Google Groups no longer supports new Usenet posts or subscriptions. Historical content remains viewable.
Dismiss
Sakartvelo
14 views
Skip to first unread message
Hugh Lawson
Apr 23, 2012, 10:20:03 AM4/23/12
to
There is a country in the Caucasus referred to in the media as Georgia.
There is a difference, though. The inhabitants of what we call "Georgia"
in the Caucasus, call their own country Sakartvelo.
I was born in Georgia (USA), and now experience a small start when the
Causasus republic of Georgia appears in the headlines.
Here's an interesting wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Georgia
A.Lu...@who-knows-where.com
Apr 23, 2012, 7:44:59 PM4/23/12
to
On Mon, 23 Apr 2012 10:20:03 -0400, Hugh Lawson <hu.l...@gmail.com>
wrote:
So Stalin wasn't born near Atlanta like I always thought!? ;-)
wrote:
Hugh Lawson
Apr 23, 2012, 8:05:24 PM4/23/12
to
exotic. ;-)
Wiregrass Willie
Apr 24, 2012, 7:15:04 AM4/24/12
to
Jimmy Carter and Joseph Stalin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin
When I was growing up, people would hear I was from Georgia -- they
always inquired if I was related to Old Joe :-)
Hugh Lawson
Apr 24, 2012, 8:41:24 AM4/24/12
to
Wiregrass Willie <wiregrass_...@yahoo.com> writes:
[ snip ]
> When I was growing up, people would hear I was from Georgia -- they
> always inquired if I was related to Old Joe :-)
Are you putting me on, WW? I would have guessed that knowledge of
Stalin's home place would be fairly rare in America.
HL
[ snip ]
> When I was growing up, people would hear I was from Georgia -- they
> always inquired if I was related to Old Joe :-)
Stalin's home place would be fairly rare in America.
HL
Wiregrass Willie
Apr 24, 2012, 9:12:33 AM4/24/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 08:41:24 -0400, Hugh Lawson <hu.l...@gmail.com>
wrote:
My father was in the army, and I was a traveling GI brat. Back in
the 1950s, most military types -- and their children -- were well
aware of Stalin and his homeland. Especially those in England and
France.
wrote:
the 1950s, most military types -- and their children -- were well
aware of Stalin and his homeland. Especially those in England and
France.
Hugh Lawson
Apr 24, 2012, 10:12:36 AM4/24/12
to
>>Are you putting me on, WW? I would have guessed that knowledge of
>>Stalin's home place would be fairly rare in America.
>
> My father was in the army, and I was a traveling GI brat. Back in
> the 1950s, most military types -- and their children -- were well
> aware of Stalin and his homeland. Especially those in England and
> France.
Off course. Army people must have been well-instructed in the USSR. I'd
>>Stalin's home place would be fairly rare in America.
>
> My father was in the army, and I was a traveling GI brat. Back in
> the 1950s, most military types -- and their children -- were well
> aware of Stalin and his homeland. Especially those in England and
> France.
forgotten about your Army days.
Now here is a touchy question for you WW.
First some background preparation.
Jennifer Rae Greeson, in some articles and a book, has shown that from
the very beginning of discussion of "the South" in the United States by
non-southerners, "the South" has been described as partly foreign,
exotic, somewhat alien to the American nation. In interviews James
McPherson said one thing that led him to study of the civil war was that
growing up in North Dakota he had seen "the South" as "exotic".
Now back to the your Army days.
Clearly, these folk were twitting US Georgians by linking them with the
nationality of a feared dictator, the controller of vast military power.
And this was done in the Army, who must do-or-die against Stalin, in
case he would send his tanks roaring across the north European plain.
Do you think this little joke conforms to the pattern described by
Greeson? Or does it fall under Freud's exception: "sometimes a cigar is
just a cigar." ;-)
For a thought experiment, suppose counterfactually the Caucausus country
were traditionally called "Massachusetts" in western Europe. Would US
mapmakers insist instead on giving it the label "Sakartvelo", since this
is the name given to the country by its own people?
What do you think?
HL
Wiregrass Willie
Apr 25, 2012, 10:09:20 AM4/25/12
to
On Tue, 24 Apr 2012 10:12:36 -0400, Hugh Lawson <hu.l...@gmail.com>
wrote:
I think you lost me on that one, Hugh :-)
wrote:
Hugh Lawson
Apr 25, 2012, 2:50:25 PM4/25/12
to
Oh well, stuff happens.
HL
HL
Hugh Lawson
Apr 26, 2012, 7:16:10 AM4/26/12
to
> Sakartvelo think you lost me on that one, Hugh :-)
I'll try to make the same point in a different way.
The Georgia (US) and Georgia (Caucausus) jokes played on a superficial
similarity of the US state and the Caucausus country, a similarity in
name only.
That my-Georgia/foreign-Georgia reminded me of something, which I will
try to describe. What I'm describing exists in the world of thought and
speech/writing. It's not like a battle, or a political party.
This newsgroup showed me that some Americans like to speak of "the
South" as exotic (meaning foreign), or has having a "completely
different culture". At first, when I started commenting on this, I
thought I was reporting a new discovery. But I've found several authors
had worked on this theme, the theme of the South as "foreign" to
America, Jennifer Rae Greeson being an example.
So naturally it occurred to me that the 2-Georgias joke might be another
instance of this foreign-south theme. While thinking about this, I
googled Georgia, and discovered an extensive account of the Caucausus
republic's name, in the subject line. Georgia is a name given their
country by outsiders.
That led me to another reflection. Why don't we just use the name
Sakartvelo for that country? The name they call themselves?
HL
0 new messages