Whereas the Cake sites were designed in an afternoon, and
Whereas we need a nice, clean, updated look,
The CakePHP Development Team calls upon aspiring designer folks in the community to submit some hip designs so we can work together to create a more beautiful world for all things Cake.
//----------The Down Low:----------//
This little program is a mix of a design contest and a design collaboration. Once submissions have been gathered, the our team will pick the top 3-4 submissions as "winners". Those selected as winners will form a design group tasked with using the best elements of the top designs to create the most totally-awesome Cake look and feel.
We feel this is a good approach, because everyone has something to offer, and disregarding a good idea just because it didn't come from a single submission is a bad idea. We want to take the best of the best!
Because that's kinda soon, we're only asking for visuals. No markup needed at this point. Just send us a 72 dpi image, in a common image format.
Please realize that by submitting an image, you grant the CakeFoundation ownership of it (along with your current residence and firstborn child).
//----------Guidelines:----------//
In working with some advertising marketing gurus, we've decided that Cake needs a genre or metaphor it can fit inside of. Something grand that communicates simple, easy, solid, yet up-and-coming.
The american 1950's really exemplify this to us: the simplicity of the gadgets of the time, and most people consider things made during that time to be rock-solid. Something futuristic set in that genre is what we're looking for. Think Jetsons. Think fifties era sci-fi.
Now, we don't want www.cakephp.org to look like the inside of a fifties diner, nor like the inside of Mr. Spacely's factory, but give your visuals a flavor that hints in that basic direction. Make it feel fifties-like, but don't take it too far.
Another note of caution: there will be a tendency for you to take inspiration from other web 2.overboard sites' looks, especially those from RoR's site. We need to stand on our own, so find your inspiration from the past, not from the present.
Desired Ingredients:
- A global navigational element that includes all the cake sites (cakephp.org, foundation, cakeforge, manual, schwag, trac, wiki, api)
- Some way to sub-brand the above mentioned sites.
- Spot for a global search box.
- Fifties flavored visuals, in moderation.
- Go slim on web 2.0 fads (like pixel stripes, squares with two rounded corners, etc.). We want hip, but our own hip.
- Keep the cake icon. We like the icon, but you can play with the words. The icon right next to the word "cake" is a little redundant, so try to solve that problem.
- The layout needs to be flexible. Some of our sites are information heavy, and are better suited to wide, liquid layouts (like the API and manual). That said, other sites can fit inside a sexier, thinner fixed layout for easy quick reading. Top submissions would include ideas for both wide and thin layouts.
//--------------------//
Ready, set, go!
John David Anderson d...@cakephp.org Resident Image and Doc Monkey
I don't get it. When we made the 0.10 release announcement people started writing like mad that we need to update the sites, which of course we had planned to do anyway. Now that there is a real opportunity for the community to help out, we hear nothing?
So, this means one of two things.
1) People are really good at complaining and saying what needs to happen, but when the offer is on the table they shudder and retreat into their little black box.
OR
2) People are diligently working to make something cool.
I truly hope the latter. I guess I just thought there would be some more talk on this.
If you are planning on contributing a design, please reply to this thread or email your intentions to participate to d...@cakephp.org
> I don't get it. When we made the 0.10 release announcement people > started writing like mad > that we need to update the sites, which of course we had planned to > do anyway. > Now that there is a real opportunity for the community to help out, > we hear nothing?
> So, this means one of two things.
> 1) People are really good at complaining and saying what needs to > happen, but when the > offer is on the table they shudder and retreat into their little > black box.
> OR
> 2) People are diligently working to make something cool.
> I truly hope the latter. I guess I just thought there would be some > more talk on this.
> If you are planning on contributing a design, please reply to this > thread or email your intentions > to participate to d...@cakephp.org
> Thanks. Happy Baking
-- Rafael Apocalypse ideiadigital +55 31 3446.2555
I would be interested in doing stuffs to help the cake project, I'm capable of some minimum design, and I do have time since I'm jobless. So spending one or two evening to make a submission is OK to me. But know your brief is specific and restrictive from the POV of my own abilities. The American fifities. Sci-fi. OK, but I just don't have any material on this.
I looked on flickr if I can get some visuals under CC on the fifities but I found nothing really usable. For fonts I have the same problem. Right now I just don't see how I can respond to your brief. But if some people have stuffs to share, I could go in.
gwoo wrote: > So no one is excited by this little contest?
> I don't get it. When we made the 0.10 release announcement people > started writing like mad > that we need to update the sites, which of course we had planned to > do anyway. > Now that there is a real opportunity for the community to help out, > we hear nothing?
> So, this means one of two things.
> 1) People are really good at complaining and saying what needs to > happen, but when the > offer is on the table they shudder and retreat into their little > black box.
> OR
> 2) People are diligently working to make something cool.
> I truly hope the latter. I guess I just thought there would be some > more talk on this.
> If you are planning on contributing a design, please reply to this > thread or email your intentions > to participate to d...@cakephp.org
I think the contest is a great idea. Too bad I'm not a designer ;) Actually I think that might be the biggest problem in that cake php is a php framework and therefore will pull more developers than designers.
For some site lists that could come useful check these out.
I'm interested and trying to think of ideas. I'm not sure if I have the time. I have the advantage of remembering at least some of the 50's. (But not America, and not sci-fi from that period). Have been thinking around 50's shapes for cars and kitchen appliances.
> I think the contest is a great idea. Too bad I'm not a designer ;) > Actually I think that might be the biggest problem in that cake php is > a php framework and therefore will pull more developers than designers.
> For some site lists that could come useful check these out.
> I'm interested and trying to think of ideas. I'm not sure if I have > the time. I have the advantage of remembering at least some of the > 50's. (But not America, and not sci-fi from that period). Have been > thinking around 50's shapes for cars and kitchen appliances.
> On 24/03/06, Mika <mmihajlo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi Guys,
> > I think the contest is a great idea. Too bad I'm not a designer ;) > > Actually I think that might be the biggest problem in that cake php is > > a php framework and therefore will pull more developers than designers.
> > For some site lists that could come useful check these out.
Y' know? That 50's thing is ok for me, but I really think that there has to be a focus on Information architecture instead than on the visuals. Cake site is broken in it's information hierarchy, usability and navigability rather than on it's aestethic aspect.
sorry, bad english.
On 3/23/06, Armando Sosa <arm.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 3/23/06, Olwen Williams <olwen.willi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I'm interested and trying to think of ideas. I'm not sure if I have > > the time. I have the advantage of remembering at least some of the > > 50's. (But not America, and not sci-fi from that period). Have been > > thinking around 50's shapes for cars and kitchen appliances.
> > On 24/03/06, Mika <mmihajlo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hi Guys,
> > > I think the contest is a great idea. Too bad I'm not a designer ;) > > > Actually I think that might be the biggest problem in that cake php is > > > a php framework and therefore will pull more developers than > > designers.
> > > For some site lists that could come useful check these out.
I was afraid to make the first post because that would mean i have a problem with the current design, which I don't! I was going to suggest starting with a Mollio base theme, but wasn't sure if you wanted a general statment like that. Mollio is a pretty nice open source theme with all the little markup like blockquotes you could possibly want. And it's capable of handling lots of data like the initial post said was needed. Just change colors pretty much, and add your 50's style logos and flare. For 50's ideas, i suggest looking at Google Images, I love the vintage ads/posters look. Like colored pencil of a lady posing with a product and a big cheesy smile. Anyways, the Digg crowd liked Mollio, and they are usually pretty harsh on CSS stuff. http://www.mollio.org
> Y' know? That 50's thing is ok for me, but I really think that there has to > be a focus on Information architecture instead than on the visuals. Cake > site is broken in it's information hierarchy, usability and navigability > rather than on it's aestethic aspect.
> sorry, bad english.
> On 3/23/06, Armando Sosa <arm.s...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > We are working hard, sorry.
> > On 3/23/06, Olwen Williams <olwen.willi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I'm interested and trying to think of ideas. I'm not sure if I have > > > the time. I have the advantage of remembering at least some of the > > > 50's. (But not America, and not sci-fi from that period). Have been > > > thinking around 50's shapes for cars and kitchen appliances.
> > > On 24/03/06, Mika <mmihajlo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Hi Guys,
> > > > I think the contest is a great idea. Too bad I'm not a designer ;) > > > > Actually I think that might be the biggest problem in that cake php is > > > > a php framework and therefore will pull more developers than > designers.
> > > > For some site lists that could come useful check these out.
> Y' know? That 50's thing is ok for me, but I really think that > there has to be a focus on Information architecture instead than on > the visuals. Cake site is broken in it's information hierarchy, > usability and navigability rather than on it's aestethic aspect.
It would probably most productive to offer some sort of suggestion to fix what you think is ailing, rather than to just complain.
If you'll read the original announcement, you'd also find that we're looking for solutions to global navigational elements and sub- branding, which are closely related to the problems you've pointed out.
Well for me personally I don't mind the number of sites, except that maybe I would put the 2 wiki's together (rather use trac only preferably), but that is only because I prefer the way the trac wiki works to docuWiki.
Well John, I'll be having a go if I get five minutes this weekend. I certainly like the idea of fifties retro and I liked the idea of 1950's adverts for the kitchen stuff as mentioned by Olwen. I can't get off on the sci-fi bit though, it has been done to death and seems, well, to put it frankly, 'too American', no offence implied or intended to our American readers. (As a European, I do not see the America of the 1950's in perhaps the same way as Americans do or have the same good associations they maybe have? ) Why not stick with the simple 'bake a cake' metaphor?
Also for a design, since we have to accommodate a few different scenarios, why not use a 'Jello' layout. That is to say liquid, with a fixed minimum and maximum width. Keeps your text line length reasonable but is fluid to a degree. We can then use one design for all. OK, your front pages maybe slightly different, but the rest could be the same.
This is a bit harder to design to, but I think much better than fixed width or fully liquid for our requirements. Throw in some extra style sheets for print, handhelds some extra accessible 'zoom' and 'high contrast' ones and we are good to go?
> The CakePHP Development Team calls upon aspiring designer folks in > the community to submit some hip designs so we can work together to > create a more beautiful world for all things Cake.
I wasn't complaining, just suggesting to fellow designers to don't get too distracted on the appearence of the site but in it's function. I'm a friendly little man.
On 3/23/06, John Anderson <anderson.jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mar 23, 2006, at 2:21 PM, Armando Sosa wrote:
> > Y' know? That 50's thing is ok for me, but I really think that > > there has to be a focus on Information architecture instead than on > > the visuals. Cake site is broken in it's information hierarchy, > > usability and navigability rather than on it's aestethic aspect.
> It would probably most productive to offer some sort of suggestion to > fix what you think is ailing, rather than to just complain.
> If you'll read the original announcement, you'd also find that we're > looking for solutions to global navigational elements and sub- > branding, which are closely related to the problems you've pointed out.
On Mar 23, 2006, at 11:03 PM, Russell Baldwin wrote:
> Well John, I'll be having a go if I get five minutes this weekend. I > certainly like the idea of fifties retro and I liked the idea of > 1950's adverts for the kitchen stuff as mentioned by Olwen. I can't > get off on the sci-fi bit though, it has been done to death and > seems, well, to put it frankly, 'too American', no offence implied or > intended to our American readers. (As a European, I do not see the > America of the 1950's in perhaps the same way as Americans do or have > the same good associations they maybe have? ) Why not stick with the > simple 'bake a cake' metaphor?
Two reasons:
#1: Its pretty unoriginal. I mean, its the first thing people think of. It doesn't take much imagination and cleverness to come up with that metaphor.
#2: Ever tried to make your mother's kitchen look hip? Its pretty hard. ;)
Let's stick to the fifties. The sci-fi comment is more to get people thinking of the futuristic fifties rather than the poodle skirt fifties.
> Also for a design, since we have to accommodate a few different > scenarios, why not use a 'Jello' layout. That is to say liquid, with > a fixed minimum and maximum width. Keeps your text line length > reasonable but is fluid to a degree. We can then use one design for > all. OK, your front pages maybe slightly different, but the rest > could be the same.
> This is a bit harder to design to, but I think much better than fixed > width or fully liquid for our requirements. Throw in some extra style > sheets for print, handhelds some extra accessible 'zoom' and 'high > contrast' ones and we are good to go?
I like the idea of print/handheld stylesheets. It would be good to remember those considerations, though they aren't critical at this point.
Jello == liquid to me. Its not fixed, so it must be liquid. ;)
I think we'd still like to see a fixed layout in any ideas that are submitted.
Thanks for your thoughts - looking forward to your submission.
I'll post my layout, maybe this weekend, but it'll be not a liquid, and not a jello, fixed, YES, because fixed design let me work with the spaces, knowing what'll be where and when.
In liquid designs we don't control the width of text blocks, so it's easy to have lines with more than 80 characters, and that isn't good to user.
I thought that you have to think about this issue. User centered design, in apps you could get some 'white-space' but in the website, you have to inform, so in almost pages i'll have a lot of text, and control that texts are essential to a good layout.
In my humble designer opinion
RA
On 3/24/06, John Anderson <anderson.jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mar 23, 2006, at 11:03 PM, Russell Baldwin wrote:
> > Well John, I'll be having a go if I get five minutes this weekend. I > > certainly like the idea of fifties retro and I liked the idea of > > 1950's adverts for the kitchen stuff as mentioned by Olwen. I can't > > get off on the sci-fi bit though, it has been done to death and > > seems, well, to put it frankly, 'too American', no offence implied or > > intended to our American readers. (As a European, I do not see the > > America of the 1950's in perhaps the same way as Americans do or have > > the same good associations they maybe have? ) Why not stick with the > > simple 'bake a cake' metaphor?
> Two reasons:
> #1: Its pretty unoriginal. I mean, its the first thing people think > of. It doesn't take much imagination and cleverness to come up with > that metaphor.
> #2: Ever tried to make your mother's kitchen look hip? Its pretty > hard. ;)
> Let's stick to the fifties. The sci-fi comment is more to get people > thinking of the futuristic fifties rather than the poodle skirt fifties.
> > Also for a design, since we have to accommodate a few different > > scenarios, why not use a 'Jello' layout. That is to say liquid, with > > a fixed minimum and maximum width. Keeps your text line length > > reasonable but is fluid to a degree. We can then use one design for > > all. OK, your front pages maybe slightly different, but the rest > > could be the same.
> > This is a bit harder to design to, but I think much better than fixed > > width or fully liquid for our requirements. Throw in some extra style > > sheets for print, handhelds some extra accessible 'zoom' and 'high > > contrast' ones and we are good to go?
> I like the idea of print/handheld stylesheets. It would be good to > remember those considerations, though they aren't critical at this > point.
> Jello == liquid to me. Its not fixed, so it must be liquid. ;)
> I think we'd still like to see a fixed layout in any ideas that are > submitted.
> Thanks for your thoughts - looking forward to your submission.
> -- John
-- Rafael Apocalypse ideiadigital +55 31 3446.2555
My preference is fixed layout too, but the reason we're going to do two is because some people don't really care about whitespace and composition. For some of our sites, a sexy, easy to read fixed layout will be king: cakephp.org would be one of those. However, other sites are mostly informational, and while sexy whitespace and composition is cool, some people like to fit more info on each page. The API and Manual sites might fit into a fatter layout for some people.
The plan for our sites is making some sort of toggle button where users can switch between layout configurations. If we decide that is a bad idea, we'll just have two options between sites. Because of the variety of material in our CakeWorld, we just gotsta have two ways to view stuff.
This gives people choice, which is good.
</imhdo>
-- John
On Mar 24, 2006, at 7:36 AM, Rafael Apocalypse wrote:
> I'll post my layout, maybe this weekend, but it'll be not a > liquid, and not a jello, fixed, YES, because fixed design let me work > with the spaces, knowing what'll be where and when.
> In liquid designs we don't control the width of text blocks, so > it's easy to have lines with more than 80 characters, and that isn't > good to user.
> I thought that you have to think about this issue. User centered > design, in apps you could get some 'white-space' but in the website, > you have to inform, so in almost pages i'll have a lot of text, and > control that texts are essential to a good layout.
> In my humble designer opinion
> RA
> On 3/24/06, John Anderson <anderson.jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Mar 23, 2006, at 11:03 PM, Russell Baldwin wrote:
>>> Well John, I'll be having a go if I get five minutes this weekend. I >>> certainly like the idea of fifties retro and I liked the idea of >>> 1950's adverts for the kitchen stuff as mentioned by Olwen. I can't >>> get off on the sci-fi bit though, it has been done to death and >>> seems, well, to put it frankly, 'too American', no offence >>> implied or >>> intended to our American readers. (As a European, I do not see the >>> America of the 1950's in perhaps the same way as Americans do or >>> have >>> the same good associations they maybe have? ) Why not stick with the >>> simple 'bake a cake' metaphor?
>> Two reasons:
>> #1: Its pretty unoriginal. I mean, its the first thing people think >> of. It doesn't take much imagination and cleverness to come up with >> that metaphor.
>> #2: Ever tried to make your mother's kitchen look hip? Its pretty >> hard. ;)
>> Let's stick to the fifties. The sci-fi comment is more to get people >> thinking of the futuristic fifties rather than the poodle skirt >> fifties.
>>> Also for a design, since we have to accommodate a few different >>> scenarios, why not use a 'Jello' layout. That is to say liquid, with >>> a fixed minimum and maximum width. Keeps your text line length >>> reasonable but is fluid to a degree. We can then use one design for >>> all. OK, your front pages maybe slightly different, but the rest >>> could be the same.
>>> This is a bit harder to design to, but I think much better than >>> fixed >>> width or fully liquid for our requirements. Throw in some extra >>> style >>> sheets for print, handhelds some extra accessible 'zoom' and 'high >>> contrast' ones and we are good to go?
>> I like the idea of print/handheld stylesheets. It would be good to >> remember those considerations, though they aren't critical at this >> point.
>> Jello == liquid to me. Its not fixed, so it must be liquid. ;)
>> I think we'd still like to see a fixed layout in any ideas that are >> submitted.
>> Thanks for your thoughts - looking forward to your submission.
Good initiative! It's about time to work on that design...
March 30 Deadline does not leave much time for creative expression... Why the rush suddenly? The current design has been in place for many month already... What about a little more breathing space?
Although I have some vivid ideas, I really don't have time.
> Good initiative! It's about time to work on that design...
> March 30 Deadline does not leave much time for creative expression... Why > the rush suddenly? The current design has been in place for many month > already... What about a little more breathing space?
> Although I have some vivid ideas, I really don't have time.
> Plan 59 might be a nice starting point for inspiration about mid-century > visuals.
> Very curious to see the outcomes. Good luck!
-- Rafael Apocalypse ideiadigital +55 31 3446.2555
@drake: Plan 59 is cool! The deadline is tight because we have neglected it for too long. We have been so busy coding that we made it to 1.0 before we thought. The plan was to launch a new design for 1.0 and we still hope to do that. Unfortunately, 1.0 has come sooner than we expected.
If we do not receive anything we can work with by the deadline, I suppose we will have to extend it, but I really hope that does not happen. I can certainly appreciate that everyone has other work, that's what happened to us, too.
...Time then for the community to bake some 1.0 designs (no alphas, betas...) and get on par with the development effort.
In order to involve as many people in the process (insiders AND outsiders)...
## To raise awareness of the Design Contest:
# What about putting a big banner graphic on all official CakePHP homepages?
# What about explicitly requesting the Cake community to actively post about the Design Contest and it's progress on blogs, forums, mailing lists, etc?
## To support the design process:
# What about a dedicated wiki section for the Design Contest? After all, it should be a collaborative effort...
It could include: - Links to: preliminary designs, sites related to the design paradigm (US 1950's, sci-fi) for inspiration, implemented design examples, etc. - Source documents of: current layered Cake logo (AI, EPS, PSD...) - Lists of: prototype submissions, involved users, etc.
By the way, I use Django and I really like their consistent design approach. It does not relate in any sense to the proposed design paradigm for Cake, but delivers a solid user experience IMO.
I did a little research on the poodle for a third grade book report. As it turns out, the poodle was worshipped anciently by the egyptians: its the "patron saint" of bad architecture. The workers of the pyramids would burn its effigy before the day's work, if I remember correctly.
Um... I thought everyone knew that. That's pretty much the first thing I think of when I see a poodle.
One of the feature's of the 50's I think is bad architecture!! Too many boxes. Why did we remove all the lovely Victorian stuff. It was an earthquake risk? Figure out how to strengthen it then. I was a kid and loved the carving.
On 25/03/06, John Anderson <anderson.jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I did a little research on the poodle for a third grade book report. > As it turns out, the poodle was worshipped anciently by the > egyptians: its the "patron saint" of bad architecture. The workers of > the pyramids would burn its effigy before the day's work, if I > remember correctly.
> Um... I thought everyone knew that. That's pretty much the first > thing I think of when I see a poodle.
Wow. I've seen a lot of postings about graphical resources about the fifties. One thing that is still worrying me is not their "practical" usability but the "legal" usability. AFAIK copyright terms are of 90 years in the U.S. So to me all this resources can only be used as inspiration, and imply a legal risk. If somebody stumbles upon material that has a license that make it directly usable the same way cake is directly usable (MIT license) I would be interested. In fact I think that given my skills its my only chance to participate to find material that I can directly use and/or modify.
PS: #I personally agree to the Jello / negative margins solutions. It allows liquid design and good readability for both small and big screens.
#Another usability idea I would advocate is to put in two different menus : -the content of the left drop-down menu "cakePHP sites". -all the other points. i.e I think the first is more indicating a "domain" of the cakePHP sphere, and the others are more the context of a task.
drakepad wrote: > ...Time then for the community to bake some 1.0 designs (no alphas, > betas...) and get on par with the development effort.
> In order to involve as many people in the process (insiders AND > outsiders)...
> ## To raise awareness of the Design Contest:
> # What about putting a big banner graphic on all official CakePHP > homepages?
> # What about explicitly requesting the Cake community to actively post > about the Design Contest and it's progress on blogs, forums, mailing > lists, etc?
> ## To support the design process:
> # What about a dedicated wiki section for the Design Contest? After > all, it should be a collaborative effort...
> It could include: > - Links to: preliminary designs, sites related to the design paradigm > (US 1950's, sci-fi) for inspiration, implemented design examples, etc. > - Source documents of: current layered Cake logo (AI, EPS, PSD...) > - Lists of: prototype submissions, involved users, etc.
> By the way, I use Django and I really like their consistent design > approach. It does not relate in any sense to the proposed design > paradigm for Cake, but delivers a solid user experience IMO.
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