laptops in lab?
EDTECH Editor-Beil
Does anyone have experience or an opinion regarding placing laptops in a
computer lab? We have a small lab with only 20 desktop computers in it right
now. We were thinking that if we switched to laptops, we could fit more. The
lab is used all day long everyday. I am concerned about laptos being to
"fragile" for our K-8 students. Pros and Cons?
We appreciate any thoughts on this.
Kelly McMahon
St. Patrick School
Wadsworth, IL
---
Edtech Archives, posting guidelines and other information are at:
http://www.h-net.msu.edu/~edweb
Please include your name, email address, and school or professional
affiliation in each posting.
To unsubscribe send the following command to: LIST...@H-NET.MSU.EDU
SIGNOFF EDTECH
EDTECH Editor-Beil
I have a lab with 30 desktops. I feel those are more secure and easier for the
smaller grade to use. The laptops we have sometimes do not function very well
so the ones that do we let the teachers borrow for the students in their
classrooms. Each class has at least 3 desktop computers so with the upper
grades they use the laptops at their desk. They don't always catch the
internet so that is another factor to look at. Yes, laptops might be small to
fit on the tables, but what if the students open and close them and press on
the screens, keys might get stuck or pop out if pressed to hard. There is a
lot to consider. I hope this helps alittle.
Letty Gonzales, Tech/Coach
Sanchez Elementary
2700 Berkley
Houston, Texas 77012
(713)845-7472 FAX: (713)847-4755
X-From: "McMahon, Kelly" <kmcm...@stpatrickwadsworth.org>
EDTECH Editor-Beil
From: R PERRY <ppe...@warrick.k12.in.us>
I could and probably should write a book on this subject!
I've taken all of our old Dell Latitudes C610 laptops that only I could keep
working and have turned my 8th grade science room into computer lab with 40
laptops (sometimes 36 students per class) with practically zero down time.
The first thing you have to consider here is I've done all of this by myself
with no funding support from my corporation, just proving it can be done! This
compares to our neighboring corp. who purchased 7000 netbooks last year for
high schools and plan on adding one to one computing the next two years in the
middle schools.
1. I have become somewhat of an expert at replacing keys, and on rare occasion
a keyboard. Before I got them, some students thought it was fun to pop the
keys off, but I told them my 2 year old grandson can do that, so they have
nothing to be proud of. Plus they started to realize, it merely hurt them as
far as having access to a fully functional computer.
2. First thing I had to do was disconnect the pointers physically because they
would go crazy and no other fix was permanent that didn't knock out the touch
pad too.
3. (By the way, I did get many ideas from this forum). Next I needed a lab
management system. Started with trials of smartsycn (raised to $1500 per
classroom), but FINALLY got open source Italc configured to work--FREE!
Missing a few nice features, but has the main ones like live thumbnails and
remote control etc.
4. The old 10 mb/s wireless cards were just overwhelmed, even with me
installing and additional personal router in addition to the schools access
point. Then I purchased two 24 port Dell switches off EBay for $30 each!
Students and I used our Enrichment class to configure static IP address and
make Cat 5 cables. I didn't have near enough from my personal supply, then I
purchased 30 25ft cat 5's off EBay for $2 each---but boy were then thin and
cheap.
All of a sudden, these old laptops went from 10 mb/s to 100mb/s! No more time
outs for the students! I could actually take control remotely of a student’s
computer without extreme latency (lag time).
5. Then my teachers computer (even with 3 gigs RAM, 512 video card) was
overwhelmed by monitoring 40 laps at the same time, so I had to configure a
second teachers computer to take half of the 40, this solved my problem! I
have two projectors going so even if I’m walking around the room, I can monitor
all 40 computers and lock one with my RF gyroscopic mouse if needed.
6. I then purchased a subscription to Quia for testing purposes. Got the idea
from this forum, best $50 per year I've ever spent! I have over 600 questions
in my question bank right now. Pulled my semester final together in 30
minutes!
7. Then I needed a student management system. Being the web master of my
schools web site I was delighted to discover our ISP had Moodle already
installed on our host server (older version, but still works). Another FREE
open source product that took some time to figure out how to configure. This
gives students direct links to Quia assignments AND gives them an option of
being able to download files from me and submit Word or Excel documents to me
without them having e-mail accounts (gave them e-mail accounts, that lasted
about one day).
8. I had some problems with cable management and fire inspections, but after
spending $250 in 25 ft power strips and making cord protectors by quartering 10
ft sections of black field drainage pipe (70 cents per 5 ft vs. $10 per 5 ft of
the official stuff) I'm still going and have been paperless for 6 weeks now!
The students LOVE it. We've even got networked chess so they can play each
other across the room by entering each other’s IP address during enrichment!
So I’ve basically taken 7 year old computers (about 100 years old in computer
years) and for less than $1000 created a $20,000 to $30,000 lab that is up just
as if not more consistently than our wired labs with desktops!
My next goal it so get student’s access to either touch screens (tablet PC's)
or digital tablets so math can be done paperless too! I believe I could
revolutionize the teaching of math if only I had the funding!
Paul Perry
8th Grade Science (taught math for 12 years)
BS: 5-12 Science, Math
Computer Endorsement
MS: Educational Technology
Castle North Middle School
________________________________________
EDTECH Editor-Hogan
>We have a small lab with only 20 desktop computers in it right now. We
>were thinking that if we >switched to laptops, we could fit more
Kelly,
I have a lab with 24 laptops and it works great. I don't' think though
that you'll necessarily get more laptops in the lab. They take the same
amount of real estate (elbow room and what not); but, significantly reduce
on chord clutter.
I don't recommend a wireless lab nor do I recommend using it without the
power chords.
What I do recommend is a laptop cart with two power chords for each
laptop. One to stay in the cart and one to stay in the lab.
That way when the lab isn't in use the laptops can be moved to other areas
if needed; but, when they are in use they just are moved from the cart to
the room.
Of course if it's going to be a fixed lab then you don't need the cart or
the extra chords.
But, I really don't think you'll fit more laptops in the lab just because
they don't have a tower.
*******
Jeff Hogan, M.S.
Instructional Technology Specialist
Health Sciences
Valencia Community College
1800 S. Kirkman, 4-14
Orlando, Florida 32811
407-582-5564
EDTECH Editor-Hogan
> We've even got networked chess so they can play each
> other across the room by entering each other’s IP address during
> enrichment!
FWIW, one thought about IP addresses in a lab/classroom (if you haven't
thought of it already Paul). I'll typically set up the DNS so that it will
just resolve hostnames without needing the full "hostname.domainname.tld".
Then for hostnames I do something like "r1s1", "r1s2", "r2s1"... for "Row
1, Seat 1", Row 1, Seat 2", "Row 2, Seat 1". This makes it easy to ID
computers without having to remember the full IP address.
> So I’ve basically taken 7 year old computers (about 100 years old in
> computer years) and for less than $1000 created a $20,000 to $30,000
> lab that is up just as if not more consistently than our wired labs with
> desktops!
It always amazes me at just how rare this type of thing is. The default
is to fall into the bureaucratic mindset and rationalize the "need" for
huge budgets. It also amazes me at how school administrations do not value
the rare people who are doing these types of things.
The administrations tend to view these people as a good employee, but one
that can easily be replaced -- and that's just not true. There never is a
fiscal number attached to that "good employee" and when they're not coddled
or have their egos stroked on rare occasions and wind up leaving, entire
programs fall apart, only to be replaced by those huge budgets or never to
be replaced at all.
In technology, there is way too much of an impulse to view issues in
terms of gadgets and budgets -- when it is *people* that make these things
run and cause them to be successful.
Regards,
.
Randy
--
"It will be a great day when our schools get all the money they need and the
Air Force has to hold a bake sale to buy a bomber." -- Women's
International League for Peace and Freedom.
EDTECH Editor-Hogan
Jeff has some good advice here, some on which addresses my concerns below:
I want to preface my response to this by emphasizing that this
information in reference to laptops labs only. One-one laptop
environments have their own unique qualities. We have abandoned, for
now, the laptop lab, we are beginning the discussion on how to implement
a one to one laptop environment using netbooks. Also, my response here
does not address curriculum or instruction. One assumes that these
discussions and decisions were made before the decision to provide any
type of lab was made.
In recent years wireless laptop computer labs have become quite popular.
One appeal is that they do not tie up a single room all day as a
computer lab. Also, it is believed that these labs are more useful for
educators and student’s alike. This is not the case. In general
wireless laptop labs are a poor substitute for a conventional wired lab.
First, let us address the time issue. When using a laptop lab, time
must be allotted for transporting the lab to the classroom, passing out
the laptops to the students, time to boot the computers, time to collect
the computers and transportation of the lab back to storage. On a good
day, with an average size class, you count on loosing at least 10 or
more instructional minutes a period. This figure does not include the
transportation of the lab back in forth from the classroom to storage.
Indeed, the transportation time needed for moving the lab between
storage and classroom and/or from classroom to classroom, results in the
lab usually being used in only one classroom a day. This, in turn
results in the reduced access to the lab. For example, a teacher may
wish to use the computer lab in period 2 and 4 but not the rest of the
day. The lab is moved to that teacher’s room where it is used during
period 2 and 4, but sits during all the other periods when other
teachers could be using it for their classes. Naturally, one could
argue that all the teaches need to do is move the lab and it sits there
all day while other teachers
Here are the reasons:
1. Teachers in our district voted against retaining the laptop lab.
2. Scheduling and use of the lab are more cumbersome. For example, in
our high school where we had two fixed desktop labs, we often have 1-3
teachers use a given lab on any day for 2 or periods each. With a
wireless lab, teachers tend to tie the lab up all day even if they are not
using it for every period. This is due to the time it takes to move and
set it up again.
3. Access is slow when you have an entire class logging on and going
somewhere on the web all at once. At best, we can only get a lab of 30
laptops to hit three nodes. These are a lot slower than 1000 mb switches
a wired lab would use.
4. Setting up and booting each machine for a ghost image takes longer than
simply re-imaging a wired lab.
5. The laptop lab wastes instructional time because each period you have
to handout, boot, login, shut down, and collect the laptops. Figure at
least 5-10 minutes at each end of the period.
6. Inevitably, one or more machines fail to charge because it wasn't
plugged in and or was left on, thus depriving one or more students of
access.
7. Battery replacement costs need to be figured into TCO. Batteries do
not last as long as the machines can.
8. Security software such as Computrace, adds to the expense of each
machine. This is between $25-$30 each per year. (30 machines x $25 x 4
years = $3000).
9. Video, sound and graphics intensive software that is run over the
network is difficult and slow.
10. Laptops do not have easily replaced components. I pulled a hard drive
out of one the other day and it required almost a total dismantling of the
machine. Count on increased labor time/costs to support laptops.
11. Laptops of equivalent quality will likely cost 30-50% more than
desktops. These margins are changing, but laptops are still more
expensive.
12. We found it difficult to schedule a computer based class with a laptop
lab since it required the teacher to set it up one or more times every
day.
Individually, none of these problems are insurmountable. However, taken
together it seemed that the logical choice is to abandon the laptops for a
wired lab.
EDTECH Editor-Beil
Paul,
This was one of the best emails I've ever seen on LM_NET for completeness and
clarity, and I have been a participant for many, many years.
Gordon
> X-From: R PERRY <ppe...@warrick.k12.in.us>
> The students LOVE it. We've even got networked chess so they can play each
> other across the room by entering each other's IP address during enrichment!
> So I've basically taken 7 year old computers (about 100 years old in computer
> years) and for less than $1000 created a $20,000 to $30,000 lab that is up
> just as if not more consistently than our wired labs with desktops!
> My next goal it so get student's access to either touch screens (tablet PC's)
> or digital tablets so math can be done paperless too! I believe I could
> revolutionize the teaching of math if only I had the funding!
---