Mac + Lisp ?
Martin Raspaud
What lisp would you advise for Mac OS X.3 ?
Tried sbcl and openMcl but it doesn't seem to work fine...
If you have any idea...
Martin
Pascal Costanza
See http://alu.cliki.net/Implementation
Pascal
--
Pascal Costanza University of Bonn
mailto:cost...@web.de Institute of Computer Science III
http://www.pascalcostanza.de Römerstr. 164, D-53117 Bonn (Germany)
Frederic Brunel
> What lisp would you advise for Mac OS X.3 ?
>
> Tried sbcl and openMcl but it doesn't seem to work fine...
OpenMCL works fine for me under OS X 10.3. I use the latest version
of OpenMCL 0.14+. What's your problem?
--
Frederic Brunel
Justin Dubs
I use sbcl. The CVS HEAD should build under 10.3. You can also try
the version from here:
http://www.cs.indiana.edu/~bmastenb/software/SBCL/sbcl-g5-or-panther.html
I've also have OpenMCL 0.13.6 installed and it's working fine.
Justin Dubs
Raffael Cavallaro
Martin Raspaud <mras...@labri.fr> wrote:
Since you seem to be indicating one of the free Common Lisps, I'll give
you a rundown of what I feel are the strengths and weaknesses of each.
BTW, I welcome corrections to the following from those with more
accurate info.
OpenMCL
+ Direct interface to Apple's Cocoa frameworks allowing the creation of
fully native MacOS X applications.
+ Blazingly fast compilation speed (all code is compiled in OpenMCL).
+ Extremely responsive Project Leader (Gary Byers), and generous
contributors (Randall Beer, Sven van Caekenberghe, Nicky Peeters, Mikel
Evins, Bryan O'Conner, etc.)
+ Multi threaded.
- Generates slower multidimensional array access code than sbcl. In
combination with OpenMCL's somewhat slower floating point code, this
means that multidimensional floating point array code can be
significantly slower (~5x) in OpenMCL than in sbcl. (This is assuming
(optimize (speed 3) (safety 0) (compilation-speed 0) (space 0) (deug 0))
and appropriate type declarations)
sbcl
+ Generated code is extremely fast. Tremendous assistance from compiler
in optimizing code.
+ Very responsive and generous maintainers.
+ Cross platform to many unices.
- Not multi threaded.
- Although calling foreign functions is possible, setting up callbacks
would be *extremely* awkward, if at all possible. This means that doing
fully native MacOS X apps is problematic. One could do a GUI in
C/C++/Objective-C/Applescript, and send data back and forth to sbcl
through a pipe (NSPipe, for example) I suppose.
- Compilation speed is significantly slower than OpenMCL, but still
quite fast.
clisp
+ Extremely portable - *nix, DOS, Windows, Acorn, etc.
- Still no MOP, IIRC.
- Even when compiled to bytecode (there is no native code compiler)
generated code is quite slow compared with both OpenMCL and sbcl.
(N.B. The fact that I haven't mentioned the responsiveness of the clisp
maintainers is merely an indication that I've never needed to contact
them. They are, of course, extremely generous to provide such a widely
portable Common Lisp implementation for Free, in both senses of the
word.)
Development Environment.
Others will have their own views, I'm sure, but I'd recommend using the
Carbon version of Emacs:
<http://mindlube.com/products/emacs/index.html> or
<http://www.inf.unibz.it/~franconi/mac-emacs/>
(if you use the latter, do *not* run the application to set your
environment vars - it will clobber any custom environment.plist file)
in conjunction with SLIME:
<http://www.common-lisp.net/project/slime/>
<http://www.cliki.net/SLIME>
If you need detailed info on how to set up your .emacs file and
./MacOSX/environment.plist file, email me.
I'm sure others have their own views, and may chime in on various points
above. But...
Summary:
If you want to do a fully native MacOS X app, then OpenMCL is really
your best choice. If you're doing a command line only app, or an X
Windows app, and you need same-lisp-implementation portability to other
unices, then sbcl or clisp would be a better choice. If you need
same-lisp-implementation portability to DOS/Windows, then clisp is your
only choice. If your application makes heavy use of multidimensional
floating point arrays, then sbcl may be your best choice.
Hope this helps.
raf
Thomas F. Burdick
Good summary.
> sbcl
> - Although calling foreign functions is possible, setting up callbacks
> would be *extremely* awkward, if at all possible. This means that doing
> fully native MacOS X apps is problematic. One could do a GUI in
> C/C++/Objective-C/Applescript, and send data back and forth to sbcl
> through a pipe (NSPipe, for example) I suppose.
Expect this to change this week. I've only done trivial testing so
far, but I've added callbacks (on OS X only) to my local system.
--
/|_ .-----------------------.
,' .\ / | No to Imperialist war |
,--' _,' | Wage class war! |
/ / `-----------------------'
( -. |
| ) |
(`-. '--.)
`. )----'
Raffael Cavallaro
t...@famine.OCF.Berkeley.EDU (Thomas F. Burdick) wrote:
> Expect this to change this week. I've only done trivial testing so
> far, but I've added callbacks (on OS X only) to my local system.
This is great news!
raf
Martin Raspaud
After all, we succeeded in installing sbcl, which seems to be the best
for what we're doing : we're implementing a program on both linux and
mac, so according to Raffael, it seems to be the best choice (because we
want fast compiled code)
Martin
Jacek Generowicz
I haven't seen it mentioned yet, so just in case ...
both ACL and LispWorks run on Linux, OS X, and Windoze, and are
available in personal or trial versions which are free (as in gratis).
... which you could use for development (though at least one, if not
both, of these licenses specifies that you must not use them for
development of products you will sell for profit[*] ... but then you
could always buy a "full" licence, if you find that the product is
worth it.
You'll have to check the licenses yourself for full and correct
details, of course.
Thomas A. Russ
>
> Hi all,
>
> What lisp would you advise for Mac OS X.3 ?
I like to use MCL from Digitool.
>
> Tried sbcl and openMcl but it doesn't seem to work fine...
What didn't work for you?
--
Thomas A. Russ, USC/Information Sciences Institute
Tyro
Have you considred Digitool MCL 5.0? You may like to try the Demo
Version of the product. It is available at
<http://www.digitool.com/download.html>.