POLL: New RTC Website design ...
Danijel Tkalcec
As you all know, making a deciding about a new logo and a complete website
redesign isn't something one should take too lightly. Since the most
important thing about web pages is the impression visitors will get when
they see the web pages, as well as web site usability (menu positions, etc),
we are making a "public poll", with the intention to pick the design which
would best suit the RealThinClient components.
So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft4.jpg
I don't think that any of those 4 drafts have the final appearance our new
web pages, but I think it will be a combination of things we see there,
taking a few ideas from one or the other draft. But, we will need to decide
on unified colors and a logo which would fit the overall design.
So, here is what I would like to know: What do you think of these 4 drafts?
Is there one you like the most? If so, what do you like in particular? Is
there something you find annoying or something you would simply expect to be
different on that draft? How would you organize the web site, what would you
display on the main page and which logo would you choose (upper-left corner
of each draft)?
Thank you in advance for all your
suggestions/comments/recommendations/critics. I will be happy about any kind
of input.
Best Regards,
Danijel Tkalcec, Team RTC
http://www.realthinclient.com
Kevin Powick
> So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft4.jpg
> Thank you in advance for all your
> suggestions/comments/recommendations/critics. I will be happy about
> any kind of input.
I think # 1 is the most corporate/professional looking. I also find it
the easiest to read. The user map is cool too.
# 2 Isn't too bad, but more difficult to read.
# 3 Doesn't work for me at all.
# 4 is corporate looking too, but feels "colder" than # 1. Not as easy
to follow as # 1 either.
It's funny how a website really makes you feel about the company you're
dealing with. I'm afraid we do judge books by their covers.
My Vote is for # 1. No changes required.
--
Kevin Powick
Femi Fadayomi
I like draft4. It is simple and looks like it will be easy to navigate.
I like the logo in draft3, it gives the product-line a distinctive
look. Finally, I prefer the color combination in draft2 and draft3.
HTH,
Femi
--
Jon E. Scott
> I think # 1 is the most corporate/professional looking. I also find it
> the easiest to read. The user map is cool too.
I agree, #1 is what I'd choose. It stood out for me more. If only I could
design a website like that! I know alot about Windows programming, but
nothing about coding a webpage.
--
Thanks,
Jon E. Scott
Blue Orb Software
http://www.blueorbsoft.com
Ron L.
#1 and #4 look too much like someone that tries to sell hardware, if you ask
me...
http://www.bitogo.com/infopath/index.html
"Joe Hendricks" <hqters.b...@joeh.com> wrote in message
news:452572fc$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
> #4 wins for me
> JoeH
Joe Hendricks
Hannes Danzl[NDD]
navigation to the top
--
Hannes Danzl [NexusDB Developer]
Newsgroup archive at http://www.tamaracka.com/search.htm
Liz
> I am into #3, myself.
I like 3, althoguh Im not sure about green and orange..
--
Liz the Brit
Delphi things I have released: http://www.xcalibur.co.uk/DelphiThings
Rudy Velthuis [TeamB]
> Hi, fellow Developers!
>
> As you all know, making a deciding about a new logo and a complete
> website redesign isn't something one should take too lightly. Since the
> most important thing about web pages is the impression visitors will
> get when they see the web pages, as well as web site usability (menu
> positions, etc), we are making a "public poll", with the intention to
> pick the design which would best suit the RealThinClient components.
>
> So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft4.jpg
For me, 1 comes first (nice, professional), then 4 (a little too
corporate, like one of those heartless big companies <g>), then 2 and
then 3 (which looks too much like a simple blog).
--
Rudy Velthuis [TeamB] http://rvelthuis.de/
"Devlin's First Law - Buyer beware: in the hands of a charlatan,
mathematics can be used to make a vacuous argument look
impressive.
Devlin's Second Law - So can PowerPoint." -- Keith Devlin
William Egge
Investor oriented websites)
#2 : Don't like. It looks modeled after freeware sites and they tend to be
messy minded.
#3 : I like this. It is product oriented, not investor or "see what other have
said" oriented. Not sure about the colors but I'll still take it over the rest.
#4 : Don't like it. I could care less about the guy holding his hands out in
joy, he is irrelevant. Its like #1, Its hard to find what I want to click on.
-Bill
TJC Support
However, most websites that I've visited of that nature are for large
companies with a multitude of products. Your company has a very focused
product line, and I think all that jazz in 1 and 4 is distracting. I can't
find "the main thing" anywhere on the page. Seems to me there needs to be
something that jumps out at you and says "here's what we're all about, and
click here for more info". If I'm not real familiar with your product
already, I'd have a hard time deciding where to start learning about what
you have to offer with either of these designs.
2 and 3 have a look that is more in line with traditional software products,
and especially 3 with the products listed prominently on the right makes it
easy for me to decide to click on one of those to investigate further. I'd
say my personal favorite of the bunch is 3. I think I like the logo in 3
the best as well. One thing I think I'd change, though, is the text
content. This is the first impression people will have, so instead of
telling the history of the product, I think you'd be better served to point
out some of the key features, probably the kind of thing you have planned
for the "What is RTC?" page.
Good stuff!
Regards,
Van Swofford
Tybee Jet Corp.
Bob D
#2 is for a shareware software, maybe for ASPack ?
#3 can be deleted from your server, now :)
#4 not bad but too common... too template !
at last, yes indeed, you need a website redesign :)
"Danijel Tkalcec" <r...@deltasoft.hr> wrote in message
news:45256a4e$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Juan J Velazquez
Regards,
Juan
--
Q Correll
| So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
#1 is the ONLY one of the four I would have stayed at for more than two
seconds. It looks professional (Except for, perhaps, having a person
in the picture. But it's a nice, smiling and friendly looking person
so it didn't bother me. [Is that you?]) and I like the location of the
"menu," etc.,.
--
Q
10/05/2006 21:28:18
XanaNews Version 1.17.5.7 [Q's salutation mod]
Q Correll
| I think # 1 is the most corporate/professional looking. I also find it
| the easiest to read. The user map is cool too.
Yep. I agree with you.
--
Q
10/05/2006 21:32:54
Dennis Landi
>
> As you all know, making a deciding about a new logo and a complete website
> redesign isn't something one should take too lightly. Since the most
> important thing about web pages is the impression visitors will get when
> they see the web pages, as well as web site usability (menu positions,
> etc), we are making a "public poll", with the intention to pick the design
> which would best suit the RealThinClient components.
>
> So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
4.
However, in general I think putting images of people on websites is real
cheesy and is some weird corporate transplant of corporate magazine
advertising. I suggest avoiding it on web pages. On web pages, space is at
a premium so when I see an image of an anonymous person on a product's home
page, I see a wasted opportunity to present information of value. I suggest
replacing that image with a little "Featured Item or News" module that is
updated with new content frequently.
Suggestion: An interesting experiment would be to code all four web pages
and let your users choose the one they like best. Write the choice as a
cookie, so that the same design loads for them every time. Use CSS to make
this easy for yourself.
Suggestion: Hold a competition, so that your users can submit CSS based
designs of your web pages to be submitted to a gallery that others can
choose as their "skin" of choice, which would be written to a cookie so that
skin would be loaded every time for them. Once you've got the CSS mechanism
set-up the competition could be permanent.
Here's a good resource: http://www.csszengarden.com/
This might enhance your business by encouraging users to dowload your
webserver and experiment with it on their own machines....
Idle thoughts.
-d
Craig Hunt
far that's not the popular choice.
Craig Hunt
Peter S.
Ο "Danijel Tkalcec" <r...@deltasoft.hr> έγραψε στο μήνυμα
news:45256a4e$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Falanga Alain
My vote to #1
Cheers,
A.
--
Ceci est une signature automatique de MesNews.
Site : http://www.mesnews.net
Magnus
> Thank you in advance for all your
> suggestions/comments/recommendations/critics. I will be happy about any kind
> of input.
I hate #1 - reminds me of the awful Borland Website - use it if you want
specialize in ALM ;-)
#4 is o.k., looks respectable.
Personally, I like #3, because of it's simplicity
--
Magnus
Michael Fritz
<news:45256a4e$1...@newsgroups.borland.com>:
> So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
I like them all especially #1 and #3. No 4 is not my favorite, though.
IMO the question will also appear: Did you hire a web designer or was it
made by yourself?
--
cu,
Michael
Zsolt Popa
but after a few visits it becames to boring, but #4 is more sci-fi oriented
and if animated wins hans down if you put a different image for every
section this is the only professional work with a value of 5K$
"Danijel Tkalcec" <r...@deltasoft.hr> wrote in message
news:45256a4e$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Roland
I like #4 the most. Corporate look and much information on the landing
page.
Roland (Beensoft)
http://www.beensoft.nl
http://beensoft.blogspot.com
http://delphi.startkabel.nl
--- posted by geoForum on http://delphi.newswhat.com
popaz
Kipe
"Danijel Tkalcec" <r...@deltasoft.hr> az alábbiakat írta a következő
hírüzenetben: 45256a4e$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Danijel Tkalcec
> #1 is the ONLY one of the four I would have stayed at for more than two
> seconds. It looks professional (Except for, perhaps, having a person
> in the picture. But it's a nice, smiling and friendly looking person
> so it didn't bother me. [Is that you?]) and I like the location of the
> "menu," etc.,.
No, it's not me. My photo is here (for now):
http://www.realthinclient.com/danijel.htm
Best Regards,
Danijel Tkalcec
Danijel Tkalcec
> "Kevin Powick" wrote...
>> I think # 1 is the most corporate/professional looking. I also find it
>> the easiest to read. The user map is cool too.
>
> I agree, #1 is what I'd choose. It stood out for me more. If only I
> could design a website like that! I know alot about Windows programming,
> but nothing about coding a webpage.
Well ... those drafts were done by professional web designers.
I could never do something like that. :-)
Best Regards,
Danijel Tkalcec
Danijel Tkalcec
> Did you hire a web designer or was it
> made by yourself?
Those drafts were done by web designers.
Best Regards,
Danijel Tkalcec
Danijel Tkalcec
here is a summary of what I picked up so far:
- the user map is cool
- don't use a person on the photo - too cheesy
- don't use too big photos, space is valuable
- logo on #3 wins by far, but with different colors
- menu on top (easy to navigate)
- products to the right (easy to find what to click)
- point out key features of the products
- show News or Featured items
- need a lot of information on the main page
As for the votes (giving 1, 2, 4 or 8 points per vote):
Draft 1 = 89 points (overall corporate/professional look)
Draft 2 = 32 points
Draft 3 = 63 points (good logo and product placement)
Draft 4 = 72 points (sci-fi look, smaller photo)
Feel free to comment on any of the above.
Malcolm
.. but please make sure the body text is readable.
I found some of the text, particularly on #4 to be on the
small size. OK, it's just a jpeg, but if it's a struggle
to read the final version some visitors will miss the
message.
Malcolm
Kevin Powick
> Thank you all for your votes and comments,
> here is a summary of what I picked up so far:
> - don't use a person on the photo - too cheesy
studies have shown seeing a "real" person on a web page is actually
more attractive to most users. Though I agree that in the # 1 photo,
people could think you are a hardware oriented company -- Especially
since your company name could construed that way too.
> - don't use too big photos, space is valuable
Less is more. Don't overload your site with text. Too many tech
oriented sites do this. Look at a site like Dell.com. Very little
text on the home page. This is why I like # 1.
> - logo on #3 wins by far, but with different colors
Yes. That logo is cool.
> - menu on top (easy to navigate)
If you have a high enough resolution, otherwise you need to scroll back
an forth. Most people would rather scroll up and down, so I navigation
on the side is better. Moving down columns of information is always
easier than moving across rows.
> - need a lot of information on the main page
No. You only need key points to interest people to continue
investigation. Info overload just make people's eyes "glaze over".
--
Kevin Powick
John McTaggart
Me too..
Ken Weeks
> Hi, fellow Developers!
>
> So, here is what I would like to know: What do you think of these 4
> drafts? Is there one you like the most? If so, what do you like in
> particular? Is there something you find annoying or something you
> would simply expect to be different on that draft? How would you
> organize the web site, what would you display on the main page and
> which logo would you choose (upper-left corner of each draft)?
I like draft #1 the best. The logo has a young, crisp,
corporate/professional feel to it. Very stable, safe, and clean. The
overall design template is simple, easy to read color combination. The
only template of them all that I would want to explore. The global
"push-pin" map is cool. Knowing it is being used globally, reassures
the user.
Draft #2 is terrible. Looks like a kids gaming site. Too young.
Draft #3 doesn't do much for me. Like Rudy mentioned, it looks more
like a blog. The logo is good. However, the young, energetic design
conflicts with the muted colors of dark green/dark orange. Feel so
energetic but bored; not a good feeling. I'm actually wanting to leave
the "site" instead of exploring it. There is a strong, nice connection
to your partnership with Borland/Devco.
Draft #4 is good and bad. First, the logo comes off as very "Fast and
the Furious". It is young and hip and fine, if the image/corporate
direction is willing to take risks. And the green is too dark. The
Visual Lesson section is the best of the 4 designs. Would be nice to
see the partner affiliation on the main page. And the top navigation,
is lost above the image. My eyes are drawn to the columns of data.
Overall, using that corporate image stock is crap. And they are a
crutch for designers. Because they are initial template proposals, the
corporate image stock can be forgiven. They want to give you a choice
of four different designs without investing too much time in a
prototype. It's cheap filler. Space is valuable. Don't jam too much
in a small space, but don't waste it either.
The community css zen garden thing that Dennis mentioned would be a
cool thing to create some buzz.
--
Kenneth Weeks
Dennis Landi
"Kevin Powick" <nos...@spamless.com> wrote in message
news:xn0es56jw...@newsgroups.borland.com...
> Danijel Tkalcec wrote:
>
>> Thank you all for your votes and comments,
>> here is a summary of what I picked up so far:
>
>> - don't use a person on the photo - too cheesy
>
> studies have shown seeing a "real" person on a web page is actually
> more attractive to most users.
I love to see a link to that study.
I doubt that study was done in the context of software developers viewing a
software dev product site. The target customer base needs to be taken into
account.
-d
Angus Johnson
I disagree, and considering the number of voters (including me) who prefer
#1, I suggest you reconsider this assumption.
Also, if you do use a photo of a person, I suggest that it's of the company
owner or a strategic member of the 'team' to convey to visitors a personal
endorsement rather than simply confronting the visitors with a cheap
marketing 'face' of an anonymous corporation.
> - don't use too big photos, space is valuable
Yes, but they need to be big enough so visitors can recognise a face.
> - logo on #3 wins by far, but with different colors
Yes, definitely the best logo.
> Feel free to comment on any of the above.
Just did :).
Kevin Powick
> I doubt that study was done in the context of software developers
> viewing a software dev product site. The target customer base needs
> to be taken into account.
You are probably right, but I still maintain that a site overloaded
with text and details is a negative.
Look at any magazine cover, tech-based or otherwise. They usually have
pictures and a few key text phrases in order to grab your attention.
If you want to know more, you open the magazine and read the article.
I don't want to have to read through an entire page of text to get the
basic idea of what a product does. If I want further, detailed info, I
should be able to read it elsewhere on the site.
If you can't explain what your product does or is for in a few simple
phrases, you need to work on your message.
--
Kevin Powick
Dennis Landi
> Dennis Landi wrote:
>
>> I doubt that study was done in the context of software developers
>> viewing a software dev product site. The target customer base needs
>> to be taken into account.
>
> You are probably right, but I still maintain that a site overloaded
> with text and details is a negative.
>
Of course, that would be bad design. I agree. I didn't say otherwise. I
was talking about losing the opportunity to display INFORMATION, not text.
Huge difference. In this context, information would take the form of
useful, well-designed navigational elements leading to other pages with more
specific info and so on... As opposed to just plastering 1/5 of the page
with some anonymous "corporate" person. This, as I said, is a wasted
opportunity to make use of the valuable space.
I happen to collect varoius designs. Its part of my job as a all-round
internet engineer to keep up on this stuff so I try.
I'll post some links in a minute to various designs that caught my eye in no
particular order. I could post some of my own links, but I'll refrain for
tooting my own horn <g>.
-d
Bruno
fast. as Kevin said, Less is more.
the main page should show only important things, secondary information
should appear at small sizes.
bye! best luck!
Dennis Landi
> I'll post some links in a minute to various designs that caught my eye in
> no particular order.
Here ya go. I keep a library of design purely for inspiration. I am not
suggesting you copy one of these (they come from different industrial
contexts), I am just suggesting that it helps kind of jolt your brain into a
"state of creativity". Maybe it will work for you, maybe it won't.
These are almost all from the deviantArt community site:
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/33648431/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/39252209/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/39709668/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/26391106/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40357699/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40856365/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40816591/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40699035/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/39246356/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40610734/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/38659440/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/24089919/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40096641/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40421948/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/40107058/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/24747337/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/10039943/
some non-web designs that I think have potential to speak to a web context:
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/38603062/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/30608985/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/28105546/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/27326180/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/29818076/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/24384370/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/37191884/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/8814589/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/8959252/
http://www.flick.com/people/horde/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/22193925/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/23203959/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/39025581/
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/37183965/
And so forth and so on... There's a lot more where this came from but you
get the idea, I hope. (The idea being to kick start the brain into design
mode). Yes, even programmers can do it... <g> There's a world of designs
out there. And some of the Art communities on the net pretty much have them
on tap...
-d
William Egge
for him, let him take a step back, isolate himself, ask himself what the
site needs to accomplish, then from his own judgment - despite weird results
(ie Original) - build the site for that purpose.
For instance if he wants people to easily see what his products are and for
them to easily understand them then he should start asking questions like,
"How can I lay out my main page so the products can be easily seen?", "In
what way should I present the products so they can be easily understood".
So, you see - its not a poll or community opinion - its hard independent
thinking.
-Bill
William Egge
just copied. They grabbed a bag of common site layouts for software and
painted your product into them.
Kevin Powick
> Here ya go. I keep a library of design purely for inspiration.
Some of those are pretty interesting.
--
Kevin Powick
Q Correll
| No, it's not me. My photo is here (for now):
| http://www.realthinclient.com/danijel.htm
Thanks.
(You might want to keep the picture of the person in the #1 web site
concept. <giggle>)
--
Q
10/06/2006 09:38:09
XanaNews Version 1.17.5.7 [Q's salutation mod]
Q Correll
| Those drafts were done by web designers.
Fire the designers of the unimaginative and uninteresting #2 and #3! <g>
--
Q
10/06/2006 09:42:21
Q Correll
| - need a lot of information on the main page
But not too much! And make the type size readable! There seems to be
a general trend of web site designers of late for tiny, anemic stroke,
fonts that are illegible to anyone except with great 18 year old eyes.
And cramming way too much "stuff" onto a page.
Keep the site navigation menu/list on the left (Most people scan
left-to-right, top-to-bottom these days.).
--
Q
10/06/2006 09:44:56
Q Correll
| .. but please make sure the body text is readable.
| I found some of the text, particularly on #4 to be on the
| small size. OK, it's just a jpeg, but if it's a struggle
| to read the final version some visitors will miss the
| message.
Yes! I made a similar general comment.
--
Q
10/06/2006 09:51:09
Q Correll
| I still maintain that a site overloaded with text and details is a
negative.
Spot on!
--
Q
10/06/2006 09:52:59
Q Correll
Thanks for taking the time to put that post together!
I found almost all of them to be form over function, Which is a MAJOR
problem with most "design school" approaches to designs and products.
There were a couple of them that I thought made a good use of function
as well as form, such as the leather goods design:
http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/26391106/
Overall, I didn't care for most of them.
Some of the better ones (to my personal taste) used pictures of people
and MANY of the more visually appealing designs had large expanses of
space used by screen objects. Quite the contrary to the geekish "more
and more information" on a page concept.
I also found the use of color to be abhorrent in many of them I think
many of those designs designers must be color blind! <g>
--
Q
10/06/2006 10:11:22
Q Correll
| Some of those are pretty interesting.
And I thought many of them sucked big time. <g>
--
Q
10/06/2006 10:24:07
Brakko Baldo
"Danijel Tkalcec" <r...@deltasoft.hr> wrote:
>Hi, fellow Developers!
>
>So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
>http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
>http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
>http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
>http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft4.jpg
>
# 4 is my favourite, looks professional, clean and easy to use;
# 3 fresh but not so professional;
# 2 low impact and looks incomplete;
# 1 too much squared and feels like a already seen.
absolutely #1
-------------
Brakko Baldo
Brian
I agree. I like #1 best too.
Best regards,
Brian Rasmusson
Bitberry Software
Do you know if your web site has been hacked?
Do you keep an eye on your competitors?
No? You should. Your automated solution is here:
http://www.updatepatrol.com
Dennis Landi
"Q Correll" <qcor...@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:4526912f$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
> Dennis,
>
> Thanks for taking the time to put that post together!
>
Your welcome.
> I found almost all of them to be form over function, Which is a MAJOR
> problem with most "design school" approaches to designs and products.
> There were a couple of them that I thought made a good use of function
> as well as form, such as the leather goods design:
> http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/26391106/
>
Overall, I hate that design <g>.
> Overall, I didn't care for most of them.
>
There isn't a single design, by itself, that I would use as my own web
design for anything but that's not the point of the exercise. In all cases
there were at least one design element or concept that caught my eye, so I
archive it for future reference.
The problem with most of these designers is that they "don't know when to
stop". But you need to bear in mind that most of these kids are really
kids in their teens (at most 22 or 23). Really. I find that really
refreshing. It puts crap I see in the "professional world" in perspective
for me. Which is another reason why, I take time to critique their work on
deviantArt. These kids are completely unfettered by professional
experience. Nevertheless, I recognize raw talent when I see it; and I'll
steal a good idea from anyone...
> Some of the better ones (to my personal taste) used pictures of people
> and MANY of the more visually appealing designs had large expanses of
> space used by screen objects.
Same here.
> Quite the contrary to the geekish "more
> and more information" on a page concept.
>
More information doesn't mean more clutter, it means utilizing all space for
some useful purpose. In the a web site promoting a product the purpose can
only be information, information, information. Luckily for dev tools
vendors the bar for good design isn't that high in the world of software
engineering.
On the note, a design that I like a lot was RemObjects' original web design.
I just had a look and its gone a lot more corporate but I loved the original
designs.
In Danijel Tkalcec's case, I think he does indeed have a lot of information
to convey. He's got a lot going on. But, he doesn't have so much happening
that he can't convey references to all of it from his front page.
Personally I want to get to any of his info in no more than three clicks.
In terms of form and function, that should be the design goal, IMO.
Even Macromedia, with its myriad products manages to accomplish most of this
in 3 clicks, sometimes four for documentation.
Anyway, my four cents. Its a topic that interests me.
-d
John McTaggart
> just copied. They grabbed a bag of common site layouts for software and
> painted your product into them.
Even if they were templates, with a little tweaking by
a talented person, they can turn it into a very respectable
and professional looking site with a lot of individuality.
Besides, in today's world, the types of designs on non-flash
sites have pretty much been covered. The chances of a site
looking similar to another site are pretty good..
Jim Rowell
> Hi, fellow Developers!
>
No question about it. #3 is by far and away the best. Very nice. Friendly
and not busy.
I'm sick to death of the typical corporate website. #1 is #Nowhere in my
book.
--
Jim Rowell
Jim Rowell
"never mind what it is, just buy it" busy site with the typical fake picture
of a smiling person that has nothing to do with anything.
It's time we started getting rid of these pos's not encouraging them.
Liz
> I'm sick to death of the typical corporate website. #1 is #Nowhere in
> my book.
#3 got my vote for the same reason.. I want websites to be different,
its like modern cars, if you have to read the badge on the back to tell
what it is, then its not going to stay in your mind.. You want it to
look good, but you also want people to remember, to be able to find it
and not ignore it as yet more faceless dull marketing tripe (even if it
is)
--
Liz the Brit
Delphi things I have released: http://www.xcalibur.co.uk/DelphiThings
William Egge
Besides, in today's world, the types of designs on non-flash
sites have pretty much been covered. The chances of a site
looking similar to another site are pretty good..
>>
Your point is really an attitude. That the general idea is that there is
nothing new left to do. There is "always" something better, it just requires
thought.
Kevin Powick
It depends on one's pov. I develop business apps. If I don't know a
company, I want their website to convey a feeling of a larger, stable
entity that I can trust and rely on.
Some artsy-fartsy site is fine if your buying Christmas cards and
wrapping paper, but for business components, I want to see a business
site.
RTC's tag line is "stability". The site should convey that.
Not that # 3 is bad looking (well colours maybe), but as someone else
said, it looks like a blogger site used to sell software. The
impression is "small time outfit".
--
Kevin Powick
Q Correll
| Overall, I hate that design <g>.
<chuckle> Different strokes, and all that. There are things about it
I also don't care for, but I thought it one of the better designs of
all that I saw.
| Anyway, my four cents. Its a topic that interests me.
And all good inputs to my mind. I especially concur with your "Three
clicks MAX!" requirement!!!
--
Q
10/07/2006 12:40:02
Q Correll
| Not that # 3 is bad looking ...
I thought it was. It pretty much sucks for me. The logo was good,
though. <g>
--
Q
10/07/2006 12:45:12
William Egge
Take a look at this image:
http://www.eggcentric.com/images/wine.jpg
Notice when you look at anything, how your attention is not distracted by
anything else. Its as if your awareness of anything else is blocked out of your
mind except the thing you are looking at.
Now look at this:
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
Notice the difference in how you focus in on anything as compared to the wine
image. Its almost as if you cannot, you just see a big page with "stuff" on it.
Lets reflect on a few comments, pay attention to what charactoristic is used to
judge them:
>> # 2 Isn't too bad, but more difficult to read
>> Not as easy to follow.
>> and I think all that jazz in 1 and 4 is distracting.. I can't
find "the main thing" anywhere on the page.
Key words: "Read", "follow", "main thing"
Now go to RTC #3
http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
#3 has the nearly the same effect as the wine photo, it is very easy to look at
one thing and you are not distracted by anything else. If you look at the
product list, your mind just sees the product list. Basically, anything you
look at is the only thing you see.
Here are some comments about #3
>> Personally, I like #3, because of it's simplicity
>> Friendly and not busy.
(This person liked #3)
>> Seems to me there needs to be something that jumps out at you and says
"here's what we're all about, and
click here for more info".
Simplicity means you are not overloaded with information, meaning "I see one
thing" like the wine photo.
Not busy means basically the same as not distracting, which means "I see one
thing".
Desiring something to jump out at you means "I want to see one thing".
If you contrast the comments, they are about one thing - your ability to focus
on "something".
So I think the the reason why some people like #3 is because they want to focus
on one thing and thats what #3 gives them.
My hypothisis as to why the wine picture and #3 are easier to read and the
others hard has to do with contrast. If you look at #3, Each component on the
page is sufficiently different that you are not distracted by anything else. In
#2, everything is very similar and I think that is why it is hard to read one
thing, things around it are too similar and they blend in and thus become
"distracting".
-Bill Egge
Hannes Danzl[NDD]
> My hypothisis as to why the wine picture and #3 are easier to read and the
> others hard has to do with contrast. If you look at #3, Each component on
not only contrast, it's also distance between and orientation & relative size
of the content groups. Naturally a designer can't save what a content creator
did wrong but good design isn't easy and hard to find. Also it is extremely
important to understand that different types of publication need very
different approaches (even if you leave the matter of navigation completely
aside).
Look at the wine page and check the orientation of the bottles and the
accompanying text and the distance between them. These are the criteria that
pulls them together, the line in between could easily be left out to achieve
the same effect.
--
Hannes Danzl [NexusDB Developer]
Newsgroup archive at http://www.tamaracka.com/search.htm
William Egge
not only contrast, it's also distance between and orientation & relative size
of the content groups.
>>
<<
Also it is extremely
important to understand that different types of publication need very
different approaches
>>
Wow, there seems to be a lot more thought to put into this to fully cover it.
I don't have time to research orientation - relative size - and publication
type, but I did modify the wine image and removed the line and compared them to
see if it has much of an effect.
With Line http://www.eggcentric.com/images/wine.jpg
Without Line http://www.eggcentric.com/images/wine2.jpg
The line seems to force me to only see one side or the other and without the
line I feel drawn to the other side. So the line, in this case, does cause
mental separation and it does seem to be a significant amount.
-Bill
Jerry Hayes
> publication
> type, but I did modify the wine image and removed the line and compared
> them to
> see if it has much of an effect.
Something I'd like to add here is some subtle aspects of the wine pages that
work well in an artistic way. The way the bottles are stacked lead the eye
toward the middle of the page. The way it should be.
The larger, faded, swirling "B" also dumps an end into the middle of the
page, (I don't think the line works as well because my eyes follow it down
after that).
For the people that like humans in their site, look at www.att.com. The
person's not a "hey, look at me!" element, but a subtle connection to their
products, (phone, computers, etc.). And just try to look at the person
without following his eyes to the products and services.
Hannes Danzl[NDD]
> line I feel drawn to the other side. So the line, in this case, does cause
> mental separation and it does seem to be a significant amount.
Actually (and not for the arguments sake) for me it works better without the
line.
blur...@gmail.com
Cyprus, Turkey, Bulgaria, Romania, etc & the fish in Black Sea.
Good luck.
Danijel Tkalcec wrote:
> Hi, fellow Developers!
>
> As you all know, making a deciding about a new logo and a complete website
> redesign isn't something one should take too lightly. Since the most
> important thing about web pages is the impression visitors will get when
> they see the web pages, as well as web site usability (menu positions, etc),
> we are making a "public poll", with the intention to pick the design which
> would best suit the RealThinClient components.
>
> So ... here are the 4 design drafts (jpg):
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft2.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft3.jpg
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft4.jpg
...
> Thank you in advance for all your
> suggestions/comments/recommendations/critics. I will be happy about any kind
> of input.
>
> Best Regards,
> Danijel Tkalcec, Team RTC
> http://www.realthinclient.com
John McTaggart
> Besides, in today's world, the types of designs on non-flash
> sites have pretty much been covered. The chances of a site
> looking similar to another site are pretty good..
> >>
>
> Your point is really an attitude.
Actually, it's a subjective observation..
> That the general idea is that there is
> nothing new left to do. There is "always" something
> better, it just requires thought.
Show me.
Those links you posted didn't really impress me
as being all that original..most, reminded me of
other print/web designs I've seen in the past.
Olivier Beltrami some@junk someother.junk
> I could never do something like that. :-)
Can you tell us who did these for you ?
I might be interested in using their services.
Olivier
Olivier Beltrami some@junk someother.junk
> I like 3, althoguh Im not sure about green and orange..
As a developper, I like 2 and 3 the best (3 probably most).
1 and 4 look like they are very expensive and for PHB.
Olivier
William Egge
device that has not been created yet.
But, just look at history at all the advancements. When there were just
horses and before someone made a car or wagon someone may have said that
"nature has been exhuasted, there is nothing new to do".
There is such a thing as something new, and that new thing is not
automatically known. The reason it is not automatically known is because
new things take a lot of thought.
Also, the idea that there is "always something better". Would it be good if
cancer were cured? When you are looking for a new delphi component, are you
not wanting something better? This is where thought comes in, nothing new
will happen without thought.
<<
There is "always" something better, it just requires thought.
>>
-Bill
"John McTaggart" <_john_@_compnet101_._com> wrote in message
news:4529523a$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Ken Weeks
> Jim Rowell wrote:
>
> > I'm astounded that so many people here appear to like the
> > formula-corporate, "never mind what it is, just buy it" busy site
> > with the typical fake picture of a smiling person that has nothing
> > to do with anything.
> >
> > It's time we started getting rid of these pos's not encouraging
> > them.
>
> It depends on one's pov. I develop business apps. If I don't know a
> company, I want their website to convey a feeling of a larger, stable
> entity that I can trust and rely on.
>
> Some artsy-fartsy site is fine if your buying Christmas cards and
> wrapping paper, but for business components, I want to see a business
> site.
>
> RTC's tag line is "stability". The site should convey that.
I'm surprised that no one besides you and I expressed these
impressions. Everyone keeps chiming in that this one is cool or that
design, images/no images is cool. But no one has really touched on the
the impression that the various logos convey and how they work with the
overall site design. Danijel indicated that he might end up going with
a combination of templates and logos. I expressed my impressions in an
earlier message, but in general the first one is still young and fresh,
but it conveys the impression of a stable business.
The fourth logo is prolly the most dangerous. It looks cool. Very
"Fast and Furious". Bad impression for a business. Gives the
impression that the business is willing to take more risks than I'm
willing to bear as a customer. Could also be a Good Thing if cutting
edge is what you are after.
--
Kenneth Weeks
Q Correll
| #3 has the nearly the same effect as the wine photo, it is very easy
| to look at one thing and you are not distracted by anything else.
I totally disagree. The colors REALLY SUCK! And it has NO
"character." Really terrible from a design standpoint. Blah,
unimaginative and uninteresting. I don't think most people would waste
two seconds at that page trying to make out what it's about. There is
absolutely nothing to attract visual interest!
--
Q
10/09/2006 10:32:24
Scott Martin
I thought NG this was 3rd party VCL!
Perhaps non-tech, off-topic, or even your own NG?
Regards,
Scott.
Q Correll
| Is this really the place to discuss a website design?
| I thought NG this was 3rd party VCL!
|
| Perhaps non-tech, off-topic, or even your own NG?
Don't type to me... type to the party that initiated the discussion.
--
Q
10/09/2006 11:44:48
Scott Martin
Scott.
"Q Correll" <qcor...@pacbell.net> wrote in message news:452a98c2$1...@newsgroups.borland.com...
Q Correll
| Sorry about that... just too busy to find the original post, you know
| 5000 posts ago for this thread.
<giggle> Yeah, I know.
--
Q
10/09/2006 15:22:53
tony caduto
> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
Draft1 seems the most professional to me.
Did you do the designs yourself?
--
Tony Caduto
AM Software Design
Home of PG Lightning Admin for Postgresql
http://www.amsoftwaredesign.com
Danijel Tkalcec
> Danijel Tkalcec wrote:
>
>> http://www.realthinclient.com/design/draft1.jpg
>
> Draft1 seems the most professional to me.
>
> Did you do the designs yourself?
All designs were made by web designers.
PS. We have decided to use Draft1 as our starting point.
Danijel Tkalcec
> #1 but please change the map to something real, you just killed Greece,
> Cyprus, Turkey, Bulgaria, Romania, etc & the fish in Black Sea.
Thanks for the pointer. Will take care of that :o)
James K Smith
#2 and #4 may have been done by web designer, but I can just about guarantee
that they came from pre-existing template mechanicals to one degree or
another.
James
John McTaggart
> or transportation device that has not been created yet.
Thus my point..playing inside the sandbox we've
been given (the various browsers) most designs have
been done and a lot of them are now templates.
When the paradigm shifts, I'm sure innovative
designs will follow..
Q Correll
| PS. We have decided to use Draft1 as our starting point.
Good choice.
--
Q
10/10/2006 09:49:40
John McTaggart
Actually, all of them could be traced back to a template
of one sort or another. Which, IMO, is not necessarily a bad
thing. The reason some designs persist over others is that
they are cost effective and work for the site's visitors.
It's the designer's job to integrate the customer's products
and services into the design in such a way that they make
it their own.
An incredible array of templates can be found at..
http://www.perfectory.com/templates.htm
And, for amusement purposes, how many Delphi related page
templates can you spot on the following design page..
http://www.softidentity.com/list.php?type=3