Nude Yoga
art
is a good site for naked yoga dvds and bare yoga books, and yoga gear
and apparel:
Nude Yoga, http://astore.amazon.com/nudeyoga-20
HB...@hotmail.com
Hmmm? do I need apparel to do nude yoga?
lackpurity
MM:
Did you get tired of meditation on your butt chakras? LOL You're a
funny one, HB. Maybe you will meditate on someone else's kundalini?
LOL
No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
Michael Martin
HB...@hotmail.com
> On Aug 19, 2:04?pm, HB...@HOTMAIL.COM wrote:
>
> > On Aug 19, 11:01 am, art <artskyc...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > Naked Asanas are the best. Nude Yoga is a turn-on. Bare Bikram? Here
> > > is a good site for naked yoga dvds and bare yoga books, and yoga gear
> > > and apparel:
>
> > > Nude Yoga,http://astore.amazon.com/nudeyoga-20
>
> > Hmmm? do I need apparel to do nude yoga?
>
> MM:
> Did you get tired of meditation on your butt chakras?
No. I just thought it was quite funny, ironic, that the OP would start
a thread singing the praises of _nude_ yoga and then give a link
suggesting it was a good place to aquire yoga _apparel_ (clothing).
{hint: one does not need clothing to do yoga in the nude} I am only
familiar with one "butt chakra," Have you discovered that are there
more than one as your question indicates?
> LOL You're a
> funny one, HB.
Well I am glad you enjoyed it.
> Maybe you will meditate on someone else's kundalini?
> LOL
>
What-ever gave you the idea that I would meditate on someone else's
kundalini,or even my own? What purpose would that serve? or are you
just making this up? trying to be as funny as me?
> No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
>
I do not reall anywhere that have I indicated a lack of appreciation
for Shakespeare. (Again I think you are just making that up.) Or
perhaps you are confusing my lack of appreciation for a sloppily
presented, poorly thought out commentary on Shakespeare's work, with a
lack of appreacitation for his writings.
HB
> Michael Martin
lackpurity
> On Aug 25, 2:18 am, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 19, 2:04?pm, HB...@HOTMAIL.COM wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 19, 11:01 am, art <artskyc...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > Naked Asanas are the best. Nude Yoga is a turn-on. Bare Bikram? Here
> > > > is a good site for naked yoga dvds and bare yoga books, and yoga gear
> > > > and apparel:
>
> > > > Nude Yoga,http://astore.amazon.com/nudeyoga-20
>
> > > Hmmm? do I need apparel to do nude yoga?
>
> > MM:
> > Did you get tired of meditation on your butt chakras?
>
> No. I just thought it was quite funny, ironic, that the OP would start
> a thread singing the praises of _nude_ yoga and then give a link
> suggesting it was a good place to aquire yoga _apparel_ (clothing).
> {hint: one does not need clothing to do yoga in the nude} I am only
> familiar with one "butt chakra," Have you discovered that are there
> more than one as your question indicates?
MM:
Surely, you know that there are two chakras very near one another,
near the anus. One is just above the other.
> > LOL You're a
> > funny one, HB.
>
> Well I am glad you enjoyed it.
>
> > Maybe you will meditate on someone else's kundalini?
> > LOL
>
> What-ever gave you the idea that I would meditate on someone else's
> kundalini,or even my own? What purpose would that serve? or are you
> just making this up? trying to be as funny as me?
MM:
You're the one replying to "Nude Yoga," and asking about apparel.
> > No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
>
> I do not reall anywhere that have I indicated a lack of appreciation
> for Shakespeare. (Again I think you are just making that up.) Or
> perhaps you are confusing my lack of appreciation for a sloppily
> presented, poorly thought out commentary on Shakespeare's work, with a
> lack of appreacitation for his writings.
>
> HB
MM:
You haven't got a clue regarding Sant Mat, or Shakespeare's
teachings. I've spent too much time on you. Try to learn the
difference between Surat Shabd Yoga and Kundalini Yoga. Your message
on them was a farce.
Michael Martin
> > Michael Martin- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
conra...@gmail.com
> teachings. I've spent too much time on you. Try to learn the
> difference between Surat Shabd Yoga and Kundalini Yoga. Your message
> on them was a farce.
Yes it was.
Conrad.
HB...@hotmail.com
my bad, you are funnier than I am, after all what could be funnier
than someone claiming to be Sat Guru.
>
> > > No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
>
> > I do not reall anywhere that have I indicated a lack of appreciation
> > for Shakespeare. (Again I think you are just making that up.) Or
> > perhaps you are confusing my lack of appreciation for a sloppily
> > presented, poorly thought out commentary on Shakespeare's work, with a
> > lack of appreacitation for his writings.
>
> > HB
>
> MM:
> You haven't got a clue regarding Sant Mat, or Shakespeare's
> teachings. I've spent too much time on you. Try to learn the
> difference between Surat Shabd Yoga and Kundalini Yoga. Your message
> on them was a farce.
>
Hi MM
You seem rather scattered lately.
I see no mention of surat shabd yoga or kundalini yoga in this thread.
nor do I recall posting any message about either one anywhere..
again, I think you are just making stuff up.
> Michael Martin
>
HB...@hotmail.com
wrote:
Main Entry: farce
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English farse, from Middle French farce, from Vulgar
Latin *farsa, from Latin, feminine of farsus, past participle of
farcire
1 : a savory stuffing : FORCEMEAT
2 : a light dramatic composition marked by broadly satirical comedy
and improbable plot
3 : the broad humor characteristic of farce or pretense
4 a : ridiculous or empty show b : MOCKERY <the enforcement of this
law became a farce>
I'm going to go out on a limb here Conrad and assume that You and I
are using definition #2 and #3
and say, "thanks Conrad, at least some one got it."
But I do believe that MM is using #4a with regards to my Jimi Hendrix
expose.
> Conrad.
lackpurity
> > Conrad
MM:
You got that right. In regards to your charge that I got PO'd, I'll
just say that it doesn't exactly make me jubilant, when a clown like
you comes along to lead everyone astray. It was for similar reasons
that Sodom and Gommorha were destroyed. This has been known as God's
wrath.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
MM:
Would it be funny if you were reborn as a jack-ass?
> > > > No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
>
> > > I do not reall anywhere that have I indicated a lack of appreciation
> > > for Shakespeare. (Again I think you are just making that up.) Or
> > > perhaps you are confusing my lack of appreciation for a sloppily
> > > presented, poorly thought out commentary on Shakespeare's work, with a
> > > lack of appreacitation for his writings.
>
> > > HB
>
> > MM:
> > You haven't got a clue regarding Sant Mat, or Shakespeare's
> > teachings. I've spent too much time on you. Try to learn the
> > difference between Surat Shabd Yoga and Kundalini Yoga. Your message
> > on them was a farce.
>
> Hi MM
> You seem rather scattered lately.
> I see no mention of surat shabd yoga or kundalini yoga in this thread.
> nor do I recall posting any message about either one anywhere..
> again, I think you are just making stuff up.
MM:
You're spinning, skating, and dodging. Typical response. Okay.. Bye
Bye
Michael Martin
>
>
>
> > Michael Martin- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
HB...@hotmail.com
How could "a clown" like me lead anyone astray when they have the
priviledge of having the knowledge and advice of the great Sat Guru
here to guide them?
> It was for similar reasons
> that Sodom and Gommorha were destroyed. This has been known as God's
> wrath.
>
oh I get it , if someone doesn't agree with you, you sic God on them.
LOL
Sounds like you really take yourself too seriously.
HB...@hotmail.com
OOOPS too late,
I am already working out my jack-ass karma in this life.
>
>
>
> > > > > No, wonder you're not turned on by Shakespeare!
>
> > > > I do not reall anywhere that have I indicated a lack of appreciation
> > > > for Shakespeare. (Again I think you are just making that up.) Or
> > > > perhaps you are confusing my lack of appreciation for a sloppily
> > > > presented, poorly thought out commentary on Shakespeare's work, with a
> > > > lack of appreacitation for his writings.
>
> > > > HB
>
> > > MM:
> > > You haven't got a clue regarding Sant Mat, or Shakespeare's
> > > teachings. I've spent too much time on you. Try to learn the
> > > difference between Surat Shabd Yoga and Kundalini Yoga. Your message
> > > on them was a farce.
>
> > Hi MM
> > You seem rather scattered lately.
> > I see no mention of surat shabd yoga or kundalini yoga in this thread.
> > nor do I recall posting any message about either one anywhere..
> > again, I think you are just making stuff up.
>
> MM:
> You're spinning, skating, and dodging.
Am I? show me where.
>From my perspective, you are making stuff up.
as pointed out elsewhere, the jimi hendrix post mentioned only tantra
yoga specifically.
I made no mention of "kundalini yoga" or of "surat shabd yoga." You
just keep making that up.
now I understand you may be confused because your "shabd yoga" and
"kundalini yoga" share some aspects with Tantra.
That can be expected given that some consider Tantra to be the
fundamental spiritual science. So it sems to me that you are doing the
"spinning"
Michael Turner
>
> - Show quoted text -
I thought Matt Damon destroyed Sodom & Gommorah.
lackpurity
>
> Yeah, but I don't know if you're considering all the possibilities
> here Michael. Forget Nude Yoga, that's kind of blase. Consider
> Lackpurity's idea that doing Nude Yoga could have people
> transmigrating as Jackass'. Nude Jackass Yoga is where it's at! LOL!
> Come on, Lighten up MM. :-) The physical form is not dirty or
> unspiritual or whatever it is that got you reacting so to this.
MM:
HB wrote like he is an authority on Kundalini, Shabd, and then he
replied to the message about Nude Yoga. I suppose I was questioning
how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
figure that one out?
Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
mystics have explained this. We need a guide, a Sat Guru, however to
protect us from Satan, as he waits on the other side with his demons,
to lead us astray.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
> On Aug 31, 12:38 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > On Aug 31, 9:26?am, Dave Barnes <davemariabar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > MM:
> > HB wrote like he is an authority on Kundalini, Shabd, and then he
> > replied to the message about Nude Yoga. I suppose I was questioning
> > how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
>
> > Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> > dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> > with it.
>
> gradually and a spiritual guide, a Sat Guru is important. I agree with
> you about the kundalini energy, about leaving it be.
MM:
Glad to read it. Thanks, Dave, for your comments.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
>
> I responded to what I felt from some of your words. That you are a
> gentleman. And That there was much that I could find agreement with.
> For that and more I sincerely thank you.
>
> But also please note how I did not include the fear things, like
> people being reborn as a donkey or demons or devils and the self
> praise superman like style arrival of the sat guru (you) to save the
> rest of us from transmigration, demons, devils and an "angry" God that
> will punish and smite the "evil" kundalini students etc.
MM:
That's fine. It's your mind and soul. If you look around, I think
you'll have to admit that it's not all peaches and cream. There are
nearly countless souls suffering in lower forms. Saints tell us why,
but we don't have to believe them. We can just ignore them and go on
our merry way, for as long as it lasts, anyway.
> Sometimes when I read what you write, you come across sort of like a
> hybrid of a fundamentalist and a person who maintains tight control on
> his students through dependance based on fear
MM:
I think your POV is in reverse. They need to control THEIR minds, if
they want to rise up. I have no need to control anybody, but if they
are disciples, then they are asking for guidance.
> and an inadequate
> energeticly designed diet that promotes submission and compliance and
> greatly diminishes the natural sex drive.
MM:
The diet has been working for ages. It has been tried and proven.
The lacto-veggie diet doesn't increase sex drive, for sure. It
doesn't make it go away, either. I don't know how much sex drive you
want? :-) The LV diet is better for people, who don't want the karma
of unnecessarily killing animals, birds, fishes, etc., and for those
who want to digest their food quicker, so they can get up with an
empty stomach and more easily concentrate the mind. LVs are less
prone to anger and lust, also. One moment of anger can cause long-
lasting repercussions. Similarly for lust. So, I'll leave it to the
sagacity of the readers.
> I wonder at times if any of your students have the strength to stand
> on their own two feet. That if they were trees, would they have
> strong, deep roots to survive and bend through the toughest storms of
> life, or would they simply fall over and die?
MM:
You'd have to take a poll. IMO, most L-Vs are more healthy than those
on other diets. I think scientific evidence corroborates my diet,
also. L-Vs life longer.
> But obviously all my feelings and wonderings could be absolutely
> incorrect.
MM:
All right. It's your life.
Michael Martin
HB...@hotmail.com
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Aug 29, 1:24 am, Michael Turner <Michael112...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 27, 10:06 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > MM:
> > > > You got that right. In regards to your charge that I got PO'd, I'll
> > > > just say that it doesn't exactly make me jubilant, when a clown like
> > > > you comes along to lead everyone astray. It was for similar reasons
> > > > that Sodom and Gommorha were destroyed. This has been known as God's
> > > > wrath.
>
> > > > Michael Martin-
>
> > > I thought Matt Damon destroyed Sodom & Gommorah.- >
>
> > Yeah, but I don't know if you're considering all the possibilities
> > here Michael. Forget Nude Yoga, that's kind of blase. Consider
> > Lackpurity's idea that doing Nude Yoga could have people
> > transmigrating as Jackass'. Nude Jackass Yoga is where it's at! LOL!
> > Come on, Lighten up MM. :-) The physical form is not dirty or
> > unspiritual or whatever it is that got you reacting so to this.
>
> MM:
> HB wrote like he is an authority on Kundalini,
compared to you I might be an authority on kundalini, after all, not
being afraid of the boogey-man I have dared to look under the bed.
> Shabd, and then he
> replied to the message about Nude Yoga.
hI MM,
you seem a bit confused, scattered still,
check the time lines.
I responded to this thread about Aug 19,
and it was about the 26th when I did the hendrix spoof.
Both increased asana practice or more tatva dharana with special
attention to increasing the base are helpful in keeping oneself
grounded in the details of daily living.
> I suppose
you suppose? sounds like you do not actually know what you were doing.
> I was questioning
> how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
It seem you are still making stuff up, or at least putting a
distorting spin on what I have written. No where have I mentioned that
I raise kundalini. I did mention that in Tantra awakening kundalini is
within the role of the guru.
>
> Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
I was wondering when you were going to get around to this,
Kundalini is often symbolized as a coiled serpent. and
Satan is referred to as serpent.
So somehow, in your mind, they are connected. LOL
>
> Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
> the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
> in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
> cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
> The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
> figure that one out?
more boogey men
has there been one documented case of a meditator bursting into flame
by the heat generated from the meditative process?
>
> Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> mystics have explained this.
So I guess, according to you, Krishna was just blowing it out his ass
when, in the Gita, He mentions meditating on Anahat.
> We need a guide, a Sat Guru, however to
> protect us from Satan, as he waits on the other side with his demons,
> to lead us astray.
>
More boogey men. But I guess you need lots of boogey men to maintain
job security.
HB
HB...@hotmail.com
Kundalini is innate for all people: At the base of the spine, subtler
than the physical body, lies the Kundalini energy, or spiritual
energy, in a latent form. Regardless of what religious, spiritual, or
meditation tradition one follows, the awakening of this energy, by
whatever name you call it, is a most innate and essential part of
spiritual advancement, unfoldment, or realization. While some use a
specific terminology "Kundalini Yoga" for certain practices, all of
Yoga actually leads to the activation of Kunalini. Thus, in a sense,
all of Yoga is Kundalini Yoga, regardless of whether you use that
specific name. Awakening kundalini and leading it to union with the
Absolute is the goal of the Himalayan sages and the path of Yoga,
Vedanta, and Tantra.
lackpurity
> Kundalini is innate for all people: At the base of the spine, subtler
> than the physical body, lies the Kundalini energy, or spiritual
> energy, in a latent form. Regardless of what religious, spiritual, or
> meditation tradition one follows, the awakening of this energy, by
> whatever name you call it, is a most innate and essential part of
> spiritual advancement, unfoldment, or realization.
MM:
No way. It should be left dormant. Read the history of the Saints.
Whether Eastern or Western, then didn't give any importance to it.
NONE. ZILCH. NAUGHT. NIL. Get it?
Our normal waking state is superior to meditating on those lower
chakras. Give me a break. It's chasing shadows. Chasing
reflections. Playing like children in a house of mirrors. Get it?
The lower chakras are for the functioning of the body. They are not
for the purpose of spiritual enlightenment.
> While some use a
> specific terminology "Kundalini Yoga" for certain practices, all of
> Yoga actually leads to the activation of Kundalini.
MM:
No, all Yoga does not. Surat Shabd Yoga, or Sant Mat, does not. Your
lack of knowledge is quite apparent.
> Thus, in a sense,
> all of Yoga is Kundalini Yoga, regardless of whether you use that
> specific name.
MM:
Kundalini is just a power, a reflection from the Astral Plane. It
merges into the Shabd of the Astral Plane. There is no need to lift
it up. We can rise up without it. Practitioners of Sant Mat have
been doing this for ages.
> Awakening kundalini and leading it to union with the
> Absolute is the goal of the Himalayan sages and the path of Yoga,
> Vedanta, and Tantra.
MM:
Maharaj Charan Singh Ji (1916-1990) used to say, "If you are in the
middle of a hill, and you want to go to the top, there is no need to
go to the bottom first. You can go right from the middle to the top."
Kundalini Yoga or practice, whatever you want to call it, is just a
diversion. It's not necessary for enlightenment. We are already just
below the third eye, in the normal waking state. Taking the attention
DOWN to the pelvic region is like going to the bottom of the hill.
There is no need to, and moreover, it is very dangerous.
> http://swamij.com/kundalini-awakening.htm
MM:
Readers can use their own sagacity, whether they want to believe your
swamiji, or me? No problem.
Michael Martin
Western Sat Guru
lackpurity
> On Aug 31, 12:38 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Aug 31, 9:26?am, Dave Barnes <davemariabar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Aug 29, 1:24 am, Michael Turner <Michael112...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> > > > On Aug 27, 10:06 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > MM:
> > > > > You got that right. In regards to your charge that I got PO'd, I'll
> > > > > just say that it doesn't exactly make me jubilant, when a clown like
> > > > > you comes along to lead everyone astray. It was for similar reasons
> > > > > that Sodom and Gommorha were destroyed. This has been known as God's
> > > > > wrath.
>
> > > > > Michael Martin-
>
> > > > I thought Matt Damon destroyed Sodom & Gommorah.- >
>
> > > Yeah, but I don't know if you're considering all the possibilities
> > > here Michael. Forget Nude Yoga, that's kind of blase. Consider
> > > Lackpurity's idea that doing Nude Yoga could have people
> > > transmigrating as Jackass'. Nude Jackass Yoga is where it's at! LOL!
> > > Come on, Lighten up MM. :-) The physical form is not dirty or
> > > unspiritual or whatever it is that got you reacting so to this.
>
> > MM:
> > HB wrote like he is an authority on Kundalini,
>
> compared to you I might be an authority on kundalini, after all, not
> being afraid of the boogey-man I have dared to look under the bed.
MM:
You're not an authority on Kundalini.
> > Shabd, and then he
> > replied to the message about Nude Yoga.
>
> hI MM,
> you seem a bit confused, scattered still,
> check the time lines.
> I responded to this thread about Aug 19,
> and it was about the 26th when I did the hendrix spoof.
MM:
The time doesn't make much difference. My brain is not as young as
yours, probably, but I do the best I can with it.
> Both increased asana practice or more tatva dharana with special
> attention to increasing the base are helpful in keeping oneself
> grounded in the details of daily living.
MM:
You could explain your terms "tatva dharana." Attaching ourselves to
the Holy Spirit, Shabd, or Nam, within is the solution to peace.
> > I suppose
>
> you suppose? sounds like you do not actually know what you were doing.
MM:
Maybe readers will choose you, over me? Let them, if that's what they
want to do. No problem.
> > I was questioning
> > how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
>
> It seem you are still making stuff up, or at least putting a
> distorting spin on what I have written. No where have I mentioned that
> I raise kundalini.
MM:
You're still spinning, skating, and dodging. You can't have your cake
and eat it, too. If you're not going to raise Kundalini, then why
waste out time mentioning it at all? HMMM???
> I did mention that in Tantra awakening kundalini is
> within the role of the guru.
MM:
If you want to follow such a Guru into the house of mirrors, then you
go at your own risk.
> > Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> > dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> > with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
>
> I was wondering when you were going to get around to this,
> Kundalini is often symbolized as a coiled serpent. and
> Satan is referred to as serpent.
> So somehow, in your mind, they are connected. LOL
MM:
Your logic leaves a lot to be desired. The whole lower creation with
all its galaxies, astral plane, causal plane, etc., is the playground
of Satan. You've got a lot to learn. LOL Satan can appear in any
form, not just serpents. He can appear as lions, tigers, wolves,
serpents, dragons, wild boars, anything fearsome that he chooses. He
can even appear as a psuedo holy man, so we need to be careful of his
tricks. Shakespeare has clearly portrayed Satan in his works, acting
like a respectable King. Marlowe also did the same with Faust, as did
Goethe.
> > Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
> > the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
> > in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
> > cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
> > The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
> > figure that one out?
>
> more boogey men
> has there been one documented case of a meditator bursting into flame
> by the heat generated from the meditative process?
MM:
I wrote one case of Krohn's disease. I'm sure there are lots of
documents on the dangers of Kundalini on the net.
> > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > mystics have explained this.
>
> So I guess, according to you, Krishna was just blowing it out his ass
> when, in the Gita, He mentions meditating on Anahat.
MM:
Search for Krishna Sant Mat. I know Krishna is dear to Hindus, so I
don't want to flame anyone. Read what Soami Ji Maharaj wrote about
him.
MM:
Anahat is confusing. We feel love or Bhakti from the heart. That's
fine, but we need to concentrate the mind and soul at the third eye,
the Ajna Chakra. Yogas of old, used to live longer, and they might
have had time to start in lower chakras. Nowadays, the best and
quickest way is to go via the Ajna Chakra.
Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master. He has mentioned Krishna and
Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
area. Get it?
> > We need a guide, a Sat Guru, however to
> > protect us from Satan, as he waits on the other side with his demons,
> > to lead us astray.
>
> More boogey men. But I guess you need lots of boogey men to maintain
> job security.
>
> HB
MM:
I guess you might not be brave enough to face the truth? Sant Mat is
for brave souls.
Michael Martin
>
>
>
> > Michael Martin- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
HB...@hotmail.com
Well isn't that wonderful.
Something we can agree on: the general overall benefits of the LV
diet.
Overeating, or eating too late at night and going to bed with food
still in stomach will increase sex drive, even if the diet is LV.
> It has been tried and proven.
> The lacto-veggie diet doesn't increase sex drive, for sure. It
> doesn't make it go away, either. I don't know how much sex drive you
> want? :-) The LV diet is better for people, who don't want the karma
> of unnecessarily killing animals, birds, fishes, etc., and for those
> who want to digest their food quicker, so they can get up with an
> empty stomach and more easily concentrate the mind. LVs are less
> prone to anger and lust, also. One moment of anger can cause long-
> lasting repercussions. Similarly for lust. So, I'll leave it to the
> sagacity of the readers.
>
> > I wonder at times if any of your students have the strength to stand
> > on their own two feet. That if they were trees, would they have
> > strong, deep roots to survive and bend through the toughest storms of
> > life, or would they simply fall over and die?
>
> MM:
> You'd have to take a poll. IMO, most L-Vs are more healthy than those
> on other diets. I think scientific evidence corroborates my diet,
> also. L-Vs life longer.
>
> > But obviously all my feelings and wonderings could be absolutely
> > incorrect.
>
> MM:
> All right. It's your life.
>
lackpurity
MM:
Yes, it is wonderful. Maybe we can build on that?
Michael Martin
> > It has been tried and proven.
> > The lacto-veggie diet doesn't increase sex drive, for sure. It
> > doesn't make it go away, either. I don't know how much sex drive you
> > want? :-) The LV diet is better for people, who don't want the karma
> > of unnecessarily killing animals, birds, fishes, etc., and for those
> > who want to digest their food quicker, so they can get up with an
> > empty stomach and more easily concentrate the mind. LVs are less
> > prone to anger and lust, also. One moment of anger can cause long-
> > lasting repercussions. Similarly for lust. So, I'll leave it to the
> > sagacity of the readers.
>
> > > I wonder at times if any of your students have the strength to stand
> > > on their own two feet. That if they were trees, would they have
> > > strong, deep roots to survive and bend through the toughest storms of
> > > life, or would they simply fall over and die?
>
> > MM:
> > You'd have to take a poll. IMO, most L-Vs are more healthy than those
> > on other diets. I think scientific evidence corroborates my diet,
> > also. L-Vs life longer.
>
> > > But obviously all my feelings and wonderings could be absolutely
> > > incorrect.
>
> > MM:
> > All right. It's your life.
>
> > Michael Martin- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
HB...@hotmail.com
> > > Shabd, and then he
> > > replied to the message about Nude Yoga.
>
> > hI MM,
> > you seem a bit confused, scattered still,
> > check the time lines.
> > I responded to this thread about Aug 19,
> > and it was about the 26th when I did the hendrix spoof.
>
> MM:
> The time doesn't make much difference.
The attributions you made to my post, and your reactions to it,
certainly seem influenced by your misperception of their seqential
occurance.
> My brain is not as young as
> yours, probably, but I do the best I can with it.
>
> > Both increased asana practice or more tatva dharana with special
> > attention to increasing the base are helpful in keeping oneself
> > grounded in the details of daily living.
>
> MM:
> You could explain your terms "tatva dharana." Attaching ourselves to
> the Holy Spirit, Shabd, or Nam,
or whatever once likes to call "it"
> within is the solution to peace.
>
peace was not the issue here, keeping oneself grounded in the details
of daily living,
maintaining contact with relative reality was.
> > > I suppose
>
> > you suppose? sounds like you do not actually know what you were doing.
>
> MM:
> Maybe readers will choose you, over me? Let them, if that's what they
> want to do. No problem.
>
In Tantra it is said that a first rate guru makes sure the disciples
follow necessities of the spiritual path.
a second rate guru gives his advice and makes some sporadic effort to
ensure the disciples understand and follow the instructions.
a third rate guru gives his instruction and cares not at all if it is
understood or followed.
> > > I was questioning
> > > how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
>
> > It seem you are still making stuff up, or at least putting a
> > distorting spin on what I have written. No where have I mentioned that
> > I raise kundalini.
>
> MM:
> You're still spinning, skating, and dodging. You can't have your cake
> and eat it, too. If you're not going to raise Kundalini, then why
> waste out time mentioning it at all? HMMM???
>
You're still thinking kundalini is some sort of boogey man to be
feared.
I am not buying your fear mongering.
An awakened kundalini is just an aspect of any spiritual path.
It is the guru's role to awaken it, not mine. from then on it rises as
it will, in its own way, in its own time.
> > I did mention that in Tantra awakening kundalini is
> > within the role of the guru.
>
> MM:
> If you want to follow such a Guru into the house of mirrors, then you
> go at your own risk.
>
that is ironic that you keep mentioning "the house of mirrors." Jimi
Hendrix also wrote a song abouit "Room full of Mirrors" and how to get
out. That must be further coroboratioon that he was a guru.
> > > Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> > > dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> > > with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
>
> > I was wondering when you were going to get around to this,
> > Kundalini is often symbolized as a coiled serpent. and
> > Satan is referred to as serpent.
> > So somehow, in your mind, they are connected. LOL
>
> MM:
> Your logic leaves a lot to be desired. The whole lower creation with
> all its galaxies, astral plane, causal plane, etc., is the playground
> of Satan. You've got a lot to learn. LOL Satan can appear in any
> form, not just serpents. He can appear as lions, tigers, wolves,
> serpents, dragons, wild boars, anything fearsome that he chooses. He
> can even appear as a psuedo holy man, so we need to be careful of his
> tricks. Shakespeare has clearly portrayed Satan in his works, acting
> like a respectable King. Marlowe also did the same with Faust, as did
> Goethe.
>
satan? another anthropomorphisation as far as I am concerned.
> > > Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
> > > the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
> > > in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
> > > cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
> > > The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
> > > figure that one out?
>
> > more boogey men
> > has there been one documented case of a meditator bursting into flame
> > by the heat generated from the meditative process?
>
> MM:
> I wrote one case of Krohn's disease.
well not exactly a convincing reference since he did not burst into
flames and self combust did he?
additionally the role of kundalini in his krohn's disease was but a
figment of your meditation.
> I'm sure there are lots of
> documents on the dangers of Kundalini on the net.
>
undoubtably,
and I am sure there are documents as to it's safety.
but what does any of that have to do with your boogey man of
"spontaneous human cumbustion"
> > > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > > mystics have explained this.
>
> > So I guess, according to you, Krishna was just blowing it out his ass
> > when, in the Gita, He mentions meditating on Anahat.
>
> MM:
> Search for Krishna Sant Mat. I know Krishna is dear to Hindus, so I
> don't want to flame anyone. Read what Soami Ji Maharaj wrote about
> him.
>
> MM:
> Anahat is confusing. We feel love or Bhakti from the heart.
How can that be? Did you not write that lhe lower chakras, anything
below third eye, have nothing to do with spiritual life? and is not
Bhakti a very important element of sadhana? Bhakti coming from Anahat
chakra would make anahat fairly important.
> That's
> fine, but we need to concentrate the mind and soul at the third eye,
> the Ajna Chakra. Yogas of old, used to live longer, and they might
> have had time to start in lower chakras. Nowadays, the best and
> quickest way is to go via the Ajna Chakra.
>
> Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master.
did he know that? or are you just appropriating all humans of any
lasting accomplishment into your "Sant Mat"
seems that way to me.
> He has mentioned Krishna and
> Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
> going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
> area. Get it?
>
I get that you think there is only one way, yours.
lackpurity
MM:
That's your opinion. Not mine.
> > > > Shabd, and then he
> > > > replied to the message about Nude Yoga.
>
> > > hI MM,
> > > you seem a bit confused, scattered still,
> > > check the time lines.
> > > I responded to this thread about Aug 19,
> > > and it was about the 26th when I did the hendrix spoof.
>
> > MM:
> > The time doesn't make much difference.
>
> The attributions you made to my post, and your reactions to it,
> certainly seem influenced by your misperception of their seqential
> occurance.
MM:
Man, you just like to make mountains out of molehills, I guess? The
time sequence was unimportant. MY sequence, the acts that I did, was
important to me. I FIRST noticed your misrepresentation of Kundalini
and Shabd. SECOND I noticed your post about Kundalini and Nude Yoga,
with your question regarding apparel. I hope that is clear. You
misunderstood me.
> > My brain is not as young as
> > yours, probably, but I do the best I can with it.
>
> > > Both increased asana practice or more tatva dharana with special
> > > attention to increasing the base are helpful in keeping oneself
> > > grounded in the details of daily living.
>
> > MM:
> > You could explain your terms "tatva dharana." Attaching ourselves to
> > the Holy Spirit, Shabd, or Nam,
>
> or whatever once likes to call "it"
>
> > within is the solution to peace.
>
> peace was not the issue here, keeping oneself grounded in the details
> of daily living,
> maintaining contact with relative reality was.
MM:
If we are TOO GROUNDED, then we will to be reborn here. Is that what
you want? Sant Mat is for people who want to escape the wheel of
reincarnations.
> > > > I suppose
>
> > > you suppose? sounds like you do not actually know what you were doing.
>
> > MM:
> > Maybe readers will choose you, over me? Let them, if that's what they
> > want to do. No problem.
>
> In Tantra it is said that a first rate guru makes sure the disciples
> follow necessities of the spiritual path.
MM:
A first rate guru can't force anyone to do his/her duty. The disciple
has to do his/her own part.
> a second rate guru gives his advice and makes some sporadic effort to
> ensure the disciples understand and follow the instructions.
> a third rate guru gives his instruction and cares not at all if it is
> understood or followed.
MM:
Read Christ's teachings. He said some seeds fall on fertile ground,
some fall on rocky ground, and some fall on barren ground. Master
sows GOOD SEEDS. The problem could be with the ground. This is not
indifference on the part of the Master. Maybe in the next life, the
disciple will be better able to take advantage of the teachings?
Shakespeare wrote about the same, saying that he got various retorts
from seekers. They would argue with him in those retorts. So, if we
are barren ground, it is the condition of our own mind. If we argue
with the Master, then it is not his fault. If Master puts a plate of
food under our noses, he can't force us to eat it, but it we are
hungry, we will eat it. Master doesn't force us to be good
disciples. I just commented on Hamlet Act 2, Scene 2, that we can be
either. It depends on what we want to be.
> > > > I was questioning
> > > > how he would be raising up the Kundalini, while practicing Nude Yoga.
>
> > > It seem you are still making stuff up, or at least putting a
> > > distorting spin on what I have written. No where have I mentioned that
> > > I raise kundalini.
>
> > MM:
> > You're still spinning, skating, and dodging. You can't have your cake
> > and eat it, too. If you're not going to raise Kundalini, then why
> > waste out time mentioning it at all? HMMM???
>
> You're still thinking kundalini is some sort of boogey man to be
> feared.
MM:
Answer my question. You're spinning, skating, and dodging.
> I am not buying your fear mongering.
MM:
As I just wrote, some seeds will fall on barren ground.
> An awakened kundalini is just an aspect of any spiritual path.
MM:
Kundalini is unnecessary for enlightenment.
> It is the guru's role to awaken it, not mine. from then on it rises as
> it will, in its own way, in its own time.
MM:
That's all? What about when all that power rises up to the stomach
chakra? We could end up with gastrointestinal problems. It's
dangerous. If we're dying there is no problem, because we're going to
die anyway. If we want to come back into the body, then in what shape
will it be? Did you check out the internet on Kundalini Dangers?
> > > I did mention that in Tantra awakening kundalini is
> > > within the role of the guru.
>
> > MM:
> > If you want to follow such a Guru into the house of mirrors, then you
> > go at your own risk.
>
> that is ironic that you keep mentioning "the house of mirrors." Jimi
> Hendrix also wrote a song abouit "Room full of Mirrors" and how to get
> out. That must be further coroboratioon that he was a guru.
MM:
The power of the third eye has been diluted by the six chakras in the
physical body. They are weak reflections of the original source.
Those energies are for the bodily functions and its maintenance. It's
not for superconsciousness. You've got a lot to learn. I don't mind
teaching you, if you want to know the truth. If you just want to argue
with me, then I only have so much time for barren ground, you see?
> > > > Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> > > > dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> > > > with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
>
> > > I was wondering when you were going to get around to this,
> > > Kundalini is often symbolized as a coiled serpent. and
> > > Satan is referred to as serpent.
> > > So somehow, in your mind, they are connected. LOL
>
> > MM:
> > Your logic leaves a lot to be desired. The whole lower creation with
> > all its galaxies, astral plane, causal plane, etc., is the playground
> > of Satan. You've got a lot to learn. LOL Satan can appear in any
> > form, not just serpents. He can appear as lions, tigers, wolves,
> > serpents, dragons, wild boars, anything fearsome that he chooses. He
> > can even appear as a psuedo holy man, so we need to be careful of his
> > tricks. Shakespeare has clearly portrayed Satan in his works, acting
> > like a respectable King. Marlowe also did the same with Faust, as did
> > Goethe.
>
> satan? another anthropomorphisation as far as I am concerned.
MM:
Whatever. You're contrary to the teachings of the Saints. They have
borne witness of him, many, many times. If you want to ignore them,
it's your prerogative. I've seen him myself, many times. He's a
shrewd character. He didn't get to rule the physical, astral, and
causal planes by being a dummy.
> > > > Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
> > > > the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
> > > > in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
> > > > cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
> > > > The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
> > > > figure that one out?
>
> > > more boogey men
> > > has there been one documented case of a meditator bursting into flame
> > > by the heat generated from the meditative process?
>
> > MM:
> > I wrote one case of Krohn's disease.
>
> well not exactly a convincing reference since he did not burst into
> flames and self combust did he?
MM:
My point was that if we dabble with the energy in the body, we might
get a rude awakening. I admit that I used an extreme case to make a
point. Even if we don't burst into flames, we can do irreparable harm
to certain organs of the body. That was my point. It's like, if we
play with fire, we might get burnt.
> additionally the role of kundalini in his krohn's disease was but a
> figment of your meditation.
MM:
That's your opinion, not mine. Check out the internet on what has
happened to practitioners of Kundalini. Are you coward to do that?
LOL If you think Kundalini is all peaches and cream, I've got news
for you, it's not.
> > I'm sure there are lots of
> > documents on the dangers of Kundalini on the net.
>
> undoubtably,
> and I am sure there are documents as to it's safety.
MM:
Then? Use your discernment.
> but what does any of that have to do with your boogey man of
> "spontaneous human cumbustion"
MM:
If we play with fire, we might get burnt. The cases of SHC were not
even provoked. Can you imagine what might happen if we raise
Kundalini up, adding that energy to those chakras? Check out the
internet.
> > > > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > > > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > > > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > > > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > > > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > > > mystics have explained this.
>
> > > So I guess, according to you, Krishna was just blowing it out his ass
> > > when, in the Gita, He mentions meditating on Anahat.
>
> > MM:
> > Search for Krishna Sant Mat. I know Krishna is dear to Hindus, so I
> > don't want to flame anyone. Read what Soami Ji Maharaj wrote about
> > him.
>
> > MM:
> > Anahat is confusing. We feel love or Bhakti from the heart.
>
> How can that be? Did you not write that lhe lower chakras, anything
> below third eye, have nothing to do with spiritual life? and is not
> Bhakti a very important element of sadhana? Bhakti coming from Anahat
> chakra would make anahat fairly important.
MM:
If our attention is "in the body," i.e. not out of the body as in
meditation, then we will feel love from the heart area. My teaching
is to THEN concentrate the attention at the third eye center. I'm not
saying to stay at the heart chakra. I can't say if that is what
Krishna taught, or not. It could be a start, but then we need to go
to the third eye.
> > That's
> > fine, but we need to concentrate the mind and soul at the third eye,
> > the Ajna Chakra. Yogas of old, used to live longer, and they might
> > have had time to start in lower chakras. Nowadays, the best and
> > quickest way is to go via the Ajna Chakra.
>
> > Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master.
>
> did he know that? or are you just appropriating all humans of any
> lasting accomplishment into your "Sant Mat"
> seems that way to me.
MM:
Okay, you be whatever type of ground you can be. I'm not forcing
anyone to be receptive. I'm just discussing the truth. If you want
to argue the truth, then it might be your personal problem.
> > He has mentioned Krishna and
> > Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
> > going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
> > area. Get it?
>
> I get that you think there is only one way, yours.
MM:
That is right, if we want to realize God. Ultimately there is one
way. There are many tributaries which enter the Missouri/Mississippi
River. They come from different backgrounds, but ultimately they end
up in the Gulf of Mexico.
Michael Martin
Michael Turner
"Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master. He has mentioned Krishna and
Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
area. Get it?"
Can you point to anything in the writings of any of the 20th Century
Sant Mat Satgurus - of any lineage - wherein Sri Aurobindo was
referred to as a "Sant Mat Master"?
lackpurity
MM:
I'm telling you what he was. Take it, or leave it.
Michael Martin
Michael Turner
That's funny. One would think that, with a philosopher as prominent
as Sri Aurobindo, at the very least Charan Singh and/or Kirpal Singh
would have mentioned him in the pantheon of Sant Mat Satgurus. Have
they?
Michael Turner
Bruce Morgen
I'm sure they have not Michaelji
-- but iirc our good friend (the
other) Michaelji considers
himself a Param Sant Sat Guru on
a par with the gentlemen you've
mentioned and therefore every
bit as authoritative on such
matters.
Michael Turner
>
> - Show quoted text -
You're probably right, Bruce. Still, turning a gyan yogi into a Sant
Mat Satguru is a pretty interesting trick.
How're you doing, anyway?
mt
Bruce Morgen
He's already appropriated
Famous Dead Guys[tm] (and
ladies too -- at least
he's not a misogynist!)
from all over the western
world into his expanded
Sant Mat lineage, so I'm
not very surprised at
this rather modest
"trick."
>
>How're you doing, anyway?
Awash in life, love, and
music -- constantly
grateful for it all!
I hope you and your
young one are well --
don't forget to pick up
that bass from time to
time too; music heals
and nourishes!
Much love -- Bruce
>
>mt
>
lackpurity
MM:
Sri Aurobindo died in 1950. Look at the geography, also, Mr. Turner.
I'm on the other side of the world, Sri Aurobindo was their neighbor,
relatively speaking. Auroville was a thriving spiritual center even
under The Mother, Mira Alfassa, Sri Aurobindo's successor, until her
death in 1973. It might be today, also, but I'm not sure about that.
I think MCSJ's center at Beas, MKSJ's center at Delhi, and Sri
Aurobindo's center at Auroville had a mutual respect for one another.
Sri Aurobindo had a different approach. I'll admit. Many Saints have
had different approaches. Read "Savitri," by Sri Aurobindo. It is
pure Sant Mat. It took him nearly 50 years to write it. It's a
classic.
Mr. Turner, why don't you learn something from a Sat Guru of the time,
rather than indulging in history? That's a familiar trap of Satan.
I chose to ignore some minor differences in approach. They didn't
choose to ignore them, and I won't conjecture on their reasons for not
doing it.
Shakespeare made it clear that Cleopatra was a Master. I don't know
of any Indian Master who corroborated that. It's a fact, however. It
tallies with my meditation, which says that NETEMARA (Yahoo ID) is the
reincarnation of Cleopatra and Madame Blavatsky. She is a member of
my group, and I'm a member of hers.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
> Michael Turner <Michael112...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >On Sep 3, 6:29 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >> On Sep 3, 8:26?pm, Michael Turner <Michael112...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
>
> >> > MM:
>
> >> > "Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master. He has mentioned Krishna and
> >> > Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
> >> > going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
> >> > area. Get it?"
>
> >> > Can you point to anything in the writings of any of the 20th Century
> >> > Sant Mat Satgurus - of any lineage - wherein Sri Aurobindo was
> >> > referred to as a "Sant Mat Master"?
>
> >> MM:
> >> I'm telling you what he was. Take it, or leave it.
>
> >> Michael Martin
>
> >That's funny. One would think that, with a philosopher as prominent
> >as Sri Aurobindo, at the very least Charan Singh and/or Kirpal Singh
> >would have mentioned him in the pantheon of Sant Mat Satgurus. Have
> >they?
>
> I'm sure they have not Michaelji
MM:
Maybe not, but it doesn't exclude him from Mastership. He and Mira
Alfassa, his successor, were Masters, IMO.
> -- but iirc our good friend (the
> other) Michaelji considers
> himself a Param Sant Sat Guru on
> a par with the gentlemen you've
> mentioned and therefore every
> bit as authoritative on such
> matters.
MM:
That's exactly right, Bruce. Sometimes, I wonder how God can love me,
to the extent that he does, but I am doing the same work as those
previous Param Saints. Absolutely. I'm just thankful for God's
grace. I'm just doing a duty. Nice to hear from you again, Bruce.
Blessings to you.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
MM:
There's a lot on Sri Aurobindo on the net. He has given question and
answer sessions. You can read the classic, "Savitri." You can search
for Mira Alfassa's questions and answers. You can look at Sri
Aurobindo's cosmology, which is pretty much the same as Sant Mat.
Many Saints have taken different approaches. It's all God's will.
Faqir Chand was a controversial Master. Saligram changed Soami Ji's
path, supposedly, from Anami Mat, to Radha Soami Mat. All these are
just cosmetic changes. They are not really changing anything. The
final stage of all those Masters was the same, and they all had access
to it.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
MM:
Trick? Sri Aurobindo taught to go to the Supramental stages. Sant
Mat calls it Parbrahm. Different names, same teaching. Why quibble
over names? When you go beyond mind, beyond Satan, differences become
insignificant. It is the path of Shabd, Nam, or Holy Spirit. Sri
Aurobindo followed that same path, and what's even more important, God
manifested in him. A result of all that was Auroville and Savitri.
Mira Alfassa carried on the tradition. She was a Divine Feminine,
IMO.
> >How're you doing, anyway?
>
> Awash in life, love, and
> music -- constantly
> grateful for it all!
>
> I hope you and your
> young one are well --
> don't forget to pick up
> that bass from time to
> time too; music heals
> and nourishes!
>
> Much love -- Bruce
Michael Martin
>
>
>
>
> >mt- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
HB...@hotmail.com
OK, as long as we are in agreement that we are dealing with opinions.
>
> > > > > Shabd, and then he
> > > > > replied to the message about Nude Yoga.
>
> > > > hI MM,
> > > > you seem a bit confused, scattered still,
> > > > check the time lines.
> > > > I responded to this thread about Aug 19,
> > > > and it was about the 26th when I did the hendrix spoof.
>
> > > MM:
> > > The time doesn't make much difference.
>
> > The attributions you made to my post, and your reactions to it,
> > certainly seem influenced by your misperception of their seqential
> > occurance.
>
> MM:
> Man, you just like to make mountains out of molehills, I guess? The
> time sequence was unimportant. MY sequence, the acts that I did, was
> important to me. I FIRST noticed your misrepresentation of Kundalini
> and Shabd. SECOND I noticed your post about Kundalini and Nude Yoga,
just for the record, you again seem to be making things up, despite
your assertion to the contrary, I made no (and I quote)," post about
Kundalini and Nude Yoga,"
> with your question regarding apparel. I hope that is clear. You
> misunderstood me.
>
>
>
>
>
> > > My brain is not as young as
> > > yours, probably, but I do the best I can with it.
>
> > > > Both increased asana practice or more tatva dharana with special
> > > > attention to increasing the base are helpful in keeping oneself
> > > > grounded in the details of daily living.
>
> > > MM:
> > > You could explain your terms "tatva dharana." Attaching ourselves to
> > > the Holy Spirit, Shabd, or Nam,
>
> > or whatever once likes to call "it"
>
> > > within is the solution to peace.
>
> > peace was not the issue here, keeping oneself grounded in the details
> > of daily living,
> > maintaining contact with relative reality was.
>
> MM:
> If we are TOO GROUNDED, then we will to be reborn here. Is that what
> you want?
I was not referring to anything so esoteric as that, more on the level
of being able to see, comprehend, and respond to the post(s) you have
read rather than the imaginary one(s) in your head. You seem to need
all the help you can get in that area.
> Sant Mat is for people who want to escape the wheel of
> reincarnations.
>
> > > > > I suppose
>
> > > > you suppose? sounds like you do not actually know what you were doing.
>
> > > MM:
> > > Maybe readers will choose you, over me? Let them, if that's what they
> > > want to do. No problem.
>
> > In Tantra it is said that a first rate guru makes sure the disciples
> > follow necessities of the spiritual path.
>
> MM:
> A first rate guru can't force anyone to do his/her duty. The disciple
> has to do his/her own part.
>
well that is your opinion, and suggests to me that you are not and
have not met a real guru.
and do note, that making sure someone does something is not
necessarily the same as forcing them.
> > a second rate guru gives his advice and makes some sporadic effort to
> > ensure the disciples understand and follow the instructions.
> > a third rate guru gives his instruction and cares not at all if it is
> > understood or followed.
>
> MM:
> Read Christ's teachings. He said some seeds fall on fertile ground,
> some fall on rocky ground, and some fall on barren ground. Master
> sows GOOD SEEDS. The problem could be with the ground. This is not
> indifference on the part of the Master.
well, if I toss some good seed on my hard packed gravel driveway, no
matter how I try to fool myself about my horticultural abilities and
accomplishments, it will not grow. If I intend for it to grow, if I am
not indifferent, I can get out my pick- axe and loosen the gravel a
bit. The seed will have a much better chance to grow then. I could
take further actions and water it. or even better mix in a little
fertilizer.
> Maybe in the next life, the
> disciple will be better able to take advantage of the teachings?
>
> Shakespeare wrote about the same, saying that he got various retorts
> from seekers. They would argue with him in those retorts.
sorry, but anything you say about Shakespeare is suspect. I have seen
your Rorschach-like technique for finding "hidden" meaning in his
writings.
> So, if we
> are barren ground, it is the condition of our own mind. If we argue
> with the Master, then it is not his fault.
only the foolish would accept a "master" without question.
> If Master puts a plate of
> food under our noses, he can't force us to eat it, but it we are
> hungry, we will eat it.
Then He should make sure we are hungry.
> Master doesn't force us to be good
> disciples. I just commented on Hamlet Act 2, Scene 2, that we can be
> either. It depends on what we want to be.
>
yes, but that has nothing to do with Hamlet.
Again. the boogey-man.
> If we're dying there is no problem, because we're going to
> die anyway.
just to correct what seems to be a misconception on your part;
kundalini does not rise at death, unless it has been active during
life. At time of death, there is a disruption of the balance of the
vayus, the pranas above and below the navel; they clash and smash,
giving rise to the abdominal, navel area disruptions in breathing
process that precede death. but this is not kundalini.
> If we want to come back into the body, then in what shape
> will it be? Did you check out the internet on Kundalini Dangers?
>
years ago,
> > > > I did mention that in Tantra awakening kundalini is
> > > > within the role of the guru.
>
> > > MM:
> > > If you want to follow such a Guru into the house of mirrors, then you
> > > go at your own risk.
>
> > that is ironic that you keep mentioning "the house of mirrors." Jimi
> > Hendrix also wrote a song abouit "Room full of Mirrors" and how to get
> > out. That must be further coroboratioon that he was a guru.
>
> MM:
> The power of the third eye has been diluted by the six chakras in the
> physical body. They are weak reflections of the original source.
> Those energies are for the bodily functions and its maintenance.
that is your opinion.
> It's
> not for superconsciousness. You've got a lot to learn. I don't mind
> teaching you, if you want to know the truth. If you just want to argue
> with me, then I only have so much time for barren ground, you see?
>
>
For some reason I would not recommend anyone learn anything about
meditation from you. Perhaps it is your proclivity for making things
up.
>
>
>
> > > > > Kundalini can be dangerous, if it is raised up. It should be left
> > > > > dormant, coiled up, asleep, in the pelvis. Saints don't even bother
> > > > > with it. It is all a trick of Satan.
>
> > > > I was wondering when you were going to get around to this,
> > > > Kundalini is often symbolized as a coiled serpent. and
> > > > Satan is referred to as serpent.
> > > > So somehow, in your mind, they are connected. LOL
>
> > > MM:
> > > Your logic leaves a lot to be desired. The whole lower creation with
> > > all its galaxies, astral plane, causal plane, etc., is the playground
> > > of Satan. You've got a lot to learn. LOL Satan can appear in any
> > > form, not just serpents. He can appear as lions, tigers, wolves,
> > > serpents, dragons, wild boars, anything fearsome that he chooses. He
> > > can even appear as a psuedo holy man, so we need to be careful of his
> > > tricks. Shakespeare has clearly portrayed Satan in his works, acting
> > > like a respectable King. Marlowe also did the same with Faust, as did
> > > Goethe.
>
> > satan? another anthropomorphisation as far as I am concerned.
>
> MM:
> Whatever. You're contrary to the teachings of the Saints. They have
> borne witness of him, many, many times.
I find no mention at all of "satan" or a "satan" substitute in the
yoga sutras of Patanjlai. And there are plenty of saints that do quite
well without a satan boogey-man as an adversary.
> If you want to ignore them,
> it's your prerogative. I've seen him myself, many times. He's a
> shrewd character. He didn't get to rule the physical, astral, and
> causal planes by being a dummy.
>
>
>
>
>
> > > > > Have you heard of "spontaneous human combustion?" Search for it on
> > > > > the net. That indicates what can happen, if we dabble with the forces
> > > > > in the body. There is a lot of energy and heat within the body. In
> > > > > cases of spontaneous human combustion, the body burns from within.
> > > > > The feet might be burned to ashes, but the shoes unburned, if you can
> > > > > figure that one out?
>
> > > > more boogey men
> > > > has there been one documented case of a meditator bursting into flame
> > > > by the heat generated from the meditative process?
>
> > > MM:
> > > I wrote one case of Krohn's disease.
>
> > well not exactly a convincing reference since he did not burst into
> > flames and self combust did he?
>
> MM:
> My point was that if we dabble with the energy in the body, we might
> get a rude awakening. I admit that I used an extreme case to make a
> point. Even if we don't burst into flames, we can do irreparable harm
> to certain organs of the body. That was my point. It's like, if we
> play with fire, we might get burnt.
>
yes if you play with fire you might get burnt. mostly because for
people who play with fire the fire itself is the attraction.
but if you pay attention and learn how to use fire from someone who
knows how, you can: cook your meals with it; dry your clothes; heat
your home; remove impurities from raw ore, transforming it into iron,
into steel, change raw ore into pure gold etc.
> > additionally the role of kundalini in his krohn's disease was but a
> > figment of your meditation.
>
> MM:
> That's your opinion, not mine.
>
You are entitled to your opinion, but let us not fool ourselves, your
opinion is just an opinion.
When beginning to learn meditation, one of the first things I was
encouraged to do was this, not pay much attention to anything I "saw"
or "heard" or experienced in my meditation, it is all distraction,
just go back to being with the mantra and concentration. Apparently
you take your meditation experiences very seriously.
> Check out the internet on what has
> happened to practitioners of Kundalini.
What exactly do you mean by "practitioners of Kundalini." To me it
seems a misnomer, a misconception.
> Are you coward to do that?
as I said, already done that long ago.
seemed to me that those reporting such difficulties fell into two
distinct groups, those who were dabbling without experienced guidance,
and those who were of the mind that by their personal efforts they
could control kundalini and force it to rise.
Dabbling or forcing, both will get you into trouble in any field of
endeavour. I have recommended neither in any of my posts.
> LOL If you think Kundalini is all peaches and cream, I've got news
> for you, it's not.
>
> > > I'm sure there are lots of
> > > documents on the dangers of Kundalini on the net.
>
> > undoubtably,
> > and I am sure there are documents as to it's safety.
>
> MM:
> Then? Use your discernment.
>
I have. and I am not afraid of your boogey-man.
>
>
> > but what what does any of that have to do with your boogey man of
> > "spontaneous human cumbustion"
>
> MM:
> If we play with fire, we might get burnt. The cases of SHC were not
> even provoked.
and as such have nothing to do with yoga practice involving kundalini,
but is just a boogey-man.
> Can you imagine what might happen if we raise
> Kundalini up, adding that energy to those chakras?
Well I am sure that you can imagine, however from the comments you
make I am sure that you have no direct experience.
> Check out the
> internet.
>
> > > > > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > > > > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > > > > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > > > > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > > > > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > > > > mystics have explained this.
No they have not all explained this. Many have explained that the real
"thing" is at sahasrara.
>
> > > > So I guess, according to you, Krishna was just blowing it out his ass
> > > > when, in the Gita, He mentions meditating on Anahat.
>
> > > MM:
> > > Search for Krishna Sant Mat. I know Krishna is dear to Hindus, so I
> > > don't want to flame anyone. Read what Soami Ji Maharaj wrote about
> > > him.
>
> > > MM:
> > > Anahat is confusing. We feel love or Bhakti from the heart.
>
> > How can that be? Did you not write that lhe lower chakras, anything
> > below third eye, have nothing to do with spiritual life? and is not
> > Bhakti a very important element of sadhana? Bhakti coming from Anahat
> > chakra would make anahat fairly important.
>
> MM:
> If our attention is "in the body," i.e. not out of the body as in
> meditation, then we will feel love from the heart area.
just to nit pick here. the chakras are not in the physical body
although the impact of their activities can be felt there, anahat is
not in the body as the physical heart organ is. So if one is actually
concentrated in anahat one is not concentrated or focused on or in the
physical body.
> My teaching
> is to THEN concentrate the attention at the third eye center. I'm not
> saying to stay at the heart chakra. I can't say if that is what
> Krishna taught, or not. It could be a start, but then we need to go
> to the third eye.
>
It almost sounds like we are agreeing again.
are you agreeing: that Bhakti is important?
that it is often felt from anahat chakra area?
that what is happening in a "lower" chakra can be a useful base, a
support for "higher" meditative activity? ... after all, you can
meditate at Ajina all you want but without Bhakti it will be for
naught, you may "see" a lot of stuff, but it will all be ego strut.
> > > That's
> > > fine, but we need to concentrate the mind and soul at the third eye,
> > > the Ajna Chakra. Yogas of old, used to live longer, and they might
> > > have had time to start in lower chakras. Nowadays, the best and
> > > quickest way is to go via the Ajna Chakra.
>
> > > Sri Aurobindo was a Sant Mat Master.
>
> > did he know that? or are you just appropriating all humans of any
> > lasting accomplishment into your "Sant Mat"
> > seems that way to me.
>
> MM:
> Okay, you be whatever type of ground you can be. I'm not forcing
> anyone to be receptive. I'm just discussing the truth. If you want
> to argue the truth, then it might be your personal problem.
You are discussing the "truth"?
Sounds to me like you are making stuff up again.
I have read a bit of Sri Aurobindo and found no mention of surat shabd
yoga, or Sant mat.
I did a web search on Aurobindo and Sant Mat and found no references
indicating any association between the two. As far as spiritual groups
go, their respective associations were always listed separately.
As well, from my reading, Aurobindo's conception of the world seems at
great variance with the one which you present. From what I have read,
Aurobindo conceives creation, in lines similar to a
Tantric conception, to be the expression of Divine Consciousness at
various levels of perfection, that all of creation itself is evolving
towards consciously expressed Divinity, and as such is not something
to "escape" while you seem to see the world as something vile and
dirty, the realm of Satan, something to be feared and avoided at all
costs. I noticed no boodgey man in Aurobindo's works. Additionally, I
found nothing remotely familiar to your "trust in me, just in me,"
attitude in Aurobindo's writings.
Others have already commented on the questionable nature of your
Aurobindo Sant Mat invention.
So yes, I question your opinions and seemingly baseless
proclamations. If that puts you in a tizzy, well, so much for your
"guru-ship"
>
> > > He has mentioned Krishna and
> > > Tantra, etc.. He drew people from many yogas, but he would insist on
> > > going to the supramental realms, far above the pelvis or the heart
> > > area. Get it?
>
> > I get that you think there is only one way, yours.
>
> MM:
> That is right, if we want to realize God. Ultimately there is one
> way. There are many tributaries which enter the Missouri/Mississippi
> River. They come from different backgrounds, but ultimately they end
> up in the Gulf of Mexico.
Nice analogy, They are very different rivers. Traversing very
different landscapes. The craft and skill-set required to successfully
traverse one is different from the other. Looking at a map there are
lots of rivers flowing into the gulf of Mexico many of which are
nowhere near, have nothing to do with, the Mississippi. Get it?
>
> ...
>
> read more ยป- Hide quoted text -
Lady Azure
Do what?
Like Orkhan Teachings?
Some Family Tree of the Divine?
Who's?
Does it mention the Dal Y'Lamha, Maube (The Green Buddha of Tara)
Rama's?
The House of the "Lion who walks Upright like a man"?
How about the "Lake"?
RA?
Ahura Mazda?
NEMESIS?
E/Y L?
Jehovah (Gi of Ah, Mountain of the Scream)?
Alpines?
Ocean?
The Great Trees themselves?
WHO?
Lady Azure
Do what?
Sevenhundred Elves
> > > > > On Aug 31, 12:38 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > On Aug 31, 9:26?am, Dave Barnes <davemariabar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > > > > > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > > > > > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > > > > > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > > > > > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > > > > > mystics have explained this.
>
> No they have not all explained this. Many have explained that the real
> "thing" is at sahasrara.
Yes. Sri Aurobindo is one of those. So it would seem that Michael Martin
is at variance with one of his Masters.
S.
Paul Crowley
humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare
FROM FOLLOW-UPS
With the shit Neuendorffer, we already
have more than enough in that NG.
lackpurity
wrote:
> HB...@HOTMAIL.COM wrote:
> > > > > > On Aug 31, 12:38 pm, lackpurity <lackpur...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > On Aug 31, 9:26?am, Dave Barnes <davemariabar...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > Surat Shabd Yoga bypasses all those dangers. It doesn't awaken the
> > > > > > > Kundalini, nor does it overamp the lower chakras. That is the
> > > > > > > superiority of Sant Mat. All those lower chakras are just reflections
> > > > > > > of the higher planes. Why chase after reflections? Go for the real
> > > > > > > thing. The real thing is found at the Ajna Chakra (Third Eye.) All
> > > > > > > mystics have explained this.
>
> > No they have not all explained this. Many have explained that the real
> > "thing" is at sahasrara.
MM:
These stages are relative to one another. The Ajna Chakra is just
above the eye center. The eye center is known as Dodal-Kanwal. These
are like platforms. Shakespeare often called the platforms.
Sahasrara is not the END in Sant Mat. It is the beginning. Sant Mat
calls in Sahans-dal-Kanwal, the thousand-petaled lotus. It is the
Astral Plane. It is the FIRST STAGE. The SECOND STAGE is Trikuti,
Brahmanda, or the Causal Plane. The Supramental Planes, according to
Sri Auorbindo start beyond the Causal Plane, or at Parbrahm, according
to Sant Mat.
Those mental planes are not REAL, vis-a-vis, the planes above them.
If you want to talk about something REAL, it would have to be ANAMI
PURUSH, the Nameless Lord. He is at the EIGHTH STAGE.
> Yes. Sri Aurobindo is one of those. So it would seem that Michael Martin
> is at variance with one of his Masters.
>
> S.
MM:
I discuss the truth. If people want to look for excuses to argue with
me, it's their prerogative. Things change on this physical plane,
sometimes. IOW, sometimes it is better not to acknowledge someone.
Sometimes it is better to acknowledge him/her. It's due to the
prevailing circumstances at the time.
I'm sure that when they were living, Maharaj Kirpal Singh Ji, Maharaj
Charan Singh Ji, and Sri Aurobindo had great respect for one another.
They were sons of the same Father, so it is only natural. MCSJ became
the Successor a year after Sri Aurobindo had died, but he (SA) must
have respected MKSJ, and Maharaj Sawan Singh Ji, IMO, my Master's
predecessor. Faqir Chand was alive then, too, as was Pir Vilayat
Inayat Khan. They all taught and followed the same path. They might
have called things by different names, merely cosmetics. That's the
only difference.
Michael Martin
lackpurity
MM:
Crowley, I'm just going to ignore your attempts at censorship, and I
hope others will, as well. You post your silliness about Oxford
writing the canon. Pure fantasy. I see there is somewhat of a schism
between two Oxfordians, very interesting.
For those who don't know what's going on, at
humanities.lit.authors.shakespeare, there has been an ongoing battle
for many years about the authorship of Shakespeare's canon. Maybe
some of you would like to join in these discussions? We have
Marlovians, i.e those who think Christopher Marlowe wrote it. We have
Baconians, i.e. those who think Francis Bacon wrote it. We have
Derbyites, those who think the Earl of Derby wrote it, William
Stanley, and last but not least, we have Oxfordians, those who think
Edward de Vere, the Earl of Oxford, wrote it. There are other so-
called candidgates, as well, but those re the Big Four candidates to
dethrone the STRAT MAN, William Shakespeare. The majority in HLAS ae
Stratfordians, believing that he wrote the canon.
To repeat, don't worry about Crowley's attempts to censor you. He is
a minority whiner. LOL
Michael Martin
Michael Turner
>
> Mr. Turner, why don't you learn something from a Sat Guru of the time,
> rather than indulging in history? That's a familiar trap of Satan.
I have learned much from Sat Guru's of the time. I have learned to
differentiate between psychic and spiritual, Kal and God, and mind and
soul.
Soul is a self-aware particle of God. God is love. Soul is love.
And the way back to God is through love, as expressed in the Eternal
LightSong of Naam.
Much love in Naam,
Michael Turner