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*** HUNGARY *** #493
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Laszlo Nemeth
Nov 18, 1995, 3:00:00 AM11/18/95
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>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Issue____________: *** HUNGARY 493 ***
>Date_____________: Sat Nov 18 00:44:03 EST 1995
>Publisher________: Hollosi Information eXchange /HIX/
>Disclaimer_______: Authors bear full responsibility for their articles.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
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>Supervisor_______: <super...@hix.com>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>HIXWEB___________: http://hix.mit.edu/friss2/ or http://hix.mit.edu/
>ARENA____________: telnet hix.hungary.com
>HUDIR____________: http://www.hungary.com/hudir/
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Tartalomjegyzek:
>----------------
>
>Felado : lon...@ix.netcom.com [United States]
>Temakor: Need Help Finding Hungarian Book ( 6 sor )
>
>Felado : Bozoki Barnabas
>Temakor: Re: Privatization of the MVM ( 42 sor )
>
>Felado : h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de [Germany]
>Temakor: 2 German want to visit Budapest ( 16 sor )
>
>Felado : bn...@loki.cc.pdx.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: Freedom fight and 1956 ( 22 sor )
>
>Felado : Fencsik Gabor
>Temakor: Virtual Supporters ( 41 sor )
>
>Felado : dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Query request ( 10 sor )
>
>Felado : kstr...@worldres.demon.co.uk [United Kingdom]
>Temakor: Sustainable Waste - WRF on the world-wide web ( 156 sor )
>
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Multiple Personality Disorder ( 30 sor )
>
>Felado : bi...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Money business! ( 16 sor )
>
>Felado : lipta...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Hungarian Lobby ( 27 sor )
>
>Felado : pa...@sensors.njit.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: anti-Semitism ( 34 sor )
>
>Felado : mg...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Have dinner w/Prof George Olah and Gov George Pataki ( 39 sor )
>
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 20 sor )
>
>Felado : Eva S. Balogh
>Temakor: Media Watch ( 79 sor )
>
>Felado : "peter kaslik"@idirect.com [United States]
>Temakor: Test-Do not read it. ( 3 sor )
>
>Felado : Pannon Jozsef
>Temakor: Re: Money business! ( 23 sor )
>
>Felado : Pannon Jozsef
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 5 sor )
>
>Felado : szucs_...@public.siliconvalley.com [United States]
>Temakor: 1956: no "szabadsagharc", word never used ( 366 sor )
>
>Felado : orc...@kincsem.btf.hu [Hungary]
>Temakor: TOZSDEI LEGEK...szavazasa ( 21 sor )
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : lon...@ix.netcom.com [United States]
>Temakor: Need Help Finding Hungarian Book ( 6 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 02:36:20 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>I am trying to locate a book that was published in Hungary in the early
>'90s. If you, or someone you know of can help in locating a Hungarian
>book, I'd love to hear from you. E-Mail me at lon...@ix.netcom.com
>and we can discuss the details.
>
>Thanks!
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : Bozoki Barnabas
>E-mail : af...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Re: Privatization of the MVM ( 42 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 03:22:48 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>My posting on this subject yesterday apparently was not clear, so let me
>try again to make my point about the privatization of the Hungarian
>Electric Utility:
>
>I do not wish to take a side in the privatization argument, I do not know
>enough about it. It is basically an economic, rather than engineering
>issue. I only expressed an opinion that a desire for more reliable service
>is a poor argument for privatization. In an interconnected power systems
>every member utility must meet the standards of the pool, hence there can
>not be significant difference between the service of the member systems.
>
>In the USA there are many private an public utilities, so a comparison
>could be made of the reliability of service they provide. I do not have the
>statistics to prove it, but based of many years of professional contacts
>with these utilities, my assumption is that the public utilities give a
>somewhat better service. They tend to "gold plate" their equipment.
>
>The other factor is the cost of power. In yesterdays's Globe and Mail the
>Power Workers union, in a full page ad made the following claims:
>
>* "In the U.S., residential customers of privately owned utilities pay, on
> the average, 33% higher energy rates than residential customers of U.S.
> public utilities."
>
>* In Great Britain the "the Conservative government told the public that
> the private sector could run the electricity system better and more
> efficiently. They promised lower rates. The awful truth, according an
> Oxford University study, is that U.K. rates are at least 20% higher than
> they would have been under the former public ownership."
>
>* ".. the top 100 managers in the newly privatized U.K. electricity
> system became overnight millionaires, with 200% pay raises and huge stock
> options."
>
>These and many other similar arguments leads me to believe, that one can be
>a "firm believer in private ownership of companies" and still see, that
>there are exceptions to the rule. In industries, which are inherently
>monopolistic, the private ownership not necessarily benefiting the consumer.
>I would very much like to read how the socialist Hungarian Government
>explained to the public the decision to privatize the MVM.
>
>Barna Bozoki
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de [Germany]
>Temakor: 2 German want to visit Budapest ( 16 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 03:47:52 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Is there anyone around who wants to show us (2 german students)
>his capital Budapest at the weekend of 24.11.95 ??
>We dont speak Hungarian...
>
>
>Is there any youth hostel in Budapest??
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Herb and Didi.
>--
>Herbert Steffan - Institute of Communication Networks,
> RWTH Aachen, University,
> Kopernikusstr. 16, 52072 Aachen, Germany, Phone: 0241/805828
> e-mail: h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : bn...@loki.cc.pdx.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: Freedom fight and 1956 ( 22 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 04:26:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>My reference was to Hungarian terms, Hungarian tradition, Hungarian
>practice. Of course, English books do use the term 'revolution', so I
>have no quarrel with that. By Marxist schoolbooks I meant Hungarian
>textbooks printed in Hungarian in Communist Hungary for Hungarian use.
>
>I cannot prove (perhaps I could, but I haven't the time, sorry), that the
>Western press borrowed the term 'freedom fighter' from the Hungarians.
>But I am fairly certain that western reporters stated that the Hungarians
>were calling themselves 'freedom fighters' or 'Freiheitskaempfer' - and
>certainly not 'revolutionaries', as early as the week of Oct. 23, 1956.
>
>As to whether Hungary was or was not a part of this or that empire - that
>depends on how you look at it. I repeat my original contention: the
>existence of Hungary as an independent legal entity was never in doubt
>either in 1848/49 or in 1956. In the first instance, the Hungarian kingdom
>was still the Hungarian kingdom in spite of every abuse, and not Austria;
>in 1956, too, Hungary was a sovereign country de jure, and recognized as
>such internationally, even if, de facto, it was controlled by a foreign
>power. It was never part of the Soviet empire in the same sense as, say,
> Austria was integrated into the Reich, or Mexico was a Spanish colony.
>
>Louis Elteto
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : Fencsik Gabor
>E-mail : ga...@sbei.com [United States]
>Temakor: Virtual Supporters ( 41 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 05:42:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Andras Kornai makes the obvious guess about the person posting as
>"szucs_...@siliconvalley.com":
>
>> I think Andra1s Pellionisz writes this stuff. Apparently he needs to
>> create a virtual supporter of his position.
>
>This may be the truth, but not the whole truth. "Dr Pellionisz" and
>"Szucs" indeed have many things in common: their writing styles, their
>peculiar logic, and their shared aversion to grammar. They seem to share
>memories of past events. They may even share a single body, and a single
>brain, for all we know. But that does not necessarily mean the two are
>the same person. The relationship appears to be more complicated. It is
>possible that "Dr Pellionisz" is only faintly aware of the existence
>of "Szucs", and vice versa. The medical term for this condition is
>Dissociative Identity Disorder. The shorthand name used in psychiatric
>circles is FUBB.
>
>It is one of the features of Dissociative Identity Disorder that
>alternative identities assume control in sequence, deny knowledge of one
>another, or even appear to be in open conflict. Each of the identities
>suffers from some degree of amnesia, but the relationship tends to be
>asymmetrical. "Szucs" mentions his mentor "Dr Pellionisz" in a reverent
>whisper. Of the two, "Dr Pellionisz" is the more hostile and controlling
>identity. "Szucs" seems worried about disapproval by "Dr Pellionisz", who
>may be continually asserting control in the form of visual or auditory
>hallucinations. "Dr Pellionisz" is the one seized with notions of
>"scientific" status and "prizes". "Szucs" is the subordinate identity,
>less verbally inhibited than "Dr Pellionisz", perhaps because he has a
>constant need to prove his loyalty by 'overfulfilling the plan', and
>thereby avoiding the wrath of the dreaded "Dr Pellionisz".
>
>Half of the reported cases of Dissociative Identity Disorder involve
>individuals with 10 identities or more. So expect more siliconvalley.com
>users to pipe up any minute now. That's the bad news. The good news is
>that even the most serious cases of Dissociative Identity Disorder are
>controllable these days. Lots of excellent antipsychotic drugs have come
>on the market in recent years. So don't give up. There is hope.
>
>-----
>Gabor Fencsik
>ga...@sbei.com
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Query request ( 10 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 09:01:09 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>To the manager of the list: A couple weeks ago I requested that you put out a
>query to the group asking if anyone knows of environmental organizations in
>Hungary. I never saw my query go out on the net, but now I see a couple querie
>s
>of people seeking info about Hungary. Can you please confirm to me that my
>query was posted. If not, please repost my query: I am seeking information
>about environmental non-profit organizations in Hungary. Please address your
>responses to Doris Rubenstein, Univ. of MN, 123 Snyder Hall, St. Paul, MN 55108
> .
>dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu. Thanks.
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : kstr...@worldres.demon.co.uk [United Kingdom]
>Temakor: Sustainable Waste - WRF on the world-wide web ( 156 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 09:04:17 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
>--============_-1395506435==_============
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>
>
>PRISM environmental information service
>
>I recommend our new W3 information resource for global information on solid
>waste management and resource recovery, information from our free journal
>'Warmer Bulletin' and much more besides.
>
>Visit, enjoy, contribute and tell your friends!
>
>Kit Strange
>director, WRF
>
>
>
>--============_-1395506435==_============
>Content-Type: application/mac-binhex40; name="PRISMnews.rel.doc"
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>!6!!*NHMamZAXlI[T!!"-!`Z2m0rXlZNJMr$Zl`!!6!3'Mr$Il1lT!!"-$JQ!N!#
>4L[2`r1A`!!"-,!H"i2(bk1lY!!"-3Jj&8L",GA*TCA)J5dp*1!!!6%-649)J5h9
>bD@9b)%eKBfPZG'pcD!!!6&3*Lq$bk1hakZMT!!%"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!B!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!43!#!G8#4J%F!!)"i!*'!J"m!!!!!!!!!3X!!!%U!!!"13!!!6X!!!D
>r!!!'`!!!"X%!!!E#!!!'``!!"X3!!J!!!3!!!)!#!!!-A!!!J!)!!!al!!#!!J!
>!$)S!!!!#!!!##`!!!!)!!!b0!!!!!J!!"q!!!!!#!!!(i3!!!!)!!!IL!!!!!J!
>!"q-!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Up3!!:
>
>
>--============_-1395506435==_============
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
>World Resource Foundation Tel +44 1732 368 333
>Bridge House Fax +44 1732 368 337
>High Street, Tonbridge
>Kent TN9 1DP England
>
>email KStr...@worldres.demon.co.uk
>or w...@gn.apc.org
>
>*NEW***NEW***NEW***NEW*
>
>URL=http://www.wrfound.org.uk
>
>*NEW***NEW***NEW***NEW*
>
>
>
>
>
>--============_-1395506435==_============--
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Multiple Personality Disorder ( 30 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 10:18:22 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Gabor Fencsik (ga...@SBEI.COM) wrote:
>: His Master's Voice "szucs_...@public.siliconvalley.com" says:
>:
>: > Dr. Endrey turned out to be an existing elderly statesman-like lawyer,
>: > who lives in his retirement in Hodmezovasarhely (a good distance from
>: > Silicon Valley...). He breeds, on his pleasure farm, a dozen or so
>: > "Grey Hungarian" cattle...
>:
>: No mere lawyer he. It's Dr. Jur., LL.B. (Hons.), QC for you, bub.
>
>i am not sure what qualifies the appendage of the letters "QC" to
>his name, for it was claimed on this newsgroup that the person in
>question practised in australia for 33 years as a solicitor. now
>a solicitor *cannot* be a queen's (or king's) counsel. only those
>admitted to the bar, i.e. barristers, may take silk, i.e. become
>queen's or king's counsel. in fact, in new south wales, the title
>is no longer issued. the entire classification was terminated, albeit
>reintroduced recently in the form of "senior counsel". i previously
>asked for clarification of the persons formal legal qualifications.
>the lack of a definitive answer increases the urgency of the question.
>
>: Calling him just a run-of-the-mill lawyer comes perilously close to
>: defamation.
>
>
>what are his formal qualifications and when were they invested and
>by whom?
>
>
>d.a.
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : bi...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Money business! ( 16 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 10:38:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Eva Balogh;you wrote,you don't understand what I meant,when I said:
>"Private ownership would require a much higher level of equity,as opposed
>to debt,and the equity would have to earn a return at least 5-6 percentage
>points higher than the interest on the debt."(so you can pay the loan back)
>Say,you invest $ 500,000.00 in a business.You expect a(minimum of)6% return
>ON YOUR MONEY.Then you borrow an other $500,000.00 for this business.You
>expect a return from this business to pay for the INTEREST ON THIS LOAN,plus
>you expect a return from the business to pay back the BORROWED MONEY,say in
>15 years.You can figure it out how much money you have to make with
>$1,000,000.00 investment,a lot! So,when you want to buy an Electric Co.you
>must pay a large amount of money of your OWN,plus you borrow the rest of it,
>otherwise you won't stay in business too long.This is why,the Hungarian
>ratepayer will pay a much higher price for the use of electricity.
>Eva,I don't believe,that you don't understand this simple mathematics.You
>just pulling my leg?
>Laci Toth
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : lipta...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Hungarian Lobby ( 27 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 11:11:11 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Dear Colleagues,
>
>Thank you very much for your tremendous and fast response. The Foreign
>Affairs Committee of the Senate has already been flooded by letters and I can
>already report on the first response: The Chairman of the Democratic Party,
>Senator Christopher Dodd has written a letter to President Clinton,
>requesting that he protect the cultural group rights of the indigenous
>Hungarian population. Please keep up this effort, including your mailing of
>letters to the local papers. The first of these letters has already been
>published this morning.
> We do have the E-Mail, fax and regular addresses of some 50 USA
>papers and of all Senators and Congressman.
>
> Now a few problem areas, where you might be able to help:
>
>1) We do not have the E-Mail addresses of Senator Bob Dole, The New York
>Times, The Washington Post, The Chicago Tribune. If you have them, please
>pass them on.
>
>2) We do not have E-Mail and Fax addresses of the Canadian media and
>politicians. Please help putting that list tougether.
>
>3) Our European efforts to this point have been dismal. All help would be
>appreciated (from our Colleagues in Hungary, Slovakia, Romania, the members
>of Scout organizations), etc.
>
>Best regards: Bela Liptak
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : pa...@sensors.njit.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: anti-Semitism ( 34 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 13:57:30 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>>In a genuinly democratic society everyone is free to keep
>>and practice whatever culture they want to.
>>The problem is when you claim to be member of a group
>>purely by your genetic inheritence; it is also impossible.
>>There is no such a thing as a pure Hungarian, or pure English, or
>>pure Jewish, whether you like it or not, whether it is
>>"Good" or "Bad". It is a fact. I'd like to be able to
>
>There is no such thing as always, but that doesn't mean that we should
>ignore wahat is usually true, or mostly of some character. there may not be
>many pure Hungarians, and English, but does not mean tat there are no
> differences
>between their bloodlines. I cannot go to India or Kenya or France and claim an
>y
>connection to those peoples and places, and for me to do so would be silly. Ye
>s
>we are all human and should therefore respect each other and help each other
>when needed, but that is not an arguement of destrying each other with kindness
> .
>There is nothing wrong with saying, " I respect you and if you need help I'll
>be there, and we can talk and learn from each other, but I have a society and
>nation that I belong to, and that is not something I want to share totally and
>openly, since that would destroy it." We can and shold help each other more
>with efforts like that in Somolia and should have done more in Ruhwanda. Thati
>s
>not the same as opening your society to being overwhelmed by influences from
>around the world. That is like taking every homeless person who meet into your
>house and letting them decide whcih holidays you'll celebrate, and what
>religion you'll worship. You are not expected by anyone to go that far - you
>don't have to give up who you are. You can help those people find work, and
> bul ild
>build them a home, but you don't haver to give them yours.
>
>Paul
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : mg...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Have dinner w/Prof George Olah and Gov George Pataki ( 39 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 18:23:14 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Tickets for dinner still available
>
>pesentation of the george washington awards to
>dr. George a. Olah winner of the 1994 nobel prize in chemistry
>hon. George e. Pataki governor state of new york
>bela bartok one of the great and original commposers of musical modernism
>on wednesday, november 29, 1995 at the waldorf-astoria starlight
>roof reception at 7:00 p.m. Dinner at 8:00p.m
>Contact: prof. August j. Molnar president 908-846-5777
> during 1994-1995 the american-hungarian foundation is celebrating its
>40th anniversary.
>It was founded on december 28, 1954. The foundation is devoted to furthering
>the
>understanding and appreciation of the hungarian cultural heritage in the
>united states.
>Through grants, the foundation supports students and scholars exchange,
>publications,
>academic programs, fellowships and research at american universities and
>colleges, serving as a bridge between the hungarian and american cultural
>traditions to enhance a better understanding of the contribution of each.
>In new brunswick, new jersey, the foundation established the newly built
>hungarian heritage center with its museum, archives, library, visitors
>center, conference and research facilities. The center also serves as the
>headquarters of the tax-exempt, publicly supported foundation. In name and
>symbolism the george washington award was inspired by the statue of
>washington, erected in the city park in budapest in 1906. It was a gift from
>hungarian immigrants living in america. For the immigrants
>the statues serves as an expression of gratitude to the memory of george
>washington and to their adopted country, while not forgetting the land of
>their birth. The george washington award of the american hungarian
>foundation honors those persons whose eminent contributions are in the broad
>field of human knowledge, the arts, commerce, industry, the sciences, and
>understanding among men and women and nations. The roll of laureates
>include the hon. Gerald ford, dr edward teller, ambassador angier biddle
>duke, general robert wood johnson, dr. Eugene p. Wigner, admirl lewis l.
>Strauss, dr. Peter c. Goldmark, joseph pasternak, james a. Michener, chet
>huntley, yehudi menuhin, andre kertesz, raoul wallenberg, cornell capa, elie
>wiesel, tony curtis and many more.
>special student price for tickets
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 20 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 18:55:19 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Issue____________: *** HUNGARY 493 ***
>Date_____________: Sat Nov 18 00:44:03 EST 1995
>Publisher________: Hollosi Information eXchange /HIX/
>Disclaimer_______: Authors bear full responsibility for their articles.
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>Send-Articles-To_: <hun...@hix.com>
>Subscribe________: <subs.h...@hix.com>
>Unsubscribe______: <unsubs....@hix.com>
>Help_____________: <he...@hix.com>
>Supervisor_______: <super...@hix.com>
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>HIXWEB___________: http://hix.mit.edu/friss2/ or http://hix.mit.edu/
>ARENA____________: telnet hix.hungary.com
>HUDIR____________: http://www.hungary.com/hudir/
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>Tartalomjegyzek:
>----------------
>
>Felado : lon...@ix.netcom.com [United States]
>Temakor: Need Help Finding Hungarian Book ( 6 sor )
>
>Felado : Bozoki Barnabas
>Temakor: Re: Privatization of the MVM ( 42 sor )
>
>Felado : h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de [Germany]
>Temakor: 2 German want to visit Budapest ( 16 sor )
>
>Felado : bn...@loki.cc.pdx.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: Freedom fight and 1956 ( 22 sor )
>
>Felado : Fencsik Gabor
>Temakor: Virtual Supporters ( 41 sor )
>
>Felado : dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Query request ( 10 sor )
>
>Felado : kstr...@worldres.demon.co.uk [United Kingdom]
>Temakor: Sustainable Waste - WRF on the world-wide web ( 156 sor )
>
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Multiple Personality Disorder ( 30 sor )
>
>Felado : bi...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Money business! ( 16 sor )
>
>Felado : lipta...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Hungarian Lobby ( 27 sor )
>
>Felado : pa...@sensors.njit.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: anti-Semitism ( 34 sor )
>
>Felado : mg...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Have dinner w/Prof George Olah and Gov George Pataki ( 39 sor )
>
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 20 sor )
>
>Felado : Eva S. Balogh
>Temakor: Media Watch ( 79 sor )
>
>Felado : "peter kaslik"@idirect.com [United States]
>Temakor: Test-Do not read it. ( 3 sor )
>
>Felado : Pannon Jozsef
>Temakor: Re: Money business! ( 23 sor )
>
>Felado : Pannon Jozsef
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 5 sor )
>
>Felado : szucs_...@public.siliconvalley.com [United States]
>Temakor: 1956: no "szabadsagharc", word never used ( 366 sor )
>
>Felado : orc...@kincsem.btf.hu [Hungary]
>Temakor: TOZSDEI LEGEK...szavazasa ( 21 sor )
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : lon...@ix.netcom.com [United States]
>Temakor: Need Help Finding Hungarian Book ( 6 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 02:36:20 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>I am trying to locate a book that was published in Hungary in the early
>'90s. If you, or someone you know of can help in locating a Hungarian
>book, I'd love to hear from you. E-Mail me at lon...@ix.netcom.com
>and we can discuss the details.
>
>Thanks!
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : Bozoki Barnabas
>E-mail : af...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Re: Privatization of the MVM ( 42 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 03:22:48 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>My posting on this subject yesterday apparently was not clear, so let me
>try again to make my point about the privatization of the Hungarian
>Electric Utility:
>
>I do not wish to take a side in the privatization argument, I do not know
>enough about it. It is basically an economic, rather than engineering
>issue. I only expressed an opinion that a desire for more reliable service
>is a poor argument for privatization. In an interconnected power systems
>every member utility must meet the standards of the pool, hence there can
>not be significant difference between the service of the member systems.
>
>In the USA there are many private an public utilities, so a comparison
>could be made of the reliability of service they provide. I do not have the
>statistics to prove it, but based of many years of professional contacts
>with these utilities, my assumption is that the public utilities give a
>somewhat better service. They tend to "gold plate" their equipment.
>
>The other factor is the cost of power. In yesterdays's Globe and Mail the
>Power Workers union, in a full page ad made the following claims:
>
>* "In the U.S., residential customers of privately owned utilities pay, on
> the average, 33% higher energy rates than residential customers of U.S.
> public utilities."
>
>* In Great Britain the "the Conservative government told the public that
> the private sector could run the electricity system better and more
> efficiently. They promised lower rates. The awful truth, according an
> Oxford University study, is that U.K. rates are at least 20% higher than
> they would have been under the former public ownership."
>
>* ".. the top 100 managers in the newly privatized U.K. electricity
> system became overnight millionaires, with 200% pay raises and huge stock
> options."
>
>These and many other similar arguments leads me to believe, that one can be
>a "firm believer in private ownership of companies" and still see, that
>there are exceptions to the rule. In industries, which are inherently
>monopolistic, the private ownership not necessarily benefiting the consumer.
>I would very much like to read how the socialist Hungarian Government
>explained to the public the decision to privatize the MVM.
>
>Barna Bozoki
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de [Germany]
>Temakor: 2 German want to visit Budapest ( 16 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 03:47:52 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Is there anyone around who wants to show us (2 german students)
>his capital Budapest at the weekend of 24.11.95 ??
>We dont speak Hungarian...
>
>
>Is there any youth hostel in Budapest??
>
>
>Thanks,
>
>Herb and Didi.
>--
>Herbert Steffan - Institute of Communication Networks,
> RWTH Aachen, University,
> Kopernikusstr. 16, 52072 Aachen, Germany, Phone: 0241/805828
> e-mail: h...@comnets.rwth-aachen.de
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : bn...@loki.cc.pdx.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: Freedom fight and 1956 ( 22 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 04:26:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>My reference was to Hungarian terms, Hungarian tradition, Hungarian
>practice. Of course, English books do use the term 'revolution', so I
>have no quarrel with that. By Marxist schoolbooks I meant Hungarian
>textbooks printed in Hungarian in Communist Hungary for Hungarian use.
>
>I cannot prove (perhaps I could, but I haven't the time, sorry), that the
>Western press borrowed the term 'freedom fighter' from the Hungarians.
>But I am fairly certain that western reporters stated that the Hungarians
>were calling themselves 'freedom fighters' or 'Freiheitskaempfer' - and
>certainly not 'revolutionaries', as early as the week of Oct. 23, 1956.
>
>As to whether Hungary was or was not a part of this or that empire - that
>depends on how you look at it. I repeat my original contention: the
>existence of Hungary as an independent legal entity was never in doubt
>either in 1848/49 or in 1956. In the first instance, the Hungarian kingdom
>was still the Hungarian kingdom in spite of every abuse, and not Austria;
>in 1956, too, Hungary was a sovereign country de jure, and recognized as
>such internationally, even if, de facto, it was controlled by a foreign
>power. It was never part of the Soviet empire in the same sense as, say,
> Austria was integrated into the Reich, or Mexico was a Spanish colony.
>
>Louis Elteto
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : Fencsik Gabor
>E-mail : ga...@sbei.com [United States]
>Temakor: Virtual Supporters ( 41 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 05:42:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Andras Kornai makes the obvious guess about the person posting as
>"szucs_...@siliconvalley.com":
>
>> I think Andra1s Pellionisz writes this stuff. Apparently he needs to
>> create a virtual supporter of his position.
>
>This may be the truth, but not the whole truth. "Dr Pellionisz" and
>"Szucs" indeed have many things in common: their writing styles, their
>peculiar logic, and their shared aversion to grammar. They seem to share
>memories of past events. They may even share a single body, and a single
>brain, for all we know. But that does not necessarily mean the two are
>the same person. The relationship appears to be more complicated. It is
>possible that "Dr Pellionisz" is only faintly aware of the existence
>of "Szucs", and vice versa. The medical term for this condition is
>Dissociative Identity Disorder. The shorthand name used in psychiatric
>circles is FUBB.
>
>It is one of the features of Dissociative Identity Disorder that
>alternative identities assume control in sequence, deny knowledge of one
>another, or even appear to be in open conflict. Each of the identities
>suffers from some degree of amnesia, but the relationship tends to be
>asymmetrical. "Szucs" mentions his mentor "Dr Pellionisz" in a reverent
>whisper. Of the two, "Dr Pellionisz" is the more hostile and controlling
>identity. "Szucs" seems worried about disapproval by "Dr Pellionisz", who
>may be continually asserting control in the form of visual or auditory
>hallucinations. "Dr Pellionisz" is the one seized with notions of
>"scientific" status and "prizes". "Szucs" is the subordinate identity,
>less verbally inhibited than "Dr Pellionisz", perhaps because he has a
>constant need to prove his loyalty by 'overfulfilling the plan', and
>thereby avoiding the wrath of the dreaded "Dr Pellionisz".
>
>Half of the reported cases of Dissociative Identity Disorder involve
>individuals with 10 identities or more. So expect more siliconvalley.com
>users to pipe up any minute now. That's the bad news. The good news is
>that even the most serious cases of Dissociative Identity Disorder are
>controllable these days. Lots of excellent antipsychotic drugs have come
>on the market in recent years. So don't give up. There is hope.
>
>-----
>Gabor Fencsik
>ga...@sbei.com
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Query request ( 10 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 09:01:09 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>To the manager of the list: A couple weeks ago I requested that you put out a
>query to the group asking if anyone knows of environmental organizations in
>Hungary. I never saw my query go out on the net, but now I see a couple querie
>s
>of people seeking info about Hungary. Can you please confirm to me that my
>query was posted. If not, please repost my query: I am seeking information
>about environmental non-profit organizations in Hungary. Please address your
>responses to Doris Rubenstein, Univ. of MN, 123 Snyder Hall, St. Paul, MN 55108
> .
>dru...@biosci.cbs.umn.edu. Thanks.
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : kstr...@worldres.demon.co.uk [United Kingdom]
>Temakor: Sustainable Waste - WRF on the world-wide web ( 156 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 09:04:17 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
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>
>
>PRISM environmental information service
>
>I recommend our new W3 information resource for global information on solid
>waste management and resource recovery, information from our free journal
>'Warmer Bulletin' and much more besides.
>
>Visit, enjoy, contribute and tell your friends!
>
>Kit Strange
>director, WRF
>
>
>
>--============_-1395506435==_============
>Content-Type: application/mac-binhex40; name="PRISMnews.rel.doc"
>Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="PRISMnews.rel.doc"
>
>(This file must be converted with BinHex 4.0)
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>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Up3!!:
>
>
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>World Resource Foundation Tel +44 1732 368 333
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>
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>or w...@gn.apc.org
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>
>=======================================================
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Multiple Personality Disorder ( 30 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 10:18:22 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
>Gabor Fencsik (ga...@SBEI.COM) wrote:
>: His Master's Voice "szucs_...@public.siliconvalley.com" says:
>:
>: > Dr. Endrey turned out to be an existing elderly statesman-like lawyer,
>: > who lives in his retirement in Hodmezovasarhely (a good distance from
>: > Silicon Valley...). He breeds, on his pleasure farm, a dozen or so
>: > "Grey Hungarian" cattle...
>:
>: No mere lawyer he. It's Dr. Jur., LL.B. (Hons.), QC for you, bub.
>
>i am not sure what qualifies the appendage of the letters "QC" to
>his name, for it was claimed on this newsgroup that the person in
>question practised in australia for 33 years as a solicitor. now
>a solicitor *cannot* be a queen's (or king's) counsel. only those
>admitted to the bar, i.e. barristers, may take silk, i.e. become
>queen's or king's counsel. in fact, in new south wales, the title
>is no longer issued. the entire classification was terminated, albeit
>reintroduced recently in the form of "senior counsel". i previously
>asked for clarification of the persons formal legal qualifications.
>the lack of a definitive answer increases the urgency of the question.
>
>: Calling him just a run-of-the-mill lawyer comes perilously close to
>: defamation.
>
>
>what are his formal qualifications and when were they invested and
>by whom?
>
>
>d.a.
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : bi...@freenet.toronto.on.ca [Canada]
>Temakor: Money business! ( 16 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 10:38:23 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
>Eva Balogh;you wrote,you don't understand what I meant,when I said:
>"Private ownership would require a much higher level of equity,as opposed
>to debt,and the equity would have to earn a return at least 5-6 percentage
>points higher than the interest on the debt."(so you can pay the loan back)
>Say,you invest $ 500,000.00 in a business.You expect a(minimum of)6% return
>ON YOUR MONEY.Then you borrow an other $500,000.00 for this business.You
>expect a return from this business to pay for the INTEREST ON THIS LOAN,plus
>you expect a return from the business to pay back the BORROWED MONEY,say in
>15 years.You can figure it out how much money you have to make with
>$1,000,000.00 investment,a lot! So,when you want to buy an Electric Co.you
>must pay a large amount of money of your OWN,plus you borrow the rest of it,
>otherwise you won't stay in business too long.This is why,the Hungarian
>ratepayer will pay a much higher price for the use of electricity.
>Eva,I don't believe,that you don't understand this simple mathematics.You
>just pulling my leg?
>Laci Toth
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : lipta...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Hungarian Lobby ( 27 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 11:11:11 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
>Dear Colleagues,
>
>Thank you very much for your tremendous and fast response. The Foreign
>Affairs Committee of the Senate has already been flooded by letters and I can
>already report on the first response: The Chairman of the Democratic Party,
>Senator Christopher Dodd has written a letter to President Clinton,
>requesting that he protect the cultural group rights of the indigenous
>Hungarian population. Please keep up this effort, including your mailing of
>letters to the local papers. The first of these letters has already been
>published this morning.
> We do have the E-Mail, fax and regular addresses of some 50 USA
>papers and of all Senators and Congressman.
>
> Now a few problem areas, where you might be able to help:
>
>1) We do not have the E-Mail addresses of Senator Bob Dole, The New York
>Times, The Washington Post, The Chicago Tribune. If you have them, please
>pass them on.
>
>2) We do not have E-Mail and Fax addresses of the Canadian media and
>politicians. Please help putting that list tougether.
>
>3) Our European efforts to this point have been dismal. All help would be
>appreciated (from our Colleagues in Hungary, Slovakia, Romania, the members
>of Scout organizations), etc.
>
>Best regards: Bela Liptak
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : pa...@sensors.njit.edu [United States]
>Temakor: Re: anti-Semitism ( 34 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 13:57:30 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
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>
>>In a genuinly democratic society everyone is free to keep
>>and practice whatever culture they want to.
>>The problem is when you claim to be member of a group
>>purely by your genetic inheritence; it is also impossible.
>>There is no such a thing as a pure Hungarian, or pure English, or
>>pure Jewish, whether you like it or not, whether it is
>>"Good" or "Bad". It is a fact. I'd like to be able to
>
>There is no such thing as always, but that doesn't mean that we should
>ignore wahat is usually true, or mostly of some character. there may not be
>many pure Hungarians, and English, but does not mean tat there are no
> differences
>between their bloodlines. I cannot go to India or Kenya or France and claim an
>y
>connection to those peoples and places, and for me to do so would be silly. Ye
>s
>we are all human and should therefore respect each other and help each other
>when needed, but that is not an arguement of destrying each other with kindness
> .
>There is nothing wrong with saying, " I respect you and if you need help I'll
>be there, and we can talk and learn from each other, but I have a society and
>nation that I belong to, and that is not something I want to share totally and
>openly, since that would destroy it." We can and shold help each other more
>with efforts like that in Somolia and should have done more in Ruhwanda. Thati
>s
>not the same as opening your society to being overwhelmed by influences from
>around the world. That is like taking every homeless person who meet into your
>house and letting them decide whcih holidays you'll celebrate, and what
>religion you'll worship. You are not expected by anyone to go that far - you
>don't have to give up who you are. You can help those people find work, and
> bul ild
>build them a home, but you don't haver to give them yours.
>
>Paul
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : mg...@aol.com [United States]
>Temakor: Have dinner w/Prof George Olah and Gov George Pataki ( 39 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 18:23:14 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
>Tickets for dinner still available
>
>pesentation of the george washington awards to
>dr. George a. Olah winner of the 1994 nobel prize in chemistry
>hon. George e. Pataki governor state of new york
>bela bartok one of the great and original commposers of musical modernism
>on wednesday, november 29, 1995 at the waldorf-astoria starlight
>roof reception at 7:00 p.m. Dinner at 8:00p.m
>Contact: prof. August j. Molnar president 908-846-5777
> during 1994-1995 the american-hungarian foundation is celebrating its
>40th anniversary.
>It was founded on december 28, 1954. The foundation is devoted to furthering
>the
>understanding and appreciation of the hungarian cultural heritage in the
>united states.
>Through grants, the foundation supports students and scholars exchange,
>publications,
>academic programs, fellowships and research at american universities and
>colleges, serving as a bridge between the hungarian and american cultural
>traditions to enhance a better understanding of the contribution of each.
>In new brunswick, new jersey, the foundation established the newly built
>hungarian heritage center with its museum, archives, library, visitors
>center, conference and research facilities. The center also serves as the
>headquarters of the tax-exempt, publicly supported foundation. In name and
>symbolism the george washington award was inspired by the statue of
>washington, erected in the city park in budapest in 1906. It was a gift from
>hungarian immigrants living in america. For the immigrants
>the statues serves as an expression of gratitude to the memory of george
>washington and to their adopted country, while not forgetting the land of
>their birth. The george washington award of the american hungarian
>foundation honors those persons whose eminent contributions are in the broad
>field of human knowledge, the arts, commerce, industry, the sciences, and
>understanding among men and women and nations. The roll of laureates
>include the hon. Gerald ford, dr edward teller, ambassador angier biddle
>duke, general robert wood johnson, dr. Eugene p. Wigner, admirl lewis l.
>Strauss, dr. Peter c. Goldmark, joseph pasternak, james a. Michener, chet
>huntley, yehudi menuhin, andre kertesz, raoul wallenberg, cornell capa, elie
>wiesel, tony curtis and many more.
>special student price for tickets
>
>=======================================================
>Felado : ibo...@metz.une.edu.au [Australia]
>Temakor: Re: Extremists hurt their own ( 20 sor )
>Idopont: Fri Nov 17 18:55:19 EST 1995 HUNGARY #493
>- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
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