This is from wikipedia. One of the most succinct and accurate
descriptions of this form of yoga I have seen.

Jnâna yoga teaches that there are four means to salvation:

    * Viveka - Discrimination: The ability to differentiate between
what is real/eternal (Brahman) and what is unreal/temporal (everything
else in the universe.)
    * Vairagya - Dispassion: After practice one should be able to
"detach" her/himself from everything that is "temporary."
    * Shad-sampat - The 6 Virtues: Tranquility (control of the mind),
Dama (control of the senses), Uparati (renunciation of activities that
are not duties), Titiksha (endurance), Shraddha (faith), Samadhana
(perfect concentration).
    * Mumukshutva - Intense longing for liberation from temporal
limitations.

Anyone care to talk about this?

Jared
o
^

To still the prana with the mind is jnana;
to still the mind through the prana is yoga.

hi jared
is this way of life possible while still living in this society? Or is
this something for people like monks and nuns who give up their lives
to follow their beliefs?
i wonder how one continues to work, earn a living, support a family,
have relationships, recreation, etc. how could someone have a job to
make the money to pay for heating, food, clothes, or maintain
relationships - family or friends - while judging everything as real
or unreal and doing only activities which are duties. duties to who?

nancy

On May 11, 8:39 pm, NBennett <nancy...@rogers.com> wrote:

You will not have to renounce the worldly life; you won't have to go
into the forest;
wherever you are, you still can progress on the spiritual path and be
in the world of bliss! The suffering is only because of sense of 'me'
and 'mine'.

On May 11, 8:39 am, NBennett <nancy...@rogers.com> wrote:

nancy

Thanks for the response and great questions. Seems like every time I
read something you write I have to smile. You (and Richard :-) are
moving so far, so fast,  it is a joy to behold...

Wisely you put forward the question:

Sure it is. No monk'ness or nun'ness required :-) In fact you will
read time and again from the masters that it is a "higher" and more
substantial form of yoga, to practice in the real world. That those
who are willing to strive to integrate yoga in there real (dutiful)
lives are practicing a superior form, even more so than those who
retreat to the mountain or forest.

When trying to understand the science of yoga and it functions and
effects, it is important not to confuse religious, cultural,
linguistic, historical and other regional attributes with the art and
science itself. Yoga is universal. Obviously it is going to be
practiced in different context, language and style in the West then it
is in the East. Many things eastern are couched in "religious" ideas
and are communicated in poetic terms. That's their history and
development. Westerners tend to be business like, practical minded and
pragmatic (even while being religious). This is our history and
development.

We wouldn't sit down to an Ethiopian meal and proclaim, "what am I
suppose to do with that? I've never seen that, I can't understand and
cook that. It's incomprehensible to me, it must only be for Ethiopians
or people who devote their lives to it." No, hopefully we just eat, we
enjoy and we grow from the sustenance and revel in the company of
those who have fed us. The truth is, while having a very different
look, smell and flavor, it is none the less food. For those of us who
can't get past the appearance of things and discern their real
meaning, we face a life of fear, unhappiness and inevitable death, all
devoid of joy and a sense of belonging and oneness (yoga).

Likewise in a jnani-like manner you inquired :-)

These all sound like duties to me. Seems you may be most of the way
there already :-)

Why not? We judge things constantly. Unfortunately for most of us we
judge things inaccurately. Jnana is the yoga which concerns itself
with "discriminating" or separating truth from fiction or what is real
from what is not. Could this be anything but a good thing? Especially
in a work a day world. Wouldn't you rather be making decisions and
taking actions on information which is true or real, than on
information that is not. No matter how well reasoned and responsible a
decision we make or action we take, its going to come out bad if its
based on bad information. So I think learning to tell what's true from
what's false has very practical and beneficial use in any and every
aspect of our lives.

You have learned over the course of your yoga study / practice that
you can do things you thought unlikely or impossible. Your eyes (inner
and outer) have been opened to truths perhaps you were not aware of
and so your heart / mind continues to open even greater
possibilities . This is how one aspect of yoga (hatha - physical)
intertwines or overlaps another aspect of yoga (jnana - knowledge). As
you learn more about the "different" types of yoga you will see they
all overlap and are at their base, all the same (yoga - unity).

I get from your questions and comments you've made before that it
would be helpful if some set down just how a western who lives in the
real world goes about practicing real yoga. There is substantial
material covering hatha yoga which has come all the way to commercial.
Raja has been adapted for the west by maharishi and others and bhakti
by the Self Realization Fellowship and some other religious
organizations. Jnana and karma are not well understood or supported on
any scale as they are such individual disciplines. I suggest the
writings of Richard Hittleman, Yogananda, Vivekananda. There are other
western equivalents like Emerson, Ernest Holms and perhaps the very
best in practical day to day applications, Emmet Fox.

Jared
o
^

a lot of my questions were based on misreading the definitions.  i
read "discrimination- the ability to differentiate between what is
real/ETERNAL" as real/INTERNAL, kinda glossed over the next part
thinking all the rest was unreal/external.
it makes a lot more sense when i actually read every word, and your
explanation, as always, helped. for me, to implement this, the key is
to focus on trying or working towards, rather than plop it into my
life as a fait acomplit and try to fit my life in around it.

just like a carpenter who measures twice, cuts once, i should read
twice, answer once.

thanks jared

nancy

you're right jaiguru. the focus should be on putting myself on the
path and progressing, not putting myself unprepared at the end goal.

nancy

nancy,

Thanks for your clarification.

In recovery circles its referred to as "striving for progress not
perfection."

On the subject of jnana, I prefer not to use the eastern words for
yoga ideas as it makes them sound so far off, unattainable and just
plain "fru fru, laa la, naa na." On the other hand if one speaks in
simple, direct English terms about yoga, then it doesn't sound like,
well, yoga :-)

The reason I choose to post this list of jnana concepts, is that it
contained, more than usual, relatively clear English description along
with the Sanskrit term. Something you hear a lot when studying the
roots and meaning of yoga is "there is no direct translation for so
and so word." And this is right,  but there is nothing that is true
which can not be communicated or understood in any language.

So in hopes of being helpful, here is my attempt to further translate
the translation :-)

* Viveka - Discrimination:

The willingness and the active attempt to discern what is real from
what is not, truth from fiction, correct from incorrect, accurate from
inaccurate, truth from lies, presentation from content, appearance
from reality, right from wrong.  See a pattern here :-)

 * Vairagya - Dispassion:

Detachment or equanimity. When one knows or strives to know what is
true, there is a real and natural tendency to get less intensely
excited about things, good or bad. Intense feelings (passion) of
excitement, happiness, sadness, fear, love, etc are generated by fear
and desire and other forms of expectation and fantasy. When ones
awareness is grounded in reality, passion falls away and is replaced
by knowing acceptance and by gentler and more subtle emotional cues
and reactions.

* Shad-sampat - The 6 Virtues:

Tranquility (control of the mind)

Is your body, which includes your mind, on "automatic," reacting to
environmental influence, without control or willful direction from
"you" the person which exists beyond its limited physicalness. Like a
car, racing out of control, constantly bumping into things, running
over others, wreaking harm and destruction in ways big and small? Do
we control our vehicle or does it control us?

Dama (control of the senses)

The senses are mechanisms designed to provide us feedback or
information about our internal and external environment. These senses
become perverted (and useless) when we concentrate on intensifying
pleasurable feedback and discouraging painful or uncomfortable
feedback. Information is information; no good or bad just feedback.
Can you imagine a computer judgeing the information we placed in it as
"good" or "bad?"  The thing would be useless :-)

Uparati (renunciation of activities that are not duties)

This is really just dropping those activities and things we do for
"distraction." Those things we do to keep us ignorant, unaware and in
denial of reality.  People often think of drugs, alcohol, sex, eating,
reading, films and the many things we do to "enjoy" ourselves. These
things can be a distraction. They can also be something we need to do,
for process, for survival and for other reasons. Either our actions
support finding and knowing what is true or they keep us from this
knowing. Duties are things we do because we need to do them and we are
responsible to do them. But what some consider duties are very often
used to "distract" us and keep us from knowing and accepting what is
true. Work, family, yoga and all kinds of responsibilities can be used
to distract. We've all known people who keep a house so clean it takes
all their time and energy and it really seems like they are trying
hard to avoid something else in their lives. It all depends on why you
do what you do. What is it's purpose for you. Not what does the thing
itself mean. Nothing has any meaning that we don't give to it. Hence
my saying, "it's never the thing its self, only the meaning we bring
to it."

Titiksha (endurance)

Stick-to-it-ness. Staying the course. Perseverance. Never giving up.
Personally, I've never figured out a way to "give up."  Sometimes I'd
like to but I have yet to find a book on the subject. Not to be
confused with "surrendering" which is not at all the same as giving
up. Surrendering is along the lines of acceptance and giving up, just
plain stopping.

Shraddha (faith)

Profound and absolute knowing. Beyond, believing, hoping, wanting,
wishing or any of the many things that pass for religiousness or
faith. When you really know what is true and what is not, there is a
"knowing" which transcends all question or doubt. No one and no thing
can cause you to "unknow" a thing you know. This is faith. Simple,
powerful, loving.

Samadhana
(perfect concentration)

One pointedness. Focus. Being in awareness of here and now. Non-
distractedness.

* Mumukshutva - Intense longing for liberation from temporal
limitations.

What this means is, once you know or even suspect, who and what you
are, there is a unshakable feeling or motivation to come "home" to
yourself. To be and act and feel and think as who you are. On the
everyday material plane, on the cosmic plane, on any plane at all.
Being freely and uninterruptedly who you are is the point of our
existence and what we're here to learn.

And who are we? We are Love, Life, Truth, Intelligence, Soul,
Principle and Spirit. And how do we live (in a practical way) with who
we are? I suggest reading Emmet Fox's Essay, "The Seven Main Aspects
of God" from the book, "Alter Your Life" and Yogananda's book, "Man's
Eternal Quest."

Jared
o
^

beauty thru chemistry...light made solid/
thought is obgectine or subgective..... subgetive thought is obgectively
at self (self-ish)_ and below that is beauty thru chemistry supporting
it all......an ILLUSION...atoms the suns over and ober they recombine
more and more atoms to live in the mind of god the dream..simple to
complex..If there is ABS:OLUTE:IY  EVERYTHING THERE MUST BE ABSOLUTE:LY
NOTHIING ,,,,between/2 cognize meditate  potentials and
fields....Black..zero vacum that was all white we see it change now
limited......sound, heat light fields potentials\............idc
illusion.

On May 11, 11:39 am, NBennett <nancy...@rogers.com> wrote:

Not to worry,
For anyone who is practicing a balanced yoga, as more than mere
physical fitness regimin, all those qualities,attributes mentioned
will develop, blossom on their own. They are not anything specific to
Jnana Yoga.