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docdw...@panix.com  
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 More options Jul 10 2004, 7:58 am
Newsgroups: comp.lang.cobol, comp.lang.fortran
From: docdw...@panix.com
Date: 10 Jul 2004 07:58:05 -0400
Local: Sat, Jul 10 2004 7:58 am
Subject: Re: Dead languages?
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In article <40ef1d19.87379...@news.optonline.net>,

Robert Wagner <robert.deletet...@wagner.net> wrote:
>docdw...@panix.com wrote:

>>In article <40ee18af.20703...@news.optonline.net>,
>>Robert Wagner <robert.deletet...@wagner.net> wrote:
>>>docdw...@panix.com wrote:

>>>>In article <40edfa9c.13003...@news.optonline.net>,
>>>>Robert Wagner <robert.deletet...@wagner.net> wrote:
>>>>>Richard Maine <nos...@see.signature> wrote:

>>>>>>docdw...@panix.com writes:

>>>>>>> 'Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres!'

>>>>>>Oh dear!  My high school Latin text must have had a bowdlerized
>>>>>>version or something.  I'd *SWEAR* I remember this as
>>>>>>'Alles Gall in tres partes divisa est'. But a quick google
>>>>>>check doesn't find it in that form.

>>>>>Richard is correct. Caesar actually wrote:  "Gallia est omnis divisa in partes
>>>>>tres, quarum unam incolunt Belgae, aliam Aquitani, tertiam qui ipsorum lingua
>>>>>Celtae, nostra Galli appellantur.

>>>>Mr Wagner, this is confusing... Mr Maine wrote 'I'd *SWEAR* I remember
>>>>this as 'Alles Gall in tres partes divisa est' in response to my stating
>>>>'Gallia est omnis divisa in partes tres!'... how does what you cite here
>>>>support his reminisce as 'correct'?

>>>Even more confusing is the Original Latin I remember as "Omnes Galii est divista
>>>in tres partes."

>>What's Life without a bit of Mystery?

>>>I remember it very distinctly. How many versions of Gaelic Wars
>>>did Caesar write? What the hell's going on here?

>>Ahhhhh, for the Oldene Dayse... when they taught Latin quotes such as
>>cannot be taught by *ten* teachers, today!

>Unlike English, where normal word order is SVO (subject, verb, object), Latin,
>along with Japanese, has no normal word order. One can rearrange the words in a
>sentence and it still says the same thing.

This is similar to what I was taught about Ancient Greek, where order word
important is very not.

>My hypothesis is that high school Latin text authors rearranged words to make it
>easier for English-speaking students to understand. Thus

>Caesar's "Gallia est omnis divisa in parte tres." and
>Mr Maine's "Alles Gall in tres partes divisa est." and
>My "Omnes Galii est divista in tres partes."

>are linguistically equivalent, are saying the same thing and are equally valid
>Latin.

All right... let's see how much I can shame myself publically with my lack
of skill; my apologies in advance for the grievous errors.

I would say not *quite* so, Mr Wagner.  In Caesar's quote 'Gallia' is a
nominative, in Mr Wagner's quote 'Galii' appears to be modified by 'Omnes'
(which would make it an object, hence accusative, but 'Galii' appears to
be a genetive).  In Mr Maine's example there is the slight problem of
'Alles'.

DD


 
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