[ANN] GOOSEE v1.2 uploaded
void
Free visual program design, project management/documentor,
with auto C code generation.
GOOSEE evolution has surged ahead -- checkout the
exciting new features of v1.2.
Go to:
http://www4.tpg.com.au/users/void/bkauler
Regards,
Barry Kauler
Alf Katz
book and have read through it and can't help asking myself "Why?". It seems
to me just a different way of writing the same structured code, without a
higher level of abstraction to make comprehension, any easier. Kauler,
himself, seems very excited by it, but I'd be more convinced if there was a
little discussion elsewhere. I'm also a more than a little scared by one of
his perceived plusses "the rapid evolution of GOOSEE".
--
Regards,
Alf Katz,
alf...@removethis.ieee.org
"void" <vo...@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:eoJ06.254$G4....@newsread2.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Kevin
> Anybody out there in embedded land actually using this?
I'm not in the habit of downloading things called "GOOSEE" from a person that
identifies themselves as "void". Personally, I wouldn't put this product in the
back of my truck.
Kevin
Steven Murray
news:3A454CA6...@inficad.com...
Well I know my say-so probably doesn't count for
much to you either, but I know Barry Kauler through
business contacts, and I can vouch for him -
still haven't used GOOSEE myself, however.
Personally, I am getting hit by 20-30 spams a day - including
one or two trojans a week, mostly from posting to newsgroups
I imagine - and I am about at the point of posting with 'void'
as my reply-to also. It's getting to the point where a lot of
my dial-in download limit is chewed up by the Spam I receive!
Regards
Steve
www.airborn.com.au
Llewellyn Griffiths
about GOOFEE and I thought that the methodology described was quite aptly
named. The book reminded me of that dilbert cartoon about incomprehensible
diagrams.
Perhaps Kauler has an offbeat sense of humour?
Llew Griffiths
--------------------------------
LLEWELLYN GRIFFITHS
Llew Griffiths & Associates Pty Limited
Melbourne, Australia
info AT llga DOT com DOT au
The reply address is a black hole for spam
"Alf Katz" <alf...@removethis.ieee.org> wrote in message
news:7cW06.18951$Xx3....@news1.eburwd1.vic.optushome.com.au...
Laurent UHRES
Dedicated Systems Magazine (www.dedicated-systems.com).
Laurent UHRES
Llewellyn Griffiths <nos...@llga.com.mars> wrote in message
news:9244ta$86p$1...@perki.connect.com.au...
Chris Hills
Have the book and the tools. Whilst I would not use them because I have
access to (expensive) professional tools there is nothing inherently
wrong with GOOSEE. There are other things on the web site that would be
of use to SW developers.
I agree that using an email name of "void" is not a good idea.
Regards
Chris
Kevin <kkilzer.r...@inficad.com> writes
/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills Staffs England /\/\/\/\/\
/\/\/ ch...@phaedsys.org www.phaedsys.org \/\/
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/
Dwayne Childers
I checked out the last version. The visual interface is very comfortable
and natural.
However, I couldn't see how to use it for developing application software.
Is Goosee intended mainly for embedded systems? Is the format documented,
so e.g. we could write code-generating software in other languages?
ChrisQ
Hmm, and for your next objective, analytical comment ?...
Chris
void
Dwayne Childers <dchi...@nycap.rr.com> wrote in message
news:t4nnd58...@corp.supernews.com...
Hi, this is "void" responding,
There are several people that I know of using GOOSEE in a hobby
capacity. Maybe others that haven't contacted me. I don't know of
anyone using it professionally.
The current implementation of the small-GOO visual language, in the
GOOSEE software development tool, is only a thin visual layer over C
-- you are really quite close to the C code at all times, so there are no
surprises. If you can program in C, you can use GOOSEE.
As to whether you would or not, that's another matter. Some people
have told me that there are programmers who are "visually oriented"
and those who aren't -- the latter will prefer to stick with code
(someone told me that there is an actual difference in the brain).
Anyway, it's free. A completely free visual design and documentation
tool should not be hurriedly criticised especially if you don't know
anything about it. My book, incidentally, is way out of date, and should
not be used as a basis for evaluating GOOSEE. All necessary docs
are now on-line.
And how can it be compared with commercial tools out there that cost
$10,000?
My critical assessment of my own product, wearing my user's hat, is that
it is a useful visual front-end and documentor, but is weak in the
round-trip
of the development cycle. That is, you generate the code from a GOOSEE
diagram, then you compile and go to a debugger/emulator/simulator. But if
you want to make a small change to the code, you have to go right back to
the GOOSEE diagram to make the change, whereas what you would prefer
is to modify the code directly -- you can of course directly modify the
code,
but then the GOO diagram is no longer correct.
I don't know how general-purpose $10,000 visual program design tools
solve this problem, though I have read about development tools that are
two-way, so a change to the generated code automatically reflects back
into the diagrams.
Regards,
Barry Kauler
Dwayne Childers
>>Anyway, it's free. A completely free visual design and documentation tool
should not be hurriedly criticised especially if you don't know anything about
it. <<
Of course not. They were questions, not criticisms. I have a lot of respect
and gratitude for your work in the past, most notably your Windows assembler
book and code.
There's a specific motivation for the question. I've worked with a CASE tool
for several years, Dbsee++, which is used to design and generate database
applications in Visual C. Recently (about 8 months ago, the project is taking
very long), I started developing software to generate code in other languages,
including MASM, Perl/Tk, Fivewin (an Xbase derivative), and Lcc-Win32.
Ultimately, I would like to place this into the public domain. Possibly not all
of the language options will generate complete applications, especially at the
beginning, but for example the MASM code will have the menus and dialog boxes,
at least, until I figure a way to integrate the database access code in MASM
(using Iczelion's tools, and optionally Randy's HLA language to help accomplish
all of this).
The problem is that Dbsee++ itself is a commercial package. Dbsee++ will remain
as one of the CASE options, but it would be good to have a free CASE option as
well. I have no desire to develop a RAD/CASE/design GUI, would rather use
something that's already been tested and works pretty well.
So, in summary, I'm keeping the eyes and ears out for a freeware GUI tool to use
for application development to plug into a freeware code generator.
>>I don't know how general-purpose $10,000 visual program design tools solve
this problem, though I have read about development tools that are two-way...<<
The specific tool mentioned above, Dbsee++, has reverse-engineering
capabilities. You don't modify the code directly, but rather place your
user-defined code in special slots in the GUI.
Actually, you can also modify the code directly, but you need to surround it
with special delimiting strings. You can then pull it back into the Dbsee++
repository, and continue designing or just regenerate everything. The tool
itself, by the way, was about $1,000 when I bought it a few years ago.
So, if you know of any CASE tools that seem to fit the bill, Barry/Mr. void/sir,
let me know when you get a chance. Good luck with Goosee.
Regards,
Dwayne Childers
bitRAKE
At a deep level I am aware that I 'see' everything in my brain in a visual
sense. I've always assumed that others were the same and had to be taught
to think in other terms. I think that the eyes came first and then the
languages :) I played with your program for a little bit - really cool! Do
you know if anyone has tried to represent assembly language - I guess it
would be machine code, because assemble language is the mnemonics; but it
could be easily converted to assembly :) So, what I'm asking is what do
you think of the possibility of a Graphical Assembly language, or has it
been done? I don't see much activity on comp.lang.visual , is there a
better place to get information on the visual languages that are available?
Thank you for your time, bitRAKE.
"void" <vo...@tpg.com.au> wrote in message
news:EAn36.50571$RC1.1...@newsread1.prod.itd.earthlink.net...
Beth
void wrote:
> Some people have told me that there are programmers who are "visually
oriented" and
> those who aren't -- the latter will prefer to stick with code (someone
told me that there is
> an actual difference in the brain).
Yup...I did a little biology in school once and this is the case...different
people have different internal ways of thinking...it has been attributed by
some that Einstein's brilliance was partly due to the fact that his brain
had a large visual cortex which meant he could visualise stuff easier than
most...
One of the team that helped with the design of the first silicon chips has
confessed that he actually developed some of the design while on LSD, as he
found that he could better "see" how things worked in his head...he claims
that he actually created complete working models of primitive chips inside
his head...(note: Beth does not endorse drugs...this is just something I saw
on a BCC documentary once ;)...LSD, roughly speaking, temporarily wires up
your brain all wrong (or, permanently, if you take too much or take it too
often - you have been warned!) and parts not normally attached to one
another are linked, parts that were normally linked, broken...etc.
There are actually tests you could do to see if you're more visual, more
tactile, more audio, etc...personally, I did the tests and I'm very much
"audio" based in my thinking, apparently...which probably explains the
"stream of consciousness" and verbose way I write...not that I'm making
excuses...lol ;)
Yes, This Is "Off-Topic" But Its Short And Might Be Interesting To Some,
Beth :)
Jim Ubersetzig
I took the test and was not a visual thinker or audio thinker -- most people
are one or the other. Turns out I am a conceptual thinker - and practically
oriented ...
building software and electronics that work.
Jim Ubersetzig