Could someone please tell me if the Little Egret sub-species seen in Thailand is the same Little Egret sub-species seen in Australia? Thanks. ===============================
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According to the IOC list at http://www.worldbirdnames.org/ , the range of the nominate race includes Europe to Japan south to Africa, India and the Philippines, while the race nigripes is restricted to the Sundas to Australia and New Zealand.
Kevin Stracey
On 20 March 2012 15:53, Sonja Ross <sonja.ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Could someone please tell me if the Little Egret sub-species seen in > Thailand is the same Little Egret sub-species seen in Australia? Thanks. > ===============================
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > send the message: > unsubscribe > (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > to: birding-aus-requ...@vicnet.net.au
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The race of Little Egret seen in Thailand is the nominate race, egretta garzetta garzetta - notable for its completely yellow feet (as though it had walked in yellow paint). The usual race seen in Australia is egretta garzetta nigripes (sometimes immaculata).
The Asian nominate race does occur from time to time in Australia - usually up north, but has been recorded elsewhere. Ruth and I saw one at the Western Treatment plant on March 20th last year, and we posted information about our sighting on birding-aus.
This sighting resulted in a little bit of email traffic, most notably from Mike Carter where he pointed us to an article he had written in conjunction with Peter Menkhorst and published in Australia Field Ornithology. I have reproduced Mike's email in its entirety below, as I think it is valuable for the information on distinguishing the races.
Paul Dodd Docklands, Victoria
From: Mike Carter [mailto:pterodr...@bigpond.com] Sent: Monday, 21 March 2011 4:51 PM To: p...@angrybluecat.com; birding-...@lists.vicnet.net.au Cc: Dave Torr Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Little Egrets
Yes Paul, you're quite right about yellow-footed Little Egrets being of the nominate Asian race - that is if there is yellow on the upperside of the toes as well as the underside because as I'm sure you well know, adults of the Australian race have greenish-yellow soles. In more extreme examples, the birds appear to be wearing yellow booties on or to have walked in 2 cm deep bright yellow paint! This subspecies has previously been seen at the WTP Werribee, Victoria, and at Darwin in the Northern Territory where they maintained a presence for several years but I don't know the current situation there. For the first records, see: Carter, M. & Menkhorst, P. (2006), 'Nominate Subspecies of the Little Egret Egretta garzetta garzetta in Australian Territory', Australian Field Ornithology, 23: 104-108. Unfortunately I don't have a pdf of this paper. That paper has photographs that show the diagnostic features. Note that these subspecies also differ in the loral pattern whilst both have mostly black bills in adult plumage. In the Australian subspecies, the bare skin of the lores extends from the eye to the forehead and is bright yellow or orange. In the nominate race the loral pattern is less conspicuous because the pale area is restricted to the upper loral region with the black of the bill continuous through the gape almost to the eye. You should check this to confirm that your bird is of the Asian form.
On the other side of Port Phillip Bay we too have been having an interesting time with Egrets at the Eastern Treatment Plant. On 6 March we had our first Intermediate Egret since March 2001 with the only other recent record nearby being one in March 2006 at Edithvale. On that day we had two other Egrets greatly different in size that confused us for a long while but which I now believe were BOTH juvenile Little Egrets in spite of the size difference. Furthermore, we had similar birds on two other nearby wetlands on Saturday 19 March. The bills on these birds are black distally but yellow on basal half and some have black, not greenish-yellow soles. All the birds were photographed and I have written detailed reports which will be sent to Dave Torr with a view to placing them on the BOCA website. I suspect that they may have bred locally so we are seeing unfamiliar, very young, birds.
[mailto:birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au] On Behalf Of Sonja Ross Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012 4:23 PM To: birding-...@vicnet.net.au Subject: [Birding-Aus] Little Egret
Could someone please tell me if the Little Egret sub-species seen in Thailand is the same Little Egret sub-species seen in Australia? Thanks. ===============================
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Hi Paul and Sonja. Paul mentions that this Egret is usually seen up north. My friends and I have seen them a couple of times at Fogg Dam where the water sometimes flows over the dam road, and also at Leanyer Sewage Ponds. Hope this helps.
[mailto:birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au] On Behalf Of Paul G Dodd Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012 7:28 PM To: 'Sonja Ross'; birding-...@vicnet.net.au Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Little Egret
Hi Sonja,
The race of Little Egret seen in Thailand is the nominate race, egretta garzetta garzetta - notable for its completely yellow feet (as though it had walked in yellow paint). The usual race seen in Australia is egretta garzetta nigripes (sometimes immaculata).
The Asian nominate race does occur from time to time in Australia - usually up north, but has been recorded elsewhere. Ruth and I saw one at the Western Treatment plant on March 20th last year, and we posted information about our sighting on birding-aus.
This sighting resulted in a little bit of email traffic, most notably from Mike Carter where he pointed us to an article he had written in conjunction with Peter Menkhorst and published in Australia Field Ornithology. I have reproduced Mike's email in its entirety below, as I think it is valuable for the information on distinguishing the races.
Paul Dodd Docklands, Victoria
From: Mike Carter [mailto:pterodr...@bigpond.com] Sent: Monday, 21 March 2011 4:51 PM To: p...@angrybluecat.com; birding-...@lists.vicnet.net.au Cc: Dave Torr Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Little Egrets
Yes Paul, you're quite right about yellow-footed Little Egrets being of the nominate Asian race - that is if there is yellow on the upperside of the toes as well as the underside because as I'm sure you well know, adults of the Australian race have greenish-yellow soles. In more extreme examples, the birds appear to be wearing yellow booties on or to have walked in 2 cm deep bright yellow paint! This subspecies has previously been seen at the WTP Werribee, Victoria, and at Darwin in the Northern Territory where they maintained a presence for several years but I don't know the current situation there. For the first records, see: Carter, M. & Menkhorst, P. (2006), 'Nominate Subspecies of the Little Egret Egretta garzetta garzetta in Australian Territory', Australian Field Ornithology, 23: 104-108. Unfortunately I don't have a pdf of this paper. That paper has photographs that show the diagnostic features. Note that these subspecies also differ in the loral pattern whilst both have mostly black bills in adult plumage. In the Australian subspecies, the bare skin of the lores extends from the eye to the forehead and is bright yellow or orange. In the nominate race the loral pattern is less conspicuous because the pale area is restricted to the upper loral region with the black of the bill continuous through the gape almost to the eye. You should check this to confirm that your bird is of the Asian form.
On the other side of Port Phillip Bay we too have been having an interesting time with Egrets at the Eastern Treatment Plant. On 6 March we had our first Intermediate Egret since March 2001 with the only other recent record nearby being one in March 2006 at Edithvale. On that day we had two other Egrets greatly different in size that confused us for a long while but which I now believe were BOTH juvenile Little Egrets in spite of the size difference. Furthermore, we had similar birds on two other nearby wetlands on Saturday 19 March. The bills on these birds are black distally but yellow on basal half and some have black, not greenish-yellow soles. All the birds were photographed and I have written detailed reports which will be sent to Dave Torr with a view to placing them on the BOCA website. I suspect that they may have bred locally so we are seeing unfamiliar, very young, birds.
Mike Carter
-----Original Message----- From: birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au [mailto:birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au] On Behalf Of Sonja Ross Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012 4:23 PM To: birding-...@vicnet.net.au Subject: [Birding-Aus] Little Egret
Could someone please tell me if the Little Egret sub-species seen in Thailand is the same Little Egret sub-species seen in Australia? Thanks. ===============================
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-requ...@vicnet.net.au
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Thanks to those who replied. I am one of the moderators of the BirdLife Photographers gallery and we try to make sure that we have the i.d.s correct. One of the photographers submitted a Little Egret taken in Thailand, so I will suggest that he puts a note in the comments section to cover the two races. Sonja
> Hi Paul and Sonja. Paul mentions that this Egret is usually seen up north. > My friends and I have seen them a couple of times at Fogg Dam where the > water sometimes flows over the dam road, and also at Leanyer Sewage Ponds. > Hope this helps.
> Tony
> -----Original Message----- > From: birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au > [mailto:birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au] On Behalf Of Paul G Dodd > Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012 7:28 PM > To: 'Sonja Ross'; birding-...@vicnet.net.au > Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Little Egret
> Hi Sonja,
> The race of Little Egret seen in Thailand is the nominate race, egretta > garzetta garzetta - notable for its completely yellow feet (as though it had > walked in yellow paint). The usual race seen in Australia is egretta > garzetta nigripes (sometimes immaculata).
> The Asian nominate race does occur from time to time in Australia - usually > up north, but has been recorded elsewhere. Ruth and I saw one at the Western > Treatment plant on March 20th last year, and we posted information about our > sighting on birding-aus.
> This sighting resulted in a little bit of email traffic, most notably from > Mike Carter where he pointed us to an article he had written in conjunction > with Peter Menkhorst and published in Australia Field Ornithology. I have > reproduced Mike's email in its entirety below, as I think it is valuable for > the information on distinguishing the races.
> Paul Dodd > Docklands, Victoria
> From: Mike Carter [mailto:pterodr...@bigpond.com] > Sent: Monday, 21 March 2011 4:51 PM > To: p...@angrybluecat.com; birding-...@lists.vicnet.net.au > Cc: Dave Torr > Subject: Re: [Birding-Aus] Little Egrets
> Yes Paul, you're quite right about yellow-footed Little Egrets being of the > nominate Asian race - that is if there is yellow on the upperside of the > toes as well as the underside because as I'm sure you well know, adults of > the Australian race have greenish-yellow soles. In more extreme examples, > the birds appear to be wearing yellow booties on or to have walked in 2 cm > deep bright yellow paint! > This subspecies has previously been seen at the WTP Werribee, Victoria, and > at Darwin in the Northern Territory where they maintained a presence for > several years but I don't know the current situation there. For the first > records, see: > Carter, M. & Menkhorst, P. (2006), 'Nominate Subspecies of the Little Egret > Egretta garzetta garzetta in Australian Territory', Australian Field > Ornithology, 23: 104-108. Unfortunately I don't have a pdf of this paper. > That paper has photographs that show the diagnostic features. > Note that these subspecies also differ in the loral pattern whilst both have > mostly black bills in adult plumage. In the Australian subspecies, the bare > skin of the lores extends from the eye to the forehead and is bright yellow > or orange. In the nominate race the loral pattern is less conspicuous > because the pale area is restricted to the upper loral region with the black > of the bill continuous through the gape almost to the eye. You should check > this to confirm that your bird is of the Asian form.
> On the other side of Port Phillip Bay we too have been having an interesting > time with Egrets at the Eastern Treatment Plant. On 6 March we had our first > Intermediate Egret since March 2001 with the only other recent record nearby > being one in March 2006 at Edithvale. On that day we had two other Egrets > greatly different in size that confused us for a long while but which I now > believe were BOTH juvenile Little Egrets in spite of the size difference. > Furthermore, we had similar birds on two other nearby wetlands on Saturday > 19 March. The bills on these birds are black distally but yellow on basal > half and some have black, not greenish-yellow soles. All the birds were > photographed and I have written detailed reports which will be sent to Dave > Torr with a view to placing them on the BOCA website. I suspect that they > may have bred locally so we are seeing unfamiliar, very young, birds.
> Mike Carter
> -----Original Message----- > From: birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au > [mailto:birding-aus-boun...@lists.vicnet.net.au] On Behalf Of Sonja Ross > Sent: Tuesday, 20 March 2012 4:23 PM > To: birding-...@vicnet.net.au > Subject: [Birding-Aus] Little Egret
> Could someone please tell me if the Little Egret sub-species seen in > Thailand is the same Little Egret sub-species seen in Australia? Thanks. > ===============================
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > send the message: > unsubscribe > (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > to: birding-aus-requ...@vicnet.net.au
> To unsubscribe from this mailing list, > send the message: > unsubscribe > (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) > to: birding-aus-requ...@vicnet.net.au
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send the message: unsubscribe (in the body of the message, with no Subject line) to: birding-aus-requ...@vicnet.net.au
