How to get into the Lotus Posture
jaj
Lotus Posture but couldn't get anywhere near it. But one day I had a
hot bath and tried it immediately after getting out and then sat in it
easily, with no effort at all, for 15 minutes. After that I was always
able to get into the lotus posture, even after years without
practising it.
But it must be a hot bath. A shower won't do it.
Ian
the internet last night for a better way. I always have pain in my ankles.
Today however, I asked a new friend of mine from India for advice and he
said that most peoples ankles will hurt, and to just keep at it, little by
little. Apparently after a short while (month?) there will be no pain.
"jaj" <j_ja...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:71d90962.03092...@posting.google.com...
Stu
> news:71d90962.03092...@posting.google.com...
>> Many years ago, when I was 17, I tried for months to get into the
>> Lotus Posture but couldn't get anywhere near it. But one day I had a
>> hot bath and tried it immediately after getting out and then sat in it
>> easily, with no effort at all, for 15 minutes. After that I was always
>> able to get into the lotus posture, even after years without
>> practising it.
>>
>> But it must be a hot bath. A shower won't do it.
>
>
in article 4aidnfebNpB...@buckeye-express.com, Ian at
so...@dunnit.com wrote on 9/24/03 8:37 PM:
> i will have to try that......i have always had pain and was searching around
> the internet last night for a better way. I always have pain in my ankles.
> Today however, I asked a new friend of mine from India for advice and he
> said that most peoples ankles will hurt, and to just keep at it, little by
> little. Apparently after a short while (month?) there will be no pain.
Hot water brings blood circulation to the muscles. With more circulation
there is more flexibility. Research has shown that it takes a fairly hot
bath (105 degrees) for a minimum of 20 minutes to raise the temperature of
the deep tissue enough to get any benefit.
It is possible to simulate the effect of heat on the muscles by doing
warm-up exercises as well. There are plenty of preparatory poses to
practice to work up to Lotus.
Be very careful of pain in the knees or ankles. Lotus rotates unprepared
knees and folds the ankles in ways that can cause long term damage to the
muscle attachments at these joints. These ligaments do not recuperate as
quickly as muscles.
Using a folded blanket under the knees and tibia will help support them in
half lotus. At first keep the knees at a 90 degree angle, this will protect
them from twisting. A weight like a sand bag near the top of the thigh will
help the femur head descend away from the pelvis. This action is paramount
for getting the rotation needed for a comfortable padasana.
--
~Stu
ajna
You know what you need?
Raw power.
Just violently bend your legs to lotus posture!
Just kidding. Maybe the hot bath relaxed your muscless. It is
unbeliavably hard to learn to relax the muscles. It is in the mind.
You just have to became consciouss of the muscles in a new way and how
to relax them. This is something they practise in martial arts for
many ears. Have you seen those MA-movies where the teacher ALWAYS
says: "Relax! Relax more, don't tense!"
But is it necessary to sit in lotus?
I first meditated in lotus posture and didn't care that my back tired
and legs got sore and all. I thougth that maybe I'll get used to it.
But then my other knee started to hurt for several days. That was for
bending it with force to a lotus posture. I immediately stopped using
that posture. Today I use a posture that feel comfortable.
Ceriel Nosforit
>> Many years ago, when I was 17, I tried for months to get into the
>> Lotus Posture but couldn't get anywhere near it. But one day I had a
>> hot bath and tried it immediately after getting out and then sat in it
>> easily, with no effort at all, for 15 minutes. After that I was always
>> able to get into the lotus posture, even after years without
>> practising it.
>>
>> But it must be a hot bath. A shower won't do it.
>
>
> But is it necessary to sit in lotus?
> I first meditated in lotus posture and didn't care that my back tired
> and legs got sore and all. I thougth that maybe I'll get used to it.
> But then my other knee started to hurt for several days. That was for
> bending it with force to a lotus posture. I immediately stopped using
> that posture. Today I use a posture that feel comfortable.
I usually just sit in my recliner with a few pillows behind my back to
get it straight, then stop worrying about it and get on with meditating.
=)
Still, I do it too irregularly for it to be very effective and should
probably not even pretend to give advice...
--
Nosforit
1. Living -- Online -- Corrupt practices
KuligArt
jaj
>
> Hot water brings blood circulation to the muscles. With more circulation
> there is more flexibility. Research has shown that it takes a fairly hot
> bath (105 degrees) for a minimum of 20 minutes to raise the temperature of
> the deep tissue enough to get any benefit.
>
> It is possible to simulate the effect of heat on the muscles by doing
> warm-up exercises as well. There are plenty of preparatory poses to
> practice to work up to Lotus.
>
> Be very careful of pain in the knees or ankles. Lotus rotates unprepared
> knees and folds the ankles in ways that can cause long term damage to the
> muscle attachments at these joints. These ligaments do not recuperate as
> quickly as muscles.
>
> Using a folded blanket under the knees and tibia will help support them in
> half lotus. At first keep the knees at a 90 degree angle, this will protect
> them from twisting. A weight like a sand bag near the top of the thigh will
> help the femur head descend away from the pelvis. This action is paramount
> for getting the rotation needed for a comfortable padasana.
Yes, it's probably worth mentioning that I spent about 20 minutes in
the hot water of a full bath before trying it. But when I did try it
after the bath I easily sat in the lotus posture for 15 minutes and
could have sat in it without any strain for much longer if I had
wanted to, but I got bored just sitting there with nothing to do. If I
had prepared something beforehand such as watching a tv program or
meditating (but not bending over to read which might have strained the
back) it would have made it easier to have just effortlessly sat
there.
Your other suggestions and warnings are worth noting too, as I've read
elsewhere that attempts to force oneself into this posture can result
in damage to the small bones of the feet etc. But I want to stress
that immediately after sitting in the hot water for 20 minutes I sat
in the lotus posture easily for 15 minutes and could have sat in it
for much longer without strain if I had wanted to, even though before
I couldn't get anywhere near it.
seeker
Ive read in an old issue of Inner Culture magazine that by far the
best posture to practice for being able to cultivate lotus is one
called the Stone Pose. It involves placing the legs up and behind the
torso and holding them there by placing feet on opposite sides of the
neck. May be hard to do but its apparently the best way to train the
relevant tendons and muscles to be able to hold lotus without pain or
permanent damage.
jaj
> best posture to practice for being able to cultivate lotus is one
> called the Stone Pose. It involves placing the legs up and behind the
> torso and holding them there by placing feet on opposite sides of the
> neck. May be hard to do but its apparently the best way to train the
> relevant tendons and muscles to be able to hold lotus without pain or
> permanent damage.
I'm not sure that my first message in this thread "sunk in". It was
this:
End quote.
Now, why would anyone bother with the difficult Stone Pose as a
training for the Lotus Posture when a long, hot bath easily gets the
relevant tendons and muscles to hold lotus without any pain or any
damage?
As stated above, although I couldn't get anywhere near the lotus
posture even after several months of trying, I tried it immediately
after a hot bath and then found I could do it easily and very
comfortably for 15 minutes, which was all I tried, although I could
have sat in it for much longer at the time. There was not the
slightest damage, pain or discomfort to any tendons or muscles as a
result, and after that I could always get into it easily, even after
years of not doing it, although I never tried it again after a hot
bath. In later years, because I hardly ever practised it I suppose, I
found that sitting in it for half an hour or longer tended to cause my
legs to get a bit numb and bluish and go to sleep and I began to get
pins and needles in them. However, none of that would have happened, I
believe, if I had tried it immediately after a hot bath as in my first
experience.
With regard to Stu's post, I think the water would have been hotter
than 106 degrees because that is hardly any more than internal body
temperature of 98.4 and it was quite a hot bath (although comfortably
so) and certainly not merely warm or lukewarm.
Well, I hope that "sunk in"!
Wishing you all the best.
Jaj
seeker
> maha...@yahoo.com.au (seeker) wrote in message news:<b6f341b5.0309...@posting.google.com>...
> > kuli...@aol.com (KuligArt) wrote in message news:<20030925185612...@mb-m17.aol.com>...
> Now, why would anyone bother with the difficult Stone Pose as a
> training for the Lotus Posture when a long, hot bath easily gets the
> relevant tendons and muscles to hold lotus without any pain or any
> damage?
One would bother using the stone pose because it is a more permanent
way of being able to attain lotus. Taking a hot bath for 20 minutes at
a hot temperature provides a temporary loosening of the tendons that
then enables you to sit in lotus. It does not mean however that it is
the best way to do it. Using the stone pose is a way to train the
tendons and muscles to attain lotus naturally and easily anywhere and
at any time, without the need for a long, hot bath.
ajna
> best posture to practice for being able to cultivate lotus is one
> called the Stone Pose. It involves placing the legs up and behind the
> torso and holding them there by placing feet on opposite sides of the
> neck. May be hard to do but its apparently the best way to train the
> relevant tendons and muscles to be able to hold lotus without pain or
> permanent damage.
I don't really undestand what kind of asana you are describing. Is
there any picture about it anywhere?
I read this Hatha Yoga Pradipika, and there was these comments like:
"Lotus posture is excellent because by sitting in lotus posture you
get enligtened immediately!" etc.
Is there really something special in the postures alone?
ajna
> best posture to practice for being able to cultivate lotus is one
> called the Stone Pose. It involves placing the legs up and behind the
> torso and holding them there by placing feet on opposite sides of the
> neck. May be hard to do but its apparently the best way to train the
> relevant tendons and muscles to be able to hold lotus without pain or
> permanent damage.
I don't really undestand what kind of asana you are describing. Is
there any picture about it anywhere?
I read this Hatha Yoga Pradipika, and there was these comments like:
"Lotus posture is excellent because by sitting in lotus posture you
get enlightened immediately!" etc.
seeker
will surely find it if you look though, perhaps on the net or in a
hatha yoga book or by asking a hatha teacher. The best way I can
describe it is that if you put first your right leg behind your
shoulder and make the ankle hold against the left side of your neck
then do the same with the left leg and hold the ankle on the right
side of the neck then put your palms together in a traditional
namaskar gesture you would end up with the stone pose.
Yes I have read the same about lotus. It is not that it gives you
immediate enlightenment but it does purify the body quickly because
the life currents are given free flow along the spine and hence the
whole body is rejuvenate by life-force. Most often in any other
posture there is not quite the same degree of straightness of spine
and relaxation of muscles, but in lotus the spine becomes locked in
place and the muscles become like soft noodles hanging from the stiff
rod of the spine. This allows the energy to withdraw more fully from
the rest of the body and begin to withdraw through the spinal passage
with the help of pranayama. This is how one attains asana, pranayama,
pratyahara the fastest way.
For myself I have found that the best way to enter lotus is to perform
the mahamudra as taught in Kriya yoga before sitting for meditation.
It is marvelous for loosening the entire body by charging it with
life-force and stretching the legs in a unique way. Unfortunately in
its potent form it is not available to the public. You would have to
seek initiation in Kriya from a true master of the tradition.
ajna
> will surely find it if you look though, perhaps on the net or in a
> hatha yoga book or by asking a hatha teacher. The best way I can
> describe it is that if you put first your right leg behind your
> shoulder and make the ankle hold against the left side of your neck
> then do the same with the left leg and hold the ankle on the right
> side of the neck then put your palms together in a traditional
> namaskar gesture you would end up with the stone pose.
Oh now I understand. Seems like a real hardcore asana. I haven't ever
really got the legs staying there, or even been able to bend them
correctly behind my neck. Too difficult for me.
> Yes I have read the same about lotus. It is not that it gives you
> immediate enlightenment but it does purify the body quickly because
> the life currents are given free flow along the spine and hence the
> whole body is rejuvenate by life-force. Most often in any other
> posture there is not quite the same degree of straightness of spine
> and relaxation of muscles, but in lotus the spine becomes locked in
> place and the muscles become like soft noodles hanging from the stiff
> rod of the spine. This allows the energy to withdraw more fully from
> the rest of the body and begin to withdraw through the spinal passage
> with the help of pranayama. This is how one attains asana, pranayama,
> pratyahara the fastest way.
Sounds understandable.
Lotus is bad for my knees. It puts real strain on them. Like I
mentioned before, I got my knee hurt for few days so I stopped it.
Fortunately it wasn't anything serious and the pain went away. So now
I don't use lotus. Maybe I should practise my legs for this.
jaj
> > Now, why would anyone bother with the difficult Stone Pose as a
> > training for the Lotus Posture when a long, hot bath easily gets the
> > relevant tendons and muscles to hold lotus without any pain or any
> > damage?
>
>
> One would bother using the stone pose because it is a more permanent
> way of being able to attain lotus.
thread, after sitting in a Hot bath for 20 minutes enabled me to
easily sit in the lotus posture for 15 minutes even though before that
hot bath I was unable to get anywhere near it, I was always able to
get into the lotus posture, even though I hardly ever sat in it again.
But even 20 years later I was still able to sit in it, and if that's
not "permanent", as you call it, what is? And note again that it never
ever caused me or my tendons or ligaments any pain or damage or
discomfort whatsoever.
Taking a hot bath for 20 minutes at
> a hot temperature provides a temporary loosening of the tendons that
> then enables you to sit in lotus. It does not mean however that it is
> the best way to do it. Using the stone pose is a way to train the
> tendons and muscles to attain lotus naturally and easily anywhere and
> at any time, without the need for a long, hot bath.
You seem to have the misunderstanding that one would only be able to
sit in it for a short period after the hot bath. That was not my
experience, because - to repeat for about the fourth or fifth time -
after that I was always able to get into the lotus posture without a
hot bath beforehand. It was not only a 'temporary loosening of the
tendons' because the ability to sit in it after that remained with me
in later years. I suspect that if I had remained in the lotus posture
for an hour instead of 15 minutes after that hot bath my ability to
get into the posture in much later years for even longer periods than
the half hour(which was the maximum I ever sat in it after not
practising it for many years)would have been improved.
Of course, getting into the lotus posture with the help of a hot bath
beforehand is not necessarily the "best" way (as you call it) because
if anyone enjoys torturing him/herself, obviously the stone pose would
be the best way for him/her.
seeker
> You seem to have the misunderstanding that one would only be able to
> sit in it for a short period after the hot bath. That was not my
> experience, because - to repeat for about the fourth or fifth time -
> after that I was always able to get into the lotus posture without a
> hot bath beforehand. It was not only a 'temporary loosening of the
> tendons' because the ability to sit in it after that remained with me
> in later years. I suspect that if I had remained in the lotus posture
> for an hour instead of 15 minutes after that hot bath my ability to
> get into the posture in much later years for even longer periods than
> the half hour(which was the maximum I ever sat in it after not
> practising it for many years)would have been improved.
You seem to have the misunderstanding that what worked for you will
work for everybody. What I said about the benefits of the Stone pose
as related to being able to attain the Lotus posture is not my idea,
it is something I read in a magazine article that was written by a
yogi. If you want to argue the point, argue with him.
When you say you 'suspect' that if you had remained in lotus longer
after that hot bath you would throughout the years have been able to
sit in it even longer than you actually attempted is a guess and you
did not actually test it out. So thats a hypothesis.
Are you saying that it requires one miraculous long hot bath after
which you merely sitting in perfect lotus for 15 minutes will enable
you to sit in it for at least 30 minutes at a time for the next 20
years? Do you think everyone can have the same miraculous bath that
you had? What was the brand of soap bubbles you used in that bath?
Maybe everyone should go out and buy that same brand it might have had
a secret mysterious miracle-working ingredient in it. LMAO you make me
laugh!
But seriously, you may not know whether you have any damage to your
tendons because there are several types of damage you can incur if you
do not work towards lotus in the right way. One of these is
mis-shaping of the tendons in back of your knees. There may not be
pain associated with it but you can elongate them and mis-shape them
to a degree such that you will have a looser walk. This is why through
the Stone pose you actually train the tendons in your hip to stretch
making the pressure on the knees much less since you are able to open
the hips much more as a result of the Stone pose.
> Of course, getting into the lotus posture with the help of a hot bath
> beforehand is not necessarily the "best" way (as you call it) because
> if anyone enjoys torturing him/herself, obviously the stone pose would
> be the best way for him/her.
Hatha yoga is a clever science. If you find a particular posture
'torturing' you can work at it gradually until you master it. For
every difficult pose there are at least a number of lesser more easy
poses to help you become strong and flexible enough to attain the more
difficult one. Just as the Stone pose helps you train for Lotus, there
are poses to help you train for the Stone pose.
Sometimes a little pain is involved in even healthful stretching
because a person is simply not used to stretching or they have a low
pain thresh-hold. If you keep at it and do it in the right way
step-by-step you can master any pose.
seeker
> Lotus is bad for my knees. It puts real strain on them. Like I
> mentioned before, I got my knee hurt for few days so I stopped it.
> Fortunately it wasn't anything serious and the pain went away. So now
> I don't use lotus. Maybe I should practise my legs for this.
One of the benefits of the Stone pose is that it opens the hip joints
up in such a way that the strain on the knees when attempting lotus is
avoided. The strain on the knees is only there because you are not
able to open the pelvic region enough to make the angle of the knees
much more natural. True lotus involves 'turning' the legs in their
pelvic placement so that the angle of the bent knees makes the lower
legs able to face upward more. This is the kind of preliminary
exercise that allows some hatha yogis to perform the pose where they
are able to place their feet into the cavity of the abdomen because
they are able to 'turn' their thighs more outward.
To get an idea of what I am talking about, place your open palms face
down on your thighs as you sit on the ground in normal cross-legged
posture. Now simulate turning the upper legs/thighs in their socket in
the pelvis outward to the side: left thigh to the left, right thigh to
the right. Do not actually forcefully turn them just do it to get an
idea of what the Stone pose enables you to achieve through practice. I
know the stone pose is hard, just like lotus is hard. But if you truly
want to achieve Lotus then you can achieve the Stone pose gradually by
using other poses to work on the legs. I do not know off hand what
these are but a qualified hatha yogi will be able to tell you or you
can find out from a good hatha book.
Otherwise just use any comfortable sitting posture that keeps your
spine comfortably straight and your body relaxed and motionless.
jaj
the Lotus Posture but couldn't get anywhere near it. But one day I had
and then sat in it easily, with no effort at all, for 15 minutes.
After that I was always able to get into the lotus posture, even 20
years later, although I hardly ever used it, and never tried it again
after a hot bath.
But it must be a hot bath, with the water as hot as you can
comfortably stand. A shower won't do it. You don't need any soap, just
the hot water. If you try difficult and tortuous poses like the lotus
and the stone by forcing yourself into them you run the risk of
injuring the tendons, joints and muscles, whereas if you soften
everything up with a long spell in a hot (not merely warm) bath for 20
minutes beforehand they will be safeguarded from any damage. I found
that out when I was 17, 38 years ago, and have never had any bad, or
even unusual, effects from it.
My other posts about it in this thread have been nos. 1, 4, 9 and 11,
but I'm having a lot of trouble getting it to "sink in". Some people
are very keen on torturing themselves with the stone pose as a
theoretical preparation for getting into the lotus, but I suspect
that's only because their heads are made of stone. True seekers will
not be misled by them, and will experiment for themselves to find out
the truth.
Tim Tyler
> I read this Hatha Yoga Pradipika, and there was these comments like:
> "Lotus posture is excellent because by sitting in lotus posture you
> get enligtened immediately!" etc.
> Is there really something special in the postures alone?
It sounds like a bit of an exaggeration ;-)
Lotus pose provides a good, stable base, while reducing circulation in
the legs.
Once you are comfortable in it, it is a pretty good pose for meditation.
--
__________
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