Vic Training exercise???
Alan Hinton
does anyone know anything about the training exercise that apparently
happened in Port Phillip Bay last weekend???
Some Plane crash or something...
Displan exercise.
Oh well I never hear about these things til later
Cathy
Simon
"Alan Hinton" <Price...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:UfXd8.1389$25....@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
As far as I'm aware, It was an exercise between VicPol, SES & Royal Life
Saving Society (RLSS). Was based around the Altona area, as the Altona Life
Saving Club as well as the Boating Panel from RLSS were both involved. If
you'd like I can see if I can drum up some more information, but you've hit
the nail in the head with what it was.. DISPLAN exercise involving a Plane
Crash on open water (well, from what I was told anyways)
Regards,
Simon.
rashbick
(the "plebs" LOL of each service didn't need to know. Only the "heads" of
each volunteer organisation knew) the information before they arrived on
scene knew what they were up for, as it was treated as a "real' incident.
It was a displan exercise for volunteer organisations (aside of course for
police).
I can't give many more details then that as I was working on the day so
missed it :-(.
jeff
by in a holding area for 2 hours... ends up being a waste of the incident.
not much point if is doesnt actually test out out response capabilities.
ahennell
running displan or other exercises is a fine balance between informing the
services prior, and keeping it secretive.
With the career services, exercises are easier to run as it's just another day
on the job. To pull volunteers out of work for an exercise is a bad thing.
There are ways of testing various components of the displan & emergency response
without actually calling out teams. Simply calling the unit's duty officer &
saying "this is a displan exercise - I need to know how many personnel you can
field in X minutes - get back to me" is sufficient. The duty officer then does
their ring around, and informs of the results.
Nothing replaces full operational exercises tho. Let the vollies know the
exercise is coming up, let them get time off work, etc (they'd probably be able
to leave in a real emergency anyway), but don't give them (or any crews) the
scenario until the day.
This way you test both Emergency Response and Operational abilities of the
services without causing undue stress to the vollies work commitments.
Cheers,
Andrew.
rashbick
had no idea where it would be, what was involved, etc (all to be revealed
when we arrived on scene).
jeff and nicole
organisations would stop feeling the need to show off and be the best and
fastest on scene. my experience is from a few years ago so it may have
changed (at least one can hope) but we got into a situation where the
unofficial competition was to be first on scene so each organiseation would
be gathered 2 km from where the incident would be (conveniently leaked) and
the whole thing would wind up being a complete toss off. I also remenber one
st john division buying members new uniforms and making them swap FA kits
for standard division ones for the day so they would look better than
another division attending the incident. everyone was too paranoid about
keeping their uniforms pretty and clean to do any actual work.
oh well, maybe we have progressed past this level by now :-)
Cathy
least we used to). I didn't even hear about it on the day. It took 4 days
til I found out from my mate who was there. I could have been racking up
hours. I always get a call if they need someone to go on duty, so why not
the displan exercise???
Sorry for whinging. Just annoyed that noone bothered to tell me.
Oh well guess I have to take it up with the div. supt.
Thanks for the info guys.
Cathy
rashbick <rash...@firefighting.com> wrote in message
news:a5bpcb$5sggm$1...@ID-102784.news.dfncis.de...
Simon
"Simon" <s...@spammers.die.bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:Q3de8.7600$RV3....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
<snip>
>
> As far as I'm aware, It was an exercise between VicPol, SES & Royal Life
> Saving Society (RLSS). Was based around the Altona area, as the Altona
Life
> Saving Club as well as the Boating Panel from RLSS were both involved. If
> you'd like I can see if I can drum up some more information, but you've
hit
> the nail in the head with what it was.. DISPLAN exercise involving a Plane
> Crash on open water (well, from what I was told anyways)
>
FYI, Coast Guard was involved as well.
Regards,
Simon.
Cathy
jeff and nicole <bou...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:TiBe8.1398$936....@ozemail.com.au...
the moment. I am personally waiting to get a pair of overalls (secondhand)
and have been for the last 18 months. I go to motocross where it is really
muddy and overalls are the "state norm" and I keep getting told that I ain't
getting any til the cadets do some fundraising.
jeff and nicole
they were easy, $30 from a painters supply shop and a set of badges. what
div are you from if I can ask without being rude? maybe I can help with
some fundraising ideas. I had about 6 years of running fundraising
activities when I was in. not trying to be arrogant, just trying to help
;-)
ahennell
> Well in our division we don't have the money to be buying new uniforms at
> the moment. I am personally waiting to get a pair of overalls (secondhand)
> and have been for the last 18 months. I go to motocross where it is really
> muddy and overalls are the "state norm" and I keep getting told that I ain't
> getting any til the cadets do some fundraising.
To me that's madness. Every volunteer emergency service member should be
provided with adequate protective dress and personal protective equipment in
order to perform their tasks properly.
At no stage should such items be held up waiting for fundraising, or worse for
members to buy themselves.
I'd chase up the chain of command - unit, division/region, state and ask why
they're not giving you adequate protective dress. It becomes a very real OH&S
issue for emergency service personnel. If they don't have the budget to supply
such items, then it's about time they made noise further up their chain of
budget to find some.
Cheers,
Andrew.
--
Andrew Hennell
------------------------
NSW SES - training officer, Ashfield-Leichhardt Unit
Australian Emergency Services Volunteers Network - founder. www.aesvn.org
Cathy
ahennell <ne...@uhohnsa.net.au> wrote in message
news:3C7D9AF8...@uhohnsa.net.au...
> To me that's madness. Every volunteer emergency service member should be
> provided with adequate protective dress and personal protective equipment
in
> order to perform their tasks properly.
>
> At no stage should such items be held up waiting for fundraising, or worse
for
> members to buy themselves.
>
> I'd chase up the chain of command - unit, division/region, state and ask
why
> they're not giving you adequate protective dress. It becomes a very real
OH&S
> issue for emergency service personnel. If they don't have the budget to
supply
> such items, then it's about time they made noise further up their chain of
> budget to find some.
>
> Cheers,
> Andrew.
>
> --
> Andrew Hennell
> ------------------------
> NSW SES - training officer, Ashfield-Leichhardt Unit
> Australian Emergency Services Volunteers Network - founder. www.aesvn.org
>
Part of the problem Andrew is that I'm a senior cadet.
We should have overalls for Motocross, displan exercises, and all night
duties, but our division has just gone through some pretty big changes like
merging 3 divisions into 1, and getting a new divisional superintendant. We
now have 2 cadet campuses annexed to the adult division.
So I have been told that coz I'm under 18 the money has to come from the
cadet campuses even though I attend the adult meetings. Or on the other hand
fork out $120 for them myself. Not everyone has that sort of money.
All the Adults are campaigning for me at the moment but the divisional supt.
won't budge.
Will have to consider not going on these "overall duties" in the future til
I get my overalls. I hve been to all the "overall duties" except for maybe 2
or 3 in the last 18 months.
I complain too much.
Cathy
Cathy
> are these the green ones?
> are you still allowed to wear the white ones cause
> they were easy, $30 from a painters supply shop and a set of badges.
> what div are you from if I can ask without being rude?
Doncaster/Box Hill Combined. The Cadets from Ringwood/Nuna are with
Whitehorse but the adults went to Manningham. Big mess.
> maybe I can help with some fundraising ideas. I had about 6 years of
running > fundraising activities when I was in. not trying to be arrogant,
just trying to
> help ;-)
Would love some ideas for some fundraising activities that I can get the
cadets involved in. We had almost 60 cadets at both campuses at the start of
last year, and 20 adults at Box Hill. Now the numbers are starting to
dwindle at nuna campus.
I don't want to start any trouble. Just get this sorted.
Cathy
Ice
Sometimes, complaining is the only way to get anything done. I agree 100%
with Andrew in that you MUST have the appropriate dress to do the job if
only from an OHS&W perspective. I wonder what the service would say (hope
it never happens) if something went wrong........
Keep trying!!
Ice
Cathy
I have been complaining and even was told to borrow overalls at one stage.
It was state supercross comps and everyone had to wear them. I borrowed the
overalls but have since had to wear our dress uniform to motocross. You
can't borrow forever. Oh well after this time I am refusing to go to any
duty that requires overalls until I get my own pair. Even if this means
getting millions of phone calls to ask me to go.
At motocross we should wear them especially on wet days so we can be seen by
the riders when we are crossing the track. We almost had one member run over
by the bikes 4 times in one day!!!! Also for night duties they are now a
state requirement.
Will just have to stick to my guns. There goes my hours badge.....
Just a small sacrifice to get the proper gear...
Cathy
Ice <mccarthy...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:WGxf8.1493$wb7....@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
Craig
Even as a Volunteer, the organization as a duty of care to provide the
correct PPE to individuals, if there is an incident both the individual and
the supervisor are responsible, in this case it would be you, the OIC of the
duty and the DO or Supt. you are totally correct in not attending with out
overalls for example.
If you can't get anywhere with your DO, DON or Supt, maybe its time to seek
out the District Officer. Because ultimately it's their bum that the
Commissioner will kick if you are injured on a duty because of lack of PPE.
Cheers
Craig
Cathy
Just to let you all know I won't be getting overalls coz the divsion has
sorta got no money at the moment. So I will be refusing to do "overall
duties" til further notice.
M'asalama
Cathy
Craig <ra...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:lMEf8.18291$RV3....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Rodney Grech
a pair of orange overalls untill you get an issue. You can pick them up for
about $30.00. In our Cadet unit we just go buy what we need. Takes to long
to get PPE from HQ
"Cathy" <Cathy_...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:uvih8.28$uR5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
ahennell
> Ok im not SES or anything along those lines but why cant you go out and buy
> a pair of orange overalls untill you get an issue. You can pick them up for
> about $30.00. In our Cadet unit we just go buy what we need. Takes to long
> to get PPE from HQ
Coz she's not SES, so organge wouldn't suit her! (or maybe it would ;o)
SES overalls, as do other emergency service overalls, conform to various
standards - usually for reflective tape / visability, and proban anti-fire
treatment. Overalls off the shelf don't meet these standards.
Sadly, I think you're right in not doing overall-demanding jobs if they're not
supplied, especially if the organisation receives funds for providing a service
at these events. I'd keep talking up the chain of command until something is
sorted out.
Cheers,
Andrew.
Craig
the correct overalls, I've been out of St John operations for a while so I'm
not sure what style are used now but if she doesn't have the correct
overalls she is out of uniform and as a senior cadet that looks bad on a
duty. (yeah petty I know) but thats life.
Cathy: if you wan't some fund raising ideas email me, I can put you in
touch with some cadet officers I still have contact with. I used to be the
Supt of a Cadet divison in Tas
raxyl@bigpond .net.au
Cheers
Craig
RFS Tim
but your local workwear shop would probably need to order 'em in.
White (as per SJA, VRA etc) you can buy almost anywhere.
Try www.blackwoods.com.au, or www.prosafe.com.au
Two piece yellow proban (unbadged) can be purchased from www.shcc.com.au
Dunno who makes 2 piece SES gear....
cheers
Tim
"ahennell" <ne...@uhohnsa.net.au> wrote in message
news:3C85BE49...@uhohnsa.net.au...
Erk
"Craig" <ra...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:Sijh8.6186$nC6....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Most importantly, it is an OH&S issue. If STJ require someone to do duties
requiring overalls as a form of PPE, they should provide it. Simple as that.
Cathy (or anyone else in a similar position) is already giving up her time
so why should she have to put her hand into her pocket when the gear is
supposed to be supplied by the organisation?
I'm totally behind the no PPE equals no work requiring PPE point of view.
Appearance is one issue but personal safety is the most important issue
here.
Erk
Cathy
SJA overalls used to be white and they may still be in some states, but in
Vic they have been green for about 4 years and you can't buy the colour
green off the shelf anywhere. I have looked and if I could buy them I would.
The other problem is I would then be out of uniform and be sent home so I
may as well not go...
Will keep putting pressure on div. supt. coz at the moment don't like/trust
region. A little thing called lost all division's paperwork for tennis and
everything else...
Cathy
RFS Tim <rfs...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:C8lh8.144$uR5....@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
Gordon ALLAN
Discussion.
This line of conversation is inappropriate for this forum and shall cease
immediately.
Should members wish to discuss this further, I suggest they make appropriate
comments as per their Chain of Command.
Gordon ALLAN
Divisional Superintendent
Whitehorse Combined Division
"Cathy" <Cathy_...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:uvih8.28$uR5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
RFS Tim
You are sooooooooooooo NOT allowed to make such a demand!
How dare you try and intimidated people from saying their bit in a public
forum.
If you are worried about your dirty linen being aired, then maybe you should
fix the problem - ie give them the gear you are obliged to supply.
"Gordon ALLAN" <atom...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:AGBj8.11695$mp.5...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Craig
But in a public discussion forum, such as this, the newsgroup rules apply,
not some rules you have come up with based on you own self interest, at no
stage has St John banned members from free and open discussion with their
peers. Disclosure to media is to be through the appropriate chain of
command, but to my knowledge this discussion group is not a media
enterprise.
Any member of St John who has a conflict with a superior officer has the
right to seek advice from a district officer, cadets included.
I am no longer a member of St John Operations, and it was people playing
politics like this that made me decide to resign my commission.
My advise to you sir, would be to spend your energies on running your
division and resolving conflict rather than spouting off in a newsgroup,
offending all and sundry and generally causing conflict.
Craig Large
"Gordon ALLAN" <atom...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:AGBj8.11695$mp.5...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Ops_M...@save_sja_from_bullies.org
<atom...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
>Attention : Current Members of Operations Branch Involved in this
>Discussion.
>
>This line of conversation is inappropriate for this forum and shall cease
>immediately.
>
>Should members wish to discuss this further, I suggest they make appropriate
>comments as per their Chain of Command.
>
>Gordon ALLAN
>Divisional Superintendent
>Whitehorse Combined Division
>
Dear Gordon,
Given that I think that in normal times you are probably a sane and
generally nice guy, as are most of the SJA Operations Branch types
that I have dealings with, and not one of the infrequent pompous, self
opinionated, generally long winded people we HAVE to deal with at
times, I would ask you to reconsider the manner in which you "suggest"
the discontinuation of this tread.
Your directive, from a "Divisional Superintendent", suggests that you
have had a brain fart!!!
What were you thinking??? <tap tap tap on your head>
Are you intent on continuing the idea that in EVERY volunteer service
there are a few people who allow their high opinion of themselves to
rule the side of their brain that controls reason and respect.
Maybe your comments should be recinded with an apology as soon as
possible.
Perhaps a short note advising that a more appropriate process, or a
comment relating to the general difficulties of Ops Branch Divisions
in relation to fund raising may have been a more appropriate in this
forum of emergency service personnell and those who support them.
Yup, it is people like you who are forcing me to reduce my involvement
with SJA, and focus on my real job as a paid officer in the Ambulance
service.
Dear Gordon ALLAN, Divisional Superintendent, Whitehorse Combined
Division, What a great example of tolerance and rapour you
demonstrate.... (I have to stop before I puke). All you have done is
bring you, your Division, and your position into disprepute.... But it
is a good thing that a lot of the readers in this forum have the
ability to apply the dickhead filter.
From,
One pissed off member who has worked for years to rid SJA of
anachronistic non communicative people (unlike you)
rast...@spam_me_not.con
>"Cathy" <Cathy_...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
>news:uvih8.28$uR5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
>> Salams to all,
>> Just to let you all know I won't be getting overalls coz the divsion has
>> sorta got no money at the moment. So I will be refusing to do "overall
>> duties" til further notice.
>>
>> M'asalama
>> Cathy
>>
followed. Lo' and behold, overalls appeared.. It is hard to staff
duties with no staff!!!
You go girl!!
And Craig, a well structured response!!! Pity others cannot be so
reasoned, or not take the post as a personal attack :))
Cheers
Bob
Christopher J. Maxwell
Tosser..........
I see no issue of national security or a serious effect on operational
status if
a member discusses issues pertaining to uniform issue on a public forum.
Please point your ego towards the nearest freight exit.
Why not politely contact members concerned directly via return email off
this newsgroup?
Stop trying to advertise / big note your position within your organisation.
There are certain ways to go about things............you failed. Publicly I
might add and as such so has
your representation of your organisation.
rourkster
<atom...@bigpond.net.au> wrote:
Having just checked my GPS I have found that I am living in Australia
not some eastern european country with a military regime, and have
come to the conclusion that freedom of speech is still allowed here at
the moment.
Rourkster
Garry
John "Cheifs" treat their volunteers. They think they run our lives, even
when not on duties.
Remember Gordon, if we didn't volunteer, you'll have know one to boss
around. Your comments show St John in a bad light Not the members who
choose to discuss matters. WANKER
Garry Luxton
NSW
ahennell
Whilst I appreciate your concerns that the current discussion may bring bad
light upon an orgasnisation, I am also worried that you find it more important
to stifle conversation than to supply PPE.
PPE (Overalls, Gloves, Footwear, Eyewear, etc) is not a "nice to have", but
essential. At one level, it simply shows respect for your volunteers and
concern about their safety.
At the more serious end of the scale, your legal obligations are clear. Any
employer (and that includes those of volunteers) who fails to provide adequate
personal protective equipment is guilty of gross negligence. Just because
you're a charity, or a volunteer organisation, doesn't remove you from your
legal obligations to ensure a safe workplace - nor does it protect you from
legal action (private & government) should an incident occur.
I can empathise with the situation if your organisation is unable to afford PPE
for their members. Many volunteer emergency service organisations are in a
similar position, however from my experience they all make a concerted effort to
ensure this most basic level of equipment is provided. Perhaps you need to put
off those one or two “big ticket” items and simply buy the overalls. Fundraise,
or seek Government assistance.
For a large, national (international?) organisation to expect their local
volunteers, who volunteer their time for training and operational events, to
then go out & fundraise is – to me – wrong. These volunteers signed up for
training, for providing first aid, for attending sporting and other events, not
to be a bucket brigade.
At no stage should a volunteer be placed in a potentially dangerous situation
due to lack of supply of PPE, and at no stage should a volunteer have to dip
into their own pocket to purchase their own PPE.
As you’re obviously in a position of power within the organisation, please raise
this matter with your peers & chain of command, and ensure that the provision of
adequate PPE receives the priority it should.
Finally, please note also that the original poster, whom you chose to come down
upon, was not the one who identified the organisation in question – she was
merely asking neutral advice.
Cheers,
Andrew.
--
Andrew Hennell
------------------------
champ
No wonder St John is viewed as a bunch of halfwits throughout most of the
country. Please, Gordon, do us all a favour - do not go around representing
the organisation ad hoc.
I must agree with "One pissed off member" who replied previously to this.
I've also been a member for years. Take a lesson, Gordon - don't sprout
bullshit in an official capacity on a NG that has nothing, in reality, to do
with your role in St John.
champ
"Gordon ALLAN" <atom...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:AGBj8.11695$mp.5...@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
Treborde
I'll avoid a complete repeat of the other post (in "st john discussion"
topic) and just say that all this doesn't really represent St John, or at
least not from my experience in the organisation. I'm a happy member. I make
mistakes and I disagree with things but St John can handle that.
Sadly some old attitudes creep in from time to time, even from people who
are excellent members (or officers) of the organisation. It's an easy
mistake to get defensive when you see the organisation you think is pretty
good coping a beating. I suspect Mr Allen is not as oppressive as his posts
suggests but he wanted to try and protect St John. To that end I think his
intentions were honourable, even if the execution was off.
TJF
"champ" <all...@ozemail.com.au> wrote in message
news:3s0k8.2761$523.2...@ozemail.com.au...
Ooooh geez I bet ol' Gordy is sitting at home in front of his computer with
steam billowing out of his ears. How dare all you insolent wretches pick on
him heheheehhe. He cant help it if the pins on the pips on his shoulder
have severed the blood flow to his brain. This happens naturally when you
take on a commission.......bwhahahahhaa. oops sorry.. I feel dirty picking
on a boss.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
Erk
me - snipped as we've all read it by now>
Excellent. I've now become a member of STJ it appears. I wonder if the whole
of the related conversation has been followed and the meaning of it
understood or not.
Surely an off-group email to any members who do post on this group would
have been preferrable to a post to a group where most members are not
members of STJ and were offering their advice to an ES colleague about a
general question on PPE. This would have achieved a better result.
I think that the original post in this thread has given the topic that was
being written about more publicity against non STJ members in this group
than was the case originally.
Erk
(speaking on behalf of me, myself and I as always)