Android on a Treo (650, 680, 700p, 700w, 750w, 755p, Centro)

[NickDG]

Hi All,

When I was reading about one of the hardware platforms Android
supports, I noticed it was very similar to what's inside my Treo 700p.

http://www.anddev.org/first_android_hardware_development_board_available-t981.html

"Their development process took about two months, now they are glad to
release their Android-Enabled Development Board. The Board is equipped
with a powerful Intel XScale PXA 270 416M 400MHz CPU. The Linux (with
2.6.23 Kernel) feels well in 32MB RAM and 64MB Flash-ROM. Additional
storage can be accessed via the two USB-Ports. One can attach USB-
Sticks and i.e. SD-Cards. The CPU is fast enough to play MPEG videos
absolutely smooth."

The 700p out of the box runs at 312mhz, but can be clocked to 416mhz
with no stability issues.

With Verizon opening their CDMA network for non-verizon phones
(Hopefully Sprint will follow), this could really work.

I have a couple old 650's laying around that I will hack around with.
I can't mess with my 700p at the moment as it's my primary phone.

Anyone with me?

Thanks

- Nick

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Here I do, and I'm using a Treo 650.

Aside from some technical specifications (e.g. RAM/ROM size, Bluetooth
1.2 "only", .3M camera) and battery life issue, the form factor is
actually not bad, IMO.

The 650's RAM and ROM (32MB each) is probably a bit short for Android
through. Models after the 650 are better equipped in this respect.

Besides, there are some apps and functions that's available on the
Treo and Palm OS, but not yet on Android, like synchronization with MS
Outlook. Although I think it's only a matter of time that the app
diversity and functionality of Android matches and exceeds that of the
Palm OS. Afterall, Palm OS has had years of head start.

On Feb 29, 9:23 am, NickDG <nick.del.gra...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> When I was reading about one of the hardware platforms Android
> supports, I noticed it was very similar to what's inside my Treo 700p.
>

> http://www.anddev.org/first_android_hardware_development_board_availa...

[NickDG]

Hi Lo Yuk Fai,

Thanks for the response. Yes Palm OS is more mature, but it is also
very unstable and can't multi-task very well.

I believe the minimum requirements for Android are 32MB RAM and 32MB
NVRAM. This is what the 650 has.

My 700p has 64/64 so it would be a better platform to test on. Plus
it has a newer CPU and a better screen.

I would like to play around just to see if I can get it to boot on the
650. How can we go about that? Any ideas?

Thanks

- Nick

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Frankly speaking, I have no idea at all. Just waiting for someone to
make it happen...

As far as I know, right now Google is not releasing the complete
source of Android. So it's kind of difficult to port the emulator to
actual hardware.

> > > - Nick- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[littertiger]

Beside hardware requirement, does porting have to use the kernel
google released?

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Android runs on top of the Linux kernel, which is GPL. What is missing
is, AFAIK, is the makefile only.

> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[Davide-NYC]

I am absolutely with you! I have a 700p.
I'm getting another phone as I am sick of PalmOS.
Willing to mess with my 700p only if there is a clear way to re-flash
it to factory.
Android on the Treo would save this elegant hardware from the horror
that is PalmOS.
I am willing to help.

On Feb 28, 9:23 pm, NickDG <nick.del.gra...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> When I was reading about one of the hardware platforms Android
> supports, I noticed it was very similar to what's inside my Treo 700p.
>

> http://www.anddev.org/first_android_hardware_development_board_availa...

[Lo Yuk Fai]

One more issue... The device drivers... While the Linux kernel is open
source, maybe the drivers for the Treo components are not
available...?

[Lo Yuk Fai]

It seems that people are keen on porting Android to various
platforms... But haven't yet seen one for Palm/Treo... Anybody knows
why? Is it related to some intrinsic problems...?

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

[NickDG]

I believe the hardware in the 700p is a supported platform, meaning it
should have all drivers needed for the radio, etc...

[NickDG]

How are they porting it? If all we need is to flash the phone, I
believe there is a way to do it since there are custom Palm OS roms
popping up for the 700p.

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Not sure if 700P is a supported platform. Guess that, officially,
there's no one single supported platform yet...?

Anyway, having tried the emulator yesterday, I'm not eager to have
Android working on the Treo at this moment. It's still pretty rough
(as expected).

Probably, interest will pick-up once Android hits 1.0, and more apps
are available (look forward to the Challenge)...

Nice weekend!

[NickDG]

Linux is now bootable through a hack. Check out the link. This is a
start.

http://old.hackndev.com/node/853

On Apr 17, 12:00 pm, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Not sure if 700P is a supported platform. Guess that, officially,
> there's no one single supported platform yet...?
>
> Anyway, having tried the emulator yesterday, I'm not eager to have

> Android working on theTreoat this moment. It's still pretty rough

> (as expected).
>
> Probably, interest will pick-up once Android hits 1.0, and more apps
> are available (look forward to the Challenge)...
>
> Nice weekend!
>
> On Apr 16, 2:16 am, NickDG <nick.del.gra...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > How are they porting it?  If all we need is to flash the phone, I
> > believe there is a way to do it since there are custom Palm OS roms
> > popping up for the 700p.
>
> > On Apr 15, 8:32 am, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > It seems that people are keen on porting Android to various
> > > platforms... But haven't yet seen one for Palm/Treo... Anybody knows
> > > why? Is it related to some intrinsic problems...?
>
> > > On Apr 4, 12:17 am, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > One more issue... The device drivers... While the Linux kernel is open

> > > > source, maybe the drivers for theTreocomponents are not

> > > > available...?
>
> > > > On Mar 22, 1:23 am, Davide-NYC <davide.gent...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > I am absolutely with you! I have a 700p.
> > > > > I'm getting another phone as I am sick of PalmOS.
> > > > > Willing to mess with my 700p only if there is a clear way to re-flash
> > > > > it to factory.

> > > > > Android on theTreowould save this elegant hardware from the horror

[Lo Yuk Fai]

That was done long time ago...

Anyway, even if Android can be loaded onto the Treos, I wonder if only
the newer models with more RAM and storage will be able to handle it.

Let's see.

[Davide-NYC]

Hello all,

I have here a Treo 650 (GSM) w charger, sync cable and a 128MB sd card
available for any developer that is actively working on this and can
verify that fact somehow.

I will ship the phone anywhere in the USA for free and split the
shipping cost with the recipient to anywhere else worldwide.

Please let me know.

Davide.

[Davide-NYC]

Hello all,

I have here a Treo 650 (GSM) w charger, sync cable and a 128MB sd card
available for any developer that is actively working on this and can
verify that fact somehow.

I will ship the phone anywhere in the USA for free and split the
shipping cost with the recipient to anywhere else worldwide.

Please let me know.

Davide.

[GLK]

Hello all!
@ the first sorry for my bad english ...

Somebody knows if the palm tre 500v (yes is the vodafone one) ...
could be compatible with Android? Really I don't like wm6 standard ..
so I hope to install Android on my Treo.

Palm Treo 500:
- Flash memory 256 MN
- RAM memory 64 MB
- clock speed of 416 MHz (I'm not sure)
- display 320x240 65k colours
- is not touch screen
- no wifi
- 3G communication & BT

Please let me know!
Thanks!

byebye
Gianluca

[Avatar]

I've not seen any success port to Treo yet.
However some interesting work have been done on HTC Touch, check these
out:

-sources:
http://cs-alb-pc3.massey.ac.nz/vogue
http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2084090&posted=1
-video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0e_ACIenhY

I'm looking for a way to port to my iPAQ h2200 too.

Do not bother to get one of those HTC Touch now, cause' Google had a
totally more interesting version of Android for the real release.

Android Demo on Google IO:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOSk9TW7z-4

If you buy it now, do it worth the money?

[Sheshu Inguva]

hi,

i got some kernel compiled for treo 650/680. what i want is a file
system on which i can start my device. anybody tried that with
android?

[NickDG]

You can try loading the kernel using cocoboot. It unloads Palm OS
then loads a linux kernel you provide. I don't believe Android has
been tried.

Hope you get it to work!

- Nick

[Sheshu Inguva]

hi i tried with opie and it works occasionally, cant boot all the
time. most of the times it hangs. i thought android might be having
better package file system...

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Now that Palm has just released the 800w, which happens to me that it
is what I would like to see, hardware-wise, for an Android phone...

Okay... Maybe a slightly faster processor with hardware 3D and better
battery life...?

But don't think anybody is going to make one such Android phone
because the market is going to large-large-large screen.

Still, I do think Palm has got one of the better-designed form factors
in her Treo line...

Cheers.

On Jun 15, 11:09 am, Avatar <avata...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I've not seen any success port to Treo yet.
> However some interesting work have been done on HTC Touch, check these
> out:
>

> -sources:http://cs-alb-pc3.massey.ac.nz/voguehttp://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?p=2084090&posted=1

> -video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0e_ACIenhY
>
> I'm looking for a way to port to my iPAQ h2200 too.
>
> Do not bother to get one of those HTC Touch now, cause' Google had a
> totally more interesting version of Android for the real release.
>
> Android Demo on Google IO:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sOSk9TW7z-4
>
> If you buy it now, do it worth the money?
>
> On Jun 3, 1:51 am, GLK <gianluca.gir...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Hello all!
> > @ the first sorry for my bad english ...
>
> > Somebody knows if the palm tre 500v (yes is the vodafone one) ...
> > could be compatible with Android? Really I don't like wm6 standard ..
> > so I hope to install Android on my Treo.
>
> > Palm Treo 500:
> > - Flash memory 256 MN
> > - RAM memory 64 MB
> > - clock speed of 416 MHz (I'm not sure)
> > - display 320x240 65k colours
> > - is not touch screen
> > - no wifi
> > - 3G communication & BT
>
> > Please let me know!
> > Thanks!
>
> > byebye

> > Gianluca- Hide quoted text -

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Sorry... The MSM6800 does seem to have hardware 3D... There's a spec
sheet here but I'm not sure if it applies 100% to 6800"A" as well...

http://www.datasheetarchive.com/pdf/2485190.pdf

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Sorry... The MSM6800 does seem to have hardware 3D... There's a spec
sheet here but I'm not sure if it applies 100% to 6800"A" as well...

http://www.datasheetarchive.com/pdf/2485190.pdf

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Does it mean we can boot Andorid using...

1. Cocoboot (http://hackndev.com/node/182 ???)
2. Kernel (for Treo 650 - http://junk.mikeasoft.com/zImage ???)
3. The Android Image (sorry, but how to build the image out of the
SDK... ???)

Reference: http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/PalmTreo650

> > > android?- Hide quoted text -

[NickDG]

I am hoping Cocoboot will allow us to boot the android kernel. We
will need to compile the kernel for the hardware on Treo.

First try should be a very simple kernel just to see if it will boot.
Then we can start adding stuff from there. (I am hoping)

My issues are getting to the bootloader and flashing the phones.

P.S. The 800w will probably be easier to hack them you think. ;-)

- Nick

On Aug 19, 6:55 am, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Does it mean we can boot Andorid using...
>
> 1. Cocoboot (http://hackndev.com/node/182???)
> 2. Kernel (forTreo650 -http://junk.mikeasoft.com/zImage???)
> 3. The Android Image (sorry, but how to build the image out of the
> SDK... ???)
>
> Reference:http://www.handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/PalmTreo650
>
> On Jul 4, 1:02 pm, Sheshu Inguva <skumaring...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > hi i tried with opie and it works occasionally, cant boot all the
> > time. most of the times it hangs. i thought android might be having
> > better package file system...
>
> > On Jul 3, 11:04 pm, NickDG <nick.del.gra...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > You can try loading the kernel using cocoboot.  It unloads Palm OS
> > > then loads a linux kernel you provide.  I don't believe Android has
> > > been tried.
>
> > > Hope you get it to work!
>
> > > - Nick
>
> > > On Jul 3, 2:25 am, Sheshu Inguva <skumaring...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > > hi,
>

> > > > i got some kernel compiled fortreo650/680. what i want is a file

[Lo Yuk Fai]

FYI, I've successfully compiled a kernel using the sources from
Hack&Dev and Cocobooted it on a Treo 650.

But then I lack the knowledge to integrate the Hack&Dev and Android
sources and compile a working kernel. Tried quite a few different ways
but none worked.

Somehow, I got to "How are you gentlemen" once.

Anyway, I don't have plans to work further on it given the hardware
limits of Treo 650.

Cheers.

[Lo Yuk Fai]

The nice guys over Hack&Dev is working to push upstream their work
into the mainstream kernel.

So when it's done, and the complete source of Android is released,
maybe I will try to do it again.

(Of course, my preferred way is to download a working kernel and the
userspace, and use it right away... : )

Still, I'm doubtful if the 650 can handle it... Newer models are
better spec-ed but then kernel support is an issue.

[NickDG]

When is the source being released anyways? Seems like it is taking
forever.

I have no problems using my Centro as a test phone if we are playing
with Cocoboot.

[NickDG]

Google released the source today. I am going to do some digging to
see what can be done.

- Nick

[Rdgoeson4ever]

http://www.engadget.com/2008/10/21/google-opens-the-floodgates-open-sources-android/
It's OUT!

I have a treo 755p ready for testing, will be available and willing to
try any and all attempts.

[luke]

The Android source is now out. I'd be willing to test on a 680.

L

[nowell29]

the source has now been released. http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS9433817554.html?kc=rss
I have a treo 680 that I would gladly experiment with/on. Thanks for
all the hard work everybody.

[windstorm]

I have a one quick question

How do you guys deal with Dalvik virtual machine? If you just port the
kernel image to the real device, without porting the dalvik which
seems to be compiled by non-standard-libc, you should not be able to
run any application wrote by yourself, right?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yours Sincerely
Kun

[NickDG]

Not really sure. We aren't at that level yet! ;)

One step at a time.

On Oct 23, 9:54 pm, windstorm <likunarmstr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I have a one quick question
>
> How do you guys deal with Dalvik virtual machine? If you just port the
> kernel image to the real device, without porting the dalvik which
> seems to be compiled by non-standard-libc, you should not be able to
> run any application wrote by yourself, right?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yours Sincerely
> Kun
>

[NickDG]

I believe a good starting point would be to compile a Linux 2.6.23
kernel for the Treo's ARM architecture.

From what I am reading, Android will work on any 2.6.23 kernel.

We should be able to move quickly from there. :)

- Nick

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Android is based on 2.6.25.

The recommended tree for 650 over Hack&Dev is 2.6.27 (http://
git.hackndev.com/?p=linux-2.6;a=summary). Not sure about the other
devices.

Anyway, after reading the "releases features" (http://
source.android.com/release-features), my hope is greatly dash... : )

"The platform requires a minimum of 128 MB of RAM and 256 MB of Flash
memory."

[NickDG]

I still have hope! 64MB/64MB should be enough! (650 probably won't
cut it) :(

You mentioned in a previous post you booted your Treo to Linux with
Cocoboot. What Linux kernel did you use?

Thanks

- Nick

[NickDG]

Here is a great thread on hack&dev about getting linux running on the
Centro. Looks like they are getting close.

http://hackndev.com/node/221

[Lo Yuk Fai]

IIRC it's a 2.6.21 snapshot from http://git.hackndev.com/?p=linux-hnd;a=summary
*without* any Android-specific patches.

In case you're interested, you may get my zImage and cocoboot.conf
from http://ifile.it/2msu7on

FYI, I formatted the SD card into 2 partitions - The first was a FAT16
for the kernel and cocoboot.conf. The second was an ext2 containing
the Android file system downloaded from somewhere.

Then tried to boot using the method mentioned at
http://elinux.org/Android_on_OMAP#Android_root_file_system

Or similarly http://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/Treo-650/2008-10-12/README

And of course, Android failed to start. : )

In case you would like to do it yourself, you may like to setup the
environment for compiling the kernel (i.e. a Linux distro and ARM
toolchains...), and get a kernel (without the Android patches)
successfully compiled and booted on your device first.

Cheers and have a nice weekend!

[Lo Yuk Fai]

Just compiled a kernel using the 2.6.27 tree on Hack&Dev. Boots on my
Treo 650.

In case you would like to try, it's at http://ifile.it/v8mbhtr

On Oct 25, 4:15 am, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> IIRC it's a 2.6.21 snapshot fromhttp://git.hackndev.com/?p=linux-hnd;a=summary

> *without* any Android-specific patches.
>
> In case you're interested, you may get my zImage and cocoboot.conf

> fromhttp://ifile.it/2msu7on

>
> FYI, I formatted the SD card into 2 partitions - The first was a FAT16
> for the kernel and cocoboot.conf. The second was an ext2 containing
> the Android file system downloaded from somewhere.
>
> Then tried to boot using the method mentioned athttp://elinux.org/Android_on_OMAP#Android_root_file_system
>

> Or similarlyhttp://download.enlightenment.org/misc/Illume/Treo-650/2008-10-12/README

[NickDG]

I downloaded your image and tried booting it on my Centro. It loads
the image, says "OK" then freezes.

Even though the 650 and Centro both use the PXA270, the memory is
different.

Here is the output from Cocoboots "info" menu for my Sprint Centro:

Machine: D062
CPU ID: 0x69054117
CPU: Intel PXA27x

Memory:
RAM base: 0xa0000000
Size: 32mb
Phys TTB: 0xa1ffc000
Virt TTB: 0xa1ffc000

I am using Cocoboot 0.5.2 which recognizes the Centro correctly.

I need to find my old 650. It's laying around somewhere.

- Nick

On Oct 24, 5:06 pm, Lo Yuk Fai <loyuk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Just compiled a kernel using the 2.6.27 tree on Hack&Dev. Boots on my
> Treo 650.
>

> In case you would like to try, it's athttp://ifile.it/v8mbhtr

[Thiago Rafael Becker]

The dalvik source code is available, and there are less than a
handfull of files that will need to be ported (as I looked so far).
For a device with armv5, or with the same instruction mnemonics and
semantics, no port effort will be needed.
For other platforms, one should take a look on all of the .S files
(277 files), and three files that have inline asm:

./vm/mterp/out/InterpC-armv5.c
./vm/mterp/armv5/debug.c
./vm/Atomic.h

The first two have only declarations of register for certain variables.

Some collateral changes will be needed for platforms that are not
RISC-like (with fewer registers, like Intel's Atom).

But I have a question: any effort into porting dalvik to non-embedded
non-RISC linux?

--
Thiago Rafael Becker
http://www.monstros.org/trbecker

[NickDG]

Great news about the porting. The 650-Centro all have armv5 cpus.
The Treo Pro and Treo 800w use armv6 cpus. I am guessing we are in
the same boat with the Libraries?

I found my 650. Using the kernel Lo Yuk Fai provided along with
Cocoboot, I was able boot. I get a kernel panic when it tries to load
the file system, because I haven't created a file system on the second
parition yet. (I am only using 1 partition)

I am trying to get a kernel booting on newer Treo devices with
Cocoboot. Stay tuned...

Cheers!

- Nick

On Oct 24, 10:02 am, "Thiago Rafael Becker" <thiago.bec...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> The dalvik source code is available, and there are less than a
> handfull of files that will need to be ported (as I looked so far).
> For a device with armv5, or with the same instruction mnemonics and
> semantics, no port effort will be needed.
> For other platforms, one should take a look on all of the .S files
> (277 files), and three files that have inline asm:
>
> ./vm/mterp/out/InterpC-armv5.c
> ./vm/mterp/armv5/debug.c
> ./vm/Atomic.h
>
> The first two have only declarations of register for certain variables.
>
> Some collateral changes will be needed for platforms that are not
> RISC-like (with fewer registers, like Intel's Atom).
>
> But I have a question: any effort into porting dalvik to non-embedded
> non-RISC linux?
>
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 2:54 AM, windstorm <likunarmstr...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I have a one quick question
>
> > How do you guys deal with Dalvik virtual machine? If you just port the
> > kernel image to the real device, without porting the dalvik which
> > seems to be compiled by non-standard-libc, you should not be able to
> > run any application wrote by yourself, right?
>
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Yours Sincerely
> > Kun
>

[Stillmatic]

hmmm...I'll be watching this thread closely for progress on a centro
port. Good work fellas

[Lo Yuk Fai]

What I have done was just downloading some codes, typed in some
commands and so.

I think we need someone knowledgeable in hacking the kernel to step in
in order to get it goes further... : )

Cheers!

[NickDG]

Can't we just work off the kernel being used over at Hack&Dev? I was
just reading they got the Centro and 700p booting using the 680
kernel.

We can build upon this kernel to add support for the various
hardware. If the display and keyboard are working in the current
release, it may be enough to start Android.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but if we get a working Linux
kernel, we should be able to use an already-ARM-compiled Android
system, living on an ext3fs partition. (SDcard)

- Nick