Adelaide Electification
Ray McDermott
Electrification and tram-trains for Adelaide
THE only Australian state capital without an electrified rail network is
to receive $A 2 billion (1.9 billion) investment over the next decade as
part of plans unveiled by the government of South Australia. Most of
Adelaide’s and 120km commuter rail network will be electrified all
passenger lines will be converted from broad gauge to standard gauge.
The Noarluga, Outer Harbor, Grange and Gawler lines will be electrified
at 25kV ac, and a fleet of 50 emu cars will be ordered.
Fifty-eight of the existing class 3000/3100 demus will be converted to
electric operation and refurbished. The remaining 12 demus in the
TransAdelaide fleet will be refurbished for use on the Belair line,
which will remain diesel-operated until an Australian government-funded
study determines the future of the steeply-graded Adelaide Hills section
of the Adelaide – Melbourne line.
Light rail services are also set for a makeover with the introduction of
Australia’s first tram-trains. The 12.5km Glenelg – City light rail will
be extended to Adelaide Entertainment Centre before joining the Grange
Line and running to West Lakes. Another light rail line will be built
from Port Adelaide on the Outer Harbor line to Semaphore. Four
additional single voltage Flexity Classic LRVs will be ordered from
Bombardier for the initial extension to the Entertainment Centre, and
another 15 dual-voltage LRVs will be ordered for the West Lakes and
Semaphore services. The tram-train project will be completed by 2012.
News managed by NewsPro.
Graham Sheldon
electrified rail network.
> Electrification and tram-trains for Adelaide
> THE only Australian state capital without an electrified rail network is
> to receive $A 2 billion (1.9 billion) investment over the .......etc"
John Dennis
> Talking of Australian state capitals, Darwin and Hobart are also without an
> electrified rail network.
I don't think Darwin is a state capital, but Hobart certainly is. It
looks like that little island off the south coast has been left off
the map - again!!
John
Matthew Geier
> On 24 Jun 2008 03:56:34 GMT, Athol <athol_S...@idl.net.au> wrote:
>
>>Does that mean that they'll have trams running into train stations?
>>
>>I guess that they'll have to have separate platforms with a different
>>height (rail to platform) to the train platforms, unless they're going
>>to do something very inventive with tram heights...
>
> From memory, that's the way it's done in Manchester, where the tram runs
> into Victoria station.
Nope - Manchester trams are high floor - the platforms make them level
boarding - this results in quite high platforms structures being built in
the streets - a lot of the out part of the 1st stage of the modern
Manchester tramway was converted suburban railway anyway - the trams use
the former stations.
The 'Eccles' line was all new - it has this silly time-keeping sapping
arrangement where the tramway turns off the road into a large station
built beside the road on land that would have once been houses and then
turns out into the road again. Of course each time the tram has to wait
for an entire cycle of the traffic lights to get into the station and out
again. The happens for several stops in succession.
Adelaide are now committed to low floor - the platforms on the mixed use
sections are going to have to be dual height - or if all passenger
services are by tram, demolished.
David Bennetts
"Athol" <athol_S...@idl.net.au> wrote in message
news:12142797...@idlwebserver.idl.com.au...
> Ray McDermott <ray...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Most of
>> Adelaide's and 120km commuter rail network will be electrified all
>> passenger lines will be converted from broad gauge to standard gauge.
>> The Noarluga, Outer Harbor, Grange and Gawler lines will be electrified
>> at 25kV ac,
>
> will make new rolling stock purchases very easy.
>
Also much more economical to construct. 25kV AC requires less heavy
overhead catenary and support masts, and fewer feeder substations.
Regards
David Bennetts
Paul Blair
seems to be slowly going to standard gauge, but their metro system is
broad gauge and 1500 VDC. Shopping for equipment just go a whole lot
harder...
Paul
Paul Westcott
> Paul Blair wrote:
>
>> The Victorians will now have an interesting situation. Their system
>> seems to be slowly going to standard gauge, but their metro system is
>> broad gauge and 1500 VDC. Shopping for equipment just go a whole lot
>> harder...
>
> only one running the modern "standard" of standard gauge and 25kV AC.
>
> QLD have 25kV but it's on narrow gauge and "visiting" standard gauge
> rolling stock are banned from using it on the dual gauge lines from NSW.
>
> NSW have standard gauge but it's 1500V DC.
>
> VIC have broad gauge with 1500V DC.
>
> ACT have no real functional train services...
>
> What gauge and voltage is WA?
Perth's suburban system is all 1067mm (narrow) gauge, using 25kV
electrification.
Paul Westcott
Kevin Martin
> Ray McDermott <ray...@tpg.com.au> wrote:
>
>> Most of
>> Adelaide's and 120km commuter rail network will be electrified all
>> passenger lines will be converted from broad gauge to standard gauge.
>> The Noarluga, Outer Harbor, Grange and Gawler lines will be electrified
>> at 25kV ac,
>
> will make new rolling stock purchases very easy.
>
manufacturers are used to customising stock. Things like external
dimensions, number of doors, type of usage, internal layouts etc. are
just some of the configuration criteria to be considered rather than
mere control system & track gauge.
It is not like Boeing plane where the outside shell comes in a small
number of configurations and the interior is the main difference between
carriers. Or road vehicles.
Kevin Martin
Paul Blair
>
> What gauge and voltage is WA?
1067mm (3'6") and 25kV AC, AFAIK
Paul
Les Brown
>
>So we'll have a mixture across the country where Adelaide will be the
>only one running the modern "standard" of standard gauge and 25kV AC.
>
>QLD have 25kV but it's on narrow gauge and "visiting" standard gauge
>rolling stock are banned from using it on the dual gauge lines from NSW.
>
>NSW have standard gauge but it's 1500V DC.
>
>VIC have broad gauge with 1500V DC.
>
>ACT have no real functional train services...
>
>What gauge and voltage is WA?
>
>And to make things really interesting, apparently the ARTC controlled
>tracks are all nominally intended to have double height container
>clearance in all new works, thus preventing electrification unless a
>new standard is developed for raising the catenary height and extending
>the reach of pantographs. Hence, don't expect interstate
>electrification any time soon...
This is an Australian tradition! It's called "rugged individualism" or "an
independant, non-subservient, self-reliance". Me? I call it for what I think
it is; "absolute idiocy".
Back in the old days, a State expressed their independance by going narrow
gauge. Then,.as if going 3'6" wasn't enough, QLD went buffered couplings,and
air-braked.Tassie went buffered stock, but with vacuum brakes. WA must have
dwelled hard on how to be different to the others and came up with the idea
of going vaccum-brake like Tassie, but just to be certain that none of their
wagons could ever couple up with anyone else's, they coupled up using centre
"chopper" couplings. Now poor SA, what could they do? How could they be
different? They then chose the only option left; that's right - "chopper"
couplings, air-braked!! Brilliant!!!
N.Z. couldn't express their individuality by going 3'6" and using different
couplings and brakes, since any option they chose would be the same as at
least one State in Australia. So they chose a system that was as far from NZ
as you could get; they copied WA. Apparently that wasn't far enough for the
Kiwis. To keep their individuality intact, they wouldn't join the
Federation!!!
Just to make life even more interesting, when they built the TAR, what did
the Commonwealth aim for, just to make sure their rolling stock couldn't
couple up with NSWGR??? They went MCB auto-couplings at a time when no other
state in Australia was using them, nor likely to fully change over for
another 40 years.
Yep, call our rugged determined independance by any name you like, because
the only lie you would be guilty of making would have been in saying it was
"good for the country".
Les Brown
Andrew Price
<mat...@no.sleeper.no.apana.no.org.no.au> wrote:
>> From memory, that's the way it's done in Manchester, where the tram runs
>> into Victoria station.
>
> Nope - Manchester trams are high floor
Yes, you're right, now that I think a bit more carefully. Engage
brain before starting tongue...
>- the platforms make them level
>boarding - this results in quite high platforms structures being built in
>the streets
St Peter's square now comes to mind, those platforms certainly weren't
at street level.
>- a lot of the out part of the 1st stage of the modern
>Manchester tramway was converted suburban railway anyway - the trams use
>the former stations.
Indeed - the line to Bury on one side of the city, and another (whose
name escapes me now - Sale?) on the other side, beyond the old central
station.
David Bennetts
> And to make things really interesting, apparently the ARTC controlled
> tracks are all nominally intended to have double height container
> clearance in all new works, thus preventing electrification unless a
> new standard is developed for raising the catenary height and extending
> the reach of pantographs. Hence, don't expect interstate
> electrification any time soon...
Double stacking on the existing Brisbane - Sydney - Melbourne corridor isn't
go to happen because of the myriad of low structures around. With the
rapidly increasing fuel costs electrification of these important freight
links should be considered NOW - obviously using modern 25 KV systems .
Regards
David Bennetts
Matthew Geier
> The Victorians will now have an interesting situation. Their system
> seems to be slowly going to standard gauge, but their metro system is
> broad gauge and 1500 VDC. Shopping for equipment just go a whole lot
> harder...
The Sydney and Melbourne suburban systems are probably bigger than the
rest of the Australian city urban railways combined. Sydney and Melbourne
individually are probably bigger than the rest combined.
1500vDC is a common system world wide. The southern half of France is
1500vDC for example.
Effectively the only difference between the traction electronics in a
25kV AC train and a 1500v DC train is that the AC train is carrying a
transformer.
Track gauge and particularly the loading gauge would have a more
significant impact.
Matthew Geier
> And to make things really interesting, apparently the ARTC controlled
> tracks are all nominally intended to have double height container
> clearance in all new works, thus preventing electrification unless a new
> standard is developed for raising the catenary height and extending the
> reach of pantographs. Hence, don't expect interstate electrification
> any time soon...
If there was the will to do interstate electrification, having the wire
high enough to clear double stacks would be a no-brainer.
It's only an issue were the interstate and the urban intersect. Like in
Sydney. Not sure there is enough space in the pantograph bays in the
Tangara and later trains to put a long reach pantograph.
I don't think there is a common interstate standard for wire height and
construction anyway - after all there is still no prospect of the systems
being linked and rolling stock through run, so no real driver for each
state to any any thing common between their electrification systems at
all. (It's more than wire height - stagger as well).
John Dennis
> N.Z. couldn't express their individuality by going 3'6" and using different
> couplings and brakes, since any option they chose would be the same as at
> least one State in Australia. So they chose a system that was as far from NZ
> as you could get; they copied WA. Apparently that wasn't far enough for the
> Kiwis. To keep their individuality intact, they wouldn't join the
> Federation!!!
Nice story. Are you sure that NZR were the same as WA? I was under the
impression that they used airbrakes in New Zealand. They were also
different in that they only had a hook on their chopper at one end.
Getting back to electrification, NZ was historically 1500v DC, now
limited to just the Wellington suburban area. The NIMT electrification
was 25kv AC, as will be the Auckland suburban system when completed.
So over there they currently have both system in use...
John
Les Brown
wrote:
John, you have ruined a perfectly good story. Yes, I believe NZ is
airbraked.
Damn.
And things have got better. NSWR changed over to MCB. All Australian 3'6"
gauge wagon can couple up to everyone else's 3'6" wagons trains and run on
each others tracks - except BPR and Zig-Zag (What do they use?) and other
preserved NFP lines.
Isn't NZ thinking of joining the Federation?
Les Brown.
Vote out Brendan Nelson
David Bennetts
"Vote out Brendan Nelson" <vo...@out.com> wrote in message
news:48647d99$0$17511$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
Though Hobart did once have quite a useful suburban service (railcars) along
the Derwent Valley.
Regards
David Bennetts
C. Dewick
>Paul Westcott <p_gwe...@removetoreplyoptusnet.com.au> wrote:
>> Perth's suburban system is all 1067mm (narrow) gauge, using 25kV
>> electrification.
>Ta. I thought it was something like that. They standardised some of the
>rural lines but not the suburban stuff. Any idea if they have any 25kV AC
>over standard gauge?
I don't think so - all the suburban trains are 1067 mm (same as QLD) gauge.
There is some standard gauge outside the Perth Metro area (down to Fremantle
industrial area, etc.) but there aren't actually any standard guage 25 KV
trains.
Craig.
--
Craig Dewick - HO-Scale Railway Modeller and Professional Train Manager at
http://lios.apana.org.au/~craigd or cra...@lios.apana.org.au if you're game!
RailZone Australia - http://www.railzone.org - No Fundies! No RailCorp CodeCon!
http://lios.apana.org.au/mailman/listinfo/aus_rail_safety for Oz Rail Safety
David Bennetts
"C. Dewick" <cra...@lios.apana.org.au> wrote in message
news:g43rij$9l6$1...@yoda.apana.org.au...
> I don't think so - all the suburban trains are 1067 mm (same as QLD)
> gauge.
> There is some standard gauge outside the Perth Metro area (down to
> Fremantle
> industrial area, etc.) but there aren't actually any standard guage 25 KV
> trains.
>
> Craig.
>
> --
> Craig Dewick - HO-Scale Railway Modeller and Professional Train Manager at
> http://lios.apana.org.au/~craigd or cra...@lios.apana.org.au if you're
> game!
> RailZone Australia - http://www.railzone.org - No Fundies! No RailCorp
> CodeCon!
> http://lios.apana.org.au/mailman/listinfo/aus_rail_safety for Oz Rail
> Safety
Whilst there are no standard gauge 25kv trains, there is dual gauge track
over which the catenary is installed, as the photo here clearly shows.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Western_Australia
Regards
David Bennetts
David Bennetts
> In aus.rail David Bennetts <davibenn...@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
>
>
> I haven't gone looking for info, but I wouldn't be surprised if their
> access conditions prevent "visiting" SG rolling stock from accessing
> the overhead power, as is the case for Queensland, where there is also
> 25kV AC over dual gauge.
>
> --
> Athol
> <http://cust.idl.com.au/athol> Linux Registered User # 254000
> I'm a Libran Engineer. I don't argue, I discuss.
There might also be some technical reasons for not being able to access the
overhead with SG stock. One could be that as the overhead is centred over
the narrow gauge side, the pantograph attached to a SG vehicle would be off
centre, and liable to entanglement. Another could be that one of the
outside rails would not be electrically bonded.
Regards
David Bennetts
David Johnson
>
> Whilst there are no standard gauge 25kv trains, there is dual gauge track
> over which the catenary is installed, as the photo here clearly shows.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Western_Australia
I'm pretty sure that portion of standard gauge trackage only sees 2
trains a week.
--
---
Innocent as a newborn alligator!
---
David Johnson
usenet.at.trainman.id.au
http://www.trainman.id.au
------------------------------------
These comments are made in a private
capacity and do not represent the
official view of RailCorp.
scoot
"David Johnson" <use...@trainman.id.au> wrote in message
news:4867a3f0$1...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
> David Bennetts wrote:
>
>>
>> Whilst there are no standard gauge 25kv trains, there is dual gauge track
>> over which the catenary is installed, as the photo here clearly shows.
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Western_Australia
>
> I'm pretty sure that portion of standard gauge trackage only sees 2 trains
> a week.
Probably a little more than that, David. The IP is twice weeky, but the
Prospector to Kalgoorlie is twice daily, the Merredin Avonlink is daily, as
is the Northam Avonlink. There is also the private dining train, cant recall
the name, and I think that runs Friday and Sunday. Still not busy, but a
little more than twice a week. No freight runs on tis section though.
shane
David Johnson
You're right. I'd forgotten about all the local standard gauge trains.
I must get back to Perth again.
--
---
Got Kleptomania? Take something for it!
scoot
> scoot wrote:
>> "David Johnson" <use...@trainman.id.au> wrote in message
>> news:4867a3f0$1...@dnews.tpgi.com.au...
>>> David Bennetts wrote:
>>>
>>>> Whilst there are no standard gauge 25kv trains, there is dual gauge
>>>> track over which the catenary is installed, as the photo here clearly
>>>> shows.
>>>>
>>>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rail_transport_in_Western_Australia
>>> I'm pretty sure that portion of standard gauge trackage only sees 2
>>> trains a week.
>>
>>
>> Probably a little more than that, David. The IP is twice weeky, but the
>> Prospector to Kalgoorlie is twice daily, the Merredin Avonlink is daily,
>> as is the Northam Avonlink. There is also the private dining train, cant
>> recall the name, and I think that runs Friday and Sunday. Still not busy,
>> but a little more than twice a week. No freight runs on tis section
>> though.
>
> You're right. I'd forgotten about all the local standard gauge trains. I
> must get back to Perth again.
>
anytime.
GrassyNoel
> Probably a little more than that, David. The IP is twice weeky, but the
> Prospector to Kalgoorlie is twice daily, the Merredin Avonlink is daily, as
> is the Northam Avonlink. There is also the private dining train, cant recall
> the name, and I think that runs Friday and Sunday. Still not busy, but a
> little more than twice a week. No freight runs on tis section though.
Sadly the Spirit of the West dinner train has been suspended/withdrawn
because of high fuel prices.