Ham banned in Broadmeadows
Lina Rinaldi
Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
area.
Does anybody know what it is exactly about ham/pork that makes it
unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
Lina
Trevor Wilson
"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
**It's based on historical issues. Bovine products are also unsuitable for
Jews to eat. It was discovered that pig meat carried certain diseases.
Religious authorities just decided to stop people from eating the stuff, so
that the diseases would stop. Like most things religious, it became part of
the whole shebang. Be aware, also, that Jews and Muslims require that the
animals must be killed in a certain way, to satisfy religious beliefs.
BTW: I think your story is bogus. It is the most idiotic beat up, I've read
all week.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com
veritas
relevance to its real gnostic teachings or relevance in today's society and
generally followed by peoples who have little ability to think for themselves.
As to the Mayor banning certain foods? Absolute rubbish! Council has no power to
do so - even if the Mayor could get a majority votes from councillors (which
wouldn't happen) to introduce such a local government by-law.
Cheers - veritas.
Ned Ludd
<5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews>:
> [. . .]
>
> Does anybody know what it is exactly about ham/pork that makes it
> unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
> cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
It's nothing more than religious cant.
---Ned Ludd
Jerry Can
The story so insults your intelligence that you refuse to believe it.
The Mayor of Broadmedows has banned ham and pork products from the
council facilities. The story is true.
Today: no ham - Tomorrow: no clitorises.
RMan
"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
>
> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
> area.
>
Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
whinging about it. That is petty people with nothing better to do.
> Does anybody know what it is exactly about ham/pork that makes it
> unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
> cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
>
It all started after Pulp Fiction, before that, pork chops all the way,
every day.........
Theodore A. Kaldis
It's just a religious thing (if one can properly characterise islam as a
religion).
--
Theodore A. Kaldis
kal...@worldnet.att.net
Theodore A. Kaldis
> Lina Rinaldi wrote:
>> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
>> area.
>> Does anybody know what it is exactly about ham/pork that makes it
>> unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
>> cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
> **It's based on historical issues. Bovine products are also unsuitable for
> Jews to eat. It was discovered that pig meat carried certain diseases.
You mean _PORCINE_ products. "Bovine" refers to cattle, i.e., beef (which is
kosher for Jews as long as it is cooked properly).
Trevor Wilson
"Theodore A. Kaldis" <kal...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:3ECD763F...@worldnet.att.net...
**Oops. Mea culpa.
Thanks for the correction.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Trevor Wilson
"Jerry Can " <nos...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3ecd7191...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
**Now, hang on a sec. The original poster said nothing about council
premises. He said:
"...the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
area."
BIG difference.
Time to vote the mayor out, methinks. Such is the power of democracy.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Jerry Can
wrote:
>
>"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
>> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>>
>> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
>> area.
>>
>
>Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
>
>At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
>of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
>whinging about it.
Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
racism.
No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
totally devoted to that purpose.
No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
veritas
> "Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
>
>>Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>>
>>Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>>products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
>>area.
>
> Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
>
> At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
> of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
> whinging about it. That is petty people with nothing better to do.
I disagree! It is a big deal. Why should I have to curb my preference for a much
enjoyed ham & salad sandwich because 12% of the residents are supposedly muslim? If
it is on the table, no one is going to force Muslims to eat it. My message to any
muslim (and anyone who supports them in this issue) who takes advantage of the
generosity of their Australian hosts is; "BUILD A BRIDGE AND GET OVER IT OR F**K OFF!!!"
veritas
RMan
> On Fri, 23 May 2003 11:10:17 +1000, "RMan" <rdj...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> >> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
> >>
> >> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> >> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
the
> >> area.
> >>
> >
> >Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
> >
> >At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the
serving
> >of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
> >whinging about it.
>
> Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
> racism.
Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
(That's a laugh at you, not with)
>
> No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
> sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
> totally devoted to that purpose.
>
WTF is Australian Society ? You mean white -anglo-euro Christians.......
> No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
> allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
> the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
Wrong fella, try going to a Bamitzvah and ordering a pork chop fella.
Why do I play in aus.politics, where the brain dead live, the anonymous
posters live, the ignorant, the redneck, the lefties, the righties, the one
eyed, the blue eyed-blonde haired 6 ft 2 90 kg wannabees
John
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> >> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
> >>
> >> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> >> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
the
> >> area.
> >>
> >
> >Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
> >
> >At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the
serving
> >of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
> >whinging about it.
>
> Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
> racism.
ahh. Irony.
stu
are gone
what about the % that can eat nuts? ok there gone to
lactose intolerant?
gluten?
cant drink the water, fluoride chlorine and a few other things
sure l missed a few but you get the idea
what an idiot
p.s. l hate mushrooms so there better not be any of them
Jacques Guy
> At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
> of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
> whinging about it. That is petty people with nothing better to do.
So let's hope the next mayor is a nudist and bans the wearing of clothes
at council events. And let's hope there's at least one muslim female
on the council.
Vaughan Williams
> sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
> totally devoted to that purpose.
>
> No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
> allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
> the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
The muslims don't have a monopoly on that. I always cringe when going to
environment conferences and the like - all pious vegetarian food and herbal
teas, and quite inedible. I'm not going to force steak or eggs down a vego's
throat or ham down a muslims or roast beef to a catholic on good friday. But
I hate it when people with particular dietary habits impose them on everyone
else.
Anthony Morton
>So let's hope the next mayor is a nudist and bans the wearing of clothes
>at council events. And let's hope there's at least one muslim female
>on the council.
As the previous poster said. Petty, petty, petty.
Even us Anglo-Aussies aren't entirely comfortable with our fellow humans
serving up dog meat, cat meat, cow's eyes, and what have you. There may
even be some local council out there that has banned some such foods from
being served at their functions - or even anywhere within the municipality -
because they're offensive to white Anglo sensibilities. (Wasn't there a
story to this effect in Sydney some time ago?)
Should you ever be in the position of actually attending a Hume Council
function and crave a ham sandwich, just hang on until the end and then get
one from the local take-away. Not so hard.
(And if a nudist mayor would have anything to be upset about, it would of
course be the current ban on the non-wearing of clothes at council events or
anywhere else in public. Is someone's 'right' to walk around naked on a par
with your 'right' to eat a ham sandwich at a council function? If not, why
not?)
Tony M.
Jerry Can
wrote:
>
>"Jerry Can " <nos...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>news:3ecd7d7e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
>> On Fri, 23 May 2003 11:10:17 +1000, "RMan" <rdj...@hotmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> >news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
>> >> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>> >>
>> >> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>> >> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
>the
>> >> area.
>> >>
>> >
>> >Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
>> >
>> >At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the
>serving
>> >of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
>> >whinging about it.
>>
>> Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
>> racism.
>
>Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
>
>(That's a laugh at you, not with)
"Ha ha ha ha ha ha" he says ... "that's not racism ... it's not racism
to give special privileges to muslims. Anyway ... muslims are violent
if you don't give them what they want. And I heard on the ABC and saw
in a Leunig cartoon that it was ok to discriminate against everyone
else and favour muslims so it must be ok".
>
>>
>> No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
>> sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
>> totally devoted to that purpose.
>>
>
>WTF is Australian Society ? You mean white -anglo-euro Christians.......
Maybe it is people coming together and learning to live with other
people's preferences such as the way that buddhists and hindus (and
seventh day adventists) do not demand all meat products are banned
from government funded events.
>
>> No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
>> allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
>> the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
>
>Wrong fella, try going to a Bamitzvah and ordering a pork chop fella.
>
So are you comparing the availability of a pork chop at a bar mitzvah
with the availabilty of ham sandwiches at a mosque?
Oh no ... your mistake...
You are comparing the availability of a pork chop at a bar mitzvah
with the banning of ham sandwiches at a public funded, nominally
non-discriminatory centre of government.
>Why do I play in aus.politics, where the brain dead live, the anonymous
>posters live, the ignorant, the redneck, the lefties, the righties, the one
>eyed, the blue eyed-blonde haired 6 ft 2 90 kg wannabees
You are way out of your league here fuckwit. Go back to
alt.save-the-abc where they still give out awards for politcal
correctness.
Scott
Anthony Morton <amo...@mudguard.ee.mu.oz.au> wrote in message
news:bak4v2$pq$1...@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU...
> Jacques Guy <jg...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
>
> >So let's hope the next mayor is a nudist and bans the wearing of clothes
> >at council events. And let's hope there's at least one muslim female
> >on the council.
>
> As the previous poster said. Petty, petty, petty.
>
> Even us Anglo-Aussies aren't entirely comfortable with our fellow humans
> serving up dog meat, cat meat, cow's eyes, and what have you. There may
> even be some local council out there that has banned some such foods from
> being served at their functions - or even anywhere within the
municipality -
> because they're offensive to white Anglo sensibilities. (Wasn't there a
> story to this effect in Sydney some time ago?)
>
> Should you ever be in the position of actually attending a Hume Council
> function and crave a ham sandwich, just hang on until the end and then get
> one from the local take-away. Not so hard.
Why should the majority be *forced* to observe Islamic rules? Next, will the
Hume Council prevent women from entering unless they are covered from head
to toe? This is Australia, and it's a western country based on individual
freedoms, as much as this displeases some...
Luke Webber
news:_Egza.1726$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
FWIW, I have real problems with the cultural bias in our schools, with their
(admittedly optional) "non-denominational" (ie generic Christian) religious
education classes. If you opt out, your kid will be cut out from the herd
and given something else to do in the meantime, meaning that they'll be
singled out as different.
Not that any of this is a serious problem for me or my family. I'm an
atheist, but I don't think it hurts my kids to get lessons in Christian
culture. OTOH, I see how it could be a major problem for many
non-Christians.
Moreover, my kids used to have a school oath to recite, which included the
line "I love God and will obey my elders and the law". Bleccchhh!
What I'm trying to say here is that there is an entrenched bias toward
Christianity in our system. Far worse than the simple removal of some items
from a council menu, which was really only done in order to avoid offense.
IMO it'd be worse if they only served fish on Fridays <g>.
Luke
Luke Webber
news:42hza.1747$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Why should the majority be *forced* to observe Islamic rules? Next, will
the
> Hume Council prevent women from entering unless they are covered from head
> to toe? This is Australia, and it's a western country based on individual
> freedoms, as much as this displeases some...
Get with the program, Scott. The ban on ham is a harmless way of avoiding
offense to a significant percentage of their demographic. Making non-Muslims
cover up would definitely cause offense to far more people. There's no
comparison.
If ham was an essential component of the Christian diet, I'm sure it
wouldn't have been dropped. It's not. It's just a common foodstuff which can
be left off the menu with no harm to anyone, and a positive benefit to the
Muslim guests. I say this mayor is acting very sensibly.
Luke
AnniSwan
It wasn't the Mayor, it was the CEO, infact the Mayor had no idea that
the CEO had made the decision.
Ham is not being banned in all of Broadmeadows just for Council
functions.
I have had a lot of involvement with Hume Council and in the past the
Muslim councillors have never had a problem if ham or pork was served,
they always asked politely if there was ham or pork in the dishes and
if there was they avoided them.
This story is a beat up by a former Councillor who lost the election
in 2000 and still hasn't got over the fact that he only got 9% of the
vote, and 2 current (independant/liberal) councillors that have
nothing better to do than kick up a stink about such a trivial matter.
Anyway with all the fantastic middle eastern food that could be served
why would you bother with Ham Sandwiches, bring me a falafel and
homous dip anyday.
AS
Anthony Morton
>Why should the majority be *forced* to observe Islamic rules? Next, will the
>Hume Council prevent women from entering unless they are covered from head
>to toe? This is Australia, and it's a western country based on individual
>freedoms, as much as this displeases some...
They haven't indicated they would do this, and it would be an inappropriate
violation of civil liberties if they did. Just as when you host a dinner
party, it's up to you what your guests eat but not what they wear.
Any eatery - even a publicly-funded one - can 'force' people not to eat ham
by the simple expedient of not including it on the menu. Hume Council have
just said it's their policy not to include ham on the menu at their functions.
I can't currently go to a function hosted by my own council and order roast
dog. Are my rights being trampled on?
TM
Trevor Wilson
"Luke Webber" <lu...@webber.com.au> wrote in message
news:X9hza.1756$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>
> What I'm trying to say here is that there is an entrenched bias toward
> Christianity in our system. Far worse than the simple removal of some
items
> from a council menu, which was really only done in order to avoid offense.
> IMO it'd be worse if they only served fish on Fridays <g>.
**Agreed. Our idiot PM has much to answer for. In his proposed preable to
the Constitution. What an embarresment that was. Here in Western society, we
are supposed to enshrine the concept of 'separation of Church and State'.
It's a shame that our idiot PM seems to have neglected that little concept
(see: Australia's present GG).
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com
Ned Ludd
soap operas---bleep and black those bits out.
---Ned Ludd
Jacques Guy
> Even us Anglo-Aussies aren't entirely comfortable with our fellow humans
> serving up dog meat, cat meat, cow's eyes, and what have you.
If they saw them in their plates some might be squeamish. So what?
If I put a little calf on the barbecue, whole, you mightn't be
"entirely confortable" either. If you were taken to a tour of a
slaughterhouse you might be not quite "entirely comfortable" for
a little while either. Might put you off your steak or your sav on the
barbie, no? Conclusion? Oh, it's here below:
> There may
> even be some local council out there that has banned some such foods from
> being served at their functions - or even anywhere within the municipality -
> because they're offensive to white Anglo sensibilities.
There _may_ be. And some moon rocks _may_ be made of green cheese too.
And there _may_ be little green men under your bed. And eating parsley
_may_ cause AIDS (there's never been studies of parsley possibly
causing AIDS, have there? So you can't rule it out). There _may_ be
some local council out there that has banned entering the room left
foot first because the councillors believe it brings bad luck too.
> (Wasn't there a
> story to this effect in Sydney some time ago?)
Possibly there wasn't, but there _may_ be, eh?
> Should you ever be in the position of actually attending a Hume Council
> function and crave a ham sandwich, just hang on until the end and then get
> one from the local take-away. Not so hard.
Should you ever be in the position of actually attending a Goon Council
function and crave removing the burka His Arseholeship The Mayor insists
everyone should wear, just hang on until the end and then take it off
once you've left. Not so hard.
> Is someone's 'right' to walk around naked on a par
> with your 'right' to eat a ham sandwich at a council function?
Ho, ho, ho! I equated _forbidding_ people from eating pork because
you disapprove of pork with _forbidding_ them from wearing clothes
because you disapprove of clothes, didn't I?
Anyway, what fucking bloody business of yours or anyone
is it what's in a sandwich Tom, Dick, or Harry is eating?
You can't even see what's in it unless you stick your nose
in it.
So what's His Broadmeadows Arseholeship The Mayor objecting
about?
Typical busybody bastardry: their kind just live to give
everybody else the shits all the while playing morally
superior.
Andrew D
<rdj...@hotmail.com> wrote:
[snip]
>At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
>of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
>whinging about it. That is petty people with nothing better to do.
So if they ban women from attending council "events", or at least force
them to cover themselves if they do attend, would you support that too? Or
is their a point at which you'd start whinging?
Andy D.
"I'm a great speller - but a hopless tpyist!"
The Enlightenment
> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>
> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
> area.
>
> unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
> cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
>
>
>
It's a tradition that the Arabs under Islam took on from the Jews.
Mohmaed basically says that whatever is Kosher is also Hallal. The
supposed story is that these animals are prone to parasites and
disease.
If you are Italian or German you probably have eaten raw pork mince
which is carefully prepared to be hygenic. These is little basis to
this unclean thing. Pigs are inherantly clean animal but they must be
kept well fed in a clean environment.
The real purpose of this food taboo is as a ritual to differentiate
muslims from Kaffers (as non-jews are called). A fundemental taboo
about something such as food creates a barrier that prevents
assimilation of muslims into society while also 'outing' non muslims.
I've seen muslims use a piece of paper to opperate a ligh switch
becuase there was a chinese man working in the office who may have.
Muslims often takeover parts of a country or even a whole country by
'demographic' assault.
***************************************************************
What makes Western Culture Unique?
<http://theoccidentalquarterly.com/vol2no2/km-unique.html>
Western Girls are exoganous: our culture is to marry OUT of our
kinship groups and she is expected to find her own partner so she is
expected to dress attractively and is friendly and open.
Look at the different basis of western and middle eastern society:
WESTERN MIDDLE-EASTERN
Kinship System Bilateral; Unilineal
Weakly Patricentric Strongly Patricentric
Family System Simple Household; Extended Family;
Joint Household;
Marriage Practices Exogamous Endogamous,
Consanguineous
Monogamous Polygynous
Marriage Psychology: Companinate Utillitarian
Based on Mutual Based on Strategiszing
Consent & Affection & control of Kinship
Group
Position of Women Relatively High Relatively Low
Social Structure Individualistic; Collectivistic
Republican; Authoritarian;
Democratic Charismatic Leaders
Ethnocentrism Relatively Low Relatively High;
Xenophobia Relatively Low Relatively High
Socialization Stresses Independence, Stresses Ingroup
Self-Reliance Identification and
Obligations to Kinship
Group
Intellectual Stance: Reason; Dogmatism;
Science Charismatic Leaders
Submission to Ingroup
Authority
Moral Stance Moral Universalism: Moral Particularism;
Morality Independent Ingroup/Outgroup
of Group Affiliation Morality
This Middle Eastern tendency toward hyper-collectivism and
hyper-ethnocentrism;a phenomenon that goes a long way toward
explaining the chronic hostilities in the area.
This perspective is consistent with ecological theory. Under
ecologically adverse circumstances, adaptations are directed more at
coping with the adverse physical environment than at competing with
other groups (Southwood 1977, 1981), and in such an environment, there
would be less pressure for selection for extended kinship networks and
highly collectivist groups. Evolutionary conceptualizations of
ethnocentrism emphasize the utility of ethnocentrism in group
competition. Ethnocentrism would thus be of no importance at all in
combating the physical environment, and such an environment would not
support large groups.
European groups are part of what Burton et al. (1996) term the
North Eurasian and Circumpolar culture area.9 This culture area
derives from hunter-gatherers adapted to cold, ecologically adverse
climates. In such climates there is pressure for male provisioning of
the family and a tendency toward monogamy because the ecology did not
support either polygyny or large groups for an evolutionarily
significant period. These cultures are characterized by bilateral
kinship relationships which recognize both the male and female lines,
suggesting a more equal contribution for each sex as would be expected
under conditions of monogamy. There is also less emphasis on extended
kinship relationships and marriage tends to be exogamous (i.e.,
outside the kinship group). As discussed below, all of these
characteristics are opposite those found among Middle Easterners.
The historical evidence shows that Europeans, and especially
Northwest Europeans, were relatively quick to abandon extended kinship
networks and collectivist social structures when their interests were
protected with the rise of strong centralized governments. There is
indeed a general tendency throughout the world for a decline in
extended kinship networks with the rise of central authority
(Alexander 1979; Goldschmidt & Kunkel 1971; Stone 1977). But in the
case of Northwest Europe this tendency quickly gave rise long before
the industrial revolution to the unique Western European
simple household type. The simple household type is
based on a single married couple and their children. It contrasts with
the joint family structure typical of the rest of Eurasia in which the
household consists of two or more related couples, typically brothers
and their wives and other members of the extended family (Hajnal
1983). (An example of the joint household would be the families of the
patriarchs described in the Old Testament; see MacDonald 1994, Ch. 3)
Before the industrial revolution, the simple household system was
characterized by methods of keeping unmarried young people occupied as
servants. It was not just the children of the poor and landless who
became servants, but even large, successful farmers sent their
children to be servants elsewhere. In the 17th and 18th centuries
individuals often took in servants early in their marriage, before
their own children could help out, and then passed their children to
others when the children were older and there was more than enough
help (Stone 1977).
This suggests a deeply ingrained cultural practice which resulted
in a high level of non-kinship based reciprocity. The practice also
bespeaks a relative lack of ethnocentrism because people are taking in
non-relatives as household members whereas in the rest of Eurasia
people tend to surround themselves with biological relatives. Simply
put, genetic relatedness was less important in Europe and especially
in the Nordic areas of Europe. The unique feature of the simple
household system was the high percentage of non-relatives. Unlike the
rest of Eurasia, the pre-industrial societies of northwestern Europe
were not organized around extended kinship relationships, and it is
easy to see that they are pre-adapted to the industrial revolution and
modern world generally.10
This simple household system is a fundamental feature of
individualist culture. The individualist family was able to pursue its
interests freed from the obligations and constraints of extended
kinship relationships and free of the suffocating collectivism of the
social structures typical of so much of the rest of the world.
Monogamous marriage based on individual consent and conjugal affection
quickly replaced marriage based on kinship and family strategizing.
(See Chs. 4 and 8 for a discussion of the greater proneness of Western
Europeans to monogamy and to marriage based on companionship and
affection rather than polygyny and collectivist mechanisms of social
control and family strategizing.)
This relatively greater proneness to forming a simple household
type may well be ethnically based. During the pre-industrial era, this
household system was found only within Nordic Europe: The simple
household type is based on a single married couple and their children
and characterized Scandinavia (except Finland), British Isles, Low
Countries, German-speaking areas, and northern France. Within France,
the simple household occurred in areas inhabited by the Germanic
peoples who lived northeast of the eternal line& running
from Saint Malo on the English Channel coast to Geneva in
French-speaking Switzerland (Ladurie 1986). This area developed large
scale agriculture capable of feeding the growing towns and cities, and
did so prior to the agricultural revolution of the 18th century. It
was supported by a large array of skilled craftsmen in the towns, and
a large class of medium-sized ploughmen who owned horses,
copper bowls, glass goblets and often shoes; their children had fat
cheeks and broad shoulders, and their babies wore tiny shoes. None of
these children had the swollen bellies of the rachitics of the Third
World; (Ladurie 1986, 340). The northeast became the center of
French industrialization and world trade.
The northeast also differed from the southwest in literacy rates.
In the early 19th century, while literacy rates for France as a whole
were approximately 50%, the rate in the northeast was close to 100%,
and differences occurred at least from the 17th century. Moreover,
there was a pronounced difference in stature, with the northeasterners
being taller by almost 2 centimeters in an 18th century sample of
military recruits. Ladurie notes that the difference in the entire
population was probably larger because the army would not accept many
of the shorter men from the southwest. In addition, Laslett (1983) and
other family historians have noted that the trend toward the
economically independent nuclear family was more prominent in the
north, while there was a tendency toward joint families as one moves
to the south and east.
These findings are compatible with the interpretation that ethnic
differences are a contributing factor to the geographical variation in
family forms within Europe. The findings suggest that the Germanic
peoples had a greater biological tendency toward a suite of traits
that predisposed them to individualism including a greater
tendency toward the simple household because of natural selection
occurring in a prolonged resource-limited period of their evolution in
the north of Europe. Similar tendencies toward exogamy, monogamy,
individualism, and relative de-emphasis on the extended family were
also characteristic of Roman civilization (MacDonald 1990), again
suggesting an ethnic tendency that pervades Western cultures
generally.
Current data indicate that around 80% of European genes are
derived from people who settled in Europe 30-40,000 years ago
and therefore persisted through the Ice Ages (Sykes 2001). This is
sufficient time for the adverse ecology of the north to have had a
powerful shaping influence on European psychological and cultural
tendencies. These European groups were less attracted to extended
kinship groups, so that when the context altered with the rise of
powerful central governments able to guarantee individual interests,
the simple household structure quickly became dominant. This simple
family structure was adopted relatively easily because Europeans
already had relatively powerful psychological predispositions toward
the simple family resulting from its prolonged evolutionary history in
the north of Europe.
Although these differences within the Western European system are
important, they do not belie the general difference between Western
Europe and the rest of Eurasia. Although the trend toward simple
households occurred first in the northwest of Europe, they spread
relatively quickly among all the Western European countries.
The establishment of the simple household freed from enmeshment in
the wider kinship community was then followed in short order by all
the other markers of Western modernization: limited governments in
which individuals have rights against the state, capitalist economic
enterprise based on individual economic rights, moral universalism,
and science as individualist truth seeking. Individualist societies
develop republican political institutions and institutions of
scientific inquiry that assume that groups are maximally permeable and
highly subject to defection when individual needs are not met.
Recent research by evolutionary economists provides fascinating
insight on the differences between individualistic cultures versus
collectivist cultures. An important aspect of this research is to
model the evolution of cooperation among individualistic peoples. Fehr
and Gächter (2002) found that people will altruistically punish
defectors in a one-shot game. A game in which
participants only interact once and are thus not influenced by the
reputations of the people with whom they are interacting. This
situation therefore models an individualistic culture because
participants are strangers with no kinship ties. The surprising
finding was that subjects who made high levels of public goods
donations tended to punish people who did not even though they did not
receive any benefit from doing so. Moreover, the punished individuals
changed their ways and donated more in future games even though they
knew that the participants in later rounds were not the same as in
previous rounds. Fehr and Gächter suggest that people from
individualistic cultures have an evolved negative emotional reaction
to free riding that results in their punishing such people even at a
cost to themselves hence the term "altruistic punishment."
Essentially Fehr and Gächter provide a model of the evolution of
cooperation among individualistic peoples. Their results are most
applicable to individualistic groups because such groups are not based
on extended kinship relationships and are therefore much more prone to
defection. In general, high levels of altruistic punishment are more
likely to be found among individualistic, hunter-gather societies than
in kinship based societies based on the extended family. Their results
are least applicable to groups such as Jewish groups or other highly
collectivist groups which in traditional societies were based on
extended kinship relationships, known kinship linkages, and repeated
interactions among members. In such situations, actors know the people
with whom they are cooperating and anticipate future cooperation
because they are enmeshed in extended kinship networks, or, as in the
case of Middle-easterners, they are in the same group.
Similarly, in the ultimatum game, one subject (the 'proposer') is
assigned a sum of money equal to two days' wages and required to
propose an offer to a second person (the 'respondent'). The respondent
may then accept the offer or reject the offer, and if the offer is
rejected neither player wins anything. As in the previously described
public goods game, the game is intended to model economic interactions
between strangers, so players are anonymous. Henrich et al. (2001)
found that two variables, payoffs to cooperation and the extent of
market exchange, predicted offers and rejections in the game.
Societies with an emphasis on cooperation and on market exchange had
the highest offers results interpreted as reflecting the fact
that they have extensive experience of the principle of cooperation
and sharing with strangers. These are individualistic societies. On
the other hand, subjects from societies where all interactions are
among family members made low offers in the ultimatum game and
contributed low amounts to public goods in similarly anonymous
conditions.
Europeans are thus exactly the sort of groups modeled by Fehr and
Gächter and Henrich et al: They are groups with high levels of
cooperation with strangers rather than with extended family members,
and they are prone to market relations and individualism. On the other
hand, Middle Old World culture is characterized by extended kinship
networks and the extended family. Such cultures are prone to
ingroup-outgroup relationships in which cooperation involves repeated
interactions with ingroup members and the ingroup is composed of
extended family members.
This suggests the fascinating possibility that the key for a group
intending to turn Europeans against themselves is to trigger their
strong tendency toward altruistic punishment by convincing them of the
evil of their own people. Because Europeans are individualists at
heart, they readily rise up in moral anger against their own people
once they are seen as free riders and therefore morally
blameworthy a manifestation of their much stronger tendency
toward altruistic punishment deriving from their evolutionary past as
hunter gatherers. In making judgments of altruistic punishment,
relative genetic distance is irrelevant. Free-riders are seen as
strangers in a market situation; i.e., they have no familial or tribal
connection with the altruistic punisher.
Thus the current altruistic punishment so characteristic of
contemporary Western civilization: Once Europeans were convinced that
their own people were morally bankrupt, any and all means of
punishment should be used against their own people. Rather than see
other Europeans as part of an encompassing ethnic and tribal
community, fellow Europeans were seen as morally blameworthy and the
appropriate target of altruistic punishment. For Westerners, morality
is individualistic violations of communal norms by free-riders
are punished by altruistic aggression.
On the other hand, group strategies deriving from collectivist
cultures are immune to such a maneuver because
kinship and group ties come first. Morality is
particularistic whatever is good for the group. There is no
tradition of altruistic punishment because the evolutionary history
these groups centers around cooperation of close kin, not strangers.
Vaughan Williams
inappropriate
> violation of civil liberties if they did. Just as when you host a dinner
> party, it's up to you what your guests eat but not what they wear.
Yes and no. It would be rather rude to serve up a food they're allergic to
or that you know they don't eat - whether for religious, ethical, health
reasons or simply because they don't like it. Whenever I have someone over
for dinner I usually ask if theres anything they don't eat. (Lots of my
relatives seem to have food allergies, so I'm in the habit of asking).
And although you can't really specify what they wear, its not uncommon to
suggest a particular form of dress if the event is formalised enough. And of
course it would be inappropriate for them to turn up in beachwear or
cross-dress... you get the idea.
> Any eatery - even a publicly-funded one - can 'force' people not to eat
ham
> by the simple expedient of not including it on the menu. Hume Council
have
> just said it's their policy not to include ham on the menu at their
functions.
And the discussion is over whether this is appropriate simply because of the
preferences of a small minority. I don't think its consistent as you can't
eliminate every food that every group of people object to. I think it would
be more appropriate to provide a reasonable selection of food and let people
choose what they eat. And if they are extremely orthodox and won't eat
anything that's been anywhere near a pig product then they can do what
people with complex or severe food allergies do - BYO food.
Vaughan
Ned Ludd
<en...@nospam.com> quotes someone thus:
>> They haven't indicated they would do this, and it would be an inappropriate
>> violation of civil liberties if they did. Just as when you host a dinner
>> party, it's up to you what your guests eat but not what they wear.
> [. . .]
>> Any eatery - even a publicly-funded one - can 'force' people not to eat ham
>> by the simple expedient of not including it on the menu. Hume Council have
>> just said it's their policy not to include ham on the menu at their
>> functions.
Vaughan, I hope you don't mind being reminded, but in the newsgroups when
quoting from an earlier message it's customary for us to tell the readers
the internet name of the sender of at least the first-level quoted words.
That makes it easier for people to follow the thread---especially those who
haven't been following it from the beginning and who don't have a
photographic memory---and it's a common courtesy to the quotee regardless of
how rude we are in our comments about the quoted words.
Cheers,
Ned Ludd
Who me?
> Vaughan, I hope you don't mind being reminded, but in the newsgroups when
> quoting from an earlier message it's customary for us to tell the readers
> the internet name of the sender of at least the first-level quoted words.
> That makes it easier for people to follow the thread---especially those who
> haven't been following it from the beginning and who don't have a
> photographic memory---and it's a common courtesy to the quotee regardless of
> how rude we are in our comments about the quoted words.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Ned Ludd
You get no say whatsoever on who does and doesn't use your particular preferred style of quoting!
"common courtesy" my arse - it's Usenet mate, get used to it or get lost.
What a Luddite!
Namby Pamby Ned, whatcha gonna do about me not quoting you "properly" ?????
--
Engineers aren't boring people, they just get excited about
boring things.
Martin Taylor
LR> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
LR> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
LR> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
LR> area.
Which radio you hear this on? I listened to ABC in the morning and Jon
Faine had on both the fellow who's taking this to the EOC and the CEO of
the council who ordered this. It wasn't the mayor, apparently.
Anyway, it's over catering for functions. All he did was to ask that out
of respect for any muslims and others there who don't eat
pork/ham/bacon, etc that they do not serve it up. Have other meats
instead.
Just wish they'd ("they" being anyone who caters for public and other
functions) be this considerate for vegetarians. It's always annoying
when we go somewhere and there's nothing for the missus to eat.
--
Change "myself.com" to austarnet.com.au for an email reply..
Trevor Wilson
"The Enlightenment" <bern...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
news:39556695.03052...@posting.google.com...
**Whilst some of this is true, most is just plain over-reactionism. Consider
some of the following groups and how they fit into your scheme of things:
The Festival of Light (and associated loonies).
Traditional Jews, living in (say) NYC.
Mormons
Catholics
Baptists
Etc.
All are Western groups. All have some weird ideas. Some even believe that
polygamy is appropriate (though I would have thought marrying more than one
woman is its own punishment).
Further and for the record:
My last next door neighbours were in their early 30s, professional people
(lawyer and scientist), owned their home and were either Christian raised,
or agnostic. They were complete arseholes. They had no respect for my
privacy, nor my rights to a quiet evening. Drunken parties were a common and
regular event. They were cold and disinterested in me and my partner. My
present neighbours are Muslims. Muslims don't drink! yay! They're polite,
respectful and friendly. They're quiet and the only party they've had,
involved their extended family and finished by 10:00PM Saturday evening.
They even gave us some leftovers. Yummy.
Personally, I think ANY religious follower is a bloody idiot and is in
serious need of education. Muslims are far from the worst bunch of people
living in Australia.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Brash
anti-white racism.
--
De Oppresso Liber.
Luke Webber
news:39556695.03052...@posting.google.com...
> Mohmaed basically says that whatever is Kosher is also Hallal. The
> supposed story is that these animals are prone to parasites and
> disease.
>
> If you are Italian or German you probably have eaten raw pork mince
> which is carefully prepared to be hygenic. These is little basis to
> this unclean thing. Pigs are inherantly clean animal but they must be
> kept well fed in a clean environment.
Actually, there *is* some basis to the idea that pork carries parasites. Not
that pork is necessarily any worse than other meats, but a pig's metabolism
is very similar to a human's (even our meat is supposed to taste similar).
Thus pig diseases and parasites are more likely to be compatible with
humans.
Of course there is much better disease control these days, so it's not
really an issue.
> The real purpose of this food taboo is as a ritual to differentiate
> muslims from Kaffers (as non-jews are called). A fundemental taboo
> about something such as food creates a barrier that prevents
> assimilation of muslims into society while also 'outing' non muslims.
>
> I've seen muslims use a piece of paper to opperate a ligh switch
> becuase there was a chinese man working in the office who may have.
>
> Muslims often takeover parts of a country or even a whole country by
> 'demographic' assault.
Um, thanks. I'll be sure to watch out for that. Like hell.
Luke
Peter Signorini
> racism.
>
> sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
> totally devoted to that purpose.
Mr Pot meets Ms Kettle and accuses her of being the daughter of a black
dude.
Peter Signorini
> "Ha ha ha ha ha ha" he says ... "that's not racism ... it's not racism
> to give special privileges to muslims. Anyway ... muslims are violent
> if you don't give them what they want. And I heard on the ABC and saw
> in a Leunig cartoon that it was ok to discriminate against everyone
> else and favour muslims so it must be ok".
In what way is allowing certain people to follow their beliefs in regard to
foods eaten an act of discrimination against others? You can keep on chewing
your pork chop, just not at the council's functions.
> Maybe it is people coming together and learning to live with other
> people's preferences such as the way that buddhists and hindus (and
> seventh day adventists) do not demand all meat products are banned
> from government funded events.
But hey what about us hash cooky lovers. Thhey won't allow us to eat those
at the council dinner either.
Cheers
Peter
Mick
"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>
> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
> area.
>
> Does anybody know what it is exactly about ham/pork that makes it
> unsuitable for muslims? ie. is it something present in the meat that they
> cant eat or is it just a religious thing?
>
>
>
> Lina
From what I heard on 3AW this morning the Mayor is also Muslim and even
worse a Labour party hack!!!!!!!!!!.
It was interesting to hear on the breakfast show several callers who said
they were Muslim saying that this could be counter productive and lead to
more racial abuse against them and others of their faith.BTW they also said
they didn't have any problems with people eating ham at any function that
they went to.Funny also that there is a function at the City of Hume tonight
and on the menu were hot dog which according to some people contain pork
meat.
Peter Signorini
"Mick" <lalor...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:xhmza.2043$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> From what I heard on 3AW this morning
You listen to this!! Oh lord.
> the Mayor is also Muslim and even
> worse a Labour party hack!!!!!!!!!!.
3AW... accusations of Labour Party hack... Surprise, surprise!
The policy decision change was mde by the council's CEO, not the Mayor.
Mick
"Peter Signorini" <pet...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecd...@news.alphalink.com.au...
>
> "Mick" <lalor...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> news:xhmza.2043$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> > From what I heard on 3AW this morning
>
> You listen to this!! Oh lord.
Cee.Oh how (yawn) boring can you get.Seems to me that lately they are just
trying to play catch-up and still losing(just look at the latest ratings).
> > the Mayor is also Muslim and even
> > worse a Labour party hack!!!!!!!!!!.
>
> 3AW... accusations of Labour Party hack... Surprise, surprise!
>
> The policy decision change was mde by the council's CEO, not the Mayor.
>
numerous ratepayers and others.
>
AnniSwan
>
> "Peter Signorini" <pet...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
> news:3ecd...@news.alphalink.com.au...
> >
> > "Mick" <lalor...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> > news:xhmza.2043$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> > > From what I heard on 3AW this morning
> >
> > You listen to this!! Oh lord.
> > Yeah so? I suppose you listen to Dumb Plane(John Faine) over on the A
Blah
> Cee.Oh how (yawn) boring can you get.Seems to me that lately they are just
> trying to play catch-up and still losing(just look at the latest ratings).
> > > the Mayor is also Muslim and even
> > > worse a Labour party hack!!!!!!!!!!.
> >
Oh well that Labor party hack opened the first ever Library in Broadmeadows
tonight, all done by a Labor council, I didn't ever hear the Liberals offer
to build a Library in Broadmeadows.
The Enlightenment
"Trevor Wilson" <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecdc230$1...@news.comindico.com.au...
> Mormons
> Catholics
> Baptists
> Etc.
None of the above have any weird ideas apart from religion. Their religion
is adapted and western in thinking.
Only the mormons over a century ago allowed polygamy.
>
> All are Western groups. All have some weird ideas. Some even believe that
> polygamy is appropriate (though I would have thought marrying more than
one
> woman is its own punishment).
>
> Further and for the record:
>
> My last next door neighbours were in their early 30s, professional people
> (lawyer and scientist), owned their home and were either Christian raised,
> or agnostic. They were complete arseholes. They had no respect for my
> privacy, nor my rights to a quiet evening. Drunken parties were a common
and
> regular event. They were cold and disinterested in me and my partner. My
> present neighbours are Muslims. Muslims don't drink! yay! They're polite,
> respectful and friendly. They're quiet and the only party they've had,
> involved their extended family and finished by 10:00PM Saturday evening.
> They even gave us some leftovers. Yummy.
Sounds like a load of crude. Your upwardly mobile neighbours were young and
had nothing in common with you and had 2 or was it 3 noisy parties.
>
> Personally, I think ANY religious follower is a bloody idiot and is in
> serious need of education. Muslims are far from the worst bunch of people
> living in Australia.
>
Muslims will slowly takeover they way they are in Europe. Where they are now
4% of the population. Once the power relationship changes due to
demograpjics things will be different. Those Australian federation houses
will be filled by Arab children and other muslim children. They DON'T
assimilate; yes some will but unlike almost any other ethnicticity too many
will not assimilate. Soon their will be calls for muslim women only
beaches, there will be demands for huge mosques and it won't be possible to
stop them form increasing immigraion becuase the ALP will be dependant on
them for votes. Don't sell out your country for leftovers and becuase you
had two average neighbors.
Jerry Can
<tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
>My
>present neighbours are Muslims. Muslims don't drink! yay! They're polite,
>respectful and friendly. They're quiet and the only party they've had,
>involved their extended family and finished by 10:00PM Saturday evening.
>They even gave us some leftovers. Yummy.
>
Are you saving up to buy a house in Lakemba? Lots of Muslim neighbours
there.
The Enlightenment
Where the RSL has to have guards to protect it against muzzie vandalism and
where the cops suffer drive by shooting straight by the police station.
Mr 'tollerance' and his family will eventually move out of his muzzie
paradise/hellhole as they have had to in Europe.
TheMan
"Anthony Morton" <amo...@mudguard.ee.mu.oz.au> wrote in message
news:bak4v2$pq$1...@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU...
> Jacques Guy <jg...@alphalink.com.au> wrote:
>
> >So let's hope the next mayor is a nudist and bans the wearing of clothes
> >at council events. And let's hope there's at least one muslim female
> >on the council.
>
> As the previous poster said. Petty, petty, petty.
>
> Even us Anglo-Aussies aren't entirely comfortable with our fellow humans
> even be some local council out there that has banned some such foods from
> being served at their functions - or even anywhere within the
municipality -
> story to this effect in Sydney some time ago?)
I believe the serving of Dog meat was made illegal in some states...
Why are our taste buds being censored?
-TheMan-
DRS
The mayor is a racist bigot. The humble ham sandwich is traditional
*Australian* fare and if he doesn't like it he can go fuck himself. Banning
it is not harmless, it's a deeply offensive political act for which I most
sincerely hope he pays by losing his seat at the next election.
--
A: Top-posters.
Q: What is the most annoying thing on Usenet?
The Enlightenment
> "The Enlightenment" <bern...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:39556695.03052...@posting.google.com...
> > It's a tradition that the Arabs under Islam took on from the Jews.
> > Mohmaed basically says that whatever is Kosher is also Hallal. The
> > supposed story is that these animals are prone to parasites and
> > disease.
> >
> > If you are Italian or German you probably have eaten raw pork mince
> > which is carefully prepared to be hygenic. These is little basis to
> > this unclean thing. Pigs are inherantly clean animal but they must be
> > kept well fed in a clean environment.
>
> Actually, there *is* some basis to the idea that pork carries parasites.
Not
> that pork is necessarily any worse than other meats, but a pig's
metabolism
> is very similar to a human's (even our meat is supposed to taste similar).
> Thus pig diseases and parasites are more likely to be compatible with
> humans.
>
> Of course there is much better disease control these days, so it's not
> really an issue.
There never was in Europe; ever. Not these days not those days.
Most of the calorific vaalue of food came form pigs prior to 1100.
>
> > The real purpose of this food taboo is as a ritual to differentiate
> > muslims from Kaffers (as non-jews are called). A fundemental taboo
> > about something such as food creates a barrier that prevents
> > assimilation of muslims into society while also 'outing' non muslims.
> >
> > I've seen muslims use a piece of paper to opperate a ligh switch
> > becuase there was a chinese man working in the office who may have.
> >
> > Muslims often takeover parts of a country or even a whole country by
> > 'demographic' assault.
>
> Um, thanks. I'll be sure to watch out for that. Like hell.
The only thing you'll be sure of is putting your head up your arse.
>
> Luke
Denmark has a 4% muslim population. This is the result:
1 Welfare Dependency; Though only 4% of the population Muslims in
Denmark Produces a massive 40% of the welfare Bill. Really usefull
immigraion for helping dependancy ratios.
2 Rape; 75% of Norway's convicted rapists are Muslim,
65% of Denmark's Rapist are Muslim.
3 Crime: 55% of Denmark's convicted criminals come from the 4% Muslim
population. In Australia the newer migrant groups such as Lebanese,
Turks have much higher crime rates than normal. Drug crime up to 10-20
times higher.
4 It's the same story in the UK, Belgium and Holland as well but statistics
are deliberatly hidden as much as possible in those countries. They are
that bad.
5 Belgium (4% muslim population) now has the Arab Leque (a musim group)
heading for parliament. The country sufffered a number of muslim riotes
recently.
Here are links confirming all of my statistics and more:
http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/steyn.html
http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/pipes.html
http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=15630
http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=16937
Similar trends in Australia:
http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/May00/Crane.htm
http://old.smh.com.au/news/0107/29/national/national1.html
And UK
"Statistics on Race and the Criminal Justice System, 2000"
http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs/s95race00.pdf
Trevor Wilson
>
>
>
> None of the above have any weird ideas apart from religion. Their
religion
> is adapted and western in thinking.
**ALL religions are weird! Every single one! Look at the beliefs of all
those religions I quoted. None make any sense in a modern civilised society.
Look at the Catholic religion. The biggest single Christian religion. In
spite of the evidence that human beings are a plague on this planet,
Catholics still beleive that more people is a *good thing*. Most
contraceptives are banned by the Catholic religion. Even that idiot, Mother
Theresa (who has been praised by the Pope) preached the Catholic line that
babies are good, to the poorest, most over-populated people on the planet.
>
> Only the mormons over a century ago allowed polygamy.
**Hah! Scratch a Mormon and you'll uncover a polygmist. In any case, many
Mormons still practice polygamy.
>
> >
> > All are Western groups. All have some weird ideas. Some even believe
that
> > polygamy is appropriate (though I would have thought marrying more than
> one
> > woman is its own punishment).
> >
> > Further and for the record:
> >
> > My last next door neighbours were in their early 30s, professional
people
> > (lawyer and scientist), owned their home and were either Christian
raised,
> > or agnostic. They were complete arseholes. They had no respect for my
> > privacy, nor my rights to a quiet evening. Drunken parties were a common
> and
> > regular event. They were cold and disinterested in me and my partner. My
> > present neighbours are Muslims. Muslims don't drink! yay! They're
polite,
> > respectful and friendly. They're quiet and the only party they've had,
> > involved their extended family and finished by 10:00PM Saturday evening.
> > They even gave us some leftovers. Yummy.
>
>
> Sounds like a load of crude. Your upwardly mobile neighbours were young
and
> had nothing in common with you and had 2 or was it 3 noisy parties.
**It can sound like what ever you wish it to be. My old yuppie neighbours
were in their late 20's and held a noisy druken party (with their BMW
driving mates, leaving beer bottles on my footpath, regularly) at least once
every month. Let's nopt even get into the jack hammer outside my bedroom
window, at 8:00AM one Sunday morning! These people (Anglo and born and bred
in Northern NSW) were complete arseholes.
>
> >
> > Personally, I think ANY religious follower is a bloody idiot and is in
> > serious need of education. Muslims are far from the worst bunch of
people
> > living in Australia.
> >
>
> Muslims will slowly takeover they way they are in Europe. Where they are
now
> 4% of the population. Once the power relationship changes due to
> demograpjics things will be different. Those Australian federation houses
> will be filled by Arab children and other muslim children. They DON'T
> assimilate; yes some will but unlike almost any other ethnicticity too
many
> will not assimilate. Soon their will be calls for muslim women only
> beaches, there will be demands for huge mosques and it won't be possible
to
> stop them form increasing immigraion becuase the ALP will be dependant on
> them for votes. Don't sell out your country for leftovers and becuase you
> had two average neighbors.
**You really don't have a clue, do you? Look at where Muslims have become a
large proportion of the population. That's right: Largely poor and
ill-educated. Australia is an extremely wealthy nation. The education system
is excellent and, as long as examinations are external, children will be
exposed to the sciences and other areas, which will allow them to question
the odd-ball religious tenents of ALL religions.
Personally, I think ALL children should learn about all the major religions,
just so they can see how nutty they are. That includes Islam.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com
Stan Pierce
"Theodore A. Kaldis" <kal...@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:3ECD7589...@worldnet.att.net...
> Lina Rinaldi wrote:
>
> > Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>
> > Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> > products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
the
> > area.
The point is...what are you going to do about it ? What about
protesting in the streets about Muslims wearing the funny dress and
frightening your children. I find that offensive.
Stan Pierce..
Peter Signorini
"DRS" <d...@removethis.ihug.com.au> wrote in message
news:baljav$9mn$1...@lust.ihug.co.nz...
> The mayor is a racist bigot. The humble ham sandwich is traditional
> *Australian* fare and if he doesn't like it ....
Get off it. Support the Aussie beef industry. Corn beef sandwiches are a far
more traditional Australian tucker.
Cheers
Peter
Peter Signorini
"Stan Pierce" <spi...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
news:Ioxza.33$ES....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> The point is...what are you going to do about it ? What about
> protesting in the streets about Muslims wearing the funny dress and
> frightening your children. I find that offensive.
Molly Meldrum's Akubra, worn evrywhere including at funerals is far more
disturbing and offensive
Cheers
Peter
fasgnadh
"Brash" <acrobat...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3ecdc29a$0$3852$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
>
> What's next?
Banning beer in dry-area councils?
> Sharia law?
No Christian wowsers imposing their religious views on everyone
for decades without your hypocritical Chicken Little Ham-it-up Hysteria!
B^D
> Fuckin multicultural bullshit is anti-Christian
> anti-white racism.
Dry Areas
No Sunday Shopping.
Banned services and facilities and entertainments at Christmas and Easter.
No meat on Fridays.
I can see the headlines now "Catholic Charity bans meat, offers fish
to homeless instead" tut tut.. how evil! B^p
Notice how readily one half-wit bases his bigot bile on the
ill-informed and factually incorrect propoganda of another idiot;
> --
> De Oppresso Liber.
>
>
> "Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> > Wow, just heard this over the radio.
> >
> > Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> > products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
> > area.
Ham and pork products are not banned in Broadmeadows.
You can still purchase and consume ham and pork.
The muslim mayor has not banned ham and pork.
The council CEO has merely decided not to offer it on the menu
at COUNCIL functions, because a substantial number of people
attending those functions dont eat it!
At my local council they don't serve Haggis.
They have never served Haggis This is an affront
to my Scottish great Granny! It's cultural food-fascism!
I demand a multicultural smorgasbord! B^)
(We had the same hysterical overeaction
when 3 out of 14,000 child care centres decided not to have a
Santa (due to cost, parents views (they pay for it!) or because it
frightened the little preppies) and the cultural Kommisars
demanded they have Santa's! (but didn't offer to pay the costs
to parents whose freedom-to-decide they over-rode!))
Now the same people want to circumscribe what ELECTED councils
and their executive officers can and can't serve. Menu madness
over Ham Hysteria.
fasgnadh
>
> "Trevor Wilson" <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
> news:3ecdc230$1...@news.comindico.com.au...
> >
> > "The Enlightenment" <bern...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> > news:39556695.03052...@posting.google.com...
> > > Lina Rinaldi <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:<5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews>...
> > > > Wow, just heard this over the radio.
> > > >
> > > > Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> > > > products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
> > > > the area.
B^D Ham and Pork products are still available for sale in Broadmedows
and it's consumption has not been banned.
Ham Hysteria has been widely reported among apopleptic Chicken
Littles with little on their tiny minds.
...
>
> Muslims will slowly takeover they way they are in Europe.
The non Muslim Chief Officer of a council with many Muslims
decided not to serve ham, and thats the thin end of the wedge
Enlightenment always seeks to drive!? B^D
Talk about loonie hystria! B^D
This one rivals their three month campaign to defend 'Coon'
cheese because one individual with no power to implement
his views, without even public support in the indigenous
community, expressed an opinion, and the press ran with it! B^D
If you put rings through the noses of the racists and bigots, it
would not make it any easier for the forces of division, of
divide and conquer, to lead them around.
> Where they are now 4% of the population.
And setting the menu at 0.01% of the councils? B^D
We can see why you are in a state of such abject terror! B^D
Brash
news:bamjds$aj5$1...@arachne.labyrinth.net.au...
>
> "Brash" <acrobat...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:3ecdc29a$0$3852$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
> >
> > What's next?
>
> Banning beer in dry-area councils?
For good reason in some areas. But you'll defend anybody who are arseholes
like yourself.
>
> > Sharia law?
>
> No Christian wowsers imposing their religious views on everyone
> for decades without your hypocritical Chicken Little Ham-it-up Hysteria!
>
> B^D
>
> > Fuckin multicultural bullshit is anti-Christian
> > anti-white racism.
>
> Dry Areas
For good reason in some areas.
> No Sunday Shopping.
I disagree with it myself.
> Banned services and facilities and entertainments at Christmas and Easter.
I disagree with it myself.
> No meat on Fridays.
Somebody hold a gun to your head?
>
> I can see the headlines now "Catholic Charity bans meat, offers fish
> to homeless instead" tut tut.. how evil! B^p
In case you hadn't noticed, fuckwit, fish is good for you.
>
>
> Notice how readily one half-wit bases his bigot bile on the
> ill-informed and factually incorrect propoganda of another idiot;
You're too harsh on yourself.
> Ham and pork products are not banned in Broadmeadows.
> You can still purchase and consume ham and pork.
Glad to hear it. For how much longer though, I wonder? Been to
Broadmeadows lately, have you?
> The muslim mayor has not banned ham and pork.
> The council CEO has merely decided not to offer it on the menu
> at COUNCIL functions, because a substantial number of people
> attending those functions dont eat it!
A substantial number of people don't eat a lot of things. But that's no
reason to discriminate against non-Muslims. But that's right, only a white
male Christian is capable of discrimination, according to you loons of the
Left.
>
> At my local council they don't serve Haggis.
Perhaps because a substantial number of people don't eat it?
> They have never served Haggis This is an affront
> to my Scottish great Granny!
Attend a lot of council functions, does she? Why haven't you asked them to
put it on the menu? Too fuckin' lazy I suppose.
>It's cultural food-fascism!
> I demand a multicultural smorgasbord! B^)
>
> (We had the same hysterical overeaction
> when 3 out of 14,000 child care centres decided not to have a
> Santa (due to cost, parents views (they pay for it!) or because it
> frightened the little preppies) and the cultural Kommisars
> demanded they have Santa's! (but didn't offer to pay the costs
> to parents whose freedom-to-decide they over-rode!))
> Now the same people want to circumscribe what ELECTED councils
> and their executive officers can and can't serve. Menu madness
> over Ham Hysteria.
Can you say "thin edge of the wedge"?
--
De Oppresso Liber.
>
>
>
Peter Signorini
> **Actually, if you'd care to examine the stats, you'll find that
Australians
> commit more crime per head of population, than any other ethnic group, in
> Australia. Specifically, Aboriginals. Second on the list, are New
> Zealanders.
Nah, nah. According to Mr Enlightenment (God, what a name!) these people
don't even qualify as human, let alone Australian :-)
Cheers
Peter
Petzl
Well Australia was raised on Christianity, our laws, the way we
think, the things we do. Islamics who have fled here (from Islamic
horrors) are effectively, in this life, protected by our teachings of
Jesus Christ (Moslems to be protected in the next, need to convert)
I have friends in and around Lakemba mosque suburbs who often find
your "polite" Islamics deliberately attacking the neighborhood to
drive Australians out
Also the link to the end of Australia's famous sausage sizzle get
togethers
*************
<http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862,00.html>
Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
population.
Hume chief executive Darrell Treloar said he had ordered the ban
because 12 per cent of the area's population -- and two councillors,
including the mayor -- were Muslim.
***************
Out of respect for Australians murdered by this Islamic cult need to
given marching orders (enough is enough)
Petzl
--
Check your system for Virus (Free Check)
At bottom right hand side of web page click the picture
"Check for security risks"
http://www.symantec.com/avcenter/
free virus detectors available eg.
http://www.grisoft.com
GET ONE if you are not using ANY!
__
Peter Signorini
> 2 Rape; 75% of Norway's convicted rapists are Muslim,
> 65% of Denmark's Rapist are Muslim.
>
> 3 Crime: 55% of Denmark's convicted criminals come from the 4% Muslim
> population.
What utter bloody crap! You get your source data on muslim crime from a
jewish website. That gives us an independent viewpoint, oh yeah!! It spouts
abject lies.
> Here are links confirming all of my statistics and more:
> http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/steyn.html
> http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/pipes.html
> http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=15630
> http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=16937
And even the more independent Copenhagen Post item talks of alleged higher
Muslim crimes as due to groups who are signifcantly marginalised and
alienated. Give you a clue - by people with attitudes like yours Mr
Enlightenment.
Try a more reliable source like Interpol
http://www.interpol.com/Public/Statistics/ICS/2000/norway2000.pdf
Notice that of the 600 rapes in 2000, 20% were solved and there were 90
offenders. 10% of these were classed as aliens. So 10% of rapes down to
muslims (at max) not your 75% of rapes, out of 4% of the population. This is
somewhat higher representation by muslims but we are talking about only *9
individuals* many of which come from a marginalised group in the community.
Not exceptional that there is a crime problem - who is to blame?
With reliable interpretation of data like you give, I think we can a lot of
these anti-muslim allegations with a grain of salt.
Cheers
Peter
Trevor Wilson
**Yep, it is a real piece of work. He sucks up all that right wing
propaganda and believes every word. Scary. Even more scary is that we have a
PM who is courting its vote.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Trevor Wilson
"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
news:q57ucvobh6niueah6...@4ax.com...
>
> Well Australia was raised on Christianity,
**Utter bullshit. The original Australians had no such belief systems. Many
Australians chose not to accept Christianity, back in the 19th Century. MOST
of the population WAS Christian. That does not make Christianity right. It
just makes it popular. Kinda like that lying scumbag, John Howard. he sure
is popular. Doesn't make him right though.
our laws, the way we
> think, the things we do. Islamics who have fled here (from Islamic
> horrors) are effectively, in this life, protected by our teachings of
> Jesus Christ (Moslems to be protected in the next, need to convert)
**Rubbish. They are protected by our laws. Jesus of Nazereth died 2,000
years ago. He has nothing to do with anything, short of filling a few lines
in some history books.
>
> I have friends in and around Lakemba mosque suburbs who often find
> your "polite" Islamics deliberately attacking the neighborhood to
> drive Australians out
**Then they only need to rely on the law to protect them. Tell me the
details of the police reports and the names of the officers (and the
station) to which those reports were made.
>
> Also the link to the end of Australia's famous sausage sizzle get
> togethers
>
> *************
>
<http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862,
00.html>
> Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
> hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
> population.
>
> Hume chief executive Darrell Treloar said he had ordered the ban
> because 12 per cent of the area's population -- and two councillors,
> including the mayor -- were Muslim.
> ***************
>
> Out of respect for Australians murdered by this Islamic cult need to
> given marching orders (enough is enough)
**Which Islamic cult? The one in Indonesia? Are you suggesting that ALL
Muslems ascribe to the notion that Australians should be killed?
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Trevor Wilson
**Well, much as I hate to admit it, I don't really regard Kiwis as real
humans, either. -:)
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Little Dorrit
"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>
> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
> area.
UK story transplanted to Australia. Rapidly assuming the status of an urban
myth.
Little Dorrit
news:snoza.2174$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> Oh well that Labor party hack opened the first ever Library in
Broadmeadows
> tonight, all done by a Labor council, I didn't ever hear the Liberals
offer
> to build a Library in Broadmeadows.
1. Has there ever been anything else than a Labor council in Broadmeadows?
No.
2. Are there enough educated or literate people in Broadmeadows to justify
a library? No. You need more than three.
AnniSwan
"Little Dorrit" <little...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecf5307$0$30223$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
> "AnniSwan" <an...@nospam.bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> news:snoza.2174$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
>
> > Oh well that Labor party hack opened the first ever Library in
> Broadmeadows
> > tonight, all done by a Labor council, I didn't ever hear the Liberals
> offer
> > to build a Library in Broadmeadows.
>
> 1. Has there ever been anything else than a Labor council in Broadmeadows?
> No.
yep, the council from 1997 to 2000 was an "independant" controlled council,
no labor Mayor for those 3 years
>
> 2. Are there enough educated or literate people in Broadmeadows to
justify
> a library? No. You need more than three.
>
Ignorant idiot, it's mindsets like yours that has caused Broadmeadows to
have the reputation that it does, it is the home of the working class and
there are many very deserved people there.
It's about providing education and opportunity to these people, something
that was neglected in the past.
AS
Petzl
<tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
>
>"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
>news:q57ucvobh6niueah6...@4ax.com...
>>
>> Well Australia was raised on Christianity,
>
>**Utter bullshit. The original Australians had no such belief systems. Many
>Australians chose not to accept Christianity, back in the 19th Century. MOST
>of the population WAS Christian. That does not make Christianity right. It
>just makes it popular. Kinda like that lying scumbag, John Howard. he sure
>is popular. Doesn't make him right though.
You are absolutely mistaken and utterly dangerously WRONG supporting a
cult of hate and war
A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
proudly and devoutly Christian. Christianity is most certain part of
Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
banned in parts of Australia)
It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
> our laws, the way we
>> think, the things we do. Islamics who have fled here (from Islamic
>> horrors) are effectively, in this life, protected by our teachings of
>> Jesus Christ (Moslems to be protected in the next, need to convert)
>
>**Rubbish. They are protected by our laws. Jesus of Nazereth died 2,000
>years ago. He has nothing to do with anything, short of filling a few lines
>in some history books.
His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
practices them today. Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
assassination
>>
>> I have friends in and around Lakemba mosque suburbs who often find
>> your "polite" Islamics deliberately attacking the neighborhood to
>> drive Australians out
>
>**Then they only need to rely on the law to protect them. Tell me the
>details of the police reports and the names of the officers (and the
>station) to which those reports were made.
More of your lying pro Islamic rubbish
The Police in NSW are interfered from stopping Islamic terror gangs
roaming around Sydney
This is now on record where these gangs were hidden from public view
for years and years while Islamic racist gangs were pack raping what
Islamics claim are infidels
Cars being parked over drive ways rubbish tipped in yards windows
broken stabbing's and so on are the norm around Lakemba even the head
Mufti carries illegal firearms. This same turd organized Islamic
attacks against Sydney police just recently
As I keep saying its time this outrageous cult is given the flick
>> Also the link to the end of Australia's famous sausage sizzle get
>> togethers
>>
>> *************
>>
><http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862,
>00.html>
>> Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
>> hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
>> population.
>>
>> Hume chief executive Darrell Treloar said he had ordered the ban
>> because 12 per cent of the area's population -- and two councillors,
>> including the mayor -- were Muslim.
>> ***************
>>
>> Out of respect for Australians murdered by this Islamic cult need to
>> given marching orders (enough is enough)
>
>**Which Islamic cult? The one in Indonesia? Are you suggesting that ALL
>Muslems ascribe to the notion that Australians should be killed?
Yes Islamics want and actively support the murder of Australians and
anyone they consider Islamic (their web pages proudly stated so)
Islam is actively a cult of hate and murder
Islamic's were listening to the radio in Lakemba's, Imam Ali Mosque,
65 Wangee Rd in expectation of the September 11th attack. Moslem's
then set about burning down Churches and Synagogues Moslems rejoicing
and becoming openly threatening in Australia
The Head Imam at Lakemba most certainly endorses killing of
Australians every where he himself fled Islam (into the arms and
safety of Jesus Christs teachings) after being involved in a murder of
a policeman in Egypt
Little Dorrit
> Ignorant idiot, it's mindsets like yours that has caused Broadmeadows to
> have the reputation that it does, it is the home of the working class and
> there are many very deserved people there.
Lighten up sweetheart. It's called i-r-o-n-y.
PS - Who are 'very deserved people'?
Petzl
A friend of mine from Bradford (UK) said they were trying to stop
restaurants serving bacon and eggs for breakfast
Luke Webber
> jewish website. That gives us an independent viewpoint, oh yeah!! It
spouts
> abject lies.
I was just about to post much the same comment. A hate website wouldn't be
my first pick for unbiased stats.
> > Here are links confirming all of my statistics and more:
> > http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/steyn.html
> > http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/pipes.html
> > http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=15630
> > http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=16937
>
> And even the more independent Copenhagen Post item talks of alleged higher
> Muslim crimes as due to groups who are signifcantly marginalised and
> alienated. Give you a clue - by people with attitudes like yours Mr
> Enlightenment.
You took the words right out of my mouth.
> Try a more reliable source like Interpol
> http://www.interpol.com/Public/Statistics/ICS/2000/norway2000.pdf
>
> Notice that of the 600 rapes in 2000, 20% were solved and there were 90
> offenders. 10% of these were classed as aliens. So 10% of rapes down to
> muslims (at max) not your 75% of rapes, out of 4% of the population. This
is
> somewhat higher representation by muslims but we are talking about only *9
> individuals* many of which come from a marginalised group in the
community.
> Not exceptional that there is a crime problem - who is to blame?
>
> With reliable interpretation of data like you give, I think we can a lot
of
> these anti-muslim allegations with a grain of salt.
Thanks for the cite. I'd been looking for something a bit more official than
the bloody Jewish World Review. <g>
Luke
AnniSwan
Well I get sick of this ironic behaviour, Braodmeadows is a great place with
people that are down to earth and have hearts of gold, most of them are
working class and have just plodded on year after year not expecting or
getting much.
It will only be a matter of time until the yuppies work out that
Broadmeadows is 20 mins from the city and they start making a killing on the
Real Estate market.
People who generalise about certain areas only cause more trouble by
continuing the sterotypic hype of the area.
I predict a big Real Estate boom in Broadmeadows and surrounds in the coming
years, if you have any spare money it would be a great place to invest.
AS
Luke Webber
> "Luke Webber" <lu...@webber.com.au> wrote in message
> Actually, there *is* some basis to the idea that pork carries parasites.
> Not
> > that pork is necessarily any worse than other meats, but a pig's
> metabolism
> > is very similar to a human's (even our meat is supposed to taste
similar).
> > Thus pig diseases and parasites are more likely to be compatible with
> > humans.
> >
> > Of course there is much better disease control these days, so it's not
> > really an issue.
>
> There never was in Europe; ever. Not these days not those days.
>
> Most of the calorific vaalue of food came form pigs prior to 1100.
It's pretty stupid to say that disease control wasn't an issue in Europe
prior to 1100. Disease of all kinds was rife, and there was no knowledge of
the causes. Moreover, pigs have always been prized because they'd eat
practically anything. Excrement, flesh, whatever they're offered. If
something died on a farm, it got fed to the pigs. And intestinal parasites,
including various types of flukes, are communicable.
Cattle OTOH, usually only eat grass and other vegetable matter. It took
modern farmers to come up with a way of processing offal so that cattle
could eat it, and there are some who say that that's what led to BSE.
[snip]
> > Um, thanks. I'll be sure to watch out for that. Like hell.
>
> The only thing you'll be sure of is putting your head up your arse.
[snip]
I don't have much to add to Peter Signorini's comments. Supporting your
arguments by citing radical Jewish websites isn't going to impress any but
the feeble-minded.
Luke
H. DICKMANN
"Jerry Can " <nos...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3ecd7d7e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
> On Fri, 23 May 2003 11:10:17 +1000, "RMan" <rdj...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> >news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
> >> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
> >>
> >> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
> >> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in
the
> >> area.
> >>
> >
> >
> >At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the
serving
> >of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
> >whinging about it.
>
> Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
> racism.
>
> No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
> sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
> totally devoted to that purpose.
>
> No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
> allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
> the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
Not long ago I was on holiday in Cebu City in the Philippines. This is a
very Catholic country. Many of the large retail stores and supermarkets come
to a standstill at lunch time and in the evening for a few minutes for
prayers over the PA system. I have observed many muslims who stood silently
with their heads bowed in respect for others. I have also observed loud
mouth westeners who made fun of this cutural / religious observance.
What it all comes down to is respect for others.
DRS
I don't need to "get off it" since I'm right on this and the morons who
think banning part of traditional Australian culture which in no way harms
others is acceptable are wrong.
::john : d : w : slater::
> "fasgnadh" <fasg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:bamjds$aj5$1...@arachne.labyrinth.net.au...
>>
>> "Brash" <acrobat...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:3ecdc29a$0$3852$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
>> >
>> > What's next?
>>
>> Banning beer in dry-area councils?
>
> For good reason in some areas. But you'll defend anybody who are
> arseholes like yourself.
>
>>
>> > Sharia law?
>>
>> No Christian wowsers imposing their religious views on everyone
>> for decades without your hypocritical Chicken Little Ham-it-up Hysteria!
>>
>> B^D
>>
>> > Fuckin multicultural bullshit is anti-Christian
>> > anti-white racism.
>>
>> Dry Areas
>
> For good reason in some areas.
No just Christian wowsersm. Political incorrectness gone mad ;)
>
>> No Sunday Shopping.
>
> I disagree with it myself.
>
>> Banned services and facilities and entertainments at Christmas and
>> Easter.
>
> I disagree with it myself.
>
>> No meat on Fridays.
>
> Somebody hold a gun to your head?
>
>>
>> I can see the headlines now "Catholic Charity bans meat, offers fish
>> to homeless instead" tut tut.. how evil! B^p
>
> In case you hadn't noticed, fuckwit, fish is good for you.
Hey dickbrain, ever hear of Minamata Bay? Do a Google there's a good lad...
Is that potato wedge. Bring on the herbivores... I'm fungry...
>
>
> --
> De Oppresso Liber.
>
Freed some oppressed people lately have you?
fasgnadh
>
> "The Enlightenment" <bern...@yahoo.com.au> wrote in message
> news:ZCsza.40658$1s1.5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
>
> > 2 Rape; 75% of Norway's convicted rapists are Muslim,
> > 65% of Denmark's Rapist are Muslim.
> >
> > 3 Crime: 55% of Denmark's convicted criminals come from the 4% Muslim
> > population.
>
> What utter bloody crap! You get your source data on muslim crime from a
> jewish website. That gives us an independent viewpoint, oh yeah!! It
spouts
> abject lies.
It's typical of that racist troublemaker.
Previously he has posted claims of 'Ethnic group X crime twice that
of local born" and when you go to teh source data you find 2: 100,000
versus 4:100,000 ! B^D Tiny and statistically insignificant
vatiations beat up into theri usual bigot hysteria. (He also
ignored the same stats showing "Local Born crime twice that of
ethnic group Y" B^D
>
> > Here are links confirming all of my statistics and more:
> > http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/steyn.html
> > http://jewishworldreview.com/0802/pipes.html
> > http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=15630
> > http://cphpost.periskop.dk/default.asp?id=16937
>
> And even the more independent Copenhagen Post item talks of alleged higher
> Muslim crimes as due to groups who are signifcantly marginalised and
> alienated. Give you a clue - by people with attitudes like yours Mr
> Enlightenment.
>
> Try a more reliable source like Interpol
> http://www.interpol.com/Public/Statistics/ICS/2000/norway2000.pdf
>
> Notice that of the 600 rapes in 2000, 20% were solved and there were 90
> offenders. 10% of these were classed as aliens. So 10% of rapes down to
> muslims (at max) not your 75% of rapes, out of 4% of the population. This
is
> somewhat higher representation by muslims but we are talking about only *9
> individuals* many of which come from a marginalised group in the
community.
> Not exceptional that there is a crime problem - who is to blame?
>
> With reliable interpretation of data like you give, I think we can a lot
of
> these anti-muslim allegations with a grain of salt.
Thats how most people treat 'Enlightenments' 'stats'; about as reliable
as those concocted by Mosley, the aus.politics Net Kook.
>
> Cheers
> Peter
>
>
DRS
[...]
>> I can see the headlines now "Catholic Charity bans meat, offers fish
>> to homeless instead" tut tut.. how evil! B^p
>
> In case you hadn't noticed, fuckwit, fish is good for you.
Actually, it's a matter of law that religious based charities and welfare
organisations may not impose their religious views on those they purport to
serve, which is how it should be. So, all other things being equal, a
Catholic charity is not allowed to only serve fish (on Fridays, a tradition
that has anyway now largely disappeared).
Yet in Broadmeadows we have a democratically elected council imposing its
religious views on rate-payer funded events.
H. DICKMANN
According to Jesus Christ: The least of my brethren's .
According to the horrible left: The poor and the workers.
According to the horrible right: Anyone who earns at least 60T a year.
You can take your pick 2 ways:
1) what is morally right.
2) what is in the best interest of your hip pocket.
Jacques Guy
>
> On Sat, 24 May 2003 10:09:29 GMT, "Trevor Wilson"
> More of your lying pro Islamic rubbish
He is not pro Islamic. He is not pro anything, except pro giving
everybody
else the shits, pro sticking his nose into everybody else's business,
pro forbidding everybody else from living their lives as they please,
all the while posturing and strutting as a great, tolerant, morally
superior paragon of virtue. If he lived in Saudi Arabia, he'd
be yelling that everybody there should eat pork and drink whisky
in order to "show tolerance and respect towards our esteemed
Western guests". And he'd be forbidding people to wipe their arses
with their left hand, because that is an "outdated tribal custom".
Vaughan Williams
> cult of hate and war
Fundamentalist Xtians have done their share of being a cult of hate and war
too.
> A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
> proudly and devoutly Christian. Christianity is most certain part of
So?
> Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
> banned in parts of Australia)
Bullshit.
> It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
Have fun explaining how that can or should be done in a secular democracy.
Particularly one whose constitution specifically guarantees freedom of
religion.
> His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
> practices them today. Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
> murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
> assassination
Any sort of religious organisation running a government tends to be a bad
idea.
> This is now on record where these gangs were hidden from public view
> for years and years while Islamic racist gangs were pack raping what
> Islamics claim are infidels
The most widely reported pack rape that I recall was indeed committed by
Lebanese. Lebanese Catholics, in fact - you know, that oppressed minority in
Lebanon that came here and elsewhere as refugees? In case you have
forgotten, Lebanese Catholics fall within Christianity, that religion you
say is all sweetness and light.
And the fact half a dozen of them pack-raped someone says nothing at all
about Lebanese Catholics, Lebanese Muslims, or Islam generally.
> Yes Islamics want and actively support the murder of Australians and
> anyone they consider Islamic (their web pages proudly stated so)
> Islam is actively a cult of hate and murder
Some islamic fundamentalists actively support that. And some fundamentalist
xtians have similarly outrageous views about particular social and ethnic
groups.
And there are plenty of moderate christians and muslims who don't peddle
hate and murder, and who probably rather resent it when the fundamentalists
are assumed to speak for all.
Trevor Wilson
"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
> On Sat, 24 May 2003 10:09:29 GMT, "Trevor Wilson"
> <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
> >news:q57ucvobh6niueah6...@4ax.com...
> >>
> >> Well Australia was raised on Christianity,
> >
> >**Utter bullshit. The original Australians had no such belief systems.
Many
> >Australians chose not to accept Christianity, back in the 19th Century.
MOST
> >of the population WAS Christian. That does not make Christianity right.
It
> >just makes it popular. Kinda like that lying scumbag, John Howard. he
sure
> >is popular. Doesn't make him right though.
>
> You are absolutely mistaken and utterly dangerously WRONG supporting a
> cult of hate and war
**I support nothing of the sort. In fact, I voted against that lying
scumbag, warmonger, John Howard and I will continue to do so. BTW: Last
time I looked, John Howard, the warmonger, was a Christian. A Christian who
sent Australians to a war which the mojority of the Australian population
was against.
>
> A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
> proudly and devoutly Christian.
**So what? That means nothing.
Christianity is most certain part of
> Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
> banned in parts of Australia)
**Sure, Christianity is part of the culture. As is Judaism, Islam, Buddhism
and several other religions. What's your point? Stupid people will always
beleive in some kind of supernatural crap. That is their right.
>
> It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
**Have fun with that. People in Australia have the right to beleive in
whatever they wish, provided they do not infringe on the rights of others.
>
> > our laws, the way we
> >> think, the things we do. Islamics who have fled here (from Islamic
> >> horrors) are effectively, in this life, protected by our teachings of
> >> Jesus Christ (Moslems to be protected in the next, need to convert)
> >
> >**Rubbish. They are protected by our laws. Jesus of Nazereth died 2,000
> >years ago. He has nothing to do with anything, short of filling a few
lines
> >in some history books.
>
> His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
> practices them today.
**Huh? Would you like to re-state that?
Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
> murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
> assassination
**Really? Evidence please.
>
> >>
> >> I have friends in and around Lakemba mosque suburbs who often find
> >> your "polite" Islamics deliberately attacking the neighborhood to
> >> drive Australians out
> >
> >**Then they only need to rely on the law to protect them. Tell me the
> >details of the police reports and the names of the officers (and the
> >station) to which those reports were made.
>
> More of your lying pro Islamic rubbish
**I am not pro-anything. I do beleive that people have the right to be
deluded by the religion of their own choosing. be it Islam, Christianity,
whatever. Provided, of course, that they do not inflict their beliefs on
others, nor interfere with another's rights.
>
> The Police in NSW are interfered from stopping Islamic terror gangs
> roaming around Sydney
**Really? Does that inlcude the gang that was locked up for record gaol
terms, for rape? Do you have some evidence of what you speak? Or is it
heresay?
>
> This is now on record where these gangs were hidden from public view
> for years and years while Islamic racist gangs were pack raping what
> Islamics claim are infidels
**Hidden? Jeez, it made the headlines for several weeks, when a bunch of
guys were sent to gaol for rape. Hardly hidden. In any case, if it was
hidden, then who hid it and why?
>
> Cars being parked over drive ways rubbish tipped in yards windows
> broken stabbing's and so on are the norm around Lakemba even the head
> Mufti carries illegal firearms. This same turd organized Islamic
> attacks against Sydney police just recently
**Do you have evidence of the illegal firearms and the organised attacks? Of
is that more heresay?
>
> As I keep saying its time this outrageous cult is given the flick
**So you say. Personally, I feel that any cult which protects and coddles
paedophillia should get the flick too. As should any religion which cannot
meet our consumer laws. That, pretty much, means all of them.
>
> >> Also the link to the end of Australia's famous sausage sizzle get
> >> togethers
> >>
> >> *************
> >>
>
><http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862
,
> >00.html>
> >> Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
> >> hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
> >> population.
> >>
> >> Hume chief executive Darrell Treloar said he had ordered the ban
> >> because 12 per cent of the area's population -- and two councillors,
> >> including the mayor -- were Muslim.
> >> ***************
> >>
> >> Out of respect for Australians murdered by this Islamic cult need to
> >> given marching orders (enough is enough)
> >
> >**Which Islamic cult? The one in Indonesia? Are you suggesting that ALL
> >Muslems ascribe to the notion that Australians should be killed?
>
> Yes Islamics want and actively support the murder of Australians and
> anyone they consider Islamic (their web pages proudly stated so)
**I see. ALL their web pages?
>
> Islam is actively a cult of hate and murder
**No. Islam is a 'cult' of peace, tolerance and love. Christianity is a cult
of peace, tolerance and love. It seems, you've forgotton that, however. SOME
Muslims and SOME Christians practice war, hate and intolerance.
>
> Islamic's were listening to the radio in Lakemba's, Imam Ali Mosque,
> 65 Wangee Rd in expectation of the September 11th attack. Moslem's
> then set about burning down Churches and Synagogues Moslems rejoicing
> and becoming openly threatening in Australia
**Really? Were you there? How many were rejoying? All of them?
>
> The Head Imam at Lakemba most certainly endorses killing of
> Australians every where he himself fled Islam (into the arms and
> safety of Jesus Christs teachings) after being involved in a murder of
> a policeman in Egypt
**Really. Got some REAL evidence? Or are you presenting more of you heresay
evidence?
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Trevor Wilson
"Jacques Guy" <jg...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ED0A1...@alphalink.com.au...
> Petzl wrote:
> >
> > On Sat, 24 May 2003 10:09:29 GMT, "Trevor Wilson"
>
> > More of your lying pro Islamic rubbish
>
> He is not pro Islamic. He is not pro anything, except pro giving
> everybody
> else the shits,
**Only those who are incapable of assemling a cogent arguement. Only those
who promote hate and intolerance. Only those morons who fall back on
religion to make a point.
pro sticking his nose into everybody else's business,
> pro forbidding everybody else from living their lives as they please,
**That is where you are wrong. People may do what they please, worhsip who
of what they please, as long as they do no harm to another in the process.
> all the while posturing and strutting as a great, tolerant, morally
> superior paragon of virtue. If he lived in Saudi Arabia, he'd
> be yelling that everybody there should eat pork and drink whisky
> in order to "show tolerance and respect towards our esteemed
> Western guests".
**Saudi Arabia is a sick, twisted perversion of an Islamic state. It is run
by a vicious dictatorship, with no moral or ethical codes.
And he'd be forbidding people to wipe their arses
> with their left hand, because that is an "outdated tribal custom".
**Actually, before toilet paper, it made good sense.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Gregory Shearman
>On Fri, 23 May 2003 11:10:17 +1000, "RMan" <rdj...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>
>>
>>"Lina Rinaldi" <linar...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>news:5c5d6a9e2e18358f2faadf5799e17b3e@TeraNews...
>>> Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>>>
>>> Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>>> products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
>>> area.
>>>
>>
>>Interesting selection of crossposts, why not aus.pets too ?
>>
>>At least get the facts right, ham/pork has not been banned, only the serving
>>of them at council events, and not that big a deal. Already people are
>>whinging about it.
>
>Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
>racism.
>
>No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
>sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
>totally devoted to that purpose.
>
>No big deal that no other religion or group within Australia is
>allowed to impose its own dietary habits on other Australians. Only
>the revered muslims have that multicultural right.
Actually, the muslim community didn't want such a ban. The mayor
did this on his own bat...probably a misguided attempt to curry
favour (in the form of votes) from a large ethnic community.
--
Regards,
Gregory.
"Ding-a-Ding Dang, My Dang-a-Long Ling Long."
Petzl
<en...@nospam.com> wrote:
>> You are absolutely mistaken and utterly dangerously WRONG supporting a
>> cult of hate and war
>
>Fundamentalist Xtians have done their share of being a cult of hate and war
>too.
Not in Australia
>> A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
>> proudly and devoutly Christian. Christianity is most certain part of
>
>So?
Its the religion Australia has based it laws the things we do the way
we behave
>> Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
>> banned in parts of Australia)
>
>Bullshit.
Nope
********
<http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862,00.html>
Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
population.
********
>> It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
>
>Have fun explaining how that can or should be done in a secular democracy.
>Particularly one whose constitution specifically guarantees freedom of
>religion.
The cult of Islam is an evil one of hate I would say a referendum can
easily put in specific ties to kick out Islam a deranged cult who's
only purpose in Australia is to exterminate Australians (and have
said so on their web page)
>> His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
>> practices them today. Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
>> murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
>> assassination
>
>Any sort of religious organisation running a government tends to be a bad
>idea.
Well keep Islam out of Australia then.
In this modern world and our wealthy Christian lifestyle already have
super taxes are applied to specifically watch this dark age Satanic
cult
>> This is now on record where these gangs were hidden from public view
>> for years and years while Islamic racist gangs were pack raping what
>> Islamics claim are infidels
>
>The most widely reported pack rape that I recall was indeed committed by
>Lebanese. Lebanese Catholics, in fact - you know, that oppressed minority in
>Lebanon that came here and elsewhere as refugees? In case you have
>forgotten, Lebanese Catholics fall within Christianity, that religion you
>say is all sweetness and light.
>And the fact half a dozen of them pack-raped someone says nothing at all
>about Lebanese Catholics, Lebanese Muslims, or Islam generally.
Not so all were Islamic Gangs widely reported in every world press
and attacks have also been found to be going on in many other
Christian countries that Islamics have fled to (Norway,
Denmark,France, etc)
The police knew and know over a 100 of this Islamic rapists but have
only charged and prosecuted 3
Commissioner Ryan stated it was an initiation right of this cults
gang/cell members
>> Yes Islamics want and actively support the murder of Australians and
>> anyone they consider Islamic (their web pages proudly stated so)
>> Islam is actively a cult of hate and murder
>
>Some islamic fundamentalists actively support that. And some fundamentalist
>xtians have similarly outrageous views about particular social and ethnic
>groups.
>
>And there are plenty of moderate christians and muslims who don't peddle
>hate and murder, and who probably rather resent it when the fundamentalists
>are assumed to speak for all.
>
Islam in Australia has always been nothing but a threat the first
Islamics in Australia started shooting Australian mums and dads as
they took a "picnic train" to a sausage sizzle
<http://amol.org.au/guide/stories/turks/aftermath.html>
encouraging Islam a active murderous hateful cult and in Australia
harming and threatening Australians
Trevor Wilson
"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
> On Sat, 24 May 2003 18:24:32 GMT, "Vaughan Williams"
> <en...@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> >> You are absolutely mistaken and utterly dangerously WRONG supporting a
> >> cult of hate and war
> >
> >Fundamentalist Xtians have done their share of being a cult of hate and
war
> >too.
>
> Not in Australia
**Sure they have. Just listen to how Fred Nile talks about homosexuals. See
if you can figure out what kind of religious beliefs the people who picket
(and kill security guards) at women's health centres. SOME Australian
Christians are full of hate and loathing. I'm gonna go out on a limb, here
and assume that you are a Christian. YOU have dsiplayed some of these
traits.
>
> >> A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
> >> proudly and devoutly Christian. Christianity is most certain part of
> >
> >So?
>
> Its the religion Australia has based it laws the things we do the way
> we behave
**Australia has based its laws on the commonsense ways of respect for one's
neighbour. Christianity has nothing to do with it. Islam teaches remarkably
similar things to us. As does Buddhism, Judaism, etc. All religions are
based on the same humanistic tenents.
>
> >> Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
> >> banned in parts of Australia)
> >
> >Bullshit.
> Nope
> ********
>
<http://www.heraldsun.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5478,6478141%255E2862,
00.html>
> Council staff have been ordered to stop serving ham and pork at
> hundreds of events out of respect to the area's large Muslim
> population.
> ********
>
> >> It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
> >
> >Have fun explaining how that can or should be done in a secular
democracy.
> >Particularly one whose constitution specifically guarantees freedom of
> >religion.
>
> The cult of Islam is an evil one of hate I would say a referendum can
> easily put in specific ties to kick out Islam a deranged cult who's
> only purpose in Australia is to exterminate Australians (and have
> said so on their web page)
**Islam is not based on hate. You really need to read up on the subject,
before sprouting such nonsense. That would be like me suggesting that ALL
Christianity is based on hate, just because Fred Nile is an intolerant
arsehole. Just as there are some complete dickheads, who are Christians
(Fred Nile, John Howard, Tony Abbott, etc), there are a goodly number of
very fine individuals, who just happen to be Christians. You should start
judging people for how they act and what they do, rather than which
particular house of worship they go to.
>
> >> His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
> >> practices them today. Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
> >> murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
> >> assassination
> >
> >Any sort of religious organisation running a government tends to be a bad
> >idea.
>
> Well keep Islam out of Australia then.
**What about Christianity. That complete fuckwit, John Howard has put the
head of a Christian church as our head of state! Disgusting! John Howard is
doing more damage to our democracy by mixing church and state, than any
other human being in our history.
>
> In this modern world and our wealthy Christian lifestyle already have
> super taxes are applied to specifically watch this dark age Satanic
> cult
**What is with this arbitrary hatred towards Islam. You have a major
problem. PEOPLE are the problem, not the religion.
>
> >> This is now on record where these gangs were hidden from public view
> >> for years and years while Islamic racist gangs were pack raping what
> >> Islamics claim are infidels
> >
> >The most widely reported pack rape that I recall was indeed committed by
> >Lebanese. Lebanese Catholics, in fact - you know, that oppressed minority
in
> >Lebanon that came here and elsewhere as refugees? In case you have
> >forgotten, Lebanese Catholics fall within Christianity, that religion you
> >say is all sweetness and light.
> >And the fact half a dozen of them pack-raped someone says nothing at all
> >about Lebanese Catholics, Lebanese Muslims, or Islam generally.
>
> Not so all were Islamic Gangs widely reported in every world press
> and attacks have also been found to be going on in many other
> Christian countries that Islamics have fled to (Norway,
> Denmark,France, etc)
>
> The police knew and know over a 100 of this Islamic rapists but have
> only charged and prosecuted 3
**Is that so? Are you sure? Are you certain that more have not been charged?
Are you sure that the police can prove enough to take it to court?
>
> Commissioner Ryan stated it was an initiation right of this cults
> gang/cell members
**Possibly. What is your point? These guys were complete arseholes. They
went to gaol.
>
> >> Yes Islamics want and actively support the murder of Australians and
> >> anyone they consider Islamic (their web pages proudly stated so)
> >> Islam is actively a cult of hate and murder
> >
> >Some islamic fundamentalists actively support that. And some
fundamentalist
> >xtians have similarly outrageous views about particular social and ethnic
> >groups.
> >
> >And there are plenty of moderate christians and muslims who don't peddle
> >hate and murder, and who probably rather resent it when the
fundamentalists
> >are assumed to speak for all.
> >
>
> Islam in Australia has always been nothing but a threat the first
> Islamics in Australia started shooting Australian mums and dads as
> they took a "picnic train" to a sausage sizzle
> <http://amol.org.au/guide/stories/turks/aftermath.html>
**Oh, please! You want to talk about ancient history, go back to the
Crusades. Christians invaded Muslim lands, in order to convert them to
Christianity.
>
> encouraging Islam a active murderous hateful cult and in Australia
> harming and threatening Australians
**So is Christianity.
The most Christian nation on the planet, is the USA. Have a look at their
record, over the last few decades:
3 million dead Vietnames
Several hundred thousand dead Central Americans.
Invasions into many nations.
The protection of the most vicious bunch of thugs on this planet (Sharon, et
al)
The list goes on.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com
Petzl
<tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
>
>"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
>news:7lmucv8se0vqd6j3d...@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 24 May 2003 10:09:29 GMT, "Trevor Wilson"
>> <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
>> >news:q57ucvobh6niueah6...@4ax.com...
>> >>
>> >> Well Australia was raised on Christianity,
>> >
>> >**Utter bullshit. The original Australians had no such belief systems.
>Many
>> >Australians chose not to accept Christianity, back in the 19th Century.
>MOST
>> >of the population WAS Christian. That does not make Christianity right.
>It
>> >just makes it popular. Kinda like that lying scumbag, John Howard. he
>sure
>> >is popular. Doesn't make him right though.
>>
>> You are absolutely mistaken and utterly dangerously WRONG supporting a
>> cult of hate and war
>
>**I support nothing of the sort. In fact, I voted against that lying
>scumbag, warmonger, John Howard and I will continue to do so. BTW: Last
>time I looked, John Howard, the warmonger, was a Christian. A Christian who
>sent Australians to a war which the mojority of the Australian population
>was against.
Exactly my point Islamics have infiltrated Christian countries and are
now attacking from with aided by Islam despots
John Howard and other Christian countries were forced to address these
external threats very quickly and effectively.
>>
>> A very high majority of people in Australia would have Ancestors
>> proudly and devoutly Christian.
>
>**So what? That means nothing.
To you maybe.
Because of this Christianity it is the framework for present day
Australia, of our laws, the way we behave, the things we do. This
wealth and our culture is what Islamic's who fled here hate and
actively attack from within
> Christianity is most certain part of
>> Australia's culture. Just as the sausage Sizzle was (Islamics have now
>> banned in parts of Australia)
>
>**Sure, Christianity is part of the culture. As is Judaism, Islam, Buddhism
>and several other religions. What's your point? Stupid people will always
>beleive in some kind of supernatural crap. That is their right.
Islam has never been part of Australian culture tried to allow them in
as camel drivers for the Ghan which ended in a Islamic terrorist
attack on Mum's and Dads taking a picnic train to a sausage sizzle
<http://amol.org.au/guide/stories/turks/aftermath.html>
>>
>> It is not Pork that needs banning it is the cult of Islam
>
>**Have fun with that. People in Australia have the right to beleive in
>whatever they wish, provided they do not infringe on the rights of others.
Tell that to our right wing parties (like One Nation who will address
correctly the Islamic threat)
I cannot see why a genuine menace like Islam is not addressed in same
fashion. Wonders if this anti-Australian Imam who often calls for his
followers to attack Australians is not searched for disarming
<http://www.geocities.com/petzlx/mus.html>
>>
>> > our laws, the way we
>> >> think, the things we do. Islamics who have fled here (from Islamic
>> >> horrors) are effectively, in this life, protected by our teachings of
>> >> Jesus Christ (Moslems to be protected in the next, need to convert)
>> >
>> >**Rubbish. They are protected by our laws. Jesus of Nazereth died 2,000
>> >years ago. He has nothing to do with anything, short of filling a few
>lines
>> >in some history books.
>>
>> His teachings and beliefs are what Islamics flee to as Australia still
>> practices them today.
>
>**Huh? Would you like to re-state that?
Islamic's I know claim, to have come to Australia because their
Islamic belief is out to kill them and there family in their own land
They target Australia because of it's safe and wealthy Christian
Lifestyle. They acknowledge they have been saved by the teachings of
Jesus Christ (even if you don't believe it, they do and dislike this
fact)
> Islamics often get caught in their affects of a
>> murderous cult where its "leaders" gain power by murder and
>> assassination
>
>**Really? Evidence please.
An Imam was chopped up in Iraq recently by other Imam (a common event)
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/04/10/sprj.irq.assassination/
In Australia Mosques such as Lakembas are financed and run by Saudi
Arabia Even import "leaders" to run activities from them
>>
>> >>
>> >> I have friends in and around Lakemba mosque suburbs who often find
>> >> your "polite" Islamics deliberately attacking the neighborhood to
>> >> drive Australians out
>> >
>> >**Then they only need to rely on the law to protect them. Tell me the
>> >details of the police reports and the names of the officers (and the
>> >station) to which those reports were made.
>>
>> More of your lying pro Islamic rubbish
>
>**I am not pro-anything. I do beleive that people have the right to be
>deluded by the religion of their own choosing. be it Islam, Christianity,
>whatever. Provided, of course, that they do not inflict their beliefs on
>others, nor interfere with another's rights.
Acceptance of Moslems who "smile" at you (an infidel in their eyes)
and believe they are harmless is dangerous delusion to you and your
family
>>
>> The Police in NSW are interfered from stopping Islamic terror gangs
>> roaming around Sydney
>
>**Really? Does that inlcude the gang that was locked up for record gaol
>terms, for rape? Do you have some evidence of what you speak? Or is it
>heresay?
refresh your twisted memory
*************
<http://www.abc.net.au/mediawatch/transcripts/090902_s2.htm>
"糎hy did it take two years and as many 70 rapes for us to be made
aware of what appears to be a home-grown form of systematic ethnic
cleansing by a group of men said to be of "Middle Eastern" extraction?
***************
No "gang" was locked up. Of the known excess of 100 Islamic cell
members they arrested and convicted three (Initially NSW was going to
release these thugs in few a days only after media reports pointed
this out, one terrorist recieved a sentance of 40 years)
It is common knowledge that these attacks were known to be happening
for years prior! NSW Police were acting under Government instruction
to leave Islamic's alone
Petzl
--
LET'S LOOK OUT FOR AUSTRALIA
http://www.nationalsecurity.gov.au/
Protecting our way of life from terrorist threat
DeeDubya
"Peter Signorini" <pet...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecd...@news.alphalink.com.au...
>
> "Jerry Can " <nos...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:3ecd7d7e...@News.CIS.DFN.DE...
> >
> > Here come the pro-muslim apologists. Their posts always reek of
> > racism.
> >
> > No big deal that Australian society has to modify itself to suit the
> > sensibilities of people who refuse to live in countries that are
> > totally devoted to that purpose.
>
> Mr Pot meets Ms Kettle and accuses her of being the daughter of a black
> dude.
>
>
DeeDubya
"Peter Signorini" <pet...@alphalink.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecd...@news.alphalink.com.au...
>
> "Mick" <lalor...@bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> news:xhmza.2043$iv4....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> > From what I heard on 3AW this morning
>
> You listen to this!! Oh lord.
>
> > the Mayor is also Muslim and even
> > worse a Labour party hack!!!!!!!!!!.
>
> 3AW... accusations of Labour Party hack... Surprise, surprise!
>
> The policy decision change was mde by the council's CEO, not the Mayor.
>
>
>
>
DeeDubya
"Trevor Wilson" <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote in message
news:3ecf...@news.comindico.com.au...
>
> "Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
> news:7lmucv8se0vqd6j3d...@4ax.com...
> > On Sat, 24 May 2003 10:09:29 GMT, "Trevor Wilson"
> > <tre...@rageaudio.com.au> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >"Petzl" <petzl...@SpAmCoP.NeT> wrote in message
> > >news:q57ucvobh6niueah6...@4ax.com...
>**I am not pro-anything. I do beleive that people have the right to >be
>deluded by the religion of their own choosing. be it Islam, >Christianity,
>whatever. Provided, of course, that they do not inflict their beliefs >on
>others, nor interfere with another's rights.
Well, isn't banning pork, Xmas grottos, Santa Claus (Father Christmas), etc,
infringing on other people's rights and beliefs???
Trevor Wilson
"DeeDubya" <class...@juno.comREMOVETHIS> wrote in message
news:mqUza.41817$1s1.5...@newsfeeds.bigpond.com...
**Mostly, no. I can eat pork, any time I like. So can the people in the
local government area affected by the ban. Santa Claus does not infringe on
my rights. I could, however, argue that teaching children *any* kind of
religion IS infringing on their rights. Children should not be subjected to
such nonsense, without being taught that none of it is proven and most is
based on the testimony of largely ignorant, unreliable witnesses. Further,
most texts on the subject (the Bible, Quor-an, etc) have suffered with poor
translations and have been politically censored.
--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au
Oblomov Alcibiades
<linar...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>Wow, just heard this over the radio.
>
>Apparently the muslim Mayor of Broadmeadows has banned ham and pork
>products so as not to offend the 12% minority of muslims who live in the
>area.
>
For quite some time now, all lamb sold in Western Australia has been
halal - slaughtered according to Islamic ritual. Years ago, the meat
marketing cooperative, looking to export markets in the Middle East,
set up Islamic slaughter chains WA abattoirs. Then, reasoning that
non-Muslims were not prohibited from eating halal food, and that it
would be more economical to have a single slaughter chain for lamb,
they made all lamb and mutton halal, so they could export any or all
of it to the middle east.
The decision was applauded by animal liberationists as well, because
it was an attempt at a viable alternative to the inhumane live sheep
export trade. Now, halal WA lamb is exported to middle eastern
countries that want premium product, and whose meat market is not
controlled by abattoir owners bribing the government to continue the
live sheep trade. As a by- product, the leg of lamb for your Sunday
roast is halal, so you can safely invite your Islamic neighbours over.
I guess, however, that some of the bigots on these newsgroups will now
swear off eating lamb, and whinge about having been forced to
participate in an Islamic ritual, notwithstanding the fact that the
decision was taken for pure, pragmatic economic reasons.
Jerry Can
What has this got to do with the topic? Do you think this makes you
some kind of politcally correct hero to discuss the pervasiveness of
halal meat in WA?
The topic is about how one religion out of all the religions in
Austalia has had its dietary requirements imposed on all other people
who attend the Broadmeadows council.
The definition of bigot is:
One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or
politics and is intolerant of those who differ
Do you understand this? Being strongly partial to muslims in
Broadmeadows has led to their dietary requirements becoming the
council standard while there is an intolerance of the dietary
requirements of other religions. This is bigotry.
It does not matter that idiots come in here and make ridiculous
statements such as:
-My muslim neighbours are nice people
-Porcine products can contain bacteria
-Halal meat is good for the economy
This does not in any way change what has occured.
Why is it that these left-wing loonies think that if they give muslims
special treatment over all other groups in Australia that this makes
them great and noble people and if anyone complains that this is wrong
and that all people should be treated with equal respect then they are
'bigots' or 'racists'?
It seems that the left-wing loonies have redefined the terms 'bigot',
'racist', 'nazi', and 'kkk' to mean a term of abuse for someone who
disagrees with the looney left.
BK
Jacques Guy wrote in message <3ED0A1...@alphalink.com.au>...
Religious groups can benefit themselves by isolating.
For instance, groups of families band together to run cash businesses while
at the same time drawing CentreLink benefits. Some of these groups have
sizable assets. The favorite way of laundering cash is to take it offshore
and send it back to relatives as presents. Taxi driving can be another
lucrative source of income, where family, cultural members, etc swop taxi
licenses while doing various other jobs, while drawing CentreLink payments.
Bakeries, etc are another way of earning undeclared cash.
By the way, the solution to the 'ham problem' is to simply label the plate
of sandwiches 'With ham' and 'without ham.'
BK
Petzl
wrote:
Not good enough for the meanacing dark age cult of Islam which require
food not to be prepred with other pork meals around
I mean why have they fled from Islam to Christian Australia
Peter Signorini
>
> What has this got to do with the topic? Do you think this makes you
> some kind of politcally correct hero to discuss the pervasiveness of
> halal meat in WA?
I think his point was probably that this is an islamic cultural habit that
has been accepted by the Anglo-Australian meat producers because it gave
them some benefit and was not going to cause great inconvenience. Kinda like
non-ham council functions in Broadmeadows. I mean how many of these council
functions are you going to attend? And surely, if you must have a protein
fix at each meal, instead of ham you can eat corned beef, salami, tuna,
chicken, roast beef, lamb, sardines or ox-tongue? Or maybe do without the
meat and eat cheese for one meal.
>
> The topic is about how one religion out of all the religions in
> Austalia has had its dietary requirements imposed on all other people
> who attend the Broadmeadows council.
Every time my kids friends have a birthday party at McDonalds I have a
foreign religion (US imperialiism) imposing it's dietary requirements upon
me. S#^t, what a terrible lot of discrimination this is against all us good
honest Aussies.
> The definition of bigot is:
>
> One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or
> politics and is intolerant of those who differ
>
> Do you understand this?
Yes, I do. That sounds like the views being peddled by Mr Enlightenment and
your good self.
> It does not matter that idiots come in here and make ridiculous
> statements such as:
>
> -My muslim neighbours are nice people
I teach plenty of them at a mixed public school and this is correct.
> -Porcine products can contain bacteria
They most certainly may do.
> -Halal meat is good for the economy
As Australia has a significant export meat trade, it most certainly is
correct.
> Why is it that these left-wing loonies think that if they give muslims
> special treatment over all other groups in Australia
Not special treatment, just a bit of respect for their customs. After all
why do we give special public holidays and plaster religious icons
throughout our stores for the holy days of one religion but not those of
others? That sounds like special treatment to me.
Cheers
Peter
Peter Signorini
>
> What has this got to do with the topic? Do you think this makes you
> some kind of politcally correct hero to...
You didn't answer me about the hash cookies either Jerry. Can I come along
to your RSL meeting and get a serve of these? No?
What about horse salami? Not available, why not? It is a tradition for
people from France and Italy
http://www.slowfood.com/img_sito/riviste/new_slow/EN/24/equina.html
The failure to provide this food choice is straight out discrimination
against the Australians of a french & italian background. Ohh, now don't
come out with the old wog tag - you'll show yourself up as a bigot you know.
Face it man, the choice of what foods to supply and what not to provide is a
decision made by every restaurant and cafe in the country, a business
decision based on the market tastes. You cna't accuse them of discrimination
simply because *one* food item is not available. This whole thread is really
so childish, if it wasn't for the fact that the attitudes behind it are so
disturbing.
Cheers
Peter
Brash
>
> > Oh well that Labor party hack opened the first ever Library in
> Broadmeadows
> > tonight, all done by a Labor council, I didn't ever hear the Liberals
> offer
> > to build a Library in Broadmeadows.
>
> 1. Has there ever been anything else than a Labor council in Broadmeadows?
> No.
>
> 2. Are there enough educated or literate people in Broadmeadows to
justify
> a library? No. You need more than three.
Hyuk hyuk hyuk!
Wanker.
--
De Oppresso Liber.
>
>
Brash
>
>
> > Ignorant idiot, it's mindsets like yours that has caused Broadmeadows to
> > have the reputation that it does, it is the home of the working class
and
> > there are many very deserved people there.
>
> Lighten up sweetheart. It's called i-r-o-n-y.
>
> PS - Who are 'very deserved people'?
Maybe I should live up to your, ironic, stereotype of me, come over, and
give you a smack in the chops. Now, THAT would be ironic.
--
De Oppresso Liber.
>
>
Brash
>
> "Little Dorrit" <little...@optusnet.com.au> wrote in message
> news:3ecf5f2e$0$1025$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
> > "AnniSwan" <an...@nospam.bigpond.net.au> wrote in message
> > news:HHIza.772$ES....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> >
> >
> > > Ignorant idiot, it's mindsets like yours that has caused Broadmeadows
to
> > > have the reputation that it does, it is the home of the working class
> and
> > > there are many very deserved people there.
> >
> > Lighten up sweetheart. It's called i-r-o-n-y.
> >
> > PS - Who are 'very deserved people'?
> >
>
>
with
> people that are down to earth and have hearts of gold, most of them are
> working class and have just plodded on year after year not expecting or
> getting much.
>
> It will only be a matter of time until the yuppies work out that
> Broadmeadows is 20 mins from the city and they start making a killing on
the
> Real Estate market.
>
> People who generalise about certain areas only cause more trouble by
> continuing the sterotypic hype of the area.
>
> I predict a big Real Estate boom in Broadmeadows and surrounds in the
coming
> years, if you have any spare money it would be a great place to invest.
>
> AS
Its started already. Property values have being heading upwards for years.
For what its worth, Broadmeadows doesn't need to import Yuppies. For years.
Broady has been exporting them to Brighton, Elwood, Toorak etc. Eddy
Maguire has done alright for himself, as has some friends of mine who own a
chain of clothing boutiques, make many of the ads you see on TV, etc etc.
--
De Oppresso Liber.
>
>
Little Dorrit
> Maybe I should live up to your, ironic, stereotype of me, come over, and
> give you a smack in the chops. Now, THAT would be ironic.
Broadmeadows has been a high crime area for a long time and it's not hard to
see why. Meet typical Broady denizen. Violence is a legitmate debating
technique and solves all problems.
Little Dorrit
> Hyuk hyuk hyuk!
>
> Wanker.
>
> --
> De Oppresso Liber.
Meet the Dux of Broadmeadows High School.
Brash
You betcha. So? Going to put up, or shut up?
--
De Oppresso Liber.
>
>