"This page is enhanced for Microsoft Internet Explorer"
Mike Batchelor
<CENTER>
<FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
<I>
This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
</I>
</FONT>
</CENTER>
I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this who will think this is a
great enhancement, and others who (like me) are wondering if the Web will
ever be able to live up to its potential when outfits like Microsoft and
Netscape are fragmenting it into vendor-specific ghettos.
I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
<FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
Maybe if enough pages were "enhanced" in just the right way so that
vendors of non-HTML browsers were swamped with tech support calls from
frustrated users wanting to turn off those tags, then some semblance of
orderly development might be returned to the WWW.
I suggest <BODY bgcolor=#000000 text=#000000>
(half-joking, half-serious)
--
%%%%%% mik...@clark.net %%%%%% http://www.clark.net/pub/mikebat/www/ %%%%%%
Mike Batchelor
<CENTER>
<FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
<I>
This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
</I>
</FONT>
</CENTER>
I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this who will think this is a
great enhancement, and others who (like me) are wondering if the Web will
ever be able to live up to its potential when outfits like Microsoft and
Netscape are fragmenting it into vendor-specific ghettos.
I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
<FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
<rant>
Maybe if enough pages were "enhanced" in just the right way so that
vendors of non-HTML browsers were swamped with tech support calls from
frustrated users wanting to turn off those tags, then some semblance of
orderly development might be returned to the WWW.
I suggest <BODY bgcolor=#000000 text=#000000>
(half-joking, half-serious)
</rant>
Frank McNeil
: Just what we needed, right?
: <CENTER>
: <FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
: <I>
: This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
: Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
: </I>
: </FONT>
: </CENTER>
: I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this who will think this is a
: great enhancement, and others who (like me) are wondering if the Web will
: ever be able to live up to its potential when outfits like Microsoft and
: Netscape are fragmenting it into vendor-specific ghettos.
: I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
: <FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
Well your override makes more sense to me than the above.
QUESTION: Does the Microsoft Internet Explorer (MIE) allow you to override
that choice. I hope so. IMO the person creating the document
could state what font and size the pages were developed with in
small section that describes the document. IMHO, that would be
good. However the method above doesn't leverage technology.
IMHO, some people can process a page faster and easier, by using
the font style (and size) they are familiar with.
Second QUESTION: Does the MIE allow a person to render fine print through
the use of a page description tag similar to
Netscape's <FONT SIZE="-2">fine print</FONT>?
Thank you,
frank
Frank McNeil
ftme...@best.com
Wolfgang Schwanke
>I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
Probably in th spirit of making your page readable to everyone,
the true spirit of HTML.
Wolfgang
--
\ wolfi | Wolfgang Schwanke /
\ E-Post: wo...@cs.tu-berlin.de | wo...@berlin.snafu.de /
/ sozial relevant vernetzte Multimediasuperdatenhighwayinfobahn \
/ mit grafischer Benutzeroberflaeche: http://www.snafu.de/~wolfi/ \
Ka-Ping Yee
>Just what we needed, right?
>
><CENTER>
><FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
><I>
>This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
>Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
></I>
></FONT>
></CENTER>
MAY I SCREAM NOW?!
------ aaaaARRRRRRRGGGGHHHHH!!!!!! ------
Very sorry about that.
>I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
This is actually not so bad an idea. I'm almost motivated to orchestrate
a movement in this direction. How many people do you think we could
convice to do just this, in support of a good cause?
Naturally, using <font face=wingdings> may seem like just a prank. But
it's much more serious than that; if we can get everyone to understand
what destruction is being wrought, perhaps we can convince people that
this protest has a serious and essential purpose.
>Maybe if enough pages were "enhanced" in just the right way so that
>vendors of non-HTML browsers were swamped with tech support calls from
>frustrated users wanting to turn off those tags, then some semblance of
>orderly development might be returned to the WWW.
If we were able to gain support from enough popular World-Wide Web
services, such as Yahoo, Lycos, and so on, maybe it could gain momentum.
But it needs to be done early enough. Before such crap as the above
takes hold.
I'm willing. Who else is?
[please cc followups to me in e-mail.]
<FONT FACE="Wingdings" SIZE=100>
Ping (Ka-Ping Yee): 2B Computer Engineering, University of Waterloo, Canada
kr...@csclub.uwaterloo.ca | 62A Churchill St, Waterloo N2L 2X2, 519 886-3947
CWSF 89, 90, 92; LIYSF 90, 91; Shad Valley 92; DOE 93; IMO 91, 93; ACMIPC 94
--- Tendou Akane - Amano Ai - Hiyama Hikaru - Belldandy - Ayukawa Madoka ---
New! <http://csclub.uwaterloo.ca/u/kryee/> Yeah, i finally made a home page.
</FONT>
Graham Sorenson
>
> Just what we needed, right?
>
> <CENTER>
> <FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
> <I>
> This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
> Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
> </I>
> </FONT>
> </CENTER>
>
--
Graham Sorenson Guide to Aromatherapy URL
http://www.dircon.co.uk/home/philrees/fragrant/index.html
James HG Redekop
Frank McNeil <ftme...@shell1.best.com> wrote:
>Mike Batchelor (mik...@clark.net) wrote:
>
>: I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this who will think this is a
>: great enhancement, and others who (like me) are wondering if the Web will
>: ever be able to live up to its potential when outfits like Microsoft and
>: Netscape are fragmenting it into vendor-specific ghettos.
>
>
>
>QUESTION: Does the Microsoft Internet Explorer (MIE) allow you to override
> that choice. I hope so. IMO the person creating the document
> could state what font and size the pages were developed with in
> small section that describes the document. IMHO, that would be
> good. However the method above doesn't leverage technology.
> IMHO, some people can process a page faster and easier, by using
> the font style (and size) they are familiar with.
You know, this is exactly what HTML 3.0 style sheets are for...
If Netscape & MicroSoft are impatient with the IETF over HTML 3.0, their *best*
bet would be to go ahead and implement HTML 3.0 as far as they can, to force
the process along, rather than undermining the whole thing by coming up with
their own "standards".
Reminds me of a story I heard about MicroSoft at the PPPEXT working group at
the IETF session in Toronto a while back. MicroSoft showed up and announced
that they "believe in Open Standards", and then proceeded to tell the WG what
their new standards should be, since MS had already implemented them and the
MS PPPEXT was already shipping. When the WG had a look at what MS proposed,
they found it riddled with bad ideas, dumb design, and features that can and
have been shown to be useless (like call-back as a security feature).
--
James H.G. Redekop Free confidential counselling for
tz...@publix.empath.on.ca SURVIVORS OF DECONSTRUCTION
tz...@csd.uwo.ca Call 1-800-MEANING
http://www.csd.uwo.ca/~tzoq/ Ap(point)ments may be continually postponed.
Ender Wiggin
(snip)
>I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
I made my page Netscape-hostile. A friend of mine
(http://www.telepath.com/zatar) pointed out to me that MS-Windows
Netscape barfs (as in GPF) if it finds an <img> all by itself.
So I put one at the top of my page. :-)
--
Mark W. Wheatley | http://www.telepath.com/mwwheatl | mwwh...@telepath.com
Matthew kirk
problems thanks :-)
Matthew K
Brian Duguid
>><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
I think this is a splendid idea.
> I made my page Netscape-hostile. A friend of mine
>(http://www.telepath.com/zatar) pointed out to me that MS-Windows
>Netscape barfs (as in GPF) if it finds an <img> all by itself.
>So I put one at the top of my page. :-)
I think this is a stupid idea. What's more, it certainly doesn't crash
my MSWin Netscape browser. You have been misinformed :-)
Brian Duguid B...@mm-croy.mottmac.co.uk
http://www.hyperreal.com/zines/est/
Graham Sorenson
>
> In <3ub6jh$5...@clark.net> mik...@clark.net (Mike Batchelor) writes:
> (snip)
> ><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
>
> (http://www.telepath.com/zatar) pointed out to me that MS-Windows
> Netscape barfs (as in GPF) if it finds an <img> all by itself.
> So I put one at the top of my page. :-)
>
It dosen't on my 1.1..
James Duncan Davidson
wrote:
> I made my page Netscape-hostile. A friend of mine
>(http://www.telepath.com/zatar) pointed out to me that MS-Windows
>Netscape barfs (as in GPF) if it finds an <img> all by itself.
>So I put one at the top of my page. :-)
Doesn't work anymore -- my Netscape 1.2b2 displayed it fine -- except
for a picture icon where the <IMG> is.
-----------------------------------------
j a m e s d u n c a n d a v i d s o n
SJupiter
of MS Internet Explorer's opening page (http://www.msn.net/explore.html)
rather, hmm, non-standard?
<!-- ***** Microsoft Internet Central Explore Page
*****
***** Temporary Version Date: 06/16/95
***** Copyright (c) 1995 by Microsoft Corporation
***** -->
<HTML>
<BODY background="bground1.gif" text=#ffffff bgcolor=#222222 link=#ffff00
vlink=#00ffff>
<head><title>Internet Central: Explore</title></head>
...more stuff
</BODY>
</HTML>
Ka-Ping Yee
Yes. This is garbage.
Ping (Ka-Ping Yee): 2B Computer Engineering, University of Waterloo, Canada
kr...@csclub.uwaterloo.ca | 62A Churchill St, Waterloo N2L 2X2, 519 886-3947
CWSF 89, 90, 92; LIYSF 90, 91; Shad Valley 92; DOE 93; IMO 91, 93; ACMIPC 94
Amano Ai - Hiyama Hikaru - Ayukawa Madoka - Tendou Akane - Skuld - Belldandy
draft Video Girl Ai manga full-translations posted - vgai...@ualtavm.bitnet
Joerg Rhiemeier
>Just what we needed, right?
><CENTER>
><FONT SIZE=1 FACE=Arial>
><I>
>This page is enhanced for <FONT COLOR=#ff0000><B>Microsoft
>Internet Explorer</B></FONT>
></I>
></FONT>
></CENTER>
>I'm sure there are plenty of people reading this who will think this is a
>great enhancement, and others who (like me) are wondering if the Web will
>ever be able to live up to its potential when outfits like Microsoft and
>Netscape are fragmenting it into vendor-specific ghettos.
>I think I may change my home page so that it is enclosed within
><FONT FACE=Wingdings>, just to protest. For all the good it will do.
>Maybe if enough pages were "enhanced" in just the right way so that
>vendors of non-HTML browsers were swamped with tech support calls from
>frustrated users wanting to turn off those tags, then some semblance of
>orderly development might be returned to the WWW.
Yes, that's quite an appealing idea! I have also had the idea of doing
something like that against Netscrape.
>I suggest <BODY bgcolor=#000000 text=#000000>
>(half-joking, half-serious)
Another possibility: drop in <CENTER> and <FONT> tags at random locations to
scramble your text. The best place for them would be within words, if
there wasn't this NCSA Mosaic bug which sometimes causes it to break
lines before or after tags even though there is no whitespace at that
point. Then add a <BLINK> at the beginning of the page and a </BLINK>
at the end, such that the entire mess is even blinking.
Background images against which the text is illegible are not an
option because these are legal HTML 3. But you could put
preposterously fat borders around tables and inline images, which also
make a mess of the page.
Another possibility is creative use of client pull. Write a straight
(non-Netscrape/Microsloth-enhanced) HTML page, but put something like
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="42; URL=http://yourhost.org/craps.html">
in the head, where the URL in this line points at something you'll
like to scare off Netscrape and MIE users with.
There are lots of ways to turn a page into a total mess for Netscrape
and Microsloth browsers while having it look fine for others.
Unfortunately, many people have no other option than using these
browsers (e.g. because they work somewhere where only Netscrape is
installed), and this means that you lock these people out from your
pages. (That's why I haven't `anti-enhanced' my site yet.)
And there is another problem with `anti-enancing': You never know
whether the people annoyed by the mess they see on their screen send
their anger where you want them to, i.e. to the browser vendor's tech
support. They might just as well flame YOU -- after all, most other
pages look OK on their browser!
The art of anti-enhancing lies in making the thing look as if the
browser was defective, not as if the page was designed badly.
I think that of all those `anti-enhancing' methods, the best ones are
enclosing the entire text in <BLINK>..</BLINK> (without any other
anti-enhancing) and using client pull to have the page re-load
automatically again and again in moderate intervals (or to have the
browser pull a small page saying `If you can read this, your browser
is faulty. Please contact the vendor for technical support.'; this
one might look deliberately ugly, perhaps blinking green text on
blood-red background).
--
~~o~~| Joerg Rhiemeier, Drosselstieg 4, D-38108 Braunschweig, Germany
~/V\~| phone: +49-531-376134, e-mail: rhie...@ibr.cs.tu-bs.de
~~H~~| Visit the World Wrights' Web! http://www.cs.tu-bs.de/~rhiemeir/
~/_\~| "A spirit with a vision is a dream with a mission." -- Rush
DocOzone
<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>All Hope Abandon, Ye Who Enter Here</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<body background="netscape-die.gif">
<META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="60; URL=http://foo.bar/">
<p align=center><B>If you can read this, you don't have Netscape.</B></p>
</BODY>
</HTML>
Create the background, any tiny little gif, it'll load the background and
CRASH NETSCAPE. Every time. Works on all platforms. Last I'll say on the
matter.
-doc-
--
_____________________________________________________________
Thaddeus "Doc" Ozone <http://www.winternet.com/~drozone/>
"Specialization is for insects." -RAH
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for next chunk to export --> http://dcs.ex.ac.uk/~aba/export/
Martian
++deadscape.html, code follows...
++<HTML>
++<HEAD>
++<TITLE>All Hope Abandon, Ye Who Enter Here</TITLE>
++</HEAD>
++<body background="netscape-die.gif">
++<META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="60; URL=http://foo.bar/">
++<p align=center><B>If you can read this, you don't have Netscape.</B></p>
++</BODY>
++</HTML>
++Create the background, any tiny little gif, it'll load the background and
++CRASH NETSCAPE. Every time. Works on all platforms. Last I'll say on the
++matter.
++ -doc-
Note that the above is illegal HTML, as the <meta> elements belongs
in the head, not in the body of a document.
Abigail
Frank McNeil
: Is it just me, or is the <HTML><BODY><HEAD></HEAD></BODY></HTML> structure
: of MS Internet Explorer's opening page (http://www.msn.net/explore.html)
: rather, hmm, non-standard?
: <!-- ***** Microsoft Internet Central Explore Page
: *****
: ***** Temporary Version Date: 06/16/95
: ***** Copyright (c) 1995 by Microsoft Corporation
: ***** -->
: <HTML>
: <BODY background="bground1.gif" text=#ffffff bgcolor=#222222 link=#ffff00
: vlink=#00ffff>
: <head><title>Internet Central: Explore</title></head>
: ...more stuff
: </BODY>
: </HTML>
HENCE, THE BROWSER IS DOING A GOOD JOB IF IT RECOGNIZED THAT BAD HTML.
IMHO, the horrible thing I expect from Microsoft is not its browser; but
the HTML code generators. I need container end tags to process HTML
with scripts and I don't think IA generates them when they aren't
required by the spec (e.g., </P>).
frank
John Hornbuckle
I don't get it... The same folks who condemn users of Netscape-isms for
"alientating" non-Netscape users then turn around and offer this sort of advice.
It just doesn't make sense...
__________________________
John Hornbuckle
GulfNet Technologies, Inc.
121 South Jefferson Street
Perry, FL 32347
Voice: 1-904-838-1490
Fax: 1-904-584-8794
Mike Batchelor
>deadscape.html, code follows...
><HTML>
><HEAD>
><TITLE>All Hope Abandon, Ye Who Enter Here</TITLE>
></HEAD>
><body background="netscape-die.gif">
><META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="60; URL=http://foo.bar/">
><p align=center><B>If you can read this, you don't have Netscape.</B></p>
></BODY>
></HTML>
>Create the background, any tiny little gif, it'll load the background and
>CRASH NETSCAPE. Every time. Works on all platforms. Last I'll say on the
>matter.
> -doc-
This is illegal HTML. That Netscape crashes on it may be considered a
bug, but a <META> tag is allowed only within the <HEAD>.
I like Netscape-bashing as much as anyone else :), but show me some legal
code that crashes it, or that it mangles, and I'll be more impressed.
--
%%%%%% mik...@clark.net %%%%%% http://www.clark.net/pub/mikebat/ %%%%%%
Scott Bigham
as spake by mikebat@.clark.net (Mike Batchelor) :
>I like Netscape-bashing as much as anyone else :), but show me some legal
>code that crashes it, or that it mangles, and I'll be more impressed.
On that note, has anyone tried viewing the Netscape-Proof Page
<http://www.montefiore.ulg.ac.be/~quinet/nonetscape-en.html> with
Netscape 1.2? I'm curious to see if the bug it exploits is still
present.
-sbigham
--
Scott Bigham | "This is our path, to fight or die."
d...@cs.duke.edu | "That's what we're paid for, so let's
http://www.cs.duke.edu/~dsb/ | do it with some STYLE!"
= PGP spoken here = | Dr. Who, _Battlefield_
Joerg Rhiemeier
>In <drozone-2107...@ppp-66-86.dialup.winternet.com> dro...@winternet.com (DocOzone) writes:
>>deadscape.html, code follows...
>>
>><HTML>
>>
>><HEAD>
>><TITLE>All Hope Abandon, Ye Who Enter Here</TITLE>
>></HEAD>
>><body background="netscape-die.gif">
>><META HTTP-EQUIV="Refresh" CONTENT="60; URL=http://foo.bar/">
>><p align=center><B>If you can read this, you don't have Netscape.</B></p>
>></BODY>
>>
>></HTML>
>>
>>Create the background, any tiny little gif, it'll load the background and
>>CRASH NETSCAPE. Every time. Works on all platforms. Last I'll say on the
>>matter.
>> -doc-
>
>This is illegal HTML. That Netscape crashes on it may be considered a
>bug, but a <META> tag is allowed only within the <HEAD>.
>
>I like Netscape-bashing as much as anyone else :), but show me some legal
>code that crashes it, or that it mangles, and I'll be more impressed.
I have managed that with a <TABLE BORDER=2001> once. Yes, it is illegal HTML
(in HTML 3, BORDER is a boolean attribute without arguments),
but at least it is legal `NHTML'. The result: Netscrape (under Unix/X11)
used up all swap space it could get, and when it was used up, died of
bus error. And it slowed down the X server to the point of unusablity.
Big Dave Schmitt
: From the Holy Book of <3v022f$k...@clarknet.clark.net>
: as spake by mikebat@.clark.net (Mike Batchelor) :
: >I like Netscape-bashing as much as anyone else :), but show me some legal
: >code that crashes it, or that it mangles, and I'll be more impressed.
: On that note, has anyone tried viewing the Netscape-Proof Page
: <http://www.montefiore.ulg.ac.be/~quinet/nonetscape-en.html> with
: Netscape 1.2? I'm curious to see if the bug it exploits is still
: present.
Yes, version 1.2b3 for MS-Windows still shows nothing beyond the
<IMG SRC=internal-external-reconnect ALT="[Netscape-B-Gon® V1.0]">
on your page, even with image auto-loading off. I had to view the
source to copy it d:)
--
Big Dave Schmitt (__)
Math Major / CS Minor / UCS Consultant U of Md Balto Co (oo)------\
dsc...@gl.umbc.edu http://www.gl.umbc.edu/~dschmi1 \/ | \
Everything above is based solely on my own opinions. ||---w|| *