Back in December 2004, I was told by an Urchin sales rep that if I paid for the "Advanced Support Plan" (costing me $750) , then I would be eligible for the free upgrade to Urchin Software v.6 when it was to be released in Early 2005. This is the *only* reason why I paid that amount. I never used their support after I got Urchin running initially.
After that Google aquired Urchin.
I have now waited over 2 years, all along having Urchin tell me that version 6 would be released "soon" and I would still get the free upgrade.
I have requested a refund of the amount I paid and will just stick with version 5.
My questions is this a "bait and switch" scam? How many other customers have been tricked into this scam along with myself? Can Urchin (google) be held liable? Can a class action lawsuit not be to far off in the future?
I am in the same boat, except I purchased the whole Urchin Campaign Manager package with the $1500 support option. I was told the same things, and bought the support plan for the same reason. Very frustrating situation.
> Back in December 2004, I was told by an Urchin sales rep that if I > paid for the "Advanced Support Plan" (costing me $750) , then I would > be eligible for the free upgrade to Urchin Software v.6 when it was to > be released in Early 2005. This is the *only* reason why I paid that > amount. I never used their support after I got Urchin running > initially.
> After that Google aquired Urchin.
> I have now waited over 2 years, all along having Urchin tell me that > version 6 would be released "soon" and I would still get the free > upgrade.
> I have requested a refund of the amount I paid and will just stick > with version 5.
> My questions is this a "bait and switch" scam? > How many other customers have been tricked into this scam along with > myself? > Can Urchin (google) be held liable? > Can a class action lawsuit not be to far off in the future?
Does anyone have any news if 6 is going to ship or has been dropped. Why is it such a hard thing for Goggle to say ? If it is going to be dropped, Google just needs to provide a conversion tool for it's partners to import the Urchin data into Analytics. If a new version is coming say so. It will not be long before the current version starts failing to install and work on newer operating systems.
I'm in the same boat. Paid 5K for the whole urchin suite in december of 2004, and was assured by a sales rep that Urchin 6 software would be released in March of 2005. So I went ahead and purchased the support option which guaranteed the upgrade to Urchin 6 software. Understand that the Urchin 6 hosted service was already released at this point, so there was no reason to doubt that they wouldn't release the software... at least I thought until Google purchased them. Urchin 6 software has been vaporware ever since. I spent $1500 for nothing, basically. And yeah, I'm quite bitter about it.
I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
> Back in December 2004, I was told by an Urchin sales rep that if I > paid for the "Advanced Support Plan" (costing me $750) , then I would > be eligible for the free upgrade to Urchin Software v.6 when it was to > be released in Early 2005. This is the *only* reason why I paid that > amount. I never used their support after I got Urchin running > initially.
> After that Google aquired Urchin.
> I have now waited over 2 years, all along having Urchin tell me that > version 6 would be released "soon" and I would still get the free > upgrade.
> I have requested a refund of the amount I paid and will just stick > with version 5.
> My questions is this a "bait and switch" scam? > How many other customers have been tricked into this scam along with > myself? > Can Urchin (google) be held liable? > Can a class action lawsuit not be to far off in the future?
> I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
No. I emailed Urchin asking about it and they forwarded my email to the "proper department" (trash can?).
I never heard a reply since then :-/
I guess the next step is to make this very public. Maybe someone will get off their butt at Urchin(Google) when talk of this obvious act of "fraud" is known by the public.
When I purchased Google Urchin 5 about a year ago, I was told that they were in beta then and that v6 was planned for release in fall 2006, that time has come and gone, and now it looks like they are saying the samething for Fall 2007 or 20xx (got that sucka hook line and sinker!!!).
Fortunately I didn't buy big as many of you have done, though I share the pain. Personally I have lost faith in the release of the Urchin 6 vaporware, and think that Google has decided to rebrand it as the latest iteration of Google Analytics and not sell a standalone version.
So, has anyone begun or looked at other web analytics type of products??? I have looked at AWS (on Linux), and Mach5 FastStats (on WXP).
Why hasn't Google responded? I also bought into the free upgrade in April, 2005. Now, all the latest features, things I was promised would be available in Urchin 6, are only offered through GA. I purchased Urchin because I could control and own my data. Also, I use a look-up table that is not supported by GA. We also wrote proprietary code to use the look-up table to automate fields in our cart (how did you hear about us).
Now, I'm trying to find a happy medium. That is, using Urchin 5.7 to maintain my logs, track campaigns, etc. Then, use GA funnels to track shopping cart activity (and some of the neat features it offers). Using Google's documentation, which claims that both systems work together, I get bogus numbers in GA, off by at least 98%. Urchin will show 2,000 sessions in one day while GA shows 2. The support document is here: http://www.google.com/support/googleanalytics/bin/answer.py?answer=55474 - a poorly written piece that does not work. My theory is that Google is making this difficult for us to figure out so all of their analytics consultants (certified Google something) can charge exuberant consulting fees for what Google should easily provide.
Aside from raising attention in this forum, I have seen zero talk of this on the web. I would be happy to join any class action lawsuit regarding the already paid for 'vapor-ware' that is Urchin 6 upgrade. I would also like to join in raising awareness of this, in hopes that Google will address those of us left hanging.
I challenge Google to address this and fix the problems. If you won't give us Urchin 6.0 as promised, then at least share how we can make them both work together, seamlessly, in an effort to get some of what was promised with Urchin 6. You at least owe us that.
> > I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
> No. I emailedUrchinasking about it and they forwarded my email to > the "proper department" (trash can?).
> I never heard a reply since then :-/
> I guess the next step is to make this very public. Maybe someone will > get off their butt atUrchin(Google) when talk of this obvious act of > "fraud" is known by the public.
Any update on this? Why is the "Do no Evil" Google doing evil things to its customer? Or if someone like to bring this to public attention , you may want to try get it digg.
> Why hasn't Google responded? I also bought into the free upgrade in > April, 2005. Now, all the latest features, things I was promised would > be available in Urchin 6, are only offered through GA. I purchased > Urchin because I could control and own my data. Also, I use a look-up > table that is not supported by GA. We also wrote proprietary code to > use the look-up table to automate fields in our cart (how did you hear > about us).
> Now, I'm trying to find a happy medium. That is, using Urchin 5.7 to > maintain my logs, track campaigns, etc. Then, use GA funnels to track > shopping cart activity (and some of the neat features it offers). > Using Google's documentation, which claims that both systems work > together, I get bogus numbers in GA, off by at least 98%. Urchin will > show 2,000 sessions in one day while GA shows 2. The support document > is here:http://www.google.com/support/googleanalytics/bin/answer.py?answer=55474 > - a poorly written piece that does not work. My theory is that Google > is making this difficult for us to figure out so all of their > analytics consultants (certified Google something) can charge > exuberant consulting fees for what Google should easily provide.
> Aside from raising attention in this forum, I have seen zero talk of > this on the web. I would be happy to join any class action lawsuit > regarding the already paid for 'vapor-ware' that is Urchin 6 upgrade. > I would also like to join in raising awareness of this, in hopes that > Google will address those of us left hanging.
> I challenge Google to address this and fix the problems. If you won't > give us Urchin 6.0 as promised, then at least share how we can make > them both work together, seamlessly, in an effort to get some of what > was promised with Urchin 6. You at least owe us that.
> On Jul 27, 6:07 am, yabado wrote:
> > On Jul 26, 9:10 pm, morgasbord wrote:
> > > I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
> > No. I emailedUrchinasking about it and they forwarded my email to > > the "proper department" (trash can?).
> > I never heard a reply since then :-/
> > I guess the next step is to make this very public. Maybe someone will > > get off their butt atUrchin(Google) when talk of this obvious act of > > "fraud" is known by the public.
I'm in the same boat as the rest of you. Still waiting for v6. If Google is not careful, a savy attorney will read this message thread and find the workings of a class action lawsuit brewing. Anybody know an attorney friend that could get this started? I would jump on board wtih the rest of the gang of the lawsuit could be put together.
> Any update on this? Why is the "Do no Evil" Google doing evil things > to its customer? > Or if someone like to bring this to public attention , you may want to > try get it digg.
> On Sep 6, 11:17 pm, TonysQuest wrote:
> > Why hasn't Google responded? I also bought into the free upgrade in > > April, 2005. Now, all the latest features, things I was promised would > > be available in Urchin 6, are only offered through GA. I purchased > > Urchin because I could control and own my data. Also, I use a look-up > > table that is not supported by GA. We also wrote proprietary code to > > use the look-up table to automate fields in our cart (how did you hear > > about us).
> > Now, I'm trying to find a happy medium. That is, using Urchin 5.7 to > > maintain my logs, track campaigns, etc. Then, use GA funnels to track > > shopping cart activity (and some of the neat features it offers). > > Using Google's documentation, which claims that both systems work > > together, I get bogus numbers in GA, off by at least 98%. Urchin will > > show 2,000 sessions in one day while GA shows 2. The support document > > is here:http://www.google.com/support/googleanalytics/bin/answer.py?answer=55474 > > - a poorly written piece that does not work. My theory is that Google > > is making this difficult for us to figure out so all of their > > analytics consultants (certified Google something) can charge > > exuberant consulting fees for what Google should easily provide.
> > Aside from raising attention in this forum, I have seen zero talk of > > this on the web. I would be happy to join any class action lawsuit > > regarding the already paid for 'vapor-ware' that is Urchin 6 upgrade. > > I would also like to join in raising awareness of this, in hopes that > > Google will address those of us left hanging.
> > I challenge Google to address this and fix the problems. If you won't > > give us Urchin 6.0 as promised, then at least share how we can make > > them both work together, seamlessly, in an effort to get some of what > > was promised with Urchin 6. You at least owe us that.
> > On Jul 27, 6:07 am, yabado wrote:
> > > On Jul 26, 9:10 pm, morgasbord wrote:
> > > > I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
> > > No. I emailedUrchinasking about it and they forwarded my email to > > > the "proper department" (trash can?).
> > > I never heard a reply since then :-/
> > > I guess the next step is to make this very public. Maybe someone will > > > get off their butt atUrchin(Google) when talk of this obvious act of > > > "fraud" is known by the public.- Hide quoted text -
My original email to Google about this, sent 9/11 to analytics- [email address]:
Your help file on using GA and UA together does not give enough information. I am looking for a way to extend my Urchin 5.0 abilities and incorporate the new features (mostly funnels, conversion data) from GA. I bought into the free Urchin 6.0 upgrade that would potentially solve this issue. However, since this tool is not available, I have only a few choices: 1. Move to another solution (I like to own the raw data) 2. Use only Google Analytics (not robust enough - will not support look-up tables) 3. Create a hybrid solution
I have contacted your authorized consultants at both EpikOne and ROI Revolution and both wanted ridiculous rates for something that Google should provide. I have paid for Urchin support and 'free' upgrade to 6.0, I invested thousands of dollars with EpikOne to visit our facility and assist in setting-up Urchin 5.0, and have spent hours looking for a hybrid solution. I will not spend more on this. We are an enterprise with several websites and need a company that can live up to its promises.
Please help (not just links for more information) to build this hybrid solution using your tools. I have invested everything I am willing to spend in this broken tool. If Google cannot assist in fixing this, we will be forced to move on, and report to others the outcome.
Thank you for your email. I understand that you would like to use both Urchin and Google Analytics to track your website. In order to use both Urchin software and Google Analytics, you'll need to make some changes to your tracking code. Please refer to the following Help Center article for instructions: http://www.google.com/support/googleanalytics/bin/answer.py?answer=55...
Additionally, I see that you would like to host the urchin.js locally on your own server. While you are welcome to download the file to examine, we do not recommend that users serve the urchin.js themselves.
Most people wish to host urchin.js locally in order to avoid making their users download it from Google every time they request a page. However, urchin.js is designed to be downloaded once from Google and is then served from the visitor's cache.
Since your users are calling urchin.js from our servers, they will automatically get the latest version when any updates are released. This will help make your reports as accurate as possible.
> Why hasn't Google responded? I also bought into the freeupgradein > April, 2005. Now, all the latest features, things I was promised would > be available inUrchin6, are only offered through GA. I purchasedUrchinbecause I could control and own my data. Also, I use a look-up > table that is not supported by GA. We also wrote proprietary code to > use the look-up table to automate fields in our cart (how did you hear > about us).
> Now, I'm trying to find a happy medium. That is, usingUrchin5.7 to > maintain my logs, track campaigns, etc. Then, use GA funnels to track > shopping cart activity (and some of the neat features it offers). > Using Google's documentation, which claims that both systems work > together, I get bogus numbers in GA, off by at least 98%.Urchinwill > show 2,000 sessions in one day while GA shows 2. The support document > is here:http://www.google.com/support/googleanalytics/bin/answer.py?answer=55474 > - a poorly written piece that does not work. My theory is that Google > is making this difficult for us to figure out so all of their > analytics consultants (certified Google something) can charge > exuberant consulting fees for what Google should easily provide.
> Aside from raising attention in this forum, I have seen zero talk of > this on the web. I would be happy to join any class action lawsuit > regarding the already paid for 'vapor-ware' that isUrchin6upgrade. > I would also like to join in raising awareness of this, in hopes that > Google will address those of us left hanging.
> I challenge Google to address this and fix the problems. If you won't > give usUrchin6.0 as promised, then at least share how we can make > them both work together, seamlessly, in an effort to get some of what > was promised withUrchin6. You at least owe us that.
> On Jul 27,6:07 am, yabado wrote:
> > On Jul 26, 9:10 pm, morgasbord wrote:
> > > I'm curious, did you ever get your refund of the support plan?
> > No. I emailedUrchinasking about it and they forwarded my email to > > the "proper department" (trash can?).
> > I never heard a reply since then :-/
> > I guess the next step is to make this very public. Maybe someone will > > get off their butt atUrchin(Google) when talk of this obvious act of > > "fraud" is known by the public.
We were a Urchin Service Provider partner. That requires a minimum of $500/month for it was $50/month per license. So 100 profiles was a "license", multiple log sources was a "license", etc. We were paying more than that $500/month min. that is for sure. So after 1.5 years of paying that AFTER the takeover and getting nothing for the monthly fee, lingering issues that were never addressed reported to them, etc, including even wrong invoice amounts from Google, we axed it. So we spent a lot of money with the promise of Oh its coming v6 is almost hear. Heard that directly from staff at Urchin/Google even after the purchase, and FINALLY something might be appearing soon! And the only ones that will get upgrade credits it seems are ones that purchased it, rather than service providers that did pay monthly and got tired of waiting and dumping money into a product seeming to never be updated again. Nice! Thanks Google!
It's currently in beta release to select resellers, but we have been updated by Google that it's almost ready to go. I think everyone will finally be able to breathe a sigh of relief once it's released to the public.
> We were a Urchin Service Provider partner. That requires a minimum of > $500/month for it was $50/month per license. So 100 profiles was a > "license", multiple log sources was a "license", etc. We were paying > more than that $500/month min. that is for sure. So after 1.5 years > of paying that AFTER the takeover and getting nothing for the monthly > fee, lingering issues that were never addressed reported to them, etc, > including even wrong invoice amounts from Google, we axed it. So we > spent a lot of money with the promise of Oh its coming v6 is almost > hear. Heard that directly from staff at Urchin/Google even after the > purchase, and FINALLY something might be appearing soon! And the only > ones that will get upgrade credits it seems are ones that purchased > it, rather than service providers that did pay monthly and got tired > of waiting and dumping money into a product seeming to never be > updated again. Nice! Thanks Google!
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