Neutral Bay tram line
David Martin
Looking at a street directory, I figure the line went down Wycombe St. But
did it cross Kurraba Rd, go into Lower Wycombe Rd, then Hayes St & terminate
at Hayes St Wharf?
Where was Shell Cove Loop?
David Martin
Blue Mountains Railway Pages
http://www.mountains.net.au/plaza/rail/
David Bennetts
David Martin <d_ma...@mountains.net.au> wrote in article
<36787...@news.camtech.net.au>...
Hayes Street itself was quite steep. There was a safety facility built in
Hayes Street to stop trams running onto the wharf and possibility into the
harbour, in the form of a catch point which would deflect an out of
control tram into the gutter - it was necessary for the conductor to get
out here and hold over the points for a descending tram before it could
proceed to the terminus.
I recall reading of an amusing incident where the breakdown tram was
summonsed to retrieve a broken down tram from the Hayes St wharf. The
breakdown tram
(C class four wheeler) was hooked up, then the entire rear apron and
coupler broke off this tram under the strain. In the resulting commotion
dogs barked and the milko's horse shied, leaving broken bottles and spilt
milk all over Hayes St.
Regards
David Bennetts
Canberra
David Bennetts
David McLoughlin <dav...@REMOVEiprolink.co.nz> wrote in article
<367974...@REMOVEiprolink.co.nz>...
> David Martin wrote:
> >
> > Where exactly was the Neutral Bay tram line's steep hill?
>
> The ruling grade of the line was 1 in 8.75.
>
> > Looking at a street directory, I figure the line went down Wycombe St.
But
> > did it cross Kurraba Rd, go into Lower Wycombe Rd, then Hayes St &
terminate
> > at Hayes St Wharf?
>
> The line went from Neutral Bay Junction south via Wycombe Rd, west into
> Kurraba Rd and south into Hayes St to the wharf. Until 1949 it
> terminated on a special jetty. In 1949 this was declared unsafe and the
> trams then stopped on the grade in Hayes Street.
According to David Keenan's book "The North Sydney Lines" the line on the
wharf was closed on February 25, 1952.
> > Where was Shell Cove Loop?
>
> The Shell Cove Loop began 100 metres south of Neutral Bay Junction and
> meandered two thirds of the way down Wycombe Road.
>
From a point just north of Harrison Street to just south of Raymond Road
The line was originally divided into two staff sections, (1900 -1908) but
these were combined as the timetable did not require crossings.
> David McLoughlin
> Auckland New Zealand
>
> I remember the Ice Age. It was what they claimed was happening to the
> weather before they invented Global Warming.
Regards
David Bennetts
Canberra
>
David McLoughlin
>
> Where exactly was the Neutral Bay tram line's steep hill?
The ruling grade of the line was 1 in 8.75.
> Looking at a street directory, I figure the line went down Wycombe St. But
> did it cross Kurraba Rd, go into Lower Wycombe Rd, then Hayes St & terminate
> at Hayes St Wharf?
The line went from Neutral Bay Junction south via Wycombe Rd, west into
Kurraba Rd and south into Hayes St to the wharf. Until 1949 it
terminated on a special jetty. In 1949 this was declared unsafe and the
trams then stopped on the grade in Hayes Street.
> Where was Shell Cove Loop?
The Shell Cove Loop began 100 metres south of Neutral Bay Junction and
meandered two thirds of the way down Wycombe Road.
David McLoughlin
Bill Bolton
> Hayes Street itself was quite steep.
Not really, something like 1 in 30 I think.
Cheers,
Bill
Bill Bolton
> Where exactly was the Neutral Bay tram line's steep hill?
Wycombe Rd, between a bit North of Harietta St and Kurraba Rd.
> Looking at a street directory, I figure the line went down Wycombe St. But
> did it cross Kurraba Rd, go into Lower Wycombe Rd
No, it turned into Kurraba Rd for a block and then into Hayes St down
to terminate on the level on a short jetty until 1952. After that
trams terminated on Hayes St short of the jetty.
> Where was Shell Cove Loop?
In Wycombe Rd between approx Harrison St and Thrupp St... it was quite
lengthy. It was originally called Harrison Loop. but later became
Shell Cove loop, from Shell Cove Rd which joined Wycombe St about half
way along the loop.
Kurraba Rd, Wycombe Rd and Harietta St are part of one of the
traditional "back routes" for auto traffic between the North Sydney
area and Cremorne/Mosman dating back many , many years. Many
residents of the general vicinity knew of the "special" trams that
operated on the route, but they only ever saw the single track ends of
the route, near the Wharf or at Neutral Bay Junction, and so had no
idea there was a lengthy section of double track in the middle of it.
The traffic on the line meant the loop was rarely needed and had been
through wired (i.e. no overhead frogs) for primary use of just one
road from the early 1900s. There has never been a satisfactory
explanation of why such long loop was provided when any loop was
barely needed at all.
Cheers,
Bill
David Bennetts
Bill Bolton <billboltonRE...@computer.org> wrote in article
<367df9d9...@news.bigpond.com>...
No way - you walk up it sometimes from the ferry on a hot day, as I've
done, it would have to be at least 1 in 10.
Regards
David Bennetts
>
Bill Bolton
> No way - you walk up it sometimes from the ferry on a hot day, as I've
> done, it would have to be at least 1 in 10.
Hayes St is MUCH less steep than the lower end of Wycombe Rd. Also if
it was anything like 1 in 10, trams would never have been permitted to
terminate on the grade, as they all did after 1952 and as peak hour
divisions did prior to that.
Cheers,
Bill
Ron BEST
conductor to divert runaways into the gutter??
(From Ron BEST in London)(temporarily)
Bill Bolton <billboltonRE...@computer.org> wrote in article
<367fa319...@news.bigpond.com>...
Bill Bolton
>But wern't there catch points in Hayes St that had to be held over by the
>conductor to divert runaways into the gutter??
Yes, but that appears to have been more an issue of making sure a tram
was brought to a stand before venturing onto the jetty.
As the incidents at Athol showed in later years, even a moderate grade
with water at the bottom combined with poor traction conditions can
add up to an exciting ride, even with a driver at the controls.
Cheers,
Bill
Bill Bolton
Sydney, Australia