The FM-HD power upgrade is not all it seems
HD Radio Farce
"To wit, how many existing installations will have sufficient headroom
to implement the increase without significant retooling of
transmission hardware?.. Some simply won't make it with their existing
transmitters, and plant cooling capacity will also have to be bumped
up along with electrical power mains service, and back-up generating
plant output... Those using high level combining schemes will face
similar issues, as reject loads, digital transmitters, etc., will all
have to be upsized... One thing's for certain: approval of a 6dB HD
digital boost will mean lots of extra hours, as managers and owners
task their engineers with delivering a wee bit more digital drive
without melting down already overheated corporate budgets. For many,
actually making it happen is likely to be an agonizing process."
Few stations outside of NPR will/can do it. A survey of the 700 NPR
stations, only 186 responded, and only 70% will up the power. The is
out of reach for most commercial stations. Even iBiquity stated that
the -6db won't help much, and even a -10db will improve little. This
still has not been approved by the fraudsters at the FCC, and Media
Access Project just submitted under Docket 99-325 that the NPR/
iBiquity studies did not factor in the affects on LPFMs. If this goes
through, expect a class-action suit by non-HD broadcasters.
Jo Jo Gunn
"HD Radio Farce" <hdradi...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a6f408cb-90f9-4ffc...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
> "Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
In a development that could vastly improve HD Radio signal reception
and propel the digital radio service forward, an agreement has been
reached for an HD power increase. It would give all HD FMs a
four-fold power hike, but most stations could get an even BIGGER bump.
HD Radio Farce
> "HD Radio Farce" <hdradiofa...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:a6f408cb-90f9-4ffc...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
>
> In a development that could vastly improve HD Radio signal reception
> and propel the digital radio service forward, an agreement has been
> reached for an HD power increase. It would give all HD FMs a
> four-fold power hike, but most stations could get an even BIGGER bump.
"People I've spoken to who actually own HD equipped stations tell me
that the transmitters they have might be able to handle a 3-4 db
increase but not the currently proposed 6db increase. They are
hopeful that doubling the power will make HD more viable, but they are
very cautious about saying it will fix everything. They also tell me
they are not about to invest the money to do a 6 db power increase.
The general opinion I've heard is, there is no return on the
investment. Imagine that.... Maybe there will be some real bargains on
lightly used two-year-old transmitters, that don't have the guts to
jump to the new power requirements. Every cloud has a silver lining."
LOL!
HD Radio Farce
>
> > "Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
>
> In a development that could vastly improve HD Radio signal reception
> and propel the digital radio service forward, an agreement has been
> reached for an HD power increase. It would give all HD FMs a
> four-fold power hike, but most stations could get an even BIGGER bump.
"People I've spoken to who actually own HD equipped stations tell me
Jo Jo Gunn
On Nov 7, 1:55?am, "Jo Jo Gunn" <vhr74a...@sneakemail.com> wrote:
> "HD Radio Farce" <hdradiofa...@gmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:a6f408cb-90f9-4ffc...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
>
> In a development that could vastly improve HD Radio signal reception
> and propel the digital radio service forward, an agreement has been
> reached for an HD power increase. It would give all HD FMs a
> four-fold power hike, but most stations could get an even BIGGER bump.
>"People I've spoken to who actually own HD equipped stations tell me
>that the transmitters they have might be able to handle a 3-4 db
>increase but not the currently proposed 6db increase. "
Too bad!
People I've spoken to are dying to upgrade and give their HD signals closer
to the reach of the analog signal!
It's on the way!
Get used to it! LOL!
Jo Jo Gunn
On Nov 7, 1:55?am, "Jo Jo Gunn" <vhr74a...@sneakemail.com> wrote:
> "HD Radio Farce" <hdradiofa...@gmail.com> wrote in
> messagenews:a6f408cb-90f9-4ffc...@j4g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>
> > "Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
>
> In a development that could vastly improve HD Radio signal reception
> and propel the digital radio service forward, an agreement has been
> reached for an HD power increase. It would give all HD FMs a
> four-fold power hike, but most stations could get an even BIGGER bump.
>"People I've spoken to who actually own HD equipped stations tell me
>that the transmitters they have might be able to handle a 3-4 db
>increase but not the currently proposed 6db increase. "
Too bad!
paul
I bought a HD radio and it's SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
SMS
Yeah, this is great news. Virtually 100% of FM stations in urban areas
are planning to add HD if the power increase is approved by the FCC. The
cost of the extra equipment is lost in the noise considering what
they're gaining in terms of (virtual) spectrum.
One reason the stations like the HD approach is that unlike an
allocation of additional spectrum, solely for digital, they already own
their chunk of spectrum on FM and they aren't going out and buying more.
It will only take a little advertising (or other revenue generation
method) to pay for the equipment upgrades.
It's rare that we get an agreement like this that has minimal negative
implications for the stakeholders.
Was listening to KLLC in HD last night. The difference between the sound
on analog versus HD was amazing. Plus it's very cool to see the artist
and title scroll across the screen.
Looks like our favorite troll is quite upset over the latest victory for
the broadcast stations and for iBiquity.
John Higdon
<09757cae-576d-4646...@j9g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
paul <paul...@att.net> wrote:
> I bought a HD radio and it's SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
No kidding.
--
John Higdon
+1 408 ANdrews 6-4400
AT&T-Free At Last
Jo Jo Gunn
"paul" <paul...@att.net> wrote in message
news:09757cae-576d-4646...@j9g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
Of course that tells us nothing.
What brand? What model? Are you anywhere near any HD signals?
That would be more indicative than posting a one sentence invective.
Jo Jo Gunn
"John Higdon" <hi...@kome.com> wrote in message
news:higgy-AAFCD3....@news.announcetech.com...
> In article
> <09757cae-576d-4646...@j9g2000prh.googlegroups.com>,
> paul <paul...@att.net> wrote:
>
>> I bought a HD radio and it's SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
>
> No kidding.
They are obviously getting better...and we'll see better performance with
the power increases.
SMS
>> I bought a HD radio and it's SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
>
> Of course that tells us nothing.
>
> What brand? What model? Are you anywhere near any HD signals?
You're missing the sarcasm.
Jo Jo Gunn
"SMS" <scharf...@geemail.com> wrote in message
news:4af73c2e$0$1648$742e...@news.sonic.net...
Apparently so!
briank101
> "SMS" <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote in message
Just heard that the FCC could approve this within weeks.http://
www.twice.com/article/387941-FCC_Could_Act_Soon_To_Boost_Digital_FM_Stations_Output.php
Glad I installed a HD radio a year ago in both my car and my wife's.
Finally HD radio may become a "real" enhancement to FM reception
unlike right now with 1% power where HD radio reception is only good
when the analog FM is good. Hopefully now suburbanites (those over 25
miles from the transmitters) will at last hear clean noise free
reception where they live and drive. I will soon be able to
confidently recommend HD radio to my friends which I haven't been able
to do up to now.
John Higdon
<aa952d68-6308-4175...@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
briank101 <bri...@coast103.com> wrote:
> Just heard that the FCC could approve this within weeks.http://
> www.twice.com/article/387941-FCC_Could_Act_Soon_To_Boost_Digital_FM_Stations_O
> utput.php
Sounds like the early days of spam. "I just found this really great
website."
Is iBiquity so afraid of falling flat on its face that it has to spam
the newsgroups with this sort of crap?
briank101
> In article
> <aa952d68-6308-4175-b5b4-52140ab66...@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com>,
>
> briank101 <bri...@coast103.com> wrote:
> > Just heard that the FCC could approve this within weeks.http://
> > utput.php
>
> Sounds like the early days of spam. "I just found this really great
> website."
>
> Is iBiquity so afraid of falling flat on its face that it has to spam
> the newsgroups with this sort of crap?
>
> --
> John Higdon
> +1 408 ANdrews 6-4400
> AT&T-Free At Last
Well you certainly like to make assumptions about who is posting.
No I'm a huge fan of FM radio since I built my own FM transmitter and
ran a pirate in Ireland at age 15 in the late 80s, early 90s and my
fascination with radio electronics led me to study EE. I really think
is IBOC is one of the coolest things to happen to radio since FM
itself. Since 1995, I'm not associated with any aspect of the
broadcast business, just a humble listener. Anyway once again I am
looking forward to the power increase and it will a nice couple of
months observing the various Chicago stations turn up their power,
maybe only in small increments at first due to equipment or site
limitations.
SMS
<snip>
> Well you certainly like to make assumptions about who is posting.
> No I'm a huge fan of FM radio since I built my own FM transmitter and
> ran a pirate in Ireland at age 15 in the late 80s, early 90s and my
> fascination with radio electronics led me to study EE. I really think
> is IBOC is one of the coolest things to happen to radio since FM
> itself. Since 1995, I'm not associated with any aspect of the
> broadcast business, just a humble listener. Anyway once again I am
> looking forward to the power increase and it will a nice couple of
> months observing the various Chicago stations turn up their power,
> maybe only in small increments at first due to equipment or site
> limitations.
It's rather amusing to see the vitriolic tone regarding the recent
events in HD Radia vis-a-vis the NPR/Ibiquity agreement regarding power
increases on HD. I mean you expect it from the troll poster
(HDRadioFarce) who is not familiar with broadcasting from either a
technical or business perspective, but not from certain other posters.
Digital radio is the future of terrestrial radio yet apparently some
broadcast engineers are so upset over the way it's being deployed that
they're actually willing to do financial harm to the stations they work
for by advising management against adding the HD sub-channels.
Higdon has had a long career in broadcasting in the bay area, especially
back at KOME. He really needs to get himself educated about HD and
pro-actively encourage his employers to get their act together on HD.
Instead he views every post that is remotely positive about HD radio as
being spammed from iBiquity. He claims to have kill-filed me because I
posted the model of HD radio that I installed in one of my vehicles, and
that I bought it from Crutchfield. Geez, talk about someone that's
suddenly a few beers short of six pack.
I heard that there's going to be a 24 hour John Rothmann HD sub-channel
available soon, so Higdon has another reason to get on the HD bandwagon.
Nick Name
> briank101 wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> > Well you certainly like to make assumptions about who is posting.
> > No I'm a huge fan of FM radio since I built my own FM transmitter and
> > ran a pirate in Ireland at age 15 in the late 80s, early 90s and my
> > fascination with radio electronics led me to study EE. I really think
> > is IBOC is one of the coolest things to happen to radio since FM
> > itself. Since 1995, I'm not associated with any aspect of the
> > broadcast business, just a humble listener. Anyway once again I am
> > looking forward to the power increase and it will a nice couple of
> > months observing the various Chicago stations turn up their power,
> > maybe only in small increments at first due to equipment or site
> > limitations.
>
> It's rather amusing to see the vitriolic tone regarding the recent
> events in HD Radia vis-a-vis the NPR/Ibiquity agreement regarding power
> increases on HD. I mean you expect it from the troll poster
> (HDRadioFarce) who is not familiar with broadcasting from either a
> technical or business perspective, but not from certain other posters.
Right, from what I can see, HD Radio Farce, has no understanding of
the radio business, has no technical expertise, and wants to put all
his money on analog AM radio.
> Higdon has had a long career in broadcasting in the bay area, especially
> back at KOME. He really needs to get himself educated about HD and
> pro-actively encourage his employers to get their act together on HD.
> Instead he views every post that is remotely positive about HD radio as
> being spammed from iBiquity.
It's amazing isn't it? ANY post that has anything remotely positive
to say about HD is criticized as being "shills" for iBiquity. I think
some of these HD Haters are living in the past.
I recall engineers and IT people telling us there was "no need for
WIndows". "Windows just uneccesarily complicates things". Time to
step into the present time.
I can't imagine that he is working against his employers best
interests and dissing HD radio. Especially with Classical radio in
such dire straights these days.
> I heard that there's going to be a 24 hour John Rothmann HD sub-channel
> available soon, so Higdon has another reason to get on the HD bandwagon.
LOL!
leansto...@democrat.com
Oh please, what engineer said there was no need for windows. In the
day, you screamed for multitasking. Don't you remember Quarterdeck?
My guess is HD Farce hates the QRM of Iboc. Who doesn't?
Mike Ward
wrote:
>I can't imagine that he is working against his employers best
>interests and dissing HD radio. Especially with Classical radio in
>such dire straights these days.
Not sure what that has to do with Mr. Higdon's stations, all three of
which feature a locally-oriented adult contemporary format.
And he's not exactly "anti-technology cranky", either. His facilities
have plenty of modern technology needed to produce today's radio...
just no HD stuff.
SMS
<snip>
> My guess is HD Farce hates the QRM of Iboc. Who doesn't?
He does not have even the slightest understanding of the QRM issue.
The key issue in QRM is whether or not there is interference within the
protected contours of the station in question. A station that now has
interference only outside its protected contours has no basis for a
complaint. It's like a vehicle owner complaining to the manufacturer
that on their previous model they went 25,000 miles between oil changes
even though the manual specified 5000 mile oil changes so they don't
understand why their new vehicle's engine was destroyed after going only
20K miles without an oil change, and why the warranty won't cover a new
engine.
leansto...@democrat.com
Oh don't give me that protected contour stuff. I want things the way
they used to be. Hash is for breakfast, not broadcasting.
The Costco in Livermore had a HD radio on display. I couldn't get one
station to work in HD. Now granted, this is in a big box store, but
people that go to brick and mortar do so for a reason. They like to
play with the device physically before shelling out the bucks.
As I pointed out many times, Fry's would actually sell a few wifi
radios if they had wifi nearby. Hell, even a LAN to play these
internet radios would be a plus. How the hell the Fry's brothers got
to be billionaires is beyond me.
HD Radio Farce
> On Nov 9, 1:44�pm, "Jo Jo Gunn" <vhr74a...@sneakemail.com> wrote:
>
> > "SMS" <scharf.ste...@geemail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:4af73c2e$0$1648$742e...@news.sonic.net...
>
> > > Jo Jo Gunn wrote:
>
> > >>> I bought a HD radio and it's SHIT!!!!!!!!!!
>
> > >> Of course that tells us nothing.
>
> > >> What brand? �What model? �Are you anywhere near any HD signals?
>
> > > You're missing the sarcasm.
>
> > Apparently so!
>
> Glad I installed a HD radio a year ago in both my car and my wife's.
> Finally HD radio may become a "real" enhancement to FM reception
> unlike right now with 1% power where HD radio reception is only good
> when the analog FM is good. Hopefully now suburbanites (those over 25
> miles from the transmitters) will at last hear clean noise free
> reception where they live and drive. I will soon be able to
> confidently recommend HD radio to my friends which I haven't been able
> to do up to now.
"Warp Factor 6, Mr. Scott"
"To wit, how many existing installations will have sufficient headroom
to implement the increase without significant retooling of
transmission hardware?.. Some simply won't make it with their existing
transmitters, and plant cooling capacity will also have to be bumped
up along with electrical power mains service, and back-up generating
plant output... Those using high level combining schemes will face
similar issues, as reject loads, digital transmitters, etc., will all
have to be upsized... One thing's for certain: approval of a 6dB HD
digital boost will mean lots of extra hours, as managers and owners
task their engineers with delivering a wee bit more digital drive
without melting down already overheated corporate budgets. For many,
actually making it happen is likely to be an agonizing process."
Most stions won't be able to afford, or have the headroom, for the
increase. Besides, a power increase will help little - the sidebands
will just jam each other further.
HD Radio Farce
"He does not have even the slightest understanding of the QRM issue."'
Really? LOL! No one has been able to stop me, and never will. Posters,
such as yourself, just fuel the fire. My blog has been firmly in place
for two years, sitting under iNiquity's website. The web hits that I
have gotten are mindblowing - never dreamed that it would have such
influence - LOL! I could care less about your insults, or newsgroups,
as they both have zero impact. On Google's Homepage for searches on
"HD Radio" - Yea! Almost 7,000 backlinks - Yea! The Internet has
literally been trashed with HD Radio Farce! Keep up the good fight!
Dave Barnett
> leansto...@democrat.com wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> My guess is HD Farce hates the QRM of Iboc. Who doesn't?
>
> He does not have even the slightest understanding of the QRM issue.
>
> The key issue in QRM is whether or not there is interference within the
> protected contours of the station in question. A station that now has
> interference only outside its protected contours has no basis for a
> complaint.
OK. Time for me to set the record straight here:
1. A station's signal does not disappear outside the "protected
contour". It's an imaginary line that really didn't mean much until
Ibiquity decided to create this much interference. I can see the 99.1 /
91.5 transmitters from my front yard. But I can't receive a clean
signal thanks to HD carriers from 98.9 and 91.7.
2. This is the Bay Area. There are many instances of HD interference
within protected contours, due to the terrain. The average citizen
doesn't understand why, and thinks the signals are just weak.
We'll see how this works out. As a radio afficionado I am hopeful that
somehow the audio quality will get better and there will be some real
effort with HD-2 channels, giving us back the programming diversity we
have now lost. But let's face it - AM Stereo was a bigger leap than FM
HD. We all know where that went.
Dave B.