Apple App Store Submission Guidelines - Artwork NSFW!!!

[Steve Warren]

Glad I caught your attention :-)

I'm working on a project that will be released for the web, android and the Apple App Store (the most restrictive venue) and I wanted to solicit some feedback. We're creating an interactive game where people engage in giving each other massages. We're in the artwork creation process, and this is what we've come up with so far. Do you think we can get away with this, or might we run into trouble with the Apple guidelines for app submission? I haven't read that yet in detail, but would value a discussion on this topic based on your experiences and instincts.

Thanks in advance,

Steve Warren

Interactive NYC

http://www.interactivenyc.com

[David Jacobs]

Where were we on the moderation/new member vetting process? 

[Michael Rentas]

You got my attention insofar as I've now spent five minutes deleting various insulting sentences about how someone could be so stupid or douchey as to send an email with an image of a nude woman attached to it to a programming mailing list and think it was funny and acceptable because you added "NSFW" at the end of your subject. Are you unaware that many email clients will display attached images inline by default? Why would you post that question to this list before even bothering to read the guidelines?

-- 
Michael Rentas
Sent with Sparrow

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[Steve Warren]

I'm sorry! I've been to meetings, but am not well known. I was posting this to the Flash Coders group where I am well known, and then I had the bright idea to include CocoaHeadsNYC without properly vetting the thought.

My sincere apologies. Flame away, or call my cellphone to tell me what a douchebag I am.

917-640-1549.

Steve Warren

http://www.interactivenyc.com

[Natalie Podrazik]

Steve, I don't think you're a douchebag.  You just caught us off-guard!  

I don't know how Apple would react to this, but, if you can walk up to a complete stranger (female) on the street and show her this image without feeling like a creep, then maybe it would fly.  

What's the male image look like?  </trolling>

[Steve Warren]

PS - I didn't do this to be funny. I'm actually working on a real project where this is an issue. I would appreciate any feedback people have on the subject, and try to keep the conversation civilized.

Once again, I am truly sorry for not thinking with my head. The one above my shoulders, that is ;-)

Steve Warren

[Michael Rentas]

Just exercise a bit of thought. Post a link rather than attaching the image. Ask your question in more general terms ("is nudity allowed in apps under any circumstances", perhaps?).

The review guidelines are on the dev site at https://developer.apple.com/appstore/resources/approval/guidelines.html. I expect you'll have trouble with the following:

• We have lots of kids downloading lots of apps, and parental controls don't work unless the parents set them up (many don't). So know that we're keeping an eye out for the kids.
• We have over 350,000 apps in the App Store. We don't need any more Fart apps. If your app doesn't do something useful or provide some form of lasting entertainment, it may not be accepted.
• We will reject Apps for any content or behavior that we believe is over the line. What line, you ask? Well, as a Supreme Court Justice once said, "I'll know it when I see it". And we think that you will also know it when you cross it.

If you're actually asking for feedback, I'd encourage you to make something a little more tasteful. What audience are you trying to reach?

-- 
Michael Rentas
Sent with Sparrow

[David Jacobs]

Just to back up Natalie's point, I think you should be less worried
about Apple, and more worried about the "you know it when you see it"
sort of concerns. (see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I_know_it_when_I_see_it )

Clearly it's inappropriate, and clearly it will be rejected.

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[Gabe Ghearing]

I'd give it a 15% chance of not getting smacked down during review; there is reason for the nudity and it's really cartoony(you'd have to be an 11yr old boy to find that sexy).

You have about the same percent chance of getting rejected every time you send an update in though...

- Gabe

[Andy Lee]

On May 18, 2012, at 3:55 PM, David Jacobs wrote:
> Where were we on the moderation/new member vetting process?

I turned off moderation but Steve is not a first-time poster so he wouldn't have gone to moderation in any case.

Steve, I agree (with you among others) that it was an error to include the image inline. It's been suggested that you should have posted a link and told us what we were about to look at. In addition I would suggest putting the "NSFW" at the *beginning* of the subject line where it wouldn't be cropped as it was for me.

I'm going to assume this was a one-time honest mistake (I know they happen) unless you start posting images every day with comments like "Hey, do you think this looks too much like a wee-wee?"

In answer to your question, I'm not an expert on Apple's review process but it seems obvious to me the image would have a slim-to-none chance of passing. I'd say the very *premise* of the app skates on thin ice, but I'm reminded of an app that a friend dashed off a while back that offers a different kind of therapeutic touch:

<http://itunes.apple.com/us/app/ibooboo/id335445494?mt=8>
> Do you have a boo-boo? Do you need someone to kiss it and make you feel better? Let iBooBoo provide you with instant relief!

(Safe for work.)

--Andy

[Andy Lee]

On May 18, 2012, at 4:35 PM, Natalie Podrazik wrote:
> Steve, I don't think you're a douchebag. You just caught us off-guard!
>
> I don't know how Apple would react to this, but, if you can walk up to a complete stranger (female) on the street and show her this image without feeling like a creep, then maybe it would fly.

Seems a really good test for all sorts of behavior.

> What's the male image look like? </trolling>

:) A very good question, but I think Steve's got enough answers for now.

--Andy

[Benjamin Ragheb]

On May 18, 2012, at 3:49 PM, Steve Warren wrote:

We're in the artwork creation process, and this is what we've come up with so far. Do you think we can get away with this, or might we run into trouble with the Apple guidelines for app submission? I haven't read that yet in detail, but would value a discussion on this topic based on your experiences and instincts.

Look for precedent. Browse through other apps in the store that deal with human anatomy and see how they approach it. There are probably a few examples in the health/medical section.

Asking around on mailing lists is a waste of yours and other people's time. It is 2012. You have access to hundreds of thousands of examples of things that were approved by Apple. Since Apple won't answer questions ahead of time, you have no better source of information.

This goes for anybody asking "do you think this will be approved" questions.

-- Ben

[Steve Warren]

Thanks for all your feedback. We've done another round of artwork, and have toned it down substantially and provided some "health spa" context around the image to make it more palatable and reduce the chance of being rejected by the app store.

Would you mind taking a look and letting us know what you think? Here's a link to the graphic:

http://www.interactivenyc.com/clients/saltvault/table_female_face_revised.png

Thanks in advance for your replies!

Steve Warren

http://www.interactivenyc.com

[Andy Lee]

Note that Steve sent this on Friday. I only just learned it was held up by the spam filter.

--Andy

On May 19, 2012, at 2:38 AM, Steve Warren wrote:

Thanks for everybody's feedback - it's useful for us at this stage to receive your comments, and more are appreciated on or off list.

This app idea came to me from a good old friend. At first, I wasn't interested in working on the project because I mostly do apps for kids and young adults in the education and entertainment markets, and I didn't want to tarnish my reputation! In the beginning, the idea was geared more towards the soft-porn, goofy, adult male audience, and I tried to foist the work off onto another colleague who I thought might do it for the money, or the opportunity to create an edgy project, but he declined. My friend came back to me and kept saying, "I know you don't want to do this work, but please - let me ask for more advice and help finding developers." I've known this guy for almost 40 years - he was a friend of my uncle, and used to come over and swim in our pool in Carmel Valley, California - a time and place where clothing at the pool were strictly optional. I started suggesting that he tone down the concept, as it would never fly through the App Store in it's original form. I said, let's go for a more therapeutic spa look and feel, and try to make the game fun - something people might actually want to play. We're still in design phase at this time, and need help and ideas to make this work. Thanks for your tolerance, and not hastily booting me off the list - something I've seen happen on other close-knit forums I belong to, where people know each other and don't always agree on how to behave.

I look forward to seeing some of you at future meetings, and agin - thanks for your input.

Have a great weekend!

-steve