Trying to wrap my head around this.
gombach
we would need to do it on OS-X server?
2. Can you point us to some current, live applications (beta or
otherwise?)
Thanks,
Ronald Gombach
mailto:gom...@livingplaces.com
Dominic Blais
On Jan 11, 12:31 pm, gombach <rjgomb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 1. The bombax server is deployed on OS-X server? So, to host for www
> we would need to do it on OS-X server?
Yes, you would need to host it on an OS X as both the framework and
the server are dependent on OS X. We are looking at porting the
Bombaxtic framework itself to GNUstep (to allow it to run on e.g.
Linux), but this will likely not be available for awhile and limited
in some of its capability because GNUstep is missing some of Cocoa's
functionality. Part of the intention with Bombax is to make OS X a
more attractive server OS by giving it a native platform for web
development.
> 2. Can you point us to some current, live applications (beta or
> otherwise?)
We are currently working on a full-featured BxApp example including
source code for folks to download and try. This should be ready
within the next couple of weeks. As we've just launched the public
beta there are no third-party apps available yet as far as I know, but
we plan to include a section providing a free listing of them later in
the year.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ronald Gombach
> mailto:gomb...@livingplaces.com
Thanks for your questions and please let us know if we may be of
further help.
Sincerely,
Dominic Blais
COO & Hacker-in-Chief
Bombaxtic LLC
Stephen Cox
Hi, Ronald. Answers are inline.
Yes, you would need to host it on an OS X as both the framework and
On Jan 11, 12:31 pm, gombach <rjgomb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 1. The bombax server is deployed on OS-X server? So, to host for www
> we would need to do it on OS-X server?
the server are dependent on OS X.
Stephen Cox
Dominic Blais
> Just to clarify.. it would run on OSX Server?
Yes, in addition to the standard OS X. In other words, the Bombax
server (and the BxApps it hosts) can run on the normal, desktop OS X
release or OS X server as long as they are version 10.5 or higher.
Stephen Cox
Stephen Cox
Chief Geek | Networkx | Ft. Lauderdale, Fl. USA
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Dominic Blais
Objective-C/Cocoa web applications. I think the answer to the other
questions is largely the same as for the question, 'why would a
developer choose Cocoa as opposed to Python, etc?'
Cocoa has a lot of advantages compared to e.g. PHP for developers:
it's faster, has better OO-support, it works with C/C++ libraries much
easier, it can access all of the well tested and well designed
functionality in Cocoa, allows debugging in Xcode, etc, etc. Why not
get all of those benefits when writing a web application?
Personally, if I can switch gears from PHP to Java for a project to
writing Objective-C it's a huge plus. I find it much more productive,
rational, and fun. Obviously, YMMV, but that's been my experience. I
think it's unfortunate that web application developers are largely
stuck with either VHLL scripting (I say that as a major Python fan) or
the massive complexity of Java EE. And if you start wanting to write
performance intensive code like image processing (wouldn't it be nice
to just hook up Quartz filters to a web app?), the existing C++ web
frameworks really don't cut it.
I agree that OS X is a good server platform for running the same
technologies that run on GNU/Linux and other operating systems. But,
the goal with Bombax is to make it evolve past that benchmark to
really take advantage of what OS X offers programmers under the hood.
I hope that helps. :)
Sincerely,
Dominic Blais
COO & Hacker-in-Chief
Bombaxtic LLC
Stephen Cox
God. I don't want to learn another lang. I thought I was ok with python and php. ;)
But back to being serious.. you're claiming that this is faster on a OSX box then PHP? In general I mean. You've done benchmarks?
Stephen Cox
Chief Geek | Networkx | Ft. Lauderdale, Fl. USA
Stephen Cox
Chief Geek, NetworkX / Electronic Etc.
p. 888.564.5223 / f. 954.337.3269
networkxfla.com
Florida, USA.
Dominic Blais
http://developer.apple.com/cocoa/pyobjc.html ) and we've been thinking
about including examples of using that with Bombax in the Developer's
Guide. As much as I love Python, I prefer Objective-C and if you've
got to learn another language it certainly a nice one. And a great
perk is that then you know how to write OS X desktop apps and iPhone
apps (mostly) as well.
We have done some internal benchmarks comparing Bombax to Java EE
(Glassfish) and PHP (through Apache) on the same system and it ran as
much as several orders of magnitude for several tasks (amazingly,
that's not an exaggeration but the higher end results were from tests
definitely contrived to stress tight processing). Effectively, it
boils down to (overhead + objective-c/c) vs (overhead + php/java/perl/
etc). With FastCGI, that overhead does eat a little performance and
we've done some work on an nginx module (our server core is nginx
which is generally considered faster than Apache) to reduce this.
Basically, if you're doing computationally intensive work or need to
manage memory carefully, it is far more efficient to do so using C/
Objective-C than a VHLL and, to a considerably smaller extent, Java.
(I know not everyone agrees that Java is slower than C, but in my
experience it usually is.) On the other hand, if you're just doing
some very quick form processing, the language and library benefits are
much more significant as the overhead normalizes things a lot.
I'll try to get some benchmark tests up this week that people can try
with their own hardware.
Sincerely,
Dominic Blais
COO & Hacker-in-Chief
Bombaxtic LLC
On Jan 11, 5:35 pm, Stephen Cox <step...@networkxfla.com> wrote:
> Thanks. That does help.
>
> God. I don't want to learn another lang. I thought I was ok with python and
> php. ;)
>
> But back to being serious.. you're claiming that this is faster on a OSX box
> then PHP? In general I mean. You've done benchmarks?
>
> Stephen Cox
> Chief Geek | Networkx | Ft. Lauderdale, Fl. USA
>
> > bombax-suppor...@googlegroups.com<bombax-support%2Bunsubscribe@go oglegroups.com>
> > .
> > > > For more options, visit this group athttp://
> > groups.google.com/group/bombax-support?hl=en.
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> > "Bombax Support" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to bombax-...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to
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Gombach Ronald
> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to bombax-suppor...@googlegroups.com.
Dominic Blais
version of Bombax as a commercial software package with available
subscription/support contracts. We will have a special licensing
program available for ISV's to make it compelling to recommend to
their clients. There are several further developments planned for
later this year, but we don't want get to ahead of ourselves. It's
very important that we're responsive as a company to what developers
and administrators want.
I see our main mission to create the best, most 'Mac-native' web
framework and server available with the most professional, refined
tools and support around. Even if we do eventually provide a subset
of functionality on other platforms, we are committed to making the
most of Apple's technology. With a lot of hard work and a little
luck, OS X just might become a much more popular internet server OS in
a well deserved way.
Sincerely,
Dominic Blais
COO & Hacker-in-Chief
Bombaxtic LLC
On Jan 12, 3:03 am, Gombach Ronald <gomb...@livingplaces.com> wrote:
> After-beta, what's your business model for Bomaxtic?
>
> On Jan 11, 2010, at 8:50 PM, Dominic Blais wrote:
>
>
>
> > It's interesting that you say that as there is PyObjC (
> >http://developer.apple.com/cocoa/pyobjc.html) and we've been thinking