Internal/Private PaaS for Rapid Application Development

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Ali, Saqib

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Mar 2, 2011, 2:14:07 PM3/2/11
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Thoughts, examples, case studies???

Saqib
P.S. Is Google App Enginer for Business  < http://code.google.com/appengine/business/ > considered a private PaaS? Note: I am not talking about the consumer Google App Engine.




Edward at Burstorm

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Mar 2, 2011, 4:49:04 PM3/2/11
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There are many options in today's market.
It really depends on what you want to do and how you want to do it.
We consider for example Force.com a "vertical" platform since you
would use it to build a better CRM app basically ; where Heroku would
be a "horizontal" platform in that it supports
a development process (Ruby). MSFT Azure is designed for its specific
market and associated technologies.

Depending on what and how you want to design, build and deploy/scale
there are other approaches that may seem more traditional but can have
specific cloud like characteristics that might fit your needs
perfectly.

There is a lot of confusion about private versus public. The way we
make the distinction is based on the level of control and segregation
of resources. Public: resources are mostly shared and there is no
control over the infrastructure that supports it. Private: Dedicated
resources specifically assigned to you that allow a lot of control of
the infrastructure.

My 2 cts

Edward Wustenhoff
CTSO Burstorm
www.burstorm.com

On Mar 2, 2:14 pm, "Ali, Saqib" <docbook....@gmail.com> wrote:
> Thoughts, examples, case studies???
>
> Saqib
> P.S. Is Google App Enginer for *Business  < *http://code.google.com/appengine/business/>* *considered a *private* PaaS?

Ali, Saqib

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Mar 2, 2011, 4:55:45 PM3/2/11
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force.com, azure, vmforce.com, gae are external PaaS offering. I was looking for something more internal - that we can host.



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Ilyas Iyoob

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Mar 2, 2011, 5:34:24 PM3/2/11
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@Edward,Saqib:

Here's a chart of the broad range of options, clearly defined.  We have worked with clients who choose different combinations based on their requirements.

Ilyas Mohamed Iyoob, PhD
Sr. Scientist, and Manager of Operations Research
Gravitant, Inc.

Carlos Amaral

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Mar 2, 2011, 5:34:51 PM3/2/11
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Try CA 3Tera AppLogic one of the best product out there. It offers a tremedous amount of flexibility.

Carlos

**** Please excuse the brevity of this message. It was sent via my Blackberry device and w/o spellchecker.

Sent via BlackBerry by AT&T

From: "Ali, Saqib" <docbo...@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 2 Mar 2011 13:55:45 -0800
Cc: Edward at Burstorm<edw...@burstorm.com>
Subject: Re: [ Cloud Computing ] Re: Internal/Private PaaS for Rapid Application Development

Raj

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Mar 2, 2011, 5:53:23 PM3/2/11
to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com, laura....@cumulogic.com
Hi Ali - CumuLogic.com may be able to help.

Thanks
Raj

Igor David

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Mar 2, 2011, 6:29:24 PM3/2/11
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Hello,

I saw Carlos that you have mentioned CA 3tera Applogic, since we (company
where I am currently working, www.dnseurope.net) are using it
for more than 2 year, just to mention few words about it:


1) Applogic advantages:

- (relatively) easily creating complex virtual infrastructure (virtual
datacenters) that suits customer`s needs,
check out this video   http://www.3tera.com/AppLogic_demo.php


Once you study documentation and become skilled for this, it will be a
pleasure for you to build something yours!

- easily creating templates from existing application e.g. if you build
let`s some complex CMS,

it can easily be turned into SaaS so you can re-sell it again and again

- let your imagination create some super-duper application which can pour
beer for your clients :)
check this for example 
http://doc.3tera.com/AppLogic29/RefAppLampCluster.html


- all volumes and virtual applications are mirrored to 2 servers,
redundancy is working OK

- all virtual appliances (components) have it`s own resources (cpu, ram,
internal bandwidth) so you
can adopt those to suit your needs


- automatic high availability service which is checking many parameters



2) dis-advantage 

- the only thing I can remember now (if you can say it is) is that access
to controller is restricted to System administrators,

so if you sell some application to customer`s and he wants to change
resources, Administrator needs to do that.

If you want to avoid that, you need to provide some Control panel so
customer can change it`s own resources.



Hopefully, we have created that, too, so customer`s application are now
managed by them.



This all may sound as I am working for CA Applogic (in matter of fact I`m
working with their product), but I am

asking is there any product good like this one? :-)


Thank you and hope I didn`t bored you will all those stuff :-)

Ali, Saqib

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Mar 2, 2011, 6:38:35 PM3/2/11
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gentlemen, gentlemen. please please carefully read the subject of my original email, which I will quote here again:
Internal/Private PaaS for Rapid Application Development

Note: Emphasis on Internal and Rapid Application Development.

Please do not send me completely irrelevant charts of various cloud based offering. That is not what I asking, I already know of them. I am specifically looking for Internal PaaS offerings that can be used for Rapid Application Development (RAD)






Miha Ahronovitz

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Mar 2, 2011, 10:06:00 PM3/2/11
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Please do not send me completely irrelevant charts of various cloud based offering. That is not what I asking, I already know of them. I am specifically looking for Internal PaaS offerings that can be used for Rapid Application Development (RAD0

Ali, are you managing a request for proposals or something? This is just a discussion group and some of the replies I read were very informative for me and many other members. Everybody makes contributions, some relevant for you, some relevant for others, etc in a public discussion that happened to take place in a thread that you started. As you know this group has  over sixty one throusands members; 61,012 to be precise today.

If you did not get the information you wanted, say thanks for what you read so far from people with good intentions eager to help you, and then diversify your research elsewhere

Miha


mij123.vcf

Juan J.

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Mar 3, 2011, 3:42:50 AM3/3/11
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On Wed, 2011-03-02 at 15:38 -0800, Ali, Saqib wrote:
> gentlemen, gentlemen. please please carefully read the subject of my
> original email, which I will quote here again:
> Internal/Private PaaS for Rapid Application Development
>
>
> Note: Emphasis on Internal and Rapid Application Development.

IMHO the confusion is that your question is confusing: you're asking for
a private platform as a service, that you can host, that allow rapid
application development.

You're asking for two different things that, in my opinion, are sold
independently: ie. you can have a development platform that allows rapid
application development (ie. Rails, Django, App Fuse or whatever;
depending on the technologies you prefer), and this platform can be
deployed over a infrastructure that it's scalable, has high
availability, etc; in a transparent way for the developers.

I don't know any provider that provides this, and I don't know why
someone would like to deploy something like this internally with all the
inconveniences of PaaS (vendor specific technology, API: lock-in), and
none of the benefits (you're hosting the platform!).

Cheers,

Juanjo

--
Juan J. Martínez
Development, MEMSET

mail: ju...@memset.com
web: http://www.memset.com/

Memset Ltd., registration number 4504980. 25 Frederick Sanger Road, Guildford, Surrey, GU2 7YD, UK.

Ali, Saqib

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Mar 3, 2011, 11:31:52 AM3/3/11
to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com, Juan J.
Hi Juan,

That's exactly what I was thinking. I just wanted to query this group to see if I am overlooking something obvious. I have seen more full-featured J2EE Internal PaaS solutions from from RedHat, CA etc, but not something that can be used for Light-weight application development.

However, as Shaloo pointed out, there is one such player in this space - Orangescape. It is a relatively new player that offers a platform where you can build highly portable apps that can run on amazon, google app engine, azure or host it internally etc. I had looked at Orangescape in the past but not for building an internal PaaS. My main concern, which you highlighted, is that using Orangescape we'll be locking ourselves into their framework, which we clearly don't wanna do. 

Shaloo and Juan thanks for your responses.

Saqib

Brad Vaughan

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Mar 3, 2011, 11:38:57 AM3/3/11
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VMware's Code2Cloud is Springsource + some tools..
 
 
B

Kliza23

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Apr 11, 2011, 1:55:55 PM4/11/11
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While I'm part of the Apprenda team, SaaSGrid (http://
www.apprenda.com) was recently referred to as "A Google App Engine for
the Enterprise" here: http://www.readwriteweb.com/cloud/2011/04/a-google-app-engine-for-the-en.php

You can also read what customers, and analysts like Gartner are saying
in this article:
http://searchcio.techtarget.com/news/2240033655/SaaS-platform-gives-Market6-multi-tenancy-and-identity-management

- Jesse

On Mar 3, 12:38 pm, Brad Vaughan <buradd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> VMware's Code2Cloud is Springsource + some tools..
>
> B
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:14 AM, Ali, Saqib <docbook....@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Thoughts, examples, case studies???
>
> > Saqib
> > P.S. Is Google App Enginer for *Business  < *
> >http://code.google.com/appengine/business/>* *considered a *private* PaaS?
> > Note: I am not talking about the consumer Google App Engine.
>
> > --
> > ~~~~~
> > Cloud Slam 2011, April 18-22, 2011 -http://cloudslam.org
> > UP 2010 Conference:http://www.up-con.com
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> > Post Job/Resume athttp://cloudjobs.net
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>
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> >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004L1755W,
> >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002H0IW1Uor GET instant access to
> > downloadable versions at
> > -http://www.up-con.com/register
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> > -http://cloudslam10.com/content/registration

Ali, Saqib

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Apr 11, 2011, 11:34:26 PM4/11/11
to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com, Kliza23
Jesse,

I am a little confused. From the artikles it appears that SaaSGrid is a PaaS that support the MS stack. So why call it a "SaaS"Grid? Why not PaaSGrid?


Saqib

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Ali, Saqib

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Apr 12, 2011, 3:53:35 PM4/12/11
to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com, Kliza23
and also how does SaaSGrid differ from Windows Azure Platform Appliance[1] ?

On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 10:55 AM, Kliza23 <jkl...@apprenda.com> wrote:
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Kliza23

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Apr 14, 2011, 10:28:10 AM4/14/11
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Hi Saqib,

You're right, SaaSGrid supports the MS stack, and is a mature private
paas / private platform as a service. However, companies license
SaaSGrid and run it anywhere they choose (Apprenda does not host). It
stitches together any number of infrastructure nodes to create logical
hosting layer/private cloud, specifically tuned for delivering
software as a service. That, coupled with all of the business
services (billing and metering, entitlements management, drop in
federated identity, etc.) and the fact that SaaSGrid automatically
transforms applications to be multi-tenant, makes it a very different
beast than Windows Azure or the Azure Appliance.

- Jesse

On Apr 12, 3:53 pm, "Ali, Saqib" <docbook....@gmail.com> wrote:
> and also how does SaaSGrid differ from Windows Azure Platform Appliance[1] ?
>
> 1.http://www.microsoft.com/windowsazure/appliance/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 10:55 AM, Kliza23 <jkl...@apprenda.com> wrote:
> > While I'm part of the Apprenda team, SaaSGrid (http://
> >www.apprenda.com) was recently referred to as "A Google App Engine for
> > the Enterprise" here:
> >http://www.readwriteweb.com/cloud/2011/04/a-google-app-engine-for-the...
>
> > You can also read what customers, and analysts like Gartner are saying
> > in this article:
>
> >http://searchcio.techtarget.com/news/2240033655/SaaS-platform-gives-M...
>
> > - Jesse
>
> > On Mar 3, 12:38 pm, Brad Vaughan <buradd...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > VMware's Code2Cloud is Springsource + some tools..
>
> > > B
>
> > > On Wed, Mar 2, 2011 at 11:14 AM, Ali, Saqib <docbook....@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > > > Thoughts, examples, case studies???
>
> > > > Saqib
> > > > P.S. Is Google App Enginer for *Business  < *
> > > >http://code.google.com/appengine/business/>* *considered a *private*
> > PaaS?
> > > > Note: I am not talking about the consumer Google App Engine.
>
> > > > --
> > > > ~~~~~
> > > > Cloud Slam 2011, April 18-22, 2011 -http://cloudslam.org
> > > > UP 2010 Conference:http://www.up-con.com
> > > > Posting guidelines:http://bit.ly/bL3u3v
> > > > Follow us on Twitter @cloudcomp_group
> > > > Post Job/Resume athttp://cloudjobs.net
> > > > Get hundreds of conference sessions and panels on cloud computing on
> > DVD at
>
> > > >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002H07SEC,
> > > >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004L1755W,
> > > >http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B002H0IW1UorGET instant access to
> > > > downloadable versions at
> > > > -http://www.up-con.com/register
> > > > -http://cloudslam09.com/content/registration-5.html
> > > > -http://cloudslam10.com/content/registration
>
> > > > ~~~~~
> > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> > Groups
> > > > "Cloud Computing" group.
> > > > To post to this group, send email to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com
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> > > > cloud-computi...@googlegroups.com
>
> > --
> > ~~~~~
> > 3rd Annual Cloud Slam 2011 Conference * April 18-22, 2011 * Mountain View,
> > CA *http://cloudslam.org

Ali, Saqib

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Apr 14, 2011, 11:59:53 AM4/14/11
to cloud-c...@googlegroups.com, Kliza23
Hi Jesse,

Thanks for the update. Can you please elaborate on what SaaSGrid supports in the  Federated Identity realm? 

Saqib


3rd Annual Cloud Slam 2011 Conference * April 18-22, 2011 * Mountain View, CA * http://cloudslam.org

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