all past tenses

[fyf...@gmail.com]

I ran into the following sentence. What it talks about is
hypothetical in nature. Since it is hypothetical, should all the
tenses be in the past forms?

"China might develop aircraft carriers if one of these days the
American government became a fascist or communist one that attempts to
invade capitalist Latin America where China is having a lot of
economic interests."

[Don Phillipson]

<fyf...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:13944c12-650b-429a...@m33g2000pri.googlegroups.com...

1. No rule of English grammar requires that verbs in
hypothetical statements should be in the past tense.
Normal usage is the present tense, as here. "China
has interests" is usually prefered to "China is having interests."

2. So far as this sentence includes three subordinate
clauses (each subordinate to its predecessor) it seems
more intricate than its topic demands.

3. Many readers may think the sentence contentious.
E.g. it cites American political styles (fascist, communist,
capitalist) as determinant without similarly characterizing
China.

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

[fyf...@gmail.com]

On 10月2日, 下午8时07分, "Don Phillipson" <e...@SPAMBLOCK.ncf.ca> wrote:
> <fyfp...@gmail.com> wrote in message

'Capitalist' is a label given to Latin America, not America. The
hypothetic case is that the US becomes fascist or communist in a
chaotic situation when the economy runs out of the control.

[Jerry Friedman]

I'd want "became" and "attempted", or "becomes" and "attempts", as you
suggest.

--
Jerry Friedman

[Mark Brader]

We are asked:

>> I ran into the following sentence. What it talks about is
>> hypothetical in nature. Since it is hypothetical, should all the
>> tenses be in the past forms?
>>
>> "China might develop aircraft carriers if one of these days the
>> American government became a fascist or communist one that attempts to
>> invade capitalist Latin America where China is having a lot of
>> economic interests."

Don Phillipson writes:
> 1. No rule of English grammar requires that verbs in
> hypothetical statements should be in the past tense.

The past tense suggests that the hypothetical condition is less likely.

> Normal usage is the present tense, as here.

The given sentence starts out with the past tense "became" and then
changes to the present tense "attempts" and "is having". Grammar
requires it to use one or the other consistently.

> "China has interests" is usually prefered to "China is having interests."

Yes. "Is having" is the sort of thing a non-native English speaker
would say.

> 2. So far as this sentence includes three subordinate
> clauses (each subordinate to its predecessor) it seems
> more intricate than its topic demands.

So it does, but it's a simple construction nevertheless. The clauses
each just modify the word immediately before them, which is easy to
follow.

> 3. Many readers may think the sentence contentious.

It looks less contentious if it's in the past tense, because this
suggests that the hypothetical condition is less likely. So:

"China might develop aircraft carriers if one of these days
the American government became a fascist or communist one that

*attempted* to invade capitalist Latin America where China *had*

a lot of economic interests."

I think there should be a comma before "where".
--
Mark Brader | "...the government is simply a bunch of people we've
Toronto | hired to protect ourselves from thieves and murderers
m...@vex.net | and rapists and other governments..." -- Bill Stewart

My text in this article is in the public domain.

[Eric Walker]

What is wanted is:

"China might develop aircraft carriers if one of these days the American

government *were to become* a fascist or communist one that *would
attempt* to invade capitalist Latin America[,] where China *has* a lot
of economic interests."

--
Cordially,
Eric Walker, Owlcroft House
http://owlcroft.com/english/

[fyf...@gmail.com]

On 10月3日, 上午7时16分, Eric Walker <em...@owlcroft.com> wrote:

Tks. Makes most sense to me by using past tenses for the less likely
and the present tense for the obviously likely.