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Re: Christians and Military Service
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1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
May 19, 2013, 2:58:05 AM5/19/13
to
"vince garcia" to philip.saunders wrote in message
>You clearly didn't read the passage clear enough to note the direct
>context, but expanded the direct context into legalism, to the point
>where a Christian based on YOUR opinion can't serve in the military (nor
>presumably serve on a jury, hold a government office, and so on) because
>they must make an oath to uphold the constution which in your exalted
>opinion they can't do, ergo they can't do any of these things
Correct Vince.
"4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life;
that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
5 And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he
strive lawfully"
2 Tim 2:4-5 (KJV)
>misguided fellow
LOL!
>> So how can you join the military where you must do so in order to join?
>>
>> 2) You must love your enemies
> Love doesn't mean let them kill you and not defend yourself
Oh! but it does, Vince.
"36 Even as it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We
were accounted as sheep for the slaughter."
Romans 8:36 (ASV)
>> So how can you kill someone you love?
>A criminal kicks open the door and approaches your wife with a knife.
>He's going to cut her throat in 5 seconds what do you do?
Pray to retain your faith and composure and reason with him, or if that
fails....."Father, forgive them....."
>"Uh, I start to pray, and--"
Yes! complete success in obeying Christ.
"25 For anyone who keeps his life for himself shall lose it; and anyone who
loses his life for me shall find it again. 26 What profit is there if you
gain the whole world—and lose eternal life? What can be compared with the
value of eternal life?
Matt 16:25-26 (TLB)
Amen!
> Ok, she's now dead, and he's cut the phone line. Now he's heading over
> to rape your daughter. What do you do?
Have you forgotten that God has promised never to tempt the faithful beyond
what they can bear?
"13 There isn't any temptation that you have experienced which is unusual
for humans. God, who faithfully keeps his promises, will not allow you to be
tempted beyond your power to resist. But when you are tempted, he will also
give you the ability to endure the temptation as your way of escape. "
1 Cor 10:13 (GW)
AMEN!
>> 3) You must do good to all men
>>
>> How can killing a man's son or making a woman a widow be doing them good?
>He's now done with your daughter, and going to cut her throat. What do
>you do?
Think of Christ and be prepared to die......
"For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We were accounted as sheep for
the slaughter."
......and then LIVE again for evermore!!!
"Anyone who loses his life for me shall find it again"
AMEN!
Jeff...
>You clearly didn't read the passage clear enough to note the direct
>context, but expanded the direct context into legalism, to the point
>where a Christian based on YOUR opinion can't serve in the military (nor
>presumably serve on a jury, hold a government office, and so on) because
>they must make an oath to uphold the constution which in your exalted
>opinion they can't do, ergo they can't do any of these things
Correct Vince.
"4 No man that warreth entangleth himself with the affairs of this life;
that he may please him who hath chosen him to be a soldier.
5 And if a man also strive for masteries, yet is he not crowned, except he
strive lawfully"
2 Tim 2:4-5 (KJV)
>misguided fellow
LOL!
>> So how can you join the military where you must do so in order to join?
>>
>> 2) You must love your enemies
> Love doesn't mean let them kill you and not defend yourself
Oh! but it does, Vince.
"36 Even as it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We
were accounted as sheep for the slaughter."
Romans 8:36 (ASV)
>> So how can you kill someone you love?
>A criminal kicks open the door and approaches your wife with a knife.
>He's going to cut her throat in 5 seconds what do you do?
Pray to retain your faith and composure and reason with him, or if that
fails....."Father, forgive them....."
>"Uh, I start to pray, and--"
Yes! complete success in obeying Christ.
"25 For anyone who keeps his life for himself shall lose it; and anyone who
loses his life for me shall find it again. 26 What profit is there if you
gain the whole world—and lose eternal life? What can be compared with the
value of eternal life?
Matt 16:25-26 (TLB)
Amen!
> Ok, she's now dead, and he's cut the phone line. Now he's heading over
> to rape your daughter. What do you do?
Have you forgotten that God has promised never to tempt the faithful beyond
what they can bear?
"13 There isn't any temptation that you have experienced which is unusual
for humans. God, who faithfully keeps his promises, will not allow you to be
tempted beyond your power to resist. But when you are tempted, he will also
give you the ability to endure the temptation as your way of escape. "
1 Cor 10:13 (GW)
AMEN!
>> 3) You must do good to all men
>>
>> How can killing a man's son or making a woman a widow be doing them good?
>He's now done with your daughter, and going to cut her throat. What do
>you do?
Think of Christ and be prepared to die......
"For thy sake we are killed all the day long; We were accounted as sheep for
the slaughter."
......and then LIVE again for evermore!!!
"Anyone who loses his life for me shall find it again"
AMEN!
Jeff...
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
May 20, 2013, 3:44:56 PM5/20/13
to
Jim wrote in message news:
> Should a Christian go to war?
Not when Jesus teachers his faithful [immersed in water] brethren, not to
"Resist evil" and forbids them to harm or "kill" other humans, and to make
sure to "Love your enemies". It makes it impossible, but millions 'fall by
the wayside' when war looms in their country.
This happen in both world wars, where professing 'christians' fought each
other and even ask God to bless their efforts in killing their enemies.
Blatant hypocrisy!!!
Jeff...
jwshe...@satx.rr.com
May 20, 2013, 6:27:16 PM5/20/13
to
On May 20, 2:44 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
Glad, you admit you would have been a "good German"
and do nothing to save those about to be gassed.
Numbers 35:19
The revenger of blood himself shall slay the murderer:
when he meeteth him,
he shall slay him.
and do nothing to save those about to be gassed.
Numbers 35:19
The revenger of blood himself shall slay the murderer:
when he meeteth him,
he shall slay him.
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
May 21, 2013, 2:02:40 AM5/21/13
to
wrote in message
news:02f6a31f-2643-4ac7...@y5g2000yqy.googlegroups.com...
On May 20, 2:44 pm, "1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist"
<jnhickl...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> Jim wrote in message news:
> > Should a Christian go to war?
>
> Not when Jesus teachers his faithful [immersed in water] brethren, not to
> "Resist evil" and forbids them to harm or "kill" other humans, and to make
> sure to "Love your enemies". It makes it impossible, but millions 'fall
> by
> the wayside' when war looms in their country.
>
> This happen in both world wars, where professing 'christians' fought each
> other and even ask God to bless their efforts in killing their enemies.
> Blatant hypocrisy!!!
>
> Jeff...
~ and do nothing to save those about to be gassed.
It's a matter of being a "Good" follower of Christ's teaching not to kill
or harm other human beings and to "Love our ENEMIES".
What the German's did under the leadership of Hitler is in the capable hands
of Almighty God who raised him into power in the first place.
> Numbers 35:19
> The revenger of blood himself shall slay the murderer:
> when he meeteth him,
> he shall slay him.
Christ's Laws are now what matter in this Christian dispensation.
And he forbids "resisting evil" and even forbids retaliation even when
personally attacked or assaulted.
"38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for
a tooth: 39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall
smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also"
Matt 5:38-39 (KJV)
It is very hard to do this, much, much, harder then not retaliating and
defending oneself, nevertheless, it is what the Master commands of his
faithful Saints.
Jeff...
1st Century Apostolic Traditionalist
May 24, 2013, 3:17:29 AM5/24/13
to
Phil wrote in message news:
>I am, essentially a reformed Christian, I differ from Calvinists on two
>points only. I am not a believer in infant baptism, I am not a trinitarian
>although I cannot tell you what I am in the regard because I am nothing
>since it is, in my opinion, a mystery that we cannot understand
I disagree, Phil, for it is quite understandable if we delve into Christ's
wholly subordinate relationship with his Father.
This is one of the verses that sums it up for me.
"5 For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man,
Christ Jesus"
1 Tim 2:4-5 (ASV)
>and therefore should not argue about.
Well as so many use it to judge others as to whether they are a Christian
or not, it comes inevitable to join in discussions about it.
Jeff...
"3 Dear friends, I had intended to write to you about the salvation we
share. But something has come up. It demands that I write to you and
encourage you to continue your fight for the Christian faith that was
entrusted to God's holy people once for all time."
Jude 1:3 (GW)
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