[pnpuff]

Il giorno lunedì 10 giugno 2013 23:32:00 UTC+2, derrr_fhurer ha scritto:
> wondering
>
>
>

> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

All Dreams Are Not For Sale ( http://www.sevwave.com/electronic%20music.html )

[Michael Kappert]

On 07/03/2013 06:18 AM, der_gavio_fhurer wrote:
>
> Who is this Gavin Schuette?

imbecile, you posted the name of your windows home directory to
comp.lang.perl.misc.

[Nicolas Neuss]

Interesting. So a tea party member pesters comp.lang.lisp (and other
newsgroups) for that long time.

Nicolas

[graham...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, June 11, 2013 7:32:00 AM UTC+10, derrr_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

You can make a rudimentary Relational Database System in lisp to do Queries but the Update commands (editing / adding records) is done in raw LISP not through the Query System.

so

SELECT NAME, AGE, TOWN, POSTCODE FROM CLIENTS, POSTCODES

can be done in a LISP QUERY.

but

INSERT CLIENTS.AGE+1 INTO CLIENTS.AGE
WHERE BDAY > JUNE30

cannot be simply done in a Query language
interpreted by LISP.


-----------------------

a TABLE (I forget LISP!)

clients = (
( fname, sname, age, town ) ,
( tom, smith, 23, perth ) ,
( mary, black, 24, toronto )
)


then you MAP EVAL( 'your function' )
onto the whole list..

To do a CARTESIAN JOIN (2 tables)
is a little more work.


Herc
--
http://phpprolog.com/demos/DATABASE-LOCK.png

[seneika]

Hey, you seem a skilled web programmer. Aren't you interested in
foreign markets? I can tell you that the brazilian market needs
guys like you.

The vast majority of online stores around here suck. I can't tell
you where the problem is. If it's only on the websites or in the
web servers or both. Sites are equally slow and ill designed. I
believe the "slow" part may be related to the way they access
their databases.

I believe someone offering a service unheard around here could
make some money.

Cheers,
Seneika

BTW: I didn't know people could use lisp for that. I'm learning
lisp myself (trying, at least) because I'm interested in AI.

[graham...@gmail.com]

You mean www.phpProlog.com ?


http://phpprolog.com/demos/pp10.png
http://phpprolog.com/demos/pp12.png
http://phpprolog.com/demos/DATABASE-LOCK.png

Yeh I'm working on Winograd Blocks World Talking AI...
as a Navman App... "why did you take the city highway?"
"How far to the nearest servo?"

I'm lucky I have time to do a big project like a Database CMS
and probably wont monetise a Web Utility. eCloud.com is for rent!

Well try and get the hang of LISP first.. in PROLOG you
have to put the RESULT into the final argument..

add (X Y Z) :-
add (X 0 X).


instead of Z = add(X,Y)


Prolog has a higher learning curve, real brainteasers
just to do some simple code... then its really amazing!


but Adult pays better!

Herc
--
www.CamGirls.com

[derrr_fhurer]

Who Gavin Schuette did ? Who is that guy?

[derrr_fhurer]

No I am not a skilled web programmer.
Never been to Brazile.

[derrr_fhurer]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, derrr_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

I am actually curious for some examples of some thing an SQL database could do that lisp can't?

[graham...@gmail.com]

Normalised RDB's are non-redundant

meaning it doesn't matter what updates you
make to the data or what algorithm you use,
you wont get a duplicate value and miss one!

e.g. in XML ( a hierarchy database more like Lisp)


library = < ibn1233, ibn55454, ibn53332, ibn542323 >

break this down a level...

library = <

< ibn1233, ... >

< ibn55454, ... >

< ibn53332, napalm in the morning , john smith , www.smith.com >

< ibn542323 , the art of war , john smith , www.smith.com >

>



Ok now John Smith changed his website to
www.johnno.com


You have *2* RECORDS and you have to edit BOTH!



------------------------------


Also you wont be able to find records in under a second
a LISP with tables over 1,000,000 records.

SQL is almost as fast as Hash Arrays
using Binary Tree Indexing.

Every term in phpPROLOG

client 4232 smith tom 43 green street usa
client 4233 jones max 22 brown road aus


Every term in B-Tree indexed in phpPROLOG

so you won't notice any slowing with a billion records in there!
( a factor of 3-10 )

Herc

--
www.phpPROLOG.com

[derrr_fhurer]

lisp must have something fast

perhaps it can use b trees or red-black trees?

[graham...@gmail.com]

No linked lists are notoriously slow!

That's why everyone jumped ship to C+

since 99% of coding in LISP was FOR LOOPS and WHILE LOOPS anyway!


--------------------

1972 PROLOG uses recursive descent same thing as LISP

VT PROLOG DATA STRUCTURE

tag - which kind of node this is.
cons_node - cons_nodes consist of two pointers,
one to the head (first item)
the other to the rest of the list. They are the "glue" which
holds the list together. The list (A B C) would be stored as

------- -------- --------
| .| . |-----> | .| . |------> | .| . |---> NIL
--|----- --|------ --|-----
| | |
V V V
A B C




This will get bogged going from 1 corner of a chessboard to the other!




e4
/
/
d3--e3
/ \/
/ /\
c2--d2--e2
/ \/ \/
/ /\ /\
b1--c1--d1--e1
/ \/ \/ \/
/ /\ /\ /\
a0--b0--c0--d0--e0
\ \/ \/ \/
\ /\ /\ /\
bm1-cm1-dm1-em1
\ \/ \/
\ /\ /\
cm2-dm2-em2
\ \/
\ /\
dm3-em3
\
\
em4


?-path(a0,e4,P).
P = go(a0, go(b1, go(c2, go(d3, e4)))) 5 secs

?-path(a0,e3,P).
P = go(a0, go(b1, go(c2, go(d2, e3)))) 5 secs

?-path(a0,e2,P).
P = go(a0, go(b1, go(c2, go(d2, e2)))) 5 secs

?-path(a0,e1,P).
P = go(a0, go(b1, go(c2, go(d2, e1)))) 5 secs

?-path(a0,e0,P).
P = go(a0, go(b1, go(c2, go(d1, e0)))) 10 secs

?-path(a0,em1,P).
P = go(a0,b1,c1,d0,em1) 30 secs

?-path(a0,em2,P).
P = go(a0,b1,c0,dm1,em2) 50 secs

?-path(a0,em3,P).
P = go(a0,b0,cm1,dm2,em3) 100 secs (1 min 40s)

?-path(a0,em4,P).
P = go(a0,bm1,cm2,dm3,em4) 150 secs (2 min 30s)


SUMMARY
a0-e4 LLLL 5s
ao-e3 LLSL 5s
a0-e2 LLSS 5s
a0-e1 LLSR 5s
a0-e0 LLRR 10s
a0-em1 LSRR 30s
a0-em2 LRRR 50s
a0-em3 SRRR 100s
a0-em4 RRRR 150s

only 4 moves ^ 3 !!

VT Prolog was written in Turbo Pascal

Linked lists are old hat..

1990's Databases used sub-tuples
and you need 1000 lines of code to read the date!

If you need Binary Indexes speed
just go a little bit more work
and design an RDB!


Herc
--
http://phpprolog.com/demos/

[derrr_fhurer]

huh???

so lisp does not have binary trees?
no red-black trees

[graham...@gmail.com]

Not in the data structure of the language that runs LISP.

This is all you need for a directed acyclic graph
(LIST & PROLOG)

cons_node - cons_nodes consist of two pointers,
one to the head (first item)
the other to the rest of the list. They are the "glue" which
holds the list together. The list (A B C) would be stored as

------- -------- --------
| .| . |-----> | .| . |------> | .| . |---> NIL
--|----- --|------ --|-----
| | |
V V V
A B C

Binary trees only work on a sequence of terms..

by LIST you really mean D.A.G.


a LIST a(b(c(d(e)))))

e.g. BASIC
10 print hi
20 goto 10
30
|
V



a DAG cons(a, cons(b, cons(c)))

A -- B
|
C -- D
|
E

where does the Index go!


----------------------------------


Now.... compare that to My relational data structure
of directed acyclic graphs.

its really a set of indexed-terms in any order!

LIST = { (1,a) , (2,b) , (3-1,c) , (3-2,d) )

( a b (c d) )

1 2 31 32


I might do a quick phpLISP.com

since all the interface and table design is already there..

I'm just not sure if its needed.. limiting to EVAL
when UNIFY() is a lot more powerful.

You don't need the TAILS Table or QUERY Table, just the HEADS TABLE
to run LISP!




<?

//**********************************
//** ADD **
//**********************************

//Copyright 2013 (c) PHPPROLOG.COM



// SQL TABLE HEADS
// +----+-----+------+-----+
// | id | ref | term | var |
// +----+-----+------+-----+
// | 1 | 1 | f | |
// | 1 | 21 | g | |
// | 1 | 22 | a | |


// SQL TABLE TAILS
// +----+-----+------+-----+------+
// | id | ref | term | var | tail |
// +----+-----+------+-----+------+
// | 1 | 1 | t | | 1 |
// | 1 | 21 | x | | 1 |
// | 1 | 22 | y | | 1 |

// 1 21 22
// f [g a] BLoCKPROLOG
// t [x y].
//
// f(g(a)) :- t(x(y)). PROLOG




Exact same Input Bracket Parser, U/I as phpPROLOG
just do an EVAL instead of UNIFY!

But yeh take me a couple months and be pretty basic LISP.

Only about 1000 instructions a second for 30 seconds..
but could handle some HUGE lists in mySQL!


Herc
--
http://phpprolog.com/

[derrr_fhurer]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, derrr_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

english, my man, english!

[gavino_himself]

well maybe lisp can be used without an SQL database

but its so powerful its not talked about

That is my theory.

[graham...@gmail.com]

a linked list and a table are essentially mutually exclusive!


this is a 'cellular' level database that I use for Prolog

LIST = { (1,a) , (2,b) , (3-1,c) , (3-2,d) }

eg

( a b (c d) )

1 2 31 32

<?

//**********************************
//** ADD **
//**********************************

//Copyright 2013 (c) PHPPROLOG.COM



// SQL TABLE HEADS
// +----+-----+------+-----+
// | id | ref | term | var |
// +----+-----+------+-----+
// | 1 | 1 | f | |
// | 1 | 21 | g | |
// | 1 | 22 | a | |

this is (f (g a))

note: (g a) is a sublist so its 2 refs are longer



OK so that will work... but one MySQL query per atom!

so this is good for PROLOG but bad for LISP

because in PROLOG it searches for which function to run
(several terms at a time with 1 MySQL statement.



so you're back to putting 1 line of LISP per table record
and using arrays

..or...

emulating LISP on top of myPROLOG..




Now you can use something like:

(def FUN ( car ( - A B )
( = FUN A )
)


Lisp right? No that's Prolog

but you may as well use =
instead of defun


( = A ( car A B ) )


where you can define = in PROLOG as UNIFY

( = X X )

which you only do once.


so I can put a copy of phpPROLOG at phpLISP
and change the brackets to lisp style

then you can write your own LISP interpreter
and use :

30 lockto 30

which will stop deleting lines 1-30 when people hit [NEW]


anyway that's the approach for now.. be about a week
to have a simple phpLISP.com running!


but every line would start with = !!

( = Y ( append A B C )


and no for loops... or while loops will work
just recursion..

maybe you could define while and for in that..


my control flow IF ELSE FI in prolog wont
be prolog commands they will be OUTSIDE meta-commands


truther X :-
assert P [ liar X ]
IF [ liar P ]
pred arg
pred arg
ELSE
assert M [ liar P ]
FI


where IF ELSE FI are not predicates
they are just the -> ; in standard prolog
neatened up..

but I can put back the outer brackets
and indent on 1 open bracket so it looks
like LISP!


( truther X
( assert P ( liar X )
( pred arg ) )
( one less bracket )
)



then you can Program LISP in PROLOG
which is stored in mySQL atom by atom

I haven't worked on how IF THEN would work
in prolog predicates themselves... that
might need a further patch to the syntax..


Herc
--
www.phpPROLOG.com
www.phpLISP.com (coming soon..)

[gavino_himself]

ok lets put down php

and perhaps try clisp and cl-prevalence

http://common-lisp.net/project/cl-prevalence/

:)

also be fun to see if cl-prevaler can run on N nodes so you can scatter query

I wonder if anyone tried this with sqlite yet...

[gavino_himself]

On Monday, June 10, 2013 2:32:00 PM UTC-7, derrr_fhurer wrote:
> wondering
>
>
>
> it seems lisp could lend itself to deep deep queries and tons of flexability to return results processed and reduced any which way

http://www.cliki.net/query-fs

look at this!

Query-FS is a FUSE-based filesystem that presents database queries as filesystem trees. It first loads plugins (lisp source files) to prepare query parsers, and then loads the queries themselves and creates a virtual filesystem with results.

[ara]

This may not relate to your question, but have you seen
http://common-lisp.net/project/ucw/features.html