Where to live in denver?
Bob McCormick
good run down on the various neighborhood and suburbs, etc of the Denver
area? Ideally a like to find out a bit about the character of each area, as
well as things like real estate values, crime problems, accessibility to
downtown or out of town, etc. I'd prefer web-based information, but any
recommendations on good books or whatever would be greatly appreciated.
rick++
the fancy stuff in the outer suburbs.
As in most large cities these days, Denver has a terrible rush hour
traffic problem. This suggests living on the side near to work.
Denver gentrified early, so there is generally no "counter commute"
direction with favorable traffic.
And because Denver was early in the gentrification game, there
are several attractive downtown'ish areas where raising children
isn't the top priorty. These a are called Lodo, Capitol Hill
and Cherry Creek.
Other people favor the foothills, with 24-hour mountain living
and access to Denver employemnt.
Housing prices continue to increase 10-15% a year, so don't be
surprised to see the better stuff cracking $300 / square foot.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Dawn Walker
"http://www.insiders.com/denver/"
They have a run down of neighborhoods in this book, and it may be on the web
site (they publish parts of their books there).
Dawn
shorty
>I'm looking to move to the Denver area. Does anyone know where I can find a
>good run down on the various neighborhood and suburbs, etc of the Denver
>area?
drfillst...@home.com
it. Try insider's guide to Denver. They have a website.
Good luck on your move.
On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 03:11:51 GMT, "Bob McCormick" <b...@web-wide.net>
wrote:
>I'm looking to move to the Denver area. Does anyone know where I can find a
>good run down on the various neighborhood and suburbs, etc of the Denver
Socks the White House cat
address to the spam gods to say:
>Do yourself a favor. Avoid Parker Road. We moved to Golden and love
>it. Try insider's guide to Denver. They have a website.
>
>Good luck on your move.
>
Avoid the southside in general. you'll most likely want boulder county
>
>On Tue, 04 Apr 2000 03:11:51 GMT, "Bob McCormick" <b...@web-wide.net>
>wrote:
>
>>I'm looking to move to the Denver area. Does anyone know where I can find a
>>good run down on the various neighborhood and suburbs, etc of the Denver
>>area? Ideally a like to find out a bit about the character of each area, as
>>well as things like real estate values, crime problems, accessibility to
>>downtown or out of town, etc. I'd prefer web-based information, but any
>>recommendations on good books or whatever would be greatly appreciated.
>>
>>
--
--
"We've heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards
could produce the complete Works of Shakespeare; now, thanks
to the Internet, we know this is not true."
--Robert Wilensky, University of California
Dan Tasman
Northwest Denver (Sloans Lake, Highlands, West Highland, Berkeley) -- young
professionals, starving artists, angry lesbians, old timers, a decreasing
number of Hispanic families. Gentrifying rapidly, and becoming
unaffordable. Everything from turn-of-the-century mansions to 1920s
bungalows to 1950s tract homes. Diverse as hell -- you'll either wake up
to ranchero music, Harleys, performance artists or barking dogs.
_Everyone_ in Northwest Denver has a dog.
West Denver (Barnum, Harvey Park) -- poor Hispanic and/or working-to-middle
class Anglo and Vietnamese. Mostly small 1950s tract homes; very ugly
commercial corridors. Very reasonable prices by Denver standards. Off the
radar screen of most homebuyers.
Southwest Denver -- middle to upper middle class suburbia, like Aurora with
bigger signs. Prices comparable to the rest of the metro area.
Northeast Denver (City Park, Park Hill) -- everything from the
predominantly black "ghetto" (which is quite tame compared to most other
cities -- it's gentrifying, too) to upper middle class Park Hill (_very_
expensive 1920s era Arts and Crafts houses, mostly college professor
types). City Park has a lot of gentrification and young professionals.
East Central Denver (Capital Hill, Cheesman Park) -- mostly apartments and
condos, some gentrification, prices ranging from reasonable to outrageous.
Center of Denver's gay community.
Far Northeast (Montbello, Gateway, Green Valley Ranch) -- Isloated middle-
class suburbia. Montbello is Denver's cheapest neighborhood, but there's
almost no urban amenities, and some homebuyers are turned off because of
the neighborhood's perception as having a high crime rate. Gateway and
Green Valley Ranch have lots of mostly new, medium sized houses at prices
considered reasonable by Denver standards, but there's still no retail, and
you're very isolated.
East Denver -- Hilltop is _very_ expensive. Montclair and Hale are a bit
more reasonable, but still pricey for what you get. Mostly middle class
1950s and 1960s houses, with additions and teardowns in more desirable
areas. Hilltop is the center of Denver's conservative and reform Jewish
community.
Near Southeast Denver (Cherry Creek, Washington Park, Congress Park) --
rich white people who listen to smooth jazz stations while they cruise
around town in their Lexii. Small houses beign torn down for mansions
squeezed in on small lots. Very, very, very expensive -- close to Cherry
Creek North, townhouses can go for over a million bucks.
Far Southeast (Virginia Vale, etc.) -- Middle-to-upper middle class 1950s
suburbia. Some teardowns. Rather ordinary, but amazingly expensive.
South (Platt Park, University Park, Observatory Park, Baker) -- Cherry
Creek-like demographics, without the shopping. Baker is affordable and
trendy, but rough in many spots.
Central (LoDo, Downtown) -- $500,000 for 1,500 square foot lofts. Forget
it.
The suburbs --
Aurora - tale of three suburbs, one the 'hood, one straight out of Leave it
to Beaver, one where tract mansions are shoehorned into tiny lots along
golf courses. Stay south of 6th Avenue, and you'll be fine. VERY strict
zoning and covenants in most places. Your address may elicit giggles among
some, because of Aurora's perception of isolation.
Parker -- You _must_ have at least two kids to live here. Like Aurora, but
farther away, and much less diverse.
Highlands Ranch -- everything from starter homes ($180K) to mansions.
_The_ address among middle class suburbanites. New, shiny, and without
much character. Close to _lots_ of shopping.
Unicorporated Arapahoe County South ("Centennial") -- very similar to
Aurora (south of 6th), except people don't giggle when you tell them where
you live.
Englewood -- blue collar 1950s suburbia.
Littleton -- middle class 1950s suburbia, with quite a bit of character for
a Denver suburb.
Sheridan -- JERRY! JERRY! JERRY! JERRY!
Cherry Hills Village, Greenwood Village -- you can't afford it. Cherry
Hills Village is a bit more tasteful, with more "old money."
Unincorporated Jefferson County -- Send your kids to the _real_ Columbine.
Middle- to upper middle class suburbia.
Lakewood -- 1950s to 1970s suburb, quite large, economically diverse. Very
lush, relatively speaking. Doesn't seem as well planned at other 'burbs,
but those who live there _really_ seem to like it.
Wheat Ridge -- like Lakewood, except the commercial areas are perhaps the
ugliest in metro Denver. Billboard central -- you'll feel like you're in
Houston.
Arvada -- Similar to Aurora south of 6th. Has an interesting "Old Town"
area.
Westminster -- Nice, middle to upper-middle class newer suburb, filled with
"planned communities." Lots of new mega-projects intended to increase the
tax base. Lots of shopping.
Thornton -- Lower middle class to upper middle class, though not
outrageously poor or outrageously wealthy.
Northglenn -- Nice 1960s era suburb, lots of brick ranch houses.
Federal Heights -- JERRY! JERRY! JERRY!
Commerce City -- Imagine oil refineries next to trailer parks and small
1950s houses. Trying to go "upscale" with developments like Buffalo Run --
get a Highlands Ranch house at a Pueblo price, but you'll still have the
stigma of a Commerce City address.
Dawn Walker
moving to a large area. But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry" reference all
about?
Dawn
Samuel Martin Ventola
Dawn Walker wrote:
>
> Great rundown of Denver. This is the kind of information a newcomer needs when
> moving to a large area.
I agree. Damn good list, Dan.
> But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry" reference all
> about?
Dawn must mean this:
> >
> > Sheridan -- JERRY! JERRY! JERRY! JERRY!
> >. . .
> > Federal Heights -- JERRY! JERRY! JERRY!
> >
As in, the Jerry Springer Show. The answer to the question,
"where do they GET these people?"
About my previous home town Dan writes:
> >
> > Englewood -- blue collar 1950s suburbia.
> >
Pretty good description of parts of it, but some of it is
quite nice. Some parts of Englewood near SE Denver are
indistinguishable from SE Denver except for the price. Some
parts of S Englewood are pretty suburban. I'd suggest
Englewood (just S of Denver) as an alternative for those who
want to live relatively close to downtown, but don't want to
pay the high prices of the nice areas of the City of
Denver. The same could also probably be said of Lakewood
(just W of Denver) and Littleton (S of Englewood).
All of this is talking about the CITY of Englewood. There
are a lot of places with "Englewood" addresses which
actually the suburbs further East, and not the same thing at
all.
Dawn Walker
that came to my mind was Seinfeld, which made me think neurotic people, or
maybe Jerry Lewis (didn't know what to think about that one ; ). Anyway, you
should write a book, Dan. Call it "The Real Dirt on Denver's Neighborhoods
and Suburbs" or something like that. Maybe it would spark a whole series....
Some of your info is the kind of stuff that most real estate agents won't
tell you , but it's the stuff most people really want to know.
Dan Tasman wrote:
> Dawn Walker wrote
>
> >Great rundown of Denver. This is the kind of information a newcomer
> >needs when moving to a large area. But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry"
> >reference all about?
>
> The cities of Sheridan and Federal Heights are very small incorporated
> enclaves where the housing consists almost entirely of mobile homes.
> Sheridan has a of of heavy industry, and is pretty rough around the
> edges; Federal Heights is much cleaner and neater. Commerce City has a
> fair amount of trailers, but it's nothing like Sheridan or Federal
> Heights.
>
> The live audience at the Jerry Springer show chants "Jerry! Jerry!
> Jerry!" when two mulletheads get into a fight.
>
> A few things I forgot --
>
> * Glendale -- it's an enclave next to the Cherry Creek neighborhood.
> Nothing but apartments, office buildings and retail. There's several
> venues of what is known as the "Glendale Ballet." Lots of Russian
> immigrants, too, for some reason.
>
> * There's a small, little known Orthodox and Hasidic Jewish enclave in
> Avondale, a neighborhood south of Colfax Avenue west of downtown. The
> commercial strip is really rough (with no businesses that give away the
> presence of the Jewish population), but the adjacent residential areas
> aren't too bad. The Hasidim are mixed in with a decreasing Hispanic
> population, and a slowly growing Anglo middle class presence.
>
> * Aurora north of 6th Avenue -- west of I-225, it's "Original Aurora" --
> not too bad for what some people perceive as a slum, but it's mostly just
> a 1950s era neighborhood that has seen better days, with many small ranch
> houses and _lots_ of apartments. The neighborhood is quite clean,
> property is usually well maintained, and there's some "clean-up fix-up,"
> but Colfax can seem a bit threatening with its pawn shops, dollar stores,
> bodegas and ... ahem ... ladies of the night. At least there's few
> boarded up storefronts. North of 6th and east of I-225, it's
> predominantly Anglo -- forklift operators, truckers, folks who work in
> places with names like ProLift, PlastiMolding, Joe's Tool & Die ... you
> know. Lots of small houses with big pickup trucks in the driveway, which
> you'll see in the afternoon because many of the residents seem to work
> the third shift.
>
> * There's still some "horsey" enclaves in Lakewood and Wheat Ridge, a few
> very close to the Denver city line.
>
> * Wheat Ridge's commercial areas may be _ugly_, but its residental areas
> are quite nice, with medium sized houses on relatively large lots, and a
> lush urban forest. Because there were few planned communities, housing
> styles are quite diverse.
>
> * Despite what people might think about Aurora, have a serious look at
> some of the nicer areas south of 6th if you don't mind the 'burbs. You
> get a lot of house for the money there, there's quite a bit of retail
> (although it's more middle-market), commercial development is attractive
> (for a suburb), there's _lots_ of restaurants, and the city has good
> schools and parks. Aurora has the most ethnically diverse population of
> any suburb, but excepting the areas along Colfax there's no "ghetto."
> It's extremely stable, and quite proud of its diversity.
>
> * There's two "affordable" neighborhoods left in Northwest Denver --
> Avondale, described above; and Regis, by Regis University. Regis isn't a
> typical college neighborhood -- it's mostly working class, with some
> gentrification. The commercial strip along Federal is gawd awful. I
> didn't mention Chafee Park, because it has little to no character.
>
> * There's a _lot_ of gentrification in Five Points and Curtis Park, north
> of downtown. Those neighborhoods are the traditional heart of Denver's
> African-American community, but young professionals of all races are
> buying property there. Denver does have a few neighborhoods that are
> predominantly black, but there's no neighbohoods that are experiencing
> the rapid racial turnover of some areas in Eastern cities. If a black
> family moves into a predominantly white area, there's usually no panic
> selling.
>
> * Lowry is a neighborhood being built on the site of the former Lowry
> Air Force Base, between the Hilltop neighborhood and Aurora. Lowry is
> designed following New Urbanist principles -- except the one that
> promotes affordable housing. Lowry is EXTREMELY EXPENSIVE, and even an
> ordinary townhouse may set you back 250 bills.
>
> * The best neighborhoods for singles, IMHO -- Capital Hill, City Park
> West, Washington Park West, and West Highland. Lodo -- well, if you can
> afford it. Maybe Baker, too, if you've got enough piercings. Unless you
> have a Ford Excursion, a six digit income, and a strong preference for
> smooth jazz, avoid The Breakers -- there's lots of single folks living
> there, but it seems like a training ground for Cherry Creek.
Maraya
figured those neighborhoods were either full of hippies, or he was saying
they were "dead" areas! A book of these descriptions would be great, but
also quite controversial. Then again, controversy sells books!
Maraya
Chris
Basil72 wrote:
> >Do yourself a favor. Avoid Parker Road. We moved to Golden and love
> >it. Try insider's guide to Denver. They have a website.
>
> If you're going to be working in Denver, I'd say avoid Golden, the Foothills or
> anything west of Denver. First of all, if you live west of Denver, you're
> going to be battling traffic just like Denverites do all over the metro area.
Too true!
> Secondly, on top of traffic, if you live west of town, you're not only going to
> be battling traffic, but you're going to have the added annoyance of the sun
> shining directly in your face on your way into work in the morning ... and
> blinding you again on your commute home later in the day.
And you can work late as most folks do during the winter and miss that, but
spring/fall is a sure blinder.
> (Commuters living
> west of the city do get a reprieve during the summer months ... when the sun is
> high in the sky during the morning and evening commutes.)
You'd be surprised - the AM rush can be a drag depending on when you're gauging the
traffic to be off peak - it does vary.
> Check out the eastern half of the metro area. I live on Capitol Hill ....
> adjacent to and just east of Downtown Denver and work Downtown. One of the
> many benefits of living here includes the winter sun being always at your back
> during your morning and evening commute.
>
> Basil
I didn't know winter's sun was at your back - should we hose him down a notch -
lol!
But seriously, living North used to be easier, but the gridlock on 25 has rendered
that null and void. A decent loft makes as much sense as anything these days, even
Brooks Towers, as Tom Jensen would have us know...
Chris
Dan Tasman wrote:
> City of Denver in a nutshell ...
<snip for major lol fest>
Dan, you simply must reveal to the world which realty firm you're with, and
then progress up into the foothills for a look at some of the toney, and not so
horsey alternates to the inversion ills.
Yes, that's 7k' or better, and we'll expect all the Jeffco/Boulder Co dirt -
rocks included.
Say Hi to Wan and get back to us!
<best peice of local writing I've seen in this group in ages - keep it up>
Dan Tasman
>Great rundown of Denver. This is the kind of information a newcomer
>needs when moving to a large area. But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry"
>reference all about?
The cities of Sheridan and Federal Heights are very small incorporated
Basil72
>Do yourself a favor. Avoid Parker Road. We moved to Golden and love
>it. Try insider's guide to Denver. They have a website.
If you're going to be working in Denver, I'd say avoid Golden, the Foothills or
anything west of Denver. First of all, if you live west of Denver, you're
going to be battling traffic just like Denverites do all over the metro area.
Secondly, on top of traffic, if you live west of town, you're not only going to
be battling traffic, but you're going to have the added annoyance of the sun
shining directly in your face on your way into work in the morning ... and
blinding you again on your commute home later in the day. (Commuters living
west of the city do get a reprieve during the summer months ... when the sun is
high in the sky during the morning and evening commutes.)
Check out the eastern half of the metro area. I live on Capitol Hill ....
Dan Tasman
>This is funny! The Jerry that came to my mind was Jerry Garcia, and I
>figured those neighborhoods were either full of hippies, or he was saying
>they were "dead" areas! A book of these descriptions would be great, but
>also quite controversial. Then again, controversy sells books!
Jerry Garcia ... that's Boulder. Well, maybe not anymore -- I'll say
Nederland and Ward.
Dan Tasman
>Ohhhh- Jerry SPRINGER! That clears things up--say no more. The only
>Jerry that came to my mind was Seinfeld, which made me think neurotic
>people, or maybe Jerry Lewis (didn't know what to think about that one ;
>). Anyway, you should write a book, Dan. Call it "The Real Dirt on
>Denver's Neighborhoods and Suburbs" or something like that. Maybe it
>would spark a whole series....
>
I'd like to, but unfortunately I'm _far_ from being a Denver native. I
do love exploring the area, though, and I'm fascinated with the built and
social environment of cities.
Dan Tasman
>Pretty good description of parts of it, but some of it is
>quite nice. Some parts of Englewood near SE Denver are
>indistinguishable from SE Denver except for the price. Some
>parts of S Englewood are pretty suburban. I'd suggest
>Englewood (just S of Denver) as an alternative for those who
>want to live relatively close to downtown, but don't want to
>pay the high prices of the nice areas of the City of
>Denver. The same could also probably be said of Lakewood
>(just W of Denver) and Littleton (S of Englewood).
I should have gone into more detail about Englewood, but my fingers were
getting tired. :-)
One of my buddies who was new to Denver was looking for a house in a
central location, outside of the Denver city/county limits, in the $130K
range. I suggested Englewood, because it still has quite a bit of
affordable housing, big lots, and more "character" than your typical Denver
suburb. It's older, of course, and doesn't have that neat "planned
community" feel that much of Aurora, Parker, Douglas County/Highlands
Ranch, Arvada, Westminster and the US 36 corridor 'burbs have. Still, a 10
minute shot up Broadway will bring you to the Mayan Theater, and 10 minutes
north on University Avenue will drop you into Cherry Creek. The chains
haven't invaded Englewood to the point that they have other 'burbs.
The areas of Englewood closer to the Denver city limits have mostly larger
(1,500 to 2,500 square foot) single family ranch houses, built in the
1950s. Some areas close to Broadway have smaller 1920s era bungalows. The
majority of housing in Englewood, though, consists of smallish post-WWII
frame ranch and Cape Cod houses, like what you might find in north Aurora
or west Denver. Should be interesting to see what'll happen when the RTD
line through Englewood opens up.
Properties in the area of unincorporated Arapahoe County between Greenwood
Village and the Douglas County line that I described as being Aurora-like
usually have Englewood or Littleton addresses. Unincorporated Jefferson
County south of Lakewood (the infamous Columbine neighborhood) has
Littleton and Morrison addresses.
Dan Tasman
>But seriously, living North used to be easier, but the gridlock on 25
>has rendered that null and void. A decent loft makes as much sense as
>anything these days, even Brooks Towers, as Tom Jensen would have us
>know...
I wouldn't mind a loft, but -- damn, I can't afford one. I can't afford
the house I live in now, if I had to buy it today. It's small, but just
so happens to be in a "hot" neighborhood according to the Realtors that
keep knocking on my door on weekend afternoons. They're building condos
in my neighborhood that are selling for $250 a square foot! If I moved
to Denver now, it'd be out to Aurora, Thornton or Green Valley Ranch if I
wanted to get a lot of square footage at a relatively affordable price.
I'm no big fan of the 'burbs, but still ...
Dan (sometimes tempted to sell and move to a big house in Arvada or Wheat
Ridge)
Dan Tasman
>Dan, you simply must reveal to the world which realty firm you're with,
>and then progress up into the foothills for a look at some of the toney,
>and not so horsey alternates to the inversion ills.
No realty firm -- I'm an urban planner. Hopefully, the libertarians among
us won't flame me for my chosen profession. :-)
Chris
Dan Tasman wrote:
Dan!
I'm surprised, but your candor is as welcome as your reviews - keep it up, or
look South if all else fails - lol!
Chris
Dan Tasman wrote:
> Chris wrote
>
> >Dan, you simply must reveal to the world which realty firm you're with,
> >and then progress up into the foothills for a look at some of the toney,
> >and not so horsey alternates to the inversion ills.
>
> No realty firm -- I'm an urban planner.
You know your stuff planner.
> Hopefully, the libertarians among
> us won't flame me for my chosen profession. :-)
Yah - wouldn't that be a career wrecker!
Maraya
their area neighborhoods. You have a unique combination of the right
profession, great powers of observation, and the ability to express
yourself via the written word. You should write that book!
Maraya
Dawn Walker wrote:
>
> I don't think you'd have to be a native. When I lived in Austin, Texas, I
> spent six months driving all over the place, going to open houses and getting
> to know the area. Most of the natives I met didn't know about half the areas
> I explored. Heck, I'm not aware of about half of the town I grew up in
> (probably a good thing). I guess what I'm saying is that even a native can
> spend all their time in one little area and not know the bigger picture.
> Also, growing up in an area makes you used to it, so you might not have the
> same objectivity as someone new. I know that I would have loved to have a
> book like that any number of times (I've lived in 6 major metropolitan
> areas).
>
> Dan Tasman wrote:
>
> > Dawn Walker wrote
> >
> > >Ohhhh- Jerry SPRINGER! That clears things up--say no more. The only
> > >Jerry that came to my mind was Seinfeld, which made me think neurotic
> > >people, or maybe Jerry Lewis (didn't know what to think about that one ;
> > >). Anyway, you should write a book, Dan. Call it "The Real Dirt on
> > >Denver's Neighborhoods and Suburbs" or something like that. Maybe it
> > >would spark a whole series....
> > >
> >
Dawn Walker
spent six months driving all over the place, going to open houses and getting
to know the area. Most of the natives I met didn't know about half the areas
I explored. Heck, I'm not aware of about half of the town I grew up in
(probably a good thing). I guess what I'm saying is that even a native can
spend all their time in one little area and not know the bigger picture.
Also, growing up in an area makes you used to it, so you might not have the
same objectivity as someone new. I know that I would have loved to have a
book like that any number of times (I've lived in 6 major metropolitan
areas).
Dan Tasman wrote:
> Dawn Walker wrote
>
> >Ohhhh- Jerry SPRINGER! That clears things up--say no more. The only
> >Jerry that came to my mind was Seinfeld, which made me think neurotic
> >people, or maybe Jerry Lewis (didn't know what to think about that one ;
> >). Anyway, you should write a book, Dan. Call it "The Real Dirt on
> >Denver's Neighborhoods and Suburbs" or something like that. Maybe it
> >would spark a whole series....
> >
>
Tim Schreiner
format.
I would have to agree with much of his assessment, which should prove quite
useful to someone looking to relocate.
The problem with writing a book ... some of the demographics data could be
outdated. A periodical would probably give enough space to give more
expansive info.
Kudos.
Tim
"Maraya" <mar...@uswest.net> wrote in message
news:38EF57C0...@uswest.net...
> I agree completely. I know very few people who know a great deal about
> their area neighborhoods. You have a unique combination of the right
> profession, great powers of observation, and the ability to express
> yourself via the written word. You should write that book!
>
> Maraya
>
> Dawn Walker wrote:
> >
Maraya
novel, using the research to make the settings very real? He could even
make it partially epistolary, utilizing the newsgroup postings. Some of
the people here are quite unique.
Maraya
Dan Tasman
>The problem with writing a book ... some of the demographics data could be
>outdated. A periodical would probably give enough space to give more
>expansive info.
Well, if people replied to the Census, it would make things a lot easier!
:-)
My neighborhood is a place where, ten years ago, the general consensus was
"you don't want to live there." Now, it's "hot." Anglos are moving into
some sections of Park Hill and Whittier that were once predominantly black,
Hispanics are migrating into sections of northeast Denver and north Aurora
because they're being pushed out of northwest Denver by gentrification.
Cherry Creek East is pretty much an entirely different neighbrohood than it
was ten years ago -- the last small ranch houses are being town down as I
type this, replaced with stucco ticky-tack that'll sell to some KHIH
listening Excursion driver for close to seven digits. 5280 Magazine just
called *Harvey Park* "hot," as if yuppies are streaming into west Denver,
restoring 1950s tract homes to their former Levittown-like splendor.
I was thinking about making a Web site for people from my hometown who
might be contemplating a move to Denver, describing the neighborhoods,
culture shock (for instance, moving from one of the fattest, most
ethnically insular cities in the country to the thinnest city, where nobody
cares what boat your great grandfather departed on from da olt country
der,) and other things that folks "back home" might find useful.
Dan Tasman
>True. Things change so fast nowadays. How about a contemporary fiction
>novel, using the research to make the settings very real? He could even
>make it partially epistolary, utilizing the newsgroup postings. Some of
>the people here are quite unique.
I've only looked at this newsgroup on-and-off, and yes, there's quite a few
unique characters here. Sometimes, I think of Denver as being thiscity
that's growing more generic as more Californians stream in -- the country
bars turning to trattorias, the remaining horsey lots in Aurora and
Lakewood subdivided for trophy homes. I see lots of yuppies, "beautiful
people" and "outdoorsy" folks with goatees, baseball caps, Jeep Cherokees
and chocolate Labs, but what else is out there? There's a Denver that a
lot of people don't know about, an alternative universe of sorts that forms
a thin layer underneath the city that most see. What about the folks who
actually listen to the American Freedom Network, the lesbians of Northwest
Denver, the Vietnamese of west Denver, or the folks who work at Coors and
not some dot-com, or the Italian truck farmers in Adams County?
Dan Notov
news:8F0FCB0E...@206.168.247.226...
> Dawn Walker wrote
>
> >Great rundown of Denver. This is the kind of information a newcomer
> >needs when moving to a large area. But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry"
> >reference all about?
[Snippage]
> * The best neighborhoods for singles, IMHO -- Capital Hill, City Park
> West, Washington Park West, and West Highland. Lodo -- well, if you can
> afford it. Maybe Baker, too, if you've got enough piercings. Unless you
> have a Ford Excursion, a six digit income, and a strong preference for
> smooth jazz, avoid The Breakers -- there's lots of single folks living
> there, but it seems like a training ground for Cherry Creek.
The Breakers is also a great place if you are trolling for transient jocks.
I've heard many professional atheletes initially bunk down there.
Aozotorp
Ted Morgen
themselves, but this will put you in touch with the realty professionals
that can help you.
Regards,
Good luck
Ted
"Ilya" <il...@flatland.dimensional.com> wrote in message
news:L1RH4.581$3i1....@wormhole.dimensional.com...
> Dan Tasman <n0-$p...@n0-junk.c0m> wrote:
> > Dawn Walker wrote
>
> >>Great rundown of Denver. This is the kind of information a newcomer
> >>needs when moving to a large area. But, I'm curious, what's the "Jerry"
> >>reference all about?
>
> > enclaves where the housing consists almost entirely of mobile homes.
> > Sheridan has a of of heavy industry, and is pretty rough around the
> > edges; Federal Heights is much cleaner and neater. Commerce City has a
> > fair amount of trailers, but it's nothing like Sheridan or Federal
> > Heights.
>
>
> Thanks for the excellent review. I want to find a ranch-type house maybe
> within 40-60 minutes of Denver, under 200K. Not very big, but I understand
> there aren't many 1 or 2 bedrooms, mostly 3-4. Say North of Denver, like
> Broomfriend, or Lousiville. How much do the houses go for in that area,
are
> they nice?
>
> Thanks for the expert help!
>
> Ilya
Chris
Basil72 wrote:
> >But seriously, living North used to be easier, but the gridlock on 25 has
> >rendered
> >that null and void. A decent loft makes as much sense as anything these days,
> >even
> >Brooks Towers, as Tom Jensen would have us know...
>
> Brooks Towers, huh? I had a friend who was murdered there back in August of
> 1981 with a meat cleaver. Jim's apt was 9J or 9K (I can never remember which),
> but I'll never forget helping his ex- move their things out of that apartment
> after the police finished their investigation. There was so much dried blood
> on the living room carpet and up the wall behind the couch that we got sheets
> from the linen closet and used them to cover up the blood.
>
> Oh well. Back in those days, Brooks Towers was notorious for crime. I hope
> that the building's conversion to condos has made the building safer.
>
> Basil
Damn - sorry to have revived an old and unpleasant memory - I guess Tom's
commercials did the job. Yes, I hope it is safer now.
Basil72
Dan Tasman
>Thanks for the excellent review. I want to find a ranch-type house maybe
>within 40-60 minutes of Denver, under 200K. Not very big, but I
>understand there aren't many 1 or 2 bedrooms, mostly 3-4. Say North of
>Denver, like Broomfriend, or Lousiville. How much do the houses go for
>in that area, are they nice?
Broomfield has some nice brick '70s era ranches that match your
description, located in the City Hall area, although you'll probably have
better luck finding a nice one one under $200K in Westminster, cheaper if
it's on the Adams county side of town. (Adams County has a reputation as
being rather blue-collar - you can have the same house in the same city,
but it seems like it'll cost $10K to $20K more if it's on the Jefferson
County side of Sheridan Boulevard.) During rush hour, you should be able
to make it to downtown Boulder or Denver in 25 minutes from just about
anywhere in Westminster. Both Broomfield and Westminster are automobile
-oriented suburbs that have lots of PUDs -- expect very restrictive
covenants and architectural controls.
I don't think you'll find that much in Louisville -- remember, prices
increase as you get closer to Boulder proper. Boulder may be the
People's Republic, but they're Communists, Greens and triathletes with
lots of money. Go figure.
Dan Tasman
>What about looking in the 60-mile radius of Denver? Do prices go up or
>down as you move away? I would really prefer to get something as far as I
>could while still being able to commute.
Prices go down as you move further out from Downtown Denver. Generally,
areas around Boulder tend to be more expensive. The southern suburbs are
somewhat expensive per square foot; northwest and west a bit more
reasonable (but in Lakewood, prices gradually increase as you get farther
from Denver, because some Denver neighborhoods adjacent to Lakewood have
seen better days); and the northen 'burbs and Aurora tend to be the most
reasonable. Far, far north -- Fort Collins and Longmont are expensive (but
still cheaper than Boulder, Denver, or the southern burbs), Loveland and
Windsor cheaper, and Greeley quite reasonable. If you end up in Greeley,
though, keep reciting the mantra "It's the smell of money. You get used to
it." You don't want to commute on I-25 any further north than Erie, though.
Trust me.
Brighton, to the far northeast, probably contains some of the most
reasonably housing within a decent commuting distance of Denver, but it's
in Adams County (i.e. many of your neighbors will probably be working for
ProLift, ProPak, ProWeld, ProLiner, ProMolding, ProWinch, and so on), you
have to pass through Commerce City to get to Denver, and it still has
something of an "aggie" feel -- a turn-on to some, a turn-off to others.
You've got a bit of a haul to reach urban amenities such as theaters and
restaurants with waitresses who aren't named "Betty Lou." Brighton's
something of a boomtown as of late, because of its relatively cheap housing
prices.
Tim Schreiner
Platteville and some of those along Hwy 85 corridor. West of there are the
old mining towns of Frederick and Firestone.
With E-470 finishing up, Brighton will likely 'boom' to the south, also east
toward I-76.
Broomfield would be great - if you can afford to get 'in'. You might look on
the east side (Lowell Blvd/Federal north of 120th). Westminster's boundaries
meander through there, too. Still in Adams County, but District 12 is one of
Adams' better school districts.
Way southwest (Roxborough) may provide something for you, too.
Good luck
Tim
Ted Morgen
1500
sq ft house. It takes me 35 minutes to drive into Lakewood, about an hour
to Downtown Denver. The house would probably sell for $170,000 if we wanted
to sell it, which we don't. Taxes are around $1500/yr. There is ample
housing here, but you need a realtor to do the footwork for you. If you
want the name of one, email me. I don't like to put her addy on a newsgroup.
Ted Morgen
tmo...@centralcity.netnews:zeVH4.591$3i1....@wormhole.dimensional.com...
> Dan Tasman <n0-$p...@n0-junk.c0m> wrote:
>
> > Broomfield has some nice brick '70s era ranches that match your
> > description, located in the City Hall area, although you'll probably
have
> > better luck finding a nice one one under $200K in Westminster, cheaper
if
> > it's on the Adams county side of town. (Adams County has a reputation
as
> > being rather blue-collar - you can have the same house in the same city,
> > but it seems like it'll cost $10K to $20K more if it's on the Jefferson
> > County side of Sheridan Boulevard.) During rush hour, you should be
able
> > to make it to downtown Boulder or Denver in 25 minutes from just about
> > anywhere in Westminster. Both Broomfield and Westminster are automobile
> > -oriented suburbs that have lots of PUDs -- expect very restrictive
> > covenants and architectural controls.
>
> > I don't think you'll find that much in Louisville -- remember, prices
> > increase as you get closer to Boulder proper. Boulder may be the
> > People's Republic, but they're Communists, Greens and triathletes with
> > lots of money. Go figure.
>
> me a while to find a tiny one bedroom for about 600.
>
> What about looking in the 60-mile radius of Denver? Do prices go up or
> down as you move away? I would really prefer to get something as far as I
> could while still being able to commute.
>
>
>
>
===========================================================================
> National Organization for the Repeal of the Federal Reserve:
www.norfed.org
> The Foundation for the Advancement of Monetary Education:
www.fame.org
> E-gold: A privately issued e-currency backed by metals:
www.e-gold.com
> Principia Publishing:
www.principiapub.com
> Gold Standard forum:
http://pub8.ezboard.com/bhonestweightsandmeasures
>
===========================================================================
>
Alan Silverstein
> Hwy 85 corridor...
Footnote... Platteville is obviously named for the South Platte River,
but ironically, there's no obvious way to visit the river around there,
not even from the major bridge that crosses it. Last Saturday I found
the access (for rock hunting) easier near Fort Lupton. (There's a bit
of agate and petrified wood in the river gravels.)
Basil72
>but ironically, there's no obvious way to visit the river around there,
>not even from the major bridge that crosses it. Last Saturday I found
>the access (for rock hunting) easier near Fort Lupton. (There's a bit
>of agate and petrified wood in the river gravels.)
This has got to be one of the neatest messages I've read here in a looooong
time! I can just picture you poking about the sandy banks of the Platte in
search of agate and petrified wood.
Basil
Aozotorp
Alan Silverstein
> search of agate and petrified wood.
And finding some... And enjoying the sound and smell of the river...
And musing, as usual, how our reinvention of the landscape has made the
original reference points, such as the rivers, nearly invisible.
Basil72
>And musing, as usual, how our reinvention of the landscape has made the
>original reference points, such as the rivers, nearly invisible.
I agree with you that there's nothing like the sound and smell of a river. As
for these western rivers, they're not much in the way of rivers, but in the
manner of all rivers, they all manage to make their way to the sea.
Basil
Dan Tasman
>I agree with you that there's nothing like the sound and smell of a
>river. As for these western rivers, they're not much in the way of
>rivers, but in the manner of all rivers, they all manage to make their
>way to the sea.
They're not much, but "out West" they mean so much more ...
Dan
Chris
Dan Tasman wrote:
Try the Snake or the Columbia - now those are rivers!
Basil72
>
>>I agree with you that there's nothing like the sound and smell of a
>>river. As for these western rivers, they're not much in the way of
>>rivers, but in the manner of all rivers, they all manage to make their
>>way to the sea.
>
>They're not much, but "out West" they mean so much more ...
>
>Dan
Dan, you're absolutely right. I grew up in Connecticut ... where the average
yearly rainfall is 45 inches and the humidity is high. With all that rainfall,
a big concern is getting excess water off the land. When I was growing up
there, I HATED rain and water. There, it can rain and drizzle and the skies
can be overcast for weeks on end, to point where every outdoor activity was
sure to be drowned out by rain. (In New England, every outdoor programme
When I moved to Colorado in 1978, I couldn't believe the endless days of clear
skies. It's such that, 22 years later, I find myself longing for a good
thunderstorm to wash away all the dust and dirt.
Meantime, I'm still amazed at how much use this semi-arid state has made of the
4 major rivers flowing out of it. From what I gather, every drop of the
Colorado, the Rio Grande, the Platte and the Arkansas Rivers is used countless
times by Colorado's cities, industries and farms before that water flows out
into neighboring states.
Basil
S Unger
the problem with lack of sensitivity to neighbors by folks who own dogs. And of
the dedication of the municipal authorities to recognize the seriousness of the
problem.
We no longer live in Denver but have moved twice due to extreme problems with
dog barking. And we are dog-owners ourselves.
The first situation involved a townhouse development where large dogs were
chained out back(against the covenants) and would bark endlessly while the
owners were at work or away for the weekend. Finally moved to SW Denver. There
we had a pair of endlessly whining miniature Schnauzers that were penned up
across the street and were never let in the house - even at minus 30F. And of
course the mean Chow next door who always charged the fence when we tried to
enjoy our backyard. And the owners would turn absolutely vicious if you even
hinted that their pooch was causing problems.
We have heard of a lot of folks who have had similar problems since we moved.
Any neighborhoods that are able to keep this problem under reasonable control?
S.
Bob McCormick wrote:
> I'm looking to move to the Denver area. Does anyone know where I can find a
> good run down on the various neighborhood and suburbs, etc of the Denver
> area? Ideally a like to find out a bit about the character of each area, as
> well as things like real estate values, crime problems, accessibility to
> downtown or out of town, etc. I'd prefer web-based information, but any
> recommendations on good books or whatever would be greatly appreciated.
Basil72
>is
>the problem with lack of sensitivity to neighbors by folks who own dogs. And
>of
>the dedication of the municipal authorities to recognize the seriousness of
>the
>problem.
> We no longer live in Denver but have moved twice due to extreme problems
>with
>dog barking. And we are dog-owners ourselves.
> The first situation involved a townhouse development where large dogs were
>chained out back(against the covenants) and would bark endlessly while the
>owners were at work or away for the weekend. Finally moved to SW Denver.
>There
>we had a pair of endlessly whining miniature Schnauzers that were penned up
>across the street and were never let in the house - even at minus 30F. And of
>course the mean Chow next door who always charged the fence when we tried to
>enjoy our backyard. And the owners would turn absolutely vicious if you even
>hinted that their pooch was causing problems.
> We have heard of a lot of folks who have had similar problems since we
>moved.
>Any neighborhoods that are able to keep this problem under reasonable
>control?
>S.
I hear you on that one! I live in a high-rise condo on Capitol Hill. A lot of
us in the building have dogs. Most of them are large dogs who are well behaved
and who bark only when necessary. However, my next door neighbor is an elderly
woman with a poodle that stands at the door and barks incessantly. Hell, the
dog doesn't bark, rather, it shrieks. You get off the elevator, and the
goddamned poodle shrieks nonstop. You insert your key into the lock of your
door and the sound sets off another round of annoying shrieking.
I'd love to stomp the shit out of that dog but, trouble is, I love it's owner.
Genevieve's aware of how annoying that high-strung dog's shrieking is to the
neighbors and so keeps the little shit confined to one of the back bedrooms.
However, in her dotage, she doesn't always remember to do that, and so that
shrieking can keep us awake at night.
(When it gets especially bad, I just go out into the hallway and up to her door
and say "Shhhh!" as loud as I can ... twice. The first "shhhh!" causes the
high-strung little shit to shriek even more, while the second "shhhhh!" results
in a whimper and sudden silence.)
The whole thing is tricky because I love my neighbor these past 10 years.
Meantime, for those of you tired over the never ending barking of a neurotic
dog, Denver has a rather harsh ordinance dealing with that. All you do is call
the police and register your complaint with them. The police will go out there
and speak with the dog's owner.
The police will do this two times. After the third complaint, the police will
issue a ticket requiring the barking dog's owner to appear in court.
I hope that helps.
Basil
Dan Tasman
> Nobody has mentioned one of the big quality of life factors in Denver.
> This is
>the problem with lack of sensitivity to neighbors by folks who own dogs.
>And of the dedication of the municipal authorities to recognize the
>seriousness of the problem.
If you don't want to hear barking dogs, I'd highly recommend that you
cross North Denver off your list of prospective neighborhoods. Because
there's a large concentration of young outdoorsy types up here, there's
also a high concentration of the prerequisite outdoorsy dogs, like
Labrador Retrievers, Golden Retrievers, Blue Heelers and Australian
whatever mixes. Those breeds aren't that territorial, but many of the
old guard Hispanic families have Chow Chows or Chow mixes, which tend to
be _very_ protective. A Chow will start barking, and the Labs, Goldens,
and Aussies will often follow suit. Many elderly homeowners have one or
more little yappy dogs, like Lhasa Apsos, Shi Tsus and Schnauzers, adding
to the near-constant background noice.
I've got a Portie that doesn't participate the barking chains, and I'm
tying my damndest to keep her from picking up on that bad habit.
Dan Tasman
>Right. What about Fort Lupton, Frederick, houses in that area, would you
>recommend them? What are the prices like?
Weld County. Inexpensive by Denver standards, but you'll be trading
Applebee's and Chili's for truck stops and diners. Kinda' aggie and horsey,
if you're into that. You'll have the "smell of money" lingering in the air.
You have to ask yourself if the money you'll save from lower home prices
will be gobbled up with longer commuting times -- do the numbers work? Will
you enjoy the "Colorado lifestyle" out there?
Basil72
>Applebee's and Chili's for truck stops and diners. Kinda' aggie and horsey,
>if you're into that. You'll have the "smell of money" lingering in the air.
>
>You have to ask yourself if the money you'll save from lower home prices
>will be gobbled up with longer commuting times -- do the numbers work? Will
>you enjoy the "Colorado lifestyle" out there?
Excellant post! Unfortunately, the "Colorado lifestyle" is being rapidly
gobbled up along the entire Front Range. From Denver to Fort Collins, the
rolling prairie and farmlands that culminate in the Rockies are rapidly
disappearing because of never-ending development, such that the "Colorado
experience" more and more means viewing the majestic Rockies over oceans of
suburban roofs.
Basil