Calling all AppleWin Developers and Users!
Michael
I see that there a few variations on AppleWin floating around.
Instead of us wasting duplicated efforts, it would be more efficient if
we could pool our resources, and produce one superior AppleWin. I've
already contacted Tom, and am slowly incorporating my debugger
enhancments to his codebase.
I propose that,
1. We should contact all [AppleWin] developers, and see if they are
interested in joining.
i.e.
http://apple2.org.za/gswv/a2zine/Sel/A2DevelopersAtWork.htm
Has anyone heard from Terry Hsu?
It looks like Oliver Schmidt is no longer doing dev, and his changes
have been rolled into Tom's AppleWin.
2. We a need a list of all known AppleWin variations, and a master
table of what features they have. I can compile this list if people
can point me to the proper download links.
i.e. I just found Rich's Robowin, today. He has a neat feature where
the MHz can be dialed below 1 Mhz. etc.
3. We should solicit / compile notes from the (end) users, and make a
WishList. Currently, I see that a few people are asking for:
* (better) Printer support
* Better/Improved Debugging, including
** Source Level Debugging
** Custom symbols
** Run-time memory names / types.
i.e.
int8 str @ 7ecb
str = 100
4. There has been talk of moving one of the AppleWin's codebase over to
SourceForge. Along with source code revision control, it would also
provide a "official" place to track changes, features, etc.
Any other ideas?
Would a wiki be useful ?
Cheers
Linards Ticmanis
> * (better) Printer support
> * Better/Improved Debugging, including
Let me add:
* Better colors (I can provide a RGB table)
* Better emulation of NTSC, "sliding window" method as used in yae 0.6
(and as used in the Apple IIeuroplus PAL encoder card)
* "Scanline" mode where every other line is either darker or completely
black.
* 13-sector Disk emulation
--
Linards Ticmanis
Linards Ticmanis
> Let me add [...]
By the way, what do you need to compile AppleWin? I might do some of
this myself, but I don't have a C compiler for Windows.
--
Linards Ticmanis
Oliver Schmidt
>It looks like Oliver Schmidt is no longer doing dev, and his changes
>have been rolled into Tom's AppleWin.
that's correct, Oliver
Poake
@newsread4.arcor-online.net:
> Linards Ticmanis wrote:
>
>> Let me add [...]
>
> By the way, what do you need to compile AppleWin? I might do some of
> this myself, but I don't have a C compiler for Windows.
>
I believe it's MS Visual C++ 6.0. I use Visual Studio 2003 & 2005 to
compile it myself. You need the DirectX SDK and the platform SDK if you use
2005.
Lyrical Nanoha
Be nice if one could use mingw. Though I do have warezed VC6, mingw is
free...
-uso.
Bill Martens
2.0 (Oliver was on that project I believe). The project sounded like a good
idea but from an outside perspective, it appears that too many cooks spoiled
the stew as the version that was being worked on never was released.
I would say that the people who should participate would be as follows from
my notes
Steve Nicolas
Tom Charlesworth
James Lee
These are the only people I have seen release versions that worked and that
were widely used.
(Of course Oliver did too but as you said yourself Oliver, you no longer do
dev.)
I havent heard hide nor hair of Terry in years but I imagine he could be
found if I look through my email archives.
I would say that there might be one or two other good programmers out there
who could most likely contribute greatly to the project, but those are the
ones I would start with.
IMHO
--BillM
www.callapple.org
"Michael" <michael....@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1137908602....@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Lyrical Nanoha
> Steve Nicolas
Was there another person by that name? Only person I know by that name is
me (Steve Nickolas) and I didn't work on AppleWin, I worked on
EMU][/Dapple. (Though, it is AppleWin I am championing now, as I hit a
wall with SDDapple and EMU][ has gone dead also.)
-uso.
Bill Martens
spelling.)
James lee was the other one I mentioned and he wrote Applewin for the Pocket
PC.
"Lyrical Nanoha" <Lyrica...@dosius.net> wrote in message
news:Pine.LNX.4.62.06...@static-141-149-129-16.buff.east.verizon.net...
Linards Ticmanis
>> By the way, what do you need to compile AppleWin? I might do some of
>> this myself, but I don't have a C compiler for Windows.
>
> I believe it's MS Visual C++ 6.0. I use Visual Studio 2003 & 2005 to
> compile it myself. You need the DirectX SDK and the platform SDK if you use
> 2005.
Ok thanks, seems I'm out then :-(. Is it impossible to compile with a
free software compiler?
--
Linards Ticmanis
Michael
(The Direct SDK and Platform SDK are also free downloads from MS.)
i.e.
http://www.winprog.org/tutorial/msvc.html
Cheers
--
"How much C would a sea slug code if a sea slug could code C?"
Poake
Actually, I did try the Visual Studio C++ Express 2005 and it compiled
although I had to add a header to every file that was complaining.
Express is free to download and use.
Michael
Yeah, I'm not exactly happy with the (HGR and Debugger) colors either,
so I'd be interested in collecting "Alternatives"
On my TODO list is the ability to enter the debugger, and be able to
change the RGB (for both the HGR ad Debugger) colors on the fly.
Once Tom gets over my shock of my AW_Debug cleanup & features (hehe),
I'll probably go ahead and add in the hooks for this once I finish up
saving / loading the debugger config.
sicklittlemonkey
shadows. And there may be any number of reasons why they haven't
visibly contributed to AppleWin.
For instance I've co-written Apple II emulators for RISC OS, Windows
and Pocket PC (actually Windows CE 2.11 - back in 1999?) and
contributed a couple of things to MESS.
Of course, AppleWin is great, and I'd also like to contribute in a few
small ways, but it's a pity its licensing is confusing and not
explicitly open source. The other biggie is that it's Windows only -
though I'm pleased to hear it might work under WINE on Linux.
Cheers,
Nick.
sicklittlemonkey
MICROSOFT SOFTWARE LICENSE TERMS, particularly section 2.iii:
"... You may not ... modify or distribute the source code of any
Distributable Code so that any part of it becomes subject to an
Excluded License. An Excluded License is one that requires, as a
condition of use, modification or distribution, that
- the code be disclosed or distributed in source code form; or
- others have the right to modify it."
This includes e.g. all sample code. BEWARE!
Cheers,
Nick.
sicklittlemonkey
Ah, yeah. For _ONE_YEAR_. After that, cross your fingers!
Cheers,
Nick.
Poake
news:1138024246.6...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
From the MSDN faq:
11. You said “free for one year” — what does that mean, exactly? Will
you be charging for this later?
We originally announced pricing of Visual Studio Express at US$49. We
are now offering Visual Studio Express for free, as a limited-in-time
promotional offer, until November 6, 2006. Note that we are also
offering SQL Server 2005 Express Edition as a free download, and that
this offer is not limited to the same promotional pricing period as
Visual Studio Express.
12. Do customers who acquire the Visual Studio Express products during
the free promotional pricing period have to pay after the first year if
they want to continue to use them?
No, as long as you download Visual Studio Express on or before November
7th 2006, you will not have to pay for it.
=============
It's free. As for the restrictions, well my legalize isn't that good but
I don't see the problem if there is one. I have a copy of VS 2005 and I
tried the Express version to see what was missing. It lacks a few things
but for a c++ compiler it's pretty decent. So is the C# Express offering
for people interested in that.
Michael
They really are anti-GPL with that inclusion. But then again, I'm not
surprised; this is M$ ;-)
Are people really that strapped for cash that they can't scour eBay for
a cheap copy of "Visual C++ professional" ? ;-)
Anyone tried OpenWatcom ?
http://www.openwatcom.org/
List of Free compilers...
http://www.thefreecountry.com/compilers/cpp.shtml
Thx for the heads-up Nick!
sicklittlemonkey
Whatever M$ are saying now, their future policies could significantly
raise the barrier of entry to anyone who wants to contribute to a
project based on these tools.
In fact I used Visual Studio professionally for years, so I'm all too
familiar with M$'s strategies here. Their C++ compiler has come a long
way, and C# and the CLI are cool, but people who buy into these "free"
versions now will end up paying for it somehow down the line.
In the case of AppleWin, I guess it's good news for now. ;-)
Cheers,
Nick.
Linards Ticmanis
> In the case of AppleWin, I guess it's good news for now. ;-)
Still, I'd be happier if using MinGW (or Cygwin) was possible. Can't
really be all that hard to adapt the source code, can it?
--
Linards Ticmanis
Andy McFadden
> Still, I'd be happier if using MinGW (or Cygwin) was possible. Can't
> really be all that hard to adapt the source code, can it?
If you build it with Cygwin, you're subject to Cygwin licensing
restrictions on the binary you distribute, because you have to include
the Cygwin DLL. You can sort of get around with with "MinGW mode".
The trouble with MinGW is that it's a lot more limited than Cygwin, and
it tends to break in ways that are hard to debug. Resizing a terminal
window will occasionally cause the window to freeze up. It's not a solid
product.
The best approach is to get it working with Cygwin and hope it just works
under MinGW. Sometimes there are some magic flags that you just have to
know about (e.g. if you use threads and exceptions there's a special
compiler flag you need to give to gcc for MinGW).
I'm not familiar with the AppleWin source code, but things can get annoying
if it uses bits of native assembly code, because the way MSVC++ and gcc
handle assembly is different. Another big concern is whether or not all
"interesting" Windows features are included in the Cygwin/MinGW header files.
--
Send mail to fad...@fadden.com (Andy McFadden) - http://www.fadden.com/
CD-Recordable FAQ - http://www.cdrfaq.org/
CiderPress Apple II archive utility for Windows - http://www.faddensoft.com/
Fight Internet Spam - http://spam.abuse.net/spam/ & http://spamcop.net/
joh...@tmfc.net
come to join if it become GPL?
I see some people out there improving MESS, no idea how good MESS's
Apple is, but what if entire AppleWin changed to free compiler such as
OpenWatcom, free GUI such as wxWindows (wxWidgets now).
When someone realize can be port AppleWin to other platform, maybe more
developers can help improving it (I hope Tom don't mind).
Linards Ticmanis
>> By the way, what do you need to compile AppleWin? I might do some of
>> this myself, but I don't have a C compiler for Windows.
>>
>
> I believe it's MS Visual C++ 6.0. I use Visual Studio 2003 & 2005 to
> compile it myself. You need the DirectX SDK and the platform SDK if you use
> 2005.
Thanks, I got it working now (after a lot of fiddling and some error
fixing) with Visual C++ Express 2005, and the current Platform & DirectX
SDKs. Another two gigs of MS Bloatware filling up my hard drive...
Boy, this code has been through some rough times. Talk about
convolution. ;-)
Managed to get the improved colors in without any problems. Now working
on improving speaker sound, the same way I did in yae... Set standard
system speed to 1014300 (23*44100) instead of 1020484, then count how
many cycles of every unit of 23 the speaker is on and use that as sample
value. Works great with tough cases such as Ghostbusters, Legend of
Blacksilver and RT.SYNTH.
Next would be better graphics algorithms, using "sliding window"
hold&modify system, and lowered brightness on every 2nd line.
But don't hold your breath, I can't promise anything coming out of this.
--
Linards Ticmanis
aiia...@gmail.com
>convolution. ;-)
Please keep in touch with Tom C. while modifying the code!
It seems it must be in bad shape, so many people have started
work on it in the last few years, then quit the project..
Rich
Linards Ticmanis
>> Boy, this code has been through some rough times. Talk about
>> convolution. ;-)
>
>
> Please keep in touch with Tom C. while modifying the code!
Sure, I don't plan to release anything to the public, rather I planned
to give any changes to Tom, and if he likes them he can include them.
> It seems it must be in bad shape, so many people have started
> work on it in the last few years, then quit the project..
Sure, it just looks like any code will look after it has been modified
many, many times by many different people.
--
Linards Ticmanis
Michael
That brings back some memories of reading that huge poster of "Murphy's
Laws for Computer" ;-)
That's a great idea for the debugger! I've put it on my TODO list.
Cheers
Linards Ticmanis
Actually I meant every 2nd line of pixels, not every 2nd line of text.
As you will know every Apple video line is displayed twice, on top of
each other, in almost all emulators. Otherwise the emulated screen would
be much too small. The idea is to create a more TV-like appearance by
reducing the brightness of every "bottom" line of such a pair of
otherwise-identical lines.
--
Linards Ticmanis
TomCh
>
> Boy, this code has been through some rough times. Talk about
> convolution. ;-)
>
carefully try to maintain compliance with this 10-year old code base.
> Managed to get the improved colors in without any problems. Now working
> on improving speaker sound, the same way I did in yae... Set standard
> system speed to 1014300 (23*44100) instead of 1020484, then count how
> many cycles of every unit of 23 the speaker is on and use that as sample
> value. Works great with tough cases such as Ghostbusters, Legend of
> Blacksilver and RT.SYNTH.
>
This is what it already does (effectively). OK, the CPU is CLK'd at
14M/14, but the speaker emu uses 23 Apple cycles for every PC
sound-sample.
IMO, it already works great with tough tests like RT.SYNTH, Archon (I &
II) :-)
Things just get hairy when the emulator auto-switches to Full-Speed
mode (during disk activity(*)). In this mode (also activated by
Scroll-Lock) I mute all sound, as the emulation doesn't run at a fixed
clock-rate.
[(*) I know that there won't be sound output during disk activity...
but the DirectX circ-playback buffer lags behind, so there could be
millisecs of sound still to output when the disk is activated.]
Ideally all sound streams (Speaker, MB, speech) should be merged by AW.
This would fix the problem with the speaker playback problem if MB is
playing.
Tom
Poake
> Poake wrote:
>
>>> By the way, what do you need to compile AppleWin? I might do some of
>>> this myself, but I don't have a C compiler for Windows.
>>>
>>
>> I believe it's MS Visual C++ 6.0. I use Visual Studio 2003 & 2005 to
>> compile it myself. You need the DirectX SDK and the platform SDK if
>> you use 2005.
>
> Thanks, I got it working now (after a lot of fiddling and some error
> fixing) with Visual C++ Express 2005, and the current Platform &
> DirectX SDKs. Another two gigs of MS Bloatware filling up my hard
> drive...
>
For others reference, I believe this is all the changes needed to get it
to work with 2005 Express
Visual Studio 2005 and Express editions
aw_video.cpp
Line 444
from: for (pixel = 0; pixel < 13; pixel++)
to : for (int pixel = 0; pixel < 13; pixel++)
Line 488
from: for (pixel = 2; pixel < 9; pixel++) {
to : for (int pixel = 2; pixel < 9; pixel++) {
aw_Mockingboard.cpp
Line 1230
from: for(i=0; i<NUM_AY8910; i++)
to : for(int i=0; i<NUM_AY8910; i++)
Visual C++ 2005 Express Edition only
Applewin.cpp & All AW_*.cpp files, add the following include above
other includes
#include "tchar.h"
At least, that's what I did with the Express problem.
Ingo_R...@yahoo.com
I wrote my own AppleWin Emulator. First I ported version 1.40 to Delphi
(v6.0) in order to understand how does the AppleWin emulator works.
Afterwards I starting from scratch making a new AppleWin Emulator
written in Delphi. If someone is planning to create a development group
for a new AppleWin project you can count on me for assistence or put me
on the Delphi portion. My AppleWin Emulator supports Z80 emulation. You
can even run CP/M Plus resp. CP/M 3.0 (with bank switching). That CP/M
version was running on a Z80B or Z80H (6/8 Mhz) CPU. Within CP/M I
emulate also a RTC (Real Time Clock) card. Moreover a RAMWORKS III card
up to 16 MByte is supported. Nine different Hires Color option I spend
for my Emulator. In each graphic mode you can set scanlines. Also in
the monochrome mode the scanline option is working fine. In the
configuration part you can change the monochrome's color. Of course,
mockingboard is also supported. And so on...
If somebody is interested in the Delphi (v6.0 and 7.0) version of
Applwin 1.40 source code then I will give it to public by sending me an
e-mail.
I not quite sure but maybe I am willing to give my "extended" version
of AppleWin to public, too. The coding of the extended version of
AppleWin is completely new. It is written on non-VCL basis. Meaning
there is no object orientated stuff in. The 65C02 and Z80H CPU
emulation is written in Delphi's assembler.
Cheers, Ingo.
Michael
Hi Ingo,
You have a link? I'd like to take a look at what you've done!
Cheers
HansO
>If somebody is interested in the Delphi (v6.0 and 7.0) version of
>Applwin 1.40 source code then I will give it to public by sending me an
>e-mail.
Please publish it!
Hans, http://www.hansotten.com
Poake
@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
I emailed him as well and so far no reply. This is definately something
I'd be very interested in looking at.
Ingo_R...@yahoo.com
I put my Delphi portion to public, now. It is based on veriosn 1.40 of
AppleWin. I started my version with 4.10.5. It resides at asimov. Here
is the complete link:
ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/incoming/WinApple_4.10.5.zip
If you have any question then give me just a shout via mail.
Next I am going to prepare a previous version of my Apple //e Platinum
Emulator with supporting all CP/M versions. Even CP/M Plus with memory
bank switching. That preparation can take a while, let's say up to 3
weeks, because I'm a normal worker. I should better say I'm a
consultant.
Cheers, Ingo.
The
Poake
news:1140826670.2...@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com:
> Hi Hans, Michael and Poake,
>
> I put my Delphi portion to public, now. It is based on veriosn 1.40 of
> AppleWin. I started my version with 4.10.5. It resides at asimov. Here
> is the complete link:
> ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/incoming/WinApple_4.10.5.zip
>
> If you have any question then give me just a shout via mail.
>
> Next I am going to prepare a previous version of my Apple //e Platinum
> Emulator with supporting all CP/M versions. Even CP/M Plus with memory
> bank switching. That preparation can take a while, let's say up to 3
> weeks, because I'm a normal worker. I should better say I'm a
> consultant.
>
> Cheers, Ingo.
>
Argh, the dreaded Asimov incoming directory. Can anyone fish that out?
Ingo, thanks greatly for releasing your code. I hope to mess around with it
soon.
Regards.
Linards Ticmanis
> Hi Hans, Michael and Poake,
>
> I put my Delphi portion to public, now. It is based on veriosn 1.40 of
> AppleWin. I started my version with 4.10.5. It resides at asimov. Here
> is the complete link:
> ftp://ftp.apple.asimov.net/pub/apple_II/incoming/WinApple_4.10.5.zip
Thanks! Unfortunately files in that directory aren't downloadable. Thus
we'll have to wait until they get moved by the Gods of Asimov, which
noadays means waiting almost forever, unfortunately. Who maintains that
server anyway (in theory I mean, in practice nobody seems to maintain it)?
--
Linards Ticmanis
Ingo_R...@yahoo.com
do you know some other places where I can leave me WinApple_4.10.5.zip
file ?
Cheers, Ingo.
Linards Ticmanis
> Hi Linards,
>
> do you know some other places where I can leave me WinApple_4.10.5.zip
> file ?
Personally I don't (don't have any webspace) but I think some of the
others here could be willing to help out. After all it's a Good Thing to
get a good and free emulator out into the world.
Any takers?
--
Linards Ticmanis
BluPhoenyx
I could host it on my earthlink account. Don't know for sure if there
are any traffic issues. Haven't used that part of this account yet.
Cheers,
Mike T.
aiia...@gmail.com
I will make an APpleWin specific page if anyone
wants it. It only takes about 20 minutes.
Rich
Poake
@newsread2.arcor-online.net:
pages.google.com is active now and give gmail account users a personal
webspace to upload files and have a basic web page. It's 1999 all over
again =p but it's free public storage.
Rubywand
I think Modus still runs Asimov. The delay from uploading to having a file
appear in the main "unsorted" directory has usually been pretty brief.
As to sorting stuff out of "unsorted", who can say? That directory is
huge! At least, though, the stuff is there to download.
Rubywand
Rubywand
Once it appears in Asimov's "unsorted" folder, I'll add it to the
collection of Applewins on GS WorldView at ...
http://apple2.org.za/gswv/a2zine/Utils/ .
Rubywand
Linards Ticmanis
> I think Modus still runs Asimov. The delay from uploading to having a file
> appear in the main "unsorted" directory has usually been pretty brief.
Well, there's still stuff from last September in there. And some stuff
uploaded around that same time took more than three months to appear in
"unsorted".
I don't want to bash anybody, don't misunderstand me. It's great that
this repository exists at all.
> As to sorting stuff out of "unsorted", who can say? That directory is
> huge! At least, though, the stuff is there to download.
I wasn't referring to that. Most people with enough interest to connect
in the first place should be able to sort this out.
--
Linards Ticmanis
Ingo_R...@yahoo.com
Heybirder (heyb...@gmail.com) sent me an E-mail:
>> Ingo,
>>
>> As was posted on usenet, files in the incoming directory on Asimov can't be
>> downloaded until they are moved out - which could take months. Would it be
>> possible to upload it to my ftp area? I will a web link available for
>> comp.emulators.apple2 people.
So I uploaded the file WinApple_4.10.5.zip on his ftp server
ftp.swaxhog.com.
Now, I am hoping he will provide as with a proper link.
Cheers, Ingo.
Heybirder
news:1142114959.4...@j52g2000cwj.googlegroups.com:
> All,
>
> Heybirder (heyb...@gmail.com) sent me an E-mail:
>
>>> Ingo,
>>>
>>> As was posted on usenet, files in the incoming directory on Asimov
>>> can't be downloaded until they are moved out - which could take
>>> months. Would it be possible to upload it to my ftp area? I will a
>>> web link available for comp.emulators.apple2 people.
>
> So I uploaded the file WinApple_4.10.5.zip on his ftp server
> ftp.swaxhog.com.
> Now, I am hoping he will provide as with a proper link.
>
> Cheers, Ingo.
>
Much appreciated Ingo.
I've made it available here:
http://apple2.swaxhog.com/WinApple_4.10.5.zip
I will keep hosting the file until Asimov makes it accessible.
Lyrical Nanoha
> Much appreciated Ingo.
>
> I've made it available here:
>
> http://apple2.swaxhog.com/WinApple_4.10.5.zip
>
> I will keep hosting the file until Asimov makes it accessible.
OMFG, this is almost an exact replica of AppleWin, didn't think it could
be pulled off so closely in Delphi as in C++.
-uso.
Michael
Pascal and C are very similiar Same with Delphi and C++.
What's impressive is that someone spent the time porting it to another
language ;-)